The Fate of Nate Jacobs and Finale

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Visit betteretter hLp dot com slash random podcast for ten percent off your first month of online therapy Hello everyone and welcome to deceoding TV, a podcast about television I am David Chen, joining me as usual. He's Patrick Clebeck, Patrick. How is your Memorial Day weekend It was delightful, simultaneously relaxing and exhausting. It was like, Ohh, I'm hanging out with a bunch of people I like hanging out with Time to stay up late with them and then get up early with my children. needed a vacation from my vacation. but it was delightful. was boats and beers and pools and amazing. goodood times with lots of family and friends. How about yourself? I know it's not what is You should put up a sign that says I Hawk if you love Memorial Day. Yeah, I also had a good memorial Day or as we call it here in Portugal, Monday U But yeah, there's no memorial day here. I did go to the beach. You know, Patrick Kleck, there's something on the beaches here that I hadn't seen in the United States that peoplee have a little wind scream I don't know if you've seen this but Uh. I've seen like beach umbrellas and towels and stuff, but something that people do is they'll put up a little screen. Think of it like Like four to five three to four panels Let' go into the sand The idea is that you lie down next to it And the screen protects you from sand that blows in your face because it is very windy on the beaches here So I'm going to the beach and I see like All these windscreens all over the place. it's a new site. likeike I don't I've been to like beaches in America a bunch and Uh, not like that. So no. I used you see kind like a lot of times like, Yeah, little mini tents beach tents that are like very thin I those before in America, but like not like just the screen. so R So it's kind of cool to like learn how other people do things, but anyway, beaches here are beautiful. So I try to go, you know, whenever I can and I did on Monday so it was very nice Anyway, enough about that. Today on the podcast folks, we got a lot of stuff to discuss bunch of TV news, including the final episode of Colberars's Late Night to discuss We're going to recap Euphoria season three episode seven, the penultimate episode of the show most likely And then our show of the week is going to be the Boroughs. But first I want to let people know about stuff that we are going to be reviewing, stuff that's coming down the pike First of all, next week's show of the week will be Spider Nore. which is the Amazon original series star, Nicholas Cage And then following week, we'll be discussing Cape Far as our show of the week. So that's going to be our plan for the next couple of weeks I obbviously Euphoria ends next week And so we won't be recapping it then. And I think for the first time ever since we started doing the show in this format, we will probably not have a weekly recap show. That's my guess We will probably just move to a weekly show of the week U and that is our current plan. I don't see any other weekly shows that we can cover that really make sense for us. Last summer was like a I remember like we hit like a how we going to handle all the shows that were happening? And like every week I keep reloading different websites like upcoming TV shows likeike mayaybe there's something weissed. It's like know Widows b shows do crop up, you know, that like can we reserve the right to to have something that strikes our fancy. But in terms of like, hey, we can confidently say in advance. Yeah, this looks like it's going to be interesting enough to dedicate every week. There's just kindind of a lull till late August sort late August. Yeahah, when Lanterns is going to be premiering on HBO Max and also Dark Matter season two. thoseose are shows that are on My radar shows that we'll probably be covering week to week But yeah, going to be a little bit of a lull. I will say that we are we have heard some feedback that people would like us to cover Widows Bay. We are going to try to pull together some bonus episodes about Widows Bay in the next few weeks. So you can look forward to that I'm also gonna try to put together a bonus episode covering the entire first season of Half Man I do want people to know that I will be making some big life transitions over the course of the next few weeks, I'm probably going to be if everything goes smoothly, I'll be Moving back to the United States from Portugal sometime in June And so it's going to be just a really busy and intense time So your patience as we kind of figure out our programming is appreciated. But if you ever have any suggestions, decoding TV at gmail. com is where you can send them or you can always comment at decodingtV d. com. So Again, to recap, Spider Noir next week, Half manan sometime in the next few weeks, Caate fear sometime in the next few weeks and also a bonus episode of half manan that's probably coming down. ike sometimes next few weeks as well. And also it'll probably be a show of the week or a couple of shows of the week until late August unless people have other suggestions. You know, silo is coming out in li Patrick I mean, you were pretty downown in season two much more than I than I was I cant I can't wait Yeah, you were a fant of season two. I didn't I didn't actually finish it I don't it was definitely not nearly as good as the first season, but it did not deter me from wanting to keep watching more of the show. and especially because the seasons have a relatively short gap in between they're about like year in change apart. They shot seeasons three and four back to back. The show is in the can. It is done. it will finish Right And that's that's rare for a sci fi mythology shows. At some point I will talk about silo on this show Right See. We'll see if could do show over the week. You know Maybe I'll get to the second season. likeike the thing is I don't we don't want to enter a show to week coverage if like one of us hates the show. That's the thing is like I don't know that I would recogn Absent me having a really exceptionally strong response, I feel Patrick, you know show of the week plus a Patrick finishes the show is probably might might suffice unless That would suffice. Well, what I'm saying is maybe I'll try out season two and I'll really like it, but I've heard it's not that good. I don't know That's not what I would recommend, but I don't know that you can reasonably just jump to seasason It might genuinely if like season three is some Huge step up. Read the Wikipedia entries. Like go read the graphic novel. It's fairly like a closed adaptation we'll broach that when we get there, because I dont cross that bridge we come there. That's one idea All right, But if you have a better idea than that and that wouldn't be hard. DodV at gmail. com. Let us know what you think. All right Patrick, it's time to get to our show of the Wek whichich this week is the Buroughs since I mo to the boroughs. I started to See things shadows and this sc possible things I know how it sounds, like you've lost your mind. That's what I'm afraid of here What's it doing? J's looking at us There are wonders in the burroughs tucked away Hid and buried Anyone who knows the truth is in danger. We've got two choices. We can give up or we can go all the way. Welcome to dececoding TV's coverage of the Buroughs The burros is streaming right now in Netflix, and it's the latest series from Jeffrey Adison and Will Matths, whose work you may know from The Dark Crystal age of resistance. Patrick Klleic, did you watch Dark Crystal at all by any chance? Watched I love the original movie, watched some of the show, fell off it, but it was on a list of I just finished Stranger Things, like a rewatch with my kids and we loved the experience of watching the thing as a family so much, we came up with a bunch of options Wow or follow up shows. like, Hey, we're going to as a family, maybe we'll try a bunch of first episodes of things. And on a list of like I'd seen online of some people recommending in the like the age group of my kids was Dark crystals. So we did watch it. They were very taken by the puppets but did not seem ready to jump into the to the show quite Yeahah. But I liked what I saw less of the storytelling, more the like the sheer artistry on his was pe Netflix. I heard the craft was excellent on Dark Crystal Age of Resistance, but anyway, The Burs is also executive produced by the Duffer Brothers, which makes a lot of sense because this show borrows a lot of its feel from Stranger Things, which itself was already derivative of many of the Amblin and Stehen King movies we watched in the eighties The Boroughross is about a fictional elderly community called the Boroughs. thinkink the villages except in the desert where many people go to retire and possibly find themselves As the show begins, we meet Sam Cooper, played by Alfred Molina, a recently widowed retired aeronautical engineer who's moving into the Bros. It was really his wife's idea to move in. And since she's now gone, Sam is not even sure if he wants to continue going through with this move But strange things are happening to the residents in the buroughs, and as a mystery begins to unravel, Sand decides he's going to stay and figure out exactly what's going on There are eight episodes of the TV showhow of The Boroughs. All of them are available right now. Patrick has seen the first two episodes I've seen all eight We'll be spoiling the first two episodes, but we won't be spoiling anything from later episodes. And later on in this podcast episode, I will tell you what I thought of the season as a whole and the general arc of the show People may consider that spoilera. I'll try to give a warning in events. But Patrick, yeah, we were going to talk about this and watch the first couple of episodes The moment I saw that it was a mystery box style show. I was like, okay, I don't want just just I don't want to just show up here and speculate on whether it's going to end up paying off And so I watched All eight episodes before today's podcast So I could kind of give a little preview of like the whole season All that said Prick Clop, you' seen the first two episod What did you think of the boroughs I don't like the tone of how you set that future reveal of David Chen. I have to be honest, I feel like you you you imbued that with that upcoming reveal with a tone. No, I mean I think it was just more like It wass just more like, yeah, like I want too be able to communicate to people. whether it's worth the journey or not, you know what I mean It feels throwbacky and it feels the kind of show that was greenit in a lot of ways in the wake of losts of like a show that has some sort of mysterious payoff. at the end often didn't But the bough the boroughs I'm really, really enjoying the first two episodes. L I sat down with my wife who watched this site unseen, but I said it was Hey, like the Stranger Things folks were involved in some sort of creative capacity and it's got a real Spielberg sort of like charm to it from the trailer. Seems like the kind of thing you and I would eat up and like absolutely have eaten up the first two episodes. I think it makes a critical error almost at the jump, which is to show too much of a creature that is probably very important to the rest of the show. upf front, I think it tips a little too much of its hand too early aesthetically about one