The Future of Smart Glasses

Audible subscribers can listen to all episodes of businessus wars ad free right now. Join Audible today by downloading the Audible app From Audible Originals. I'm David Brown, and this is Business W B in twenty fourteen Google Glass, Google's for A into the smmart gllasses space. fell flat with consumers and failed to gain a hold in the marketplace. Not only that, the high tech frames also inadvertently created controversy Remember the glass hole backlash A decade later, Meta changed the narrative, introducing a streamlined fashion forward approach partnering with brands like Ray Ban and Oakley to make less ostentatious smart specs With millions of pairs now sold, The results are hard to deny But now Google is back in the game, hoping to give Meta a dose of healthy competition with its new Android XR smart glasses which the company just previewed at Google IO in May. But as smart glasses become more mainstream and get even smarter with advances in artificial intelligence people are raising concerns about privacy, data sharing, and facial recognition They're questioning the ethics of how companies and their consumers use these products. Here to unpack the ups and downs of the smart Glasses evolution are Wired senior gear editor Julian Chockatu and wired staff writer Bon Ashworth The two have tried on their fair share of frames on Wired's gear desk. We'll talk about how Meta emerged as the leader in the space and dive into the privacy debate. And later, we'll get Julian and Boone's thoughts on their test drive of Google's brand new Android XR glasses. and talk about where the industry might be headed next Pop in those earbuds Or maybe you've got a pair of audio enabled smart frames, you're gonna to want to pull them out because that's all coming up next. 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The ventureX businessus card from Capital One, you earn unlimited double miles on every purchase. pllus big purchasing power means you can spend more and earn more. The Capital one venture X businessus card. What's in your wallet? Term supply, see capital onene. com for details Julian Chakatu Boon Ashworth, welcome to Business Wars Thanks very much for having us Hey David happppy to be here Yeah, it's great to have you. I can imagine running the gear desk at wired's gott to feel like that proverbial kid in the candy store. Before we get into the smart glasses, anything come across your desk recently that made you think, well, that's that's a new one. What didn't see that coming. Well, I'm holding a different pair of smart glasses. They're the Xreal R one glasses that I used to watch the Fellowship of the Ring yesterday just a giant screen on my face. that I can move around with Tell listeners a little bit about or, what it would describe it for us Oh sure. they're lightweight glasses that plug into your phone or you know your steam deck or console And then they project a big screen out in front of you and it's a little blurry And it's a little bit of a limited field of view. It's about fifty seven degrees. you still see the rest of the room around you in your peripherals. Kind of dizzy and kind of hard to get used to, but after a bit, you settle in. Sounds like fun, question mark. I'm try to. I'm trying to imagine watching a movie with one of these things on. I can't imagine that would be a pleasant experience. I gott to admit. I did not make it through the entire three hour move. Julian, what about you Well, I broke my leg in like two, two months ago And so it's been this opportunity to call in some stuff that are things that I would not usually test, accessibility minded stuff. And one of which is a electric wheelchair, which actually debuted at CES earlier this year. Wow, It's called the strut EV one. It is very expensive, but it's equipped with LIidDAR, so the same sort of sensor technology on autonomous cars, It can detect obstacles around you. so you just push the joystick forward and it can sort of navigate around those obstacles without you having to manually you drive the wheelchair yourself There's like follow me mode, there's different speeds. It can go up more inclines than your usual mobility scooter. So it's actually been very, very nice in being able to just even take the dog out for well, not really a walk, for him a walk, but me a roll. But it's just been nice Well, let's get into the glasses. want to get to Meta here in just a couple of minutes But I know you guys have been testing out Google's new platform, and I can't wait to talk about that because I think of smart glasses and Google's what comes to mind. I mean, that was the first time I'd heard about smart glasses. And I'm wondering if maybe Julian, you can take us back to Google Glass, which at least I feel like that was the first time a lot of us got a glimpse this might be what is it? Prototype debut in twenty twelve became available and twenty fourteen It was around that time, yeah. I just remember I was in college. I was very into tech. I didn wasn't graduating in anything related to tech, but I was just super interested. And I just watched Google IO as a fan, not as a journalist. And I at the time was super excited at Google Gloud because I think they debuted it. It was the one where They had skydivers into