Working with Linda Ronstadt

This is Fresh Air. I'm Terry Gross. One of the successful British invasion bands of the sixties was the duo, Peter and Gordon. Peter is my guest Peter Asher, who later became a famous record producer The first record Peter and Gordon released became a number one hit in England and the US That song, A World Without loveove was written by Pul McCartney for the Beatles But John Lennon didn't like it, so Paul put it away until Peter asked to record it Paul had been living in the Asher family home where Peter, his sisters, and his parents lived We'll hear why a little later. It's a great story So here's a World Without Love from nineteen sixty four Please lock me away D't alow the day here inside where I hide with my lonely l Whatter what they say I won't stay in a world with a club sing out ate. Rin outside the room. I'm okay. Here I stay with my lonely n But they say I won't stay in a world without love. So I want an ino See my d s She may come. I don't know it work. When she does, I loseab until then knock me away. Peter and Gordon went on to have other hits, including Nobody I know, I don't want to see you again, and I go to pieces After the duo split up, in nineteen sixty eight, Peter became the first A and R man at the Beatles new Apple record label. The first person he signed was James Taylor, who had never recorded before Peter didn't stay long at Apple, he moved to LA, produced and managed Taylor, and helped turn him into a star He introduced Taylor to Carool King and launched King's performing career He produced and managed Linda Ronstad Other artists he produced over the years include Randy Newman, Cher, Neil Diamond, Morrisy, Diana Ross, Elton John, Bonnie Wight, Barbara Streissan Robin Williams and Steve Martin Wow, that's really a phenomenal list Pete Asher is part of other important moments in music history Peter co owned the gallery, where John first met Yoko while her work was on exhibit there Peter was unintentionally responsible for Mick Jagger meeting Mary Anne Faithful began their romance In addition to the many Grammys his artists won He won three producing Grammys and in nineteen seventy seven was on the cover of Rolling Stone A new documentary chronicles Peter Asher's life. It's called Peter Asher everywhere, man playing in select theaters around the country Peter Asher, welcome to Fresh air. I really like this documentary. It' You've had such an interesting life So let's start with world without love. Paul ever explain why John Did it I think it was the lyrics. First of all, I think I don't think it's quite true to say that Paul wrote it for the Beatles. I think he wrote it pre Beatles actually. Oh that's right. You say he wrot. Ict he was like sixteen or something like that., whichich is extraordinary. And I think what John didn't like about it was the lyrics that he thought that please lock me away was an absurd line to put in a song And so he would actually say to Paul, OkayK, I will lock you away. The song's over. So it's copyrighted to Lynon McCartney. Everything was. Yes, I know. And Paul told me one of the times I interviewed him that he regrets having the beatle songs that Paul or John wrote independently credited to both of them Eespecially because even if Paul wrote a song himself Credit started with Lenon, Lennon McCartney I'm not as sure I agree with Paul about that. I think it was something particularly charming and emphasized the closeness of their relationship that they agreed to credit everything to the two of them And I think that was actually a very fair division of credit and save them any arguments because at the beginning, of course, they did actually write together the songs they wrote in our house in London, as you point out, O so is it John came over, they sat down together at the piano or together with two guitars facing each other. and wrote together So I think that evenven if they just later did it in commemoration of those moments of togetherness and creativity I think it was kind of a cool thing to do So since you were talking about them writing songs together, let's hear a clip from the documentary. And this is a part where Paul is talking about living with your family and what that was like. and it leads into writing with John Lennon at your home. And in the second part of this clip, we'll hear you It was such a family Claire was a very nice younger sister. lot of fun. And then there was Peter,' interesting bright guy. I could talk to him about anything And also very interested in music, very musical. So there's a lot of connection there. They got a piano in my room and there was a piano in the basement as well. So when John came to visit, we could write there on the piano at the same time There was a little music room in the basement And I do remember one particular occasion, shortly after Paul had moved in John came over and he and Paul went down to this music room They were down there for a couple of hours and then Paul called up the stairs to me in my bedroom. N ask I wanted to come down and hear this song they had just finished writing. They sat side by