Family Bonds and Future Outlook

I need to be careful hours see this. I was gonna say it. You know, you sung about writers when you have friends break us. When the other person doesn't take any accountability spoils my blood. I'm not saying she's this fucking monster, but takes some accountability for your actions. Do you think you will make kill of the French wom U if I'm being completely transparent Hey, I'm Perry and I'm in great company. It's Pa I don't want to close my eyes I Don't wantna fall asleep close I see better. Yeah I don't wna miss a thing. H will a dream of you. A sweetest sing willll never do. I still miss you parents. Sing. When you go through heartbreak, it is hellish. It's the worst thing in the world. And then what makes it even worse It I feel like the world was then looking at me laughing at me Wow. I felt embarrassed. I felt horrified. It was awful. How do you stay sane through that I didn't You don't. I hadt meantic the autumn I had like serious breakdowns. I did. You also went through miscarriage. We were about twenty four weeks when we lost baby but we've named him and I think having to give birth to a child that you can't take home This is's awful Guys, just before we start, I wanted to let you know that this episode contains discussions about miscarriage and baby loss Please take care whilst listening or watching. If you or someone you know is affected by this, please know that support is available. You can find information and links to helpful resources in the show notes Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of Great Company. Today's guest Perry Edwards. That is enoughset Okay, now before we start, if I can ask you one favor Hit that subscribe button. means you can join our community and it means that we can keep making this show better and better for you each week. You can do that one thing, thank you so much. Enjoy this episode of Great Company with Perry Edwards Perry, listen,'ve just listened to your brand new single. Yes passenger princess. We're just listening to upstairs? Oh nice. What do you think? You like it? Okay, I promise you, right? It's unbelievable It reminds me of kind of like, it's like Admiral Levine. Yeah. like a rock poppy. It's insane. Oh yeah. I really happy. Thankk you. you When you make that, when you do a song like that? Do you know in your head like this feels good. This feels exciting. This. I think so, yeah. And I've got that feeling with this song And I wrote it with Nin and Eesbitt and we just have such a laugh together I would take in the m like the lyrics I don't want to take out the bins. We were like, can we open a song with this is the first line or is it bit random? It's a bit O there, isn't it? And then my patience is on Mjoral Like my patience is wearing thin, likeike, I've got time for this shit. So that's kind of like we were just banter in and it ended up being a thing and now I just love it Can you how do you find a sort of career since being in a band for so long and then becoming solo. that's big shift It is a big shift. That's the I think I've struggled the most with that shift. What exxplain why It's like a double edgeed sword I keep saying because You come out when you're a new artist and you're not established yet, right? and you're trying to figure out your sound, figure out who you are as an artist. It's an art at the end of the day. So you kind of you have to try everything before you know and before it sticks, like look at Sprina Carpener. She's been around for years.. But only now it's like starting to pop off and people are listening. it's like, but she's been great for ages, but it just takes one thing to stick. Does that make sense? Totally. hundred percent. You can work around like behind the scenes, do your thing. When you come from band like Little Mix was because we were, we were huge, we were successful, we did a lot. People then have the expectation of you coming out of a band that you have to then be great from the get go But who has that expectation? yourourself, your team. I think everybody. I think my label probably expected it The fans expected. like everybody has these expectations of me. Yeah. That is a lot of pressure and I don't do well with pressure like that and it gets to me. And I think if I was a new up and coming artist and I was figuring my shit out behind the scenes and then I came out be less pressured. but I don't want people hearing me and being like, ah, that's not what I thought she was going to do when she left the group or that's not the kind of route I thought should go down. So it's a lot of pressure, but then you're blessed in a way because you have a fan base already So you canouge as you say. It's like you've got to we up the pros and the cons really. Yeah, because you're so right. I think what you're basically saying is he takes Sabrina Carpenter. peopleeople look at the end product and they go, my God,'ve been doing it for so many years. everyvery artist, every person who's successful has been doing that grind for so long. And so now because you've had so much success before it's like, okay, well there need to be success now. It needs to like follow that kind of success. But that don't had the others to lean on No. and that little mix didn't Yes, we won X Factor and we were successful, but it didn't happen overnight. It wasn't instant. We had a few dododgery singles or a few things that didn't really work and then we' try something else and we were R and B at one point then we went really pop and then we went more like regimented salute, like yeah, everything was all. like we tried everything and it worked because people grew with us over time. Whereas I'm coming out now from that And they're like, do something great now. Do it now, instant. And I'm like, giveive me a minute Just let me figure it out. I just w to understand. what I mean? Yeah. Wow. like I just want to figure it out. What does that do to you emotionally mentally? Beuse that's a hard thing. having that much. It is a lot think like I'm people pleaser as well. I like people to be happy. I want my team to be happy. I want everyone around me to be like in this happy little bubble and everything's great. and blah, blah blah, which obviously isn't life really, is it? You've got to take What is it? got r Yeah, you got to take the rough with the smooth and And I think, yeah, I just I want to please everybody and I want my fans to be pleased and Please and other people so much, you then start to really lose yourself, I think. And then you can kind of get lost. I'm really trying in later life not to be a people pleaser. Me too It's hard, but I'm better at it, I think. Also, is there a pressure as well? like being in a band and then becoming solo and then others within the band also having solo career. It's not competitiveness. but it's I imagine you have to have different sounds I mean say it's not competitive, but it really is. Great between us, like me and the girls, we don't have that in our b bon Like we love each other so much. If I see the girls doing well, I feel like I'm winning because I love them that much. I want to see them tr truthully. And that makes me happy. Whereas everybody else from the outside compares us all the time and it is draining Like Lene doesn't want to be compared to me the time. I don't want to be compared to Jade all the time and vice versa. it's exhausting again. but it's just how people are, I think When you come from a group They love to pit you against each other But Little Mix was never about that when we were together let alone now. