Canadian Geography and Closing Remarks

Ting is a complicated profession, which is why we're here discuss Mall, shhadow Lord, currently fininished airing on Disney Plus, my name is Dan Morren, and I'm joined as always by my co host Cat Benish is here, Hi Cat. Hello, good evening. We sat down about forty minutes ago and now we're starting this podcast. And No, you can't know what we talked about. Tony's in the l also here, Hi, Tony. Hi, I'm trapped until we finish this podcast at Cantley Well, welcome. U Maul, Shadow Lord wrapped its first season with episodes nine and ten. whichich were shocking episodes. I did not see that coming. and I got my first ever jump scare in a Star Wars show. Well, it's pretty good. I got spoiled. byy who? No The internet. Why are we on the internet? It's my job Is it though Are you supposed to be writing moving right along. We're bringing a very special Friday night energy to episode. Bill, which relationships will survive this particular recording? Keep listening to find out. I'm a writer. I don't need you to bring guilt. I bring my own guilt Hm Um, Y. I think I think he could be guiltyier. Okay. Yeah. Yeah Yeah Yeah Chapter nine, Strange Allies, followed by chapter ten. Dannis decided to ignore us this podcast Tony. I mean, I think he usually does. I think it's just usually we get about fourteen minutes in before he does that. But that forty minutes of sitting here not recording a pike as burned up all whatever little bits of goodwill just decided thirty minutes ago if I should talk and then just remove your tracks and posts. Do you not do that all the time anyways? I think You know, it's important to remember that Dan is I was going to say very lazy, but he would cut that out. And so here, let me just you'll just drop this part in veryer busy being a successful author I was going to say very ethical and feels like I need to represent exactly what we said on the podcast Um, Should we talk about what happens in these episodes? Does somebody want to do a recap I mean, I feel like there's not a ton to say because these are very fight fight fight episodes I did watch them in one sitting, which I kind of felt like they were designed to be Yeah in one sitting. and they were a nice little package of Star Wars, but I'll talk about Episode nine So at the end of episode eight Um our little blue friend G. All right, thank you It' me.ario. Yes. That' like drracul. It is meario. I've come to Sako. I'm concerned that you've conflated Italian and Romanian accents, but moving past that, he got a phone call from Dryden Vos And we set up a little hollow phone call exchange between Draad and Vos and Pul Bety. Maybe if you're it's not Paul Betneany, but it is somebody doing a decent Paul Betany It looks like Paul Betney. Yeah. It does look like exactly. Qion When you sign a contract with Star Wars, you must be giving them the right That's an ent I personally Star Wars. W is an entity with whom you can sign a contract with Tisney. I'm assuming you must be giving them the right to your likeness. Yeah, I mean they make action figures and they put your face on all kinds of stuff. So I assume so. Yeah I think a lot of they probably they probably have the rights to make put you in video games and cartoons and all kinds of stuff. I don't know if you have some first right of refusal to be like the voice of stuff. I'm always a little surprised who they do get to voice people in video games and cartoons in part because I assume it doesn't pay very great compared to these in movies They' supped be fast and cheep eisod it's like I imagine, I don't know about first wor refus, but I imagineed something like that. There are some cases where It also depends probably they give the first right refusal to like, do you want toly yourself? I don't know. but there's a contract online We can read some cls. You know, there's the thing. There's probably very personalized and leveragedays because it depends how big a actor you are, right? Like Paul betting and you can probably say, no, you don't have it like I'll show up if I want to Aed wrinkle, though they owned Paul Betanyy. Paul Betney. Paul Betneany does business with Disney also via the MCU cororrect. So yeah. But a lot of So there is I think there is like there's churn there's certainly ch because we see like for example The actor who voices Riley Lawsons son is also on the Percy Jackson show And so like there's a lot of like they clearly work with people and then like, oh, we like And like they are already like I just assum we already have you in our HR ass.. you're in Rllodex. Yeah. O like you've signed this contract. You belong to us now. and like you're you're a known quantity versus some other person we bring in for you. But there are also contracts, especially with the MCU. and I think probably to a lesser extent, Lucas Film where they' are like That was at Lucas Film. We have We're going to make X projects over the next year and we can like call in our chits basically and be like, you're in this There was the whole thing where like Chris Evans was on the hook for some certain number of movies. and there was always the question of like if he's in a movie for like minutes as I Cio Yeah. Do that count or not? And I'm sure I think lawyers would say yes. Yeah. I think it does unless specifically defined in unless and and I think I think there every now and then there's been some leak where youw you find out like about like You know, here's the legal ease on like which X men you own, you know, because they And it's like, congratulations. You bought seventy five X men, but not their're villains or whatnot. Well I mean, it's all worked out. And some of these people Chris Evans or Sebastian Stan, they signed contracts with them when they were relatively unknown, right? So you might think to yourself This is bread and butter for me, right? Like I' You know, I I don't really my career is coming up or whatever, but like If I do this, I'm basically set evenven if it loalks up the next like decade of my life I mean yeah. But off short version, that was not Paul Bet. It was what it was. That for out why we exited about that. I'm really good at holding the like what stacker we just said I like to ask these questions that are so innocuous, but like quick sidebar here is like It's about olives thing you It's actually about apples Oh Dan Dan is an expert on apples Actually so we fun part to tell my actual story. We've started buying like all the when we go to the store now we'll buy like one of you look whyy does Dan look a shameed? It's not a shame. I's tired. know. So buy like a cosmic crisp and a lady Alice and a pink lady and hotoney crisp And like we've gone throughs tast Yeah. and we tried them all. I've really liked the lady Alice. Dan has become quite a fan of the cosmic crisp. We all love panic crisp Please runite in with your favorite apples U please don't We do have olive chat today. But the story can tells, I still remember I had my A eleventh grade history teacher who was awesome, who told us at the end of the year that she basically runs her classroom like Machiavelli She was so good She told us that during she during essentially every week during essentially faculty meetings, I'm sure I've told this story before Tony She would be like discord in the story, which leads to the Trojan warar Ales Apples and she rolls the apple of discord in front of all the three goddesses to have them fight. I think I'm updating my file on you in terms of when it all went wrong.as this She would literally roll an apple? No She would basically ask very innocuous questions at these like very boring school meetings of like all the teachers And then just sit back just to watch the chaos unfold. Should we chain all the students to their desks? Discuss. 