the Mosconi center. It was such a big thing and Sergey Brinwag had the Google glasses on. and it was just such a new and exciting time. and it was just what was supposed to be this revolutionary new technology. But ultimately it kind of just fell flat. You know immmediately everyone started calling people glass holes, anyone who was wearing them They also looked very nerdy and techy. And you know, obviously the big focal point became having a camera on your face, which is you know kind of a parallel to what the same conversations that we're having now on smart glasses. But I think overall, it was too expensive, too early, and it just didn't work as well to warrant all of those capabilities at the time, but they definitely were first and in some ways, they sort of opened the idea up and here we are almost more than ten years later. And now Google is coming back to compete with the likes of Meta. Well, Julian, what was it about Google Glass and the promise that got you really jazzed? Was it Be there's a lot of functionality that was built into The dream that Google sort of put out there Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of it It kind of is functional, you know, not having to pull out your phone to see where your next turn is while you're walking down the street of New York because you'll be able to see that information on the little display on the glasses. Just being able to dismiss a notification that comes in without having to pull out your phone and check your phone and notifications and all that. the side and talk to an assistant of some type or even you know, just take a picture easily. All of those things I think there's a convenience level to that where it was just an exciting time for being able to do those functions without having to constantly pull out your phone, which I think at the time people were also talking about screen time. I have heard you say three times without pulling out my phone. And it seems to be was that was really the convenience factor of not having to do that You mentioned gllasshole. Why do you think Google Glass had this U I don't know, this this stigma attached to it Yeah, I think at the time social media was still Sort of in its you know infancy was still early days and you know people had smartphones, but the idea of now strapping one to your face and taking a picture without someone perhaps knowing, I think was so new. And now it's much more commonplace, even though we still have those same conversations on privacy, it's still far more commonplace see someone do that today. Yeah, for sure. But I think it was just a little too early back then that there was just this backlash of No, I don't want that. And, you know, we're still seeing that again, but I think it's a little more accepted ever since Meta's versions sort of got popular We have not mentioned one of the key factors here that really sort of weaken Google, I think, in the minds of a lot of folks, and that is How it looked when you were wearing them Be they looked like they were supposed to be somewhat inconspicuous in that they were sort of They were light and clear looking but didn't really look like glasses. And so those folks walking around with them, it looked like How do we put this kindly? it Well, there you are, there you are. Which brings us to the next iteration flashing forward a few years, Bon. I know you spent a lot of time testing Ma's Raybands talk about glasses that look like regular sunglasses. That's one of the benefits of going with these new metaglasses, don't you think Sure, not that I'm a fashion expert at all, but looks are just such an important part of a thing that you're going to be wearing front and center on your face. People wear Rayban glasses and Oakley glasses because they look good. And Meta made a really strong partnership there with Rayan and Oakley to make glasses that It functioned as smart glasses, but also looked like something people would actually wear Yeah, and for not too much of a price premium either, what are these new metaglasses coming in at price wise deepends on the model. you can get them anywhere between two hundred and fifty dollars starting and then they go up to five hundred. I think the display lenses are a little bit more expensive than that And what are the display lenses? Is that part of these flagship Gentu glasses? Is that what you're talking about No, the Gentu just have audio features and cameras Meta's display glasses were something they announced, I believe in twenty twenty four came out last year. and they have a small display down in the bottom of the screen that can be used for transcription, language translation seeing directions that guide you around They also require a wristband, a compute puck, they call it in order to kind of offload some of the gesture control and technology that they need to pack into the glasses. So they're a little bit bulkier than the Gen two ones, which is something that peopleople were critical about So they look a little Google glassier But they have the displays, which has sort of been like the holy grail for smart glasses for a long time, is having that heads up display like you would in a video game or just walking around. From the perspective of someone looking at someone wearing these new display glasses, meta