Training Humans to Be Good Humans

I'm not saying that to give affection. I'm just saying give affection to patience and calmness and open mind Right? Because when your dog misbehave, you want him to go back there go back to your good state of mind, right? You don't want the dog to do five flight avoidance Those are the bad state of mind good state of mind is Patience can surrender or happy or lucky Those are good state of mind. Welcome to the Hubberan Lab podcast discuss science and science based tools for everyday life. Ii'm Andrew Huberman, and I'm a professor of neurobiology and ophthalmology at Stanford School of Medicine. My guest today is Caesar Milan B known as the Dog Whisperer, and the preeminent dog trarainer in the world. Today's episode is truly for everyone, not just dog owners. You're going to learn a lot about human psychology and behavior, and it will help you better interact with other humans in every type of relationship. For instance, you will learn a simple tool that allows you to move through the world with a clear calm state of mind that will allow you to interact with others more effectively, to listen and act with more clarity and intention. And not incidentally, that clear calm state of mind is also what dogs respond to best and what makes them feel safe and healthy Today we talk about the critical importance about understanding dog biology and psychology and the fact that they are pack animals And that we have to remove our human sense about these animals as our pets. And of course, they are our pets and they're extremely cute. They are family members, but understand the hardwired aspects of their brain and biology that allow us to be the best leaders for them. I have to warn you, a lot of what you hear today may sound counterintuitive at first. until you understand the biology of dogs and the fact that they respond to people's energy and actions, not words. I know they can listen to commands, they can learn words and commands, but they're responding to the energy and the actions associated with those commands Only then can you be the most effective dog owner. And by effective, I mean making your dog as healthy and feeling safe as possible. I should point out that one of the reasons I'm so excited Caesar came on this podcast is that I had an amazingly positive experience with his methods. yearsars ago when I got my first puppy, Costello, who was a bulldog mastiff, I read his book, Be the Pack Leader. and the principles within that book criticalical for developing an incredible relationship with Costella, who lived eleven years. You could bring him into any environment. I would bring him to class. I would bring him into different people's homes. I could take him essentially anywhere. He loved kids, he loved people, and he was extremely well behaved. Exceedingly lazy too, but exceedingly well behaved. And I credit that to the methods that I learned from Caesar's book. So if you have a dog or you're considering getting a dog, or you want to better understand how to regulate your energy and behavior in all types of interactions with dogs, with cats, and with other humans, today's episode will teach you those extremely valuable tools. And I'm extremely pleased to announce the newest member of the Hubberman Lab podcast team Strummer He's also a bulldog mastiff mt He's similar to Costello in breed, but I should say not a pure English bulldog. so Not a lot of snoring and the other stuff that go along with English Bulldogs. I love the English Bulldog breed, but when they're mudded with other breeds like this one, they breathe a lot easier and he's just the sweetest thing. So you'll be seeing and perhaps hearing more from Strummer. I am applying all of Caesar's methods to training strrummer. You can see he's a very calm, relaxed dog He gets two walks a day and a bunch of other things you'll learn about during today's episode that will benefit you if you have or you're thinking about getting dog Before we begin, I'd like to emphasize that this podcast is separate from my teaching and research roles at Stanford. It is, however, part of my desire and effort to bring zero cost to consumer information about science and science related tools to the general public In keeping with that theme, today's episode does include sponsors And now for my discussion with Caesar Milan CessR Milan. Yes, sir. Welcome. I'm a huge fan. Thank you You're paying it Thank you. Thank you. I'm honored to hear that. But I will say your book Be the pack leader I read the hard copy To raise my first puppy, we never had a dog in my home growing up. Yeah. to raise Costello. Yeah Bulldog mix, stubborn dog We went eleven years Together, he and I end that book and your other teachings were tremendously impactful for my relationship with him. Yeah, but also in my work life and my entire life We're gonna to talk about some of the themes from that book and beyond today, but I just want to extend my gratitude. Thank you. It's a true honor and pleasure to have you. time. Yeah. in modern Parliance they say, you're the man. No, you're the man. The PAack leader. That's right. Many, many people want dogs, have dogs. concepts of dogs that lead them to think they're a great dog owner, but a lot of dog behavioral issues, emotional issues We know probably reflect something in The human as well. N probably. so certainly. Yeah, because there is no knowledge behind instinct. There's no reaction. So you can never blame an animal for doing the wrong thing You see it? so you can guarantee for a dog to do the right thing And so how? Well, that means the human has good energy And what's good energy? Well, if you understand the power of silence, which that gives you patience power of calmness, which that gives you trust and calmness is just just learning how to breathe Right? The power of confidence, that's knowledge, right And the power of love, when to give love. Because a lot of times people give love at the wrong time. So you end up nurturing the wrong behavior Right? So that's what happened to my clients And then the power of joy, that's the celebration, right? We're going to FIFA right now. We're going to W upp. Nobody celebrates unless they make a goal You see what I'm saying? But they have to be patient, calm, confident, love what they're doing and celebrate afterwards. See they follow that formula It's the silence, it's the comment. before anybody is going go through something so powerful, such as winning, right or being in a team or being in a group The energies of silence, calmness, confidence, love, joy is what makes them I'm a great team because that's what connects your spirit, your instinct, your heart and your mind. And the same way we have to connect with a dog It's not just emotional, it's not just intellectual You know, when people just want to train the dog What you train is the mind. What you connect is the spirit, the instinct and the heart. That's where you connect And that's why I say trust, respect, love Trust the sppirit, respect instinct, Low with the heart, create with your mind for many people, especially in the United States They're not familiar with feeleing energy and exchanging energy with I'll give an example of when Costello, my previous bulldog, some probably bulldog mastiff, who knows what he was? whatever he was. He was Costello But I learned something very important from you Before he's Costello, he's an animal.' spirit Spirit, animal, species, breed, name so the last thing they are is the breed in the name. So when I rehabilitate a dog, what I'm doing is bringing back the happy spirit brringing back the healthy instinct and bringing back the rules binders limitations mind because that's what makes them well behaved when they understand rules by under mutation. No matter what breed they are. So it really doesn't matter if you have a pit buoy or Rd white or German shepherd, or I'm Mexican and you're white and African America, it really doesn't matter the race of the human. What matter is that person has a happy spirit I held the instinct. in a well educated mind Right? So you want to be a good human Right? And you want to be part of the pack of the good humans. when those humans are good Right? are thoseose are the humans they help other humans. or the create well behaved dogs. because they're following in that You know, there is some people are born F me, I'm part of the pack where it's better humans, better planet But I know a lot of people were not ro to that path. So it's that Yeah, certainly u raaising and living with Costello, taught me a lot about how to sense people's energy. I had an amazing experience with him that I just wanted to share briefly that I realized now is probably the spirit component It was something that I tried on the basis of what I read in your book So I was walking him and sometimes he didn't want to walk in a particular direction, you know, And so he was always walked at my side and a little bit behind me. I had that going from very early point. I practiced no look no touch, no speak. you know, minutes of contact coming home and we can talk about why that's important But at one point I decided based on what you put in your book to try something that seemed kind of wacky to me at the time where I was just going At some point during the walk, it was we had a great stride. We're having a good time. He smelling things. he said, but we're moving on. And I decide to just send him approval energy Like I'm just gonna think it and then I and then feel it. I'm just gonna to send them some energy Wh I'm just doing this, I did not change where I was looking. I did not change as far as I know, like the tension on the leash, who knows And he just looks right up at me. And I was like, this is incredible after a really good day of hiking or work he used to come to the lab with me or something we were sitting or I was cooking or something every once in a while, I would just while I'm doing something else, I would just send him. positive energy And he would look over at me. It was wild. And I realized he's sensing things that are beyond my words. In fact, I don't know that he ever really listened what I said terribly much. He could really feel what I was feeling. He was probably paying attention a lot more of the time than I was aware But I also had the experience of when he was doing something I didn't like, I could send him disapprovve.. And he would stop It was wild. We were, you know, meters away from each other. And I could send him this energy. Now to you, this is probably like, yes, of course, but I think for me and I think for most people that have dogs or thinking about owning a dog I think this is crazy, right? Yeah. But I swear on my life that I could do this in a variety of circumstances while driving, anything, and he would react according to the the energy that I was sending Yeah out As a neuroscientist, I could make up some story. Okay, well, we have fish have electric sensing field. I could make up a story in neurology, neuroscience that would more or less hold together. But I want to know your impression of like, what is this? and then hopefully that will take us into a discussion more about energy exchange between all sorts of beings. Well, you know, silence is very powerful. Right? u the power of prayer My mom certainly is always connected U you know, when I crossed the border, I filed my mom. You know, I jump the border. And so jumping the border is a life and death thing, right? And then so you you you give yourself to God and then of course, you know, your mom it's always thinking about you So you feel this energy that is done by the prayer or by the silence You are what you believe And so if you believe you can connect and you communicate this way, because you You're going to be I mean, the fact that people are not aware of energy, we can feel that the person doesn't feel good And we don't even know each other You know, so imagine if we humans are sensitive to that, all animals never stop this way of being Right? The sensitivity of animals, they don't go into the mind. They stay within their instinct becausecause that's how they stay safe, you know and maintain the peace And so what you did was exactly that. Don't talk with words, talk with energy, body language and intention, you know. How do you become the best doctor in the world? Because that's all you think about it That's all you think about it, you know, Even when you go to sleep, when you nobody you're not talking about it. That's So you create a love of attraction, you create a love of creation. The most difficult law is the love of maintenance. R? Be it's easy to attract, it's easy to create What's hardest to maintain, right And that's why patience is so important or silence is so important. because this one is infinite. It's an infinite energy So if you feel that, imagine how powerful you become And then just to be where I hear where you are claiming your space, Tom That gives you another power because that gives the animals the capability to trust and then your intention, right? What is it that you want with our words? I just don't want you to pee over there. I just don't want you to go after that dog. I just want you to stop doing what you're doing because think about cats communicate with a dog. It's a completely different species, but can a cat control a dog The same way you did. S Silence, calm, confidence That's that's that's why a cat can control a Rdweiler and a pitbull R when people feel, o as a very dangerous breed At the moment you think something is dangerous, you give your power away Right? At the moment, you bring silence, calmness, confidence, you regain your power back And that's the first Line of communication before sound But most people focus on, I want to train my dog. I want my dog to listen to commands. No, no, no, no. You want your dog to listen to your silence, to your calmness, to what's in your mind without saying a word That's exactly it right there. That was the the relationship with Costello improved in order of magnitude when I understood that that I could talk to them all day or say whatever It had a very little potency compared to how I would show up. And then it also taught me a lot, of course how to arrive home, how to walk into it, Id bring him to class. I taught four hundred person class. he would walk in. It was very interesting. Everyone, you know, dog dog M most professors wouldn't bring their dogs to class. and He knew it was all there, typical Costello, you know, he would just kind of walk to the front of the classroom He wouldd wait a few minutes, not look at anybody. and then he would decide, he just like glare it all up. He could light up a room But I understood that I wouldn't let him be like too much of a celebrity or else he would start misbehaving. I had to remind him like, you know, we have a structure and an order. is correct. And I do think that peopleople would benefit so much from getting in touch with this capacity that they have to sense their own energy and the energy of other people regardless of They have a dog Well, you know, Americans go to India to be quiet Right? And then to to to practice not eating, which they call fasting Right? And then to stretch That's practically it is silence, you know, leararn how to breathe and then stretch gives you a little bit agility into it. and you learn to control hunger whichich in a third country that's what we learned Right? We learn to control hunger, We learn to be quiet. We learn to be calm. We learn, you know, whatever we know, we do really good at it We become really good farmers, really good animal people Right? And family people, you know, God people and so we have a good structure, good discipline and such a basic, simple stuff And that's what gives us the upprehend of walk a dog off leash. know when I started walking dogs in America, I don't know it was illegal to walk dogs off leash I was walking forty, sixty dogs at a time Right? And I was doing an off leash because that's all I knew. You see it? And so that that u that energy of silence, calmness, confidence is what now I now that I understand what I did is what led me to this event, you know, for people to see me from Englandwood to South Central Its a Mexican guy that walks a pack of dogs from Englandood to South Central off leash That's when the LA times came and and did a piece of me because they didn't they couldn't understand, you know, this concept