'ause she would get bored and that's how she would entertain herself was just asking these questions that would just like Machiavelli so much as sociopathy Yeah, well, I think we have different takeaways from that cat, but that's okay. She was a great teacher That's what you said. Th the words that you've said over and over again. not unlike Kat's teacher who is also not Paul Baky. Okay. And now as back to as long as we don't find out that you are somehow accidentally trained by like time traveling Maky Belly which Dan a novel idea. But It's a good novel idea. It's not a good novel idea. It needs What was like actually a crypto bro back in time. What I think see I think Machquia Elliot like shows up in this time and he's like No. and he gets back in the pod and then he goes a hundred years further and he's like, okay, now I can I can work with this. I can work with this. I think I think Machiavelli gets out in twenty twenty three and is like No, thank you. Um Okay, we have covered, I think the first thirty seconds of the episode. The important thing is that cr our crime faction cuts a deal with Trydon Voss where Drydon Voss wants Maul to kill a guy who's the head of Crimson Dawn. I don't think we've ever seen because the last time we saw or the last time in the future that we saw Drryiden Voss, he was the head of Crimson Don. or maybe he was reporting to Maul. I don't remember. I think he was Maul. Yeah. He was reporting him Maul. So it sounds like his little deal with Maul not wors all the time. Yeah you know, it sounds like he does not get the move up. So he's Yeah. he's promised to get Maul. planet in return for An assassination job. But in order for that to happen, Maul needs to meet them outside the city. Maul wants clearly Maul is still interested in, you know doing something with converting Devin to the dark side. And so he sends a force email to Devin. They meet in a statue, and then they're like running through the darkness in the streets and trying to get. There's a fight scene on the edge of the city where they blow up an ATST. A lot of stormtroopers die so many stormtroopers. There'sgroundun I do appreciate Thank you. I do really appreciate the g M the Kit a stun gun If you're seventeen, you're not to commit also start. I'm going to point out he was he picked up a gun Which meant he had to at least switch it to sun, so it was a choice because the storm trooper he picked up the gun from was not the one storm troopert hurt any. I wouldt have the question for you, Tony, and I I thought I haven't done itet takingen back I think they've actually been aging up Reiley throughout the series. I think he looks older now than he did the beginning. What do you think I do I do not have a sense of how old he is. Uh, and I and it's, you know I hisis behavior does seem. So I think He's clearly high school, right? Yeah. I would covever that late teens That's that covers a pretty Yeah, but that I mean, that covers a significant kind of range and especially like Are you a child or an adult? And in high school, you kind of move along that range becausecause sometimes he and you know a lot of growing up in these couple episodes, right? This is not even his first chase across the city. He's seen several explosions. That's what it takes to make you an adult witnessing an explosion. How many? But he does, you know, he does pick up a gun And there's definitely the thing where his dad is like, this not the life I wanted for my child is my. But is also holding a gun. Iimated in a later episode that he has trained him how to use a weapon. Yeah Yeah Um So Yeah, I think they are I dont I am reminded a couple of episodes earlier when he's running around with Devin and they're on the run and they get, you know, cornered by the Inquisitor and things like that. And at first he's like, what is happening? What is happening? We can't trust the bad guys. What's going on? Stormtroopers aren't our friends And there's like a little bit of a connection between him and Devin, but she's clearly like of a level more worldly than he is. seen a lot But, you know, he's now stunned once he's stunned a dozen stormtroopers. I mean, you know that's sort of like you're He's not a part of the gang So there's this extended sequence where there's like a river of acid sludge And they have like a little skimibber thing that they have to like ferry people back and forth. Im reminded of the classic like go box great rain. Yeah. Yeah problem because it's like, who's gonna go with who And then you know, and then stormtroopers show up before the stormtroopers show up, the Inquisitors show up. It's cool and they like rush in and like the crow Oh yeah kind of like tles leaps off a wall Yeah Yeah. not natural There's some really good Yeah like design, character design, audio. And you have this I mean, I'm impressed because this is a show that has had a lot of fight scenes and a lot of set pieces, you know, Yeah I feel like I didn't love the set piece on the bridge, especiallyelt a little bit of thatted It felt very clone Wars. Yeah, I felt the same way. It was like, ye directing at each other. everyveryone marching towards each other. But this the fight on the by the asset sledge was good and especially there's that one O shot where all of the raving lightsabers like they're all blocking each other. we reound that to be like, that work? Yeah. and I I was also reallyally impressed that Darth Mul actually sent everyone first and like ye, Darth Maul actually may not be a bad guy He is a bad guy, but he is a very smart bad guy. but he is our bad guy is named after Machiavelli. Well, yes, because I want to be I want to be extremely clear here. Machiavelli is a bad guy. No, I said like Machiavelli, like it also I disagree Well, that's what I was wishing for because clearly Yeah I think there's a anyways. we'll do this for another day. Nad Well he does. writ in with whether Makia Vllvelli's a good guy. Okay. H anyone actually read the printince write in and tell you think Makiavelli' a bad person? Oh okay, you're making them do homework. Yes. You cant just like go off of like whatever clod tells It's called having an opinion. Name your top five Monkey Vlly books There's more than one. Oh my God there is. I took an entire class of Machiavelly and Klawitz. That explains a lot. And Klauswitz, it wasn't just Machquiavelli Okay. U so Uh there's