The Concept Behind Mitrea Corso

Pushkin Mihawk first became known to audiences as an actress, especially through her work in Stranger Things and in film. But she's been quietly building a parallel life as a songwriter of genuine depth. Since her debut album Blush in twenty twenty, she's released four records that are ever more reflective. Mitrea Corso, her fourth album, arrives at a formative moment in Hokk's life, following her marriage to longtime musical collaborator Christian Lee Hudson . The album's built around a central persona named Mitre Corso, who serves as a conduit for exploring themes of ego, ambition, and cre ation. Recorded in Woodstock in New York City late last year, the album was co produced by Hudson and Jonathan Low e, with album's artwork taken from watercolor paintings made by Maya herself. On today's episode Recorded Live from South By Southwest, I sat down with Maya Hawk and husband and co producer Christian Lee Hudson to talk about the making of My Trio Corso . Together they reflect on the development of their artistic lives separately, Maya in New York and Christian, mostly in LA , but also what it's like to come together as partners in life as well as music . This is Broken Record Real Musicians Real Conversations . This is an IHAT podcast guaranteed human I just got back from an amazing family vacation in Northern California . It was the perfect reset for our busy lives. Now if you're planning any upcoming trips, you could be listing your space on Airbnb. It's a smart practical way to make use of your place while you're away and earn some extra cash at the same time. And with the cohost network, you could hire a local cohost to handle everything like managing reservations, guest communication, and even styling your space. Find a co host at airbnb. com slash host . The future won't wait and neither should you. That's why American Public University offers master's programs designed for momentum , affordable, high quality, and flexible, so you keep moving forward. With career relevant programs in business, healthcare, education, IT, and more, you can gain skills you can use right away and the confidence to power your next move. American Public University made for what's next . Learn more at apu. ap us u. Being a small business owner isn't just a career, it's a calling. Chase for business knows how much heart and effort go into building something of your own. Manage all your business finances from banking to payments to credit cards , all in one place with their digital tools, plus access online resources designed to help your business thrive. Learn more at chase dot com slash business . Chase for business , make more of what's yours . The Chase Mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply . JP Morgan Chase Bank NA member FDIC copyright twenty twenty six ,orgenP Ch Mase and Company . Here's my interview with my Hawk and Christian Lee Hudson live from South By Southwest . Hi everyone . All right Thanks for having us. No, thanks for coming. Thanks for being here. It's cool to be in Austin and South by Southwest. It certainly is. So one of my I think I'm on the flight here , there's like five American cities that feel like they have their own internal logic different from any other you know, it doesn't feel like the it's not better than it's just very different than any other part of America . New Orleans feels that way. New York feels that way . I would throw LA in the Bay or the LA area, the Bay Area, and Austin, you know, feel like just completely their own unique things. Chicago's kind of unique too . Person agrees. Chicago and would agree . Yeah, you know what that is true, that is true and it has it certainly has a history. All those other cities do, so I wouldn't I wouldn't take that. How did you guys ' musical connection start? How did you guys start playing together? Via email. That's what I was gonna say. Yeah. The postal service. We yeah, exactly. We have a mutual friend named Benjamin Lazard Davis who produced my second record mosque and played bass on my first record . And knew Christian from working on Aquarville River , right? Exactly. Which you would I did a tour with them and just met the band kind of and then the guy Will, the songwriter and I wrote a few songs together. Cool. And Benjamin joined them at some he's a member now. He's like an on again it's like one of those bands like bright eyes where it's like who was the members of it? I don't know anybody who is who's who around? Right, right , right . Collective. But Will and Ben were on that tour. Will is obviously Okerville River, but then there's another Will Will Grave who's also been playing with me since I started who were on that tour with Christian. And then I asked Ben to work on this record with me or really to work on an EP and then all of a sudden I had like nine more days off of stranger things than I was supposed to have and was like, what if instead of making an EP we made a record because we've got some extra time. So then we had like two months to write six more songs and I was sending Ben and Will like poems every single day and they were, I think drowning in poems with which to put music to. And Ben was like, can I send some of your music to can I send one of your poems to Christian? And I never responded to the email. And then I got an email from Christ No, I