of walking a dog off leash. This dog shaman or something And a dog here in the land of the free. right? Because you know, dogs in America have rights, but that doesn't mean they can walk off leash. You see the dog has to be on a leash. And humans have to learn to transmit that energy through the leash, because there's a lot of dogs that react on the leash. when the dog should be the most well behaved, then a dog is off the leash You see it, but the leash in the animal world is tr respect love. the leash in the animal world is that human understanding You know, silence, confalmness, confidence, love, joy And that's ack leader, direction protection Right? That's the only way you can say, I'm a pAC leader Right because you areired that energy I'd like to take a quick break and acknowledge one of our sponsors, Elements Element is an electrolyte drink that has everything you need and nothing you don't. That means the electrolytes, sodium, magnesium and potassium all in the correct ratios, but no sugar Proper hydration is critical for brain and body function Even a slight degree of dehydration can diminish your cognitive and physical performance. It's also important that you get adequate electrolytes. The electrolytes, sodium, magnesium, and potassium, are vital for the functioning of all cells in your body, especially your neurons or your nerve cells Drinking element makes it very easy to ensure that you're getting adequate hydration and adequate electrolytes. My days tend to start really fast, meaning I have to jump right into work or right into exercise. So to make sure that I'm hydrated and I have sufficient electrolytes, when I first wake up in the morning, I drink sixteen to thirty two ounces of water with an element packet dissolved in it I also drink element dissolved in water during any kind of physical exercise that I'm doing Especially on hot days when I'm sweating a lot and losing water and electrolytes. Element has a bunch of great tasting flavors. In fact, I love them all. I love the watermelon, the raspberry, the citrus, and I really love the lemonade flavor. So if you'd like to try Element, you can go to drink element dot com slash Hubberman to claim a free element sample pack with any purchase. Again, that's drink element dot com slash hubberman to claim a free sample pack Today's episode is also brought to us by Juve Juve makes medical grade Red light therapy devices There's one thing that I have consistently emphasized on this podcast is the incredible impact that light can have on our biology and our health Now in addition to sunlight, which I've talked about a lot on this podcast Red light, near infrared and infrared light. been specifically shown to have positive effects on improving numerous aspects of cellular and organ health These include faster muscle recovery, improved skin health, wound healing, improvements in acne, reduced pain and inflammation, improved mitochondrial function, and even improvements in vision. Nowadays, there are a lot of red light devices out there But what sets Juve lights apart and why they're my preferred red light therapy device is that they use clinically proven wavelengths, meaning they use the specific wavelengths of red light, near infrared, and infrared light in combination to trigger the optimal cellular adaptations. Personally, I use the Juve whole body panel about three to four times a week, usually for about ten to twenty minutes per session And I use the Juve handheld light both at home and when I travel. If you would like to try Juve, they're offering up to four hundred dollars off select products for listeners of this podcast To learn more, visit Juve, spelled j oovv dot com slash Hubberman. Again, that's j oovv dot com slash Hubberman I'm u in a dilemma, whether to go down the concepts of What is happening in third worldld countries, not just today, but always in terms of how people sense energy and use energy versus what we do here. I'm also keen on the fact that many people listening donon't know how to walk their dog. Yeah. I'll ask a very simple question first shouldh the dog always be next to you or behind you Is there ever an instance where the dog should walk out in front of you? And as I say this, we both realize many people walk with their dog in front of them. So could you tell us about the concept of where the dog is relative to? Well think about it, L at it this way. so people can adopt the concept quicker If you learn how to walk a dog It would eliminate ninety percent of the problems The other ten percent will be rules by of limitations, right? That's it Um So when a dog is a pup, he follows his parents And then he plays, then he explore. But the first activity he learns is to follow Follow, play explore So playing explore becomes like a reward activities That's the Chucky cheese time Right, Right. And so the follow is the one they learn, you know, the rules, boundaries, limitations, they learn to stay focused and I get distracted So naturally dogs They need to learn to follow When they go in front of you They are in the mind of a player or explorer But at the same time,, if you do this every day, the dog learned that he has to lead you to places. Is that stressful for the dog If a dog is middle of the pack and back of the pack, yes. If a dog is front of the pack, no You see it? And so very important in order for people to have a f the backack dog, they need a lot of knowledge And so most dogs are perfect middles or back The back should be the easiest one But when people don't do the right thing with the backag, he becomes fearful. The middle of the pack should be the one for the families because they're naturally happy or lucky But if you do too much excitement, they become hyper You see it? And this is a cross breeds Yeah, yeah, yeah It doesn't matter if it's a bulldog or a, you know, litter. It's front of the pack, made of the pack back of the pack. But it's more back of the packs being born followers, then it's only one per litter litter at the back So that's what they call in the breeder world Pick of the letitter Yeah. So in a liter of German shepherds only one can be a police officers The other one is speet quality or they call them the run of the litter Back of the pack, sensitive, middle of the pack, happy W lucky is the HR of the famam of the pack. is the middle of the pack, right? And then the front of the pack is the one that gives direction protection ideally for a family or for a tyypical domestic situation. I'inking the United States, but elsewhere because this is going everywhere and this episode will go everywhere. Middle or back of the midleack. Middle. Yeah. A family who has never raised a dog together? Yeah, middle. How can you assess the litter when you see them So that you pick a middle of the pack dog. Yeah if that's what's appropriate. Sounds like that that's the goal. The front is going to be very easy to assess because he's going to be the biggest one. He's going to be the one is moving the sisters and the brothers away from the mom. Right? He's already going to practice dominance And then the middle is the second to get to the mother. And the back of the pack, they always wait. You see they're more shy. Naturally, they're just sensitive What if you don't have access to the interaction with the mother? Having gone to pick up puppies a few times, sometimes you just see the puppies, the mom's in another room. Should you ask to watch the interaction And if you can't? how can you assess if you just? Well, normally if you're in a situation the breeder knows because that's what they put ribbons, you know color ribbons. So they so they know, okay, this is midals, this are back Even though they don't call him that way, they just call him round of the round of the litter, you know pet quality of front of the pack. The front of the pack is just the obvious one Right. And so when Just go inside, you know where the puppies are and there's no mother and nothing just stay quiet. And every time you present something new, you're going to see the more confident coming to and the more happy Gaki coming In the back of the pack, it doesn't get close anythingything new, it just can be a pillow And that's the first time they're experienence a pillow and the front of the pad will go And then in the middle of the pack will go and play. It's hardwired.'s there. That's why you can guarantee good behavior Right? because now you, okay, I want a middle of the pack Ber colleie. I want a middle the pack goone retriver I want a middle of the pack pitbull. You can have it You say, because that's going to guarantee you exactly what you want. It's going to be easier for you to tell him what to do because he was born naturally a follower. versus if you get a front of the pack, whatever breed Chihu, I don't care what it is Hey they're born You know, with the disposition of giving direction protection. So wherever human wants to live with them needs to have more knowledge Right? So that's me running a pack of dogs and having different animals, the animals know that I have a big energy They don't know I have forty three acres. they just know I have a land. and that you're in charge of it. Yeah. and all the ups and downs that I went through and I have been the wars that I got through Rite the divorces and all of that stuff And I went through and I find my silence, my calmness, my confidence, I love my job, my back They know my energy is big Right. So so that I can have a front of the pack but I don't have one. I have middles and back. even you, even me. Yeah, because it will require so much. I would need to find him a job You see what I'm saying? L like a border patrol something like that looking for lookingoo for the bad guys. like that would be a job. It's just one officer and one dog He doesn't need the pack ascinating. I'm sure like many people listening, I'm trying to figure out was Costello front to the backat. I think he was was an enormous dog. I mean even within his litter. And when I went to go pick M, I had met him as a three week old puppy. he was the one butting all the other ones out eating from their food bowls he was They claim. Yeah, he didn't yelp didn't yp at all. He just everything took everything, peid where he wanted, you did everything. So there was it was a difficult thing raising him. This new one, strrummer who's four and a half months. he's definitely middle, maybe even back of the pack, but. He was second out when he was born and they said, Ohh, you know, he's going to be the pick of the litter. They said it, but definitely not. Yeah you know, quickly it was clear that he kind of kept a little distance. He is very sensitive. Okay. That's good. much sweeter Yeah sensitive. Yeah, much more playful And that's the part that I have to work with because they enchant us. you know, like I knowed with Strummer. he' he has figured out, you know, that if he gets into play mode, it lights me up And then I have to remember to stay in in my place, my proper place becausecause I'm trying to teach him here, this is the order of things. It's very important because I want to be able to bring him anywhere. Leave him in a room alone with little kids and trust completely that he's not going to accidentally do something For people that want to learn to sense their own energy use their energy field Should they also be asking if they are front, middle, or back of pack? the human? Yeah in the human world. This is something it's a little bit of a sensitive topic, right? because every guy wants to say, yeah, I'm an alpha, and not a b. everyveryone thinks that way. I like to think in different circumstances people can move up or down the the human hierarchy. I mean, I work with a lot of scientists and I can tell you in many environments that they don't come across as alphas, but you put them in a laboratory or a lecture environment and I mean, they own their space because that's their expertise. So it can move around Can you explain what it is to observe oneself, really think honestly about oneself and where One really lies in this let's call it what it is. it's a hierarchy, but that makes it sound like one is better. It just is what it is. You're either front, middle or back a pack human. That's their special magic, right? Being back of the pack means the master com surrender So we have to learn to master coucer re. Th are more sensitive. state of mind, right? So when I'm assessing and evaluating a dog, I go into my calm surrender state. I go in the back of the back. When it's time for me to give direction and protection, I go to the front of the pack When I achieve whatever I need to achieve, I go into the middle of the backack You said? so the human can can take advantage of this position of this of this state of mind Right? The dog, the back of the pack dog It's going is's going to tell you listen, I'm here to master camp surrender. It doesn't mean I don't do happy go lucky He can never do Cm confident. Backappack can't do Fack N, never. Are we talking humans and dogs now If we're really transparent Well, it's just to have the fine line between what the human can do, right? versus what the dog can Right? So it's important to understand, you know that a dog is born with a position And the human can go from whatever position he was born two different positions, right? Be it's a lot of like you say, it's a lot of scientists people who are very brilliant on this side, but when it comes to a dog, a dog takes over Oh, yeah, or even just at a coffee shop, you know, they sort of they become a smaller version of themselves. notot because they're weak, it's just it's not their domain of expertise and they feel weak in that environment. Correct. Or they turn on one energy more than the other one. And so a lot of these people turn on more of the affection energy Right? And affection or love energy in the animal world is not a strong energy. Yeah. tellell me more about that because practed on your recommendation, no look no touched, no speak when I got home. Most difficult thing for people to do, I think, you know, they get home and the dog is like, scrappy see them. tail is waged. They're excited. And I'm like, I'm going to ignore my dog. This feels like abuse, right? You know? But I come in, do my thing. and then After some period of time And what I realize is E everyvery time after that, I'd come home And he was called He was excited to see me but he was calm never jumping up and touching me, never jumping up and touching anyone else But if someone came over and they were super excited, it almost would confuse him. Like this is not how people enter the space. Most people, I think have a very hard time not greeting the dog with Men and women squealing this, right It's great. And it makes the dogs anxious. It causes problems in the relationship Absolutely. But I think most people don't realize that. Well, that's exactly you said it. You know, I don't want to ignore my dog And I don't want to like tell my dog that I don't love him, you know, because then the interpretation, the dog missed me. You know, every time you leave an animal behind walls, the animal is going to go excited or anxious Right. So not always what you're greeting is a happy dog. Most of the time, what you'reeting is an excited inch dog that is confuse. right? So it's very important, you know, when people see dogs read another dog, there is no excitement That is You know, and they wait until they the front of the pack allows them to come in They can't just come in into their intimate space So it's a ritual. So it's three rituals that are very important for people to master with no touch, not talkou no ey contact One is the meeting. Every time you meet a dog, always remind them about safe peace. No sigh ears, trust respect first And then is the walk dog right next to you. Wh't you quiet. And then when you feed So those three activities are very meaningful to dogs all starts with the meeting with the greeting Every time you reunite to remind your dog that areS source of safe and peace, of trust, respect, of nose, eyes ears. You have to tell them that. Dissect nose eyes ears for us. because I think most people, because we're humans, especially in the U S and you know in Northern Europe or wherever, they're likeien Speaking nice now. Yeah. there people are just speaking constantly like, Hi, hi, hi, you know This is not the best way for to communicate with a dog who you are and what you're