highting fight fight fight It's a pretty I feel like, you know, this this fight scene, I feel like is interesting. I like the like the drama of they trying to get away Yeah it's hard. you know, this is this whole episode is very I felt like it was kind of probably lifting from like a western where you got the like people together and like even when they're like wal and they're having their weird conversations and it's like You've got the Mandalorians, you've got the Jedi, you've got Maul It's the weird together and the Lawsons. Like that's a weird collection of people. It also very much reminded me of Fellllowship of the Ring when they're running away from the Nazgul and they get across the forord, I think tobris, the ferry debris. Yeah of just like getting across and being the last ones. And I again, I really like what they've done this entire time, heightening the tension of Darth Maul with the with the bad knee. and they've done that really like subtle ways. There's a couple things. One, I think it is really cool to see how they throw these people together and how Maul especially is trying to balance his long term and short term goals, right? because he has he has interest in this and he does things like letting the other ones go first because he is smart enough to know like, okay Well let Devin, you know, we let Devin go because she's the one I want to see apprentice. so I need to show that I trust her. But then I also am going to let her master. I mean, I let Doci go because if I don't, she'll look at me and be like, noah he's not he's selfish, right? And it's all very cleverly calculated. It is And again you know, it's his show. Yeah. what it's like He wants to be a crime boss, but also he has a personal vendetta against Palpatine. and also he needs to get off this planet. I mean,'s an apprentice. Yeah,'s it's also interest. I think it's also interesting in that it shows a good example of how you can create tension Even if that is not about whether or not characters live or die, Yeah because we have first of all, lots of our ancillary characters biteed here. Spy Bot Spy. Oh my Godd. Spy Bot. Did not do that There's a heartbreak Maul has a reaction to myb being being pissed. It's like it's like his dog. you know Well, and I guess it's like, I don't know how you read that exactly. I read it as like he's upset you could maybe, you know, a less generous reading is his that's an inconvenience for his plan. I I think he's a like I think he's upset. I think's I want to think he's upset. I mean they he does p it a couple of times in various episodes. Yeah B is the one who's as evil as he is. But like Sybot also kind of Spybot gets like more screen time than the nameless Dathamary guys who technically briefly get names before and also several Mandalori Cas Cook? we haven't gotten there yet. I mean she she unexpectedly dies shortly afterwards. Less ceremoniously. But like ye, like I do enjoy that the Dathamirary guy takes out several stormtroopers when he realizes he's going to die, which is a great move There's also a fantastic shot at the end there where Maul throws his lightver and before the camera goes with it it cuts up. I feel like it was very similar to that many bit Yeah in the accolyte too. And then also when he jumps in the air and blocks it, like again The angles and the shots on this are so dynamic and so good. And I think you pointed this before, Dan, it's also very easy to follow what's going on, which is great. correct. But say like that is the key. Mul We know Maul will survive because we know the chronology events. Well there might be twins. you don't know. Also like, I always feel like that's how I get frustrated people. Yes I always get frustrated when people are like, o, well, we know that so and so is alive or well they're not around later, so they must be dead, which sometimes people are I when people were like dismissing rebels because they're like, wow, they don't show up later. so they must be all dead.' like No they' be just this background thing. Yeah But also You know, lots of horrible things can happen to you without killing you Yeah exactly. And the dynamics's probably the big one where it's like he's inside a stomach all several. And also like emotional trauma and the dynamics mostly b being in a stomach. Because if he gets captured, for example, that shows a different dynamic. D differentnt plots happen. if he gets captured by the inquisitors and they are able to Either torture him or get information of him or like the dynamic changes. as we'll see in a moment, there are things to fear. Anytime you have a main character in a book, that's true. Like I think of there's like ten Horizatio Hornbler books and they're never like, Ohh, man, I don't know Hornbler is gonna to live die. That makes the book so bor. It's like, no, it's the protagonist. It's fine. You don't kill your protagonist. But we did kill a lot of people who don't have names. It's like several Malorians died who minute Yeah. That ded to bring me to this episode. Yeah. Spybot did shock me. I cried out Yeah, you were very impited We went out for Spybot. Cortly after Spybot dies U they're like they're transitioning from acid River to jungle and theiz say also what P you know wizardors say somebody's going to, you know, Someone's over there and and suddenly you're like whoo the what now? And I was like, who could they be talking about other than Darth Vader Sur surprise, It's Dar Vader, your big episode. Did not think was Darth Vader And when they were in I was like,h I don't know, mayaybe it's like another Inquisitor and then when they go out there And what's cernamic in the Mandalorory? Rook cast. When she gets killed, it's done to me like crunching, I was like, o, there's a rancor here. and I was expecting a dinosaur to come out and then I was I was expecting Swamp mononster. shocked. Horror movies shock That it was Darn Vader. Absolutely f awesome reveal U And then I guess I don't know if this bleeds into the next episode, but like Mul is like Who are you That was cool that none of them were ever singking. Well this I was wondering this is people like his first mission. Well people should know who he is because like there isn't posters of Darth Vader all over Turing the empire. He's also he's only been Darth Vader for I'll short amount it becauseight. Yeah, yeah, yeah. he he he comes out at the end of Revenge of the Sif This is a year or two question mark after that. So he hasn't been around a lot. And I I mean, it it's very interesting because it's not. I mean, sometimes we see Darth Vader and other things and he's like chat he doesn't say anything here. This is one we're gonna because you know, since Dam Joel Jones passed away has been widely reported, they Lucas Film basically bought the rights to his voice so they can synthesize that. So they absolutely could have had him use dialogue. But it's so much better. It was so when he doesn't. I was just say, I think it's like to your point here, this is the first time we see Darth Vader. and like it has been I think they fone whoever made