of its core mysteries. you if you don't really understand the how and the why. But absent that Just a wonderful cast from like top to bottom, like just Just a who's who of folks that you have seen in so many things over the years. And anchor with Alpha Melina is just such an inspired choice because he is one of those actors that makes a show like this work. I is going to give dramatic weight to the most expositional of scenes, like imbues everything with a sense of gravitas. like it's just a great cast and he's an someome of you that every time he's at the center of something It just occurs to you Why is he at the center of more things? Like I know he's around, but it just feels like I don't see him as. in a way that match with a frequency that matches his talent. So the Buroughs has been a delight. I can already sort of see potential gaps in like where that is going to be satisfying in terms of the payout. But the thing about a mystery box show is there's a fine line is are you here for the mystery box? Are you here for the characters that are going to go and solve the mystery along the way Oftentimes that can go extraordinary lengths to chilling any sort of negativity you might have over the mystery box. One might be disappointed but you still enjoyed the journey. too of in mystery box shows The whole journey is finding out what's inside the box. I think what the buroughs gets right? Insof far as what I have seen is that I prefer the mystery, paid off well and was interesting and intriguing But if it doesn't I don't start every episode wondering, gosh, I wonder what's going on in the boroughs. I kind of want to just see what this cast of characters gets up to. and that's a pretty good sign for a show I largely agree with pretty much everything you've said I think The Bors is a fantastic show. I've had a great time watching the show I saw someone describe the Boroughs as a cross between Stranger Things and the man on the inside, the Ted Danson show. I think that's a very astute because essentially it has the feel of strranger Things, which again is very reminiscent of Spielberg, Stehen King movies, like the supernatural horror elements kind of thing. This dials up the Spielberg though. Like absolutely. Stanger Things is like d like Spielberg aesthetics, Stehen King sort of substance. like this even including like the title treatment has like the old school Amblem sort of William Spielberg collaborative musical motifs. And I would say that's a huge part of whyy this feels so much like something from our childhood is the music It's very, very reminiscent of John Williams scores for T, even Indiana Jones, you know, like those kinds of movies And then the man on the inside is the first season was about Ted Datson infiltrating a elderly community and trying to solve the mystery And so you combine all these together and it makes for a really nice fun mix that also maybe has a couple things to say about what it feels like, what it means to old and contemplate the nature of your existence. So I've been having a great time with the show and I will tell you this Patrra Kleubbeck having gotten to the end of the show I don't regret the time I spent with it. and is a lot more that is a lot more than I could say for many shows we cover here on deccoding compers. Okay, so I think a huge part of the success of the show hinges on the cast You're watching these characters hang out and solve problems for a lot of the show. And so it really needs to work in order for you to enjoy watching the boroughs So the cast of the Bros includes Judy and Art played by Alfrey Woodard and Clarark Peters This is a couple that's been together for decades, but is now starting to question elements of their relationship. There's Wally Baker, played by Dennis O'Hare, a retired doctor who's dying of cancer and looking for a medical miracle Jack Willard, Sam's neighbor of the burrross who's played by Bill Pullman And Renee, a retired music manager played by Gina Davis I just want to say shout out to Dennis O'Hare, who I think is probably The I would say like arguably the lowest profile person of this cast who has always been one of my favorite character actors He did a wonderful job in movies like, say, Michel Clayton And it's nice to see him like really finally get kindind of top billing. likeike, he's really one of the main characters. He's kind of Alfred Melina's U, one of his closest buddies in the show All that said, Patroclep, what did you think of the chemistry? between these characters. That's what you know really sold me on the show at the top, which is why I think some of the decisions it makes in terms of unraveling the bits of its mystery box at the start are kind of handm fisted and almost feel like the show isn't starting with its most confident foot, but the moment we get into the buroughs and spend time with these characters, it spends a lot of time in these opening episodes, making you understand the complicated dynamics that exist. You have this familiar aesthetic of suburbia. But then Why are people friends? Like what is romance in like a stage of your life like this? Like what is does it mean to be with people your entire adult life and then settle down here? when people's emotions and attractions might be changed. like there's One of the great like joys is actually the mysteries between the people who have already been here before, like as Alfred Melina joins their group and starts learning about like, o. I thought this is how these two present out in public. But like in private, it's a little bit different, a little more nuanced. And they spend an enormous amount of time in all of these great actors by the very by choosing a lot of character actors They get you have to speed on buying a lot of the emotional beats and relationships really quickly. like their own interactions with one another sell you on. These are people that know each other very intimately very well. and they all carry secrets, but They're not necessarily mystery box secrets. Like there's a whole scale to what it means to be a secret at the burough, somewhere more banal than others and I think a show like this which Especially early on, you're not getting many answers. It's mostly just mysteries. and huh, that's odd lives or dies on you buying the existing character relationships and wanting to hang out with them key to West Stranger Things worked was like the core kids, I just want to see what they get up to. And then eventually that show expanded into being, I, you know, care about the lore and the world and how all this stuff works Early on, you can't buy into any of that. You just to buy into these characters. And I think the cast does an exceptional job of being Just fun to be around You know, they kind of amp up a little. Sometimes it feels like Oo, they they like to have sex and drink and like do drugs and Gina Davis old people do drugs. Wha. Gina Davis is swearing a lot And it' a little it feels Try hard is look bit like they think they're being subversive when it's like, okay, like we get. oldld people also had like that fun, right? And it feels like the show trying a little too hard in moments, but I never got hung up on that. It does feel like, you know, like that comes and goes, but at the end of the day, I'm left with a really interesting suite of characters to I'm happy for to learn all the different dynamics between all of them as you as you go on little adventures One of my favorite things about the boroughs is that The main character played by Alfred Melina is an aeronautical engineer. and It's a plot point that he liked to fix up old cathode RayTube televisions with his daughter And if that skill comes in handy for plot reasons during the course of the show Uh and honestly Watching the Bros reminded me kind of why I fell in love with movies and sci fi in the past where basically You're watching these people try to solve a mystery, try to overcome a problem, and using their intelligence to do so. And I just realizeed that that's like somewhat rare. They're using their actual skills, their engineering know how, their ability to create intricate machines, right? It's like, oh wow, you know, this reminds me of to the future and things like that where like you could use actual hard skills to try to solve some really interesting problems Uh and, you know, that's one of the reasons why it really reminded me of the movies I watched growing up, you know? And u and why I kind of fell in love with moovies in the first place a little bit. so Do that speak to you at all or is that just me No, and I think especially stuff like this is refreshing in an era of you know, as we come on sort of the tail end or a different version of the superhero era is That's like extraordinary things happening to extraordinary people And I think part of the magic of a lot of the Spielberg stuff is extraordinary things happening to ordinary people. Um And that's a lot of what the bureus captures like, sure There are extraordinary things happening like in the boroughs. but These are all just a bunch of average folks like kind of figuring it out. Like even stranger things like worked because it started there. like the introduction of eleven or like It's extraordinary things happening to our core cast of characters. And then that of course escalates and many, many people become superheroes over the course of that show. But I think the bough starts there and it's it's novel to W a scene unravel. as the characters do something that you think you might do in that situation if you were that character, right? Like you and I are not engineers, but if we were, we could imagine like if I was an engineer, How would I try and solve like extremely specific machine that solves this problem, right? Yeah And we would like it's aspirational. It's like, oh man, I'd love to be so smart that I could do that in this movie or this TV show. So All right, Patrick. Should I talk about the overall arc of the season? Is that cool with you? Yeah, no, I'm deeply curious how how for you. I will not spoil anything, but I will talk about what I thought of the show as a whole and I will reveal whether the mystery is resolved. I will not reveal what the mystery is, right? So like that kind of stuff. If you do consider this a spoiler, skip ahead a few minutes. put a timestamp for when the TV news segment of this episode iss going to begin But Patrick like you, I also felt like, wow, they really showed the creature right away. you know, like they're not even They're not even beating around the bush a little bit And that was a little interesting. I guess because The last show these guys did was Dark Crystal Age of Resistance. they want people to appreciate the creature design. So it's like, at look at the creature. It's right there where you're seeing it in full blown, whatever it is Right away So I am going to explain to you that the mystery is solved in like they do explain what the mystery is. And I will say that What I'm about to say Can be a feature or a bug depending on how you feel about All right. But The manner in which the mystery's solution is revealed and the solution itself is extremely straightforward Like It is onene of the most straightforward reveals I've ever seen. And in fact If I ask you to just make something up, like to just guess what what is going on. And you get you guess it?, you know, it's very plausible you could come up with Literally the entirety of what is happening So Some