display glasses Do they look pretty much like standard ray bands or like the Gentu glasses It's kind of old man from Up but make it fashion So they're a little I think they're a little bit boxier. But I think if you're if you've got the right kind of face, I suppose or just confidence, I think you could pull it off Okay, all right. well what about sales? How are sales going to the best of your knowledge? I think Meta sold nine million pairs of glasses. Total, I believe it was seven million in twenty twenty five alone So they've definitely been doing pretty well in terms of sales So does this mean Meta has been able to crack the code and do what Google dream of doing but wasn't able to pull off. Snapchat, I guess tried it too, right? But has Meto achieved what a lot of people thought wouldn't actually take off? Yeah, I think they have. I think it's also a something that everybody else seems to be following in their footsteps. like Google has recently partnered with Warby Parker and Gentle Monster. which are also very fashionable glasses brands. So they're doing sort of the same thing of trying to make them Fashion forward For sure, but it seems like there's something else beyond just the fashionability of these glasses that makes them a success. you can get a pair of meta Ray band Gents. I've seen them in local stores here in Austin, which is where I I'm at. I have to admit, haven't seen them on a lot of faces But I know where to go if I want to get some. and that was not a possibility when Google was doing its thing And I'm wondering if in a way built in retail store presence that Ray Ban already has if that partnership is sort of the key to the ball here Yeah, I think so let me, hereir, I'm gonna turn my camera on real quick so you can see them. I'm wearing a pair of the Gen two Ray bands right now Oh yeah, for sure. look I would not know the difference. I have been told they don't necessarily work on my face, but o, that's hard. The meta people told me they look quite good Yes, of course they did. But no, seriously, they look really, they look very natural. and can you get prescription lenses in them? You sure can. It's a little bit more of a process, but you can do it Well, then that's the whole shooting match right there. If you're talking about reaching a lot of consumers, you're going to have to have them at retail locations, you're going have to be able to deal with those who are constantly going to need glasses for reading, getting around. And it sounds like That's a big key to what's made these metaglasses a success. Or what do you guys think I think definitely the retail aspect of it is very important because it's kind of like smartphones. know, there's always new companies trying to enter the market with a new smartphone, but unless they get themselves in a carrier store in America They're not really going to find much success. And so by partnering with what is essentially the largest glasses brand in the world, S Lord Lxotica, I think theyve position themselves very well to be able to anyone to be able to go to any store and probably find them in stock. And I think Google is trying to do that similar strategy. Warby Parker has a lot of locations Maybe they will find similar success there, but maybe not to the same extent. Well there's also genuinely useful use cases, I guess. Like I was recently paddleboarding with my mom and we were I was using the meta Rayband glasses and was able to take pictures without, you know, again, taking my phone out of the dry bag or whatever There's also, know there are some people who are legally blind who use the AI to identify things around them.ice. There are transcription services for people who are deaf that that can be useful too if the AI is good enough to make it work There are real reasons that people want these and real things that they can do Some of them haven't manifested exactly all that Well But I think the promise is definitely there, and I think people are really intrigued by it Well, Boon, when you did your article about the live product demo for the Gent Ts, you included a claim that was pretty startling and kind of a step beyond where we are right now. Mark Zuckerberg was saying that people not wearing these glasses will be, and I'm going to quote him at a pretty significant cognitive disadvantage And I guess for all the talk of the AI features and these high hopes that Zuckerberg clearly has for this I can't help but wonder if these are just you know, more convenient versions of the smartphone that we've gotten used to. and now we're just sort of transitioning to a different form factor that you wear on your face. Maybe not even that. Because what? I guess really, you're only getting a fraction of a phone's functionality, right? What's your take on this I think Meta in particular has done a really good job at putting the right phone features into the glasses, right? Like it's things that you would want you want to take a picture in the moment Want to ask a question that's off the top of your head, W to know somebody's name That's not in there yet, but maybe eventually someday I think maybe a significant cognitive advantage is kind of a crazy way to say it, but also I do think like There are advantages to having this information readily available