side at the piano and hammered out the first version anyone had ever heard of this brand new song they had just finished called I Want to Hold Your Hand. Peter Asher, your reaction was what? When you heard the song Amazement. I mean, I thought, am I losing my mind? or is this one of the best songs I've ever heard in my life or possibly both. but I was thrilled and amazed. And they looked at me for some kind of reaction And I said, I think that's amazing. and perhaps the biggest giveaway is the fact that I immediately asked him if they could play it again And perhaps the second giveaay is was the fact that they were delighted to play it again. I think they knew that they'd written something special, whether they had in mind the fact that it was going to break the whole change the whole attitude of the whole world, starting with America that everyone was going to become a Beetle fan when they heard, I want to hold your hand that was the magic track that set off the American Beetle manania epidemic I don't know, but that's what it turned out to be So Paul was living with your family because your sister, Jane Asher, was a famous actress by then Yes, Swell was her boyfriend Yes. The Beatles had a home in London for when they were there, but Paul I found it too chaotic He must have moved in very early in the Beatles career because if he and John hadn't yet written, I want to hold her hand That had to be pretty early. That's a good point. Yes, that's correct. I'm very bad at dates as I told you, But yes, that would certainly would be true So watching Paul's fame, what did it teach you about what it means to be famous because you are on the verge of becoming famous yourself. It's a good question. I don't really know I learned anything about becoming famous and suddenly nobody was Nobodybody was famous in a way that compared to the Beatles in any sense But certainly when we go to America, there's no question the template for a famous British invasion member had been sort of set by the Beatles and that all the girls who chased you around the streets and stuff, which they did following what they'd seen in the Beatles movie and how they knew everyone reacted to the Beatles. The screaming reached fever pitch. and we were lucky to be sort of part of that. whole madness It was a thrilling time Did you always feel lucky that girls were chasing after the band and that they were screaming probably so loud they couldn't actually hear the music that you were playing and you might not have been able to hear Gordon when you were singing with him on stage. So yes, that was that was very annoying. That was true. I mean, it was certainly one of the downsides of technology of that era Monitors hadn't been invented yet at all. Oh, you had no monitors. No monitors at all, let alone the fancy inars that we all have today So we couldn't hear ourselves at tool I mean, Ringo, I remember did an interview explaining that He knew where he was on the song by watching the backs of Paul and John You can tell from their movements which bit of the song they were in But you couldn't hear anything during the screaming and the technological setbacks It was u it was guesswork It must have been strange for you from, you know, going to a guy who is playing, you know, like small clubs Yes to suddenly having a number one record touring America, getting on the E Sullivan show. It's like An extreme jump It was indeed. I mean, I often say you know, there was a comparison between at one point, you know, I remember when I was before I'd even made the record I was at a university, reading philosophy. at London University bicycling home from school four in the afternoon in the dark and the rain very often, if it was a British winter And only less than a year later, I think. I was instead driving down Sunset Boulevard in the broad sunshine in a rented mustang being recognized by beautiful women. And at that point, I kind of went, this isn't a substantial improvement, you know? I think this is better So I made the decision to quit university, of course, and and take up this pop stuff full time. Did it change your self image to have women chasing after you? No, but it's fun That's for sure I don't I don't know changeed my self image, but I suddenly feel suave and grown up and Un mananly? I don't don't think so I think my insecurities remained intact, but it was certainly a muse So you loved American jazz, folk music, rock and' roll. And suddenly you I mean, you go to America and everybody iss really really absorbed in the British invasion Americans were in love with British bands. Was that incomprehensible to you? It was a surprise, I mean, because that's the whole miracle of the British invasion that we loved all this music, you know. As you said, folk music and jazz and I was a big jazz fan. and and And it just was extraordinary. And then then we learned all this music R and B and the Everly Bothers in our case and so on and decided who wished to emulate among the stars of American music. And then the miracle is that we somehow learned it all and it slightly and sold it all back to you It was it