about and what the trust relationship. Well it creates excitement,? It creates a dog to learn to greet people with excitement So if you greet your dog with excitement, you are the source to other humans. So he's going to greet all the humans excited. He's going to jump on people Not everybody wants a dog that doesn't belong to them to jump on them So But because, you know, that let's say you do that Your dog has learned to welcome humans. Excited You, so When a dog is born, he burns with the nose open fifteen days later, they opened the eyes, twenty one days later, they opened the ears. This is scientifically. This is an all the encyclopedias. So that means the dog met his parents through the nose. then the eyes then the ears You, But when people wants to do ears, eyes, nose, they want to create a human They want a dog to understand the way you and I understand Hey, Hra, how you do? But we can control that excitement Hy, we should. some people right that, right But so it's a different ritual for us. You know, we believe in parties, we believe in parades For a horse to go to New York is a very excited place. It takes conditioning. Because no horse will ever volunteer going to New York. See it has to be conditioned because you're bringing him to a very excited environment with his instincts, safe flight Yeah Wely there have been these problems I don't know if you saw a couple of the carriages in Central Park took off. Someone was killed recently. There's a whole debate going on now whether or not this is good or bad for these horses. but it's just clear Regardless of where onece sits on the debate that you can't take the instinct out of the animal. There are triggers that will send them over an edge. Or you have to make sure that you, you know, you keep eye on how is the spirit of the horse is the instinct of the horse healthy, you know, is the spirit happy You know, because when they just go into the habit of working, working, working, working, even a police dog can crash You see what I mean? even a police dog can bite a police officer because it's overw I have a few friends from the special operations community. they work with these dogs that jump out of planes parachute do M M. Yeah, yeah, the Malan was Several of those guys have told me that with those dogs, you cannot ever ever let up guard as the leader in fact you guys who got a little soft with them, just a tiny bit. like One anecdote was they decided to invite the dog in to watch a movie with them one night when they're on deployment or maybe they were training, I don't know. And He let the dog get a little too close to him during the movie the next day he got bit. And it's like they're constantly trying to move up move up the hierarchy. He's like, it sucks because you fall in love with these animals., but you have to constantly keep the relationship in its proper place or they'll not turn on you, but they'll try and take your position. They don't try. That's the thing with animals. they don't try, they just doom. right. There is no knowledge behind instincts or reaction. So at the moment, your energy goes downam att the moment. so they' keep an eye on your energy, you know, But at the same time, you know, this kind of dogs are always in a high level of excitement. And they keep them that way. Yeah they're vigilant They they' keep them like like that. they don't know how to Turn it off So to create a great some family dog or even if somebody lives alone, it's no look, no touch, no speak in the first couple of minutes of contact Yeah until the dog becomes. peaceful and calm and open mind. So surrender means the mind is open So once the mind opens up, you can teach whatever you want, such as waiting such as being calm What if somebody has an anxious dog right now? they haven't been doing this and the dog is pawing at them and running around Should the person just stay completely in that calm space moving about and ignoring them, touching them, or should they be physically I mean like, you know, get off me type. Well this also had to do with how much exercise physically exercise the dog has received Right? How long as his walk. Be most people walk twenty, thirty minutes, that's not enough and the dog ended up and the house for twenty twenty three and a half hours. In my opinion, it's borders on abuse. It's really incredibly hard on an animal. That not the same say I love my dog And my first question is how long do you welcome? What is your recommendation? I realize it varies by breed and by age Yeah and by level of energy because some are couch potatoes, low level energy, some middle and some high, right? And so it depends on the energy of the dog. So not because a dog has a back of the pack doesn't mean they don't have high level energy Okay? becausecause the sled dogs. there is a lot of guys that go in the back. It's only one in the front if you notice, right? And even in the back of the pack dogs because they create a pack from middle back, right? And that's where they stay in that mode And so even the back of the pack, they have to have the same level of stamina as the one in the front So now because he's the back of the pack' couch potato. You know, So then then you have to understand the levels of energy that they're born with low, medium high Yeah. a lot of times people say, Oh, bulldogs are couch potatoes you can have a bulldog that is absolutely athletic. abbsolutely athletic. A has that D and out to go and you know, obviously you have to help him with the breeding part And because they they just go into, you know, no limits So you have to help him, you know Strummer has a lot of energy compared to Costella. Um, so Tw minimum thirty minute walks per day as much as a couple hours twice a. Wit a backpack on, right? Obviously the dog iss a little older because you know, the backpack adds that extra half hour 'cause now the dog is carrying something. So a weighted backpack. Yes. And how should one assess like percentage of body weight of the dog? Liket the beginning, you can just put a backpack because they's psychologically, you know, they don't want to wear anything, you know, Nothing that we put on them, they want to wear it. You know, a leash, a collar, a muzzle, a boots Ites't matter, doesn't matter. So psychologically that drains them R becauseuse they got to get used to it So you walk into the dog calm surrender to it and then you take it off And then the mind will become very drained Once the dog gets used to it and then you start putting weight, you can start with five pounds. Remember, every time you add something, you challenge the mind And the goal is simply for the mind to surrender You see it? And then the body, the body is going to become calm because it's wasting energy. So your job literally every day with a dog is to empty the tank empty the tank, you know, because a tired dog is never going to give you problems E true, ever. how? He doesn't have the energy to give you problems Right? And then on top of that, you create rules bs limitations such as just put food right here, but you can't touch it. So the mer has to be disciplined not to touch it thenen the mind has to learn instead of doing this. to do this and that requires self discipline. If you tell the dog, don't touch it or don't touch the human, donon't touch the food, Don't touch the cat They go into a con ornder stay and they wait Yeah the first thing that I taught strumers Um was to suppress Just as a general theme. He learned it right away. At eight weeks, it took about a day. Maybe even half a day because I had learned the hard way with Bustello, who was much more stubborn I could set food down Y. as a eight week old puppy because we went through the training process. He's not touching it until he looks at me. I can walk around the room, I can do whatever I want. He's tracking and then When I say, okay, then he's going to eat. I will just mention, there's an inhibition from the forebrain down to the brain regions that control impulses. And that's what we call top down inhibition, which is nerd neuroscience speak for what you're describing practically And I feel like it carries over to other circumstances more easily I can put food in front of them now and Leave the room. I don't do this for extended periods, but come back, he's not going toouch it.ep And then he starts to eat Now it's a little bit more difficult with thingsings that like trying to teach them to not be mouthy on So I have a rule. no skin in dog's mouth. There's just like it's all or none. Make it simple. because when it's really cute when they're a puppy, their teeth a little sharp and then you can kind of but I just have it's a thick black line And my girlfriend knows this too. L she's like, noobody wants to put. It's like no skin goes in his mouth. Th because that's a simple rule. Yep and If he does happens to, you, go for skin, I'll do the little Yelp thing. He understands right away Yeah People hear this They're going be like, this is terrible, right? You're putting food in front of him and he wants to eat and you're not letting him, but Could you elaborate why this is so important to the dogs happiness and wellbe? Be I believe it is, and I could see that in Costello. I see it in Strummer. there's a trust, there's a calmness, there's an availability to go more places Many people, they just like, he's hungry, she's hungry. They missed me You know, they didn't know what they were doing. Or they feel guilty because they didn't walk the dog playays a big role in racing dogs Well, then let's stay on the walk for a moment. What is so critical about the structured walk? I've been doing two hours a day or so obstruction since he was little. and people say that's too much for a puppy And I feel like he's been great with two one hour walks because I forget instincts. R? They forget instinct that a dog is instinctually is going to follow his parents to find food and water. right? Yes they do it after two months of age because otherwise they will stay within the den Right, But from two to four, they follow You know, they follow and somebody's always taking care of. You can see it in the African wild dogs. there is always somebody that supervises the litter but they allow them to follow Right? And then they they go to a certain stance because they're growing But as soon as a dog gets into six, eight months of age, that guy wants to walk more than thirty minutes guarantee He doesn't want to stay in one place too long So all these people with their dogs home all day, or some people will say, well, the dog has the yard, running around the yard. It's not the same, right? Being able to run around a yard. withith the yard, it becomes like the zoo, right? There's animal in the zoo with a yard That's not natural. That's just practical for the human Right? And the human feels like, okay, I have a backyard, that's where the dog does exercise, but the dog is going in circles. So exercise for a bird is for a fish you know, a bird have to fly, a fish have to swim, and a dog has to walk It's just the nature of each species Right? So the walk is the most important activity in my eyes R? Look at the homeless people with their dogs. Why they can walk a dog off leash? You were the first person I ever heard say that homeless people are the best dog owners. And the humans who are blind, The human who are blind dog is right next to them. A homeless people dog in the back Right? So what are they doing right? Well the dog is following them Right? They're in a follower state. And so the dog the dog that lives with the blind is not allowed to get distracted purposes to guide the blind. And the dog that lives with the homeless, he is not allowed to go in front. Consciously unconsciously, the dog stays in the back Nine out of ten homeless people have a pit buull And the dog is well behave off leash I see lot of them in my neighborhood where this is Los Angeles. It inccredible. Incredible, R. But in Mexico, every single dog in a thirord country, every single dog is a leash So that's in America, the American dream for a lot of people is to have a dog walk off leash Because people pay a trainer to train the dog to be off leash with this is the nature of. You seear it doesn't make any sense, you know, once you hear it is you just have to help them by practicing the ritual of not touch, not talk no eye contact. let the dog becalm surrender in front of you. Make sure they're in the walk. He's also in the same state of mind and before you feed him. Do this for at least three weeks Right? So you get into this habit Right there when you greet when you walk and when you feet So then this dog is going to have this beautiful silence, calm surrender. And this is the dog you bring into dog parks or dog beaches And then your job is to make sure that the dog that your dog is going play with had the same energy as your dog. You have to be selective, just like with kids, right? I don't bring my dog to dog parks. I use don't need to I'd like to take a quick break and acknowledge our sponsor, AG W AG one is a vitamin mineral probiotic drink that also includes prebiotics and adaptogens I discovered AG one way back in twenty twelve Long before I ever had a podcast, and I've been taking it every day since. The reason I started taking AG one and the reason I still take it every day is because AG one is to my knowledge, the highest quality and most comprehensive of the foundational nutritional supplements on the market AG one is designed to support things like gut health, immune health, and overall energy And it does so by helping to fill any gaps that you might have in your daily nutrition I get asked pretty much all the time If I could only take one supplement, what should that supplement be? And my answer is always AG one It has just been so helpful for supporting all aspects of physical health, mental health, and performance. If you would like to try AG one, you can go to drinkagG one d. com slash hubberman to get a special offer. For a limited time, AG one is giving away a free bottle of their new Omega three coenzyme Q ten product Omega three and Coenzyme Q ten are known to support cardiovascular health Cellular health and energy generally brain health and much more I personally take them both every day Again, go to drinkagG one d. com slash Hubberman. to get a free bottle of the new Omega three cooenzyme Q ten with your first AG one subscription. Today's episode is also brought to us by Eight Sleep Eight sleep makes smart mattress covers with cooling, heating, and sleep tracking capacity. One of the best ways to ensure you get a great night's sleep is to make sure that the temperature of your sleeping environment is correct And that's because in order to fall asleep and stay deeply asleep Your body temperature actually has to drop by about one to three degrees. and in order to wake up feeling refreshed and energized, your body temperature actually has to increase by about one to three degrees. Eight sleep automatically regulates the temperature of your bed throughout the night according to your unique needs. I've been sleeping on an eight sleep mattress cover for nearly five years now, and it has completely transformed and improved the quality of my sleep The latest eight sleep model is the Pod five. This is what I'm now sleeping on, and I absolutely love it It has so many incredible features. For instance, the Pod five has a feature called autopilot, which is an AI engine that learns your sleep patterns and then adjusts the temperature of your sleeping environment across different sleep stages. It'll even elevate your head if you're snoring and it makes other shifts to optimize your sleep. If you'd like to try eight sleep, go to eightsleep dot com slash Hubberan to get up toll three hundred fifty dollars off the new Pod five eight sleep ships to many countries worldwide, including Mexico and the UAE Again, that's eight sleep dot com slash Hubberman to save up to three hundred and fifty dollars I've followed your recommendation with Costello and also a strummer E exercise, discipline and then affection.ffection. bud. And for many people you know, they're going to hear that. I mean, it's a reflelective for you now, of course This is your Dlaine u But they're going to be like this but they don't want to walk for sing in the morning. I want to cuddle with my dog for sing in the morning. I mean My household now, I had to be really clear. If we don't follow