on your face in the moment I think my argument is just that's probably going to be less of a social advantage becausecause I'm trying to imagine being in a normal conversation with somebody not remembering their name and then having to wait for the glasses to tell me or like having a you know, not knowing about a topic that they're talking about, not wanting to sound stupid. asking my glasses a question or whatever, or just like even even with the display lenses, like Having a little thing, a little window in the bottom of your screen that you are looking at Pe are going to be able to tell that you're not making eye contact or that you're not, engaged with them in a face to face conversation And I just I just feel like there's going to be these weird tells that you are interacting with your glasses not a person Sometimes it's annoying when're having a conversation with somebody and they pull out their phone and they're texting away on their phone. That feels like they're dismissing you in real life. And I just think that This is in some ways going to be an easier way to do that And so I think it's just going to come down to how people How people deploy it in the moment? If you're sitting there by yourself and you want to ask it a question or take a picture, like that's totally fine. If you're in a conversation with pbody in a room, I think it's going to get a little stickier. Julian, a couple of things here, and I'm wondering how you feel about this if you think I'm being overly cynical or what But if it comes down to buying a pair of specialty glasses, T avoid pulling out my smartphone. I'm not sure it's worth three hundred and fifty bucks. But then moving on to that next level where we're talking about the display lens I don't know, it seems like it leans really hard on AI to do a lot of the lifting here And I'm just wondering if we're all not just sort of getting a little toxed out by You know, AI is the buzzword. How do you feel about it Yeah, no for sure. I mean, keepep in mind also that for all of these glasses functionalities, like you still need your phone tethered because a lot of the processing ends up going through your phone, especially with cellular connectivity. So you still need your phone. att some point maybe there will be cellular smart glasses and that will be a thing. but they still rely on phones for a lot of the processing Um, you know, for AI features, I think There's definitely way too much being done from the techp companies in shoving AI in our face in every single way. and I think there's a rightful rejection of that, and I think that is completely valid and fair At the same time, I think there are elements of some of this technology that has been evolving for the past ten something years, you know machine learning, It was the buzzword. and I don't think it had any quite as much of a reaction as AI. But a lot of this is sort of some of the same similar foundational technologies. and I think There were a lot of features that I've come to rely on and love from machine learning, whether that's automatic transcription, when I'm doing an interview, I just hit record and afterwards, everything's already typed up. and I obviously vet and make sure it still sounds accurate and everything is there. But you know it sure as hell beats having to reype everything and listen to the whole recording again, right There's things like that that have evolved over the past few years that I think AI is polishing and offering some of these capabilities that are genuinely useful. For example, Google Lens, I think is one of my most favorite features where you know my dad even uses it where he goes to like a tree and he's like, what tree is this? And he'll Oh, well cool, it's this one, right And that's all using machine learning. And I've used Google Lens countless times to identify. my wife uses it. And the evolution of that is sort of the same thing that's through Google's Gemini glasses, for example. You know, you take a picture and you say, hey, what is that? When I did the demo with the Google glasses this past two weeks ago I sat next to a board game, it was Chinese checkers. I just asked Google the glasses, hey, what is this board game? And it told me, oh, it's Chinese checkers. and it sort of gave me a little history about it. And then I asked, how do I play it? and it started giving me instructions on how I played it. But then I said, Hey, actually can you just save that into a Google Ke notote? and it saved it on a note in my phone so that I can look at it later So I think there's elements of this where it's really helpful. And you can imagine that when say you're at a restaurant, you're like, oh, this looks really good. I kind of want to make this at home. Hey, can you like find something like this and give me a similar recipe and save it to my phone? Hey, I'm walking past a poster for a music show. and can you just put that on my calendar? because I want to remind myself to buy tickets All of that stuff becomes much more sort of ambient computing and more integrated with the daily flow of life and breaking that pattern of, oh, I have to stop, pull out my phone, take a picture, and maybe I then get distracted by something else I see on my phone. So I think there' elements of that that I think people