was a It was a remarkable achievement from a business point of view, I suppose I want to mention another connection between your family and the Beatles, which is your mother was a professional obo player. She performed with symphonies and taught obo at the Royal Academy of Music, also taught private lessons. and one of her private students was George Martin who later became the Beatles producer. I don't think he was producing them yet. Am I right about that That's right, yeah. I don't think so. No. I think that's corct Yeah it was an extraordinary coincidence. So by the time my mother was introduced to George Martin as her daughters Boyfriends reccord prod you say? She was like, Ohh, it's George, you know she had given in private lessons to because he was concerned about passing his exams at the Gildhall School of Music And he had to Oo was his second instrument and he required some further training evidently But presumably it was successful Let's talk about your very first career, which was as a child actor And as I think we mentioned earlier You were in a film with Claudette Colbert. You had a part in the TV series, The Adventures of Robin Hood, which I used to watch and You're in a TV series with Boris Carloff episodes or an episode. So what was the experience for you being like, I think eight during part of this. was when it started, I did my first film Blan's wife with Claudte, Colber and Jack Hawkins when I was eight, Yes. Yes. So what was the experience like for you? Did you feel like This is exciting. I'm getting to meet movie stars. or did you just o, okay But I enjoyed acting too. I mean I was I enjoyed the work but it's very standard Read the script, learn your lines and do what the director wants you to do, and hope that it was good. What was it like seeing yourself on screen? Did you go to a movie theater and see yourself? Yes, we used going see rushes quite often in the evening, you know, and see what youd shot that very day or the day before perhaps becauseuse I had to develop the film, I suppose Did' it make you any more or less comfortable with yourself in terms of how you looked Did it make yourselfl conscious I don't think so actually. I think maybe self consciousness comes when you or comes with puberty. I don't know. I don't think I felt very self conscious at that point now Did your mother feel comfortable with you as a performer since she was a performer too? She played Ovo Yes, she was surprisedingly cool with it. I mean, all three of us got signed Jane and Clire and I Those are your two sisters. My two sisters and not And that we did bits of acting The only thing we did together was Jane and I did one of those episodes of Robinhood that you mentioned We played in there was one called Children of the Greenwood when we played a brother and sister peasant couple. Whereas in the other episodes I did, I played Prince Arthur, Rather Pasha But u No, we yeah, we we were all signed and all worked and all enjoyed it Jane enjoyed it the best and also was the best at it and had a career. and built a very fin acting career which persists to this day I mean, part of the reason why you became an actor is that you and your two sisters had red hair. so you all had That's the reason we got signed. Yeahah that some agent spotted us and said, Ohh, they're you know they're very picturesque or something And yeah, ye. But most of the stuff you were in was probably black and white Yes, and we were never all three of us in something together. That's why if you look at the casting directory of that era, It has to say in the black and white, alongside the black and white photographs, it says all have red hair in big letters because that was not evident from from the photos in the guide because they couldn't afford color printing at that point So let's get back to you touring So when you first got to America, What struck you as musically most different about the U. S versus England Everything was different. The radio stations were completely different. You know we only had the BBC. You had all these brilliant little stations where the DJ actually played the records himself BBC never happened Somebody else, you know, put the needle in the groove and so on it was very organized And then as a jazz fan, the craziest thing was, you know, in England, when if a jazz leegendary jazz player came came to England, they'd be playing concert halls. and being treated with extreme respect And in New York, you know, there just all these jazz clubs and all our heroes were playing these places that were like scummy kind of smoke ridden little jazz clubs, which was very exciting for us But there was a huge difference in how they treated the music I already had copies of Downbeat With all the jazz clubs I wanted to go to circle I knew who was playing where and when and so on U And I remember going to see people like Roland Kirk Whereas in England, we'd see theelon' Monk in Boyal Festival Hall So their attitude to music was completely different at least to jazz In the sixties, while you were performing and recording with Gordon, your singing partner U you also