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, because Little Mix was never that. No that. I think Little Mick is one of the greatest bands of all time, one hundred percent forad out. you. withithout a doubt. I agree. It's unbelievable. You are on. Thanks two blow that horn. Yeah I'm buzzing. Okay, fifty million records sold worldwide Over fifteen billion global streams and sold over three million concert tickets. Unbelievable When you put it like that, is insane isn't it My favorite? Yeah, go You Vocals. Yeah with Jason Derilla. Oh, seecret love song I love that song. It's so It'squred I don't can I Shall I go for it? Go for it Go for it I don't quite know the lyrics, but can your M last. It is sing on the dance floor Beautiful. And if you be like then I can be like then because that wasn't good. That's No, that was really good, but that's a hard bit that th that's a big bit. Even I get a bit well that comes. So when you get to that when you get when you were getting to that moment, Yes, and you have to take it to another level 'cause there's a bit at the end. Oh yeah, I' be shoting myself. Wit I that one and then because' stupid thing of holding it on every night. People were expecting it then I thought, oh Ill have toar. Exactly just like that. J like that. C you it? I can't, I'm not warm. Do know, I haven't sang that song in six years. Have you know. And I'm thinking about like performing it again when I do the live gigs because it was such a moment and the crowd love singing it. Yeah. But I'm so scared becausecause that note is insane But I always said to myself If I fluffed it up and it went wrong, I'd just do it again Oh so youop you would just stop and say, right, I'm gonna do that again? Yeah because it's right at the end. And as long as I know the cate, I'll just do it again. That's why I just come back in. You have the confidence to do that now, right? Wh? Oh yeah. whichich is amazing. It's so funny how like as we go through life, we get this complete confidence. And we're just like, why didn't we have this mentality when we were younger? Beacause all the stories of you when you were younger, you were this incredible sing you could always sing But you didn't have the confidence to go and do it. No, I was just terrified. Why were you terrified when you were younger? I don't know. I think you care more about what people think. I think that comes with age. And even though your elders will say, you won't care as much, you know, just let like don't worry about what people think and what they say. But it's hard to actually do that when you're younger, I think, because I think people's opinions mean everything when you're younger. I don't know why But as I'm getting older And I'm realizing life is too short. I'm only put on this planet once, I wantna do it right, you know what I mean? I can't spend it worrying about what people think of me Now I'm at the place but like you said earlier with the people pleasing thing. If people don't like me But but do you really mean that? Yes, I do, whereereas before I didn't I wanted people to like me. I needed people to like me And now I really do not care at all Where do you think that comes from? Because I You do therapy, right? Yes And I do therapy. Well I've actually sort of stopped my therapy. I don't know. I've stopp since becoming a dad I've stopped Okay. Is is that just becausecause you haven't got time really? No time. Yeah. Yeah. No time to like breathe, no time to do anything. And so And actually I think therapy, if you can do therapy in any form is the most important thing because the self awareness that we get from it. Absolutely. It's crazy, right And what I realized all of what the reason why people please, the reason why I want to be loved was from a lot of different things when I was younger. Yeah. Why do you think you have that within you? What have you learned about yourself? I think I have serious abandonment issues. you too? Yeah Yeah. I think that's what it comes down to. And I never realized it at the time because I grew up with my mom doing everything for me and having her such a strong independent woman. But really, I think about like my dad left when I was six month And I think that your body holds ono the trauma, even though I don't remember it, I still think, oh, my dad didn't want to be here. Do know what I mean? So it's like that And then you have relationships and they'll leave you for someone else. and it's all it's constantly it's like, oh God, I'm not good enough becauseuse nobody wants to be around. Does that make sense? Itakes total sense. It's got real deep real quick. Re. Hey listen. Real de. Oh no I open you up straight away. Wy, am I talking deep now? Like No, I'm so with you. I think that's what it is. It's totally that. Yeah My parents divorced, and I think that for me and I was sent up to bor in school and I've spoken about this a lot, but that's what did to mean, you don't really realize that. And now for me, which is I'm going through this process now because I've just had a baby boy, right? I'm looking at me a younger me when I was sort of eighteen to twenty seven. And I feel so sorry for that young kid because I was trying to be so many things I just wasn't. Yeah. L so many different things because I was so scatred not fitting in, being abandoned and it's sad to think that I went through so much without realizing why I was going through it. Yeah. I feel like at the time you don't, you just kind of plod along with it, don't you? And then when you start looking back on it But yeah, it's like that little child inside of you want to like protect it. And then when you have children gives you a whole new out look on life, doesn't it? Why did your dad leave U, he met someone else. And they're still together now and I adore her. so it's like, everything happens for a reason. But at the time it was like, oh now You know what I mean? And I was just a baby so I didn't know I don't know any different. And like at the time we just went through, but then when I'm now that I'm older And I look back on how my mom was I don't know how she did it because I couldn't imagine doing what she did with two kids on her own likeike no money, nothing. likeike, you know what I mean? It's hard. But when I never felt like I didn't have things when I was growing up Ething we had was second handand, but I still had it You know what I mean? Yeah. So I don't look back on my childhood and go, Oh p man, I had nothing. I had a great childhood. I was very happy as a child Yeah, I do That's interesting. No, it's amazing. And And you grew up, but you moved around a lot, didn't you? Yes. So went and you ended up you in New Zealand for a bit as well.. We were everywhere A it again though. att the time I was like, Ohre we're off again. but when I look back now I think My mom was probably just trying to figure this shit out on her own. and she just wanted to keep moving around Yeah then everywhere So when was the first moment that you realized that you could sing. a very young age actually, because I remember being like I went to a Catholic school and we sng for everything. We sng for our lunch, we sng for our breaks, we sung just everything was singing. And I remember sitting