Legacy of Calvin and Knox

Spotify, it's Jay Sheddy. Are you one of those media strategy people sccrolling through spreadsheets, searching for an audience that pays twice as much attention to your ads than they do on social Let me introduce you to Fat And they're here with me on Spotify. Trust me, I know fans. They don't skip, they stay for hours They don't move on, they manifect. They're not a demographic group The event Spotify advertise You're among fans Have no fear, Chosen Foods is here to defend your favorite foods from the forces of seedy oils and sketchy ingredients. With cooking oils, salad dressings, and mayo all powered by the good fats for one hundred percent pure avocada oil and simple delicious ingredients. Chosen Foods Welcome back to Finburse history, joining me Horacio Gould. Hello. And this is an urgent discussion on Calvin Knox And our true intellectual heirs. Yeah. Well when you say urgent, you mean that this is urgent. I need to get this out. All right, okay. I'm fired up. Yeah. You're on the toilet. It' hours. need to get this out. I need to talk about John Knox. Yeah. And John Calvin. This has really fired you up. This is. In between these episodes, you were rifling through it. you were giggling to yourself. Giddy, You look a man man This is my heritage. Yeah. This is my psychological architecture He iss the architect. You know the end of the matrix where he meets the architect. Yeah. That's meeting John Ce. Be there's only a little bit of me, so it only explains a very small part of me, but for you, this is This is all of me I read John Calvin and I just did it all makes sense. Right. We's part three of our series on the Reformation. We've dealt with Martin Luther. D D. We've dealt with him. D we've killed him. We killed Luther. Now the piece of Augsburg is where we left off last time an easasy truce between Lutherans and Catholics But it left out U Calvinism Now who what Calvin Chipmunks? Is Calvin the Chipmunks. John Calvin. Unbelievably he's French I couldn't believe I still toally thought you was a Swiss fuck. but turns out that hidden amongst in the toilet. What I will say is that he's the bravest Frenchman who's ever lived and he's the only French man whose hand I'd like to shake. Jean de Calvin, but he has his name has been anglicized because it makes more sense in English then French, Joh Galvant. Does not make sense. Do it? It's John Calvin. It's not John Pork, Charlie Je Jean de Calvin Jean Calvin In the same way that when I watched the Manosfere documentary, I was like, this is such an Anglo American I can't imagine a French man. Oh the dirty bitch, lookook at my money. Oh Jeanl it doesn't make sense. Does doesn't work. Do it? The little French. Protestant manisphere in some ways. Yes. it's about the hustle grinds set. Yes. taking going outside the Matrix, Catholic Church, as you were saying. Yeah. That's what Andrew T saying. basically grabbing your own life by the boat straps and we are all fallen. We're all neo in the fucking thing. to us how we live. Exactly. In France is the muscle winet the muscle windet rather than the muscle windet. What's the muscle Is it muscle? Food free? Right, yeah.et? think muscle wineet's probably better. No, I'd like muscles muscle, but ye. Is it muscles? Yeah, I guess so. No, it sounds it's too much like that I think's that they're waking up drinkinking wines Truffle wine set that's good is good. It's less hle wine set more truffle wines's good. That is good. It' got to go in the end. C couple of plers and misses, but we' gotes. You've had a couple of misses this series, but you've opened this episode with the a corker. Chris one. Yeah. So Jean de Calvin, the bravest Frenchman the only brave Frenchman you could say. The one you could shake his hand without surrendering. Exactly. Yeah., you just shake his hand and he actually shakes it with go Oh, please I' sorry, takeake my wife, please U He does not have springs under his arm. He has no movement in his arms. H arms don't. He's complete disabled. Sthen Hawkin. Stephen Hak ost proster manans have lived. Ste Hakins. When that guy cot surrender? No, and he's lived a very calvinous life Well There's not much much play.s the phot of him up on Eppsy's Island. Yeah J his thought was AI. Yeah. It is that the first time I' been tricked by thinking something's real is definitely AI. This is this is this is a hawking Let's get to the bikin bikini girls Yeah, I mean, when you first found out that Haorkin was there, you're like, well, I'm sure it was something else. I'm sure it's not it's not what I'm imagining. because what I'm imagining is two bikini guy gals with cocktails and him in the middle. This is John Calvin when he goes to Rome was even talking to other Catholics. Yeah people in Switzerland are like, hang on, how are you? I can't imagine you going there. You don't make sense there. And he's like, I' if I can I had a holiday for myself for us. Anyway, So who is John Calvin? Now he's sort of the unsung hero of the Protestant Reformation. He is the Clude Michallia of the Protestant Reformation. so he doesn't get his flers. does not get his flowers and if he doesn't want flowers, put them in the bin. He wants just a dry piece of wood or something Calvin is he sees what Luther's doing and if Luther's a monk Calvin is a lawyer Okay. in that he's trying to implement a society based on Luther's teaching. Right, Which Luther isn't doing. Luther's all about faith in the book. Yes. But Calvin's like, yeah, but how can we actually make this civilization that how implement it He's off getting off the toilet Let's Let's go with it flush wipe next. done. Yeah. So Calvin is born in fifteen oh nine. He's a lawyer and he's in sort of Northern France And he converts to Protestantism. And bear in mind Switzerland, which is where he'll make his name, that's in the Holy Roman emmpire and that's a bunch of city states. So it's just as loose as Germany. France is a big power. and again, this is a very confusing time. There is a great battle for the soul of France. There's a significant chance in the sixteenth century that France will ultimately be Potestant. I know the French Hugenots. whichich is just I mean the past imagine the sliding doors moment It doesn't m thinking about Where would England go to forget itself If France is not there. Yeah. Now, if Luther is a kind of beer drinking sort of table thumping pooy German, right Calvin is frail, intensely private Chronically ill, migraines gout, asthma I mean, he is sort of haawking S I suppose He only ever eats one meal a day Basically doesn't sleep. Right So a sneeze could kill him. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. He's very frail But he converts to Pstantism Which is not really the done thing in France. Right. There is a thing called the Affair of the pllacards. Right. So this is in the fifteent thiry which is as exciting as it sounds. It is veting stuff Yeah no, listen, the clash of the Lanyyards. Yeah it's not although there is a big lanyard clash culturally. in that there are people who wear them who are either autistic disabled or gay And people me today. Today there is a clashion I did see this is telegph podcasts It's making me laugh a lot with them Camilla. Yeah m me off because I don't know, I've really been enjoying telegraph headlines and It's just's can send them to me. they're really funny funny. someome of them. I'll get some of them up, but yeah, they're talking about that it's yeah, that there's like a new class clash between the landards and the non lanyyarded Did they actually say that? Yeah I was joking. Yeah it's great. They're saying this with a very intellectual, intelligent way everything that we joke about. And basically the hatred for Kir Star is because he represents the Lanyard class. I see and And that's kind of the new division. And it's the Lanyard class. They're the ones who slow down the bureaucrats,re the kind of, you can't wear that, you know. And there are a lot of jobs worth. Well givei than that, There's a lot of times in this country that I do feel like you jobs wororth swine. Yes. I want to get we need to get rid of this whatever this attitude is. Yes. Now actually I can't because I manager? No, they wouldn't. Yes. What that your cinema? one hundred percent. Cinema. one hundred percent I was watching half of the latest fucking twenty eight years later Really enjoying it in the best cinema, this new amazing cinema in Leicester Square. If I can finish halfway through it just The picture went, said Sorry, we're gone. I realized that it was across the road, they were showing it And it started forty five minutes later. We're forty five minutes film. I try to go in to see it And they're say sorry with the tails clos. It's like, Lad Just let us in. L yeah, we told you this whole story and he says we're like is it full? It's like No, there's los of room I was like, Well just like let us in. just let us in. No because But my manager might see on CCV I wanted to call him a swine. Your a swine in a c. Did he have a lanyard on? G coursese he did. R He had rectangle glasses. Right. You know that, that's like yeah, there's no way this person can ever think for himself There's no free thinker Yes. How's the rectangle? You mean like Fame Gon Erickson? Sort of images scrowdown Yeahet, those ones there See that one,, that one Yeah one. There's no way that this person has had any individual. myather in laws wears those glasses. And he has a he has a lot of ideas. Okay, fine. Yeah. They're mainly about Bandstown in the Surrey area. Oh ye of course he's a councor. He' is a councllor and in the recent local elections, the Lib liibdem's had a surge and he sent a gIF on the Wall Family WhatsApp of an AI Libdem bird going es here L li Denver countes. Yes. All right, so he feels. No, it's not threatening. He's not threatened by the Lb Denver. Oh right. so he's sort of like a werewolf It's likes almost like's a sururge to the L liibenver withith a big yellow cloak. Yeahah We got that You know, there's because you know, there's boomers on Facebook Cuck's revenge This boomers on Facebook but then this boom this boomers discovering AI and it's a whole new sewer of them going. Is this amazing and it's the most boring you know. This episode of Fin Vversus History is sponsored by Surfshark. O. Yes. Yes. VPN. We love it. Vj pussy Nga Nungas It's all there. This is the opposite of that Yeah. This is not a badge Pussy Nunga Nungas. This is a virtual private network. Okay with which you can explore images of badge pussy nunga Nungas Admittedly if you talk about a virtual private network too much, you'll never really be able to see a Vagj Pussy or Nunaungas. Yeah.'s weirdly they're pick a team feellas pick a team willll scare away all the Vagjapusy and Nunga Nungas if you keep talking about a virtual private network. But a virtual private network is is important. It's so important If you want to explore the internet freely, Privately, this is like having armor, which I know you already own. You already have samurai armor. Y and chain mail. when you re enact battles. If you will again pass Keir Stammer's Communist porn ban Pretend you're French with your sururfshark VPN O Mexico C on and say I can watch what I want now. Nobody can enter your command center if your command center is in Mexico. Yes, or wherever. Exactly. It means it's a constantly moving command center. Yeah between the lines. Kirst Aarman and Rach Riza Jega, we can't find the command cere's it gone Where's a commander? Where's this man wanking? You will never find me. I'm using Surfshark. These are the unique benefits of Surfshark. Secure your digital life with Surfshark VPN. It's a risk free thirty day money back guarantee as we always say, the risk free is on the guarantee of the money, not what you're looking at the end. fth that you want to use this VPN Surfshark take no liability for what you're working at in order me me. If you go to sururfshark dot com slash Fh or click the link below You will get four extra months of sururfshark. Don't let Ker Starmer's online threats catch you off guard. Keep your data safe and