Interview with Actress June Diane Raphael

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Upr payment forty dollars for three months, ninety dollars for six months or one hundred ninety dollars for twveth plan required fifteen doll for month equalent to taxes andes extra. initial plan term only greater thanty gigytes in slow netork busy t Trop yourself in this an interesting l. It's the start of another workday for the dateline team. She's saying no, I didn't do it. Dad did it. It was a murder suicide. Our producers are catching up on breaking crime news. Monday, there's motions and stuff. When she saw herself on video, she realized, wow, this is exactly as I remember We're going to cover all the ins and outs of this Welcome to Dateline True Crime Weekly I'm Andrea Canning. It's july second, and here's what's on our docket In Las Vegas, a former youth pastor is accused of murdering his wife on a hiking trail Disturbing allegations emerge about what went on in his church youth group. She actually said that David told her that the only way that the two of them could ever be together was if, quote, Bernadette was not alive In Dateline Roundup, we've got the latest from the courtroom in the blockbuster cases of Luigi Mangioni and Alec Murdoch There were dozens of media outlets, international agencies, local TV stations, and of course, true crime proodcasters were there. Plus, we're joined by June Diane Raayfield, star of the new legally blonde prequel series, who's also an avid dateline viewer She talks about the case she can't get enough of. I'm surprised at the recent development, which I learned about on your podcast. Before all that, we are heading back to a San Diego County courthouse and the murder trial of Navy optician Larry Milliete. Before resting, the prosecution called another bombshell witness For the past six weeks, prosecutors have tried to convince jurors that Larry Miliete murdered his thirty nine year old wife Maya back in twenty twenty one They haven't presented any physical evidence that a murder even took place, and Maya's body has never been found Instead, their case is largely focused on Laria and Maya's failing marriage Prosecutors say Larry became increasingly unhinged as he realized Maya planned to leave him The crux of their case is a love triangle involving Larry, Maya, and Maya's lover, Jamie Laird Last week, jurors heard from Jamie about the affair Then, prosecutors called a witness no one had heard from before Someone else deeply affected by the affair Jamie's wife at the time, Patricia Joining us again is NBC seven invvestigative reporter Alexis Reeeivis. Hey, Alexis, welcome back. I enjoy you. Thanks for having me. Sure. This affair between Maya and Jamie is really central to the story the prosecution is telling. Remind us who Jamie is And when he got together with Maya, So Jamie started working in the same office as Maya in the summer of twenty nineteen But it was about six months later, while he was on a work trip to New York that he said Maya started texting him and That texting very quickly turned into a physical relationship. He said within a month, They started meeting at hotels, meeting in their cars. They were also using secret Instagram accounts to send hundreds of messages. Actually over the course of a year, they sent A detectives said that they sent seven hundred and sixty messages, most of which were sexually explicit in the early summer, late spring of twenty twenty. and this is the year before I vanished Jamie said Larry actually caught the two of them inside of a truck just outside of their office. And the week Ma vanished, Jamie said that Larry had called his then wife Patricia Nicole Layaird to essentially expose the affair. What do we know about Patricia Laird? So Paticia Laird has been a San Diego County Sheriff's deputy since twenty sixteen. We have known just during the course of this trial that Patricia was pregnant, she actually wound up going into labor the same night Maya was last seen alive, january seventh, twenty twenty one. And something we didn't know until she took the stand is that Larry didn't just call her the week Ma vanished. They actually were talking the whole year leading up to that point that Maya disappeared. What was her demeanor like? It must have been so uncomfortable talking about her ex husband's infidelity. Right. We weren't really sure what to expect, but she did smile a few times while she was on the stand. She didn't appear shy, She did not get emotional the things she kept saying over and over again is that she remembers that year, essentially reaching a point with Larry that she didn't want any more drama. She didn't want to be a part of the drama. She just kept saying she wanted to move on with her relationship. She wanted to believe Jamie was being loyal to her. and she said, Who wouldn't wantan to believe that your husband is actually being faithful, especially if you're pregnant? Larry was calling Patricia a lot Right? So yeah, he would call her from different phone numbers like his work number or some of the kids numbers or some unknown numbers. and it got to a point where she was just really sick of it. So she started blocking Larry. She didn't really want to deal with him calling her anymore And then even more surprises came from her testimony. What were those surprises? So she called Maya. I don't think anyone knew that Patricia Lar had ever talked to Maya directly. She said she wanted to call Maya woman to woman and see what was happening She says May told her the fffair was a story she made up to make Larry quote feel stupid. and that Larry was, quote, crazy And that's when something interesting happened because