next to kids in the classic k Dven that Like it would really offend. It is natural. Yeah. because people who are toneed deaf don't understand how their brains work fascinates me. I'm tone deaf. Oh really? I think so. Okay Well I didn't wantan to say it but No, I'm joking. But I don't know how people caught hear the note Ls like a fl. And so on cuckool That offends me? I know I shouldn't, you can just you could just hear that. Yeah. but some if I go la and someone goes la, I'm like no that's wrong. Do you know what I mean? But can you name the note? So if I No, I'm not good. I'm not like'm not like Uzo Eik. But can you can mimic people. So if someone says it, you can go straight into it. Yeah, like pitch And I know if people have good pitch or they don't and I knew that from a very young age because I could sing along to anything and I used to impersonate people a lot Brittany, I went through Brittitney stage Like a song like that all the time all the time. I do that again somebody more. Yeah like that. I just loved it. I wanted to impersonate everyone and then like anastasiaaron Like Alanis Morret. E like I used to just yodle all the time. like on it was like never ending, but I would just spend hours and hours and hours singing. So I knew it was like a passion Does that mean though when when you go into singing, do you then try and mimic someone? How do you find your own voice? Because if you're fans of Brittney Spears or Abberel Levine or whatever or Diana Ross, doesn't matter who it is.. you kind of want to mimic them because you know they've been successful. So how do you find that voice within you? I think it just comes eventually because I think you just take it like you're take in so much youre like a sponge at that age, aren't you? So you try everything and then Whatever feels the most comfortable is what I think is like your natural singing voice Does that make sense Yeah. So when people sing in cururseive, I'm like, but that's not real, is it popular school Depends how you define popular. I had a lot of friends, but I don't think I was a popular girl But I' moved around so much, so I was kind of popular because I was always the new girl. Be that's what I meanion. Because you were moving around so much, I imagine that would be quite hard to fit in because you're constantly changing the whole time And then you go to New Zealand to spend time in New Zealand and then you come back again. Yeah So that's a lot is a lot for my little nervous system at that age. Yeah. But I used to just think, o, it's good because I'm good at making friends. So I had to then Iroduce myself to people and be like, Hi I'm Perry Yam from England and D d you know what I mean? Yeah. But that's another thing as well. My accent used to morph into different things Because when I lived in Wymouth, was a bit more posh And then I went to South Sields, and then I was like talking more Jordie, and then I moved to New Zealand and I all of a sudden being like Kiwi It bit odd isn't So now my accent's all over the g X factactor was a big moment for you. and you know, I say this every single time, but I think it's pretty amazing, right? Harry Sttyles won a Grammy. ight And he got up on stage and he says, I want to thank the X factor It's amazing you know a lot of people when they speak to me or a lot of my castmbers are made in Chelsea, they don't w want to talk about it That' not me I'm such a believer in understanding and recognizing your roots. I agree. You know good, bad, whatever it is, you have to recognize where you came from. Where do you sit with that I completely agree I think every platform and every opportunity we've being given as It's wild Like I'm lucky I got an X factor. I'm lucky I got noticed. I'm lucky, I went all the way and we're lucky that we won You know what I mean? And I think I don't look back and go, o, X factor graves. because yeah it was hard and it was a lot, but I'm so grateful it happened But I'm a bit like that with everything. My mom calls me Pollanna You know, Pollyianna, the movie. Do you remember that? No? And it's a little girl and she's just so positive about everything. Like I always think like I don't like it when people rewrite history either I don't like it when people look back on things and go, Oh, it was this and it was that but it wasn't, wasas it? Do know what I mean? I ex. That bugs me. It's like just yes, it was hard and I'm not saying it was the The more straightforward Most humane. Sure, and it wasn't the most things weren't handled, right But I'm still very glad it happened and it got me to where I am now grateful. But if I could because on your solo career now and in your head, I don't know you're probably thinking. I think this is that because you hundreds percent have the talent, you have the personality, you have the looks, you have everything You could you do though, right? You could you could have had a solo career or in a band without the X factor. right? So if I gave you a magic wand truthfully and you could really you could or a genie, and you said, I give you one wish. You can redo your life and you can do eter or not do it Would you redo X factor? Yes. You would. one hundred percent. one hundred percent and I would one hundred percent want to be in the group again Like I thrive in a group dynamic did when I was younger because was I wasn't confident. I was painfully shy And every time I auditioned, I sounded terrible And I'd never experienced nerves before. That's so annoying. Kning that you can't give your best in that. And my voice was shaking andn. it was going like that. and I was like, o my go, I don't know what's happening to me. And then' like, oh, you're justervous. And I thought, is that what that is? I don't I've never had that before. It's weird. So I think when they put me with the girls, I was thinking, right this is it. My mom even said that if I'm lucky, they'll put me in a group because I was so painfully shy If the camera was there, I'd be like that. Im trying to avoid it. now I'm like, look at me. But at the time I needed the girls around me and I was so young. I was only seventeen. That this baby. I was a baby, sixteen when I first auditioned, I think in seventeen ish when we won eighteen maybe. We had Jesse on the podcast, right? And she said, Being in a band was amazing and it's not until you go solo that you realize how powerful being in a band really is. It's true. I think it is just I knew that in the moment though We knew we were blessed to have each other And I think if You know, we didn't get along And it was hard and we went through all these different things because it wasn't peachy all the time, it was hard but we still had each other. And I think we'd always put our shit to one side and be like, no, we're in this together and we want the same thing. We have to make it work. But exxplain to me the hard bits, right? Because For someone who looks in, and I know, but for someone who's listening right now are watching looking in theyre, but you had everything. You got to travel the world, you got to do this, you got to do that. So what are the harbits that people don't see I think the hard part is being seventeen, eighteen and being whisked away from your family and that's it. You don't get time to say them that much. You don't see your friends, you miss events, you miss big milestones in people's lives. you don't get to be a part of normal