this realize like we don't We haven't really played around with people encountering Vader for the first time. Most of our interact with Vader are people who know him and fear him. And it is way more enjoyable to be like everyone be like, you're not a quisitor. L what is this? It is And that is like such a weird take onli like Darth Vader, maybe the most recognizable iconic thing in Star Wars. And what if we put him into a thing where people are like, we don't know what this is Yeah. And I also appreciate just the way he's animated. Yeah. I feel like they very much went back to the like nineteen seventy seven Darth Vader who's like hking and he like he's swinging his sword almost like a baseball bat and he's He's got kind of Frankenstein kind of m. And I feel like a lot of that was P just the limitations of you know, we thear the suit and Darth Vader was played by a big bodybuilder and, you know, and the lightsaber fights were not, you know, there were limitations for how they much they can choreograph them back then. And this is almost like Let us take that and like twisted into that Yeah instead of like I feel like I don't know. I'll just say I was kind of more impressed with this Darthlader than like the Darthader we see in Obi Wan, which is a little sad where it's like You know I would throw into this and I mentioned Kat and I were watching it like the closest antalog to this is Vader's first appearance in Rebels where he Canan and Ezra run into him And they have the same reaction because they've been fighting inquisitors And they're like And Ezra I think says to him like, what was that? Another inquisitor? and Kayan says no That was something else because like they bring down like like an ad ad on him or something and he's just like and' like, o no. Well you saw that too when they're trying to collapse the u when Temple Yeah.most they like Vader were just batting it away. Well, and it's so interesting in the dynamics, right? Because I do think it throws into two regards that like Docy I think says a dark Lord of the Sith at one point right now. So that's a different beast than what they've encountered. The Inquisitors are not that Even Maul who's a nominally a Sith apprentice at one point It's got that far. Maul has crossed paths with Anakin I Yeah right. But its but it doesn't, you know, ye. But I also have this like the warring apprentices like who like Dad likes which of us better sort of situation Yeah, and it's it was also to your point about fight, fight, fight this it's interesting, they keep changing who's in the fight in the dynamics to do a really good job So like the previous fight, right was the Two inquisitors against the three Jedi surrounded by stormtroopers And now we have essentially the three not Jedi, but like Ma and the two Jedi versus Vader and the two Inquisitors and now like it's increasingly getting more and more intense and they'll have to hold themselves. And I think it's also been very cool to realize like You know what? Like Devin and um Docy actually must be quite good because they hold their own for quite a while And I will say also on a side note here, there's one moment where I think Devin's in danger. It's in this episode of the last episode And they do a quick shot of Doci's face and they animate his concern for her in his like turtle face In his st her face. Yeah There there's a lot of little things I like here. I mean There's a line in episode nine where when they've regrouped, you know, that statue in they getting their way out Cast says to Maul something about like what about the old man And he says, show some respect. That's a Jedi master. And then' like but he's going to be a problem. He's like, we're in we need him now for this is again, Maul's calculus, right? Mauls I love the fact that he and Docy and Devin kind of unquestionably unquestioningly work together. for this whole span up into a point because it's like We're not going to survive if anyone like we're doing our best here with three on like the two inquisitors. and then you throw Vader into the mix too and it's like, okay, we're just barely holding our own. I also I just like the dynamic. I mean, I think I get bored of fight fight fight pretty quickly I just even like this dynamic that like they're not trying to defeat Inquisitors. Yeah. They're just trying to get away. But it like it keeps Yeah, like whether it's the the acid thing or the the then they' they're in a temple and then they're on a bridge that a bridge that does not look structurally sound. No likeike, you know, they're just trying to hold off, get away because I'm not super interested in the like Wh will win this fight. but it's like Who's going get away? and they have shown us like You know, it has been interesting. This is a show with a lot of characters and A lot of them do not make it in this it's it It kind of feels like we are pivoting to horror movie here. It is a little hor. It is sure. I also like and wrap separate So the not dp. We can go on the podcast. I've want more to say about that. You guys are done. Noope, So like they they're fighting on that. And then at one point Vader Darth Mll they push off Moroc Right Yeah into the void. But we know he's not dead. They tell'll be the effect of him going, o sh. But we don't know again, maybe this is how we turned into that weird whatever he is Yeah, maybe we don't know if he reports for work tomorrow or if he is lost in a canyon for thirty years years. It's unknown Unknown. Wait for the Tie in novel. And then Maul Devin gets separated fighting the crow in the ruins Maul realizes his moment and pushes they've been cooperating over when the two of them cooperates, they're able to hold their own against Vader. And then at one point, Maul stopped cooperating with Doci They don't do as well. Uh Maul falls back pushes Doc Eat into Vague Beanards grp And then runs away just in time for Devin to see Vader kill Docy. Docy does I believe get a hit on Vader. Oh yes. yes. And I feel like that was kind of the like now Darth Vader is done with Yeah. I mean it's the same thing that move happens in Empire too. there he and Luke are fighting a bunch. Luke gets one off on him and Vader's like now more hand. But that's when he really does the battering again and again. I think you're absolute right like very evocative of E early Vader. And again, which makes him so Frankenstein is such a good analogy there. There's just there's something about the hulking L He does not fast. It's just it's and he also like he's almost kind of unsteady. It' it's very terminator like, right whereere he just he just doesn't stop. Every time you think you've got to wait there's part where like a hand That's the jump scare. That legitimately scared me. I litose It was good Yeah, I felt like that was unusual for Darth Vader. I feel like usually we see him coming from a long way. That was not the Darth Vader who like smuged Darth Vader who sits at the opposite end of the dining table. Yeah. This is like, no, I'm coming through allall for you. So the keep f I'm assuming Devin is or sorry, I'm