this, we're damaging the opportunities for Strummer, we're actually hurting his psychological wellbeing. Yeah. The only hard part with him is he doesn't necessarily like to wake up early, but sometimes have to walk them early. so it takes a little bit of extra encouragement The day always starts. with a walk then disciplineed training and then food and then some affection. Yeah but it's not hours of like cuddling on the couch right. It's like a, you know, I mean I love him. I would love to pick him up and treat him like a little baby. R much more often than I do. Right. But I just see the incredible results that come from this exercise discipline and then affection. J' just living a natural life as love. You're right we want them to live as natural as possible And and so that's love. in my eyes, like exercise, discipline. discipline is not punishment. because that's a word and in the animal dog people, when they hear the word discipline on the dog, they put it as punishment. Yeah, they're thing you a teacher hitting them. Yeah, like punishing the dog And no, you' just making sure the dog follows the rules beind limitations. The dog follows a structure, you know, and that's what we call discipline. Right And that's how we achieve becoming well behaved or achieving success because we had to be disciplined Right. And so a lot of times what I end up helping people is understanding the word So So the block doesn't block the word doesn't block them from doing the right thing Right, which is your job a as a pet parent because now' the title pet parent Right? is direction protection? than love But most dog people want to do affection, affection, affection And when it should be exercise, this an affection, body my heart I think the walking part is so key, obviously. and I'll just say it. tell me if you agree or disagree, if you want, but I think most people are just lazy They don't want to walk. And if they walk, they don't want to do it without talking on their phone or looking at their phone and the dog consense if your energy is on the walk or the energy is someplace else. you connect, you disconnect or you're in a flex leash with a harm is on and you're in the phone, which are the worse Right Yeah Yeah. so it's the moment where you are connected to mother nature and through the dog, right? And people now, you know, they see, God is dog backwards. All right, so you're connected to spirit and you're connected to Earth. But you can be connected to technology And the phone is the same thing as the phone is for connection, communication and relationship, so does the dog connection, communication, relationship to God to earth, to you. And so then you create that triangle and then the dog is inside that bubble You know, o, this human is really respecting God, this human is really respecting earth. really This human is really respecting the moment. So you create this vibe Right? And the dog is in a follower state. So he's going to imitate the energy that you're in And what is prayer? An imitation of everybody doing the same energy? It's so fascinating that Your relationship to dogs has opened up this understanding of human behavior, but not just how we behave, but how we relate to the entire world, like did energetics as keeps coming up in our discussion. I feel I have other practical questions, but I want to touch on something that you mentioned before we started recording which is that in a third world country People are aware of death very early on And so the connection to the spiritual comes first All the rest follows. The complete inversion of somebody like me who was born in Northern California, It's like Silicon Valley. they call it that then. And you learn everything through the logical structures you know, science and science. Yeah And my dad's a scientist but even if one loves poetry and music and things like that, which I do order. is through the sort of like bricks on the ground first. but there's no concept of death actually until your grandparent dies or an animal dies or something. Tell me about this relationship to death and how it structures the psyche and the energy of people in third world countries because direct outgrowth of everything we're talking about. I think it's going to be extremely useful to people regardless of where they live in the world. I think that's the first step you know to learn not to be afraid of death Right? That's the first step because in America they don't want nothing to die, but it's just what it is, right? for life and death So it's just that's when in the Mexican culture, we have the Diaos Merto, the day of the death So we learned to be okay with it. We learn to accept it because you know, in Mexico, I Or thir our country, death is everywhere You can see it everywhere. You know, I'm from the north of Mexico, Sinaloa and you see people the chop heads in Kingop and, you know, you go to school and people they' dead So what what do you end up doing in this moment? You end up believing that God will protect you. That's your spirituality Right? And just like what, I don't want a person to break into my house. You get a dog R And so that the mother nature to protect you So for us, when we grew up that way, seeing death everywhere, we learned to surrender to this higher power Right? And we are what you believe, you know, So it's really good, you know and in our experience to be able to surrender to dead, but at the same time, we also surrender that somebody is going to give us direction, protection, love. The same thing is the pC leader Right? And we just surrender to that Right? as well, we surrendered to Earth, giving us food and taking care of Eth. because it's a combination of spirituality and instincts in a third world country. So it's almost like people in third world countries Please. They see the reality of death Yeah early and they place themselves in a sort of hierarchy. They look upward ofentimes not always, but oftentimes these are religious people, right? Yeah. My father's from Argentina and is a Catholic country and is Latinos for By design, we are taught to spirit first And then second is mother Nature Right. Yeah, it's numbered, you know, now that's the it's like an order And then you have to go to work Right? So job is number three. And then you have to love the family and then love is at the end R But it's God first, Eth second, which and then his family or work Well, here in the United States, it's raised very differently. first. And it's also this idea that stuff is the portal to Ha happiness. That. Having L's phone. Yeah, having access to all the app. Shoes. A lot of shoes shoes, bags. I gre up with one pair of shoes You know, we'm pair of shoes. And so we grew up with very nothing. but then so what how do we stay happy Right? How do we stay happy? So it becomes like a belief system, right And so that belief system It has helped a lot of people that I know that to stay happy It's just happy people with nothing whichich is the key, right? You first have to learn to be happy, healthy, loving, smart with nothing then when you have something And then you're already happy healthy, loving smart It just adds into your accomplishments Animals don't understand money fame power. Animals understand natural, simple profound So that's the part that I grew up in. Natural, simple, simple profileile. Natural is your instinct Simple as to love, profound as your spirit. Natural symbol profound So even if you're not smart, Right? You can still be natural, simple profound and have an amazing relationship with animals. inccredible Even if you're not, you don't know how to read, you don't know how to write. you don't know where Europe is. But you can still have an amazing relationship with God and with mother Nature and with your family And therefore, if you're good to those three, you're good to you I used to joke because I'd bring Costello to my lab with me In a lab of about fifteen people I'd walk in with him and to around he like walkinged into the lab, he'd see all the students and people working. He used to bring his toy around each of them sitting at their desk or trying to get them to play. know he was part of the lab and people really I like to think they loved him. They told me anyway that But I used to look at them sometimes and I think it He doesn't care that I'm the professor. He doesn't care. That's the best part about this relationship. He doesn't care. He doesn't care Even if we go home at night, sometometimes I would sleep in the lab back then doesn't care He just wants us to be together, He wants his walks, He likes to be on things. And I just realize he just kind of wants to be around debt joy of family, a laboratory. He just wants to be part of this. and it really helped me to just remove that concept that he even knew what roles were or jobs were just this place we went. I think dogs are a wonderful way to look at the world differently and realize different we are as a species, but also All these things that we've created. Like these are just human creations. Yeah. And they're important. jobs are important, obviously. but to not project that onto him, but also is very useful to not project that onto in the world I'm not going to point at any specific colleagues, but I knew people who are very who are very prominent in their field And the way they go into the world, He's almost disappointed because people weren't feeding them the adoration that they felt they deserved But no one cares, right? because they're in their own experience. And I just mentioned this because in your book and these teachings of that we've been talking about and today, they They taught me a lot about the human energetics. We're not dogs. so we can't just transfer that in. But it taught me that like most of the time when we think we're operating from a place of like knowledge and roles and all this stuff There's something that's been constructed by humans like a uniform. show this person's in charge. They have all the stuff that reveals their accomplishments, the degrees on the wall. Take that stuff away And It's a very different kind of interaction Like who's this person? likeike what are they about? like what moves them forward or back? Are they a good person or a bad person Are they scared and I think it's very helpful People learn to tap into this a little bit. You know, when I go to people's home, the human tells you the story And a dog tells you the truth just by just looking at her That's it. The dog immediately tell, this is the energy we feel, this is the philosophy we practice, and this is the actions we do. Immediately, the dog always he's the most honest member of your house. They don't know how to lie ? They don't know they don't know how to to do what we humans do They don't just just just don't. right? So it' I listen to the human because I need to understand, okay, where is this human stuck? Right? And then through that conversation, I go, okay, what about it? If we think of think of spirit, thinkink about silence. Do you like silence Okay, silence is part of the spiritual world And what about calmness? Calmness I think I'm calm. Okaykay. Let's breed And then I chang the instinctual world just by Breathing, right And then I start giving the information so the intellectual world is more simple It's more clear with the nose, eyes, ears. Rules by limitations. I'm just giving this simple information, right So your mind knows how to execute Right. And then when do I love? Hold on, just just wait. Wait And then when the dog goes Now That's when you love. because I want to teach people to love silence, to love calmness, to love an open mind because people had learned to love an excited dog, an interestious dog, a dog that that was a victim, right? So if you rescue dog And then the dog was in a bad situation, the person goes and rescue dog because he feels bad. And then that same person start telling everybody in the family what happened to that dog. So now the whole entire family feels bad for the dog So when they describe the dog, they describe the past So they learned to love the past. because they feel sorry for this dog. So the dog now is fearful, controlling the house. you know, has doesn't listen to the humans At the moment, I grab the same dog and I bring him to the ranch and I give him silence, calmness and be part of the pack, that dog changes They live in the moment. So really what happened to the past to a dog a month ago, a year ago is irrelevant. It's relevant. What's relevant is how do you treat him now And the only thing they need to become good is a safe peace environment. trust respect human with exercise discipline or exercise mental stimulation, activities then the love comes at the end Sfe peace, love, trust respect, love, exercise discipline, affection See, love is number three is a reward Right is a reward. How do you stay happy? Well, and then you are grateful How do you stay healthy? You learn how to breathe and do exercise? How do you stay smart? Well, you learn, you achieve and you give it away, or you learn to turn your mind off And then So when do I practice love? Well, practice love once you master your spirit, your instinct and your mind Th love that thing about you loveove those three things about you. Your silence, your fate calmness, your trust to you And then your confidence, your mind Love that Can dogs smell stress? Yeah. It feels stress, smells. But you remember it' the feeling of the energy that you have inside your electricity Right? you're not functioning normal. thenen that same energy is going to create a chemistry Right? Then you're going to sweat and I mean It's just going to go into the nose, eyes ears. But these firstus without the nose eyes ears, just the animal in them is going to sense When an earthquake is about to come, they sense it way before it trembles You see it? so that energy of mother nature is shifting at such a low level of sensitivity then we see, then we hear things. Humans are so obsessed with dog quote unquote intelligence that looks like our intelligence. Like if I see another video of like how many words a dog can learn or you, dogs doing tricks or walking on their hind legs, None of that impresses me. I also like cephalopods octopuses. I have a couple of them actually, and I'm fascinated by them. And people think they're extremely intelligent and they Maybe But I'm interested in their intelligence. You can find a video of a guy who taught an octopus to play a piano. But if you look at the training process It was just shaping, right? reward this and reward that video I'll go on records saying totally unimpressive to me. It tells you far more about the trainer's willingness to painstakingly shape an animal than it does about octopuses at all They I mean, I'm not saying an ant or a plant could have learned to play the piano What he did could be done with a horse. If it just had big keys So there's nothing interesting about this, but humans, we seem obsessed with transferring our Let's keep it to first world because that seems aligned here. Our first world understanding of what intelligence and knowledge is and skill is Putting that onto other species It's crazy. It's crazy. It doesn't reveal anything except our own short sightedness and stubbornness about being unwilling to think about these other ways of communication and moving through the world. is that self oriented first versus back oriented? you know, what is what the back needs Vversus what is what you want Right? So that is more like where when the human just wants a baby, for example, and they get a dog Humanizing a dog is a good for the dog, no. Right? It's not good. It's good for the human You know, it's good for the human fantasy and fulfillment emotional fulfillment or whatever thing they have in their mind But is it good for the dog to be a human. Why would he wants to be a human Why didn't I try it trying to do the same thing with a cat because what they say is a cat. So you can't humanize a cat. You see what I'm saying? So the cat sends the human to hell Yeah, because the cy only comes whenever he wants to come. so you can't influence anybody who doesn't want to be with you rightight? The dog, you have to teach them to live without you. He has to learn to keep you distant because it's a pack oriented. So you can influence a dog much quicker then you influence a cat You can't influence anybody who doesn't want to follow you. How do you feel about