became the co owner of a bookstore and an art gallery that were part of London's underground culture of the time. Describe what was new about the clothes, the music, and the sense of liberation after growing up during the period England was rebuilding. and suffering food shortages after World War II Absolutely. Well, rationing, people are amazed to realize that rationing It didnn't end until nineteen fifty six L the last item, whatever was the last thing it was still rationed. And what year were you born? forty four So, you know, yes, was was it was a big change. and I think that is part of it because Britain as we grew up Everything was rationed, everything was gray and standardized and There are shortages of everything And we very much admired You know, the spirit of the blitz and all that stuff and tighten your belt and you know, fight them in the beaches and the general spirit of the thing. And obviously we won the war in theory, but it certain didn't feel like it And and we could see that America was the country that was going to change the world from then on. The British Empire's days already was kind of numbered, it turned out. So the chchilian attitude was sort of fading away. I think we' decided, you know, that was all very well. We admired what our parents have accomplished They God, we won the war and all that stuff. But now it's time to have some fun. So we're going to wear silly clothes and bright colors and open and have a good time And we did. So how did you change during that period I wore silly clothes and dressed up and smoked dope and smoked up and had fun. It was that era in the fifties where you'd sort of tried to look like a grown up. And and then By the time we got to the sixties, you wanted to avoid desperately looking like you'd grown up You wanted to look like somebody cool and young So the gallery that you co owned is where John and Yoko met during a period when The gallery was exhibiting her work. Were you there when they met? I was there when John showed up, and I can't remember I wasn't actually the person who introduced him or anything But John came in his mini cooper with a chauffeur and Yeah. I mean it was John Dunbar who ran the art half of the Indico operation And he'd seen Yoko or talked to Yoko or something. And that's he suggested that Yoka would be a good person to be, you know, exhibited in our gallery which she was, indeed And I certainly saw John there at one point But I don't think I was the person who actually physically introduced them So the gallery even though sometimes they get blamed for it in a context. But that gallery was the place that the whole controversy started about whether Yoko broke up the Beatles? Well, exactly. I mean It was It's funny because I tell the story and it's part of my state show, which is a bit our story is half music When I tell that story get such wildly different reactions to different days Because sometimes it's ah, you know, what a sweet love story. Other times it's gonna, I don't know. And then finally, one time that only this happened As soon as I told the story, somebody jumped up to their feet and said, It was you. You broke up the Beatles. And I had to say, No, I didn't, you know because I didn't not your fault. You were my faultact exactly Th sound So I think this is a good time to take another break. If you're just joining us, my guest is Peter Asher and the new documentary about him is called Everywhere Man. We'll be right back after a short break I'm Terry Gross and this is Fresh air This is Fresh Air. I'm Terry Gross. Let's get back to my interview with Peter Asher. Americans first knew him as half of the sixties British invasion band Peter and Gordon Their hits included A World withithout loveove, noobody I know, and I go to pieces. Asschher went on to become a Grammy winning record producer, his two most enduring music relationships were with James Taylor and Linda Ronstadt. So in terms of your music life, You went through a transitional time. In the late sixties, Gordon Waller, your singing partner, decided he wanted to go solo And you knew that you wanted to produce recordings I did. the minute I went into the recording studio and figured out what producers did This would be so cool. you know, I love the idea of being able to influence the arrangement and and sound and identity musical identity of a song Before you had produced any record, you became the first AN R man for the Beatles new Apple record label. ANR stands for Artists and repertoire. Describe what your job was Well, Apple took this very bold step of actually soliciting tapes Because normally there's's kind of no unsolicited material're supposed to be sent in to most major record companies But we actually took ads going, you know, send your tapes to Apple Records Did they ever giant mail bags full of tapes and the sad thing was they mostly were not any good. Not just that it'd be weird stuff like somebody snds in hundred pages of lyrics that they know John Lennon is anxiously awaiting to write music for and things like that Um You'ddenly realize there's awful lot of odd people out there