just am bad at my email. Forgot And I never responded. And then I got an email from Christian being like I got your poem then. I And was so embarrassed because I was a big fan of Christians and was like, Oh no, oh that poem that was just a first draft. Please let me send you an editor. Don't work on that yet , but we've gone back since and like read those early emails and they're actually very sweet . And they're awesome. Yeah, they're awesome. So that's how we 're a great first poem too. Yeah. I wouldn't I was like, this is awesome. Wow. Ben sends crazy emails and that was a really good one again. Good Yeah, yeah, for you did it feel like this is maybe like the idea of it. Like you're okay, you're gonna get these poems in some form and write to them. Is that like a typical process for you? Or did that feel like were you surprised by how easy or natural that process was? Kind of I mean writing I like to write in a lot of different ways and that was a really fun way to be like , you know, sometimes you go in a room and someone has like seventy five percent of a song and you're like, cool, I'm just gonna throw out some like ideas for the last twenty five percent. And there this was a fun way to just be like this has no music and no you get to decide what the rules are because it was also COVID we were just sitting in my closet like with my guitar being trying to figure out what made the most sense out of the thing. So it was different and fun and immediately I was like, Send me another poem . Yeah . And then we had really a lot of fun and we met kind of making that record . It's incredible . I want to get back to just sort of the evolution of how you guys got to the latest record. But I mean, it's interesting because or maybe maybe I'm wrong, but I'm just gonna say this. You're not primarily like a songwriter or you were new to it at the time. You're right, you're right, you're not wrong. I would argue with that. I would say but I would but I don't just maybe it's I know I shouldn't let you up here. Yeah . I would say that misses Dreams Health is constantly writing songs. She writes songs every single day. She is a natural in the form of like in the fashion. Absolutely. I feel like before I like even awake, there's like a full like complete song that I'm just like, What the fuck is this? Well, okay, what I will say is that a big part of what's happened in my own musical evolution , so to speak , is that Christian, when we worked on Moss together, was so encouraging and was so like, well, actually show me like when you wrote this poem, what music did you imagine? And I would play it for it and you'd be like, wait, that's good. What do you like? Why didn't we do that? And I was like, No, it's not, it's trash. Because I was a very fortunate young person who was around artists my whole life and around amazing musicians my whole life and people that were so good at guitar and piano that it felt embarrassing to pick up an instrument in front of them, you know, and who were such extraordinary composers and instrumentalists that it didn't feel like I had anything to offer . And Christian was kind of the person that entered my life and was like you have something to offer because it is you that is offering it. It's not about the jazz school . It's about the nature of your heart and like the truth that you know the music and the words and how they combined. And so that sort of encouragement working on moss kind of created Chaos Angel in a lot of ways because was a product of me being like, Oh, I can incorporate my own melodies and I can write music. That was your third album. So by the time you did your third album, you did start to have more confidence in yourself as a person who is writing songs . Absolutely . And like which isn't to say that I wrote them by myself, I didn't at all, but I would instead of coming to the table with just a piece of paper with words on it, I would come to the table being like this, is what I've been playing. Like what do you think? I really like this chorus, but the verse melody sucks. Let's make it better. You know, it was a sort of more wouldn't you say that that's an accurate description of the vibe ? Yeah, I think that's a really accurate description. I think that you like chronically underestimate what because most of the musical ideas are working on it. I know. Most of the musical ideas that you have, I'm like, wow, this is so fucking heavy and trippy and there's a certain beginner's mind of when you don't know like what the rules are, you don't know that you're breaking them in a way very smart. You're very good at undercover. I am very good at turning a compliment into an insult It's truly makes me wonderful to be around. That is . I'll be like, oh, so you were saying I look beautiful by which you mean I'm dumb, you know? It's like a really , you know, it's really there's a lot of fun ways to twist a sentence. It's really convoluted to go from yourself. I'm a pleasure . You are actually Is the inverse true? Like if someone says you're smart, do you feel like well why are,n't you complimentary? Come on, aren't I beautiful? Yeah . What do you mean I'm smart? You know what I think about this one? You're saying I'm ugly. I have three daughters . One's a baby. So she doesn't really count. But I've so two daughters that are sentient in the sense of they can