people might find that to be disappointing But Refreshingly It does mean that it's possible for this story to be completely self contained. likeike you get to the end of the season And you're like, hey, that was a fun story and we never need to visit the world of the Boroughros ever again Right? That is a very plausible outcome from this whole situation So But I will say I was a little surprised, you know, I was a little surprised by like how straightforward it is and how the way in which it's lit you know how u Particularly in lost, right But other shows as well where there are certain reveals that You know, you and I will probably remember forever, right? I like, o I can't remember I still remember the day when it was revealed that so and so did such and such. I can just say just make your own kind of music, sing your own right? Like exactly. Anyone who's watched Lost was exactly what I am talking about. I know what you're talking about. I know what you're talking about likeike that was an amazing moment in TV history, right and I think ideally you want your reveals to be like that where There is a big reveal and you're like, whooa not only do I have more information about what's going on, but the manner in which it was revealed was mind blowing to me In my opinion, that does not happen in the show, right? It's just The information is dropped in a fairly pedestrian way. And the actual information itself is fairly pedestrian. It like sure fe sure sure, not a bug. Yeah ye, there you go. There go there go. So I mean because we've talked about this before where you know, have you extracted burroughs from The cultural context, the economic context that it's built in. You could imagine looking at that as a bug Mh withithin the context in which the burs is being made, I think that is a feature. We've talked about how it is profoundly know, irresponsible is like a heavy word, but like You're wasting people's time if you're building a show cannot resolve some core tension of itself by the end, both knowing there is no certainty of follow up seasons and the lengths between those seasons can be extraordinary in length. And so The idea of like This show playing it perhaps a little too safe in terms of like what it's tiding up. Right Sounds Fantastic, easier to pitch to other people. Yes Like by the end, you're going to get answer for whatever questions you have pretty much. U I agree that that makes it much more appealing to people in general. and also you don't need to worry about some big cliffhanger where there might not there might never be a season two. So So that's one point I just wanted to make about how everything resolves. And then the other thing I wanted to say is just I really think the ending or towards the end of the show, the final couple of episodes pulls up some of the heart strrings, man, like And even though the setups here are so easy. I'm like Yeah, I c I cry so easily. It's hard to get you to shed some tears in this one Yeah you know, H Yeah, it really got me yes, there's some really I'll just say Fairly silly and bizarre plot developments that happen towards the end of the show. At the end of the day, I was like, oh man, the emotional core of this show really works And ultimately is what is important. So I had a good time with the show And I would generally recommend it to anyone. Like I think it's a good time and H some interesting things to say And well shot. well acted, greatreat cast, great score this is a win in the streaming era. So the boughs Check it out. That's what Patrick Kleckin, I think here on decoding TV And that's going to be our show of the week. This week. again, reminder next week, ourur show of the week is going to be Spider Noir, the new Spider Man show starring Nicholas Cage on Amazon Priv videoideo, and we'll also be finishing up our coverage of Euphoria season three. N week on deccoding TV as well Sking. Pushing Creating Learning, discovering At ArAMcoO, we believe in harnessing the power of data to push the limits of what's possible That's how we deliver reliable energy to millions across the world. Aramco, an integrated energy and chemicals company. Learn more about us at arramco. comot Introducing the Total Solutions advantage only from Comcast businessusiness. It's the largest fastest fiber powered network for small business, gig speeds with equipment and security included, and a five year price lock. No one does business like Comcast Biness. Switch today. Get started for sixty dollars a month for twelve months when you add an advanced solution to a qualifying interternet package. Limited time offer Restrictions apply newew customers only requires three hundred megabt second internet, security edge and additional qualifying service, one year agreement, paperless billing and autoay bank account required. Taxes and fees extra. Patrick Klek, it's time to get to TV news this week. and This is actually I almost thought about like maybe this should also be a show of the week, right? But I had a chance to watch Stehven Colbert's final episode of the Late Show Did you I don't think you watched this or did you hear anything about it? I'm curious I caught up on a weird version of it, which is that when I knew that you were watching the episode, I just clipped last night while I was playing a video game put on it in the background. But it turns out I put on like the extended versions of all of the clips. like so it's like I watched interviews with other late night hosts I saw John Stewart come through, but it was all like during the interview, Colbert would break and like, by the way, like not all of this is going in the show. I was like, oh, I guess I'm watching a ninety minute version of the episode. I caught a significant chunk of it by the end And There were some fun things about the episode, right?? He got all the Strike Force five hosts to do a little sketch with him The main guest of the show was Paul McCartney And they did a little performance at the end during which Colbert performed. And there was a handful of reflections on what it meant to be the final episode of Lateo but I have to say I was a little surprised at the lack of popp and circumstance. It was very much just like a regular episode of the show, right? They did a monologue. they did a bit at the desk. Uh, and you know, he did in an interview with Public guardian and that was basically it U Daniel Dario over at Variety was not a fan He called the season finale or a series finale to say a letdown Uh, and he says Colbert couldn't escape being Colbert as the episode wore on, and the final program sadly proved the case for his show's obsolescence Unfortunately, this host is gifted at neither interview nor sketch. In the former, he talked over Paul McCartney relentlessly Uh and attempted to pull rank on McCarney by asking if he'd ever met the Pope Uh, and Al, Daniel Dari was not a fan of like the sketchwor in the episode as well. So I have to say U Kind of the show went out a little bit on a whimper, you know, despite that having like a lot of guest stars And a lot of like other people showing up to show support It wasn't like, o, wow, what a definitive statement of what this era of television has meant. I will say, One thing that really struck me petrocopic and I'm not proud to admit this is at the very end of the show, they have like all these people who worked on the show pouring out onto stage and you see them all. And it's like two hundred people Work on the show two hundred people work on the show And It is an incredibly expensive show, right for What today draws very few ratings. I think they are saying This show is one of the highest rated episodes ever of the show U six point seven four million viewers, it's most watched weeknight episode of all time U but that's up from the average of two point six nine million viewers. And obviously, we know many people that are able to generate that many views on YouTube and more with way, way fewer resources and it really did feel like seeeeing all the people that work the show. againain, I'm sure they do great work and they're hard working and the quality of their work is excellent But it really did feel like a show from a different era. You know what I mean? of like, oh, we're We're probably not going to do that anymore. We're like the era where we could spend that much money on the shows that was watched by this few people is over Uh anyway Did you have any thoughts Patricklopppic on the fin episod Yeah, no, watching the final episode or, you know, clips of it, mostly reaffirmed our previous positions, which was that a little bit of what you you sell Is this all you got Um, and so that might be it., but I also think You're not handing it to Donald Trump by admitting perhaps like this is h, you know, a case in point like why this format has been in a decline long before it became a political talking point and a way to try and Seaar liberals like visa v the Trump administration. like there is This format is is changing. peopleeople want it. People want to see people talk. peoplee want to see. peopleeople get interviewed. None of that has changed, but the mechanism by W it happens, the scale of said production, a lot of that is changing. Not all of that is because of political pressure to like push people out, like It's just people's habits and like how, you know A lot of the stuff that talk shows used to produce, people are listening to long form versions of that as podcasts or like audio it's just It's changed and In many ways, like the creakiness of Colbert's final performance is ends up illustrating the very reason why this is going away. You know, I think what's much more likely is in the future Like one of the dynamics on all of these talk shows would have was, you know, you had your set And then like once a year, like and now we're live from New York and they'd rent out like a concert hall. likeike where bands would normally play. and you do these special one offs in the same way that podcast tour I and do live versions of like I think that's where all of this is headed is like rather than having this big home r It's super expensive You're staffing up to go do special one offs and stunts and things at concert venues or going on tour because that's where They're all just chasing inevitably where podcasts have gone. and like that's what Cle Bear is going to end up doing some form of in the future is probably U something that goes has'm still up on stage. It's just not at That theater any. It's interesting that you mentioned that, Patrick, because shortly after the late show with Stephen Colbert final episode debuted Colbert appeared on a public access Monroe, Michigan broadcast called Only in Monroe Did you hear about this patch climbic? Do you have a chance to watch any of this? I watched like a brief bit of the exchange between Colbert and Jack White and Who was the interviewing at the time. There was Jeff Daniels. Je Daniel was also on it. Yes.. So first of all, Patrick, let me start by saying, you know, you and I have shared our disappointment of Colbert's career trajectory several times of this podcast And The Colbert on the Monroe broadcast only in Monroe. I thought was classical bear. This is like the cold bear I fell in love with becausecause it is so dry And so almost avant garde because you're watching Stephen Colbert in this public access show that's like incredibly low budget This is the most I have enjoyed watching any Colbert in like probably