cats? I love cats. I love all animals. You know, I was going to invite you to the rrench because we have all these species and we can assess and evaluate your dog better, right? with the chickens and the dogs and different species so we can see the prey drive You know, and you can you you you you you are going to Be able to see, do you have a dog with prey drive and how do we block it? Right? Or you have a dog with clay drive and you just leave it open. Oh, I'd love to bring Strummer out there. It's a good place because your dog gets to interact not just with dogs by with other species that trigger Pray drive Very, very important because what makes your dog social is that he learns to accept others She I don't want a dog that has a a protective drive or I'm not interested in that. I just want a dog that accepts everybody Yeah, And that's a dog that is going to give you zero lawsuits Zero liability, right? because he accepts everybody. Oh ye, I know people California in particular whose dogs charged other people lawsuits like it even if they didn't bite, it's That's a whole thing. It could be a lasa absolute. It could be a dog that was not meant for protection But because he doesn't have rules but limitations. he doesn't walk and you know every day the dog is bored, confused, or frustrated. and then he releases that because he's a predator, dog by nature is a predatory. They're going to move forward to release energy You see it so But you want them to move forward with the right state of mind. Right? Or when you tell the dog to move forward Right? That's that's just discipline But people't don't have that kind of understanding. and the dog end up doing whatever they want, so the dog end up, you know, putting people in a lawsuit, which another another place where the dog doesn't know, you get in zoo about it, you know? So he's not going, oh my God we we're going to lose money, you know, dog is not going understand that concept And as humans, we project so much onto other species, other people. In the backdrop of everything we're talking about, I'm I'm hoping that people are seeing the ways in which They can show up in circumstances with more calmness., especially if it's not reflexive You know, before every episode, I I do. I ask for certain things, I try to open up certain things so that Um I realize not all of this is under our control. That's my belief and to try and invite certain things in. So it's not reflexive. I do it as a call it a discipline happy to do it, but I think People assume that you're either calm or you're an anxious person People assume that their dog's either calm or anxious This is a terrible Misconception. I think we can become calmer regardless of where we are in our natural levels of anxiety. Animals do not will never choose anxiety or be live an inchous life. We're the only species that follow unstable leaders Right? So to be the pack leader in the animal world, you have to be the most patient, the most calm, the most confident, the most loving, the most joyful. Everything has to be at one hundred percent. Then you can be a pack leader Right? And your job is to resolve problems. That's practically it. So the least thing you can do is to bring problems, anxiety, fear, insecurities, all of that stuff is something that you bring back home You don't want that So before people hit the door coming home, they should do a check in withself. a little prayer too God just Let me be silent, calm, confident, love, and joy to my dog That's it. I want to practice no doou, no dog, no I contact and just help my dog to calm down and then I'm going to give him aection. I'm saying that to give aection I'm just saying, give affection patience and calmness and open mind Right? Because when your dog misbehave, you want them to go back there Go back to your good state of mind You don't want the dog to do five flight avoidance Those are the bad state of mind. good state of mind is Patience canes render or happy or lucky Those are good state of mind. I think here I'm projecting a lot and assuming a lot. but I think a lot of people down I think they probably like that their dog is so quote unquote happy to see them at the end of the day. E. Be I think many people feel devoid of real love and connection and the idea that their' fur baby I really don't like this term. They're not babies, yes, they have fur, but like out of respect for animals We have to remember that they're animals first. When I first heard you say like they're, you know, they're Spirit animal. Yeah, you know, species and then breed and then the name the name It was so helpful for me because I don't want to get into it here because it's not directly relevant, but in science, I've worked with humans worked with animals, and you know, I stopped working with animals because it was really hard on my soul. Yeah. I understand biomedical research. I understand when there's a whole other discussion. But even just the way that people would start to talk about animals, like we work on them, not with them. And this is a complicated issue we could get into sometime, but I started to realize like we start using words to either dehumanize or humanize animals Both are terrible. both. So when I heard you give this description of, you know, a spirit, animal, etcetera, I was like, he's saying don't humanize these animals because it makes them feel unsafe Yeah. And all confused. orre confused. Yeah. And years later, I realized Again, with all due respect to biomedical research and the need to make discoveries, I do think there's too much animal research that's unnecessary. These kinds of things. some is essential, but et cetera But I realize there dehumanizing animals And I thought Oh my goodness, goodness. becauseuse I had this incredible contradiction in my mind. It was a real soul dilemma I love Costella I I It was like he was a family member And I was willing to do all this work on myself and with him, but In my profession, I was observing things where I thought this is Not okay. And I stopped. I'm work with humans. Even saying I work on humans, you hear signs disase, It is terrible Terrible And I think words matter to humans because they shape how we behave correct. And so I'm noticing a theme throughout today where You have words And simple ways for people to remember, no look, no touch, no speak. R? Eercise, discipline, then affection, etcetera. That's telling people people stuff in people language level that you're really interested in and you're trying to convey is animal experience and then the spiritual experience. I'm not trying to psychoanalze you here, but this is the structure that I hear emerging and I think will be very useful to people because we're going high level, low level all the time So peopleople start to think about themselves in this way and think about their animals. Why not I think a lot of people are going to say Oh no. I come home and I want to be loved by my fur babies and I want them to and I miss you and I want to do facime with you. and like, you know, I think people genuinely, however, want animal to feel safe They want their animal to feel secure. Number one. And when I think about real love, it's about safety and security first So For someone that has, like the other day I was in the hospital visiting a friend and the woman behind the counter we were talking she said, She said, I have two friend, she's. I said, Well, you work long shifts. She goes, Yeah, they're home alone. I come home, they're pooping in peening. I feel so guilty. That's right. And my first thought was, you shouldn't own those dogs, but she's in love with a dog Well, okay, so I passed along a little bit of what I'd learned. She And she just said flat out, I can't do it. I can't do it There's no way I could come home and they're going crazy and I'm and excited to see me that I couldn't just pick them up and just hold But it's making them anxious She's nurtery Yeah, the same nerves that is helping humans to be healthy, she's helping her dogs to be unhealthy It' so cont That exactly where you were going through, you know, working with humans versus working on humans, right? So she's helping other species Right? But the species that she's in love with She is not But that's because the story she is is accepting in her head. She's agreeing with that, right? I have so much guilt can't stop it, right? because that's what she's trying to do to number her her guilt When I was growing up, most people didn't have dogs in our neighborood, suburban neighborhood. There are a few dogs Now everyone's got a dog. It's like having a phone Everyone's got a dog doesn't seem like a good thing. It's a great thing for me because I love to teach people, you know about energy, philosophy and actions. I want people to have a trials, respect, love. The most incredible relationship with a dog is you know a dog really makes you a good human if you do things right. And then once you practice that, you can just give it to other humans because it makes it tangible. Is energy really work? Yeah. what about if I have a good philosophy? that that really works? Yeah, it works. What about if my actions are good? If that really works. Yes. Now you combine the three and watch what your dog does, right? And then you go and do the same thing with other humans Right? So you create this beautiful trust, respect, love with humans, or connection, communication, relationship, you go and create safe peace and love environments. Horse people are really good about safety Right? So So the priority in the hse world is not love. The priority is safe So so a horse person is going to teach a child Don't scream, not touch, not talk eye contact, right? So the kid will learn that with a horse, you have to be quiet, calm and wade into the horse. give you the signal And the same person will go and teach the kid with dogs ask if you can pet them But because in the horse world, safety is number one How do you keep the horse calm and your way And then the horse come, How do they walk a horse? The horse is right next to the human, never in front So people can people you can see a little kid walking a horse You see it? And the horse is behind the kid, not in front of the kid But first is the meeting. And then the third thing is feeding the horse If the horse is too excited Don't put the hay yet Wa uil the horse comes down, then the he you goes down. The meeting, the walk and the fitting incredible and they're big, so we have this natural respect for them peopleeople don't necessarily have for a dog, but a dog obviously can bite, you know. But why not have that respect for someone that we say, you know, man, dog, man, best friend? Yeah The dog has the best titles of all the animals on eararth The dog But when it comes to the actions, we don't honor the dog because we want the dog to be a human We don't respect the dog because we want the dog to be a human When you honor and respect somebody, you honor who they are You respect who they are You learn about how they are and that's what you love ee it You love who they are. You don't love what you think You love who they are And you don't try and project that there's somebody else I think Some people making assumptions here, but some people will hear some of what we're talking about today and they'll say, o, Well, that's how I should become the pAC leader with people. I should never let anyone walk through a door before me or something like The point you're try to make is that human to human is different than animals to a human.. You don't just transfer the same thing. Some things transfer, but other things don't. Yeah. I've worked with nonhan primates before.. It's interesting, a lot of people go to the zoo. I'm not a big fan of putting large carnivores and primates in zoos. I'm not. I wantanna be clear. don't issues with that. But people will smile at the monkey or they'll go like, you know, for a Macaque monkey Bearing teeth is aggression So a friend mine, she's animal behaviorist and she said, Oh, no, if you want to do an affiliative behavior with a monkey You lip smack which sounds kind of cute and funny And people go, o, but you could tell somebody that a hundred times. and they'll still go. it's like we want to project our own understanding of what we think is going on and even in the presence of knowledge dog is going to feel more safe and secure and happy if you come in no look, no touch, no speak. Yeah. There's something about the human brain where we just want to project. No, but I want my experience. And it's an incredibly selfish It was really the realization for me that it's very selfish of me to come home and want a certain kind of interaction with my pet Costello but to the interaction in the terms that work for me And I said, you know, this is the first time I owned a dog. Everyone in my life for the longest time, they're like, you', I was talking about it since I was a kid. You're never gonna to get a dog y. I waited until I had the finances So I had a home I waited. I am very proud of the fact that I waited. I desperately wanted an animal for so long since I was a little kid and things like that, but I wanted a dog. I knew at the time when I got them that it was the right time. Yeah But I had to be very careful becausecause I wanted it to go so well that I found myself projecting what if he doesn't attach? And there was all this stuff. And then I read your book and I realized I want this to go really well I have to get out of my understanding what I need on my terms and start thinking about He needs and I need in his language. Yeah And it was like this light bulb went off.. I'm just, you know, this is really a statement of gratitude that hopefully will be informative for people because we the human brain just is like, no, I want to be loved and so I'm going to do this thing that's actually harming the thing that I say is my fur baby Like no one would ever hurt their fur babies, but they're They're doing it by projecting human stuff. Anyway, I'm telling you what you already know, but think it's just something I really want to underscore because people herear affection last. like This is just a, you know, guys being like, I'm alpha. No. Thats the complete opposite of it's about respecting the animal Yeah It's about safe, peace, trust respect Once you have those two pillars Then you bring the love Because that's what you want to love. You want to love the treasndies. Not because you love people, you trust them Not because you love people, you respect them. So love is his own energy, his own, identity. You want to love trust. You want to love respect. That's what you want to love You want to live a place that you feel safe in peace That's what you want to love. That's the land part. Right? And then the relations tries respect. then, you know, the way you experience the world body mind heart Right? So at least those three things, just do it that way. you know, just put love at the end. It won't hurt you. It will only make you wiser, right? It will only make you more patient, more more more calm. And you will see the outcome The reason why I say no touch, not dog noy contact is because if you want to touch a back of the pack dog, he's going to run away If you give eye contact to a front of the pack dog, is exactly what the monkey means It means fight when you're looking at somebody. I'm w to touch them, right? And then when you talk to a middle of the pack, you're going to get him very excited. So if you practice not doion or do eye contact to any position of the back What you're going to allow is no ey sears to come to you You see it? so you're going to create a law of attraction The dog is gonna come to your smell And then he's going to assess and evaluate, can I trust Can I respect? Do I feel safe? Are you're a peaceful human? That's what you want them to know about you that you can be trusted, that you can be respected, that that you can be a safe source, a peaceful source. thenen once the dog you, okay, yeah, you have that thenen the dog is gonna to sit right next to you He's going to do this or he's just gonna relax. As soon as he gives you that, that's when you give love. There's nothing wrong if you wait a little bit There' nothing wrong. You just You just following the steps. you are the one who's being disciplined. You see, to be a good leader, you have to be a good follower So you have to understand the power of calm surrender. You have to understand