stuff anymore. And you're a you're a goldfish in a pond. Ebody's looking at you. Everybody's watching your every move, who you're dating, who you're seeing, who you're out with. Are you drinking? Are you partying too much? Are you being boring? Are you it's everything. It's like when you're that age I didn't know what the hell I was doing at seventeen eighteen. I was figuring it out, but I was figuring out with a lens in front of me twenty four seven. It's also too young to figure out. Yeah, Paparazzi's trying to get up my skirt at eighteen years old. I'm like This is weird. Men following me home Like all these different things that people are like, but you're so lucky you're gonna go about. I'm like, yeah, but there's people out there who are also a bit nuts. And we have to deal with them a. You like you lot You had Paparazzi trying to do upscanninging and you had men following you home Yeah, a lot of the time. ye That's terrifying. I know. And I used to park up somewhere else and then either go to my manager's house or go somewhere else until I'd lost them and then I'd have to go all the way back home then because I didn't want to be followed. so I'd have to try and lose them There's just like this is the thing. there's two sides to Be famous, I suppose, isn't there? And you don't have the choice, but now it's so different to what it was when we were on the scene When we first came out like paps were everywhere Cameras were everywhere Every move was documented, everything was a headline, everything was seen. whereereas now I feel like I go about my life and nobody cares, but maybe that's because they're bored of me. bd. But it's not the same anymore. I don't get papped everywhere anymore. I don't think anyone really does May because of social media. they've taken that money away from peraps essentially, haven't they? But can I ask a question because you had abandonment issue, right? Yes. Because your dad left when you so young and that you thought everyone was going to leave. When you get given fame? Yes It's like the most It's like nectar for someone who has abandonment because it's so exciting. And wait everyone wants me and everyone loves me. It's everything you've ever wanted it's hard, right? Because you also want to be a singer but you also want to be famous, I imagine, right Part Yeahah, parts of me enjoys it When it works in my favour, I love it. If it gets me the front of the queue, why not If it gets me a discount. Why not? But when it's like people are invasive and in my space, then I'm like, no. But I do think fame is addictive. one hundred percent. I think when you're liked and when you're adored, it's the best feeling in the world because who doesn't want that? It's normal to feel like that. Even if you're at school and you're misspopular or misseda popular and you go through your life if you're working in an office and you're the main one or you're the golden boy or whatever It makes you feel something. so you can't deny that. I can't say, o, I don't like it. I love it. I like it Think I wanted it and I craved it more before I had children xplain to. So I think for me being in the industry and being a singer was everything. And if I wasn't that, I was a nothing. I was a failure. I was a nobody, nobody cared. But then when you have kids It just puts everything in perspective and it's like, hang on a minute. Yes, I do this because I love it and it's what makes me happy and I'm at my happiest when I'm on stage. It's not everything. It's not my children's health and happiness and everything else. That's what's important So I think you just get a whole new Look on life. Yeah, your py shift downt. Ething shift. It's crazy when that happens. yourour brain expands. Yes. E shifts and everything becomes different. Don't get me wrong, I want it still. I want to be out there. I want to be a pop star. It's who makes me feel like me. Im like I love being a mom, but I also love doing what I love to do. So it's finding that balance. It's not like I need it Now, otherwise, I'm in nothing. So you know what I mean? Yeah Toty. So when you were in littleittle mix, right, results mattered massively. did one hundred percent, right? You needed to be the top. It was like, we need to do this. We need to be the best. Yeah. And that also comes with that feory of abandon. We're going to lose this at some point. It's going to go Yeah. It's going go Absolutely. And now that's shifted where you don't think there's not as much pressure on yourself, it feels like a little bit No. And I think that changes as well with the industry. The industry is completely different now Back in Little Mixed days, if we didn't get a number one or a top five, it was a failure. It was bad Be the amount of money that was invested in us and the amount of work and time and commitment that everybody put into it, it was a big huge disappointment and it felt like shit Whereas now? position doesn't really it doesn't matter anymore. It's about streams and it's about this and it's about social media content and everything's kind of shifted anyway. So I think then you start thinking, well, right? well, that's not important anymore Now this is important and X, Y, Z is important. So I think that shifted anyway Back in littleittle Mix, if we didn't get like the success we craved, we felt so shit What was what was the hardest part about being in Olmics around that time? What was it What I said just about our personal lives being everywhere Like that was a law U And it was a lot to deal with because it didn't it wasn't normal really, is it? It's not normal Becauseuse also you're growing up and you go through a public breakup as well. And that's tough. Yeah That is tough I think it's I think it's only tough because one I mean, people are going to hate me talking about it, the fucking, I can't catch a break If I talk about this, am talking about it? But anyway? Be it's your life. Yeah that's your life. Yeah. I talk about it. Like when you go through heartbreak, yes, it is hellish. It's the worst thing in the world. Can't eat, you can't sleep, you feel horrendous. again. Abandoned. You feel abandoned and you don't feel good enough and you feel like you've been left for something better or whatever it is, obviously And then what makes it even worse is I feel like the world was then looking at me laughing at me. Wow. I felt like everyone thought, o Jordine And not my fans. like my fans were like, We love you. We'll fight your'll corner no matter what. But I felt like everyone I felt embarrassed. I felt horrified It was awful. How do you stay sane through that? I didn't I had a minted the autumn I had like serious breakdowns. I did. becausecause it wasn't just the heartbreak I was dealing with, I was dealing with everybody like looking at me and I felt ridiculed I just couldn't cope with it. I hate it. I was breaking down in performances, which isn't like me at all. I was breaking down. I was crying constantly. I think I was depressed. And I know that sounds ridiculous, but I think it was this plus this, plus this and everything on top it was like I had to be there for the girs. I had to be switched on. I had to power through for littleittle Mix, but I also just wanted to be left the fuck alone. But I also was getting followed every two seconds and asked about a twenty four seven and It was the headlines, it was everywhere. and it was a lot. And like