Are You Proud to Be American

They out the wires. So much's happened. What is up Hi L leararning his own is Ivan Layon Junior. You can take the little IFB thing off your. Oh yeah. And's in an interview. And it's me, Rachely Lindsey. We did an interview with Maureen Edibore. She's a constitutional law professor. We talked her about Supme C court It's a lot. I mean, it's this actually crept up on me. It's the time of year. This always happens, right? into June Right at the top of July, you get the most controversial decisions, the ones the court holds out on before they take a break. but I forgot until even when we talked about this on Tuesday's podcast It didn't even hit me. I was like, oh my gosh, yeah, it is that time. courourt time. There just it's just a lot of stuff going on all the time. They sneak it in the summer They want to come in and do their racism. They want to cracked on us and stuff I use That's just racism all the. You still believe in the court. You're still a court believer. You believe 'cause you have to ' you're. Well, yeah, but all levels of the court. All right Right? Like you know, we'll talk about it with, you know professor when she was pro all levels of the court. believe in you believe in the courts We have to have a judicial system I mean But it needs to change. likeike it's it's extremely problematic. They're contradicting themselves Like they're it's li It's almost liars. They're liars. It's almost laughable at the length that they will go to in these opinions to defend something to align with their political beliefs or their moral values or their values, I should just say, rather than what's good for the people or what's right or what precedent says. Um, let's start with the hat b it? I don't know if I've ever seen you wear something designer Now when you told the story on the podcast about the hat, It wasn't Gucci. I got two hats. Whoa, let's talk about it. I got a Givantci hat and I got a Gucci hat. What where's the Giivantchy It's the house I How do you feel you' been getting compliments? I mean, noah, this is just the hat. I wanted it so I love the bucket hat life But I wanted a book at hat. have every day bucket hadat, I want a bucketatck to wear out a little bit. And so I got a couple of bucketheats and decideed to, you know, do the buooket hadat today. I think you should put it up a little more. You a little far back It's yeah,' a little's a little right. I. But you know what? because I looked at what I looked at W was Nigas who woren bucket hats in the past and Like I identify with almost all of them You know who wore a bucket hat Gadget And let me tell you guys something right now Hiss podcast Basically inspector gadget. Guy Doing all it is histonics People think is the person that's solving it when it is A smarter complicated competent woman who's actually making it go. I am the inspector gadget. podcasting lookook at me, look at me, look at me and this she makes all the sense. Inspector get so like niggas like niggas with bucket hats in the past have been actually Kind of trustworthy. Think of one that wore a bucket hat that you didn't like. I don't know. I think you're. I'm not gonna argue think about it. Can you think about anyone who's been in the bucket who's had been in a bucket life that was a villain No when I'm googling famous bucket hat wearerars. the first one that comes up is Gilligan from Gilligan's Island and I hate Oh my gosh. I loved that show. But see Ived Gilligan's Island. Gilligan was the man. Now I don't I don't count a Kango ass kind of a But maybe if you count the Kango Okay, well if you count that as a bucket hat then you got Ll Kuj as well Who really is the first hip hop superstar? You know what I'm saying No noody can rap quite like I can't I take a muscle b man then LL took the book and had through errors. And actually here's the thing about LL and his bucket journey Be he had the hat And then he took the hat off And then when it came back to LL at the end when he went on Akins die. Do you remember Atks died, LL? Did he go Hello Thout the entire nineties always was a bodyguy. He was buuff. But then Something happened in like, two thousand one or two thousand two. when LL came back out and he wasn't just buff He was shredded And it looked like he went on a no carb Akins kind of situation. It was' Akins L. Was it around headstrong? I feel like that's when he was It was headadstrong Paradise LL It was headong remember I ever meant to hurt you laugh together, cry together Lord willing and we going die together. He said Lord willing and we going die I never understood the Lord will we going die together part. When you say you grow old together. That's how I took it. But I get it, When you say die together, do you mean like at the same time? Because that's tragic. I just think you Mc Gl together. Yes, yes I hear you That never happens. What happens is one person checks out like six or seven years before the other person necessarily. And then Well. You think people like they die exactly did some noteooks Sometimes Even in a notebook I think I feel like she died slightly before he did. because he he found her dead No they she remembers him He gets in the bed with her, they hold hands and they wake up and they're gone together So I've always had a thought there Wh was He poisoned her I've always I've always had a thought. I've always had a thought They're adding things that are not there. There's like no reason to even make room for that. But they die acutely Okay. They were both old and they were having a conversation, thenen they just fucking die. Have you not heard of the whole thing when a woman dies first or when a woman's like really sickly, a man usually unless he gets married quickly, like we' dive. very quickly after like from a broken heart, like without. So I think that that was weighing on him the stress That shit is six months. Remember a year? No no no. that happens. this nigga. Have y'all seen this? Hold on. Have you seen that they checked out at the same. Do you remember what happens before that though? They have this huge moment and And she's like, he's like She's like, I remember and he remembers and they're crying and it's so emotional. And then immediately she can't and he is broken over it, broken. I think that him They were married in real life, that couple That was James Garner. And wute Maybe they weren' Well here's it like here's like here's the deal though. was the couple watch Aams because they James Garner play No, Rachel's the young James these are what we' talking about older guys. older people like James Garner was James Carter did a lot of shit I don't think he was actually married to real life. That woman might have been I The actress was also very famous. it was that Nick Cazavevelli's mother Yeah o Okay. so they definitely don't know why I know that cash beties His father was John Caseretes. Gina Rollins Rll Rolls. Okay. So like, yeah, apologize to her she is not just the lady from the notebook, she's been doing a whole bunch of amazing shit her entire life. she's passed away now Um, yeah, so when I just backack to the bucket hat thing to put a bow in this whole thing. LL is also bucket hat connoisseur. He's had all different kind And when he got into the paradise, level of his career, he brought the bucket hat back because he actually left Bcket Hat life. in the nineties and which is wearing a ball cap Foo ball cap, different types of ball cap, but then he brought the bucketage you' so well versed. Listen, you're in good company Do you like my slides? What kind of slides are those Nike I am not a slidewarer. Kbe y'all like come Ginzy appro I am not a slide I am not a slidewarer I'm obsessed with these. These is super comfortable. I you toit your hand in them They' Nike. I want it They're Nike I don't want to put my hand in it. Let me put my hand where your feet were kind of discuss this shit you want. Look at the bottom, no so So then What's Jon? Thank you.. That's how I know you' real nigged. These are super comfortable. You actually don't real crazy clos toed. I'm for sure. They're clos toed. Exactly, yeah. Okay This is an interesting question. I'm not a sockwearer in slides. These are so comfortable you would not want to put socks on with. because I see the bottom of it about to be my whole personality. I. Who Wh'd you get They're I felt like somebody would have gave you those. Why becauseuse you get a lot of shit given to you then you put the link Oh I don't actually don don I put my outfits on a link all my store. Yeah, yeah, not necessarily stuff. For adults with Crohn's disisease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matters Trumphia offers self injection or intravenous infusion from the start Trymphia is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self inject trymphia, proper training is required. Trremphia is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease, and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis. Serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them, and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection flu like symptoms or need a vaccine. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Tmphayia today. Call one eight hundred five two six seven seven thir six to learn more. or visit Tmphiaradio d. com given to me be sometimes We have a lot of news We have the Spreme Ct obviously, we're going to talk about that. LeBron James has left the Lakers. There was a Jayalen Brown trade that Jayalen Brown was criticized for being smart. U Barack Obama. I feel like that's not the first time we've heard that. Barack Obama weighed in on slavery and slave owners and slaved peoples. We'll talk a little bit about that I also want to pitch something to Rachel and ask Rachel a question later on. I want to pitch you a special episode of Higher Learning I also want to ask you a question that leads into this weekend, which is Not just the fourth of July, but the two hundred fifty of the United States. I ask you your a question, see what you think. Okay. As this Z corner as well. I want everyone to weigh in on this question we'll talk about a little later, but Dononna, get us started All right, let's start with one of the stories you teased and the sports. There's a bunch of changes happening in the NBA with free agency having just started. One of them is that LeBron announced that he's not returning to the Lakers. He hasn't decided on where he's going to go yet, but it won't be in LA You're a Lakers fan. What do you think about the new look of your team You mean the white boys? seeing a lot of white players. So let me tell you something, L look, here's the deal Uh, you know, the Lakers If you play well, that's all I he about. right? Now it is kind of crazy to go out there Everybody from the Wakers the Wakers, the Quakers said, no, you on the it's the white's the white. you can't get past.ak. You can't get past now. Laourne called him the L.AQ sn the snow L. Lamemourne said that they like the L.A. Quakers and all that stuff like that. The Wakers, all of this stuff stuff. I only legitimately care about How good they play So if Walker, Kessler, Mamo and the rest of these guys come out there, Austin Reeeves is resigned. shout out to Austin, Reggie Berry, all the people over there If they play well, I'm waing. It's funny It' funny, but you know, they look like Budget Niggas that Joh Wick try to kill L like John Wick Villain.'s they look like the lakers now. I'm good with. I' have a problem. You think they're going to be good withith that with that starting lineup Don't what are you what do your f? S of The decisions made are interesting, right? If you look at what happened with the Lakers this season You have, um They brought Walker Kessler in Cannard is gone. Ru Haimi looks like he's gone. Markcus Smart is gone LeBron James is gone There are some players in there that you wonder what the fuck was going on. And while specifically out T talk about M market smart. Market Smart comes in after a career where he's played really well est player of the year was a real huge part of the Celtsis culture for a long time, but actually has like a resurgence in Los Angeles, right with what he's able to do And you feel like if Markcus Smart is not going to be a laker next year that he must be going get a bag from someplace, right That's not what happen Marketmart, I think, signed a two year thirteen million dollars contract. Somebody looked that up Houston Now he has MA dokadir who he was with in Boston. So that might be a reason he would go there. but it's not like he got broke off to leave the Lakers and go to the rockets. We look at some of these other guys that they're not bringing back They're not bringing back Ry who's fantastic for him. They're not bringing back Luke, who was phenomenal for them different times, particularly once Luca was injured It would seem like what yeah, two year, thirteen million dollars contract with you Rock and Markmart. It would seem like What you would want is go out and get that three and D wing get somebody in the middle that Luca could deal with. It was like he likes Walker Kessler and then you would run the team like that. That's not what they did. They went for a weird white overhaul. And they let out a bunch of guys who had already been contributing. So I don't know. But has that been and I'm Lakers are not my team, but has that not been the story over the last several years of the management with the Lakers Hasn't that been a critique from fans of like, the miss like who they've brought to the team, maybe who they've overpaid for rather than like building a certain team around LeBron. Hasn't that been some of the talk? or am I So like is this not kind of in some of the decisions that were made just in as of recent in line with how the team has been managed over the last several years. I mean, yes and no, right? They were able to build a team in Laureon James that was good enough to win a championship,'ll be a champ in the bubble in the bubble Okay. But still though, that team was an elite NBA team Before that, I would say if you're being your most cynical. the time off between the pandemic happening and the bubble is probably the thing that helped them the most. I think that team probably still is the best team in the NBA that year But you don't know, they're older Anthony Davis gets hurt a lot LeBron Jan was getting older. wouldould they have gotten injured up and nicked up on the way to that title and not been playing as well. in the playoffs, but I still think that team at its best probably wins the NBA Championship that year U evenven though a lot shit happened in the buubble was weird, whatever. Yeah. whatever. But they still around LeBron James was able to go Russo Anthony Davis brought into White Howard run. they were able to put a team around LeBron James at least at that point to go out and win a championship and be really competitive. That's this same group brought in Luadontic and Luadontic is there now. So the question is how do you build around him? when you can't build around him and LeBron James at the same time? You're probably going to have to get one guy out of there And now they're building around Luca. What I don't understand is Some of this stuff is worth they had already done. that already brought in guys couple of guys at least that were good Lakers. Right? When you go back to Luke, when you go back to Rom, you go back to Market