who who think they need to be signed to Apple Records But eventually, of course, we did find a few good people, but usually not sadly through the unsolicited tapes They usually came through connections or friends or or coincidences like me meeting James and things like that Why did the label go through that route Because it was the spirit of Apple, I think, the idea that, you know, we we are the first label who's going to really pay attention to artists and take them seriously because everyone has experience of trying to get a record company to listen to you and they refused you know, u u'm And until you had a manager and until you went through proper channels, it was really hard to do that. So we were kind of going, we wanted to be the ones who we got it, you know, if you're sitting in your bedroom writing songs, You don't have to keep them a secret anymore. send them to us. Well, the first person you signed was James Taylor and you did not find him in the slush pile. How did you find him Well When Gordon and I paid America We were supplied backup bands kind of locally. There'd be some promoter in say the Midwest or something would find a band to back you up. and usually would just find an out of work local group do it for cheap And so the quality of those bands varied enormously But one band that I actually liked that came to us in that manner was a band called the Kingbees One of the King bees was a guitar player called Danny Korchmar. And Danny and I when the Kingbees were backing us up on the road. beccame great friends. We remain great friends to this day. He's a brilliant guitar player and a remarkable man And then subsequently, Danny was in a band with his childhood friend, James Taylor. that band was called the flying machine And it suffered all the vicissitudes that living in New York could convey And you know, there were drug problems and money problems and food problems and all this other stuff going on. So Finally, that band broke up James decided to go to London And when Danny found this out, he said to James, you should look at my friend Peter Asher. He's, okay And we toured together for you know, a while back and, uh, So that's how I got my phone rang and this G on said, you know, very sort of cultured slightly southern accents explained that he was a friend of Cch's and you know, uh And I said, greatreat, you know, if you're in London, come over. I mean, come and visit. So we came to dinner the following evening And he'd already made a demo tape previous week And he played me a couple of songs on the tape and I was completely blown away. And then he picked up my guitar and was leaning in the corner of the room and played me something live. And I couldn't believe it. I thought his guitar playing was exceptional. His singing was exceptional and the songs were brilliant. and wax on about each of them if needed, because they were all different. I mean, his guitar playing was slightly classical, but with jazz kind of harmonies on it. He listened to a lot of Manhattan records and his singing style ow more to Ray Charles and Sam Cook. So u I said, lookook, you know that This is amazing. I love your music. I've just got this new job as it happens. I'm head ofan after a record label. Would you like a record deal? And he kind of went say Yes pase, I'd love one. And that was that. So he was the first artist to signed to Apple Records. I took him into Apple offices the next day or the following day'm not sure. And and Paul and George were both there at the time So they came in and sat and listened to James sing a couple of songs and kind of went, Yes, we agree I mean I was going to sign them anyway, but obviously getting the bosses on side was Very important What was your vision for him? What did you encourage him to do? Just keep writing some great songs because I love the songs And then we started talking about the kind of record we should make. and that's when I decided that On this particular album on the Apple album orrchestrated it quite a bit. I had a friend of mine called Richard Houson who is a jazz guitar player and a classical music oseer to write some arrangements for us because I was mostost anxious that People take James seriously that they not think he's just Yeah, o, it's another long haired folky because he definitely wasn't and isn't ' that was the thing of that era You know, if you if you saying Sanging and played the acoustic guitar, you were a folk singer whether you sang folk songs or not But in this case, so we made that's why we made the first alb And that album, as you probably know, was not tremendously successful who just laid the groundwork. the first sound we made when we got to America Yeah, you left with James Taylor for the US which is where you recorded his second album And you left Apple for good. You hadn't stayated Apple very long. No, I would have if I hadn't left, by the way, I would have got fired because Alan Klein came in. Well because Alan Klein was coming in and firing everybody I can see the writing on the wall So I broe down in the letter of resignation, but he was in charge of Apple overall