a decade. Like I think He was very, very funny. It is worth watching the whole thing. And by the way It is up on his brand new YouTube channel. So he has a YouTube channel now Uh like a Stevenen Colber YouTube channel, not the Late Show YouTube channel. And as you talked about Patrick, like, that's where things are going. Let's talk about this only in Monroe broadcast that Stepeen Colbert did. This public access broadcast A lot of misinformation going around about this Patrick, because I think what happened here Here's my understanding is Stephen Cole Baird did a broadcast on On in Munroe, which is in Munro, Michigan. and This is I don't know if you heard, Patrick, but Stehen Colbert also did a broadcast in twenty fifteen He also did like a public access Monroe, Michigan broadcast back in twenty fifteen. Do you recall this at all? Like this is the first I hadd really heard of it Uh vaguely. I mean because one of my favorite bits is when I think Will Ferrell's done this a couple of times where actors and comedians will shoot regional commercials that only show up.ike I know Will Ferrells in a bunch of these for different beers, if you go and searches on YouTube. So the only way to find them is to find someone who captured on YouTube because it ends up only airing locally, linearly. And so there is a long history of doing likeike local commercials and I do remember Colbert doing some version of this in the past So What happened in twenty fifteen was Stephven Colbert was in a limbo period he had gotten the gig of being the host of the Late show from David Letterman U, But he had not yet started that role yet. And he had left the co beare So he was kind of in this in between period where he was like between gigs And there's all this pressure of What's your first broadcast gonna to be like? Like,'s your first show going be like And so he and I think one of his producers had this idea of Well, what if we just did our first show in a public access show? in Monroe, Michigan, Like That would be like a funny thing to do and we could like work out the kinks and, you know, see what the workflows like And so that's what they did in twenty fifteen in that between time periods, Steven Colbert did a broadcast Urom Monro, Michigan on the public Acess showhow onlyn in Monroe. And Shortly after recording and airing the final episode of Late Night with Steam Colbert he returned back to only in Monroe again. Now I think what ended up happening was He this YouTube video onto like his personal YouTube channel And also it was out there. People assumed that because It was public access that therefore it was public domain and people could reshare it. So they could post it on their YouTube channels and they could post it on Twitter and they could post it on whatever the hell And so they posted it on all these different channels and then CBS began issuing takedown notices of the broadcast. And people were like, what? like Paramount is trying to suppress Stepven Colbert Wh where like reed alert, reed alert, you know, like people are like Paramount' trying to suppress anyway, this forced CBS to do two things. Num one down issuing these town notices. Number two, issue this statement Qote, Sthen Colbert's return to Monroe in the Only in Munroe episode was financed and produced by CBS Studios and was posted on Stehen Colbert's YouTube channel in collaboration with Monroe Community media and the Late Shows YouTube channels As is a regular practice, we send copyright notices to unauthorized websites that post copyrighted content from CBS and our network sizeed studio talents such as Stepven Colbert. However, for this episode, we've decided to waive further enforcement of this standard industry practice until additional review In my opinion And I'm not going to say this very often over the course of the next thirty years Pretty reasonable steps and statement from Paramount. Uh, so But I think people just didn't know Paramount CBS like helped to produce this O in Monroe segment. They just thought that Colbert and Monroe alone had the star power to get Jack White and Jff Daniels and Steuishhmy. Patrick Kleopic, any reaction to any of this silliness I don't blame you for Colbert spent the last six months bashing CBS. So I think the notion that there might have been some formal separation, I think is a reasonable. But this is also you know, a natural consequence of automated takedown technologies, right? Like where things end up happening on the internet as a result of just what they're, you know, the everyday course of action when they may actually be interfering with Um, But the actual intent is of the creative talent involved Yeah, so that is what that Kerfuffle was. You might have heard a little bit about like, oh, CBS is suppressing Colbert's new show. It's all lies, like it's very alarmist. They're just trying to protect their intellectual property. So which I think is relatively reasonable thing to do in most cases Speaking of Paramount I don't know if you heard this Patrick. Jackass TV show returns to Paramount Plus with restored original episodes According to this variety story, the series was temporarily removed from Paramel pllus at request of Johnynoville and the Jackass team in twenty five so that they could revisit and restore key creative elements that had been altered over time According to the Parount Pus serervice, the refreshed episodes now reflect the original version I' sorry the original vision of Jackass from when it launched on MTV in twenty ten According to Knoxville in the time since the release of Jack As twenty six years ago, the television episodes have been reedited, resequenced and recored to the point that they were unrecognizable I found this out the hardw way last year when attempting to watch them. Ek Kudos to Paramaount for giving us the money to restore the shows to how they initially aired in the first place. We can't wait until you see all the terrible things we did to each other back then. and in the manner we intended and And apparently what this was for those who are curious like what the format was is like They would chop them they would chop up the episodes into different chunks like than they were originally intended and also put like censor bars and other ways of censoring the content in ways that like weren't originally intended, it made it difficult to watch. was alsoir was airing on MTV. L Jackass like like origins are like little cliiped segments. I used to watch the show religiously when it was out originally. The censorship not granted, I would actually John Knox would probably also agree this makes me want to revisit this. Like sometometimes a sensor is actually part of the punchline right clear when this show was airing on MTV It was being edited cognizant of the fact that It was going to be censored. like Watching a penis get blurred out is sometimes funnier than seeing the actual penis on the screen. U agreed. aggreed. Patrick, I didn't know that you were such a big jackass fan. That's the Oh my ye, one of my all time favorite like things like I I adore all things Jackass Um, since I since I was a formative part of deffining my love of certain types of physical humor, like when that show aired originally on MTV when I was a teenager made lots of imitations jackass videos with my friends on tapes that have since probably for for the best and deleted and lost lost of time. And yeah, I've watched all the television shows. There was one time where my My, uh ahead of the previous film coming out U My wife and I were rewatching the old ones and My youngest was too young to have any sense of what was going on in the world. But my oldest was old enough to like pick up on what was going on in the TV. And I remember we like turn it off when she was paying attention. U But there was one where she made us rewind the clip over and over is when she It's one where they go in to like a bathroom store and there's lots of like toilets, but they're not connected to anything And they go in and like somebody, you know, some of the guys like go to you know, distract the salespe. while one of them goes to the newspaper and takes an actual shit in one of the toilets. And it so it's so funny. And when my daughter realized She actually went poopoo in there. like had to rewind it like five times so she could just like roll over on the on the ground crying of laughter. and I was like, you get it, you know, you get it I mean, I was going to say Jack is very good. I, you know I don't know that I would show the whole thing to kids that young, but you know, I'm not the one writing the video game newsletter. parenting for parenting and gaming. so I'm not an expert Um, I love Jackass. I think it gets a bad rap ic because I think people think it's just People like smashing their own testicles or whatever with with a hammer. But there is actually a lot of creativity In the stunts that they do, a lot of setu And there is a genuine pleasure in watching how this whole situation is going to unfold, right? Because they often put themselves into these unpredictable scenarios. And then you don't know how I don't know how that's going gonna to affect the human body I don't know how crashing a golf card at sixty miles per hour is going to affect human body And Jackass lets you find out Well, I also I' know Jackass movie in theaters, except for Jackass forever, maybe And I'm really excited about Jackass best and last surprise movie this year. I didn't know we' going to arere going watch that theaters Pr I hope so. the summer is always tough just to line up babysitter. like my kids can go to more movies with us, but that's probably not one that I would take them take them to. I show the clips of things that I think are funny but probably the whole movie Yeah, I mean, part of what's very charming about the Jackass go read any interview with like these guys like It'd be very easy, I think, to make the assumption that they're just a bunch of bone headed chuds. And They are but also like There's like a brotherhood, like a deep fondness for one another. L they're all deep like lifelong friends, who've gone through many ups and downs, like you know, the death of, you know various collaborators someome collaborors like Bamarjera coming in and out over the course of addiction and whatnot. And They're also like they understand why their show was funny. Jenny Koxville is like Re really, really smart. person. like go read anything with him. L and so There's just more going on to the show. and it's also something that grown up with, right? Like like I'm younger than the stars of Jackass, but you know Not forty years younger, right? And so watching their bodies get more fraid as mine has and like the way they've maintained friendships and found joy Yeah in this pursuit they did when they were so young There's something really charming and enjoyable about that that any, I don't believe them this this is the last one. I kind of think You're just going to get more space in between them. but I'll take whatever I can get. I don't care if this is half of a clip show and a couple of extra stunts, like I will be seated as soon as I possibly can I think that's a great point, Patrick about how There is this like nice family feel to the jackass. And also by the way, I want to say unironically, I think there's like a non toxic masculinity element to J S because They're all comfortable with each other's dicks Like a lot of the stunts involves dicks waving