smmart. You feel like you get rid of a couple of different pieces, bring in some new pieces you address some of the athleticism concerns, you address some of the three point shooting, you address some of that stuff. And then you you take it away, but then Quin Gimes a small guard, likeike C Sexton, all of these guys. He trreated Jayla Brown. Why didn't they do that? That's Bill Simmons you guys are hearing from right now. Still upset. Still pissed. Still upset. But anyway, so you say all of that shit And it's like I don't know what the direction is. who knows? As a Laker fan, did you think that This was LeBronze last year. Did you feel that was going to happen wasoping for hammer for your team for everyone involved Okay for everyone involved.e fan. so no I was hoping for everyone involved. Okay. It was like but Ill Do you think that they was worse Do want LeBron gone. Yeah. Do you think that you because you said they can't build the team around both Luca and LeBron? Do you think that it really was LeBron's decision to leave No. Okay. I don't think it was really L Brad's decision to leave. I think Beause R're Paul saying the decision came down to happiness Yeah, but the reality is who's happiness No he's saying his H situation with Leron James, hisis situation with LBron James Uh Bron James. is not Anybody's everybody's player. He's not. it's impossible for him to be I don't care who you are in NBA right now And I mean this for any player I mean it this for Yokage I mean this for SGA I mean this for any player. save maybe one Save maybe one If LeBron James is in your locker room, is his locker room And it doesn't really matter how much better you are than him. No one is close to LeBron James in cultural significance in the MBA r Nobody. No one It's a joke Steph, maybe So if you go up to if LeBron James ends up in Golden State thenen you can make the argument that LeBron James is joining Steph's culture But even then You got two big dogs sitting at the table That's we. You got two big dogs sitting at the table, right? But if LeBron James is in your locker room She might not be the number one basketball priority in the locker room He might not be the number one H like organizational priority in the locker room, but he is the number one cultural priority in the locker room player that's the biggest deal culturally. in the NBA to me should always be the best player on a the team. Always You you have an incongruent team The player that's the biggest deal culturally is not also the best player on the team Because what that means is that the best player on the team has to make cultural space. for the biggest cultural deal on the team and the biggest cultural deal on the team has to make basketball space for the best player on the team and ain't going to work. So with that mentality then Where does LeBron go I mean, what's being thrown out there Golden State, Cleveland, Miami It's up to him, but I know I'm saying to your point using that like what you're to what you're saying because it makes a lot of sense Which of those if those are the top three choices, right? becausecause we know that he's not necessarily chasing the max contract at this point. R. I think happiness means a championship for him So you think so? Well what else does it mean? What do you think that that means? I mean, when I hear happiness, I don't think he I don't think he doesn't have to. It's not money. To me, it means a reign I don't think it means. So then what does it mean to you A nice city, a fun. I think happiness means to him legitimately the situation where He's not under a ton of scrutiny. Why would I don't know? was happ same. Obviously LeBron James would love to win like another ring. I would imagine he would love to win another ring. but The most distasteful thing for him to do in all of this would be the ring chase. But I don't think that it's being it's never going to be couched as that. My opinion is, so if it's not if it's not for a ring or for competitiveness, so you' just going to play another year on a team what? with people you get along with, your friends? Like I don't I don't understand what would be the motivation if it's not because they're never going to say he's going to chase the ring. Like at this point, that's that would never be the narrative. But I would imagine that that's truly what it is. So what would be the motivating factor to choose a team then if it's not money It's not compometitiveness What is it A good time. I really do think that that's what it is. And so let me tell you what I So where iss it going? So I don't have no clue We have a podcast here that should be trading in this and we'll see what they say Right now, there was two most anticipated podcasts ever. One was Bill today when he was talking about Jam and Brown in the whole trade. The one is everybody going to be waiting to see what Rich and Max say on game over about where Lebron James is going Let me tell you what I think and I don't know LeBron James. I've ed to Rich Paul like a couple of times, but nothing on this, like never They're not gonna do that. But let me tell you what I think. I think The most important thing about all of this stuff is that LeBron James does not want to stop playing basketball That's true So that's the most important thing. Yeah. So legitimately, What place has the most upside for him playing basketball What is the path of L' resistance to him as a basketball player to where he can still go do this thing that he obviously still wants to do Do it U without people breathing down his neck and they being a pressure cooker If you have Lukadontic on your team peopleeople are going to be like, We're in Lucaass prime now. The Lakers need to be competing for championships. Luca needs to be competing for NVPs. The question on that team is not How LeBron James going to be sent off. The question is how good can Lua Donas be And so Luca is going to be press, we go in. Let's do it Let's do it. makeake this team like I want it to be in all of that because I can't have my career be a wash out. That's a lot for somebody who at this point justust want a hoop So there are a couple of places where you can just hoop and be competitive And there are a couple of places where you can just hoop. If he went to goolden State right now, That's a just hoop decision You would have LebBron, you would have Steph, you would have maybe Draymon if he if they resigned him because he opted out. And you'd have a situation where people would just have fun Watching them play basketball And if they made it to the playoffs and they were healthy, people would be like, oh my God, who's beating them in the seven gamame series if it was LeBron and AD and all of these guys together alsoso, if it broke down by March and everybody was hurt and There was nothing. noobody would really give a shit. People people people would literally look at this like Look how cool this is. And that's kind of the situation you almost want to be in if you're him. because He can't be the best guy on the Championship team anymore You can't be the second best guy on a Championship team I don't think LeBron James he probably can be the third best guy on a championship team, right this particular And look That's still Probably the best forty one, forty two year old guy we've ever seen That's still incredibly impressive. I think if you want to stress it, if you want to play until he was sixteen point of game LeBron, you could probably pay to about forty five or forty six if you wanted to. pressure of being that guy I don't think it's a part of the happiness component. I think the happiness component is Just let me hoop So I don't have to go into the basketball abyss because I'm not quite ready yet rereeed disagree You think he wants to win another ring. I think he wants to be competitive. he's an athlete. I don't think hes just wants to just go somewhere to keep playing. I do think that that's part of it. I do not think he's ready to retire for sure. But I believe within that he also wants to be on a team that is competitive. Absolutely. I think he wants to be on a team that has a chance to win the ring. I think he wants to be on the team that is relevant That and because and there' no such there's no such thing as an NBA team that is relevant and not competitive. So I getess always say the same thing. But what I don't think though is that LeBron James because if it was about winning a ring, LeBron James would say, Hey I'll come off the bench for the San Antonio Spurs Or LeBron James would say, I would I would come like he wouldn't have to come off the bench there. Well, I mean, he they just signed to buy his hair. So like like I don't he wouldn't he wouldn't necessarily have to come off the bench. but if it were just about I want to go and be a part of something where like I want to chase one last ring because can I be honest with you We can get off this The last arena he gets is not even going to matter We're on we're on LeBron watchatch. I'm really curious to see how this If LeBron out. Give me a teams right now before you get off this giveive me teams now Leron Jes go to winnerning So I mean Denver, Miami So, Miami's an option. I mean, yeah, do but we don't know what that looks like yet. If you go there, right? If you go to Miami, Miami is reconstructing a and they don't have a ton of money to spend. So if if you think that LeBron Jonis and Bam Bam and Wiggins, you at LeBron Janon? mayaybe Maybe they may but the same but the same time if you go there You are not the guy there. So this reign that you win is not even going to be viewed in the same way. This ring is for history is just another it's a Wikipedia stat. No one's going to care. This ring doesn't really I don't agree with this. Hold on If LeBron James goes and wins a ring as the in Miami. if LeBron James goes to Miami. or goes to any place where he's going to be the second or third best guy I could argue that that diminishes him in an argument with my. You can argue that on Golden State. If you if he goes to Golden State, right These rings that people get Robert Oy has seven rings or something like that, right? It's seven. Right. He' a song. He has seven rings, right when Robert Orey is having a conversation with Charles Barkcley The only thing those rings mean to Charles Barkley is that Robert Oy can look at Charles Barkley and go h, nanyoo. he can't compare Chles Barkle If LeBron James goes and goes and wins another ring. on a team where he's not the man I would suspect that people would be like, Jordan never had to do that like know like Jordan never had to like and' already different. L they already have different stories as far as their legacy because One was loyal to a team, One was one Ges from team to team. So like the story is already different. Nobody looks at LeBron like, o, he's that loyal player that stays with the team as they do with with Jordan. That's already different in that. I just think I think this is interesting. It's I disagree. I think that When you talk about somebody being culturally relevant, which is obvious LeBron, like you said, like hands down That still makes him the man on a team to me. So I feel like I could make an argument for him going to Miami. He's still like the man. The only problem with that is that the Lagers just told him to go ahead and leave. Well, that that's what you said. That's not what he said. No. That's what happened. So so what what this what happened LeBron James was also they're not in the conversation for winning a ring. LeBron James is He's the man culturally, right? But he wasn't the basketball guy. There's a lot in in the locker room with that. They clearly decided that they were moving on with Luca, which they would be Stupid not to Lucas twenty seven years old And like what Averaging thirty four, thirty points a game or whatever the fuck it was like leading the league and score in first team all NBA Lucas That's the guy that you want to continue, right? You want For'm sure he's the fure. Light he's the future. He's the now So Really? Yeah, they know. Like wherever you go, so LeBron legitimately just could not override Lukadones in L.A. If he goes to Miami He's a complimentary player the Jianest at to D Cpo If he goes to Denver, he's a complimentary player to Nicola Yokich. if he goes to San Antonio, he's a complimentary at least from a basketball standpoint From a cultural standpoint, he dwarfs all of those guys, which is why It's a precarious situation thing is everything that you just named about LeBron James chasing going around and chasing stuff Every time he went to the new place, He was the focal point of the place He went to Miami. It was let's build around The man in Miami took a backseat to LeBron. De Wayne Wade who was already there took a back seat to LeBron. Kyrie Irvin, who was already in Cleveland, took a backseat to LeBron Everybody that was already in Los Angeles took a back seat to LeBron for LeBron to go to a place now and take a back seat to win a championship. I'm sure he wants to compete, but He's now in a legacy Mandingo fight with Michael Jordan and that just don't help it that much I'm so interested to see. Yeah, I'm interested to see too because what's that? I'm interested to see What's the happiest place for him to hoop? for wanting to find happiness. I hope he finds it. I hope he gets it. Do you think it'sch neverever mind. No, no, no, ask me, please. Oh, no please, please. Be because we don't know this. And look, and everybody who has said this Remember this Once you done in the NBA, you done. Everybody that has this conversation, including myself has to understand it like You ain't never really seeing your face on the jumbo tron like that So Saying to somebody else who's been on the jumbble tryon who's held up the NVP award. ve been to the places. you ever see that video where LeBron' dancing And girl comes over to LeBron And LeBron does like he's basically snaps his finger tells his man like he tells his man, deal with this. Like Turning that off Everybody feels like Oh man, just lead a game Go be a dad and a husband and the tequila salesman and all of that stuff like that Cut the switch off. Your light switch and his light switch ain't the same. Yeah. whoo's saying that? Your light switch turns off kitchen in your living room. his light switch turns off Dorna. His light switch turns off the American Airlines arena. H shit turns off Madison Square Garden. It's tough to hit that motherfucking swet. Of course it is. So so like being that that's the case You know, what I was going to say is The other thing for happiness would be to find happiness off the basketball court. but it's clear that he's not quite ready to do that yet and people that criticize that I haven't had to make that. Oh, yeah, I don't understand people criticizing that. Do you have any thoughts on a Jalen Brown trade? You guys notice Wh's Bill Good Bill in here Like you have any thoughts on Jaylen Brown traade Not a whole lot. I mean, I guess I'm a little surprised of the trade I surprised some of the conversation, like you already alluded to it where it's like he's too smart or the analytics reports people are talking about, just like the conversation that is that people are allegedly having behind closed doors about Jayalen Brown almost to like a smear campaign A little surprising. But u You know, Bost is not, I mean, neither one of these are my teamh, but yeah, just Jllen Brown was traded