this is the thing when people are like, stop talking about it, I'm like, but it really affected me. But veryt You shouldn't feel like you have to stop talking about things because other people say so. Who cares? Yeah. No, you're right. W was as hard for Zanne as it was for you, do you think I think at the time I think when you're I need to be careful. I say this. But there was let's just say there was a bit of a I was going to say it. So there was a bit of an overlap You say And u I think when you're moving on with somebody else, you always get on better. When you're the one left behind That's when it's hard because it's like, oh shit they've left me for Someone more beautiful that makes someone better than me, whatever it is That's how it felt at the time and then you you have a song that they've written about you, but then they someone else is in the video It's it was one thing after the other, after the other. And I remember finding out A about that? Perry, that is it. Yeah. And I just I went in and my dad and my brother were at the house at the time and I' just moved into my little bungalow in Surrey. So I was trying to get as far as I could And I just remember finding out about that and it was like the nail in the coffin And I thought this is how get a little bit much And then I started crying my eyes out and then my dad started crying and he was like, I don't know how I can take this pain away. And I'm like, you can't. Nobody can. This is hellish. Like what is going on? It was like it was really one thing after the other. and there's so much that people don't know about that I would never say, even though I've just spilt some beans, but there's so much that went into it that I would never talk about that I went through and it was real hard So that's probably why I get a bit frustrated. How does it How did it change your understanding of your love? It made me realize that that was very unhealthy and that I mean, you can say it was young puppy love or whatever and you're like whisked away with it. and think now that I've experienced what healthy love is With Alex. Yeah, it's so nice. It doesn't make you feel sick to your stomach all the time. It doesn't make you feel icky. It doesn't make you feel like you're not worthy or you're not good enough or you could be doing everything better. And you know, it doesn't feel competitive. It doesn't feel Like that's exactly what I would say it was. It doesn't feel like that when you experience it the good way. And sometimes we get confused, right? Yeah think that's We think that's passion. Yeah. I like they love this much. This is exciting Yeah. I mean when I' thrill. I when I met Sophie and We were like best friends, right? And we then met each other and we started like hooking up and I was like I remember saying to things like, I'm going to go on a night out And she was like, okay And I was be like what? Okay. And there's no backlash in this? I'm gonna drink loads Okay. Yeah. and it was I actually at the beginning got scared with Sophie because I was like, A this It was still. I see what you're saying. was was under. It like there's no like fire, there's no like heated There's no heated things. There's no arguments, There's no. And then what I realiz is actually being still. Feeling confident in a relationship. Yeah is actually what you're after. one hundred percent. We still have peaks and ups and downs. O course, that's natural. hundred percent it's not really up a height and they'm really low and they'm really here I'm really there. That isn't healthy It's just not. You can call it passion, but that only takes you so far, doesn't it What do you love about Alex Oh it' such a sop. I just I just love how Calm he is and how understanding he is and how caring he is and thoughtful he is and Like's things he does up and here it is a shit out of me, but that's fine. But like yeah, I just feel safe with Alex. I feel just content and happy and It's not. I thought You, um You also went through A miscarriage twice together. Yes, we did And you had a really tough time with it. Yeah I feel like the first time round it was more just I don't know because I found out I was pregnant. Yeah. Then I went to have a scan Andcited you were really excited. I was just like, oh my gosh, because it wasn't planned. and it was I felt weird, but I was a bit like, o, okay, maybe this is a good thing. L we love each other. We're going to be together forever. little. So maybe it's like, okay, but I have a scan and just check, but before the scan I started bleeding And I was thinking, Oh no, maybe Maybe I'm not pregnant, but I was still still seeing pregnant on the stick and everything like that And then we got there, well, I went by myself actually, I was on my own. so I went into somewhere on Holey Street went for the scan and then they're like G Okay And the woman said to me, she was like, there's no sack, there's no baby And I thought Marson, I've imagined the whole thing. like I was starting to think, did I read it wrong? I'm sure I said pregnant and I'm sure there was I did so many of them. So I was then convinced that I'd made the whole thing up, so I was going a bit crazy And then I went into the, you know, the appointment after with my gynecologist and he sat me down and he's like, No, no, no, there's no baby. And I said, no, I understand that. I've been told that, but was there ever a baby? or was I'm really confused. L just And he wass like, no, no, there was a pregancy, Darlen, but now it's gone And he was like, you've miscarried. And I was like Oh. Okay, and then I just felt weird. And then it was a bit bizarre. It was almost like it felt like something that I wasn't fully attached in a way. I don't know that sounds awful. Yeah because it was so early, it was all a bit of a Yeah bit when wety and I was just it was all a bit weird. So then it kind of freaked me out moving forward and then when I fell pregnant with Axel Then the whole pregnancy, I was thinking, oh, no this could happen again. So I felt like I was scared to get attached, but then I was attached and then it was almost like scary. Wow, No one I didn't even think of it like that. Yeah because you don't you want to you don't want to get attached. Yeah. you're like, well it's you don't know. it's gonna to happen. But then you can't help but get attached. You can't help but get excited. And then the bigger you get and the more bump you get and it's all becoming a bit real And then you decorate the room and all these things. And luckily my pregnancy with Axel was Amazing. I loved every second of being pregnant Once I was past the twelve weeks and I felt like I felt like everything was fine, all the appointments were great, everything was going well. I thought, right, this is it and I just basked in it. I loved every second of it That kind of got me feeling a bit more positive and I was like, rightight, I can do this. I've birthed a human, I've done it once, I can do it again. And then we got pregnant again. and then we were about twenty four weeks when we lost. our baby but we'd named him and it was all this kind of again, I was attached but because I had just had axle I wasn't living in the headspace of o somethingomet could happen. I was just like, I've just done this and I'm doing it again And I love it So I wasn't even thinking anything was going to go wrong. until it went wrong. And that was like traumatic