the power of patience. If you don't understand that, you're going to be a terrible leader So I'm not telling people to be a pAack leader just because you're the dog owner. No, no, no. I'm telling what it requires to be a facul leader The highest level of patience, the highest level of kindness, highest level of confidence. and then knowing when to give love and know when to celebrate Love, joy is a celebration energy This one is direction protection What do we want of our PAC leaders, politicians? We want to We want to have an America that feels safe, peace We want to have a Mexico that feels safe peace. We want to have Argentina that feels safe peace We want to have a Colombia that feels safe peace We want to have a Venezua if feel' safe peace Otherwise we can't feel the love We want to have somebody that we trust and respect so we can love them That's what we want is our instinct to want this as our spirit to the want this I'd like to take a quick break and acknowledge our sponsor, Function Function provides over one hundred and sixty advanced lab tests to give you a clear snapshot of your bodily health This snapshot gives you insights into your heart health, your hormone health, autoimmune function, nutrient levels, and much more. They've also recently added access to advanced MRI and CT scans Function not only provides testing of over one hundred and sixty biomarkers key to your physical and mental health It also analyzes these results and provides recommendations for improving your health from top doctors For example, in a recent test with function I learned that some of my blood lipids were slightly out of range. As a result, I decided to start supplementing with natokinase, which can naturally help reduce LDL cholesterol And it did. In a follow up test, I could confirm that this strategy worked. My blood lipids are now back exactly where I want Comprehensive lab testing of the sort that fununction offers is just so important for health. I mean, how else are you going know what's going on under the hood And while I've been doing blood workk for years, it used to be time consuming, complicated, and expensive. In fact, I used to spend thousands of dollars per year trying to get this kind of data. and the data, frankly, were not all that good. But now with function, it's extremely easy and affordable The function membership is only a dollar a day, three hundred and sixty five dollars a year. And if you think about the information it provides and the health challenges it helps you avoid and the proactive things that it can do for you to enhance your health, I truly look at it as a savings. To learn more, visit functionhealth. com slash Hubberman and use the code Hubberman for a fifty dollar credit towards your membership. Again, that's functionhealth. com slash Hubberman These days, most leaders of countries seem to there projecting the most confidence that nothing can fasee them. That seems to be the competition on both sides of the political l. It's like who is more certain of the statement they're making? This is like and this is like just seems to be the thing we select for, not the traits you're describing Got my theories as to why that's so, but I think we can all look around and see how that's going. I just got I can learn a lot from animals, right? I think all leaders should show us you know, themselves with a pack of dogs so we can assess and evaluate their energy well You know because they they say the philosophy we want to hear Right? They always talk great about the intellectual part people want to hear. But then the energy and then the actions, that's what we end up seeing the end, right? Look at Mexico Right? We always o, a woman president. Mexico is going to be well takaking care. Same. No safe, no peace No trust, no respect. It's the same. It's a continuation of the same philosophy, but they all say great things You see what I mean? I don't like the dogs I say, you know, listen, I'm going to bring you back your silence, your calmness, your surrender. That's my contribution to you because your humans made you five flight avoidance I don't say nothing to the dog. I just feel it and I do it to say it. Because they don't care about what I say. they care about what I feel and what I do The human cares about what you say. So you can just brainwatch the human all you want, lie to the human and the human willote. We're the only species to f unstable leaders. There is no specy that will vote for somebody that has unstable energy. to begin with, they can't care less what they say I watched that series on Netflix' Chimp Empire fascinating, you know, it' very hierarchical you know, troops and the alpha O occasionally we will feel like he's losing. some control over his troop And he'll go in these displays where he starts breaking trees and being his chest. and They look a lot more like humans humals look a lot more like them But I saw an interview with Jane Goodall you've probably seen this where they said, you know, what what is your favorite thing about them? And she and she says, no, dogs are my favorite species. You can really trust them. The chimps like hum. They're way too much like us. They lie, they cheat, they I mean, if you watch Chimp Empire brrace yourself for, you know, when they decide they're going ostracize a member of their of their trial. It's they make them suffer an extended punishment. it's brutal And that's the primate brain Um, sadly, humans were Yeah. So as to move beyond that, that's our role. Yeah I'm making the assumption that some people either have a dog or they're thinking about getting one. correct Preparing oneself for every interaction sounds like the The thing to do until it becomes reflexive. It also, it's a lot of work. Like you describe a brief prayer at the door, setting intention. I think that's awesome Yeah. it Waking up in the morning Mhm I will say hello to Strummer I take care of myself first, move about. If he has to use the bathroom or something I'd let him out right away. but he waits And then he gets up and we do our thing the temptation to walk over there and just he's, you know, he's sleepy, He's a bulldog, he's calm and to just grow like because I love him. My heart fills when when I you know walk in the room with him. Yeah. I think this is the thing that a lot of people are challenged with, but they're like So For me Temporarily breaking down my notion of cuteness was very important. He doesn't understand cute, correct He has no concept of cute He only understands what he understands. I'm the one projecting like, o, but he's like, I want to cuddle him and I to play with him I confess this is easier for me to do now that I've done it with one dog before. It's much harder My girlfriend and she's like, she gets pulled in Yeah. We joke. You caved to love. we joke. you know, It's like we cavave to our own feelings of love. But it can damage the safety and the and the and the general pack order. And then people think, o, pack order sounds like not love. Could you elaborate a little bit on why it's so important to stay in the frame of We're really asking humans to think more like dogs but to behave in a way that is somewhere in between. eighty percent of my clients are women eighty percent When I go to their home because I like to assess and evaluate the dynamics inside the house The dog is in the front. Wife is number two K's her number three, husband is in the back back of the pack. This in the United States. the United States. Yeah, yeah, yeah. United States. So Um Why did Ogus in the front? She puts them there Why? Because she only practice affection And why the husband is in the back because she practiced rules bounders limitations with him You said look. So she is capable to practice leadership But she practiced it with the wrong member in the house The dog needs the leadership Right? Be whyy did they call me? becausecause now the dog doesn't the kids can't walk them you know, the the friends kids can come to the house The dog steals food Right? O the dog barks at the neighbors they don't have the ideal life that they chose or they thought they were going to have by having this labradoodle It should be the easiest one, right? because those two breeds are practically, you know, the epitome of like most docile breed. I know.. I tell the labradoodle people like try raising a bulldog mastiff, right Yeah from eight weeks on. you'll learn a lot about yourself. It's a different strength. Yeah, right. So this breed should be easier because it's the sign Theyon'll be easier But because they only practice affection first only affection. the dog ended up going in front of the pack So this is what happens when people want to practice affection first or when they prioritize affection to the dog to the rest of the pack It's very clear for me that she practiced rule bind limitations to the husband. He has to do whatever she said dog doesn't do whatever she says He's here So that we have to change, you know, we have to help people to understand. it's not that love is bad it's just, why are you giving love to? I'm so happy you're raising this. I think some people will say, well She has to treat the husband basically like a child because he's playing video games. I'm making the assumption here that we don't know what the dynamics are between the husband and the wife. Right. And I have a lot of married couple friends where it seems very balanced. I don't know what happens when I'm not there, obviously, but I know somewhere, yes, indeed, like there's some infantilization of the male. but he does that to himself too. Okay. He's behaving like a kid.. Or I also have seen very balanced and I've seen where it's a bit more of kind of the structure I grew up in at least for the early part of my life. Maybe it's because my father's from South America, but until my parents split, it was like my dad was the dad, and then it was my mom, and then you know, and then there was the kids. and sadly we didn't have a dog. But things are very different nowadays. Right? And so I'm trying to remove any assumptions that the dynamic between the husband and wife are that way solely because of one or the other.'s There's an agreement there.'s correct. There's always an agreement. Yeah,. The agreement is he surrendnder That's agreement. At one point, you don't want five flight avoidance, so the guy end up surrendering But the dog didn't. the dog took over. And you also don't want so domineering that she's in flight flight surrender. I don't want that. That exists too and that's bad also. Yeah. My relationship now with a woman is I have a good instinctual relationship My masculine energy is the the one who gives direction protection. When before, I used to follow this concept of happy wife, happy life. how can I make her happy? She has to make herself happy. so I end up surrendering to everything she wanted And so this concept of, you know, happy wife, happy life didn't work for me And so I just went back and to okay, I'm just going to become confident and attract a woman that wants to be surrendered to this area, which is the instinctual area Spiritually we're the same, emotionally we're the same. financially, you know, we're the same Um But instinctually, that's the part that I couldn't, I couldn't just not be masculine, right or calm confident. I just couldn't. I just couldn't And thats it works beautiful now. Oh it sounds like you've hit the bull's eye. Yeah there. Actually, since we're talking about human relationships, I have a friend who has a very happy, very successful marriage in the real sense that you walk into their home They have some they have a of kids, One of them has some special needs, but They're managing that well, the home is very balanced. They seem very, very happy And he was giving advice to some other guys. and he said, you know, among the women that would be like partners good partners for you. You have to make a decision about How much you want somebody who's going to give you instructions versus leave you alone versus once you know, some direction. It' a very edgy thing to say, you know, at the time now you can have these kinds of conversations finally Yeah. and it was very interesting. There were three other guys at the table, none of whom are married, including me, and we each had different answers to that question One said, yeah, I want somebody that I can like really be in like kind of wants to be led Not subservient, you know, obviously, respect and kindness, but the other one, he said, I want someone who's like really gonna to like keep me in line. I was like, I was very shocked. I was like, this is incredible. But he being he was being awes. He wanted someone who was basically going to like keep him out of his childlike nature. Okay when the childlike nature wasn't going to help right keep the structure of the home. I think it's a very important thing, this notion of We don't have good words for this keep us off of the barbed wire. L we hear dominance, hierarchy. and it sounds like control. It sounds like subservience. It gets into notions of like all sorts of things. But this is a fundamental aspect of the human spirit. That's the instinctual part Like I said, we can both love God at the same level We can love love at the same level and we can all develop our intelligence at the same level But when it comes to instincts That's the only area in my life that I know that my c confidence is going to lead Right Be that's what I do with dogs practically it I walk a pack of dos, so they're all gotta go and to a can surrender state And so in my house, I wanted the same thing because I want her to feel safe peace. I want her to trust respect I wanted her to love that about me But I have to be that man that has a high level of patience, high level of confalness, high level of confidence, high level of love. I need to earn that position. I don't just want it. I earn it but I need to have a woman that understands, you know, that that's what I'm looking for Right. Yeah, instinctually. Not in the mind, not in the hearts, it's temporary. No, no, no, this is permanently. You know, your instincts and I will provide safe peace I will be a peaceful man, a safe man to be with, a trustworthy man, a respectful man, a loving man R, smmart man, I will always work on having good energy and only fall on good philosophy. and only doing good actions because I won that position Did you take some time before your current relationship after your divorce sort of feel into this and think about how you were going to be that or Um, is this something that you decided to evolve in the I realized that I was picking I was picking the wrong woman Right? I was I was I couldn't understand why I can pick a dog and making the perfect dog. I can pick the perfect dog for you. likeike I can go pick it. I couldn't pick up the perfect woman for me. I just want The one for me What I think is perfect for me And so I had a trouble because I had the wrong philosophy inside my head, you know, what a man should do or what a woman should do. It was the wrong philosophy, period Right? Once I changed the philosophy, and then I went, okay, just I need to find a woman with this spirit, with this instinct, with this heart and with this mind So I was more like clear Right. Okay. now I know what I'm looking for. Right? And she's a back leader. but not in the house pack she has three restaurants Chlean But she earned it. She did it on her own Rady And and that was that was it. She came and say, I just want to give you my calm surrender I said, that's all I want from my want to have a beautiful relationship. So she knew that she wanted to be in the role that she currently is. Yeah Also, there was a knowledge of self going into it. Yeah, because when she, you know, she's doing her business, she has to be a pack leader. They get tired of being pack leaders Right They just just get tired of like I don't want to You know, give direction and protection twenty four seven s, even at home. So at home, she just wanted somebody to give her safe peace. trust respect. can't surrender Thus she needed to connect to her instincts. Right? it's important because, you know, she connects to God, so she's come surrendered to God. Right? So she comes surrendered to the business. She spe she needed to we comes surrendered to a men But it has to be the right man. So I was the right man at that time, right? because I earned the position You know, I