understand what I'm saying . I can kind of screw them up or maybe set them up for some sort of, you know, healthy life you know . And I'm always like, oh wow, you look beautiful. I'm like, oh yeah, but you're smart too. Like how is he like, fuck I shouldn't have said that or like how you're so smart and I'm like, Oh, I don't wanna think she's just like a nerd. Oh, you're beautiful too. And I don't know, I don't know. I'm very neurotic about like balancing any compliment I make with them . Yeah, being a woman sucks, you know? I mean, there's just like it's like there's just like it's all bad. Oh, don't clap for that. No, it's okay . But like, it's all bad. But I will I think as long as neither one is that heavy , you know, I mean, smart can be heavy, but I think it's just all about like it's not about what your parent says . It's about what you think they value about you. Yeah . And like, and I think that kind of extends more broadly to your partner or your friends, it's not about what they say to you. Like your best friend can be like, you're such a betch and you'll be like I know, you know , but like that and that's a wonderful and it's a compliment . And so it's never about what the words are. I think it's always about the feeling behind the words when it comes to intimate relations hips. Yes, the intents, the intent or perceived intent at least. In terms of when there's intimacy, it's about intent. Yes. When it's a stranger, it's about what you said. I think generally, right? Yes. That does make sense. I mean, I hadn't really thought about it or broke it down the way, but I think that's probably accurate. Yeah . I'm curious about because you both are really , you know , potent artists and engaged artists who have had different paths. You know, each have had your different path and they've kind of converged in this way . But what was your experience with the arts growing up? Like what was your relationship with it both in terms of how it int wasroduced to you and then, how did it sort of evolve on your own? How did it become something that you sort of took ownership of and felt like, oh, this is like for me, like I grew up with a lot of I grew up with my grandma who was from Detroit. So I just grew up in a motown in the house and I thought to the point I thought it was new music. But then I got to junior high, got into skateboarding, and I was like, oh, the Roman is like, That's my music, you know? And that sort of and then you circle back, circle back at some point to motown, but I did at some point sort of forge my own identity and art outside of whatever my family thought We're kind of curious how you guys would you guys came up with and how you guys started what music and art started to be formative in your own sort of identity. I'm going to set you up and I'm going to set you up by saying that I think that we know positive. Like I know you see it positive. Like just that one I think the thing that's cool about our friendship and collaboration is that we had a really different experiences . Like I was drowned in the arts and I think Christian really had to find it on his own . I didn't I don't know if somebody said the arts when I was a kid, I don't know if I would know what they were talking about. Really? There was no like art in my life there but there was weirdly there was Motown a. lot of L myike grandmother was a record collector, but didn't talk about the arts. She just grew up in Chattanooga and like was loved getting stacks records and motown records and showed me all of that and did that take? Absolutely. I was obsessed with it, but I also thought it was new music, which was very funny because I would like take it to school and it was like, wow, no one kind of knew I was talking about like, oh yeah, that's a song from like remember the Titans or something or whatever. And yeah, so I didn't really know about it and when I was like a teenager and there was like an arts program in school. I went to like a fundamentalist Christian school where there was like art was like , I don't know, it's like a poem about Jesus maybe or something. But yeah, it's liturgical . Versus I went to a high school where not while I was there, but in its origin , the headmaster used to take parents on school tours and say that if the students didn't have interracial sex and tried at least three different drugs before they graduated, he would consider himself a failure. So yeah, I had a very different headmaster. It was very different priorities than you . Really different priorities. You know, he had his own issues Stanley Bosworth. But what I mean to say generally is that I really was just like the arts seemed like the main option . Like I kind of remember meeting people with other jobs and being like, what do you do? And people would tell me like, why? You know what ? Yeah . And just like, you know, a normal thing to do every weekend was go to the Metropolitan Museum of Art and go to the nutcracker . Like it was just like everything was art and music and film and storytelling. And so it's something really cool getting to work with you is to kind of combine this like art as revenge and art as identity that I feel like you hold where like I couldn't rebel by being an artist . That was not a rebellion for me true . But it was for you and I feel like I love getting to like bring the feeling of like