because I feel like when you're that far along and you have to have the procedure. It's it's I don't know, it's just different. No way to have a miscarriage is easy If it happens at the beginning, it's not easier than it happening further down the line. it's just not nice in general, is it And I think having to give birth to a child that you can't. I'm sorry Oh, Perry She's been This is awful. I like to just cry, I swear a cancer, that's fine. But cry. let me know it's okay to cry. Yeah. know. I can't even imagine that you know, I can't even imagine. Yeah. goingo through that experience and Yeah. It is sad, but we have his little ashes and it's like It's just it's just life, isn't it? It's awful. and it does it seems so unfair You know it's really important to talk about this because so many people go through this and you're helping them because they're going, well, she's gone through it so I can get through this as well. Yeah, no, and that gives me some peace. L that makes me feel a bit more like content with talking about it. What would you say to someone who's experiencing that right now or just going through it? I think There's not really anything you can say to make it easier I don't think anything really necessarily helps, but I think for me, I'm in a position where I ' been through it twice, but I've also got two children. So it's like, I can't even imagine what it must be like for the women who go through what I went through and still don't have a baby. Do you know what I mean And I was it took me a while to want to go again and I always knew I wanted more. children that just one. I always knew I wanted Axel to have siblings, whether two or three or whatever didnid't have it in me to get pregnant again. Like I was just terrified. I thought it's probably best to just leave it. So that's why there's such a big gap now between like A and Alanus. It's not a huge gap but it's not the gap I wanted, you know. But it took me a lot to get over what happened to try again And I think especially after what happened with this When I was pregnant with a Lanice, I was just on edge the whole time. All I did was to eat oneking four and a half stone of comfort food Every appointment I was just my like stomach felt like it was doing somersaults. and it's so scary. I was like just it was just a lot. Every appointment, it wasn't enjoyable. And and that upsets me because I love being pregnant I love the feeling of it. I love carrying a baby. I feel Pful. I feel like untouchable. It's wild how you feel I'm like sad that during the pregnancy, I didn't get to enjoy it fully until the very end, really. 'Cacauseuse I was just always on edge. 'a you feel like that's sort of been taken from you. Yeah. Yeah. And we had so many extra scans. like Alanis was scanned more than any baby in the history, I think, ever. I was like, give me one more. I'll have one more. fancy another one. Hest Yeah fancy another. I couldn't get enough scans just for reassurance because I was just so scared That's so understandable. Yeah. I want to also mention Alex as well because you know if a partner is listening to this right now and their wife or whoever is going through it. What would you say to the partner? How does the partner react? What does the partner need to do say to make it okay? Be they're in it, but they also need to protect their loved one. who's the one experiencing it? Yeah, I get why people say it like that. and I get in the moment why Alex was like, you know, you're going through this but it wasn't me. Obviously I'm carrying the baby and I'm going through the procedures and I'm having to do all these things that I didn't want to do. But he just felt for me because he knew how hard it was and what I was going through. But then I was also looking at him thinking But you've lost our baby too. Do you know what I mean? And he'd planned all these things and what we wanted to do. and we're gonna have two running around and this that and the other and we had all the stuff ready. Like it was just, I think for him put on a brave face and he kind of dealt with it becausecause I think that's what a lot of men are told to do. And I hate that shit hate I don't think that's healthy at all. Why should men have that mentality? And why should they be taught that from a young age as well? They should be taught how to feel. Yeah. And men would probably be more decent if they were taught their emotions. Yeah. It's okay s and feel. It's okay It's okay. It's okay'll have to bury it and become you can't cry. Yeah, you can let it out I think that's yeah. I think that's important. And I think Alex did go through the motions and he tried to T toughen up and be there for me, but I know he went through it and I know he was struggling becausecause it's just awful Did you speak to the gls? Do you speak to the band members Yeah, I spoke to the girls and they blessed them. They were sending me like hampers from the White compomany and this that and the other. And they were really sweet about it. was it was awful. I think I told Leanne at the time, because we have a group chat from when we had our babies because we were pregnant at the same time. We did everything together. Of course, we'd be in sync with our children as well. It was I spoke to Lenne and I told Leanne first and I was like please can you tell Jad, would to have spoke to Jade, but even just telling people what had happened was making me feel sick to my stomach. So once I explained it once A kind of a sight, please can you just take it from here and let Jade know. And she was like, of course, Bab, like no problem So that was hard. like telling people. And then friends would message and be like, how's the bump? How you feeling notot known that we didn't have the baby anymore. So it was like, and then I felt bad on them. Miss, people, please I again, I'm thinking feel you feel awkward Now I feel awkward for them. haaving to tell them all there is no baby. And you'd be like,'s okay by the way, But we're all right that kind of thing. It's just all a bit. It's a really hard dynamic to get right, I think You know, we had Jessie on and she obviously went has been and is going through such a Yeah Mmhm. U And she said that A her prncy, how how you all reached out to her How is your relationship with each other now I mean, when I think Everything we've been through is a group And even though it ended in ways that I wouldn't have wanted it to and we're not that close anymore and we're not in each other's lives. I still feel everything that the girls feel and I think they're the same. We'll always have that weird connection and saying Jesse go through that, it broke me because you wouldn't wish that on anyone. It's literally wild. And as much as we've got our issues and you know, I think I don't want to see her go through that. I don't want to see her hurt and I don't want to say any of that. It's heartbreaking. You know because the really interesting what you said is that when we talk we talk about breakups, right? And you talk about the breakup with Zayan and that being public and how tough that is What you You know, you sung about righters when you have friend breakups you know, like I I broke up with a friend as well. Well he sort of broke up with me, I think, more than I broke up with him. Yeah. It was traumatic. It is. It was. It lot. I was like, sorry, am I sixteen again on like being broke what