Patricia says being a law enforcement officer, hearing the word crazy This didn't seem really normal to her. so she wanted to ask my if she was okay. I needed any help, like with police resources, a restraining order, for example Apparently, Maya turned her down, said she didn't need any of that, and she wasn't scared of Larry. With these phone calls from Larry to Patricia, It sounds like the prosecutors were trying to portray Larry as maybe somewhat obsessive The defense handled the calls between Patricia and Larry very differently. Yes. In Cross, the defense really wanted to drill down the point that Larry was always polite that Larry wasn't aggressive, didnn't seem violent, didnn't seem unhinged. and they also wanted to counter her, you know, did Maya really have the ability to say that he was crazy, you know in what way? So I think that was a big area of some damage control. Yeah and also what you said earlier about Maya telling Patricia that she was not scared and didn't need her help. Yeah, she shut down the opportunity to take any kind of resources. Alexis, how did Patricia's testimony impact the defense's strategy that, you know, Jamie could be an alternate suspect in all of this. There's definitely a couple things that worked in favor for the defense after Patricia took the stand. I mean, Jamie you didn't really have to impeach him. He admitted on the stand that he lied, but she insinuated that Jamie could still be lying, that he might still be holding some things back So That helped their case. I think it seemed like something that worked against the defense was Patricia backing up Jamie's timeline of events, where he was, what he was doing at the time when Maya disappeared. That's really what the prosecution, I think needed Patricia Layered for, is that they needed someone to say, this is where Jamie was. She went into labor the night Maya disappeared, and they were at the hospital for five days because of complications She said, Jamie was with her. That's really what the prosecution needed, I think, to help the jury eliminate him as a suspect. One thing, you know, obviously that the defense has to work with is that Maya's body has never been found. And in fact, a dateline was mentioned during the trial this week in our for our Missing in America series where we profiled Maya. That's right because that's a huge part of this case that I think sometimes we forget about because there's this presumption that she's not alive. The jury has to not only if they want to reach a conviction against Larry, they have to reach a conclusion that she is in fact de and she's not alive somewhere out there. So this prosecution has to prove that there was all of this attention on her case and in this day and age The likelihood that she is alive is pretty much non existent. We should say Larry has maintained his innocence from the beginning At the time we're taping this, the defense has not started presenting its case to the jury yet. But according to the court, they've only asked for one day to call witnesses The jury should get the case next week and we will be watching closely. Alexis, thank you so much for your analysis. Of course, thanks so much again Coming up A Las Vegas youth pastor is accused of murdering his first wife twenty years ago One of the key witnesses against him His second wife Everyone knows winter is the real mess maker. 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This message comes from DSW, with their semiiannual sales starting now and featuring lots of deals. At Designer Shoe Warehouse, they'll give you something to brag about, like forty percent off clearance in all DSW stores, or an extra ten percent off clearance at dsw dot com Find shoes that get you, at prices that gets your budget. DSW. Let us surprise you Just before sunrise on august twenty second, two thousand six, David and Bernadette Vandermir set off to hike the Angels Landing Trail in Utah Zion National Park Hundreds of thousands of people make that same trek each year, drawn to the trail's breathtaking views and treacherous terrain But Bernadette never came back down. David, a youth pastor, told investigators his wife had accidentally fallen off a cliff to her death They had some suspicions about David's story, but the case was ruled an accident, and it stayed that way for nearly twenty years Th then last week, news broke on NBC affiliate KSNV. Authorities in Utah reopened a murder case surrounding a suspicious fall at the Angels Landing trail at Za National Park. U.S marshals arrested David Vandermer in Las Vegas to face charges back in Utah for the murder of his wife and insurance fraud East Idaho News reporter Nate Eaton has been following this case closely and recently spoke with Bernadette's family for his podcast, Courtroom Insider Nate, welcome back to the podcast. Thanks for having me, Andrea. Good to see you. You too. All right, so Nate, take us back to the beginning. Tell us about David and Bernadette. What was their story They actually met as teenagers. They performed together in a church play. They fell in love and they got married. Bernadette was fairly young, only eighteen years old Her family says that faith was so important to them. At one point, she actually worked in a casino as a cocktail waitress and her mother said that she would often share the gospel with people who she met while they were gambling. She was Fred's word about Jesus Christ that people should be delivering drinks too. And by two thousand six, they were living in Vegas and attending a church where David was the youth pastor. So that brings us to August of two thousand six. Walk us through what David said happened that day in the National