see you next time. it to the shot No Golf is a mental game but you can't focus if you're not comfortable Lulu Lemon Golf Gear frees your mind and your swing, with fabrics that breathe, wick sweat and block UV. Streamline cuts, clear distractions from your backswing and your follow through. So whether it's the first tee or the last hole, your mind stays where it matters. On your next great shot, dial in your game this summer with Lululeemon Golf gear available in stores and at lululemon dot com d This episode brought to you by Google Chrome You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a fifty page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online makes sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check Responsse is setup required compatibility and availability varies eighteen plus Anyway Calvin's a French lawyer who converts to Protestantism. We get to the clash of the lanyards, the affair of the placards. It's fifteen thirty four. okay? There are Protestant reformists that're posting placards around France criticising the Catholic mass There is no way to imbue this with any drama, okay? This is sixteenth century liturgical disputes It could not be less relevant to anyone today. okay? But we have to get there to talk about our intellectual ores Posters are titled True Articles on the Horrible, Great and unbearable Abuses of the Papal Mass. So these are kind of people who are talking about Chinese organ harvesting outside the British Museum You know what I mean? Yeah. you know there's people with like photos of like Yeah, yeah, I do know that. I mean, there's all around Trafagga Square, there's like the people trying to get the Iranian rooyalists in. There's like people saying like convert the end isigh, there's a whole mixture of them. I don't want to be insensitive Where does organ harvesting end And Chinese cuisine begin. It fam cu. They are they're eating anything. Yeah, right? So at what point is it just harvesting? Yeah Don't you know they're Chinese? Yeah what you should say. It's called harvesting. It's their harvest. It's how they make food, All right That's I think it's culturally insensitive. I think it is a could complain about. Chinese organ. I'm a cultural relativist. you. Okay, E culture is of equal value. Yeah. Saying you can't harvest organs in China is like saying you cannot do a wasle in a Sarriolchra, sure Another thing my father in law has massively violent opinions on. What He's a big big pro AsL guy What is my whatice and all Wassale is a pagan apple harvest festival where they black up, but in a good way. Oh right, positive. Positive black face. Right. Robert Downey Jr. stuff. Right. You know, It's so funny that it's fine. So the affair of the pllacard is basically a bunch of French Protestants, which I realize is a contradiction in terms. they pllacards everywhere all over France and the previously tolerant king, I don't know which king he go so much for the tolerant king. This is too much. Placards you taking the piss? I'm And so he clamps down on the reformers, which means John Calvin flees France to Geneva. Now, we get to Calvin in Geneva, fifteen thirty seven This is where he basically starts preaching U his sort of sense of like more extreme Lutheranism. Is this the Beatles in Hamburg Yeah, yeah, but the opposite of that. It's Dylan going electric, Except it's Calvin going analog Calvin goes acoustic. right Unplugs everything and goes, it's all too loud o. So he goes to Geneva and he starts preaching. Calvin's big thing, okay is that Whereas Luther said that everyone is a sinner. we're all in the gutter, but through your own internal consciousness and belief and faith, you can reach salvation. Calvin says N. Listen, God is all powerful. He's already decided who is going going to heaven and who's not And what you can do is you can try and find signs in someone's morals or behaviour if they are chosen or not This is the birth of fat shaming. It's fatness as a moral sin Calvin is going you're not chosen for salvation because you're fatty. That's where this starts. So would you say Britain's fat families, canan we get some of that up please? Would you say this is playing on a Calvinist tradition. I'm saying it is impossible in a world without Calvin That's what I'm saying Okay, so it' it's putting all the responsibility on the person But it's not their fault in a way been predestined to to be fat immoral. But you slob, Well, in some ways, yes, but you can still work and you should work to try and prove that you that God has chosen you. If he hasn't chosen you, there's nothing you can do about it. Well, that's not a Calvinist attitude. No. That's a Catholic attitude. or maybe a Lutheran one But he still thinks it's all predetermined. So whatever Whatever happens was always going to happen. So Calvin is starting to attach morality to and like in a religious sense, to how people act in their lives. Right. So whereas Luther's saying it's all an internal process. The conscience. Inner conscience. Calvin's saying actctions. Actions speak louder than words. Okay. Okay. Frides speak louder than words.osts like thinking is too spiritual for Calvin. Exactly Even that through myself. I don't know what you're thinking. Yeah How can I not a minder? That's magic. I can see your're very Batman. Batman, what did he say? It's not who you are what you do that divines you. Yeah. So he's a Calvinist. It'sil you eat. Yeah. That's what you eat. So Calvin believes in he doesn't believe in transubstantiation. So the water into white, that's all bolls.es That's all Bllocks. God in the Bible is obviously he agrees with Luther that that's the main source Ch church' Bllocks. But he thinks that you should build a society where people are trying to in a sense, prove that they're worthy of salvation. Right So that's where he's getting up at four AM. He's Mark Warbberg. Yes. he's the grindser. Yeah. Okaykay. No Catholic is getting up at four AM It is the Protestant hours. There's no it is And the clock probably they're eating dinner at ten. You get two hours