to the fil. I saw I saw you'd have to tell two first two seconds. Yeah. I saw I saw that one. That was nice for that you were here able to capture that. Crazy trade. I waitited until taught of Thrones was over. But you knew the trade was a trade was coming. No. the trade had happened Fucking Chris didn't know No, no, I'm saying, but we knew that this was being talked about. Well, we knew that it was being talked about, but here's the deal They kept looking around the leee And it looked as if they were trying to say he didn't have like value. like all that conversation. that to me was more of the shock like Oh, he doesn't have value. Oh, he's this, he's this and And it's like, whyy are we on this whole smear campaign with Jayalen like this? Apparently that was right Apparently he didn't have much value because of what the actual trade was what They traded him for Paul George. ps. Yeah first But those first round picks are going to be Pilly's first round picks And Phy now is going to start presumably, always presumably because you never know what Jel and be. Philly's going start Joeln B, Tyrees Maxi, VJ Edgecom Uh Jalen Brown, like the heat That's going to be a strong team if healthy. If healthy Phillies are going to be the Phillies. The seventy sixers are going to as baseball baby. The seventy sixers are going to be a team that's going to compete at the very top of the east. So those first that you got ain't going to be shit. unless it goes terribly inhilly, unless and B pl get hurt then all of this shit gets fucked up and they can't win at all. them first ain't gonna be worth the mother fucking thing Right? So like those pigs are not they traded him Paul George thirty six year old Paul George. Paul George will play decently in the playoffs It's it's a historically bad traade It's like one of the Boston For Boston. Yeah. It's like one of the worst trades but they felt like they had to do it which tells you two things. One, they felt like they had to trade him. Yes. and two They didn't get a like good trade offers for him They didn't want to come off Hugo. They wouldn't want to would want to come off the Sireman to get Yonest, which seems fucking nuts, but Bill is one of these fucking crazy Hugo people. That then they get Hugo got start averaging forty quick L look Gzaasus aage for. It needs to happen quickly They didn't want to do that for Jannaent to the couoopa in Boston And everything that you heard, you heard Jayle and Brown might go Alanta, Jayel Brown I might to Portland, Jayen Brown might go to Houston Apparently None actually was twking None of it. So they made this. don't know why It doesnn't matter why I'm just saying it doesn't necessarily mean all the things people were saying were. No, it means that he didn't have a crazy market If didn't have a crazy market because the Nigaate thinks that he's smart or because If you guys are telling me right now, that's crazy. that Jayalen Brown didn't have a crazy trade market because He thinks he's too smart. It's like my dig all Like so look, Jamen Brown thought he was the smartest guy in the room. What the fuck But yeah, he's smart. like he went to cal. likeike he like, you know what I'm saying? Like he thinks If you're telling me he's some sort of asshole then that's one thing But yeah, I feel like that's what they were trying to say This is a. How how dare this big black buck? No, I'm with you. It's ridiculous. If's even that's why I'll call it a smear camping's like Oh, he's smart? This guy thinks he's this guy thinks he's you using these big words around us Jayen You're not supposed to use these words around us. Put the ball in the hole Nigger. Shut up and Drupple. Shut up andu like off his now, man Nigg's eclicic. He's an ecliced guy He's curious guy But I could tell you one thing when he looks across the lines and he sees somebody else that thinks they're as good as him. This is the thing about Jalen Brown That fuck would more than anyone Jaylen Brown sees somebody on the other side Jamen Browny his head goes Jayen Brown sees somebody on the other side Jay Brown goes Bet than me No, sir and Jen Bran And then Jaylen Brown locks up And then he goes crazy. Does it all person I would want on my team. The type of guy Jalen Brown locks up and Jalen Brown goes crazy. And advanced analytics might have his O off, all of that shit like that. I get it. But when it comes time to fucking compete Jalen Brown goes I know you don't think you better than Jalen Brown. And then he goes crazy. Jason Tatan didn't say anything for him. I tell you, man, life skins, b, you' It always comes back You were trying to work your way to it You just put you put your faith in them Th then you need something and you get traded for Paul George. Howope Pilly is Fantastic That That might be my new favorite team. Somebody tell Bill Your new fage is gone Why not That's how youre supposed to do it Why not? I't have I don't have a basketball team. I don't have a favorite team anymore M Y, it's not the maress anymore That's been Maax for a while. Why? They blew up my twenty eleventeen It's been a lot blew up the twenty eleven team. Yeah, the championship team. hasn' been the same. The team was so fortunate to get there? Doesn't matter. We did. Okaykay. we did. They won. I know And then it wasn't And then and then they everybody went their separ ways. That the same Championship teams. I know. so that might te Luca took it back to the finals, man, Gafford lively Al looka Curise would not have a favorite team? Until now. And now your team is Philly. You like Sixers. I'm coming back, you know Really isark. I used to be I used to be It's dark g. I used to be, you know, I had all the the AI stuff I'm back. I'm back. It's a full circle moment Philly Ph in Boston. hold on. Somet just dumbed on me. Oh Philly versus Boston is light skinned versus dark skined Animus. This is your dream. B Boston is team lightskin. Boston is Derek White and tatem And now they got Paul George, who's a red bone slash highigh yellow Right? They got rid of Jalen Brown and now Philly got the dark Knights Philly is the Dark Knights in the NBA. What Eco Maxi. MB. Fucking Jaylen, they are dark K knights, bro Da. the dream chases. Don't you love how in real time he's unlocked this and Th about this before I didn't think about this before Like they call Jalen Brant. They probably Jason Tatum, the front office probably ask him what he thought about. J and Browny, like kid Black ass Not done That's funny. I can't believe this mother fuck This is gonna take my team man. I' gonna ship them out. This is this is perfect time. I'm going to Philadelphia too next week. youast looking for Jayalen Brown. I'm going for the I'm going for the for the MLB All star weekend. I get jersey while I'm I'm telling you man. I'm back. I'm back. My brother's a die hard seventy six fan. I'm Ms M excited. Let's see if we can get Sar to answer the phone. Meetsu Let's see if we can get see our to answer Lets see we can get Chris run U If we get Chris Ry on the ph, I want to know what he thinks. Re Chris Ryan, Let's see. is he going to pick up Chris Pick up That's my guy. What's up? Chris. you're live on higher learning right now This is Chris Ryan You're live how learn. I want to ask you a question. What do you think about Philly versus Boston as a light skins versus dark skins. Hear me out So Boston hang up, Chris. Boston Boston has Tatem Hi, Chris. Boston has Tatum Boston has Derek White Now to have Paul George Think about Philly, y' dark knights HCom Maxi MB Uh Jalen Brown, what do you think? Light skins versus dark skins, What are your thoughts? Whatever you say, man. That's a smart man. That's a smart man. Okay real quick before you go Seven games series with the way the teams are currently constituted right now. Philly versus Boston what w I think Philelphia win. I think they would win too. and that's whys easer Rachel says that's her new team. She loves a Mandingo Come on in, the water's warm in Philadelphia. Oh shit, it's the fuck I'm talking about. Come on in it's warm. Hi Chris, peace you your brother. Bye. Is that a same silly. A lot of people st they like stay loyal to the teams that they're from You made from here Yeah, but I started I lived here for two years. And I am loyal. I lived here for two years when I was a kid and that's why I became a labor fan. I am loyal cowboys are that is. Yeah, I am quiet loyal for a say you got to be loyal Thank you Thank you. You got to be low. That's like fucking That's like being in a relationship with Jeffy Donon. I wonder how soon I can get my Jayalen Brown jersey You like that N. You know, O manages him, right Uh really? That's a Arunde client to Jalen Brown. I didn't know he had athletes. goodood for o, greatreat, I'll get tickets. Let's do some politics. All right, Kamala Harris. She is reportedly strengthening ties with mayayor Zora Mamdani as speculation grows about her potential presidential campaign There's also multiple reports that she has been meeting privately with other progressive leaders, activists, and people in the Democratic socialists of America as she worked to rebuild relationships within the Democratic Party We guys think about Ta here' is his strategy think she's running for real I m you're gonna try it. I think she going try it out. I mean, what she could have obviously been the govern She'd have lost everyone of California. I don't think she should have done governor. but well didn't she didn't want to governor. I think would have been a great thing for her to be the governor, but obviously didn't want that. So unless she is going to pivot to something else, it seems as if going to continue her career in public service and run for president. This tactic is really interesting tr. This made me feel like she's running more than ever. Before I was kind of like,, we're just kind of floating her name around because nobody else has really declared yet for some of the other front runners that we know will definitely throw their name in the hat theirir names in the hat. So I understood the conversation being around her, but this makes me think she's definitely running now Definitely And I think I think it's interesting too, not because of twenty twenty four because of what we talked about in the last podcast. You've got moderate Democrats putting up their letter, signing it, you know, talking about DSA and progressives in such an extreme way that doesn't unify the party and then Here comes the story with Kamala Harris reaching out, not being critical notot being, I think it's interesting. Not being critical, not joining on the side of some of the Democrats that are established buts reaching out and reaching out to Mum Dani, which again shows his power in all of this and having conversations with other Progressives. It's interesting takingly smart strategy by her If true, these are reports. But if true let me tell you why It's smart for her doubly to me. Number one gives her the opportunity at least rhetorically to Adress, begin to men U, Some of the mended hes, some of the wounds That existed? after she was part of an administration that underwrootad of genocide. And Kama herears or anyone that would come from that administration would have to peak directly to that and about that. Um Talking to Mamania at the DSA is not the way to do that. It's to engage with the people here and engage with people who are affected by this and have done this work And I'm sure I don't know anything about this, but if you were sincere about doing that, that's what you would do And there were mistakes that were made so Kamala Harris is going to have to remedy those things in order to get any type Oh I don't know credibility back on that particular issue. And so if she's talking to these people She's talking to this wing of the party Maybe perhaps That's a part of it That's part of H her want to do that as part of that Um, but also They're up. They're popular. They got momentum So from the standpoint, not just of politically But like, how are you guys doing what you're doing Like No one else from the center of the party seems to be willing to reach out and talk to you guys and make you a part of this so called big tent I will I might What advantages that can I glean from you guys And also what councsel from someone as politically successful as Kamala Harres, might you guys need there be some way of communicating that you guys are not? open to or Hven't haven't been that I can giveift to you And might there be something I learned from you guys, which to me in a true big tin is what would happen Well, and to add to that I also think that It puts her ahead of the competition So of course, people are initially going to one of the first seeds she planted with this and separating herself was in her book Right? She talks about Biden. He's a proud Zionist. She talks about how she maybe tried to talk to him, to get him to see Um the other side of it But he is he believes what he believes. she planted the seeds in the book This also puts her ahead of anybody. if she decides to run in twenty twenty eight, it puts her ahead of them because if people try to question her sincerity It would be too late if she waited u til closer to announcing she was going to run. The fact that she's doing it now, she can say for the reasons of the things you're saying. I'm seeing what's happening. I'm listening to the people, I'm watching this movement, I'm watching the energy. I'm learning from the past. got I started doing this. I was proactive in doing it. She could make an argument more than the people that are coming who might also run in the twenty twenty eight race, assuming she runs as well That's what I also think is smart by this. She'll be able to point to more of a sincerity in what she's doing rather than just it looking Totally like I'm just trying to win your vote Well And still people will think that regardless. but She's ahead of the competition. Number one This story, who reported this Who reported this? is Asos, right Well this comes from the post. I don't know who was a political. Who did the original reporting on this? Like you guys find that out. Ao Axioos has had a full breakdown of it. What just okay Here's the thing This story coming out is interesting too because this story coming out telling it's telling me Kamala Harris wanted people to know that she was doing this. one hundred percent. Right. So the fact that she wanted people to know that she was doing this means L This in and of itself is a political move. She's courting The DSA. She's courting Mamani. She's seeking at least by with her name and her reputation and her standing the center of the party, which She's in pretty good standing or has been in the past She's seeking to legitimize them or with that group of people, right? That's why I'm saying as opposed to the headlines we were talking about earlier this week. Right. so number one This could be a a thawing of the relationship between the DSA and the center of the partarty, which I don't think it's going to be because once again, I believe that fight to be existential for the center of the partarty. The any lefte Le of center organization or left of center political momentum Once again, I've already said it just destroys the center of the party because they no longer will look serious Like they just won't look serious anymore. You won't look serious taking corporate money. You won't look serious Uwriting the g side. You won't