dicks everywhere and like the dick needs to be in your face or you're interacting with someone else's dick. and it's like Hey, there's something kind of a there's something a little bit aggressive about that at the time that show came out I'm also going to say, Patrick that These people did not end up in the place where I thought they would. You know What I mean by that is when watching like the very first episodees of Jackass, you're like, o, that person is definitely, you know headed down a bad path in life, right? And then meanwhile S of them. I'll just say Stevo, I'll say like I did not think that Stevo would make it to this point And he seems like a very Wholesome positive individual who like has a whole story about his sobriety and how that's important to him. And I'm like kind of kind of a role model in some respects around this topic. And so I agree. That's been very surprising to see And also delightful. anyway. so It's wonderful. You and I both have like some very strong positive feelings about the Jackass universe. And and now you can watch the original episodes restored on Paramount plus I got to go back. I had to admit when I first read this story, my thought was Oh it would make sense that there's probably some late nineties humor. It's like doesn't hold up and These actually be the kinds of guys that I think would edit it because they feel good. like guilty about like, I don't know, like saying, you know, the way that like, you know, ableist slurs were just like slung around in the night like that was my first impression. was like, oh, is there just stuff that they now look back and go Right. That's not who we are anymore. We're going to edit those to better reflect. like how we've learned and chang because these I think these guys would do that. I think they would do that and tell their audience that didn't think it was It be like, that's not woke like we're just we're just different people now and we would't make stuff like that anymore. But instead, it's much funnier that it appears to be that Johnny Knoville tried to watch it. was like, o, these has been edited like nine times. This is gross or maybe the license music was lost the way's like I' believe me. I have not watched that show since it aired. I've only watched the film, so I will be there catching up on Same, same. Gad to hear that they're going to be in an ideal form on Parmel plus. Anyway, those are some thoughts on Jackass so far This is an interesting story, Patrick Klepk. this comes from variety. comot Calcici and Polymarket are spoiling reality TV shows and studios don't know what to do about it For those who don't know calcium poly market are prediction markets where people can make wagers on certain outcomes And according to this article, the winner of CBS' Survivor fififty was announced live on air on may twentieth but bet traders on prediction market platforms, Cosi and poolymarket and survivor fans exposed to reports of the fluctuating odds saw Aubrey Braco's payday coming before the season even began When a Survivor fififty market opened on Kali six weeks before the february twenty fifth season premiere Preliminary trades forecast Brocco to have a sixty one percent chance of winning nearly double the odds of her next closest competitor And quote, That's what they're called markets, by the way, the you know, like is a market open for this you know, this season of television and so on by january twenty eighth, she had jumped to eighty three percent and by february twenty eighth Just days after the premiere and before Bracco had accumulated much screen time, a user bet forty five thousand dollars that she would win the season By markets close on the day of the finale, a stagging thirty two point seven million dollars in wagers had lifted our odds to ninety seven percent For anyone following along Braco seemed all but certain to be crowned the sole survor minutes before the finale. Kosi goed in a push notification. Is the island already decided Pre taped reality TV shows are facing an unforeseen problem. Prediction markets are spoiling their endings. not just survivor Kaly users correctly predicted Galaxy Girl at ninety one percent odds would win this season's mask singer Three months before it was revealed. The The site similarly spoiled the winner of next level Chef in February Even though that season didn't conclude until may twenty first Doug Mason, a contestant on the ill fated season twenty two of the Bachelorette peaked at eighty nine point five percent in polymarket, ninety three ninety three percent in Gusi Be ABC cancellled the premiere I will also point out by the way that Cali Jeff Prootz Responded to variety of supportorting. and said that prediction market platforms are incentivizing people to lie cheat and steal to get ahead. Kelsey then responded, saying. If the market volume on survivor is any indication This isn't something that's stopping people from caring about survivor. That being said, we're looking at adding product features to prevent spoilers Pydrocpic Any thoughts on Prediction markets, spoiling reality shows and their effect on society in general I'm not sure how much they can actually do about the spoiling part. Like it's just so easy for a piece of information to be passed along and exploited for gain and then it only takes that to happen to a couple of people before peoplee start picking up on like a shift in the market and then doubling down believing that that is and you know, I mean, I don't I don't I don't know what the people who make Survivor can do to actually change this book because the incentive structure is so simple, easy and straightforward to make a quick buck 's like, I can't even really blame people for like, I could just make a thousand dollars by doing nothing. Right and not and like experience no consequences. I kind of can't What getm mad at that? Like I'm mad more at like look, self admit, I like I like betting. I do small steak bets all the time. Uh like I even use have used Calcici in the past because sports betting is illegal in Wisconsin, but prediction markets or not. Now you might be asking yourself, that doesn't make any sense. and you'd be right You'd be right, that doesn't make any sense. But my brother and I both have kids now and we don't go out to the bar to like watch sports. and so like One thing we do is like we just sit around and I mean, we I bet five dollars on Australian basketball and was very invested in that five dollarars Australian basketball game. It never leaves the app. I make no money on it. It's just like a way to pass the time with my brother when we watch sports and hang out, That said, they should be wiped out and illegal and I shouldn't be allowed to engage with them. not because I have a problem regularly and also they should be completely leillgal and no one should ever use a vehic.' like much more deeply relegated like there's no there's really it's a wild West out there. like I think they just shouldn't exist. Prediction markets are terrible. Like you should not be betting on Are we going to invade another country? like this it's rotten for society. I do it to pay to place two dollar bets on like New Zealand likeike soccer teams that's And I may be fine, but like I also recognize that doesn't mean it shouldn't be annihilated from society. So that's sort of where I end up on it. And I just don't think there's much I don't think any of these productions could do much about it. Kowsi's making shit up. like products in place to prevent this. likeike no. I think you're lying too. Think about how many people will know about the outcome of a reality show like Survivor Before it airs, right?ike A Dozens, if not hundreds of people, right All those hundreds of people need to do is tell one friend Hey. betet on this outcome and you will win basically unlimited however much money you want? you can you can have it, you know D depending how you're willing to wager. One, especially is the way these prediction markets work is there's no house, right? So like the way betting markets work Um Im Yeahah, you're you're generally competing against other people play competing against other people. like whereas like, you know, when you see It's impossible to avoid betting lines now because they're on literally everything these days. when it says like, oh, I wonder if this team will win by, you know six point five points like that is set by a house. likeike they're The house, the fandu or whoever, the casino is saying We're going to set a number that's going to trick X amount of people into betting this one way or the other. so we make money on prediction markets, it's the wisdom of the crowd, so to speak. like that is that is swaying where that those lines go. That is the appeal of prediction markets is Theoretically, you are getting information from the wisdom of the crowds and therefore The idea is that like if everyone's placing bets at the same time, you will end up with better information. That's the theory. But in reality, It is a massive for huge scamps. Oh my God. L what they like the they tried to defend like, well, you know, like if you're in Iran, like, wouldn't you want to know if you're being bombed today? And we really just think that like Calci and poolymarket are like the place to go to have secret insiders in the government making money on the side knowing the upcoming war plans. becausecause if you know those war plans through the prediction market You can know whether you should be hiding in a bunker today. And that is just the wisdom of the crowd I agree. I think they are Terrible for society and that now they're leaking into like spoiling shows, right? whichich is really bad. So I guess the the takeaway here is prediction markets shouldn't exist or they certainly shouldn't exist in their current form where u, you know People can basically make unlimited money through absolutely no work any kind of quQote unquote, cheat the system, although the system is really functioning as it's designed And also Stay away from them if you want to avoid spoilers for some of your favorite reality I think you and I will all st about how the this prediction marketetss on U future episodes of TV shows that people have seen, right? L You and I get some shows in advance and people are placing bets on like, to so and so survive into the future episode and you and I know that information. And there's nothing preventing me from like taxing that to a family You know what I mean? Like Right, especially if the wagers are smallmall scale enough, like, you know what I mean? Like How are you tracking down through as like these places like Well, we have AI tools, the what the AI tool that like tracks whether I texted my cousin to let him know who's liive at the end of the new season of severance. Like I'm not doing that because I'm not a like despicable person but it's You don't have to be despicable to like understand the insteadive structures G people to do stuff like that. Yeah I think It's not heading anywhere good You know, it's already been it's already been bad And it's not hitting anywhere good. And I have a feeling . Things Bad things are already happening peopleeople already having their lives threatened over quote unquote contracts I think they're called, right? in these things where oh, you defined it as this and you meant it like you should have Hey,, I bet a million dollars Rue is going to die at the end of Euphoria and I'm going to threatenens Sam