no art is everywhere. Art is everything and you can bring the art is rebell ion. Art is crazy . And we can kind of combine that in a way that feels really cool. Yeah. Growing up in New York, I mean, like you said, you grew up steep in the arts and in New York City. So like art probably has to go pretty far for you to feel like it's rebellious, right? I mean, this walks us down a whole new rabbit hole that we could talk about forever, which is like how do you make rebellious art now? How do you make protestt aren' I don't have an answer. Like it's very it seems very borderline impossible because of the way that the internet works and the way that like moments happen and like niche niches happen and how difficult it is. Like I was reading something about, you know, like it used to be so the way David Bowie dressed used to be so transgressive . And now it's like Harry Styles and Vensent Boone and everyone dresses like David Bowie and what could you possibly wear that would be transgressive? Yeah, I don't like, I don't have an idea. What sound could you make? That's what don't know. No. Like Yoko Ono is like the closest . I mean, yeah, like that's the most transressed. Not even anymore. It's just bad it's true. It's like not that she's bad, but like what I just did is bad. Well, another she's amazing is transgressive at all anymore because everything is everything. Yeah, and the only way you can pretend to be transgressive is to like be ugly or unfortunate or like horror or make some make a sound like that no one wants to hear is I mean like sonically ugly by the way . The biggest way you could be transgressed is to just shut the fuck up Yeah, that would be a crazy rebellion we all are obsessed with ourselves . I guess getting off the internet. You mentioned quitting social media. I don't know if I heard that right, but getting off the internet, I guess, is which is I don't want to say it's a weak weak way to be transgressive, but it's I mean in, the grand scheme of things I gu,ess it's not that. It's more of a personal thing than it is. It's like , I don't think I even get any points for being off social media because I'm still benefiting from it and profiting from it because I have the capacity to have someone who can like run my social media for me . So that's not a rebellion at all because I'm entirely participating in the system of it. I'm just trying to protect my own brain and peace from it. Yeah. So that's like zero rebellion. That's just like walling yourself in , which is working for me, but like I wouldn't brag about . We'll be right back with more from Maya and Christian after the break . I just got back from an amazing family vacation in Northern California . It was the perfect reset for our busy lives. Now if you're planning any upcoming trips, you could be listing your space on Airbnb. It's a smart, practical way to make use of your place while you're away and earn some extra cash at the same time. And with the cohost network, you could hire a local cohost to handle everything like managing reservations, guest communication, and even styling your space . Find a co host at airbnb dot com slash host . The future won't wait and neither should you. That's why American Public University offers master's programs designed for momentum , affordable, high quality, and flexible , so you keep moving forward. With career relevant programs in business, healthcare, education, IT, and more, you can gain skills you can use right away and the confidence to power your next move. American public university made for what's next Learn more at apu. edu. Being a small business owner isn't just a career, it's a calling. Chase for business knows how much heart and effort go into building something of your own. That's why they make your business growth their priority. The team at Chase takes the time to understand your mission , where you are now, and where you want to go. Their broad range of solutions is designed with you in mind so you can bring your ideas to life. From banking to payment acceptance to credit cards, you can conveniently manage all your business finances all in one place with their digital tools. Looking for tips and advice? Their online resources are always available to give you the solutions you need to help your business thrive. See how your business can get stronger and go farther with chase for business . Learn more at chase. com slash business . Chase for business make more of what's yours. The Chase Mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply. JP Morgan Chase Bank NA member FDIC copyright twenty twenty six JP Morgan Chase and Company . Let's talk about a song like Lionus on your new album is that seems like it's to a large degree ripped out of your life, but probably that there's also some things in there that we wouldn't necessarily recognize , you know ? Well, I guess I would say that I think that that song Miley Cyrus actually talks about this and I quote her all the time about it, which is that like every, I wish I could remember her pithy way of describing it. I don't , but that every song is like an encapsulation of a singular emotion or like we are we contain multitudes, right? Like sometimes you wake up in the morning and you're like, I hate my life and then an hour later , I love my life. And then like , you know, like we are always so many people . And so a lot of the time one thing that helps write a song is to like zero in on a specific feeling and to take out all the nuance and all the different ways in which you know you don't really feel that way and to add as much breath and life and blood into the singular feeling as possible . And I think that Lioness is a song about a moment where I was really struggling with gratitude . And like, you know, I had had all my dreams come true. I was doing the thing that I love most in the world and I was doing it and was able to take care of myself and provide for myself . And that was everything I wanted. And I was really depressed and really not feeling the magic, feeling the spark of creativity and I had this incredible moment on set where I got to watch my best friend bring the fricking house down with a performance . And I was like, Oh my God , it's not this environment that's not allowing magic to happen . It's not the genre or the tone or the budget or the this. It's me I'm emotionally shut off. I'm blocking out the magic . And I think that was a song that came from me wanting to kind of just do a wake up call and get out of the funk that I was in and so it's kind of like a cartoon version of my most ungrateful, like bratty self until the last verse . Like we've recently been talking a lot about this, you know, you know the voice in your head that tells you that you're like an absolute monster and that you're a bad person and that everybody hates you. Like we've been talking about that voice and been calling it like Schmigl . And like Schmigl is like, you are a bad person nobody loves you . You know? You do that voice too, Christian, is that awesome. It's kind of maybe just 'cause my voice is lower, a little bit scarier, I would say. Yours is kind of charming and easy to interface with. So you'd say yours ? Mine is like you are you are not doing good. You are doing bad stuff and you're no one likes you and you're you're you're a delusional weirdo . Exactly. And like sometimes when I go to like a fashion event, I speak in an accent and I do it accidentally, but she's like really fabulous and she says Darl,ing . She's like, Yes, darling, I'd love a glass of water, you know? And like these kinds of different characters that exist within all of us, right? You have like the little demon in your head and you have the fabulous person in your head and you have you. And I think sometimes I like to write from those Christian is an incredible like character songwriter and actually writes songs about characters that aren't him at all . And I would say I write songs from the point of vsiew of different characters that are all me . And like, so the lioness is like kind of like this depressed actress . She's like, everything's great. I love another water with ice , but I'm so sad and I don't even feel like an artist anymore. Am I an artist? You know, that's like that cartoon character . So every so you write from character s that are external , primarily, you would say. Yeah, they're I mean, they're external in the way they have behavior that is like different an amalgamation of different I'm like a collage artist of just different stimuli or whate ver it's mainly. My characters aren't anyone specifically, but they're sort of kind of a lot of songs that are stories from experiences that you never had. Yeah, exactly. But that's what I mean. It's just like collage of different people's experiences or whatever and how they would it's like a fan fiction of life of people and stuff, you know , they got they got that joke.. Okay Well, I didn't even mean to make that joke idiot. Christian has a song called Fanfiction . And they laughed. And I think it's 'cause they know that. Yeah. Thank you. I'm asshamed I didn't pick up on it. Well, I didn't pick up on it either and I'm embarrassed that I accidentally quoted myself. So I want to ask Maya, you're as some maybe still are a fan of Taylor Swift? Totally. I mean, I mean yes. Boy say, how what? How could you not be? She's the goat, like she is inspired a generation of songwriters to be themselves and to be free and believe in themselves. That's what I wanted to hit on. So what is it about her songwriting and her influence? Well, she's an extraordinary musician who I'm pretty sure can do anything , but I think she chooses to write songs that are really simple and really approachable or like a lot of the time musically . And so much music is so intimidating, especially for young women. And I think it was really when I was a little girl and I got my first guitar and I went home and I typed in, oh, I want to learn how to play , you know , all you need is love by the Beatles. And I was like, I can't. Like what the, I mean, maybe that one is actually kind of simple, but it's weird. It's weird, right? Yeah. Like and I was like, oh, I can't do this. And then I was like, oh, this is so discouraging, right? I'm so like , I feel so bad about myself that I can't, it sounds so simple when I listen to it, but when I try to do it, I can't do it. And then I was like, okay, I'm going to learn to play Taylor Swift's hours. And I was like, oh, I obviously can't play it as well as she can, but I can play it. I can sit in front of my family and be like, These are the chords and I'm playing it and I'm singing this song. And it's so encouraging . Like it's so inspiring and