look serious ' saying we're for health care for all, but we're not really willing to fight for it. Like it won't look serious anymore if people believe that there's a cohort to your left that is serious. You just won't look serious. Then your donations dry up Then your power dries up, then you either have to become them or become something else. That's an existential fight Kamala Harris doing this is very interesting because She's either saying we don't have to have that fight. Yeah, or she's saying she's willing to fight to the left of where she was before which would be a really interesting development if that happened. I don't think it's possible I don't think it's possible. I mean, in twenty twenty, when she ran, Axio first reported, which means it was definitely leaked. Yeah. when she first ran The first time She was more left of where she was under Biden So you know, because I remember it was all, she's flip flopping. Which one is she? whichich one is she? So if she's leaned through that, it's almost going back to kind of how she originally started this when she ran for president the first time Kamala Harris in her own campaign the opportunity either distance herself from some of the stuff that was going on or tell or make the case to America she would have done things differently. Yeah. A lot of times she neglected to do that was the moment. But I will say this though. and doesn't really take it back in the book. I keep going. I will say this though Doing that while being the vice president of the United States is for Cerries Do that while being an active part of the administration, notot saying you would do things differently. She should answer that question better But being a critic of the administration publicly while inside of the administration, I'm going to admit that that's a tough situation for. Of course, but I think there was a way to answer it where you don't shit on Biden, but also recognize that you are two different people at the end of the day. think thought about that more. o Barack Obama I was talking a little bit about Slave times George Watton st. Did you see this? Yeah, he did an interview with MS now and talked about the complexities and contradictions in history and had this to say about George Washington? And I think sometimes we get confused in thinking that U These two stories are U completely separate They're intertwined. Right?? And which is why it's possible for me to be a great admirer of George Washington and also acknowledge he was a slave holder. and that does not negate His greatness, it simply acknowledges that there's a profound deep flaw in You these founding fathers who were also geniuses and gave us these tools. and which is true of all of us, right? It's true of every president. We're this mixed bang. We got contradictions and embody the country's contradictions you're disappoed I'm not gonna get rage about it. It's just more of like The softness softness in the way we're talking about it.. You know. A lot of people didn't like what I had to say the last time I talked about someone from that family and how it was a little bit Obama. Yeah, and how it was a little bit M It was a little soft in the in the phrasing I would like to think that he misspoke when he said great admirer. I would like to think that that's not the word that he meant to use because I guess for me, the question then becomes what does it mean to admire someone And how was Then also, how was the greatness of George Washington established. What did he have to do to become great Who did he have to overpower? Who did he have to enslave? Who did he have to torture in order to build his greatness B did he literally have to? whip and stand on in order to build the greatness that we talk about now You can't separate that You can say factual things and recognize them. He was our first president. He fought in the revolutionary War. He was a great a general. He was, you know, a part of laying the law and You know, found as a founding father, those are true things But to say you admire someone means you revere them. You have deep respect for the things they did for what they value, for their morals And so to me Again, we talk about there's a way to say things and there's a way not to say things You know, you can't separate the fact that beforefore he was the president of the United States, he was the president of the Constitution Convention, which established that people with three fifths of person. R for taxing and Um counting the population in order to establish like the House of Representatives anduff like that and how people are represented in different states He was a part of that. He presided over that. You can't separate that. I'm never going to call that person and admirer. And you can go down a number of list of things in order he did to protect his wealth to protect his property and I'm not talking about his house or his land. I'm talking about slaves. thingsings that he established with his power as president in order to keep black people in their place So he could be That is not somebody you can call and admire And there's aaway, being redundant to talk about what George Washington did and separate that as something that you look up to I'm going Well said I'm going talk a little bit about George Washington in one specific case here in the second. But before I do You realize they might be So Obama's one of them President No, no, no, no. Obama, Yeahah, he's a president. This is uncomfortable for us to do. And I get that people What do you mean one of them? Who's them? Okay, so let me, let me tell, let me give him example. So we just got through talking about like Lebron James and all these And sometimes the the thing that I was trying to like articulate too many words as always. b LeBron James is that LeBron James retiring from his job is not exactly the same as the rest of us retiring sometimes from our jobs. Sometimes we do our jobs longer If you've been someplace And thirty thousand people have been screaming your name Like it's it's like it's that's a thing. like that these guys you have to go from being King whatever. to do every single night in and night out, all of that stuff is tough, right? And The reason why I say that sometimes it's like I want people to remember that when we're putting these frameworks on people that they're not us I'm not saying that they're better. I'm saying it's different. L that's a specific culture and that's a specific thing and that's its own thing that you have to turn off Obama iss one of them. Obama admires likeike George Washington, off course he does. off course he admires him He is in the for he's way more George Washington than he is Vanner O Rachel was not even close Oh Oh, Rachel, like way more. like he's way more George Washington than he is me or you or anybody in this room. And he would have to be because he became the president of the United States of America. He would have to be. Do you understand the life of service that Barack Obama has led You understand that Barack Obama, someone, I think this is actually to me, it's interesting because criticism Barack Obama that comes from the right. is inverse of the criticism that comes from him from the left in an interesting way. The people on the right believe about Obama the same thing that you actually believe. a little bit if I'm reading youite? They believe that he couldn't possibly be One of them that he couldn't possibly be or have the love or the belief in America and country most people like Obama are assumed to have in order to get where they go And we're hoping that that's actually not true. and then they're saying that it can't be true But the reality is it is true The reality is is the belief in America that George W. Bush had to have, the structures and the systems of America, that George W. Bush had to have, that Ronald Reagan had to have, that Bill Clinton had to have, that all of these people have that we criticize all the time, Obama has them So when like when you when you're asking Obama about an American president Obama's going to go, yeah, look at that guy's a genius. A lot of the frameworks of the country and the precedents And No that America's belief in the rule of law America's belief in or it's Supposed belief adherence to the rule of law and to the Constitution All of that stuff. thoseose are things that are probably deeply and profoundly important. Barack Obama, right and When we talk about those things, we're normally talking about them criticalpint Lw rights we didn't get, laws that don't work for us People who believe in that. They look at the brilliance and the operating efficiency. of that system And they go, I think I can make it better But the first thing you have to do is kind of submit to it And so when I'm listening to him talk about George Washington Um I'm listening to him. I'm listening to a guy that's in the club talk about someomebody Tal to somebody who's out of the club about somebody else who's in it. Like, you know like within your friend group You got people within your friend group that other people don't like and they criticize those people. But they're one of you. So there's a way that you talk about them. Obama is defending not just George Washington's identity He's defending his own. because Just to be real he had to JSOC people. extrajudicial killings. terrorist tart he had to do some of that stuff Some of the stuff that a president has to do Some of that stuff that a president that he feels like a president has to do that you have to be involved in it, he had to Like like not slavery stuff At some point somewhere A group of people were sitting in a house And There was a guy in that house that was a terrorist or a suspected terrorist And Obama dropped the fucking bamba on their head and killed everybody that was in that motherfucker the children too And Th are decisions once again, just like I don't have I don't I can't make the dec. I can't tell people that It's easy to make the decision to leave NBA basketball, I can't believe I'm comparing these things. I also can't tell people what types of decisions have to be made And M in protion of national security in the interest, should I say, of national security Like I'm not going to act like I can sit back in Monday morning quarterback. going in I can tell you that those things are against my morals and my values and I wouldn't want to do them I'm not the president And I don't know that I believe in the American system enough even to be involved in that type of thing. I believe in a different system I believe in something that could be rather than necessarily something that is. and that's this has to do with the question I'm going to ask you later. But like This is like One of his guys Like this like legitimately People would say there's no possible way a guy that looks like Obama has experience Obama can believe in America enough to be president. And then we're hoping that he doesn't The fact of the matter is doeses now he always did. This is another frustration that we have when we're talking to our friends that are deeper into this Like obviously some of the people that we've had on this like a conversation between me and Bakari is interesting. Bakari is like with me and Bari were talking one time And we were talking about America's interest in the Middle East And I was like, I don't give a fuck about America's m interest in the Middleast. I don't fucking care about America's interest in the Middle East Cari is somebody who The framework of his mind, right is a political person, So he thinks that America being strong in the Middle East is better for Americans in other places He doesn't believe that because he's cynical or because he's a warmonger of some sort. He believes that because that's a part of his framework as being somebody that's involved in that type of stuff So when I know that I'm talking to him, just like I know that when I'm talking to people that are to the left of me. They go Let's burn everything down and live on a commute They will like like let's let's control the means of And I'm like, hey, you know I'm not quite there yet I realize that I'm not even them But I definitely know I'm not Obama. So when he says that I always go, h. How will people respond to that? But he didn'tiss misspoke. I think he was being Very, very genuine I I think he's more like George Washington than he is I think that I understand your point in the sense that I think that there's a commonality, I think there is a commonality that they have as being presidents that they share and that makes them there's a similarity there. thingsings that a president has to do in order for country or constituents or you would think that they have to do I'm talking about George Washington on what he was doing also personally for himself, laws that he was making that would benefit himself personally Um like The fugitive. Let's talk about Let me ask a question. But how many people have you killed for political reasons? No,, no. again, that's why I said I believe there's a commonality. obbviously the answer is zero, but I'm saying there's a commonality with him as a president thingsings that that you end up doing or that that are a part of being a president, like that that happen, right which is what your point is when you're asking me how many people that I've killed whatever you just said. But But I but what the difference I would say, which is why I don't say he's more like them than me is because of his lived experience person and this is what I believe Say what you want, We can agree to disagree. I'm just not agreeing with the more George Washington. we can agree to disagree and I know we will. I'm just saying that I also look at people what I believe to be their intentions and their motivations for doing something. And to me, George Washington and Barack Obama are never going to be motivated by the same things because of their different lived experiences to run for political office. That is my opinion. We can agree to disagree A couple of things Barack Obama's even lived experience as a black person is different than. Well, everybody's black. 