appreciate when they finally get to try and see these features out in the real world. But of course, that's also not to minimize the rightful rejection of all the AI capabilities that are being forced on everyone as well You've said so much there that I think so important because that's what happened organically with the smartphone when people found ways to incorporate the smartphone into their everyday lives in ways that probably weren't even conceived of by the initial designers. and that led to a whole, you know infrastructure, but listen, We gott to talk about some of the downsides here, and we're going to do that in just a moment. My guests are Wired magazine senior editor, Julian Chockatu and staff writer Boone Ashworth. When we come back, we're going to take a look at some of the thorny ethical issues that surround smart glasses. Stay with us We are live from Feddy's house. Guests are gathering around the TV, even with a big storm outside. A we worried about the fee. No, they have Xfinity WiFi. Get reliable fiberpoweredig Wiifi with Peacock includcluded to stream the beautiful game this summer. Xfinity. Imagine that. Restrictions apply new gig interternet members only spepeeds vary use of fiber cooaxial cable, Peacock offer for Pacock premium with ads currently ninet nine month value A actctivation required to access content. terms apply. Peacock must be activated within first ninety days, manage existing subscriptions to avoid multiple charges. Third party subscriptions continue until cancellled I'm Leon Nefo best known as the co creator of Slowburn and Fiasco. I had of course heard of O fans, but always with a distant and quiet skepticism. A silent judgment, you might say Who is actually using this platform? U I am I'm O Fans creator and comedian, Gracy Canan. I work from home now I'm on Oly fans. and In case you guys don't know, it only fans is ask your husband My journalistic curiosity got the best of me when I found out that my own sister had started an only Fans account. I'm not a sister, just to clarify. It turns out, a lot of what I thought I knew about On fans was wrong I felt like I wasted three point five years for something that wasn't real What happens when cononnection comes with a price tag? Listen to Only Fantasy wherever you get your podcasts, or binge all episodes of Only Fantasy ad free right now, only on Audible. Start your Audible subscription in the Audible app or on Apple podcasts. Hey welcome back to Business Wars. My guests are Julian Chhokatu and Boon Ashworth from Wired's Gear Dk You know, we've been talking mainly about the technology, what smmart Glasses can and can't do. guysu, do you? Mind if I share something with you and I'm not sure that this goes to the can or can't situation, but pair of the Gen two glasses and when I was setting them up, I had to, you know, integrate it with my smartphone so you'd download an app to do that And as I was typing in all this information, I was reminded about why I left Facebook years ago. You know, I was kind of you're both laughing. and and I I was thinking You know, I just don't want Facebook looking over my shoulder all the time when when I'm on my computer And then I realized, what am I buying into? It's going to be looking at the world through my own eyes in a sense, right? And sucking in all of that data King far more about me as a personers could have ever really picked up from you know, the inferences that you can draw based on how you use your computer It was really seeing the world as you see it. and I'm wondering if that's given you any I don't know. pause or maybe creep you out a little bit or am I just being too paranoid here No, I think that is the number one thing I think that a lot of people also, especially in the wave of Meta's popularity with the glasses, I think the number one rejection was that but it's meta. Like you know Meta has just a really bad history with privacy and managing your data and all of the above. It's just just not a good company from that outlook. And I think anyone who is interested in trying to keep their data private would probably not want to buy the metalasses. Boon probably can say the same, but Boon, what do you think? Yeah. a hundred percent. I mean, I one of the reasons I'm kind of excited to see where Google is going with its glasses is not because, you know, Google's like the good guy necessarily, but it's just it will be nice to have something feels like viable smart glasses that isn't made by Ma, just because Meta has has truly was same. There's just this whole track record of privacy issues that have gone wrong. I believe they're being sued right now because very sensitive videos had been uploaded to a meta subcontractor who then solved videos that people had record on their glasses and didn't know that they were sharing. so things like eople naked, people using the bathroom, people having sex. like you have to be careful What you're filming on your smart glasses because that might wind up somewhere that you are not expecting. I have these visions of putting the glasses on the bedside table. Oh my gosh. I'm talking to you specifically, David. be careful. Did't mean me specifically. You guys are cruel. Of course, this is another thing, right? Because you go into, I don't know, you go into a gym