park, that terrible day Well, they went a few weeks before their wedding anniversary to celebrate that. And according to the probable cause affidavit, David and Bernadette drove Desion National Park. It was august twenty first. They spent the night there, early the next morning, very early. They began hiking Angels landing before the sun came up David said they reached the summit while it was still dark that he stepped away to set up a sunrise photograph Then heard his wife scream, he turned around, and she had fallen off the cliff. Now, investigators thought that part of his story were suspicious, parts of him. But according to the affidavit, they didn't believe they had enough evidence to actually prove that this was a crime. So that's what her death was rule, accidental, and the case was closed Nate for years, that's where the case stayed a lot of years. What happened to David after Bernadette's death? He moved on with life, and so did her family, Andrea. David returned to the church where he was the pastor, the youth pastor after she died But then around two thousand eight, the affidavit says that he was fired after leaders learned at the church that he was throwing parties for teenagers and giving them alcohol and encouraging gambling Eventually, he built this entirely new life in Las Vegas working as a school counselor and actually becoming a yoga instructor. So while David was building this new life, investigators say another story was unfolding behind the scenes According to the affidavit, former members of the youth group began coming forward with allegations that David had groomed them Investigators looked into it, but no charges were brought at the time. So What led to the investigation into his wife's death? A few years later, a senior pastor at the church contacted authorities in Utah and said that they no longer believed that Bernadette's death had been an accident Okay, so there's an important witness in all of this who really seemed to help crack the case wide open. and investigators identify this witness in the affidavit only by her initials S H. Yeah, she said that David began grooming her when she was fourteen years old She said that the relationship became sexual when she was sixteen And at this time, David was still married to Bernadette. So according to the affidavit, SH told investigators she tried to break things off with David the night before David and Bernadette left for Zion National Park. Right. And she actually said that David told her that the only way that the two of them could ever be together was if, quote, Bernadette was not alive. And get this, after Bernadette died, she ended up marrying David. Oh my. Wait, so is this now Marriage number. It was number two because then he got married again. Okay. Investigators believe this relationship then motivated David to kill Bernadette. there was more to it than just the relationship. As we know Nate, in a lot of our cases, life insurance comes into play as a possible motive Yep money. And according to the affidavit, David collected around five hundred sixty seven thousand dollars in life insurance proceed after Bernadette's death. Now, I spoke with her mother who told me that the very morning they left for Zion, Bernadette had told her that they had recently increased their life insurance coverage And she said, comeome here, I'll show you. And she took me to the computer and put a code in and it didn't work. She put another code in and it still didn't work. The password had been changed. and she said, David, chang the password. I'll figure it out. We can log in later and I'll show you. So many suspicious things happening in all of this. Nate, you know these cases can be tricky for investigators where people pushed off cliffs. In this case, you know, David's the only person with Bernadette on top of the cliff that morning. What else did they uncover to propel this investigation They went through the timeline that he gave them minute by minute. He had always maintained that he was setting up the camera to take the sunrise photo with his wife when she fell But according to the affidavid, when investigators compared his timeline to the NASA suunrise data They didn't match up If David had really been getting Bernadette into a position for a sunrise photo, the sun should have actually been coming up. But the first nine hundred and eleven call came in long before the sun was visible from the location. So it was still dark that nine hundred eleven call came in. And so once they were able to piece all this together plus the previous woman coming forward They say that the evidence pointed to murder and that it was not an accident This all led to David's arrest. He was taken into custody pending extradition back to Utah, but then Another shocking twist in this Right. We learned he was supposed to appear in court on Thursday. The judge showed up and said that actually He wasn't going to be there because he had died He's not here, he's see still take it c. And then the jail released a statement saying that they had an inmate who had died from self inflicted injuries who was David. I can't even imagine what this is like for the family. all these years go by. someomeone's finally arrested for their daughter's death And then now he's dead so quickly afterwards How they react to this Yeah, it's it's been a roller coaster. You know, when Bernadette died, they had their suspicions, but then they say that they were able to put them aside and move on with life because he was never charged. So when investigators called to tell them the news that he had been arrested, they felt like they were finally going to get those answers that they had longed for. But