didn't just my cheese was is you'ret ear in the position. You're just a man and dad d da. No no, no, no. When you arere a good pack leader, you earn a position You know who you are. You value who you are and that's what you love. self knowledge, self value, self love. So I did my rehabilitation for me because you know, even though my grandparent and my father taught me well about animals They didn't tell me well about women They say you make money and you get whatever you want That was it Yeah, that's incompleteteomplete. How do I assess and evaluate does the right women How How do I do? How do I make sure I do good connection, communication relations? Everything I teach with a dog How How can I achieve it with my same species I didn't receive information I just I would just given a project And I accomplished that. I became money fame power. and I just went and grabed whatever was available Well, I can certainly say, might be direct Yeah why I tapped its? I mean, I think my parents split because of a power struggle about roles in power. And my father' from a Latin country, my mother's not, But irrespective of that,, it didn't matter. I used to think that was the reason, but it now, fortunately, they both remarried. They'd been remarried for a very long time, very happily to have a newp And my sister and I always say like They're like with their perfect fit. Yeah. It just like works. because of exactly what you're describing, these these dynamics. Yeah. I mean, I think I didn't say it, but I saw online at some point, someone said, you know, the way you destroy a country is to get the men and women to hate each other And we see that a lot now. I like to think maybe things are improving a little bit, but so much of what we see because of anger at leaders, frustration with, you know Social dynamics and belief about what people can and can't become. all of this stuff has led to this place of a ton of distrust, but the power structure is all messed up Yeah, they fight flight avoid each other they say they love each other. And they still because there's an instinct there, they still desire each other Right? I mean, men and women are still seeking to be together, but You hear the they're, you know, all the guys are like kids and you hear the all the women are, you know, they want something that they, you know, can't be achieved in this common thing and you know, and I mean confusion. Yeah, a lot of confusion. And of course, I know some very happy couples that where they've worked it out But the roles in those couples seem very It's like they're being themselves and it just works. Yeah. Yeah. I just don't want to think about it I just want to feel it Right? I just want my spirit, my instinct and my heart And I know what I gott to do anyway, I'm fifty six, I know what I gott to do. But I just don't want to have a five flight avoidance at home I just don't want to have that Ever, ever, ever ever, right? So it it's very clear to me, you know, that that what I looking for is exactly what everybody looks for in a relationship human dog. Se, peace, love, trust, respect, love, body mind, heart, exercise discipline and affection, Follow, play, explore. Everybody wants the same thing. They just do it with a different species. I want to be able to do it with a different species and my own species. you know, and and and, uh and I'm I'm the happiest I' ever been I you you breathe and exude happiness, I have to say, it's real.'s tangible. It's amazing. becausecause I was already happy with my goal in life, right? My dream was to become the best dog tree in the world. And I became the dog whispper So I train humans. I don't train dogs, right So So this dream was bigger than what I thought But then I could' have a good relationship with a woman, which was fascinating to me at that time. whyy I have five flight avoidance Why I don't have come surnder happy your lucky come confident? Why don't I'm not saying my woman is not conf confident orwards me. If I'm wrong And then yeah, she can, you know, give direction protection, but if I'm not, there's no need All right, So that makes me a very consistent m with my with my role That's it. I keep my peace, I keep my patience, my calmness, my confort, my love much every single day of my life I don't miss one day if I don't feel good You see it? h internally. I'm a hundred Because with people, it only takes once to be on the receiving end of an outburst to just there's always that little asterisks going forward. I share with you the desire and fortunately I have it now to not have fight or flight at home. from a dog either or from a dog either. right I' always sccaary exactly. So I'm guessing that the home you grew up in had a fair amount of fight or flight. Otherwise, maybe that It was very very machismo. you know, My parents still li marry But that's so, you know, it was it was this way that's it, you know, So it was definitely a more like sadness Because my mom was not allowed to do her own self. you know, and so that's obviously not healthy for for the dream of a woman Right? So she has to, you know, have just be a mom and stay at home. and it was It was hard for her, you know. Um That That's all I saw, you know When my dad was disciplined was disciplined with anger And with my mind with discipline, with disciplineed with guilt Yeah, and that was it, but It worked a little bit Then I come to America and says, Ah, this It's a completely different way of looking at things Right? You can work on your energy, you can work on your philosophy, you can work on your actions And then you can become just as good as you are with a dog Because I have an credver relationship with dogs, right? and an incredible relationship with God because He definitely allowed me to become what I dream about Right? And I came and do it in a different country. I have to learn a different language Right? And then I went all over the world That was God, right? Me following the Spirit and the instinct Now I can tell you how I did it But in the beginning, when I jumped the board, it was all spiritual. it was all instinctual, it was all passion It was not the mind doing it. It was just my spirit and my instinct and my heart J following this dream. R And adapting. I have to learn this, I have to do this. But then at the same time, I saw a lot of great things in America You know, like you can beat you. Oh yeah This is a good philosophy. The Stoics' a great philosophy, right? Um and then your actions, okay and just w. Shoulders up, head high Bed. Walk And that's pract your body language, you know also exudes what you're thinking and what you're feeling And because I'm with dogs all day, I just keep that energy twenty forty seven Beautiful. The u as a practical tangent. the thing about just shoulders back and walk, I think it's funny to see when people try this. they like. I'm going to be the back leader That doesn't work. I'll tell you, really doesn't work with a buulldog massiff. No.ake. if you get frustrated with them, they feel it and they pull back. It's wild They just can feel it. likeike if you're frustrated, let's go. It's like, no, I'll sometimes give a little bit of a stern I have one little command that I occasionally use, I keep its potency But if Costell or in this case Strummer is really being stubborn just for stubborn sake And that's it. That's all. But if I do that more than three times on a walk, it loses its potence. Correct. It's just my way of saying like no. It's just a no. Yeah. But I don't say no And if I will it, Yeah. And if I were to And I'm realizing as I say this, that little is probably more of a reminder to myself Yeah. as much as it is a reminder to him. happened to both. Yeah. I'm just kind of trying to create this thing like, no, we're go, I lead this walk. you need this walk. I need this walk. We're doing this walk And he just He goes. Now, it's a little bit tougher when my girlfriend walks in he tests her more So can we talk about that when a dog is veryy respectful of one person, obeys the boundaries But then to other people, they' How should that be remedies? If the three of us walk together, for instance She'll do whatever she she wants withith me, he does whatever I Yeah, okay But sometimes with her, she'll say, he was great. No, he was really difficult How does one facilitate that? I think the first thing women have to realize is how much they are in their emotions. and how much they think about things. Right? So you know, the fact that we go into the silence and the calmness and just we follow through that's the spirit, the instinct and the mind And that's what that's what it's walking the dog But in my experience, women go into the emotional And vibration And then there's a Castello, Mamanos and they begin to have an intellectual conversation So the dog knows that that human is only using half of who they are, which are the heart in the mind Right? And so it's very important for women to remember the spirit powerful thing and say, how are I going to practice silence instinct is a powerful thing. How am I'm going to practice instinct breath cal ins side, R? And you just want to go from point A to point B, very simple, very practical. You're not negotiating, you're not looking at anything else, you're not distracted You just can't for the task. And then the dog just follows that silence, the calmness and the confidence. is when the human doesn't use the vibration, the dog has an option to get distracted. to do other things, to go away from the routine of from the structure from whatever you want you want to do. But at the same time, the same woman can ride a horse And in order to ride a horse, she had to be quiet, confident. Oh, yeah. My first girlfriend was she had horses at home. Yeah. They had a stable below their home. They actually weren't that wealthy, but her dad actually had like not even a junior high school education. He came over from Greece. He became a taxi driver. And he was gonna give his daughters this life. and they had this horse and It was incredible to see her. because she's a very, very quiet person actually, very artistic. And but with her horse and he was a wild one, he was geildlded late. And so it was a whole thing. her in the presence of that horse, like she just understood because he was dangerous. He was actually a dangerous animal. and a totally different side of her came out.. And so it the first time I realized I was like, I mean, I was a teenager right? But I was like, w she has this immense power. correct. It's not like the kind of power that we think of. Of course, women have power. you know, all this. It was a completely different landscape And I was like, whoa, I mean, first of all, I can't do that. Right. I had to learn to be around him. But just that the level of calm and confidence too clean a horse, like you know, you This horse can kill you. Yeah, right. But if you walk around going, o my gosh, this horse can kill me does not go well. But exactly you know, so what we have to remember is the human par before the gender Right? So just go back to your human. Can a man and a woman ride a horse? Yeah. Why? Because they're using the same energy and the same philosophy and the same actions. So it' it because it's a man or a woman, no, no, it's because they're using the same energy. So' a human thing Right? Not a gender thing. right? So I invite, you know my female clients to don't forget, you also have this calm confidence inside of you that your dog needs, right Craves, especially in Europe because most of the time people call me because the dog is in a fight state, right? So most of my cases are aggression And so in your case, you have no choice. You have to lead the pack And the only way you can lead the pack is with calm confidence You love the pack with love and joy. So you already know how to do that Right? You have to get you have to tap into what people call masculine energy Right? So can a woman ride a horse? Yes, she has to be in this energy to do it You see it? She has to. So she they just have to learn to recognize, okay, I'm not changing me. I'm just using everything about me Right? It's like a man. Can a man use a feminine side? Yes, you can, off course, you have it Right is you love joy and your masculine as you're calm confident Silences for everybody Patience. Rise of silences before Calm confidence or love joy And this is what they call feminine and this is what they call masculine Right? So' however you want to call it, just be the whole human Use your spirit, use your instinct, use your heart, use your mind Frust respect love and then do whatever your mind wants to do has nothing to do with women or men If we deivite and we see each other different I said, no, it's because I'm a woman. I have to be emotional. Yes, you can be emotional at the right time J like a manen can be emotional at the right time Nobody's saying that to be loving. What we're saying is how to use this energy for good. where you reward good behavior on humans and good behavior on dogs with the energy of love Right If the energy of love can change bad. It will be no bad man in the world Right? Because moms normally give you love. But love doesn't change the bad energy is the calm confidence that change the bad energy the idea that, you know Society is broken, humans are broken. I mean, there are a lot of problems in the world right now Purpose leap, by the way Tell me more If we get the wrong information, we're going to be No connection, communication relationships. So how can we become powerful? Right? Becauseuse when we unite and then we become powerful, the pack unites But if the pack is separated, the pack fights fight and avoid each other Right. So purposely we get the wrong information. That's why my goal is to give people the right information. If you have low money, middle class richher, it really doesn't matter. We should all know the same thing about dogs We all know the same thing about God. We should all know the same thing about earth All of us has nothing to do with what position in the backag youard economically speaking. y it. So What is that wor it looks like? Well, that wor looked like like all humans around the world, regardless of the economical position, they're all going to have an amazing relationship with dogs How? Because they all have the same information That's it. I love that. I mean, I feel like we we're drifting further and further away from ourselves as as a species And what I'm hearing is that lookingooking at our interactions with this other species dogs and looking at our practicing our ability to get outside ourselves and tap into other aspects of ourselves. likeike the need for calm confidence when we just want to be loving, That's really about wanting to be loved. Yeah. You know, the person coming home is not it's not that the dog needs their love. They can hear Oh, you know, actually the dog needs calm confidence. but I translate it as No, this person just feels so tired at the end of the day. they need is something that just adores them. Yeah You know, and the whole process of raising Costello was One of Reading your book, reallyally? is this is why you're here. I mean, because I saw and experienced so much value from your teaching. and then realizing that If I really want to get what I won't. Yeah It means building the relationship means not doing this thing in the moment. I'm thinking about the whole relationship safety first. right. And so it's couter intuitive thing of needing to go against self in the moment create the sort of picture where you get so much more and everybody wins. Yeah. There is a version of everybody, including the dogs wins. Everybody wins, but it requires a level of Self discipline, awareness. calmness, breathing that I think many people And certainly in that time, I felt like just so much constant pressure to do do do So there's a certain amount of slowing down and self awareness that's required for everything that you're describing What is your justust for that on a daily basis. I mean, you're a master now, right? You're a virtuoso at this for the I would say there's unskilled skilled, master and virtuosity. You're up backack on the back of the backround. But so for somebody who's trying to move from unskilled to skilled in the domain of like sllowing down, thinking about what the priority in this interaction is, getting all that working while life is happening in real time lot's happening and