Eevinson, you better make sure Rue dies or else like, you know O else I going gonna lose a billion dollar? you know, stuff like that has already happened We're ha sports all the time. likeike sport yeah that's like like athletes will get heckled. in like in arenas over like not hitting the over on like an assist and a basketball game or something like that is and those are ext in some ways extensions of people's relationships with fantasy football, like but it all Like I think there's not wrong with fancy football. I' think there's like really nothing wrong with like low stakes, like highly regulated gambling. but like we just keep digging deeper and finding more corrosive ways to apply the same exxploitative techniques. Yeah Sad stuff, sad stuff McKay Hoppins wrote a feature about online sports betting for the Atlantic. Many people did not like that article But he did have one thing in it that I thought was very astute where he said you know, he went to Vegas to gamble. You can you can gamble on sports books in Vegas. And I don't know about you, Patrick, but I used to remember a time when you need to either have a bookie Right? Or you need to go to Vegas to to play bets on sports. Now anyone a shady website that shady websites. Yeah like that's that's what I used for A long guide was a website with a It's like banking part was in a country that allowed you to operate it and then you could use a terrible website to bet six dollars on the Chicago Bears But he had something that I thought was very astute, which is When he was in Vegas, he's like, this is what gambling should be It should be in the middle of a desert and really hard to get to and it should make you feel vaguely bad about yourself when you're doing it That's what gambling should be. and instead It's on your phone, right? You can log on and do it on your browser. And there are going to be immense social consequences, the likes of which we are only beginning to experience Final topic Vought rising trailer debut, petrolypic I don't know if you saw this, but the privateical series vought rising. Release his first trailer last Friday morning Go back to nineteen fifties, New York City to show the evil origins of Vought and Jensen Zackles Soldier Boy End quote. So yeah, Pat Klepk Any reaction to the Vought rising trailer real quick I know the trareer Vot Rising looked like it actually might be a pretty good show, which doesn't shock me given that GenV's first season was pretty terrific as well. likeike it will not be any surprise to me If Oh man, Vought Ryen capturing a little bit of that juice that the boys used to have in the way same way the GenV also caught some of the juice that the boys had in a different way early on. So I mean, The booyys an end bad enough that I am completely off engaging with the world in you certain capacities or with the right argument. blown away by the trailer, but in watch It' like, Yeahah, like that show looks like it could be fun I'll check it out when it comes out, but I don't know that I'm u necessarily anticipating it. like highly as much as like I'm open to the idea of it. plus twenty twenty seven, you know Time heals all wounds. It's like, well, it's just sitting there I guess I could check an episode or two out. How about you? Are you ready to get off the train completely I kind of I mean, I mean, I kind of am. that said, we will almost definitely be covering it on decoding TV as a show of the week probably, right But I will say that My first reaction when I saw the trailer was Oh, this is where all that money went Like my I have this theory that that Amazon Prime was like, hey Eric Krypti, we can give you This much money. you can allocate it however you want But you got to split it between Vought Rising and the boys final seasason and also maybe what the Bys Mexico or whatever that that other series is that' still in development And u and he's like, we're going to allocate it all towards what like I say it looks like an expensive show. It looks like Even in the trailer, we get like more locations in the vaought Rising trailer than we did for the entirety of the boys season five And also imagine it this way. You know, E Kryptia hasn't said anything articulate this from what I've seen. The boys is you adapting an existing ory GenV on rising is you taking this universe and telling your own stories within it It's not super shocking that like a different kind of energy goes in to that. And so that's why I remain like open to the possibility that bought rising is actually pretty decent because It's an opportunity for these creatives who've done some interesting work in adapting the Bys' comic book But this is almost wholly their own thing, just using the existing characters So Maybe that will free them to do more interesting things, question mark. I'm still I still feel pretty burned by the boys season five Petroclepic I have to say. Yeah. And I feel like again, we talked last week on the bonus episode about the scale of it being so small and , somebody pointed out online the season two finale of GenV had more scale than the season like the series finale of the Bys That's true Right? The GenV season two like that was actually like a fairly impressive final episode where there's like lot Dozens of characters and mayhem unfolding and We didn't even get that for the boys. just man. What a disappintment Well, you can check out our thoughts of the boys on last week's bonus episode. but anyway, bought rising, it's on the way And I think they made a mistake. by not investing enough in the Boy seeason five finale. Like I think that From what I can tell, Patrick, the general reaction to the boys season five has been very bad And that is going to color people's desire to get into the vot rising. L And you need to finish this so strong so that you can then propel it into the next season. having said that. U the biggest counterxple that has ever lived is House the Dragon. So which is a hit show despite the Game of Thrones ending badly. So, you know aybe I'm completelyull of graround. Anway, that's going to bring us to the end of TV news this week. Sking. Pushing Creating Learning, discovering At ArAMcoO, we believe in harnessing the power of data to push the limits of what's possible That's how we deliver reliable energy to millions across the world. A RAMco, an integrated energy and chemicals company. And leararn more about us at arramcoo. com Introducing the Total Solutions advantage only from Comcast businessusiness. It's the largest fastest fiber powered network for small business, gig speeds with equipment and security included, and a five year price lock. No one does business like Comcast Biness. Switch today. Get started for sixty dollars a month for twelve months when you add an advanced solution to a qualifying interternet package. Limited time offer Restrictions apply newew customers only requires three hundred megabt second internet, security edge and additional qualifying service, one year agreement, paperless billing and autoay bank account required. Taxes and fees extra. Patrick Cleet, before we get to our conversation about Euphoria season three episode seven Where can people find more of your work on the internet this week Yeah, you'll be to hear me this week talking about a game that I've been anticipating for a very long time called Mina the Hoower. It's a new game from the developers of Shovel Night another excellent adventure game. I literally thought you' were going to say z zer seven first slight, which I bought today because it's out today. So I'm excited about it Yes, no. I have not had a chance to play that. I've been spending a lot of time with you know, the Hollllowers part of a feature I'm doing over at remap. You able to read that an interview later this week at remap radio. com and here we talk about the game on or flagship podcast, rememap radio. And then I have a newsletter called Crossplay parenting and gaming this week will have as we do every month, sort of a curated list of all the family friendly video games that are coming out this month that you might want to put on your radar. If you're looking for something you and your kids to play together. You can see all that at crossplay. News All right And again, a reminder for what's coming next week we will'll be covering the series finale of Euphoria as well as the new Spider No series starr Nicolas Cage on Pime video L look forward to that next week episode of Dcoding GivV Let's get to our conversation about this wee's episode of Euphoria ation life No matter what is being pulled towards a bright of feat It doesn't feel like it And if you step back from this moment your life Y life in the history of the world Welcome to deceoding TV's coverage of Euphoria Season three, episode seven this week I'm David Chen, joined by Patrick Leppic as usual. Patrick, we're going to discuss this episode of Euphoria and share our overall thoughts and talk about what happened. First, I wanted to mention I expressed a puzzlement last week about the finger in the box that Cassie was sent People point out in the comments that that was actually shown in the previous week's episode of Nate getting his finger cut off and obviously a very silly mistake by me to not make that connection on the podcast. So I just want to say it's very clear that itsates finger I still think it's a little bit weird the way the show edited it, but you know I do want to acknowledge that I did make an error there That that said, Patr Clppic, what do you think of you for season three episode seven? Oh, David, you playing a clip of Colon Domingo at the beginning is just a cheat code. Just like this show deploys that actor as a cheat code to distract me from all the stuff that is not working Inead episodes Can't say they aren't setting up some stakes for the end of Euphoria, whether I think those stakes are interesting or the journeys we've gone along the way to get to those stakes particularly well earned I think this is a deeply frustrating episode with a handful of high highs and just many questionable decisions by characters doing things that don't really make a lot of sense for these characters simply to put people in positions the finale. It it's like if we have to be this clunky and have the characters betray themselves and their own motivations in order to get there That is a frustrating place to be for a show like this. So I want to see the end. I'm deeply curious to see where it all ends up because I thought I had a picture of the end game and now David, I think like A version of the show where everybody is dead is one hundred percent on the table. I don't think that's what's going to happen. But like it is within the window of possibility. So I don't know where the show ends up But I suspect it ends up ret frustrating ret disappointing U and I don't regret the time that I've spent watching this season because the production values are through the roof and it's a lot of actors. I really enjoy But the storytelling, its worst impulses this season are on display in many, many ways in this episode alone And that is that's an unfortunate place to be. so I'll keep watching not only because we're covering it, but because it is interesting. It's just, it was a big swing and a miss and I think B street continues with this Episode of Before you. How about you We talked about this when we were covering the boys, but there's this kind of having done this podcast with Patrick for many weeks