assuming Master Dockey is dead. You get stabbed with L saber. I dont A lot of people get stabbed with things and get better The Grand Inquisitor got real really That's true. It was fine later. but with But he wrote cast sound like her back up broken There Yeah. that was real b.' bones The one that I think might still be alive is Lawson because we don't see a body. He does stumble off after getting shot and is there are a lot of people that yeah, we don't necessarily see, but Yeah, sorry we jumped ahe. No, no no. I was just so I mean it's a fightight fight There's a f fight fight. they fight in the ruins. Devin turn evil nototably that like she loses theue saber and then gets given the red lightsaber so that everyone understands like by the way, she's turning evil now, she has a red lightsaber They fight Vader Maul pulls her out, they crash the ruin and then they're off. And then we haven't talked at all about the fight scene that's going on over in the jungle. To boots and Vario and Riley and Lawson Lawson and basically kind of running around in the jungle. There's a turret. There's a turret And they did a good job at like making the turret kind of scary because the Sg droers is there's This it felt video gameasqu where it's like, no matter what you do, there will be twelve more stormtroopers or living in ten seconds. But the turret is this kind of like This is a threat Right. And there's and there's this fog, right? I love the fog sh all the stuff. There's earlier a shot when Vader, I think first appears in lightsab his lightsaber. You don't even see the lightsaber but you see the glow of iting him and it's terrifying So good. Again, the visuals in this, there's also one, I think matte painting the very start of episode nine, those again just incredible Yeah, so the Vario amazingly agrees to be Bait. which allows two Boots and Lawson to grab the turts, most of people down and shoot down the b Big ship. shuttle Yeah the shuttle Um And then more stormtroopers and gunhips gunsips show up. They're shooting him for running around. then eventually Paul Bentney shows up shoots down the gunships Um Sanvario gets on, but essentially Riley and Tuboot can't get to the ship So Lawson decide, tells two boots to make sure Riley gets on the ship and take care of him. Get them to his mother, I think. Get him to his mother and then grabs It works for the emmpire. mean It's. Yeah. And then which would be interesting to see if they talk about that dynamic in the next season And then Lawson grabs the turt and runs into the fog, shooting down storm troopers doesn't go very dies almost immediately. Yeah He doesn't die. He gets shot. No the turret dking almost immediately But Riley and Devin get off Maul gets off U One Mandalorian is saved. Unnamed Two boots is there. And that's and both kids are mourning their Yeah, both kids arev and basically parent figure tells Maul that she will Subscribe to the newsletter. Yeah. Yeah sububstack. Well interesting I don't want it to make it sound like it' too much of a rapid jump. Obviously he's been working on her since he first had these two characters interact I do think she is in the heat of the moment here. And we may see this show is coming back for a second season. We may see that she regrets that initial like in the moment like, yes, I want revenge right now. I will like teach me. but she may be like That may not be an immediate sort of falls of the dark side so much as it's a driven by this moment. Well, it's interesting to see both her and Riley mourning at the same time and Riley is sad and crying and Devin, I think is fued with anger I've had people process their grive differently. And I think We talked this earlier like or I mentioned it like in the last maybe episode eight where Devin is there to protect Riley at one point she has a chance to protect him, but she doesn't. Riley gets kidnapped. and I think she knows that. It would be really interesting to see to what degree Riley is a foil along her path at the Dark side in the next season. if he's in it at all. Yeah, I thought it would be, but I mean, I wasn't sure if they were going to how much they were going to set this up for a, you know, next season versus would these be a ten episode kind of encapsulated thing and it sure seems like they wrote this expecting to continue the story because it does not feel like the story is done It feels like they told chapter one of the story I should think this was a really surprisingly great show for a show I was kind of skeptical of because I did not dont I did not have a very high opinion of Maul, but they really made Maul a more interesting character This is not a show that I feel like other animated Star Wars things has had filler episodes and it's frustrating when you you know, you only get like eight episodes a year and then one or two of them are filler episodes. and that did not feel like the case here Uh I don't know. I just the performances of all the characters are really good. I thought the writing was pretty solid. There's a lot of fight fight fight and action sec pieces which may not be for everybody. I feel like some of those are just, that's what you get with animated Star Wars. so That didn't bother me And I think the scenes are well done and they really lean into The of what you can do in animation and things that are harder to do in live action the language of every. we We've talked about this before. the way the characters move. like You can't do that in live action, you have to treat the vocabulary is different. The choreography is different. You can draw characters doing literally anything, right? And like they do a great job of making the characters move like people. and like the This is the thing we've talked about, I think with a lot of the animated stuff is how much better the animation has gotten over time, notot only for the way that it looks, but the way that it moves. Like there's a scene here you come done the I think the look of it's like a close up on Darth Maul's fist like clinching. The leather and his glove was incredible. I thought just the musculature of the way his hand moved looked so good and real and like The fact that even if it's cartoonish, it's modeling so closely. they've gotten so good at modeling the movement of people and everything seems very fluid. If you go back and watch the early Clone War stuff, like it's janky Yeah And they've gotten a lot better at that. And they use the strengths of it, which is these ability for the characters like you look at like the Crow and Maroqu, right They jumping around and doing stuff and Docy's doing sersults and all this stuff and it's like do this in live action I don't think it would look as good. I think it would look kind of corny cor. The big thing I noticed is just the environments look so much better. I was watching a clip of or early Star Wars thing or Clone Wars thing, I think where a character, who we're going to see in the Mandalorian and Grger gets introduced. and I was just like, o, you know, I remember liking But I don't think the standouts of Cold Wars, the