'causeuse right, because we're not a monolith.. I'm biracial. Of course, Of course. assuming commonality because of it though. So so so what what I'm saying is when I'm say because of how he identifies Right Yeah. So we're saying that so it it's interesting kind of Sometimes what we do is we say, hey, his experience must make him closer to mine, but I understand that his experience is different to mine. I' also listen to how he expresses himself, but yes, like how he represents himself. And which is why what I said? No, no, no. I said I was like, I would like to think he misspoke. That's what I said, But he said it, right? He called him a great admirer, and then he talked about his greatness. He said it twice. That's just me saying, I wish I said that. I said, I would like to think that. And then I go on to talk about how problematic it is. But I think that to your point, it is because of the commonality that they have as being presidents and what that requires and things that you have to do and execute I am saying when you say, but he is more likeike in general like him than me is where I disagree with you. That's what I'm saying. So so just so we all know He said that He said all presidents wear a mixed bag. He said, all presidents, we have to do things. we have to he, he said that He said we was came in George Washington. So when I say So when I say that he's more like George Washington than he is like us I'm not talking about like, you know, the fact that he know Al Green Lyrs or the fact that he went to a black church or anything like that. I'm talking about two things. Number one D. the The fortitude of his belief in country He probably has. more in common with George Washington than he does with me If he would have to have that That would be it would be Almost malpractice for a president not to have that. Yeah a politician. Youd have to be U, but particularly one that achieves what you have to be died in the wool Gant it Patriot. People don't want to believe that Barack Obama is for sure. R. But he definitely is All this stuff he says B all that stuff I believe it. There are also some things. in Obama's u History That's a justest. He is to the left of a lot of these guys and he's and there were some things like that That even suggested that Barack Obama went to take a different relationship or a different tenor O even something like Israel that other American presidents did, right? But he didn't L at the end of the day, He like, he didn't And so when I say he's more like George Washington than he is like us, I'm not talking about like on race or anything like that, like or even in his personal life, I'm talking about the fact that gets down. Obama in that clip is trying to convince us to have some compassion for George Washington. You think compassion? Nuance to at the least Nuance at the least compassion. He's well I mean, he's taking it up for his guy He is am I tripping? He's both siding it is how I took it. I don't because he's like, yeah, we can acknowledge, which is why the right had something to say about that comment, tootally different. and then We're saying something different about it. The right was mad. They felt like he was smearing the like two people heard a statement or two groups of people heard a statement and took two different interpretations. This iss why I say you both sided it because they think that he was smearing the founding fathers by mentioning the fact that you can recognize that they're slave holders and we're looking at it like how the hell are you going to say that we should have admire George Washington. So I think I wouldn't say compassion. I feel like he politicked. He both sided it. And the reason And I think that's a problem. And the reason why is because they think Pase One of them We think He's one of us And really, he's one of them He is part of a class that those people aren't a part of He's part of a class that we're not a part of Yeah. he's part of a class that is very specific that we continue to try to identify with. We continue to see our morals and our values and our cultural norms in this particular class thoseose particular class of people Barack Obama hang out with George W. Bush He's he has a Barack Obama had Barack Obama and his family have a fuzzy relationship with George W. Bush I blame George W. Bush for the death of thousands of black people I don't want to be around Judgial abuse My job that I lost at TMZ, I lost that job at TMZ becausecause I got an argument. peopleople treating George W. Bush with furry, fuzzy, whatever. Ellen Degeneres. Yeah. And then everybody was telling me I was tripping. I got mad and flash the fuck off Lost my job. in front of the but verbally under your airort then N nothing happen on that want we want to be very clear verbally verbally flash the fuck off. They smear me. Yeah. They smear me. But at the same time If Barack Obama hasn't a president problem He might call it ex president Like he might be with an ex president. He understands he is one of those guys. Wh would Wh would he call Which president could he call that wouldn't, you know what I mean? Like who's Well, thiss my point. My point is like my point is and you know, we belabor it, I'll get to what I was talking about. but my point is, I just thought we got an interesting three. It's like, yeah, We Obviously we agree, we can agree to disagree, but like I feel like in our sort of inability to sometimes understand that That actually leads to arguments like we had like last week or the week before with everyone around Crocket or Talo Rico or anything like that. like we start having conversations where we count people as part of our cohort because they look like us and because we have a connection to them when the reality of that situation in that clip that we just watched Obama was talking about slavery Two black people remember Obama is also not So we know to my knowledge descendant of enslaved people. Okaykay? But like just Obama is talking about that two black people and with George Washington, I'm not chiding him for it I'm saying he's talking with George Washington on that. Yes. I will just the only thing I will say is in relation to our conversations that we had before and how people need to start talking about it, it would be different if I looked at that and I was like, he clearly misspoke and I left it there I can look I can listen to that that that interview and how he spoke And not be afraid to say he was wrong And that to me is a conversation that sometimes and we talk about this, that we are not having. We have to be able to call out things that are problematic and not say, well, I have to put I can't say that because of the way that they look or we have to be able to to listen to the gravity or the weight of what somebody is saying and how it can impact us rather than focusing just on who's saying it If that makes sense. It that m sense. All right, I just w want to say one thing before we move off this because I was gonna do a whole thing B about that Okay, so George Washington Now you should mention this stuff. Lo slavery And I don't wan to hear that narrative that at the end of his life, he changed his mind. I cannot fucking stand that. Like George Washington loves slavery. L slavery He was a big big, big fan of slavery. Like he liked it and the life of one woman is indicative of this. Now our audience is like super duper smart Eeducated and smart. So even like a lot of the hay shit, Nichgols was like, man, they' putting us on shit actually saw a lot of people that wrote me that we're really grateful for your breakdown. Areciate. And at least even for the acknowledgement of it, even if they understood it, it was the acknowledgement and taking the time to do it. So continue There is one story Oh One Black woman That is indicative of just how far George Washington went slavery name is I wantna judge She was Martha Washington's personal assistant personal attended. She's a skilled seamstress. She grew up at Mount Vernon. She grew up there, basically raised inside of the household Washingon became president, he relocated to Philadelphia and he brings his enslaved people with him. Now This next thing is one of the is one of my favorite George Washington tidbits Okay Pennsylvania law att the time said that Six months of residency meant automatic freedom So Pennsylvania was trying to get rid of slavery. There wass a lot of northern states that were passing stuff that were trying to limit slavery So if you stayed in Pennsylvania For six months, you got freedom automatically that passed that law. Washington moves from he moves from Washington to Pennsylvania. Okay, cool. He knew that. Washington and his people knew that. So while he's President of the country He's shuffling his slaves out of state lines every six months. So Washington would take some of the slaves on a trip Below The Mason Dixon line. or whereatever to reset the clock on their slavery then bring them back. loved slavery loveoved them is a premeditated act continuously hold on to the institution of slavery In seventeen ninety six Oer figures out that she's being given away as a wedding present to Marars Washingon's gnduer. And this woman was apparently like cruel, she was mean She was like a lady thatashingon on the judge didn't want to go work for Um, So while of Washingtons are sitting down at dinner sca. She on a judge left and disappeared out of the front door She disappeared into what was Philadelphia's free black network catches a boat to New Hampshire Uh without telling anyone. It's like just she just Boom, gone. No secondeary plan, no nothing like that. She's out of here Um that in that case, George Washington champion of freedom and liberty, would be like, hey, we lost one Like you can't You know, slaves is basasically like Pokemon to him And had hundreds, by the way. We going catch ' them all including her He uses the government So hunt her down You guys think I'd be making this this type of shit up. He did I know that our audience knows a lot of this, but I'm just reiterating when we talk about George Washington. He sends an agent after her. He sends her nephew after her She is like legitimately living a life if there was any type of we would have been got Kary Washington in this role if we were thinking if we couldn't If we could tell the truth about our fing fathers She is asked by people on the street If you are in fact this woman that the president is looking for, she says no. Um But she's telling people also around her that she would rather give her life than to go back and work or Washington H The president himself was using federal resources was using his power, his cultural power to pursue A twenty a twenty two year old woman He dies in seventeen ninety nine. She's still legally his property She's a fugitive for the rest of her life. She's considered a fuitive. never legally free and just not caught She marries a black sailor, has three kids uh, and lives in poverty, in New Hampshire dies free in eighteen forty nine after fifty years on the run from the president. of the United States of America, obviously wasn't president that entire time,. But she lives a life in secret basically in hiding, trying to outrun The clutches of George Washington So When we talk about these guys being products of their time They weren just products of it, guys They were believers in it. They created it. They were believers in it. They believed in it. They believed in it. like I could go into a whole situation about Jefferson. Jefferson was a product of the Enlightenment. So all of the people that had come before Jefferson talkal about the natural rights of man and all of that stuff. Jefferson actually as a private lawyer defefended a couple of people, deffended a couple of freedmen, right? question that you should always ask the people that orr Supposedly your allies is notot whether or not They believe in something but whether or not they're willing to pay for it Like what does it cost you? You believe in the freedom of men But what if it cost you your slaves What if it costs you economically? Are you willing to play the cost of freedom for somebody else? Yeah. And these guys We're not going to do that. because That's not what they believed in. They didn't believe in that. They didn't believe in any of that stuff And so they're legitimately lives that are on the other side of that, of course, we know about Sally Hemming's life raped by Thomas Jefferson For however, you guys call it the greatest love story of your time or whatever I just know that Tomas Jefferson allowed his children to live in slavery So he couldn't upered that much Right So so like so all of this stuff and that's I know you guys know that, but all of this stuff when we're talking about this, we're not talking about these things are both grand, but they're also like quaint. They're also like specific. There's also There's like There's viscera there. There's stuff that gets on you There's all kinds of stuff around that. It's gritty It's real This ist in no way to k Obama's nuts Like I happen to I'm still comforted by the site of Barack Obama, and I probably always will be comforted by the side of Barack Obama. But I'm not a fool I'm not and this's not I'm not a fool We disagree and I and I think you made a very, very compelling place case I'll end on this Do you know who I? Do you know Brian Scalibrani is Brian Scalabrini is this gigantic white person who used to play for the Boston Celtics. Okay. And he became kind of a meme Like, he became kind of a meme. evenven though he played for the Celtics for a long time. Scalabrini actually like Brian Scalabrini. He would do this thing where he would play Ginger, Yeah. Brian Scalabrini.amba. Wh White mamba they called him, yeah. Okay. Scalabrini would do this thing where he would play random guys that would talk shit about him because He did have the most successful NBA career, right U and what he would tell those guys as he would say, I'm closer to LeBron. than you are to me And then he would play them. And he would prove I don't give fuck how nice you think you are It's a different type of nice. in NBA Barack Obama is closer to George Washington. That's what you want to h on, gohead. Barack Obama is closer to George Washington than he is to me. Okay We just just everybody me and Rachel disagreed, so don' don't put it on her. They won't when y'all they might But they might agree with you. This summer, Fanou is the best place to bet on goals. Including equalizers. Uhuh vollies? Yep, headters. Every goal is worth more on fanool. So let there be goals. New customers get up to one thousand dollars in bet reset tokens when you bet five dollars five daily ty one plus present select states, of required, reffund issued is non withraw of bus betets that expire seven days after receiv. M minimum five dollar wage are required for five consecutive days, Max refund two hundred dollars per day. restestrictions apply, including token expiration, seaful terms at Vendual dot com slash spportsbook. Gambling problem callall one eight hundred gambler or one eight hundred My Ret. All news Sundays at nine exclusively on AMC and AMC plus start. An Ris' of Mortal Universe comes what Vulture calls the most momentous event in fictional rock history. Thousands of fans. I want millions Smider This is the Fampireless Dot, all new Sundays at nine exclusively on AMC and AMC pllus stream now. You, But they might agree with you. don't put it on her. Okay, let's take a break real quick All right guys, we have We have some why has coming in is going to talk to us a little bit about Con laaw Lgal Eagle situation and the Supreme Court and all that kind of stuff U Her name is Marine Edibore And she's going to be on the podcast. We also want to talk about how she speaks about how learning in the streets Okay, the Supreme Court is back up to their old tricks And they're all tricks O Giving out decisions. What do you call it? What do you call it? rendering a decision? 