and you're wearing these glasses and they see this guy come in with his rabands on And everyone kind of does a double take, you know, looking for is that red light on on the temples there? What's, you know And, you know There's the question of what ethically we should or shouldn't be able to do with these glasses. but You know, the ability to record everything without people always, you know, being aware of it What are some of the biggest privacy concerns that you see coming along with these products, Julian, what would you say I mean, I think it has to be the camera is like number one because it drives everything else, you know, the same thing like if Meta wanted to add facial recognition., I think last year it was some students found a way to add facial recognition tracking software into the Meta glasses and they were able to correctly identify people who were riding the subway So, you know, That kind of tech can obviously always be used for nefarious purposes, but I think ultimately, the camera is the number one thing that I think it's up to these companies to really figure out a way to make it so that people can't go around the hardware and actually find ways to disable the recording light for the camera, which is a common thing a lot of people are doing with the metaglasses But also I think designing them in a way where maybe modular cameras you can remove so that maybe if you're entering a sensitive environment, you don't have to take your old glasses off. and maybe if your glasses wear like I am have to carry a second pair of glasses. but maybe you can just pop the cameras off or something. I think a lot of social ues will form as more and more people probably will end up buying and wearing and using these glasses. But I think we'll see a bit of a you know maybe we'll see Science saying no meta glasses, please or something to that effect. But I think a lot of the responsibility still falls to these companies because they're the ones pushing the technology, they should be responsible for keeping it safe, private and you know minimize that data breach risk I mean, glass holes, that whole thing is kind of really deep sixixed Google's first iteration. And I wonder, Boon if you think that maybe Ma is vulnerable here Sure, yeah, absolutely. I mean, people are calling them pervert glasses. Our colleague, Miles Cle, just wrote a story about the rise of the metetaayan creep And my other colleague, Reese Rogers is also on the GeR desesk and I wrote about people who are removing the lights, would the indicator lights on the metaglasses that tell you when somebody's recording. And you can find whole TikTok streams of people saying, you can go in and drill it, You can put a cover over it, you can do this So I think like an element of this is just human behavior, like peoplee are always gonna to use technology for ill. at some point I do think, you know metahasted get on top of that a little bit more. and I think that The way that that's going is that people are going to be very critical of this technology when people use them in this way. Yeah, and I also think that like obviously we saw Google Glass start more than ten years ago stop and fail, and then we hadn't really heard a ton of other smart glasses in between. There were a few, but not really from any majorajor companies. But I don't think at this point, Smartlasses is going to go away. Like it's too big. all the big companies are making them. This is for sure going to be a very real part of our gadget sort of life cycle products here now, much like the Apple Watch or smartwatches in general. So I think we're just going to have to see how these companies respond to how people use and maybe abuse the products They look good, but it would be nice if they, you know do good as well Yeah, for sure. Listen, what is this segment call? Does it have a name? Because already the brands are putting their own name on it, you know, Google Glass and metaglasses? Yeah, I mean, I think they're just the smart glasses category. And what's interesting is that, you know, the category is really wide. rightight now, like sort of like what Bubin mentioned initially the glasses he was talking about testing earlier Those are like display specific glasses where you kind of plug them into the smartphone, a gaming console, or a laptop, and you can like project your laptop screen to the glasses to see something. So you don't have to crane your neck down all the time, like great for something like an airport or an airplane. But that's a very different category compared to these more stylish glasses that are designed to be walked around with and this AI features to sort of work with you throughout the day. And then there's also that other category of glasses that's like more accessibility minded. So earlier last year, the Nuance is a brand from Aelore Lxotica. they came out with hearing aid glasses and these are supposed to be know for people who with low to moderate levels of hearing loss You can just wear these glasses and they try to beam in on the area that you're looking at and improve the audio that picks up and route them through the speakers. So that's another category. you know we're going see we're seeing transcription glasses for hard of hearing people who can also now see the text of