at the time know and I'm sure you've read about the fights between John and Paul about whether Alan Kleinine was evil or not or whether he could be a good manager And Paul lost the argument in this instance and they hired I thelined to be the head of Apple And it was clear that he was going to fire everybody and he did fire most people So if hadn't quit, I certainly would have been fired pretty in short order Well let's take a break here. My guest is Peter Asher. The new documentary about him is called Everywhere Man We'll be right back. This is fresh air. This is fresh air. Let's get back to my interview with Peter Asher Americans first knew him as half of the sixties British invasion band Peter and Gordon. Their hits included A World Without Love, Nobody I know, and I go to pieces Asher went on to become a Grammy winning record producer. H two most enduring music relationships were with James Taylor and Linda Ronstadt So let's get back to talking about James Taylor You recorded your second album with him in the US U He was going through at various times U he had a heroin habit And yes You probably don't want to dwell on this, but I would like to ask you if it interfered either with his music or with your relationship It interfered with his music a lot. I mean I think it takes up some quite a bit of your attention, you know, being a junkie and because it's quite a complicated process and you have to keep finding it and buying it and you know. So Yes, it changed that and a relationship No I mean, I knew very little about it. I had to sort of lookook up, you know, as it were what what what drug addicts were Wh, you know Um, we didn't know a whole lot about it So I just thought, oh, he spends a lot of time in the bathroom or whatever. worried about him, but But eventually, you know, eventually we discussed it openly And I was basically saying to him, what can I do to help? and, uh So I helped him as in whatever way I could. And of course the actual process of becoming clean took him, you know, years But eventually, of course he did it very successfully One of my favorite James Taylor recordings is Fire and Rain from his second album, Sweet Baby James, which of course we produced. And it's a song about a friend who died by suicide Did he tell you the story behind the song? A little bit. I mean, he's told it publicly. I mean, Szanne was some a friend who had killed herself and I think people didn't want to tell him or something So there was some delay in them actually getting the information And of course, the thing about flying machines in pieces on the ground, and there's been much misinterpreted people think it relates to a plane crash and it doesn't at all The flying machine was the bandn, as I explained before, that He was in withith Kooch that broke up, so that was the flying machine in pieces on the ground So I want to play Fire and Rain, which was recorded in nineteen seventy, and I want our listeners to know that it's Carol King on piano. And after we hear this, you can explain Why and how you got her to play Just yesterday morning. They let him know you were gone. Suusanne the plans they may put an end to you Walked out this morning and I rode down this saong I just can't remember who to send it to. I've seen fire and I've seen rain I seeen sunny days that I thought would never endin seem only times when I could not find a friend But I always thought that I'd see you again Okay, so how did you get Carol King to play piano on that and why? Well, actually Danny Korchmar is is a key figure yet again in this story because When I came out to LA I wanted to put together a little band to play on the whole track because I wanted to keep it much simpler than the preceding album had been. and to make sure that every song was based entirely around the arrangement that was sort of self contained in his guitar playing and his singing And I found a drummer called Russ Kunkel And Danny Kortmar himself was going to play guitar obviously. And then I was trying to choose a piano player and By this time, I'd heard some of Carol King's demos. I already was a huge fan of hers. Gothin and King wrote so many of my favorite songs f course, you know Will you said L me tomorrow being the first one when she was eighteen, there was number one all over the place that went on to do you know, Natural woman and I it is something good and up on the roof And I loved Carol King's piano playing specifically, because it was very much an accompanist kind of piano playing flashy, not complicated, but just write, sort of sing a song write a piano So I got to meet Carol through Danny Kchma I then asked Carol if she would consider playing On this James Taylor album that we were about to make. I said it would need you for about five days. I love your playing. I think you and James would sound great together And she said, maybe And she didn't know James was. So I invited over to my house where James was staying at this point. And she sat down next to James at piano bench James played his guitar and started playing piano, I suggested they just sit and stop playing And it worked