a peace. You get more than that. There is a time difference between you go r the clock the Protestant hours are the night hours. and then at what ten AM. You'd say the Catholic hours begin. Right. A about ten PM.ight Okaykay, Wh is where they have dinner. Yeah yeah. But the Potestants are in bed. They're turn at six PM. Exactly Be as Brian Johnson said, one of the most Presbyterian men there are poss Yeah deffinitely. Do does not want to talk measures like just has come. It's about as Presbyterian as it gets Be he doesn't want to die because he thinks there's nothing there. Right. Right? So the Catholics they're not there aim down dinner too late and what Br Brian Johnson says, you should leave about four and a half hours between your final meal and going to sleep. So this is the birth of the least spiritual people the planet. There's just nowhere else in the world that this is really come at all. And there I guess there's like Buddhism which is like minimal and stuff, but this sense of earthiness and groundedness. ' completely unique here. J Just breaking news Brian Johnson's got some nighttime erection data from my nineteen year old son. His duration is two minutes longer than mine. Raise children. justust stand tall be firm and be upright. I've come around to Brian Johnson,. No, no. I first he pissed me off, but I think he's now gone so far that qu's pretty good value. I think measuring your son's erections and then being kind of pissed off at the two minutes further than yours. Listen, we all have it's hard to make a relationship with Father Son You know, F someballing is difficult. If you're not football fans, if you're not football exactly, so you know, measuring each other's bonus is just one and not just like how big they are, the stamina. Yeah How are they let's just break that. How are they are they jacking off? L what are they doing to measure their it's nighttime erection data I imagine, if I know Brian Johnson, he will have custom made ring that goes around. It not a penis tracker Its penal trackers sor. It iss aenal track. Penal tracker. Yeah fit for your penis. Yeah. It's like a co whoop It's like a whoop bandie fie Dch. Yeah Firm tech tech ring So you've got Father Sun whoop dig bands and you're measuring each other's nighttime directions. That's bonding. Is that a jewel shot? What's that jel shot thing again? Qickick shot in any way that you're tering afterwards to go to bed. Right Yes.venty five pounds. So I guess yes, it's sort of the final frontier of biohacking is where you and your son pop on some tech cock rgs.'re all penle measuring ringss. Then you wake up in the morning and over breakfast you can compare The extra data Men loveves that. They do. they do. They do You know I'm I pray for the women in that household. I really do Could we talk about something else, please, guys, guys. And Brian's there like,, why don't you measure your own vaginal wetness? Why don't you fucking shove a data collecting tamp on up there Wh's got the driryes vana, I by So Calvin believes in simplicity and worship so he's actually the guy comes up with this. Yeah. he's the boring one Luther' actually a bit of a laugh. sureure, right? Yeah. Beause even by the end, didn't talk about him's fat He's a sausage Hes really fat by the end. Beer drinking constipated light. So Calvin Sing has being like, I don't think you're the guy, mate. You're on the toilet You're fat fuck stuck on the toilet. You' not you're not Jesus. He's Evis president. He is Elvis. He's German Elvis on the toilet in the sixteenth century, eating burgers, right Whereas and Calvin's going, I don't know, man. I think. So in Geneva, what he does is he basically creates the boring Protestant utopia, which is why Geneva today is like it is obsessed with time. clocks and accuracy. Yeah. it's like Swiss people are some of most bord people you ever meet. Yeah. I mean, it's the Boring Lands. Yeah. It's so dull I did a tour in Switzland like twelve years ago. De Bapti. Everything works, everything's clean Yeah. everythingthing's nice. Nothing fun It has no cure at all. No vibe at all It's just clogs. Yeah, right U I did We'd be driven round. The most interesting about it was we were driven round by a guy who smoked so much weed had he also had those you slightly crosside had those eyes that made you look the glass that made your eyes look massive.. But he'd look at us in the with view mirror And he'd be talking about like conspiracy theories how like the government r out to get him tried to move to Switzerland and stuff. But like his eyes were like flooding the fucking rearview mirror. He's out. He was the most interesting about Switzerland. It's so dull But that's because that' Cvin Calvin makes it this just ideal ordered unchaotic society. So gets he gets banished from Geneva, right quite early on.. Th then in fifteen forty one, he's asked to return because of this growing religious unrest in the city And then the Council of Geneva passes the ecclesiastical orrdinances based on Calvin's proposal for reform. Come with me now. Yeah, ladies H you pack some spare pants, okay? Sorry, I did not warn you that we were talking about the ecclesiastical ordinces of fifteen forty one Geneva All right. They call for a restructuring of the Genevan Church with ministers being split into pastors, doctors, elders and deacons. Right Which basically means Um you it's again, it's less power. in the church itself His teachings becomes Calvinism, right? which is denies that the body and bloods, that's orbolocks. This then starts to seem is unlikely. He's doubting those numbers Yeah, is it big Yeah he's a Christ and everything. Yeah. I mean he's a Eucharist denier. Yesist Aimayah, I must say, I'm a proud Eucharist andah. Um There's no way that's his body No way. That's no hory There's so many pots that There's so much wine. That's all his blood. Now, he's bothering about in Switzerland. Now when he dies, he becomes he gets buried in an unmarked grave. Of course. He's my bin Laden he doesn't want to become a martyr.. And he doesn't want to become