the day that he died, I actually spoke with them a few hours after that And they said that they felt like justice had been served, but his death won't erase the loss of Bernadette. She was a wonderful, special woman of God. She had a great bright future ahead of her and it was cut short Such a heartbreaking story, Nate. Thank you for bringing it to us. Thanks for having me Up next, it's time for dateline roundups Luigi Mangioni and Alec Murdoch are back in court gearing up for their trials Plus, she's a beloved actress and podcaster, and a devoted dateline viewer. We'll be catching up with June Diane Rayfield. Hey, what's you doing Are you doomscrolling other people's vacations? Miami, San Diego? With Expedia, your trip can earn rewards which you can use towards your next eligible stay. Soon, people will doomscroll you. Expedia, the one place you go to go places. Terms apply Close your eyes, exhale, feel your body relax, and let go of whatever you're carrying today. Well, I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class. I got them delivered free from one eight hundred contacts. Oh my gosh, they're so fast. And free. Oh sorry I couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry. Namaste. Visit one eight hundred contontacts dot com today to save on your first order. onene eight hundred contacts. At DSW, we ask the important questions, like what shoes are you going to wear Whether you're prepping for wedding season, festival season, or just planning the ultimate vacay, the right shoes can make or break an RSVP. So own the moment. You've got big plans and we've got just the shoes at the perfect price, of course. Get ready to getet ready with Designer Shoe Warehouse. Head to your DSW store or dsW dot com today And let us surprise you. Welcome back. Joining me for this week's roundup is Dateline producer Sue Simpson. Sue, thanks for being here. Thanks for having me. So, Sue, we are back in South Carolina, where Alec Murdoch was back in court this week. He is, of course, the disgraced former attorney whose double murder conviction was overturned by the state' Supreme Court in May. Remind us why these convictions were overturned So Andrew, as you know, in twenty twenty three, Murdoch was found guilty and sentenced to two consecutive life sentences in prison for the murders of his wife, Maggie and his son Paul. Shortly after he was sentenced, Murdoch's defense team filed an appeal arguing that he didn't get a fair trial. The appeal eventually made its way to the state' Spreme Court and five judges unanimously ruled to overturn Murdoch's conviction and ordered a new trial So this is the first hearing that he's had leading up to his retrial Murdoch was wearing an orange jumpsuit, prison jumpsuit and was shackled. And remember, he is behind bars not for the murders, but for financial crimes that he pleaded guilty to. He has always maintained his innocence though for the murders. And soue, the courthouse was packed and this can fit what? two hundred people? two hundred approximately in Andrea, No surprise it was packed, right? There were dozens of media outlets, international agencies, local TV stations, and of course, true crime proodcasters were there The judge, Deborah McCaslan, acknowledged the crowd when she sat down at the bench Let' see we have a full house. Good morning. So Andrea, this is a new judge. She took over from Judge Clifton Newman, who recently retired And while many of the people at the hearing were probably very familiar with the Murdoch murders, the judge was not. and she acknowledged that Let me tell y'all I don't know anything about the first trial So when you tell me something Please be complete when you tell me because don't assume that I know because I don't. Murdoch's defense team has already filed several pretrial motions, which were brought up at this hearing. What are they asking for So the defense has requested a change of venue. They also ask that Murdoch be allowed to wear civilian clothes and to be unshackled when he appears in front of the jury We learned that the defense is planning on calling eight new expert witnesses and asked the judge for access to some of the evidence from the investigation They did. They want access to DNA evidence recovered from under Maggie's and fingernails. Back in the day, investigators determined that this DNA belonged to an unknown, unrelated man. So they want to find out everything they can about that DNA it may turn out to be you know Innocuous. We don't know, but It's worth looking into The defense told the judge they'd cover the cost of this independent DNA testing. and the judge had something to say about that. I'm going let you pay for it. Yeah, a lighter moment. The judge did not rule on any of these motions at this hearing, but she did put a tentative date on the calendar for the retrial, which is a big deal That's right, april fifth, twenty twenty seven Okay, speaking of trial dates, in New York, we have an update in Luigi Mangioni's federal case He is accused of gunning down United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson back in twenty twenty four and faces several charges, including a state murder charge and federal stalking charges. He has pleaded not guilty to all of them So this week, Mangione made a brief court appearance for his federal proceedings. What happened there Well, Andrea, according to a court official on Monday, Mangioni appeared thirty minutes late. He apparently got stuck in a courthouse elevator. Okay. Yep. And he remained shackled. his building engineers freedom from the elevator. And when he finally walked into court, he walked in through the entrance that's reserved for the judge When