perfectly. I thought piano playing was exactly, exactly what I had in mind And James loved her too, and of course he was a Carol fan already And so we sort of booked Carol as it were as a studio musician for the next five days And that was when we recorded every track on Sweet Baby James. And if you look, you'll see that Carol King is credited on piano on every one of them And that's how Carol King and James Taylor became friends and collaborators Yes, exactly so. And he recorded her song You've got a Friend before she did U Barely. Yeah, they were almost the same time M Did she have any problem do I mean, she would get composer royaltty, so it would work in her favor in that respect, but could have taken away from her own recording Yes, exactly. No it was an act of great generosity What actually happened was kind of interesting when James was playing the Troubadour in Los Angeles after Seaby James was a big hit Persuaded Carol D Asashy's play with James live which she did So when Carol agreed to play with James at the Troubador, James had the idea of the Carol might like to do a little set of her own to get a feet wet as it were in terms of of get actually being a performer in front of a live audience. So she agreed to do that. and it was on the opening night at the Trouubador at the sound cheheck while Carol was sound checking her own piano just to make sure it would all work and everything She ran through a song she'd just finished writing the night before And James and I were just sitting in the audience at the Tp door in the empty house And we heard Carol sing this brand new song she just finished called You've gotot a friendriend And James fell in love with the song completely So eventually we asked Carol if James could learn it finally asked Rather nervely, I think whether she would consider letting us record it even th knowing that she was going to record it as well and, uh Both versions of you've got a friendriend got made. And then the miracle is you know, rather than than than just hurting anybody It was a huge success on both counts in James's version of You've got a friend who a number one single all over the place and Carol' version of You've Got a Friend was a key track on the album that became Tapestry and went on to sell a gazillian billion copies. Yes, I think you were required to own a copy of that album. Exactly. Everybody I knew had a copy So since you produced the James Taylor version, why don't we hear that? Do you want to say anything about the production It's it's quite minimal. Carol didn't actually play on our version Basically James and Danny Kchma on a couple of acoustic guitars and Rus Kunkel playing a Congers, I think, largely I think I may be play Kabassa on it doing little tiny back beats chorus, but that's about it Okay, this is James Taylor. You've got a friend prodrouced by my guest, Peter Asher When you're down And trouble And you need a help in hand. And nothing Well nothing is going right Close your eyes and think to me And soon I will be there T bright and up Eeepven your dog is night I just call my name And you know wherever I am Oh ye be See you again. Win the spring sumer fall All you got to do is co And I'll be there again again Got a friend So that was James Taylor, and that recording was produced by my guest, Peter Asher. There's a new documentary about him called Everywhere Man We'll be right back after a short break. This is fresh air This is fresh air. Let's get back to my interview with Peter Asher. Americans first knew him as half of the sixties British invasion band Peter and Gordon Their hits included a world withithout love, noody I know, and I go to pieces. Eschher went on to become a Grammy awward winning record producer. And he worked extensively with James Taylor and Linda Ronstadt Let's talk about your recordings with and your relationship with Linda Ronstadt you were recommended by a friend to go hear her. Now, she was already pretty famous because she had recorded and performed with the bnstone ponies. So people knew who she was But the band had broken up and she was kind of, where was she in her career at this point when you heard her I don't remember exactly, I suppose long you, different drum was a hit and long long time was a hit But she hadn't taken off in a huge way, I guess And I hadn't heard of it I'd heard the records I think on the radio But I didn't know anything about her And somebody recommended I go and see. I said, Go and see this girl who's playing at the Bter End in New York because she's amazing and she was amazing in every respect She looked amazing. She sounded amazing. She was amazingly smart and bright and brilliant and and well readen fascinating as a person So I was I was knocked out. And her voice just impressed the hell out of me Now I understand why you were excited about her Why was she willing to sign with you? Well she was thinking about changing managers. She was with a couple of people and at that point, I think she was with Herby Cohen turned out to be slightly dishonest When the band got arrested at an airport with forged air tickets. Yeah had