a site of religious pilgrimage, but he says that because he doesn't want anyone, it's not about him God Because that's the thing is that there's not these huge figures in Protestantism in the same way personalities. No, it's not like people It's the cult of no personalities. Yeah No one's got loads of pictures of Calvin saying I fucking love Calvin. Yeah. Like there's none of that stuff at all. I do. I have a picture of Calvin in my toilet. right? my a picture of Lutfa on the toilet in my to my toilet. Yeah Calvin is the guy from whom you know You'd take annglicized Protantism comes from. Right. We're not Lutheran really we're Calvinist. because a lot of Calvinist reformers go to Britain especially into Scotland. And this is where we get to The second hero of the story John Knox So John Knox is a Roman Catholic minister in I want to say the early fifteen forties. Gcot We should place this actually. Sh we place fifteen forties? fifteen forties in Scotland Christ So this is after William Wallace Yes. And it's before I want to say it's before whiskey H I think we're still in pre whiskey Scotland in the sixteenth century thirteenth the fifteenth century Okay beforefore Iron brerew It's definitely before its it's after whisky it's before Iron Brew. Yeah ninet one pretty old. Yeah. And when's Tisky invented? sixteen to eighty nine. Shit So it's after whiskey before Tisky. Charlie G gone on the ryming one, that's very good. That's pretty good. Tisky sixteen twenty nine. I love Tisky. I fucking love Tiskkey. That's good. You know, I like a. I've realized what like I like a beer where It sounds like it could be a concentration camp you haven't heard of H'm in. Tisky, Tisky Yeah, you liberated Tisky really fucked him out. Exactly This one of the gods. Half a Birkenau, please. No You know, the craft be Achwitz IPA, please. Yeah, exactly. Zuber Sber yeah. Subper could be a terrible place. Zber Yeah he's escaped from Zuba. He's locked up for ten years in Zuba. You know, IPAs aren't doing that. Yeah. Bw doog, you know, Dakal palle. Now you're talking. Now you're talking Pight of Saxenhausen, please Anyway So John Knox is a he starts and this like this just sums up This just sums up Scottish culture. He starts as a fucking bodyguard bodyguard to a Protestant preacher called George Wishert. And he holds a massive broadsword.ight And then Wishher gets arrested in fifteen forty five U and so and then he gets assassinated, I think, he gets executed and he's devastated. So Knox sort of goes on a bit of a rampage and then he gets captured by the French forces at St. Andrews. He then gets made a slave White slave. He's a white slave And he' Sottish I mean, I'm trying to find slavery in my heritage.. Anyway, so John Knox is forced to row in French galleys for nineteen months Because he's fucking Calvinist he loves it. He love that shit. He loves it. That's brilliant. You can't touch me. Yeah What do you mean? Well, my punishment is to do more work. Brilliant. Brilliant. He then when he's released, he flees to Geneva And he becomes Calvin students, right? So it's while in exile in Geneva in fifteen fifty eight that he writes The first blast of the trumpet against the monstrous regiment of women This book this? He says women can't be rulers. Right. Because at the time, Scotland was m Scots merican of Scots Elizabeth I is on the throne I Th think fifteen fifty eight? Yeah. Yeah, so for him, it's upside down world. The world's gone in tone. Yes The world's gone mad. This is fucked. So LBC everyone is calling in. what times we living in? This is mental. LBC is impossible in the world without knockx. Yeah o. So he writes a book saying women should not rule. This is madness, o And then Elizabeth the first, Oh, she takes the phone just shortly after that. And then he goes, well, not no you're the exception because you're a bloke really. You look like a bloke. Um So he then comes back to Scotland In fifteen fifty nine, having, you know, drunk from the teat of Calvin in Switzerland. And when he arrives in Scotland, it's much like the rat landing in Venice to start the Black death, but instead it's Don't call us sorry. Don't call us that You're saying Presbyterianism was the black death. I'm saying if you view boringness as a sort of disease than in that sense. orr as a medicine to your Catholic disease of opulence and l paintings. Right, right, right. So ye this is this is what is, it's not laxatives, it's ' is a mododium. Yeah, Knx is a mododiem. Let's just caught that ass up. All right? Tom Kox is literally Yeah, a mododium arriving on a ship. So Knox comes back to Scotland up Scotland. Yeah and he's fired up by Calvinism, but he thinks because this is why Scottish people are the way they are. Remember the Scottish history is blue faced can get it. Yeah. Britain's As I said, I don't relate to any of them in the Taliban firing fucking the Taliban. I don't ye Yeah, I don't relate to it all. Yeah. This is where I start to feel Scottish. Right. Okay. it's a and it's all from a French guy razyrazy French guyia Switzland, anyway So Knox comes back to Scotland and begins the Scottish Reformation. He starts these massive tub thumping ceremonies, preaching In Stt Garles's Church, Edinburgh, G a photo of that up Charlie. Stt Gar's Church, Edinburgh, which is where my parents got married. Wow. Wow That's how much it is in my bone. My parents got married at Knoxes Church And he's there going like these chur this church needs to be way more boring. Right. Fuck it all off. He's saying I want a plane room He's literally, I just want white walls. I want to sit in the garage. Well, yeah, I guess it's This kind of rown of Protestantism is it's a divorced dad, right? He's they divorce from Catholicism and you go to visit. You're not from a divorced family that moment when you first visit your dad after the divorce. walls. they haven't had had They've had a woman in their life for like over a decade. Yes. Yes. So they don't know what to do fuckking eating eggs and that's it. you know. So this is what the churches have become. It's