'causeuse it's a verdict when theupreme Court does it. What is it?ot a verdict. What is it called? It's decision. It's decision. Supreme court decision I am One of their main ops and haters Rachel loves the Supreme Court. but we wanted to get somebody on to help us make sense these decisions. So we brought on Marureen Edibor who is with the Brennan Center for Justice and Assistant, prorofessor of laaw at Washington and Lee University School of Law. Teaches in rights about constitutional law, voting and elections, was the policy director and counsel for the Cgressional Black She joins us on higher learearning today to help us understand these verdicts slash decisions, slash whatever Maureen, thank you for joining us It's really good to be here. Thankks for having me. Yeah, an interesting time to be a constitutional law professor. I say this all the time. I cannot imagine being in law school right now with everything that seems to be coming down from the Supreme Court. I'm going start with birthright citizenship becausecause although You know, we knew this decision was coming. It's that time of year where we get some of our most controversial decisions before the Supreme Court takes off And Majority people thought Okay, there the Supreme Court will decide will uphold the Constitution when it comes to birthright citizenship But A lot of people were surprised how close the margins were. Starting there. I mean, It's six three, but technically I guess if you look at what was written when you take what Justice Kavanaugh put in there, it really is kind of five four. to you do the slim margin say this decision about where the court is today. That's a great, great starting question, Rachel and I appreciate it because I've been reading a lot of news about the Supreme Court's birthright citizenship decision and many people are praising the court. They're proud of the court for doing the right thing. but When you dig a little deeper into the reasoning and you read the majority and then read The dessents Something really troubling comes to the fore And it's that, you know, the court might have done the right thing in this instance But The dissents are setting up the Republicans effectively to create policy around limiting birthrightright citizenship to people who are legal permanent residents or people who have some sort of like legal right to be here in a way that is completely contradictory to the purposes and intentions of the fourteenth Amendment. Most troublingly, you know, there are clips going around about Justice Thomas walking through, you know, the Ray Burn House offffice building. Supposedly you might have been meeting with some people or maybe he was just taking an afternoon walk But the questions that come to my mind after seeing that clip In reading his dissent is that he's making an argument that the fourteenth Amendment's birth citizenship provisions are really race conscious and they were for the reconstruction moment. They were only for the children of the enslaved and for the enslaved to become citizens. and you, we've stretched birthright citizenship beyond what it was you intended for. and that is actually just a fiction, It's complete fiction and it's preposterous. I mean, You could go back to eighteen fifty five predating the fourteenth Amendment. and you would find that, you know, for example, in Massachusetts, there was an impoverished Irish mother. She was a citizen of Ireland. She came to the United States. She had a child here. Massachusetts deported her There was wild massive outcry. You know, the concept of birthright citizenship predates the United States Constitution predates the creation of the United States. It's something that colonists, you carried with them across the Atlantic as they came to the United States from the British. In many senses, the fourteenth Amendment is a codification, a constitutionalization, I guess, of ideas that Americans already understood to be sort of natural. You're citizen of the place in which you were born. So the revigionist history surrounding the majority opinion, which is like almost the shortest part of the sort of the entire thing, it's troubling. And I think it points to policy that will continue to attack naturalized citizens, continue to sort of try to strip citizenship rights from people who should have them. And even more, the fourteenth Amendment was, you know, was enacted to take out of politics, this idea that you know, the wins of politics can determine whether you're a citizen or not That is something that the framers of the fourteenth Amendment did not want to happen. They wanted to take it out of legislative hands. And so yeah, I guess it's a win. we should celebrate. we should be happy, you know, but There's something troubling underneath it all Yeah, it's it's I feel like a lot with this court in particular when you look at the dissents, I'll say from the conservative right leaning side. you get a lot of insight into how they really feel and almost as if it feels like a roadmap other people to say, okay, we lost here. Now I'm going to challenge for this reason because this is what the court is thinking. Kavanaugh kind of like talks about the fourteenth Amendment one way, but then talks about it. and maybe you can explain this a little bit almost as if like, well, Congress could make policy. you kind of touched on it a little bit. He alludes to Congress could make policy to change some of that. then also this call out from about Clarence Thomas in regards to Justice Brown Katanji Brown Jackson, where she's saying he uses race when he's always talked about a colorblind cononstitution, but in his dissent, he uses race in order to talk against the fourourteenth Amendment and the protections that it provides. Can you talk a little bit about that and the contradiction in that Yeah. I mean, I think Justice Thomas wants to have it both ways If you recall the students for Faredmissions decision, he wrote something that was really vying to be the main dissent in which he argued that the Civil Rights Act, the Friedman's Bureau Acts, they were all actually race neutral And they were race neutral because they promised you the formerly enslaved, they promised bllack Americans the same rights that white Americans had at the time. And for that reason, it applied to everyone equally. And even more, there were white refugees who benefited from the Friedman's Bureau Acts, et cetera, et cetera. Three years later, we're reading a different history from Justice Thomas You know, it's really confounding. It almost points to a sort of conclusion driven law office politics, right? Eact that the reconstruction statutes were race conscious or were they race neutral. The vast majority of academics argue that they were race conscious So perhaps in this sense, Justice Thomas got it right in arguing that it's race conscious, but it's very troubling the way in which he contradicts himself and his position on the particular statutes in the Reconstruction era that were really drafted and aimed to help the formerly enslaved Um Do you read this as the court? leaving it open for Congress, the president, whomever to make policies surroundingir birthright citizenship been They can rule if constitutionally challenged. Does it Um violate the fourourteenth Amendment, Like was there almost some instruction given that, hey, We're saying that this is ironclad in this regard, but there are things that you could do to still stem the tide or restrict citizenship that wouldn't be in violation of this amendment. Is that too cynical It's not too cynical. And in fact, I was just listening to something earlier this morning from like moderates regarding the fact that you know There are maybe some open questions regarding whether Congress could pass a law that says, you know, to obtain birth right citizenship, you must be, you know domas heed with the intention to stay here, like adding some sort of definition to what it means to be a natural born citizen so far as the parent's status. How would they do You know Cand. I mean, perhaps they would just write legislation, right? but also You know, going back to elementary school, Congress can't really override the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court has reaffirmed that time and time again. So you know, perhaps it's really a battle between the Supreme Court and Congress, like we saw with the Voting Rights Act and what section two means. Perhaps like that's the next iteration of this, but ultimately The final arbiter of the Constitution is the Supreme Court. It's not, you know, the Republicans in the House of Representatives in the Senate And if the founders wanted to add a domicile restriction to the citizenship cllause, they would have done that They had every opportunity. They were really smart people. The Republicans loved talking about the founders. Immigration was a thing at the time that the Constitution was being written. Certainly were the Reconstruction amendments. so It would be interesting to see how the court would deal with legislation like that, but it seems to me that at least symbolically, like we probably will see attempts at legislation to cabin the meaning of what birth great citizenship means Can you? Oh, go ahead No right. Can you explain you mentioned domicile. Can you explain a little bit of what because Justice Alito kind of talks about this subject to the jurisdiction of versus domicile in his dissent and almost saying how well, he says that this is a serious mistake on behalf of the court and talks about this versus this. Can you talk a little bit about and explain that because that's kind of an argument that's being used towards peopleople having dual citizenship or even birth tourism as we've seen the far right use as well. Can you speak to the difference between the subject of jurisdiction of and domicile Yeah, I mean, so the concept of birthrightright citizenship comes from like a Latin term meaning the Latin term is you solely, meaning the right of the soil. So if you are born in a certain place and there's a certain person in charge of the place that you are born, a certain nation, you are a citizen of that nation, regardless of if you want to leave, stay, whatever But Justice Alito is really trying to play some semantic games as well as some make legal arguments that suggest that you know if you come here on a temporary visa, a visitor's visa, and you're pregnant and you just so happen to have a child. But you know, you got a plane ticket back. like in what sense, you know, are you subject to the jurisdiction of the United States states necessarily. I think it's a weak argument and I'm now and sort of trying to explain it sort of helping me understand how weak it is. but There is something to this idea that if you don't have the intention to stay, right? if you don't have any kind of like legal recognition in the United States, perhaps it's appropriate using the words of the Constitution to render the child do you have here the citizen of the place you came from because you had an intent to go back But again, that's a really weak argument. It's an argument that goes against common law. It's an argument that goes against the understandings and the history and tradition and practice of people in the United States going back to colonization. It's an argument that, you know the British crown would have rejected. It's not a strong argument. The words domicile, legal permanent resident, parent, whatever. That's not in the fourteenth Amendment Again, the people who wrote it were relatively smart So if they intended for that to be the meaning of the fourteenth Amendment, it would have been. but it's not I mean before we get to some broader questions about the Supreme Court, what else happened that was of note that you feel like people aren't paying enough attention to. So the birthrights citizenship thing was the headline But there were other decisions rendered as well that felt like losses in terms of a progressive cultural society. Where are some of the other decisions that you feel like people need to be paying attention to Yeah. I think the campaign finance decision is something that people should pay attention to. I mean, we're all having this conversation about the two party system, how inadequate it is. How Democrats don't feel like the party's listening to them, how people are experiencing representational misalignment, which is this idea that the person who represents you is not acting in your favor. They're not voting in your favor. You do not feel represented by them. And even more, I don't know if you all seen this graphic from the Pew Research Center going around that lists all of the political typologies And you see like there's not even a plurality on the left or on the right. You've got like the tuned out right, you've got the religious right, you have the unconventional right. you have the left is left R, You've got so many offshoots of both parties. And so going back to the campaign finance decision, what it does is embolden political parties to take a lot of money from billionaires that can't donate directly to candidates because of existing candidate contribution limits that are very low. thousand five hundred dollars as opposed to forty four thousand that you can donate to a party. So would you eliminate the coordination limits, which allows the party to coordinate with the candidate in terms of directing where the money will be spent, you know, the ads, the neighborhoods you're going like leaflet in, all of that stuff. When a billionaire can circumvent the candidate contribution limit You're effectively creating a system where the Democrats and the Republicans will solicit funds from billionaires and trillionaires. and those billionaires and trillionaires will say, Hey, I just wrote you a really nice forty four thousand dollars check. L can you get coffee to talk about it? And maybe in the coffee they'll say, I really like Tero Rico I really, really like Talor Rico. Can you carry that message to, you know, the leader of the DNC? And so know that money will then be spent tos that candidate and that candidate will then likely feel some sort of obligation towards the interests of the corporation or the billionaire. So the Supreme Court is emboldening political parties against a backdrop in which people do not believe in them. peopleeople do not align with the main tenets of either party and increasingly we're supporting fringed candidates from fringe parties that don't necessarily have platforms. So it's deeply troubling in that respect. And you know, another thing I'll say about this is The campaign finance case actually started with a challenge by JD Vance. JD Vance challenged the coordinated spending limits between the party and the candidate Um, and In recent news cycles, Jadie Vance has said, you know, Watergate wouldn't have lasted two hours, you know, in today's news cycle. Well, campaign finance laws came from Watergate. They came from Watergate because in the course of the investigation, Congress found that Nixon said to the dairy lobby to the dairy manufacturers basasically that unless you give money to my reelection campaign, I will not support increased subsidies subsidies for dairy. In discovering that, you know, Congress said we can have this kind of quid pro quo, this kind of pay pay to play. you know, we should criminalize this. and that's the origin of coordinated spending limits. And so there is great irony in you know in JD Vance making those remarks and the Supreme Court emboldening political parties in the way that they have now. I guess like one last thing I'll say about that is My initial thought on the campaign finance case was who cares if the party coordinates with the candidate? You know what I mean? They're doing it already It's not a big deal. Perhaps this will just make it easier for parties to support the candidates that they like and that they want But I thought Todd Akin, right? Like I don't know you all remember Todd Aken, the candidate from Mississippi. The Mississippi Senate. He made a crazy comment about like legitimate rape. and that did a lot of damage to the Republican's brand and many leaders wanted him to Drop out of the