what people are saying on these glasses as well. So I think there's going to be all sorts of these types of categories popping up and each going to be tailored to specific things, just like how phones and wearables are kind of doing that right now We're going to hit the pause button and when we come back, we're going to get a first look Google's brand new Android XR and talk about of smart gllasses Stay with us Whether you're exploring your current fascinations or discovering new ones, Audible has all the stories that'll introduce you to your most fascinating self. Tap into a whole new world of heated conversations with a Sucy romantasy series. Become your friend group's sci fi expert on the latest blockbuster book to screen adaptation Or find unexpected reveals through the exclusive episodes of a viral true crime podcast. However you choose to listen, Audible keeps you fascinated, so you can be just as fascinating. 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Instead, he left a trail of broken bodies This season is about a doctor who was never truly held accountable for the patients whose lives he ruined A story of greed, betrayal, and a fight for justice that will leave you questioning who to trust Listen to Doror Death, the cowboy, wherever you get your podcasts, or binge the entire series right now only with Audible. Hey, welcome back to Business Wars. I'm here with Julian Chokatu and Boon Ashworth from Wired. Now just a few weeks ago, you both co authored an article that previewed Google's new Android XR line of smart glasses First, I got toa ask, how'd you get that first look How was Julian just built different Yeah It's just good building relationships over a long time. Well, how how does it work? Do they do they do they bring you in and you have to you know, get your eyeballs scanned and go through a number of security doors and all of that stuff. Top secret facility zer zero seven N're not gonna to lie fairly light on the security actually, but it was at Google's campus, they brought us into our demo room and they had my prescription already, so they just put prescriptions on the glasses so that I could try them on. And they do that for everyone who comes in so that they don't have to, retrofit other types of lenses or whatever. But basically I got to try the reference design which wasnt The final version that is going to come out later this year from Morby Parker and Gentle Monster, the reference design is what like the hardware version that Google and Samsung have been working on privately. And the technology will be what's available in the devices later this year. Wait a minute, didid you sayams Samsung is teaming up here Yeah. so Android XR is sort of a ross collaboration between Samsung and Google. So they're working both on the hardware and software. You could say that Google is maybe working more on the software side and Samsung is helping with the hardware. And then of course, the design comes from Warby Parker and Gentle Monster. Nice. And how do they look? Do they look as good as the medicine They pass for completely normal glasses. I think you can still see the cameras obviously. so I think they're a little more stylish than the Raybands, but maybe I will get some flack for that. They felt very lightweight, which is a very important thing because who wants to wear these really bulky things all day on your head. And the version I tried technically had the full feature set There're basically three types of glasses that Google is making, audio only, a single display and then a double binocular display. And the binocular display sort of gives you that full feature set where it's like a rich display experience. The single display is you, almost the same. It's just a slightly lesser display capabilities. and the audio version is what's coming out first and that's more akin to the Gen two metaglasses where You know, you can hear what the assistant is saying and you can talk to the assistant, but you can't just see any visual data Very interesting. Boone, how do you feel about these glasses? And what's the difference between this new iteration and say, the metaglasses if you had to single out any particular feature Yeah, I mean there's slightly less dorky than the original Google Glass, I'll say that. I didn't get to try them the way Julian did, but I'm excited to see what they do I'm also particularly excited to see how Google's Gemini AI works in them because I have experience with the metaglasses and I don't think that Met' AI is quite on the level that Gemini is right now. And so I'm interested to see how they pull off putting that stuff in their glasses U during the IO event When Google was announcing these glasses, they definitely were focusing less on content capture and trying to, you know film the world around you and more just using the cameras as a way to guide you through the world. So I think that's definitely a focus that Google is going for curious to see how that plays out for us. That's interesting. Where do you think this is going in the short term? Are we going to start to see the sort of similar walled off gardens, the way that we have iPhone and Android, we're going to have The Google Glass functionalities, they're all going to have certain strengths and Meta is going to have