very much symbolic of the divorced dad's new apartment. Charlie, can you find the photo there's a photo of men who live on their own interior design' pretty funny. Yeah. This is what all churches look like. Yeah, this is a Lutheran church. This is a Presbyterian church It's basically just a computer, a computer and then like a rack of weights. That's it, look That is ye, this is This is John Knox's church, right? This is where my parents got married. It's A windowless room W strip lighting A computer chair, a desk, a bin and that's it. That's it. That's all you need. There's a God in that room What you need? Gop here. Yeah This episode is brought to you by Starbucks. That is fire. Whoa, that's good. This might be the drink of the summer. Okay, I like this one too. I'm not worth it, okay? Try it for yourself. Starbucks refreshers concentrates are coming home. Find them in the coffee aisle and make it yours. Wantna know the real story of how Oasis made Britain mad for it, how friends turned us onto coffee culture and super layered hair. The secrets of Nirvana, trainspotting, gay hookups, Diana's revenge dress, and what it was really like to be a spice girl plunge back into the decade when the world fell for cool Britannia, bumpster jeans, and lemon hooch withith talkalk nineties to me. Listen now wherever you get your podcast and if you use Spotify you can watch the whole show too. That's talkalk nineties to me out every Monday. So he starts preaching And he also Mary Queen of Scots Uh He starts having meetings with her He starts basically he starts all these riots. The Scottish Reformation begins in what fifteen sixty. O Um there's there's like there's a sort of a civil war. and Scotland becomes officially Protestant in august fifteen sixty Um abolishes the mass. then u Also Elizabeth I first is trying she wants Scotland to be Potestant because then that would secure a Northern border. Yeah Mary Queen and Scott Basy fucks it because I think she surprised to kill Elizabeth and then Elizabeth has to kill her or. This is before that because Knox visits Mary Queen of Scots Wh at this point is a fucking Spanish teenager. French French teenager. Yeahight. She's annoying French teenager with blue hair or something. Yeah And she's calling on H man John Knox just to like come and explain yourself. Yeah. He goes and meets her and says you're fucking voodoo nonsense like Don't fucking don't teach me. I'm school of hard knnockx. literally I think the last time they meet He makes her cry. Yeah I mean, this is the long road to to your dad making waiters cry. Right. You know, let's debate me. Debate me. Yeah. deebate me. What do you de What it is The M marketplace of ideas. Okaykay? You're free to debate me. Dad, we're never going to go to this restaurant again, but otherwise they'll never learn. We had a terrific discussion. It was a brilliant dinner. Now they've learned something, they won't do this again. It's actually very selfless for the next person has to be served by them. They've quit their job U So yeah, that's right. So she returns to now Protestant Scotland, having been in exile, Kockx is like, right, well you're a threat to the Newon Protestant Scotland. So he's trying to demand her to abandon the Catholic mass and then he makes her cry after criticizing her relentlessly to her face. And she's a teenager. She's a teenage girl And he's just fucking he destroys her. It's the first Fabrist gets destroyed B by truth and logic. John Knox, making Americ cle of Scots cry, right It's like those uniul debate things where they're debating like literal nineteen year olds. Yeah it'll be like a professional debate. It's like the Charlie Kirk thing. It's like, yeah, you're debating like the weakest members of that tos. Yeah eighteen year olds. Yeah barely neuro normative enough to fucking look you in the eye. Yeah, blue hair fat with a teddy they hold it an anxiety. They take the they take the headphones off Yes Charlie. so I was just wondering. ave you read the Bible? Have you read the Bible? Yeah. Knox basically Knox, Mary Queen have S gotot your six and He founds his legacy to the world is Presbyterianism, which basically is a radical democratic Protestantism. o, which is antimonarchist. Interesting. So it comes up in English of War, right? Yes. So whereas Anglicanism, which the pope is the king basically in Anglicism? Yeah, Knox would say that in theation the English Reformation, which we will deal with more when we do Henry VII, that they just replaced the pope with the king he's like let's get rid of like no human should be in a hell of the church. It's going to be a council of elders whichich is where the word Presbyterianism comes from. Right from the Greek, right. So he actually is sort of Birth American Purisism. Yes It's all yeah, because that's libertarianism Yeah, devolved. Yeah Antimonic. Yeah. Yeah, it is fucking. He's the first emo. Yeah he's a fucking mum. It's John Kobs. Where are you? Yeah, he's listened to my chemical romance in his room.ting himself, right. Bas Anglicanism is much more gay. It is much more gay. Because there is still beauty in Anglicanism. So this is the church that Henry VIII accidentally founds because he has a boner for a. And this is the sort of the church that I was raised in a little bit more. It's basically Elizabeth first centrist dads. the sectarian violence and clone on.. It was fucking super Protestant with Edward VI Yeah. It was super Catholic with Mary. There's too many factions. so she just goes right down the middle and said let's just cherry pick a bit way. It. Yeah. the first play. Yeah ye. So and that means that we can still have some fucking It's still a fucking church. We can have some beauty. It doesn't have to be the most m. It doesn't have to look like a betting shop. It like Ladbrooks. Yeah. but we can do without the pope, without some of the Bllocks. Say what it is, it's a guy whose girlfriend's left him but he's kept the house Right. He's not moved to a new house and had to decorate it or not. Right, so you can still keep some