the hearing finally got underway, Andrea, the judge made a big announcement that she'd be pushing back his federal trial date from this November to january twenty fifth, twenty twenty seven Do we know why Sim Well, she said a November date would be impossible, her word, because of Mangioni's state trial, which is scheduled to start in September. She said the defense can't go through with jury selection for the federal trial while the state trial is in process So last week, we found out that Mangioni might be in talks about taking a plea deal in his federal case That's according to what sources familiar with the matter told our New York affiliate WNBC What happened with that? Apparently those talks fell apart. That doesn't mean that a plea deal is off the table entirely. A plea deal could still be considered right up until Manioni's trial date Okay, this next update, I have to say, completely caught me off guard. Yeah I bet newews about Nicholas Alaverdian from Utah. Nicholas was the international con man who faked his own death in twenty twenty before fleeing to Scotland to evade rape charges Overseas, he took up a new identity as a British orphan named Arthur Knight. I confronted him about his identity in one of my most memorable Dateine interiews. What do you say to someone who believes that you are Nicholas Alverdian? I am not Nicholas Alver. and I do not know how to make this clear Nicholas was extradited from Scotland, brought back to Utah last year to stand trial for the rape charges against him So there were two separate trials, rememind us about those In august twenty twenty five, Andrea, a jury found Nicholas guilty of raping his former fiancee. He was sentenced to five years to life. and then in september twenty twenty five, a separate jury found Nicholas guilty of raping his former ex girlfriend. And he was sentenced to five years to life as well for that. So this is where my jaw dropsed last week News broke that Nicholas died What happened Yeah. According to a press release from the Utah Department of Corrections, they said that Nicholas died from complications of an existing medical condition after choosing to discontinue medical treatment We don't know Andrea what that medical condition was. He was only thirty eight years old. So That is it for Nicholas Oivverdian. Wow. that was a long saga, that story. Sue, thank you so much for these updates Thanks for having me For our final story this week, we are joined by a very special guest, someone you might recognize from your favorite TV shows like Netflix's Grace and Frankie. That was a joke It' funny Or maybe from her podcasts, How did this getet Made? and the deep dive This movie, I truly believe, was like the cultural reset that this podcast needed. June Diane Rfel is not only a successful actress and podcaster, she is also a keen dateline watcher She's here today to talk about her favorite cases plus her role in the new legally blonde prequel series called E, available on Amazon Prime Video. June, thanks for coming on the podcast. I'm thrilled to be here and talk to you. Likewise, and we have to say for our listeners, you are dressed in true legally blonde fashion with a lovely pink Saint John. Sain. John's suit It's so Ell E though your mom. It is very Elle Woods coed, but Elle got her fashion scense from somewhere. That's what you're gonna find out about in the prequel series. A lot of it, if I may, came from Eva Woods. So awwesome. All right, so as we said, you're a big dateline fan. How did you become interested in true crime? You know, I think I just started I started just watching the show and I loved it And I think so many women are drawn to the show to be quite honest. True. There is something about listening to these stories that are told with such humanity and such empathy for the victims and their families where I think we're kind of getting back some agency and learning and understanding what red flags were and how we could prevent it. But it is actually, I think, no surprise that women have really latched onto this genre. Yeah, they have. And also I think because so many of the cases involve men taking the lives of women It is nice at the end of our datelines, most datelines to see them Yeah You know, have their comeuance that they're going to prison justice. So you previously moderated a panel at South by Southwest with my fabulous colleagues, Keith and Josh. And it was an incredible experience. It felt It was like the Beatles were there. People were going crazy for them. Yeah. peopleople love Josh and Keith. Yes, they do. I mean they are to say that one of the things I walked away with was both of them, but I specifically remember Josh talking about J how much of his time was spent just on a day to day following up these stories, just staying in touch with these families and victims. And I thought that was so beautiful Yeah, we really do stay in touch with the people we interview and we'll do updates on shows and we'll also do we have a podcast called afterfter the Vverdict where we check in with people. love And I'm generally a ball of cheers at the end. I love hearing those stories because it does make you reflect on all you have and how You know How people can overcome such tragedy and to actually give back and prevent it. It's always special to hear about. Are there any true crime cases you're following right now are interested in? Oh gosh. Well, I'm absolutely following the Luigi Mangioni case. We just did that by dateline. I'm just fascinated by that case and who he is. I'm surprised at the recent development, which I learned about on your podcast about his plea and how he's going about it and the defense, rather. R Yeah ye