it makes you feel like, oh my God, a song that I love that changed my life and inspires me is accessible to me . And it makes you believe that you can write songs and that you could even write songs that could change the world . It's like punk rock. It's like the Ramones or whatever when you I'm sure that like everyone that plays music had the moment where they're like, Oh shit I could do this today. Yeah right now just go to like the thrift store and buy the thing and I could play like fucking whatever. That's what Taylor Swift does, I think. And then she does that and then also happens to have like written I think a lot of the greatest songs of the last twenty years and like and over and over again alb,um after al bum and it's pretty impressive and does it while being like pretty incredible role model at the same time and not seeming to have that be too much of a burden. So it's pretty cool . Yeah Yeah . What is your favorite Taylor swift album? Fearless, but I've been in the game from the beginning and you can't replace your first experience. You know, so I wouldn't say that I wouldn't I don't I wouldn't say it was the best album, but it is my favorite. Yeah . It's also We did fall in love to a Taylor's to fearless, the fearless song. We did yeah. And then to some red . I So would say like Fearless Red and then Toronto Poet's department. Wow . You guys fell in love to fearless. We had some pivotal we've had some exaggeration bonding moments It's most men that you meet as a young woman when you say you like Taylor Swift, they say, Oh, that's so annoying. Don't put it on to the car. I don't want to listen to it. I don't want to like, oh you're so like and you get to meet one who puts it on in the car on purpose , not to manipulate you. It's a pretty big deal . Christian . I'm speechless. He's a lifelong fan. He like he's heard Taylor on the country radio and went to go see her live during the fearless era. Right? No, during the self title self title era. I grew up in LA and there's one country station. I don't know what there is now, but there's one country station go country . F I don't know what the numbers are, but or the letters, but it was teardrops on my guitar. They started playing and I was like, I used to listen to country music because my dad introduced me to Hank Williams and I was like, this fucking rocks. This guy is amazing. Yeah . This new music from the nineteen forties. And when I listened to country music mainly as a joke because you could turn it on and be like, Damn you hilarious. They're punning on this truck . So hard. Like song after song, truck puns, fish puns and Taylor Swift or whatever Tim McGraw or whatever I think is what it was that and I was like, this is amazing and like weirdly like meta and felt like the internet at that time and like the my space days of the internet or whatever. And it was cool. And I called into the radio station and won tickets on the radio to go see her first LA show went and was very an embarrassed like fifteen year old boy who was like, Oh shit, it's a bunch of little kids here and I was front row just ripping it. It was amazing. Where did you go with it? I went with my best friend at the time, Michael Mann, who's not the director, but different guy . So in other words, I'm the luckiest woman in the world . That is phenomen . I want to ask you about heavy rain from your newest album. I'm so glad that you do. That is it's a stunning stunning. It's a gorgeous song. And there's like some like halfway through, something happens halfway through one of chord verses that is like, I don't even know what you guys do, but like something changes. I wish I could play it. That's my I mean she there's a modulation that happens because Maya I was on tour in Europe and Maya had sent me of this we tried the old method of Maya sends a poem and like a vague melody and try to map it out and Maya sent me like this crazy melody that modulated all over the place and then I sort of figured I don't even think I've really figured out how to do it, but figured out how to modulate into a different key just boring. You figured how to do the guitar, how to play against what she was singing. Yeah, and like change it. She went into a different key in a way that was really effortless and like kind of like, whoa , just something I never would have thought to do that you know, have you ever seen on YouTube those videos of people like reharmonizing like a guy on the news or something like that. Yeah. Or like sort of like I tried to do that with the thing that she sent over . It was a really cool. That song was really fun to write and fun to communicate about and came from a really special like some songs kind of drop out of the air and that was one of them. I was having a weird day and I went with my brother was doing a play at Lincoln's Center, which had been a lifelong dream of mine . And I walked him to the stage door and then we sat out on a bench and we were just talking and all of a sudden just the like, you know when the sky just like rips open and dumps water like out of the blue and it just and it did and I got into a cab and I wrote ninety percent of that song in the cab , like running away from the rain while he went into the stage door . And it was and I like now that's like my favorite song. We really Christian taught me about Jud y Sill Beautiful. One of my favorite singers songwriters ever. And we really I was like feeling very inspired by her at the time, and we were really inspired by her for the production on the song. Awesome. And so it's like, I don't know, but that song feels very magic , magic to me. Wow, there's no way I ever would have imagined Judy Sill was the inspiration for . Wow, that's incredible. One last break, and we'll be back with Maya and Christian. I just got back from an amazing family vacation in Northern California . 