its strengths I think that's kind of their dream, right? Is havenvingt you locked in that walled garden I do think Google's approach is a little broader because of Android XR allows third party developers to build on it whereas Metz is doing its own thing I think in general, the future of smart gllasses is likeike Julian was saying earlier, more niche, you know, trying to make them lighter. And I think there's going to be a lot of smaller brands really fighting it out. And I think they're going to struggle in the face of these giants Yeah, but I think one thing where this may play out slightly differently also though, compared to smartphones, is that this is such a design focused product. like you put this on your face. And I think there's opportunities for smaller companies who really lean into that and try new things and play into that design factor where mayaybe they can actually get someone interested enough if they have the technology right as well to produce something that maybe they'll collect a niche group of people who want to wear that versus what is sort of the trendier, more popular or meta classes, right? So I think that does play a factor because, you know, it's just such a big design play You know, I wonder Is there anything left of AR and VR? or is that pretty much off the table? Is everything sort of focused on AI right now? And how does that factor into what's happening in this smart gllass space? Well, so I think a lot of it is actually converging, especially around AR specifically. Like a big part of these smart glasses, especially with the display is that with the cameras you'll be able to layer things over the real world and see them through the display. And so that augmented experience still follows through, especially something like you're navigating with Google glasses and you have Google maps pulled up, right over the real world. But I think the other very interesting thing that we also saw at that event two weeks ago is this project Aura that is coming from a company called Xraail who's developing Android XR glasses with Google. Samsung and Apple have their very bulky mixed reality headsets like the Vision Pro What XRel is doing is what I saw in their demo is essentially ninety percent of that functionality brought down to something that is the size as a pair of smart glasses. W. It is incredibly lightweight. I was able to use my fingers to like click on apps, like full Android apps, run them, play a game, even just like move around. I could see the world around me. One of the things they showed me was, oh, you could like even watch your video and fling it to the side of your eyes while you're washing the dishes. So it had full Android XR capabilities. so like all the typical Android apps you can access all in something that is essentially a pair of glasses, except the downside is that thing does have a wire connected to a battery pack that you have to put in your pocket So there is a compromise there, but the fact that we went from something like last year or two years ago with something as heavy and bulky as a Apple Vision Pro to already seeing something like this in a much slimmer, more comfortable form factor. I think you can imagine in five or so years, that stuff was just going to miniaturize more and more. and maybe you're basically going to run a full phone experience with As and all on something like smart glasses in five, seven, ten years It seems like it's conspicuous in its absence. We haven't really talked about Apple Are they a player in this space at all from what you can tell, Bon. Have you heard anything from Cupertino Oh, they they're getting there, I'm sure Right? Soone name me me eventually? I think they're probably working on it I think they had a they had a little bit of a they had a little bit of a setback with their Vision Pro, which was really heavy and was it very expensive and didn't quite reach I mean, it was a developer device, so I think it probably reached an audience they were expecting, but they haven't really iterated on that very much. But I think the pressure to get into the smart glasses space is Definitely probably pretty high in Cupertito right now. So I imagine they're working on it. WWDC is soon I don't know if we'll hear anything about that. That's their developer conference. The bigig Apple conference? Yes. So I don't know if we'll hear anything about it there, but I imagine there is something going on You know When will we know? When do you think most people will be convinced that The age of smart glasses has arrived. It's one thing if you guys are plugged into what's going on there in you know, Silicon Valley and San Francisco Bay Area and all that That's going to be, I would imagine, you're going to have a higher concentration of people using these glasses. But say here in Austin, which, you know, it thinks of itself as a big tech city, even if there's some question about that I'm a little surprised that for all the talk about how Metaglasses have taken off I dont think I've seen any in the wild yet And if you look at the raw numbers, nine million is a lot But you know, it's hardly a saturation. Well I think we're getting close. Really? And I think we're getting close because I I just saw my mom last weekend who lives in rural Northern Idaho