something to do with it or something But anyway, for whatever reasons she was looking for another manager. I think we're of One of the things that she felt was that her input wasn't taken seriously by previous producers, that she was like the chick singer Right. I think that was true. and And the same thing applies to the record producer and manager, you know both of which I was in the case of James and eventually Linda I think two of the greatest tracks on the first album that you did with her O Heart Like A Wheel, a song by Anna McGarriigal and you're no good Um And I think she suggested heart like a wheel. She had wanted to record it And yes, I think Everyone else who was working with her didn't. Yes And you suggested the song, You're No good What made you think of that song for her? I think Kenny Edwards, a bass player and was originally one of the stone ponies. I think he might have suggested it as well. We all knew the song, I'd learned it from the swinging Blue Jeans' English hit. but he knew it from the whoever did the R and B version? And u Then we cut it a couple of different cut times tryrying to get it right And and the final version owes a great deal to the genius of Andrew Gold, a fantastic guitar player and keyboard player and drummer. and base player to He played a lot of most of the instruments on the final version of the record that we did And we finally thought that we' got it right. And when I remember playing that back and Rarely does one actually super confident that records are hit? But in this case we were listening to you no G and kind of went If that's not h record, you know, I don't know what is or I'll eat my hat or whatever the idiom is Well, you didn't need to eat your hat E exactly. really well. So let's hear it. This is Linda Ronstadt, You're No Good, produced by my guest, Peter Ashing. Even better. in better ' I'm over you N stop How you really A over. Maby you no good You' look good M look p was gentle and true. Well I broke a heart on some on two a back may enough funough Baby anotherough. So that was Linda Ronstadt You're No good, produced by my guest, Peter Asher One of the things that you did was you decided like the musicians are so important on recordings You started putting their names on album covers. A lot of album covers did not mention who the musicians were It was a common practice to name them on jazz albums because those were instrumental albums. Yes. Most rock albums of the period were you know The front person was a vocalist So talkk about why you did it and the impact you think that had Apparently it had a substantial impact, according to the musicians, and I'm very glad if it did becausecause yes, I mean, Motown records, for example, you had no idea who anybody was. I never saw any Motown players listed on any album Supreme four topops, nothing and uh So and that that seemed to be fairly consistent throughout the industry. And I remember looking at records as, you know, as a fan Back in London I would always wonder who was playing on it and couldn't find the information You know, the guy who took the album cover photograph was more likely to get a credit than the people who to play to this breathtaking music So it seemed to be entirely logical. You know, it wasn it was I wasn't doing anything magical and I just thought they should be listed because they played so well So we put them on the back of the record And apparently it did make a difference to those musicians because they would obviously get hired based on I want something that sounds like that, you know And that's a good thing. So I still do that to this day, but it's more common these days I want to thank you so much for talking with us. The film is fascinating, The documentary about you called Everywere Man And I wish you good health and continued performances in producing Thank you very much indeed The new documentary Peter Asher Everywhere Man is in seelect theaters nationwide Asher continues to tour his one man stage show, sharing stories and songs from his decades long career. This Halloween he'll perform at a place he knows well that very rarely hosts public events, Abbey Rhodades Studios Tomorrow on fresh air. President Trump is pushing Congress to pass a law that would require showing a passport or birth certificate to register to vote and create strict ID requirements to vote. The rules of the midterms are being rewritten from redistricting to campaign money. We talk with Ari Berman, who's covered voting rights for years at Mother Jones. I hope you'll join us To keep up with what's on the show and get highlights of our interviews, follow us on Instagram at NPR Fresh Air. Fresh Air' executive producer is Sam Briger Our technical director and engineer is Arjie Bentham. Our engineer today is Charlie Kyer Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myeyers, Anie Boldonado, Lauren Krerenzel, Theeresa Madden, Monik Nazareth, Theaya Chaliner, Susan Ya Kundi, Anna Bauman and Nico Gonzalez Whistler Our digital media producer is Molly Svineesper. Roberta Shurak directs the show Our co host is Tona Moseley. I'm Terry Gross.