is It hurts, doesn't it? Yeah, it really It hurts. My friend, he said to me But we can't be friends for now. And I went What he said because of the Sven things And it wasn't my fault, right? Okay. But it was a very tough thing for me. and it took me about a year to get through it because I was suddenly like Hang on a second, you lose that sort of sister, you lose that brother. Yeah. It's really tough to do. And no one really talks about it, do they? No How when you're used to living in each other's pockets for so long and telling them everything and being like experiencecing everything with this person when they're gone, it is just as hard as a breakup, I think especially when you don't get closure That's the worst of it. That's the worst part If you get closure after a breakup, cushions the blow But I think when That's it it's done and you've got no say in it anymore. It's almost like, well, hang on a minute. You don't get that like You can't shift that out of your system, can you? You're like me, you need closure as well. I need closure. Yeah. I can't move on without closure. I need to be told those things. And I find it so hard. I know. What are you like in an argument? Do you have to I'm not good in arguments. I'm not good with confrontation. like I'm quite quick witted when it comes to funniness But when it's serious, my brain doesn't think. I can't I can't argue because I get overwhelmed and I'll just cry And that's annoying in itself. So I just cry the whole time and it's just a nightmare. I'm not good at arguing. unless I'm sticking up for somebody else If I was like arguing for a friend I wouldn't back down But when it's me, I'm like, u, I just I hate it. Oh, so you've got that so you wouldn't back down. No If I was fighting for somebody that I cared about, I would just be like a bulldog. with myself, I'm like, o, I haven't got time for that. Yeah, but you have this heart, That's why it hurts so. That's why when you have this that's like it's almost It' too much. It's too much. I can't handle it. It's accack it. You know your lyrics in same place, different views, says say you' change, when will you mean it? It's always a stormy season. Time and time, I've tried to see the best in you, but no use. When you see my red as blue, we're on different pages. So there's nothing I can do. me and you in the same place, different view Beautiful. Thank you. Mhm. I think it's just like Sometimes you just won't win with people. You just don't say eye to eye at all. You could talk you could discuss something with somebody for hours and hours and hours and still at the end of that discussion be like, well I still think this and you still think that And that's what it kind of came to What annoys me more A again, I have to be careful how I say this because I don't want to seem like a bitch, but for May upsets me the most is when situations like this happen when the other person doesn't take any accountability booils my blood I'm not blaming everything on you. I'm not saying she's this fucking monster and everything was her fault and blah blah, blah. But take some accountability for your actions and realize you were difficult You did have difficult moments Granted, there was reasons for those moments But you can only pick somebody up so many fucking times before you start losing track of your own sunny. And you want to be there for that person, but if they don't, if they can't accept, help and they can't accept the love that you're trying to show How do you win? How do you get past that? You can't No because what you're talking about you' talking about fairness as well. Yeahes.'s like, hang on a second. I understand there's fault here, but you need to you need to accept that. I hate that. I don't like putting the blame on people. Don't put the blame on me and make me out to be something that I'm not. Yes, I'm not perfect and I might not have been there enough or I could have done better, I suppose, but I thought what I was doing was enough I thought I'd tried everything So then to then sit there and further interviews and discuss it publicly and be like I wasn't supported You were though You know what I'm saying? You were So just Again, take some accountability Do you think you' feel better? Do you think you're still angry I would say more frustrated than angry because I don't like being painted into a person that I'm not because I'm an open book. I'll tell you exactly how it is. And I'm very open, I'm very to the point And that's beautiful by the way, because I can feel that fl. Yeah. I have be real. Perry, it's so refreshing because To sit with someone and I'm so open. Yeah. I know you are. watch you al lot. Yeah, but I just because it's so authentic and you are so authentic. Yeah. And that is really important in life. You have to be. Yeah. I think it's I to be genuine. You have to be just but it exhausts me when I see other people that I know inside and out when they're not being genuine and it frustrates me Do you think you will rekindle the Frenchbe If I'm being completely transparent Part of me wanted to until the documentary And then part of me withdrew again. And this is the thing I'm not a horrible person. I haven't got a bad one in my body, but I can cut you off. you can do that. I can cut you out my life like that. If you upset me and you hurt me in a way There's not really any going back. I can forgive But I don't want you in my space. And this is what I'm learning in therapy as well. Like I'm there's capability in this capacity, right? Yeah. You're capable of anything. You can achieve anything if you really go for it and you work hard But my capacity is fucking small I only have a certain amount of roof. Do know what I mean? that I can cram in. I have my career, I have my relationship, I have my friends. I have things going on, there's personal thingss There's everything. I don't have the capacity for somebody like that in my life anymore and that might make me sound like a bitch, but I just don't have the energy for it. And as much as I will always love her I don't think I can hack that energy. in my No, I think It makes more sense than anything and I think I should take a leapf out of that book and I think more people listening should take a leapf out of that book because actually there is not enough time. There's not enough time to try and fix everything and make everything okay. And if you can't, you just have to let it go you have to just move back. Yeah. You can't fix everything and you can't fix people. That's for certain. They're setting their ways and clearly they don't think there's anything wrong with them You think, okay, you do you and I'll do me and that's that Your mum is called Debs yeah. or debs Who's more important, Alex or Debs Oh my gosh, Jim Oh, that's tough becausecause my mom is my world. She's my everything. She's my village. She does everything for me and Alex. So me and Alex wouldn't cope without deb. She she really? She's that She's at home with the kids now. She's my nanny, she's my mummy, she's my best friend. She's my gone out buddy. We do everything together, me and Debbs and The thought of not having her in my life is the scariest fear. My worst fear in life is not having my mom But then I have Alex that I'm going to spend the rest of my life with. and he's then going to have to step up and be the Dbs one day, you know? And that is like scary. You know what, it's