now years There's this kind of sinking feeling you get when you get to kind of the final two to three episodes of the show, and you realize it's not gonna to turn things around by the then It's like, o, like No matter what happens in the final episode, this is probably not going to be great And that is how I feel about this season of Euphoria. This season of Euphoria theoretically was going to explore topics like the sexual exploitation of women the depiction of women and usage and deployment of The image of women in Hollywood H the drug trade across you know, into Mexico and how law enforcement approaches those things What it's like to have friendships that fracture over time as you leave high school and everyone goes off and does their own thing That's kind of some of the topics that have been introduced since the beginning of the show And As of seven out of the eight episodes, none of those topics has been explored with any kind of particular insight or depth It's a very what I would describe as a surface level exploration of these things, like kind of Oh, have you have you noticed that a lot of women are going on only fans Have you noticed that sometometimes TV shows trade on the legitimacy of or the sexiness of only fans to to kind of boost their own numbers, But then some people are really squeamish about it. and we have really deeply ambivalent views towards women in our society. know That's about as deep as I think this exploration goes. in my opinion, you know, other people may get more out of it Having said that, The genre trappings of the show continue to be prettyret strong. I mean, it It's still a really good looking show. It's well lit, it's well shot Sidney Sweeney is really doing her best to Uh maybe get nominated for an award this this season. likeike she is really, she is putting in the most acting out of any character in the show. U And so you have to respect that to some degree, but yeah, overall U it's a bunch of Sounded furious signifying nothing this season I think Who knows the finale could turn it around? But let's about what actually happened episode We start this episode with a flashback featuring Coman Domingo as Ali. We see how he goes on drugs. He hires a hooker played by Natasha Leone And this doesn't go well when he returns home to his partner and kid and needs to explain things, But then we see him turn his life around and become somebody who helps other people And that's great. We also See that he knows a lot of people that died during COVID due to depression from addiction And I just have to say that The way the show has handled COVID is actually kind of She feel like this is like, oh yeah, that was a tremendously isolating time in people's lives and a lot of people did have horrible impacts to their mental health. and it's really rare to see a show acknowledge that. And and anyt timee Euphoria does a character flashback. It's generally pretty good. It's generally like, okay You did a good job and that illustrated more about that character's backstory motivations in an effective fashion But Patrick Clip, what do you think of getting more of Alie's backstory this episode? Yeah I mean, he's just Like I said, like Clem Domingo is a cheat code. He's just a really, really wonderful actor. I've really enjoyed his character across Euphore, he's one of the constants. like anytime he's on screen somethingomet interesting is happening and M Eespecially for somebody who's only alluded to know I guess part of what was seeeeing what was about to unfold. like He's talked about the terrible things that he's done and we can make continuations on the terrible things that he has done Is there value? in putting that on display. Or is that just Well, we got toa find something else for him to do when he doesn't really have a natural way to be in this story anymore. It's probably commal in C be. like it's so well acted, so well shot and really kind of brings a lot of the character full circle in a way that I found very interesteresting and enlightening. And it was all just to have that moment to reflect on COVID, which is You know, I'm with you. I thought that was very poignant by the story the story to point out that O one hand It was the right thing to do to try and mitigate whatever risk we could in how an however messy that might have been because Not doing so was also going to harm people But you can't pretend like that didn't have different forms of impact on people as a result of those different mitigation factors and strategies. and so acknowledging that in a very real way It isn't like staying home was woke. Like it was like, you know, it it's a very realistic sobering look at the consequences of one of the most consequential events. that will ever happen to you or I over the course of our lives. And so all that worked really well for me. and I thought they did just enough to justify an excuse to bring him back into into the story. If we're nothing else then to have a nice origin story, interesting origin story for him. and also for it to be this kind of final moment with Rue before she goes on one last ride. Right. So let's talk a little bit about that, right? He tries to discourage her from goingo Rue has been tasked by Alamo Brown with infiltrating Laori's hideout and getting the money out and all the stuff out of the safe, right And U Rue believes that if she does not do this that Her mom will be harmed And so she needs to do it, but Alamo tries to say, hey, don't don't do this. like it's not good. You need to stop doing this and get this out of your life Rue believes that she has been spoken to by God because of the burning bush They make the comment, Patrick that Moses never saw the promise line. Are you familiar with this concept that Moses never saw the promise line So for those that don't know The idea in the Book of Exodus and the other books in the Old Testament is like Moses' job, as tasked by God through speaking Timoth through the Burning Bh, was to lead the Israelites out of Egypt into the prromised land. And they wandered around in the desert for forty years And Moses never ended up seeing the promise like he died in the desert I'm simplifying things enormously U If I recall correctly, Patrick The reason why he did not see the prromised land is because U at one point, they needed water And God said, Hey, go up to this rock Moses, go up to this rock and speak to the rock and tell the water to come out And Moses goes up to the rock and rather than speak to it strikes it with his staff. He like puts his staff on and then water comes out and everyone gets the water And God's like, hey Cool, dude. I've told you to Speak to the rock Uh, and And as a result, I think that was the punishment If that's that's if I recall my Sunday school classes correctly likeike that's b was like, guess what? You're not seeing the promise l most. I'm like, dud Harsh man. L the guy like gave up his like decades of his life to lead these people through the deb. You're not going to let him see because he's because he's hit the rock instead of speaking to it kind of harsh anyway It is a you know, then in the story Moses does Paris before he can ex see the promis l if we continue the analogy and Ru is Moses She didad he dead nextxt week, right? I think that is possible I think it's reasonable. A question for you. Do you think Rue is right to believe She has to go through for this for any of it to have been worth it Yeah, I mean, like I I'm with I'm she's in the hole But I do think It is entirely reasonable on her part likeike her family, her sister Others would be under I think that's a reasonable conclusion for her to draw that like you've seen it this far You've got to step over the line and see what's on the other side worst case scenario is you're dead, but if you die, I don't think your family does. And I think that's the calculation that she's making, and I don't think it's necessarily U I would agree. I think I have a lot of questions about the DEA's involvement. like why can't they intervene mayaybe it's a timing thing where, you know, they want this whole bus to go through before they can take everyone down and it's like But she needs to do this thing now, right? And so maybe that's why, but it's hard for me to believe that the DEA wouldn't want to help her not die you know, in this situation, but whatever I don't think the show is super interested in the intricate details of the DEA's work in the show. Uh, anyway So what else ends up happen in the episode We learn what happened to Almo Brown's guy. He needs he like had part of his intestine removed By the way veryer bizarre petroclpic he's talking to Alma Brown about like, oh, like the bullet shaved part of my intestine And and I need this bag now for the rest of my life Literally in another show that we have discussed on this podcast this week, there is a whole plot about a character's intestine getting nicked in basically the same fashion Not gonna to reveal which one but I'll just say it's weird that I saw these two things within like a twenty four hour time spin Alamo sends him down with Laori's men and some women to kind of do this job Meanwhile Uh We see what happens with Cassie and that show that she's supposed to be on. Brian Grazer The actual producer of Euphoria and big time Hollywood producer in reality said, Hey, Sharon Stone, I don't think you should be having Cassie in your show. It's too risque. I don't want to have protest all this stuff. And so Cassie and Maddie are both fighting. Um, but Maddie has a plan to come back. Even though she lost all her only fans followers when she deleted her page She goes on a date with Dylan, the Eion Kight's actor. and after they have sex He drinks water with Nate's finger in it while Cassia unlocks his phone and tries to use his Instagram to post a selfie, which she eventually does So yeah, I have to say, despite the fact that I don't think the show is that good It often is a provocation Right? It often is like, I'm going to show you something incredibly gross and upsetting. And I want to see if you react to it and seeing a guy post quot as with Sidney Sweeney Drink a finger Iice water I have to say it was very disgusting and they did get a reaction out of me. How about you bed Yes, upsetting. The less realistic thing was that she can't get her account back I'm right. Now I just briefly searched.. And it doesn't appear to be like many places, if you self delete a account on only fans that there's not a button to recover it. But I'm sorry The show presents her as like galivanting around with some of the most L you know on demand celebrities like like in in a very highly coveted demographic If you are telling me, there is an engineer that like if she came back and said, I would need this account back, it was a mistake, please, that only fans couldn't find a way to do that Okay, if I can I guess I'll just hand wave it for pl like She's not just a random noobody and only fans. like she isn' in like by most accounts in this episode, one hundred thousand subscribers within twenty four hours putting you in a high percentage of or low percentage of the audience on there. It's just a little silly. it's just a little silly in a way that like I had Find other ways to explain this. Sure, sure, sure. But yeah, I don't think the show iss trying to say anything with a finger, right? other than other than oh, what a what a hilarious coincidence that Uh he's drinking her husband's finger juice I did