of the you keep the plant. He can keep the plant alive Okay, the stuff on the walls. The lighting is nice. Right, right? But she's not there. Yeah. Okay In Presbyterianism, I'm leaving you and I'm going to go and live in a fucking box room Al always angis. It's still a divorce, but your dad's divorcing your mum because he's secretly gay. He's a gay man. Yeah. my dad is angry Yeah Yes because when you go over to your dad's house, it's like, Hi. Why is this look nicer than our house? Yeah. Wh have you Why has your interior design flare been set free now you've left And you go, that's the pope. No, it's not It's your stepdad You go but but but no But when do you have this? How are you suppressing all of this? I didn't know you. Hey He. Yeah, exactly. I actually the spirit of Anglicism, which what I find so funny is it seems to be maybe one of the most gentle churches. Yeah, it' Like the English vicar is a fucking referee. Yeah, they're like everything's completely soft. Jam jam It's j J just jam It it can't really survive as a church because it doesn't have enough Drama Dama it's not anyone to be in there. It's not really oppressing anyone in any way. It's more like well, you know, if if you can be gay, Yeah of course. yeah yeah. If you want. I mean, if you want to be an Anglish, please come your come that one. is that one And Ily, if you ever stop believing in it just go. it's fine. Yeah. So it's just very. So Anglicanism is it's the religion of empire The Brit Empire is Anglican. Yeah, so it has that Elite ate what is it? Pate patern Paternalism. Yeah, paternalistic. And also there is you know, the aesthetic of emmpire Rajkor for example. It's still interested in architectural beauty. Yeah in sartorial elegance. Yes, sure. you know John Knox would rather just be sort of fucking naked on a beach. Well it's very similar the mouse suits. It's the same thing. Yeah. ye it's the same thing. So there's still a now we've got the The differeiffnces between Presbyterianism and Lutheran churches. So in Presbyterianism, if the Bible doesn't command it, you don't do it Whereas Lutheran and Anglican, if the Bible doesn't forbid it, you can do it, R Just slightly gentler. So in terms of decor Presbyterianism, white walls, no statues Luther and Anglicant, stained glass, crucifixes, candles. So yeah, so American Protestantism is closer to a Presbyterian Itsertainly evangelical is where it's all about the Yeah Music in Lutheran and Anglican you get choirs, organs, hymns, Presbyterianism. originally Acapeella only Barbberop, that's it N even a loud fucking piano. No piano Chanows are gay. fuck off Go to the fuckking West end and do jersey boys. This is a f. Why don't you suck off the audience while you're at it if you're playing the piano, okay? Anglican hymns, the most goed hymns of any church. I those Well there's a there's anlican yeah. but in general, I think blows Catholics out the water. they'd love that ome. I think the Christian relationship to music is probably the strongest of any religion U Oh But you know, they a strong relationship after that. Theyve only got one song though, th? They do. They do. But it slaps It slaps And again, what would the Christian call to prayer be Well, which come in, there's tea. know, it's not the same, isn't it I've made sandwiches. Excuse me. Yeah, they would be actually be a woman on a minim. Excuse me. Are you allowed to part there What's theure permit for that? That's the Ct of Prayer. That's Angllican Court of Prayer Yeah. The busy body, the curtain Twitcher. Yeahah. Not quite as mystical as thatk bar S hear some scientology here G on then. It's just too modern, isn't it There's no such of history here It sounds like the fucking monkeys or something It's not bad. It's pretty good actually Is's that scientology. Gos py rock. Yeah. That's unbelievable. yeah, I doubt that. Doubt that's trp. Lets we'll circle back to that Yeah. But yes, Presbyterianism and get rid of the piano. Fuck off. Yeah right, Strip it all back. So he successfully creates the Scottish Presbyterian system In march six, fifty, sixty four, Approximately fifty years old, he marries Margaret Stewart. Oh damn. Relative of Mary Queen of Scots, she's seventeen Al and It is crazy that this is like a long running thing now the gu marriage is a teenager. Oh o So he's guilty of being a fucking lgeard. Yeah. Listen, you know? it's listen to what? It's sex tourism. Ppyarianism but sex tourism. Right. Right. It's it's fine. We're all in the gutter. Soas he managed to pull himself up by his bootstraps pretty well because he was a bodyguard. He's one of now he's one biggest It's one of the biggest zero to heroes ever. Yeah in that he basically was a slave. He was a slave But then it's fucking amazing grace. He was was blind, but now I see. was He was jent a slave on a slave shit He was enslaved by the French. Dar unchang? Darren unchanged. Darren unchanged Yeah And then he marries into the fucking royal family. Yeah. a relative of and he makes the queen cry I mean he's savage. It's brilliant. If only he was born after YouTube, he could watch highlights of him destroying people yeah,' twenty five minutes knock slaps. You know it was like hitch slaps. Yeah It knocks at knocks out No knock knocks out knocks out punch. Yeah, be brilliant And then his seventeen year old wife nurses him through his final illness U John Knox dies seventy two, age fifty eight, he's buried in St. Giles, which is again my parents got married. And he now the great irony is that having having destroyed Mary Queen of Scots with fact and logic. Mary Queen of Scots is it her son is James VI Who becomes James the first Is that right? a grandson Sorry. How? Long story? Long story, Charlie, We'll get to it. Yeah. So the irony, of course is that He Basically having defeated her and N York Elizabeth Prisoner. When she dies, eventually Her son takes the throne But he's raised by Protestant Tutors, isn't he? James I first? Yeah he's Protestant. He is. But then he makes the King James Bible. Yeah which is the kind of Protestant. The Anglican's