race. withithdraw from the race Those sorts of controversies raise, I think, very legitimate questions about whether parties ought to have more control over their candidates and whether campaign finance laws should support greater control, such that candidates can't necessarily go rogue with party money, like Todd Aiken did. But there's also a flip side of that that's really troubling. So I think People should think really carefully about that decision and perhaps read it themselves instead of sort of like falling into the camp of, oh, I like support the Republican side, I support the Democratic side. There's so much nuance here. And I think the bottom line is We are embolding corporate interests, embolding millionaires and billionaires like Peter Thal, for example, to bank roll candidates who will not do what the voters in their jurisdiction want. And it won't matter because they'll win real election anyway, likely based on the money that's being spent on the campaign Um The Supreme Court U upholds the bans on transgender athletes in girls and women's sports not shocking coming from this court, especially from other cases that have been in front of them and how that they've responded in their opinions I saw some talk about that these cases should not have even been brought. And I think one of the not think I know, one of the athletes tried to get her case dismissed because she didn't want it heard in front of the court because of a decision like this. What does Even though it's not shocking that this is how the court ruled and they voted along the party lines, what does this say? And I guess in the bigger thing message, how important of is it now that since it's up to the states to decide if they're going to ban transgender athletes and girls and womens sports The voting is on the state level since they'll be making those decisions. Yeah, I don't know a lot about the statutory Title Iine law behind the court's decision. I also didn't read the particular decision, but I will say that This sort of trend of leaving it up to the states to decide the scope of our fundamental rights and our protections under the law for discrimination that is based on know protected statuses That's troubling to me that in one state you'll be allowed to do X, but the neighboring state you won't be allowed to do X. You know one thing about the Constitution is that for identities that are sort of inherent that u that are that can't be changed. and I understand there's some debate about the nature of transgenderness, but you know There are factors that courts use to determine whether someone should have heightened protection under the law. And a number of those factors, if you apply them to transgender people sort of point towards giving them heightened protection under the law So allowing states to discriminate in certain ways It's It's ultimately troubling and I think that trans people have been scapegoats. for so much and they have been used as a political wedge tool. and much of the courts opinions around them prior to the case just decided like have not been great. I just I'm troubled by this idea that we will allow vulnerable people to be subject to the whims of political majorities. I think it's anti American and I just think it's wrong. lastast question for me I have a comment And his comment is about you later. But last question for me. is how fragile is settled case law likeike settled constitutional law. How fragile is that? Like it seems that we are going to be reasserting and fighting for laws that like Kavan ongh all these people when he was being uh confirmed confirmation hearings, they ask him directly uh, about Ro, settle case law Federal case law is'uff that they would say li Biding their time until they fundamentally reshaped U what people like myself believe is a very important freedom for the women they share their communities with Every seems to be up for grabs for the court at all times. What rights cononstitutionally are settled Are we going to fight for not just procuring more rights expanding rights, A we going to fight for our basic rights every single generation based upon the whims of the court? Hm I think the latter, you're going to have to fight for your rights that aren't specifically articulated in the Bill of Rights is probably what Justice Thomas would tell you, which is crazy, right? Like this idea that You know, the court in the nineteen seventies, which established many of the rights that we think of when we think of the Constitution, the right to abortion, the right to privacy, the right to being equally represented, the right to not have your vote diminished all of those rights they're being chipped away at because the conservative right doesn't believe they're textualist or originalist, meananing that they're not articulated in the Constitution with any specificity. They were not intended to be in the Constitution with any specificity. And unless the history and tradition of the United States supports a right clearly supports a right, you're just not going to have it. So at this point, we have effectively a constitution that is frozen in time, which is actually what many people want and to enlargen you know the rights that people think that they should have, that prior courts thought we should have, we have just amend the Constitution, which like by the way, it's the oldest constitution of any you know, modern democracy and the average length of a constitution is nineteen years. So in many senses, we're at a very existential point where prior precedent is completely being threatened. and I don't believe Anyone should feel certain about anything with the court that we have right now. How does it feel to be a constitutional law professor right now or even just someone who's dedicated their life to the law and, you know, taking an oath and respect respected the system when it seems like the That seems like the highest court in the land is just It just seems like a free for all Yeah, it's honestly really tough. It's tough to explain to students The Dob's decision in a meth like a methodological manner You know, because you want to teach students to believe in the corporate to believe that the people who are judges are doing the right thing But at the same token U you know, they swore with their right hands up, you know, that Dobs a settled precedent that it would or not Dobs, excuse me, Roe a settled precedent, that it, you know, was going to be upheld. And as soon as they were confirmed and they got through They lied, rightight, they overturned So it's hard to have faith in the court right now. but one thing that I do try to tell students is that Theupremourt to thepreme court It's a political body. They are not above politics. We all know and have seen that since probably the nineteen eighties One thing that gives me faith is lower courts Lower court judges are speaking out. They are writing letters. They are writing decisions blasting the Supreme Court. They are disagreeing with Supreme Court precedents. They're changing Supreme Court tests because they don't believe that they're workable. And so long as we have integrity in that process and also integrity in state courts You know, not everything is lost, right? But it is hard to say that it's notot all just politics when in many senses, it is, at least for Sotus Yeah gott abolish Listen. I want to say something. So in Washington Lee in the I guess there was an article last year For you were asked about podcast, TV show recommendation. And for podcast, you sit still processing hosted by Wesley Morris And Jenner wortham my first one to say shout out to Wesley Morris friend ofine Great guy. You said though it's no longer airring It offers a granular and academic perspective on culture, television, film, books music etc Then you say Higher learning with Van Layon and Rachel Lindseay. is also great is also great. Still processing Wesley Morris and Jenna brilliant people offers a granular and academic perspective on culture, television film books, music etca There're the smartest niggers out there is basically what you said about them highigher learning withith Van Lathon. And Rachel Lindsey Also great. Are you can to address this? exxplain yourself And you know what? Yes, actually. Be still processing is no longer on air. And you know, things have changed in the podcasts fear. I do believe that this podcast is getting increasingly academic, increasingly political, increasingly like touching this podcast is an octopus. You touch culture, you touch politics, you touch on religion, you touch on You know, the gender wars, like everything culture, TV, like everything is fair game And so if I were to answer that question today, I would answer it differently I appreciate being in the same senate as still processing, but thank you. That's the difference between you and I. I'm not also great young Marureine. Okay Thank you. Thank you for join us on higher learearning. Thank you. We'll continue to bring you back as we monitor the court. I don't have any faith in the institution anymore. I want to have a completely separate conversation with you about packing the court and about reforms and checks that can be made on the court because I tend to believe now that the court is actually an enemy of the people and an enemy of progress. But I think that's for a more robust And a bigger conversation with you so you can maybe Tell somebody like me. That's a skeptic. what the worth and utility of the Supreme Court is now. Iagine imagine if you didn't have it, but over time. Hey look Once again, I could argue that besides the Warren court, consistently ruled with power against the American people. I could I could I could argue that. I could argue that. But I would love to have you back to have that conversation. you game for that I'm absolutely game. 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Call one eight hundred five two six seven seven thirty six to learn more. or visit Trempharadio. comot This episode is brought to you by the Active cash credit card from Wells Fargo. That's a mouthful, but that's because it packs a lot in Earn unlimited two percent cash rewards on purchases with it, big or small So whether it's buying tickets to the game or grabbing coffee, it earns unlimited two percent cash rewards on purchases. sayay it with me The active cash credit card from Wells Fargo. be two percenter Learn more at Wellsfargo. com forward slash active cash terms apply See, she's game for it. All right, Marie, thank for join us for H learning today. Thank you. than you Donnie, what should we do? What did you say? You had a have a question. You a goinging out message. Oh, I have a question. I have a question Uh and it's kind of on the backs of the Barack Obama thing. America two hundred fifty is coming up. This is coming out on Friday. I think before the July Saturday, right? Saturday. Are you proud to be an American Right now No, because of what America represents Try to do this just for this exercise in general, It feels embarrassing almost to say that. Right now. In general, you're proud to be an American You're asking me to speak of it right now. I'm giving you my answer. it feels embarrassing almost because of I mean, like we're just coming off a conversation of talking to Professor Eddborgh about decisions that are being made by the judicial branch that are personally personally and politically motivated. and our me and those decisions affect the rights of people in this very country and want to shoe them out like they're garbage and like they're trash isn't how I felt like the country that I felt like I grew up in. or was raised in, even maybe it was, but I just didn't realize it at the point. So right now it feels embarrassing to say that You guys Proud to be American. Do you How about this? Better question Do you guys love America Forget aboutd because you're right, proud to be in America. Everybody. do you love America You do love the country. That is such a loaded question. Yeah. That's I feel like it's 'causeuse like it's nuanced because I've only ever experienced living in America and I think There have been times especially growing up as a kid I enjoyed it. And I will say as a kid I would have said that I was proud Understanding that being a proud American, especially in the context that it's spoken on today is very much and probably was before based in white supremacy. So I don't think loving me Do I love Be in America or do I love what was the question Do I love America? Um I do think I would say no in my current space that I'm in But I do think it's a nuanced question. I think it's hard to to have a complete answer on that. or I think there's levels to the answer There's levels to it, right? Because I'm proud to be black. And I'm proud to be Black American because We're from here, I were born here, and there's culture here and there's things that we represent and that we have contributed society, whether they want to give that to us or not. And I'm proud of that proud of you know, my lineage, I'm proud of, you know, What it means for me to be a to be a Back American, despite the way that we are treated and recognized in this country doesn't take away my pride in being black and from America. So I understand the loaded part of it. I don't want to take away from that. as a country and what our country represents Why would I love that So it's hard What's your answer Van I'm really. What's your answer? Wow Look at that Be I want to see if you can just like answer it so No. everybody I'm not trying to both sideid it. I get it Donny, are you are you proud? love America Yeah, that's what I was I was about to say a little bit of what Rachel just said. Like I'm proud and I love my experience my personal experience as an American, like I love The my experience having my friend like he had and barbecues. something I love somebody What what happened? I muted. I was audio went away. Yeah, ye, yeah. Somebody said u. America love it. an. What I was saying is I love my experience. Like when I think of my experience being American, I do think about experience with uncles and aunts listening to like Mazing Freakaking Beverly on the holidays. like I have and I I take pride in the accomplishments of people that I personally admire in my life or U outside of my life, like I think My personal experience as an American, I am proud of and I love, but if I'm talking about more like granularly or like, no, no, no looking at it from like an exterior, like a twenty thirty thousand foot level of being an American Like of course, there's shame and discuss with our history and our interactions with other nations and countries. like yeah, of course. But when I'm thinking about myself, my experience Yes, very proud Bonard ns And Iike Iess said, it's like Rachel said, in Jade and Donnie. I mean, guess it's pros and cons. I guess my experience when you I appreciate your bar Jesus Christ. the mate m. get off when I was about to cry ard Bard like Bard' I feel like America we have we're in one place, one country that has like a lot of opportunities. So we do have that. Yeah. do have a lot of that. but That's straight that's awesomeed done That's That's good shit, dog.. No know, it's a tough question for black people, right? beeninking about it? So you know what You know why I say yes though Wh Uh I say yes to because of I think Obviously It's the cool you guys of all Oh answer the question it's not