animated series was the visual was the stories. Which character Uh there's a if you remember in the there's Is it technically a movie? There's like the animated Clone Wars it's kind of like the pilot it's where Ahsoka gets introduced. They go and rescue a baby hut that has been I don't know if we'ol. We followed Dan had we had like early one. Janes That may not be on Jane' We follow Janes's watch list Watch list. because it's's not great But that hut comes back in Mandalorian engment but is all grown up now Ahsoka calls him stinky Maybe maybe we watch should I forget I've probably seen it once and not rev Yeah because it's not great. Firstod I was watching that when I originally started. I think it took us a couple episodes to watch to the Clone watch before I was like, eh. Is this really good? I don't know, and then it got really good. takes a while. And you know, it's You know, it'll be like, here's a Jarar episode with Jar Jar being stupid for twenty minutes and then it's like, here's an episode about the horrors of war. But for kids, you. Guys, our landmine's ethical, but for kiss. They are not turns out. What do we do with dessters? For kiss. U there is some I mean, so they've said basically they're already working on season two. They've been doing it for a while. someome comments which I enjoyed Charlie Bushnill who plays Riley says he's really interested in seeing Riley's growth after losing his father Sam Whitworth said Maul gets a ponytail, opens a dog rescue and gets a squirrel friendriend voiced by David Collins, who's the guy do the voice for Sybot I'm here for it Uh and apparently Vario is still in the picture. continues to be evolved in the AB andC wild to me. I thought there was a a character. I for sure thought he was gonna die. I mean, there's even like there's the episode where like Maul's like, we're done with you. And he's like, I'll hang around. It's like. All right, buddy. But he brings a nice levity to it. It actually's a good balance there. Especially with feel spybot that Devin doesn't know about Maall pushing Dockey Very few people know Brad Ra, one of the producers said and the audience is one of the people That's good dramatic irony right there when the audience knows things that the characters do not. Um But yeah, there's a lot I'm Yeah, like you said, Tony, I think they had a story idea. They executed it very well over ten episodes And It looked great voice acting, very solid. Sam wor is I mean, he's elevated that character. I think as we talked about the past and really turned him into an interesting fellow. Interesting ensemble cast. likeike it wasn't just Maul, but like and I feel those conversations with a Cad Bane story was like it was Cad Baye, like everyone else wass these bit they were tropes. but everyone here was like really interesting. and like as are multid dimensional K even K sorry Kad Bane, not but you're not interesting. You're not nor are the other characters of that. But this was this was really interesting And I like I I mean, I love the mishmash of all the different like Star Wth tropes mixed together, rightight? I mean, I love that it's like We've got becausecause we don'tnd a lot time with basically cops in Star Wars, which is fine. but we've got Cop Dad and his kid. We've got Jedi Master and Arentice. We've got Maul as your villain. We've got Mandalorian kind of mercenaries, and we have, you know, a robot cop. And like a random crime lard It was like maybe a heart of gold, but really unclear. Yeah, mightbe appendix of gold. Also like the subject. sort of a subplot of this whole story in this first season is also the slow encroaching of the empire. Yeah, right? Like Janx is a planet that is like it's kind of been left alone, right? Like you know what We just Keep our heads down you know, we've got our own law enforcement We're not really worried about anything and it's really not until the empire by the end of this as they're fleeing L the beginning, there's a shot of like the there's the star destroy flying over the city and they're there's a curfew. Storm troopers are everywhere. They're checking everybody's IDs. like and you get the impression, like as I think Lawson says at one point is like, they don't Go home afterwards rightight? This is how the empire is deserating control And it's interest I mean, I feel like they are very intentionally This is like an occupied city. Yes. Yes, very. it feels intentional that like, for example We see like they've they've got a new paint job. but they the republic drops shhips.. The emmpire seems to have brought one hundred of them to and they're all about to blow up. you know. And we do also see, I thought it was interest. I think this might be chronologically our first Lambda Suttle appearance. I assume that was Darth Vader's personal rightide there. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it does seem significant that it's like, yeah, remember that ship that we used constantly in the Clone Wars. Now there's one on every street corner of this this city that is not at war, but is occupied I think that also is true is like it definitely shows the encroaching of the emmpire. I think it also shows another view on like how the rebellion forms becausecause you have three groups that are arguably at odds with each other who are fighting each other in the first half of this who are like Yeah, like it is way better for us to team up against this evil than to fight our petty fight And I think it was kind of interesting to see the first time we saw that with Andor was like somewhat moreally like great characters and it interest seemingly more so Ver gray characters in fact, not really gray at all are still fighting the empire. It's also interesting because unlike I think the Bad Batch tackled some interesting territorory similarly, watching the empire becoming more and more of a force. But this time, I think we're dealing with also the impact on like normal people, like average people like seeing especially Lawson. I think, you know, he's a cop, whatever, but like He's just a dude, right? Like he's not a guy who's like a spepecially trained mercenary or whatever. like he's just a guy and a kid who's caught up in all this events. And that feels very relatable when you're tal the perspective of like, what does the empire does it mean for you as a citizen When the emmpire just rolls in and is like running it now. I like the bad batch, but like They're super soldiers. they have no home. Yeah. They're they're just, you know, they're bumming around the galaxy looking around for their next job They don't like, I mean, they make some friends here and there, but like They're not from anywhere. Yeah.. you know. Yeah. This reminded me a lot more of the story of Gorm from another perspective U All right Do you guys think Lawson is dead? Is it just me? or do you guys think Lawson's al to? no body Yeah, it always Starars nobodyody is is I mean, we need't we don't see a body for Rcast, but she's heard she sense My hunch is they haven't They don't know yet is my hunch. They're kind of keeping it open