like that when they showed the finger later and it was in the sink, it was like in a more advanced state of decomposition. I was like Somebody's job was to think about how long that finger had been in that cup and then show how long it had been decomposing Very funny. It's kind of classic like Cohen Brothers esque Hijinks and I can't say I didn't enjoy it But anyway She does get her On Fanss account back up to over one hundred thousand subscribers despite kind of Violating this guy's social media. I'm curious we'll see pretty' see Yeah prettyty bad pretty bad. Pretty badly pretty badly in a pretty objectionable way. so Anyway The people that Nate owes a debt to bury Nate underground and give Cassie seventy two hours before Nate dies of starvation U And so then Cassie's trying to get the money And then she's eventually threatened and then she asks Maddie to get the money and Maddie goes to Allamo Brown and asks for a million dollars He agrees to assist in exchange for a percentage of all Cassie's future earnings During a desert standoff Almo kills Naz the Armeniian Now The idea is Almost said, okay, I'll give a million dollars and then he doesn't give him a million dollars. He just shoots him instead, which I don't know Like In my opinion Let me just say this Patro Cl, if I was batty, I'd be pretty disappointed at this outcome Okay, because you're promising me a million dollars and then instead you kill the guy. And then there's like I got to be constant there's going to be collateral damage and consequences from that. mayaybe we don't know if NA the Armenian is extremely well connected. What did you think of how the whole Matty NAS Alamo Brown thing resolved. deeply frustrating. like from Matdie just like, o, just like casually mentioned like I don't know, Rou said something about the DA. likeike no why would you say that? You're the most calculated person on the show. Like you are you have thought through the next six things you said in your in your head before they come out of your mouth, which is why you sound so confident When you say them, you would What is just casual like like literally that whole chain of information makes sense. Why would Rue mention it to Lexi? That makes sense? Why would then Lexi mention it to Maddie makes no sense, then why would Maddie mention it to Ellen R? In my opinion, it does not really like maybe you could say she's playing forty chess, but it's like There's a lot more damage that like unpredictable damage that can be done by revealing that information than by not revealing it. And so's very frustrating betrays it otherwise. I mean, obviously the, you know Maddie's in a vulnerable spot like she is exposed you know, that she actually wants to help her friend. And so I can understand her acting slightly differently or more hesitation. but that is a uncharacteristic u mistake that makes very little sense to me. Alamo in the midst of like one of the most important moments of like his work at the moment like decides like, yeah, I'll just like, I'll just get in the car. J just like go shoot a guy. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah the deser. take on this incredibly high risk activity for seemingly very little reward or reward that he doesn't fully believe in yet. Everyone' just walking around and trying not to hide that they're just doing menacing things out in public. like's twenty twenty six, is' present day just showh like walking up the front door and that it's just not a All these things are caught on camera somewhere. don like I don't And also you're right I do not believe that Elma would that himself. Like he would send someone to do that. That's They did. they he shot him in the middle away from where the protected flowers are. You tell me there's not a camera around there like watching what's happening in this spot, none of that makes a lick of sense to me. So it's a lot of characters acting irrationally and I just didn't really none of that worked for me at all. I mean, Matdie ending up in a place where She was going to like have a group of women that she sort of managed and controlled and turn that into profit And now it's flipped around where it seems like she's going to be the one that now toity held next to Alamo for all sorts of different like is a really sad place for that character to end up And as a result of many poor decisions she's made along the way, but u Yeah, I just Again, like it's like so many things in this show moment to moment, like The way that Alamo tips his hat so he can figure out the trajectory of how he's going to shoot the gun Sick Extremely cool. But when I think about the logic of anything that led us there It like completely falls apart in a way that U undermines how you feel about how entertaining it might have been. as it was unfolding. Well, what happens is Almo does shoot the guy and then convinces his henchmen to give up Wh guess Why does he do that? This is guy' the most menacing character in the season and he's just like Yeah, I don't know, like, yeah, I guess I'll just help. like yeah, on I'll get in the machinery U Anyway, they dig up Nate Jacobs who has died because he's been dug he's been down there. They thought he would survive for a few days, but a snake wormed its way down there And bit him and killed him. And by the way Apparently, he was originally supposed to die of dehydration or suffocation or whatever But Sam Evenson changed it because he says he was driving around LA and he had this vision of stake getting in And that's what ended up happening Also, in an interview with Esquire, Sam Levinson had this to say about U what Fate, Nate Jacobs meets, he says, it was what was exciting about the character is being out of high school They're in the real world and the consequences are real. There's no safety net. I like this wild West frontier aspect to it where you can make something of yourself, but you're going to have to live with the consequences end quote. That's been a theme that he's discussed multiple times during interviews. He's like, guys, they're not in high school anymore s like all the little messing around they did now it has consequences to which my reaction is Uh did you see the final episode of Bey seeason two like Freickaking Fez got shot in the stomach and Astray died in that episode Multiple people like almost die throughout multiple points during the course of the show U I'm pretty sure the stakes were already pretty freaking high In Euphoresis one and two You know what I mean? So Um, if he's like, o, but now there's no safety net. It's like, did you feel that Euphorses one two is heavily safety neted Patrick Lppic? Like, didid you feel these characters were like in this cocoon of safety in Euphorees one and two? No, also, but just like the idea of like, well, they're not in the real world anymore. So also they're getting involved with Armenian gangsters. I like the level of life. I mean, I'm I'm constant telling you like, you know, David, like I'm inebt on Kalcici to these meanian gangsters when I bet on an Australian basketball. It's just not It doesn't it doesn't match the trajectory of where the show ended up. It very much feels I mean, even the way he describes the creative process of coming up with AD is like, oh you're just hodgepodging a bunch of different ideas stapling it onto euphoria because it's a vehicle. try these ideas out And that can be fine if what you stle together is entertaining its own right, but I think it ended up being entertaining enough on its own and also in many ways failing Almost across the board all the characters that people had come . to be invested in across the first two seasons of the show. Though I will give the show credit Uh I am Not squeamish, horror films are my favorite thing U, but I discovered last year when I had to get an MRI that I turn turns out I Caustrophobic did not know that, disiscovered that as part of the MRI process. notot fun And so I was fast forwarding parts of this sequence because it was actually straight of like triggering like what I would describe as like panic attack adjacent. It was like I don' need to see this. like fair it's It's like setting me back into how I felt in that stupid MRI machine. It was like, well, they did a good job of making this seem like one of the worst ways you could die That's how I felt in the MRI machine I'm not going to watch this anymore. Let me know when he gets bit by the snake. I need to just talk a little bit about the ultimate fate of Nate Jacobs, played by Jacob Lordi Obviously, Nate dies in this episode of the show and I have to say Uh you and I have sp you and I have talked about this all season. But I find the show's handling of Nate Jacobs to be quite bizarre U The season one and two Euphoria, Nate Jacobs was kind of had these extremely serious psychoosexual issues felt almost sociopathic, very dark and quite dangerous That character is virtually gone in season three. And ideally when a character in a show dies You want that Death to feel like it connects in some way with that character. L You want the death to be like, oh, that is where that character was inevitably going to go Like It was headed towards that way. I could name some exampl, but I don't want to spoil any of the great shows in TV history. I did not think at the end of season two that Nate Jacobs' ultimate end was going to be Bitten by a snake in the middle of a desert because he owed money to Armenian gangsters. Wow. no, mayaybe that's just because I'm not creative enough But that did not feel like the logical endpoint of that character I you just don't understand how that comments on the toxic masculinity of that character before just think on that long. Maybe put yourself in a coffin and just think on that, David Thank you Thank you, Patrick All right, finally Rue talks her way into Laori's hideout somehow U, but Not really very well because I think they are going to kill her But before they can do that, Fe helps Rue open the safe and inside they find no money However, they do find something much more upsetting, which is IDs of people that have banished from Alam's Club. Fey, who's fed up with everyone lying to her. She realizes she's not going to get the money. She screams to wake up Wayne as the episode comes to close. And look Even though this season the shows are good. I mean, this is an amazing sequence, right? withith them going down and then the machine in the background going on, all the sounds and the lighting and them opening and then like Fe becoming more and more agitated game recognized game like just expertly directed sequence and Sam Levinson I think Sam Levinson is a much more talented director than he is a writer Yes. And there is some really great direction in this whole season and not very much great writing Patrick Clip, any thoughts on any of this stuff with Faye and the final seasons of the episode. Yeah, I mean Fay's not wrong, like, you know, and granted, she has fallen in love with a white supremacist. so is You know,'reaking choices you do not on any level got to hand it to her. You know, well, but in a bad situation, not exactly a whole lot of I do feel like it's in some ways her making the best of a shit sandwich. obviously she was a contributor to making such shit sandwich, but I also don't blame her for being there's a little like One of the decent threadlines of this episode that kind of starts with Jules and then happens between Rue and Lexi then happens between Rue and Fe.