my scary thing at the moment Like I had it I had a moment with my dad where it was during lockdown. and I think I mentioned this proble during lockdown, he came back and he'd been on a bike ride it was a hot day and he didn't really remember where he hadd been. It was just a he it was of a heat stroke or whatever it was. And it suddenly went I had this moment where I went Well, you're not invincible Wait Hang are saying, you're not invincible. you're not Yeah that's hard It's not nice that feeling. And now You know, I'm very close with my parent but very close to my mom. My mom is just I love my mom. Yeah. And you think like How many How many more summers? How many more Christmas? How many more on? I know I'm getting into that stage now where I startay It tellills me. It's the worst I can't imagine it. My can'. I don't even want to talk about it Jimmy Mv on. Dads living forever. What's something your momum taught you that you hope you can pass on to your children My mom's always been really good at letting me be what I want to be She's never said, D don't do that You shouldn't do that She's like, you just learned from it So if you fuck up, you fuck up and you make it work. And another thing is she always says to me, which I absolutely love is there's nothing in this life we can't fix And I love that. Yeah ye. because in the moment it feels like it's the end of the world, but there's always something you can fix, you know and you can get past it. You get past it, it's not forever, it's not a forever feeling. and You can get through it. That's why what I love. when a door shuts a window opens, you just to find that window and get yourself through it. Absolutely. But P, what's amazing is that you're juggling new music, your babies, being how are you juggling all of that With debs What debs? She holds down the fort for me But yeah, I've got a very good balance of work life, mum life All that stuff, I think But you wouldn't be you without making new music, without touring, without being on stage, without singing. No, I don't think That's with in your soul, isn't it? Yeah, I love it So are you not so excited about this new music? Yeah And I feel like I've I figred out my sound a bit more now And I'm I just love the music I was raised on. Like what was that? Like pop rock U like bit of pong, like guns and rolles aerossmith Steve Perry journey That's all my favorite kind of music. Amith. Aerosmith and Aval Levinee grown up, Hailey Williams, Paramore They are all my biggest influencers with music. When I'm around the house, that's the music I want to listen to. I want to listen to the big ballad eighties, pop rock ballads. all of that is the love of my life. When you hear those songs, what does it did to your soul? It makes me feel like warm and fussy and like amazing inside I love that feeling. So greatest song for you of all time Oh my gosh, that's impossible. Do you have to pick it The first song that came to my head was probably Eerl Smith I don't want to miss a thing. That's to be one of the great songs I've written, No Without a fricaking d. Without a doubt, right I don't want to close my eyes I don't want to fall asleep because I'm miss you bear. I don't wantna miss a thing. E when I dream again go A sweeter sing will never do. I still miss you, Perry. Singer And I don't wna miss a thing Thanky can I just say Brilliant man. Oh Thanks saw you. No no, honestly. You're so great I wish other people I wish people listening watching right out could feel the energy of you. Your energy is just I This sounds sounds weird Y You would be you're just such you're an amazing mother. Oh that's love. You're an amazing mother, an amazing friend. You can just feel it like yeah on you. It's just it's a lovely Aura to be around. I love that. Thank you so much. You are too. Listen, we're going to leave all the links to all of your music in the show description. E thatill off left. one hundred percent. I want everyone to go and check out every Single one of your songs. Oh, that would be great Get them streams up where we Get those freaking streams. Yeah, go on That is Is it wed like to finish our conversation with eight questions. you ready? Okay, yep, ready. What's a single phrase that makes you smile or cheers you up Don't worry, be happy. Okay, no worry Be happy B bestest compliment anyone's ever given you The one you just gave me then. But it's true, by the way, that's genuine. I promise you, your aura is just beautiful. That's so nice. What scares you most about yourself U not trusting my own intuition M. Wow. Yeah terrifies me I feel like my gut's very strong and I don't listen to it often, but I should Apart from today last time you cri No I was gonna say that five seconds ago. When did I last cry yesterday Okay It's not a regular occurrence that much. it just so happens that it was yesterday. What happened yesterday? I just felt very lovely Doveian in my feels What's something you can't let go of singing Yeahcent. What's your guilty pleasure? Probably like a good teen rom com likeike the summerte' pretty off campus, which I'm watching now and it's Is it good Wait Wait, is it? Oh my gosh. I'm honestly. Is it like Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I can't wait to get in the car as much as I love your company. I can't wait to get in the car. watch it I've downloaded episodes on my iPad on episode six or something. Is that good?? It's so good. I thought the summerertime pretty was good and then it's but it's wild though because the first episode you just say tits, tits ass tits. It's quite like sh but it's really good. Wait what's it called? It's called Off campus. Off campus. They were hot Yeah. Yeah Oh gosh, they're hot. It's just brilliant. It's so good to watch this? You should. Did you watch the Smmera Tempod? Iid didn't watch it No, Sophie did. She loved it. Did she say she will love off campus? Oh my gosh, T her to get it on tonight. What turns you off B Arogance hundred percent What turns you on the way people talk to people and the way they handle a room That is like a big turn on Does Alex handle the room? Yeah. Oh yeah. He walks in a room and hes it But in a nice way. quite bad but also quite humled. He sp It's just really goodird. I don't know. he's got something about him. He's very like bous, but alost like charismatic and like you know what I mean? he's just so funny That is sexy. It's so sexy. That means he knows himself very well. Yes, and I like that. He's got a very silent like confidence in himself. I love that sort of fit Bonus one Okay, favorite little mix song g givees to me I might have to go You know what? todayoday, I'm feeling power Yeah I'm feeling power. That's a bop isn't it Not shout out to my ex I do love Shout Automatics and it was such a moment in time and it was a great campaign. number one forages really defined us as a go group, but How are today is warm V. Do you remember that? viral wave you did wave Dn't do a viral wave when you were sing that song in the Oh yeah but that wasn't real, was it? It was edited. Yeah, it was edited, but how good would that have been if it was real? That would have been so sic, wouldn't it? You' singing. That would have been unreal.' never been in the same room since the breakup, but that would have been iconic. S Yeah H we areo, you the greatest company ever. Thankk you so! you are amazing. Oh L that! I wasn't expected to cry