ended to see if they want to do something with him in the next season. That's my gu. I think what's interesting is there's a lot of There's a lot of possibilities there. And I think they like you said, keeping your options open might be good, but also I think there is an interesting story to be told I saw this somewhere else do a good job of this with the You just don't know Right Like like you never find can sometometimes And just happens. peopleeople die And you can't go back. Right too dangerous. You can't go back for sure. Maybe they're alive. Maybe they're not. you have to live with them. We were just watching season two, the Night Manager. That was the when they did it Maybe there there were few places. There were a few stories I see I've done the good job. It was like, guess what in life sometimes You don't know. You don't know and you have to deal with the not knowing. Yeah. And I think that's that's some in some ways, that's harder because you have that hope in the backyard L like well may I never saw him die Yeah. So, you know, complex. It is said for sure Mocky Miller doesn't think it's sad. He thinks it's good planning. No, again, you have to read the print Fine prints. L Sour in seven eighty nine joke All right, listener mail. Listener mail. I mean all chat veryery excited to see where season two goes. We'll be back obviously to talk about that. Yeah. I feel like the evil twilk will be fun. Like we don't see a lot of evil This evil. Not yet. It happens Uh All right Normally I don't include stuff from the threads on our discord, but I'm gonna include these because people I don't read the whole thing. S please do not read an entire thread from Discord. Yeah CJ says Olives, Yay I like them enough that confuses me that most other people don't like them Like, yeah, they're salty, but the rest of the flavor isn't subtle. I feel like most people can agree that nice olive oil tastes good and the nice part of olives tastes like that for pretty obvious reasons Um, Thanks to you J U Joe says black olives, thumbs up. Green olives, thumbs down. parentheses. this is mostly about pizza. U and the rest of I think are for me talking about alll of. Y I guess I don't need that. We already knew Kat was an olive supporter. But I generally agree. I do think black olives are superior to green olives. and I wouldn't put green oive on pizza. I would just put a black ol of on piz I think that's fair Matthias on Macedon says, yeah, but not too many hashtag olives Too much of a good thing Um Have I changed your mind about all of it Tony No Did you think that this was going to change my mind? I was aware that other people like this I'm fine that other people like things that I don't like. What So you want to be like o. No, I'm fine with that. People like different things Not everyone has to like the same thing I like. and I don't have to like the same thing other people like. You We're all different. I'm not. Rick writes in. So Rick sent us a few questions that got waylaid by the interternet post offffice, but we'll fire them up now Ftirst Rick wrote Hi, I saw a few places online speculating that Devin will become Maul's apprentice and eventually Darth Tallon from the comics. Do you think this is a likely possibility I will ask what everyone is wondering, whoo is Darth Tallen? I know the name, but I don't know their background I know that it's a Twi L like dark Jedi Yeah possible I don't think we know much became a Sith lady Hello Yeah does have kind of mall like tattoos, certainly possible That would be cool That would be very cool I guess we're going to have to I guess see what happens, I suppose. But this seems like a lot late. I think that character I think that seems like timelinees to When do they says one hundred and thirty seven AB Y. Oh, I'm so sorry Yeah What year does that? one hundred and thirty seven after the Battle of Yavven, which seems way. But how could they be Um, Darth Ma's apprentice. Are Darth Mul's apprentice in the I guess the point is do they live, do they outlive this? but it it's a question They said lived Yeahah, I don't know. I don't know. The ban the basics of the way this character seems to exist, probably not, but I don't also don't know what which canon this is from. I think so I think Darth Darth Hen be Devin, but maybe inspired by or something Maybe inspired. Yeah Is Darth Callen from the new or the old That is Don't this is no, this is leegends actually. so they come In theory So Darth Talon is totally from Uh comics that don't exist. Devin is mentioned in the Wikipedia. You may be looking for and it says Devin isar a apprentcess of Darth Mul. It possible that they might borrow some stuff from that character for this, but brring back Mara Jade literally said they're not going to do it Be I say it right before really good idea for her, I'm sure Rick also asked High Star Wars pals. After watching episodes five and six, it seems to me that Maul is taking a much more balanced approach to his force usage It especially evident in the practice sequence he goes through. He starts off with a single lightsaber and more Jedi like forms. Then towards the end goes back to his original double bladed form. It's very clear to me he has evolved from the Hatefield Rge Beast from the Phantom Medicine Clone Worars TV series, Do it seem to you that he's using both the light and dark sides of the force Loving this series and hearing your commentary every week. thank you and keep up the great work. Thanks for next weeick I mean, I think we're talking about this of like, is he? Is he dark? Is he light? Is he like a different form of chicken meat like? I think this is a question that that modern Star Wars is much more interested in engaging with is this idea of Does this only exist along these two polarized, you know I think Money is very clearly saying, I mean, no, that it's not to, in fact D Bifurcation of this dichotomy is actually a very bad thing Um think is one of the lessons from Star Wars. I think a lot of stuff has like The Last Jedi played with this. the Aolyte played with this. like a lot of these have really dealt with this idea that like you know, there is a continuum here and it's you don't have to necessarily be on one side or the other. That said. so small as a bigg Jedi and and Palpatine have kind of like a monopoly on how you think about the force, but it's more complicated than that, you know But I think Darth Maul to our conversation, that Darth Maul is very clever. and I think well use whatever tool is most effective for what he needs in that moment and not bound to any sort of one dark or light or he's uses Ezra too of like he uses the tools that are available to him for his aims, whatever they might be Um, Rick writes one more thing more recently Hi Star Wars Pals after watching episode ten a second time, I think Maul won in the end Hear me out. He got off worldorld and tricked Slash Ged Devin into being his apprentice Did you catch the foreshadowing moment where Lawson witnesses Maul throw Dockey at Vader? Yeah, I think that Lawson is not dead and we will