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Were you aware of that modulation you did, or was that just was it was it a conscious effort to do that or a conscious decision? Right? No, no, not at all. I mean mistake. I was just like in the cab, I think and was like, Oh no, this was later. Christian like sent me back a voice memo for like him putting music to the song and I was like it's really good. It's really good but for the bridge I was just I was hearing this thing and I'm not trying I'll try to sing for you. It's like, you know, it goes like this and I sang it into the thing for the bridge. It's just like this really complicated like baroque ass in' like Gregoryian chant, fucking like deepest music thing that I've like never heard of. I feel like I had to go to the library to like figure out what it was. Like no, just this like little thing that's like the most insane thing you've ever heard of. Well, I've been musically redible. I've been working on having more security with instrumentation, but I'm not a very secure player , but I love to sing and I sing a lot of melodies. And so I'm like oftentimes melodies will come to me , but I don't understand the chordal makeup of them. And so and usually they're just like naturally within a key, but sometimes they're not and this one it wasn't. But I swear to God, I didn't even write this song. It dropped out of the sky and Christian help bring it to life. And I don't I don't give myself any credit. Did you write? Did you in the cab? Did you write it on a note pad? Or was it? No, I wrote my notes app. Well, in your app in there . It was raining. I am usually a notade p girl , but you know, inclement weather. I should , it's not good note pad weather when it's pouring. Speaking of Gregorian the devil you know feels in feels a little grigorian in some ways in a way the vocal is produced, you know? That's so cool. Yeah . And I feel like you did something similar on your previous album on Better Totally which is all good for singing. Thank you for connecting that the first person ever to bring up the song that we were like the day in the studio were like this fucking rocks. Yeah I was like , this is gonna be such a big hit. I think like a really cool rapper's gonna sample this and put it in their song. Like I think this is gonna be the you know what Eminem what's the song where he samples Dido? I think this is going to be I think this is going to end up on like your dad's myself so confident. It's like when I go to my Spotify for Artisan scroll down, it's like the bottom one . I was like, I am the uncannary in the coal mine. If I think something is going to succeed , it means it will not. But maybe that says the same thing about me too. That's one of my favorite phrases. Yeah. Cool. You should never pick a single. Well, yeah, yeah, me neither . But I really think you're so right in some ways, my like dream of what I wanted to have happen with that song is kind of what we tried to do with the evil you know, which I'd never thought about before, but kind of happened. I got really that song kind of came out of I wrote a crazy poem and Christian and I were writing a lot of music for this record and he was like, You know what? I think you should send that poem to Ben , Ben who did Blush and Ben is like just always doing such weird rhythmic stuff and is really good at like talky weird melodic changes and he kind of wrote all those verse melodies. And then similarly, he was like, how should the chorus and he was like, should I work on the chorus? And I was like, No, no, I have the chorus. And we were lying in bed on Christmas and I sent Ben a voice memo of me doing Deal with the Devil, you know And that's still the audio that's he put that voice memo through a voice voc er and that's still the audio that's on the that is on the song that came out. Really? Yeah. Did you add anything to the voice? Like did you add any layers to the vocal? I think we it's Vo Coder with the voice memo and then I think I overdubbed the lead, but I'm not he edited. Ben is like always there's like sneaky like I don't even see it 's like two hundred something . He's always like great, let's do a double. Let's do a triple. What if we quadruple pulled it? What if we know Quinta pulled it? No . And did you and did he, I guess he recorded you guys recorded some of this at Ben's place just that song . Just that song. Okay. But that was his place in. And then he recorded other pieces on the other two songs that he worked on, which was Last Thoughts on Morningstar, or not he worked on a ton of them, but yeah. Last thoughts on Morningstar and terms of estrangement. Yes, yes, yes. And he did a lot of pieces of those in his studio in LA, but I wasn't there for it. Got it. But Dev knew I was there for it with him. So cool . So you guys have a little you guys gonna do a tour for