the English speaking Bible. It's the Anglican Bible, isn't it? Yeah, It's kind of text. Is that like the best selling Bible in the world, right Yeah, I guess it is. I guess it is the best setting. Um, donunt know What's theast What's the least Christian country? It's due to a catastrophic typo in the sixteen thirty one. which said thou shalt commit adultery That's amazing. It's incredible. There's a Bible made under Charles I They said was so people were reading that going, All right, fuck, Brilliant. All right brilliant. but also the fact that catastrophic tyypo back then it is not as easy to correct things actually iss catastrophic. That is a fucking catastrophic the wicked bike. Oh no Oh fuck. Unless they went thou shalt commit adultery turn the page. Nat. is A fuck, there it is. Thou shalt committed of. That's pretty funny I wonder if they missed out all the kn nots? So it's like thou shalt covert thy neighbor's ox I don't understand what shouted me. Yeah So u Presbyterianism becomes ultimately the central divide between England and Scotland culturally and now Scotland starts to really punch abumve its way intellectually because Isn't there something about there's a stat where it's like the more likely you were to have a printing press more like you were too Potestant And then more likely you were if does one in your town, more likely you were to be Protestant, the more literate society. Yeah. So Scotland becomes an intensely lilliterate society because Presbyterianism even more than Luther is about reading. Yes. You got to read. And they're like Inentor per square. Mile is the best anywhere. Scottish Scots invented everything, right? Yes. and there's barely any of them. And also within the British Empire people who toilets. Yeah, toilets. Yeah. TVs. TV, TVs. The electron electric grid. The phone. Yeah. I mean, our modern life is watching TV on a phone on the toilet. And that Scotland Scotland Scotland gave again us that They're the first all crescent. They're per I'm So it's true. Presbyterianism Then That's all about whereereas Luther says you should read the Bible just so you can decide whether you agree with it or not and it's your own faith. Presbyterianism is like, you need to read the Bible because you're in charge of the church R up to you because there's no kings ' fuck them. R up to you. You're running it I see. So you got to read it. You gott to be able to read, which is why everyone in Scotland. And again, I mean, we're all councilmbers Yes. We're all councillors. We're all Jackie Weaver Whereas Anglicanism is a fudge U and Fudge it is Fudge Right So ye between Catholic and sorry,ight. And they surfudge fingers as. They surfudge fingers. Yeah, R. So Eddie isard's joke, right cake or death. Y That's what the anant to like. Yes, it is. ye yeah. and terms of America Calvinism. Calvin's the rooutot from the tree from which U You know, you'd say Calvin's the tree of life for people who don't nap in that you've got one branch which leads to Scotland, one branch that leads to Puritanism, which leads to America becausecause obviously the puritans Maybe eighty years later disgusted with the direction of the country. Right. much like people want to do by now, because ironically, London's going too Muslim.ight Where are you going? The Gulf. Brilliant. You've nailed that lad, well done. They are going to America to make it more puritan. Yes That's all Calvinists. So like the Calvinist work ethic. you know,' American purishis Definitely. The Presbyterian iconoclasm destroying idols and That's America. How ugly a lot of American cities are buildings are? That's knnockx. Yeah, you know. And yet they're all fat Interesting, whichich Calvin would have hated. Yeah. Im not shouldort have hated it as Yes, iss true. That's kind of the I suppose that's I guess that's the story of Calvin in a way. he's actually who we're all because there's not much to think about him as a person because he doesn't want any of that stuff He's been walking in the chair. I mean, who cares? Who cares really And he's French, which again, is just mind blowing to me. And yet he is responsible for the annglosphere, I'd say. The idea of the West is impossible without Calvin, I don't think The idea of cap capitalism is a Calvinist. I don't think the idea of the West and the idea of the Anglosphere. Yeah. because I guess the West is Spain, France. The West is not Spain What talking about? What do you think'th Africa? I say the we's fallen. I don't mean Spain has fallen. It's never woken up. No one's saying Spain has fallen Yeah. What do you think about the releligious character of like Australia then How do hear that? Do' that differers much from America from when you've gone there Um It's a good point actually. I suppose it's aiss it's more of a missionary society and I guess I don't know much about what was cook He must have been an Anglican Yeah. It's very Potestant vibes there, I feel. Yeah. Yeah. but yeah, it's not the same If you'veot not got the same hustle I think it's impossible to separate American religion from There are economic Yes. Uurgency. Yeah, right But they don't have that in Australia. Yeah. They see it as like a moral good to make money. Yeah ye. So that is the story of Calvin and of friend of the pod John Knox. In our final episode in the Reformation, we will deal with the Empire striking back, the counter Reformation, the evil priests Darth Vaders. How do they respond? with Spanish Inquisition, all that stuff, they clap back. They clap back hard. That's the final episode in this series, that's already on the Patreon. We will hear about some terrible stories of Protestants being massacred, which I am firmly against. Anyway, we'll also be doing a deep dive on the history of the Amish. Yeah, that's on the Patreon. that's great stuff. That's great fun And our live special on the JFK assassination recorded at Hackney Empire last year. That's going. It Great show. That's it from us for this episode. We'll see you next time For the final episode in ourur Reformation sereries, goodbye. Bye bye