come back and reveal the truth Also, is this a branch in darkide slash Sith family that starts a new generation and more Darkide lineage going forward I missed Maul Throwing Docyet earlier but I to we saw Mall throw Docky We just didn't like that Lawson saw it apparently. I don't know. I'd have to rerun that. I missed that part. I missed that part too Um We definitely have to rew watchatch that. But yeah, I definitely think Losson's liive. We we talked about that. But ye, Maul clearly won. I don't think there's any doubt in my mind that Maul is not the winner of like this show I like his point that Rick's point that like The branch in the dark Side Sith family, right? That Sith is like a flavor you know, that the dark side is also more broad than simply like the Sith Orthodoxy kind of like Well, that's cool because you're gonna have a sosoka then more broad too because she's not a Jedi, but clearly she's a light user I think and again, it's sort of getting away from the idea that the only people who are allowed to wield are these these extes Were the you know, was that coven in the accalte? Oh yeah Where are they? You know, it's it's good Tony Well, it's not bad there's And their show show got cancellled. so we'll never know. that's not their fault. Witch Kevin. Oh, I like them. God, the witches are so cool Bad news cat. I know about that. I love to watch it Finally, we have a new segment, which I'm calling Canadian Geography segment I. I looked it up. I know Windsor is not next to Toronto. It's next to Detroit. I'm sorry I'm sorry It apolog Toronto. is We apologize for everything Samrightan has said on this podcast. Sam looked it up after the show and I was like, no, okay. Sam, who I know from other technology relays. Hi, Sam. says Hey, ACP crew. In the most recent episode, you mentioned the train from Windsor to Que City, but didn't seem to know where Windsor is Windsor is actually about a five hour drive southwest of Toronto and is the southernmost city in Canada. Oh, that's interesting. In fact, the running joke among people who live here in Southeast Michigan is that it is in fact, South Detroit. Contrary to the journey song, D don't stop Eveving, there is in fact no South Detroit, but if you look south across the Detroit River from downtown Motown, you'll be looking directly at Windsor I've done that. I've done that view. It's amaz. It's weir to be looking south Detroit and seeing Windsor. For which Andy writes in, says for your new Canada geography.a two people wrote it on. This is why it's a segment. There's two people your to Canad' Geography Corner segment, Windsor Canada is across the river from Detroit. Also, fun fact, Windsor is the only part of Canada that is south of the United States Cat looks really unhappy about that Oh south of the Contiguous United States Correct. Let's be Pcise here forty eight. Yeah. let's like let's not make just not do I need to write back in can say sorry. Yeah. Not all of the lower forty eight. that would be no good. Yeah. An any of the lower forty eight I think answer. Yeah. But if you want to write in with other fun facts about Fanadian geography, then whenever we record our next episode, maybe we'll talk about it O or can write directly to cat at And and or about your favorite apples U Apple varieties. trying to like generate content, engagement. Yeah Fming engagement. I'm curious what people think about Fming apples and engagement. I always have questions for our listeners That'sine Some of us make conversations. Some of us do podcasts Do do you have a favorite npp They're all fine U I like probably a Granny Smith, but mainly for baking purposes Because the tartness is good for baking. You cut the tartness with a with Gran? Okay, Cat is so unhappy with me, You can't. You can't see the series the series of ures. You just said reed delicious Tony I just want to be clear, listeners, it is clearly not I see Granny Smith as your perfect I think it's a good baking apple. I' agree with you on that. It's not an apple that I enjoyed eat by itself Don'tat grandmas are here first. Um Well, if you would like to send in any of that information You can reach us via email at ACP at the inccomparable. com or on Mastedon at ACP atZepN Deflights or on Boostkuy at ACP.encouple. com or in our member disiscord if you want to be a member. and if you're not a member, you should become a member. You can go to the encomple. com plus members, sign up, get access to that member disiscord, plus you get a bunch other stuff like extra bonus episodes, bootleg episodes S Sag A lot of talk, lot of talk U When are we three gathering again? been lightightning win or rain I believe two weeks, two weeks. We will be back to discuss the Mandalorian and Grogu Available ser moginners. Thats which is basically a little out of our remit, but we've embraced it. I mean, let's be clear. Is it a movie? Is it a TV show that's in movie theaters? We'll find out. We'll find out But're soon. We have a babysitter. We have dance' parents babysitters. We're very excited Yeah So that so you don't have to go too long before you hear from us again. I know you're bought tickets so we have to do it. We have to do it. It one of our can not funded. No it's not Hey it's not one of the things we talk about doing and that don't do After we do that. Yeah that, we don't really have a lot of plans, so we'll have to come up with something. So write in with your suggestestions Gu guys w to go finish Secret Monkey Island rightight after her hiding. No. I was thinking we could also potentially do clone war It's a lot of clone Wars. Not all of Clone Wars. Or we go back and do Rebels. I love watching Rebels. I'll watch it again Well I feel like you've said that before. I then not done that. we did. We did rewatch all of our blls We've seen it twice on all the. Well, but we haven't done a podcast about it We did a podcast about an episode here and there. Yeah But we haven't done a podcast about the whole thing. I've also When I've had to watch young Jedi adventures, they're not back A thrilling endorsement. When compelled to forced to watch something our child was watching then he found too scary. All right, we're wrapping up Thank you everybody out there for listening and thanks most of all to my co hosts, Kat Benish. Thankks for being here. This has been a blast. I enjoy this way more than I was expecting I had low experations I guess Interpret that how you will. Fair enough. Thank you, Machquiavelli and Tony Sindalar Read the printince They'll be back for episode about the Prince. Tony said the lot. Thank you for being here Like the littleittle Pince? It's a really fast read. The little prince, yes. Oh my Godd. Remember what Hakivelli said, Draw me a sheath M I've actually never read the littleittle Prince And I've never read the prrince. so what Bye Tony, thanks for being here. Bye. Thank you, everybody out there for listening. We'll see you next time, but until then M the Force be with you The inccomparable Podcast Network. Become a member and support this show today the incomparable. com slash members