binary. The reason why I say yes, though, is because like The people that raiseed me up Just like you, same people. They put their salvation in America. Yeah Like They I was actually raised to be a patriot, which is an interesting thing about a Southern black boy is that and by the way, I'm calling myself a boy at that time Don't call me a boy from no pitchers' mils and nowhere else Um, The thing about S the Black Boy is the people that raise you up put America. They make America superior to whiteness. They actually make m America, the and adult to whiteness peopleeople that raiseed me. inks that the more American the country gets the better off they'll be they felt like The things that were holding them back was America actually not being the America that it says that it is in this idea is actually their salvation. So the reason why rather than tear things apart from the inside, which Back Americans have never done The reason why Black Americans have been revolutionaries and reformers is because There's obviously huge, huge arguments and disagreements here with inside the Black intelligence. But I just talk to people I know They believed that if theirir dreams were realized that they would be better off And they also believe something else I could realize them They would look progressively their lot and they would be like Every generation comes along and they're a little smarter than us Like Van good with the words. lookook at them. He hasn't experienced the same things we've experienced. He never experienced anyone being druggg out of their home, lynched and in front of their family He's never really experienced going to the store and having someone say Black people can't shop here. They believed My life would be a realization of theirs. And that realization was America And they believed in it in a way that it seeped off of them. They served My family, they went into the military Like my family went and became pololice officers My family was like went and open stores. And did their part. economically, come from small business people. We have a Cement finishing business as a family business. Right? They believed in a lot of those things, right? They believed and all of them All of them, they believed in it. they believed in it. And over time they saw it bear fruit Bin I think when I got out there They got dug a little deeper And in digging deeper I notot only challenge the country but challenge those people. Esespecially when I was a younger man I would sit down When I was talking to them And I would tell them while their dreams were wrong. I was sitting in front of people who are dead now And I would look at them like they were weak And I would tell them why their dreams were wrong, why their Why of shit that they blare for and the shit that they like went through hell and high water, Wh that was wrong Uhm J just get emotion becauseuse all those people are dead now I wish I didn't have to do that. You know what I'm saying? I wish I wish that like even at that point I would have understood that Their dream of America. is not wrong they did like their want and their wish and even their existence inside of it That's not wrong But for me Now It feels like casting off the country is casting off them So Interesting an it up when I was crying I'm crying pod. No, no, keepeep it in there because when I listen to you say it, it's like I wouldn't have told them their dreams are wrong and you're so right in what you're saying because and I also think of it as They had to be that way as a means of survival And because of their sacrifice and what they gave to this country, what they gave of themselves in order to provide a better life for us We can now. we have the freedom Question. the systems that they had to walk through and survive through in order to give us the liberty to think to recognize what was wrong So I understand what you're say that's why it's like It's so hard to answer the question because I am proud of where I come from. I'm proud of whose shoulders I stand on. I'm proud of what they built and because of them, I'm able to exist the way that I do in this society. Now that doesn't take away from the institution like the the the institutionalized racism. that exists within this country and how it was built and all of that, and we're never going to love that. But I love the people that I come from that are from this country. Yeah. And it's like is like for me is They are so American. This is the biggest thing and this is the last thing this this is the this is the last thing I'll say. man. These people They are everything that made them, right They are. like the people that I'm talking about that I feel connected to that I visit when I go back to like to Louisiana, even now you Man, they are I listen to all of these white people And I'm going to say white people and not white supremacy because a lot of people that talk like this are white And they like You'll listen to somebody. M John, I'll give an example Mike Johnson goes It's talking about like, u You know, his experience here I'm the grandson of guy that came over from Italy and start a small thing about you're the grandson You're a grandson You speaker of the house, you're the grandson Your grandfather immigrated here I go to the back Aventures like I go to the back uh of Vventures Memorial where my father is buried. He's in the front Reason addition to the club. I go to the back and there's slaves there. Who are you talking to If you want if you want to play that game, if you want to play the legacy American, if you want to play the people who like you Like you can' fuck with me Like you can't like you like you can't. And those people They had to believe Like their lives went through so much trauma and turmoil And they were they were telling me around. they were telling me what I was entitled to as an American. They were telling me how My life should be And they were making sure that I could stand up and they were making sure that I understood and then at a part I would just look at them and be like, kind of stupid. I'll just be honest with you. L I'd be like, you know, you go off and you go to college and you visit a couple countes and you go Hey man, the shit that y'all are talking about. this is not This is not the actual shit. like, have you read this? haveave you been this? and they would just be like, keep on living and now in this situation where I no longer have grand designs of like what America could be and what it's going to be I just want what they wanted I just want what they wanted. And I think that want is like the thing that orients my identity as an American. I think that want and that deference L is what oriented because They never got it. Yeah That's so true They never got it And so I don't know. I've been I've been looking at the America two hundred fifty thing and at all of this different stuff because I've been watching people The more I learn about these stories, I'm been watching people talk about this stuff and they talk about like what is an American? like what is what is an American. Nobody to me I don't even want to do that because I want to put hierarchy to it, but like people that are Then people from Marygin, Louisiana Th then people from Bachelor from Watson Bunky from New Iberia, all of them people, them black people That's American D them motherfuckers That's American. They tilt the soil, they fought for it Yeah. They die for it. They invested into it. They believed in it They fucking earned it. They was fighting revolutionary wars in nineteen fifteen and nineteen twenty five and nineteen thirty five and nineteen sixty five That's the shit that I'm talking about. So when I think about the country and my identity I don't think about that flag or none of that other shit I think about them But Still though. We just into some fx shit right now. I was gonna to say, so you' gonna be decked out in your red, white and blue. Y sparklers reppping your two hundred fifty. No, no, no. I'm you know, I'm'm not I'm not gonna do that, but. I just it's almost a search for patriotism as a Back American. is a it's different for everybody, which says a lot, which is so crazy to even say that on the hills of some of thesepme court Supreme Court decisions that came out Patriotism is not I modn I guess, as we like to sees. I think I think everybody here yes express a different version of it Besides Bonnart I just think I think everybody here was able to kind of might We sold it all for him. We took the words out of his mouth. was like was able to kind of give us This really interesting treaties. Donnie talked about Frankie Beverly and Mae and all of that shit. Jade and obviously you and the Benard was like, sheit, man He said it's already been said. Bernard was likeigger. Bernard was like Nigger. I love to play video games You said he'd love what? like video gam. Oh. put hard car through like shit Nigger. I like streaming apps. I U We got to get out of here. You guys go, you know Go explore. G whereere you going for the thing? I'm in Texas T house. Texas, Dallas, right outside of Dallas, hanging with friends I take mushrooms every morning You took one today That's why you cry You know, but you know, the tearfulness is because I'm off the Lxipro Oh yeah, a lot of people can't cry on Lxro mostost people cannot cry on Lexapro Lexi Pro made me into a fucking savage. I feel like Lexi Pro made me into like, it really made me into my dad. So how many gummies did you take today? I say I took When did you feel it? How long many hours does it take? So I took the gummies And then M So I took the gummies and then like in the middle in the first fifteen minutes of the minidnight bo as we did before this, I started to kind of feel it. Yeah emmpty stomach It gummy. I say this about the gummies about the mushrooms. It doesn't cut down on the amount that I talk, which I would like Wellen I could didn't do that Well It does help me pay attention better though. Really? Yeah I'm not gonna lie. It helps me because like it used to be before. I don't know if people could tell on the podcast. like people would be talking And I would be like, okay Okay. They could tell. Okay. We all could tell. Okay. See for me, I able to sit in the moment I'd move, but Vive anance helps me stay still. You still want the Vive an Sorry, I just saw somebody put this not J for something. Wait, didid you see President Trump talking to the AI version of Teddy Roovelt Did you see please just just watch just watch it So I thrown this in last minute.. Keep your nerve and remember the nation comes first, you get through. I know you you. Nigga. Bro, hold on, bro. Bro, what? See, seeee, this is the type of shit. This is what we just saw this Bro Trump bro Y He said, than you for those words. Why did they publish that What you Why would you post that? I'll tell you why. Probably because he asked them to probably like probably the reason why they the reason why he has no idea who' talking to any same person. you if you haven watched Superman before Superman be talking to his dad daddy, right? His daddy Jorelle comes down and it's like Superman have a ho because his daddy, whatever. Superan like is Superman going nuts sometimes in beforece sa No sane person would be like we need to put this up of you talking to the AI except for the fact that Trump wentin So you what? Roosevelt really likes me I just tell like Apparently they cut the video short because I guess it went on Like he continuues I bet it did. He continues to talk. He probably all the time. He probably asked them a question and when he didn't answer back they were like, we gott to go. Bro. We got to go. You guys. We got you guys Guaranteee twowo months A strike inside of Iran And Trump will say Teddy Roosevelt told me Teddy Roosevelt told me to speak softly and walk with a big stick. And this is our big stick He's about to be talking to this mother. Oh, he's going to call Teddy a friend Teddy' a friend at this point.'s's a friend. Yeah, ye yeah ye. Tdy Tdy the other day who really gave me some good advice. this guy nam Teddy Teddy you guys know Teddy? Teddy Roosevelt T They' strong guy Thad of having him join the administration. In the military on Mount Rushmore, this is a guy, this is a class guy The Titty meme coin, all of this stuff. by the way U Do you have crypto? Do you guys have crypto? No, I don't do it. I don't do what I don't understand. You don't do what you understand. Yeah, you have crypto? S you did white people Colombian. There's a culture there There's a culture. That's all I'll say. culture I did quite enjoy going to Colombia. Okay, wait, before we get out of here That t shit Fri. I can't believe you I put it in the chat. like we we have to talk about this. Thank you for putting it in the rout. Before we get out of here, Donnie couldn't find the words. But as Van brought up the great question, asking us Are you proud? What does it mean to you? It's two hundred and fifty years and I think that Personally for me when I have a birthday I reflect. like I think about the last year. I think about other birthdays, I think about where I am now, I think about where I want to go. It's a time of reflection. So as we're coming up on this two hundred fifty years, I think that we should all do that. We should reflect on where we are what it means to us, where we want to go, just like just the current state of everything, like how things are affecting you, whether it be the economy, whether it be foreign relations, whether it be, you know, certain institution, education, healthcare, all those things And I want you to go out on these words Republican Congressman Neil Neels I believe is how you say it. Texas. from Texas, my home state He was asked about Fourth of July. And you know, of course was asked about the state of Americans and where they are right now and saying some Americans will experience a fourth This iss two hundred and fifty If year mark and one way And they asked him what he thought about it and how he would celebrate. And I want to go out on these encouraging words. as we reflect on two fifty. This is where we are Let real quick. How do House Republicans make the case that you're fighting for affordability when you go back to your districts Affordability we talk about Affordability is the big. I'm gonna to go there tomorrow. I'm going well over to Fth I'm going to give me a couple big lobster tails. I'm going give get me some nice rib eyes. I'm going to sit in my backyard with my family, my neighbors And we're going to be And join the fourth celebrating two hundred fifty years the birthday We're going to be celebrating the greatest president in my lifetime, Donald J. Trump Maybe watching fireworks won't be up here It's going be too hot, right And I'm ined eleven o'clock I heard fireworks aint going off to eleven o'clock Easter on the fourth of July I probably have to sleep through that way Listen, everybody understands you're going to see a little increase in energy prices because of Iran I mean, come on, people are stupid. You realize that when you have a conflict Iran. But I think in the end The short term increase in some of the costs of of energy you know, gasoline and stuff is temporary. President Trump made it very clear to these companies donon't be gouging, no price gouging. Cut it off. I mean energy, what? Oil is it He said fuck y'all, happy fourth S think cs off and not stop learning anser the same. She's right Coke the fuck.