it' coming through the phone and this and that schedules How do you recommend young or old Oh start to cultivate this awareness in this. I think the quicker we become aware what is life about Right? Be we're all going to die And so what is life about And life is about life, right? Life is to be happy, to be healthy, to be loving and to be smart. That's life. And then it's time. how you structure, how you manage time Right? And then it's memories. That's all you take. Once you realize those three things I think you're going to be able to focus and experience life U The way animals do because they're very grateful of life, the structure time very wisely. And then by the time they die, they only take good memories Right? Be that's all you take. Good memories And so the quicker we surrender to that concept the quicker we are going to focus on what what's valuable Right And what and things that we can definitely practice that this concept of love Right? And so that to me is Be grateful of life every day, be thankful of life every day. You know, learn With your mind to learn, to achieve, give it away. It's very important to be at service and make other humans, you know or animals, you know, achieve what you just achieved. Of course, you know, the energy of love to love those three things about it, right? Your spirit, your instinct and your mind Learn to love that about you because that's who you are So who sees him Milan Ses a Milan is a spirit, He's an instinct, he's a heart, and he's a mind R And then man, I value that so much And And that once I value that, it's easy to love what you value You see it? It's easy to l what your valume And so once you realize this natural simple, profound self, you want to give it away I give it away to dogs and because I do that, I get to rehabilitate dogs, the people consciously have confused Yeah? becausecause dogs in America, you know, dogs in country are skinny, but they don't have psychological problems. Dogs in America are chunky and I get to have a TV show. So dogs in America should be the happiest, healthiest, loving, smartest dog on Earth. because that dogs in America have rights You understand that concept? But why would a guy from Mexico? Cstant America and National Geographic gives him a TV show Because America created f flight avoidance unconsciously Even though America loves dogs more than any other country I've ever seen in my life Dogs have birthday parties in America. Dogs have Christmas presents in America. Dogs get merryed in America I see it very ye os That's, you know, taking the humanization to another level, but that's that's just shows you, you know, the the The creativity of human But now because the dog has all this money, fame and power, the dog is happy My goal is for people to understand know happiness and health and having a good heart and having a good creative mind You shouldn't think too much, right? It's just about being grateful Right? It's just about being thankful It's about loving those two things and then make sure that your mind learn, achieve, gives it away or learn to turn it off. So don't use your mind to think bad things What's your process for turning off your mind. This is a very common challenge for people. I think the easiest way for people to experience because they have to see it, right? You can tell people. But if they don't see it inside, they're never going to see understand what you mean So what I help people with is I put him in a cold plunch. Right? And once they go to the five flight avoidance, they want to see and they get to the calm surrender, what are you thinking? I'm thinking nothing. as exactly what clear mind looks like. right? So through that co plunge experience, the human gets to understand breath Patience you know, confidence and not to think anything because you're doing this with your spirit and your instinct and your heart This is your mind just have to wait for the three minutes. That's it without anticipation. So there's just nothing there Right? And then of course, the call doesn't let you think. Right? But the only thing you can do is breathe. R right wait And so then once they see it, okay, that is the meaning of not having nothing in your mind Right. So I make them experience it versus if I just tell them They can't picture it As somebody who's a real believer, as you probably know in deliberate cold exposure, I mean, I think it's people it's zero cost. I mean you use a cold shower, you know, it saves on the water bill. So this isn't like having to run out and buy something What it tells me because of the cold plunge immediately reliably releases adrenaline. J which then wakes up the brain as well. Do your instinct. shhuts down the fore brain. The very fascinating that you're saying this because Fore brain is strategy, etcera in the first twenty or thirty seconds of deliberate cold exposure, the prefrontal cortex, which controls All the top down inhibition of impulse is it's not shut off, but it is greatly diminished. You can't strategize well. You're just thinking out, you know So You're saying people need to get past the point where they're trying to suppress impulse, but they need to experience adrenaline. That's right. Got it. Yeah That's right. And gets a piece. Yeah. And that's the energy to bring to your interaction with your dog. Yes. And ideally to your spouse and your kids Everywhere everywhere. so a human after a cold planche brings that energy away. You don't have to talk. Everybody knows your energy feels really good. all because you went to mother Nature That was mother nature, Cole Rice water, coal, That's mother nature R So imagine You bring that energy to to meeting a dog to walk in with a dog, to feed in a dog That's it. That's all I want people to experience because everybody wants They want to do that Right? or they want to do I'm not aware of how I feel, I just want to give affection You see so that so that that It's good for the human, not necessarily good for everybody else. Becauseuse that human spreading that energy So my goal is for people to spread, you know, silence, confness, confidence, love, joy because that's exactly how you feel after a coldplunch. Exactly in three minutes, you get into that stage. You have to learn to love, you know, the process of I'm gonna fight flight avoidance But I'm not going to listen to that part of me. I'm going to listen to my cal sur. I'm gonna listen to my calm confidence And then once I finish, I'm going to listen to my happy go luck And that's all you want. That's it. Th three state of minds are super powerful You know, I've thought a lot about deliberate cold exposure adrenaline and nore epinephrine, you get this long arc of dopamine that lasts hours and hours and hours afterwards. And my critics will say, well, it's just dopamine in the body, not in the brain Actually newew finding show it's dopamine in your brain and body. L arc of very few things produce this thing of long lasting dopamine drugs while spike and dramin Well, good relationship with a dog is long lasting d on me You know, a well balanced dog is a long lasting whatever you want. you know. I hope you want the four worlds, your spirit, your instinct, your heart and your mind, all of them by walking. Just walk with the dog for a long period of time and then you do your play explore that The best medicine any human can get. It's the amount of peace that I still get from my relationship with Castella. I mean, he's passed now, but he's still Yeah every believe in a spirit uh is I mean, I very not wor it makes me well up, you know, not of sadness. It's like I can feel the love of the relationship. You know, I had to ask and on my list and I'm going to ask, this is the right time, I believe. So as Costello got it eleven years old.'s pretty old for bulldog.'s right. He had some sort of spinal stroke. He couldn't walk. He was falling over. I was like distraught. How can I get this fixed? And at some point I realizeed, you know, when people say like they'll let you know Yes I had a feeling and then a thought and it went something like this I made a contract with him take care of them. Yeah and in the contractor being a really good dog, own but like mostly in the contract of the relationship, I owed him a peaceful exit hated going to the vet, so I got someone to come to the house and do this thing Most people, they hate the concept of death especially in family members or a dog on I think it would have been useful to me to understand the day I got him someday this is going to end. Yeah And I think like this thing about Honoring death is a real thing so important Because that last two weeks was a real struggle between me and myself. My desire to just keep it going. and I realized I was being selfish. It was about me. And of course gave him the best passage I could And people in my life who knew me and knew my relationship to him, they said, I actually can't believe you did it I'm surprised you were able to But the moment I realizeed like this is the final line in being in the contract of being a really good dog owner And I was like, of course I have to do this. Yeah. So No one likes this topic Given where you're from, what is your relationship to the concept of death as it relates to dogs. And the question is very specific here. Do people say they know, they'll let you know? Yeah The question I want to know is Is it okay to show your dog sadness? or does it make the dog that's dying more anxious. With my kids because I have two kids and you know, obviously we have a pack of dogs. they have experienced dogs passing We always make a celebration I always bring them to their favorite place. So I definitely bring more the energy of happiness. and I ask my kids, if you're gonna cry or whatever, just do it away from them Otherwise you hold a Right? So I don't I want them to go back. That's why it's so good to think to believe in God because they're going back to the source So They're way better with him than with, you know, here and. I did my homework right too also. So I feel really good. that I gave best life for that particular dog, right And so when it's time to go, they tell you, they tell you they can, you know, as many, many signs. But at the same time as, you, when it's the day, is everybody happy Everybody's happy.re we're going to dance, We're going to celebrate We're going Uh, you know, it's a ritual. You can make a sad ritual. Or you can make a happy ritual. You see it's time for him to depart, time to go So when I die, I want everybody to be happy. I don't want no Sdays. I Listen, my life is beyond what I thought Right? So I give the same life to a dog. Same is I'm very dedicated human Seven days a week. U Even if I don't feel good It doesn't matter. I go and walk that path I'm very committed Right? It's all about honor, it's all about respect. That's my way of showing my heart. And in my mind I don't have one day that I I did wrong by them So when it's time for them to go, it's time for them to go, but we're going to make happy about it because they're going back to God. That's how I see it And, you know, as you as as you're talking about, the spirit never dies. You know, the spirit never dies and it's an opening for me to help another soul and another soul because that's why I'm here, right? I'm here on earth to my time can be used wisely to keep helping. And that's what I find, you know, my inspiration motivation. That's it Beautiful not what I expected, and I'm so pleasantly surprised. He challenges me to even say it because he's still so new, but when Strummer dies, Yeah, the last twenty four hours of his life will be a celebration. Yeah with him. Yeah, celebration. All right. Yeah. All right.' happy sppirit, you know, saying love. Dance, you know, just happiness Be they once you start going like this, they don't they they get worried You know, and then the spirit lingers You don't want it. You just want it to go, you know and for them to give you direction protection. This, you know, I have a big pack on heaven You definitely have a big pack waiting for you. When I go home, ye I' gonna to have the, you know, how many dogs I have I saved my life So he is yeah, I'm going home I love it. You know, Earth is a beautiful home, but it's temporary. Well I believe this too. You know, I've talked a bit about my faith. now's not the time, but I'm, you know, my audience knows I'm very very much in agreement that, you know, this is this is an amazing phase of us. Yeah. but it's not the only phase. and So if people are feeling sad. likeike, you know, the number of people I know who turn to their dog for emotional support. Yes around a loss of a loved one or a breakup or loss of a judges of the world, whatever Yeah is your Stance on that is bad because they're passing that attion the dog doesn't know what happened Yeah. But I mean, obviously they're going to help you absorb the energy, but after you did that, just take him to the beach so you can let go to the energy. Same thing when you bring a dog to a hospital, right? and the therapy dogs They go to hospitals, you know, kids cancer,. de pressed people blah,ah blah, That dog absorbs that energy Just like you will and absorb people's energy. Y job is to go and let it go So every time you give b energy as, you know, help people or help dogks to get rid of that energy that is not healthy for them Yeah, utilize it, you know, is available But again, you can also go and take a cold plunch before you hug the dog. and that way you kill that energy. you know, kill that energy. just kill it and only give good energy to your family Give good energy to your home' discipline It's easier to just to go and throw up negative energy that you just grab. It's easier. but then you spread the whole thing everywhere Oh man, I saw in so many laboratories where the boss brilliant scientists thinking of one in particular, and they would do this like what I would call trickle down anxiety. They'd be stressed and they'd walk through the lap, stressing out. Graduate school is already hard. Yeah especially in the If I may in the sciences. Yeah. Very, very hard. veryery competitive Post stoc is even more uncertain. likeike you don't get a degree at the end, you're investing five years of your life, know And to walk around the boss walking around like making people anxious. Yeah, terrible. The other thing that was terrible was walking around, making people feel overly confident. People would do that too. So everything you're saying, it's like you could see it in these very hierarchical human relationships. But I think with dogs, we we're so I'm just going to say it. I feel like We are so selfish as a species. like that these animals are here for us and just for us to give me love when I get home, to console me when I'm I'm sad, to give me all the things I want. Yeah that I would be blind to the the basic needs of that animal. as really is it's as selfish in my opinion as saying, oh, these are animals that we work on that just serve our purposes to advance our careers or scientific understanding. And again, there's a place for that, but we have to be incredibly nuanced about where that's appropriate and where it's inappropriate It is a selfishness. The selfish part. in the unselfish part. So what I'm saying is don't forget to be at service before somebody is at service to you Right, So the spirit instinct, love to be at service And then they love and the mind loves to be served So this is your selfish part of it. And this is your unselfish part of it You see it? So you are here to serve God and you're here to serve Eth. All right? So don't forget that to be at service because they skip it. So once you go directly to the heart and the mind, this is what I want. I want my dogor to love me, d. Okay, fine, you just skip spiritited instinct R? Be the sppirit would never bring bad energy to the heart instinct whenever bring that energy to the mind You see? So so if you remember that you are four things and this is what you want to give to your dog, to yourself, to your house, to your family. And then you're going to be focusing on making sure that you snap out of it, whatever like you do on yourself, snap out of it, right? And then and then you go bring You know, patience, calmness, confidence, love. Th you go hug the dog So you also have to learn to snap yourself out of it from whatever energy you went and attract. It's like stepping on poop. You got to remove your shoe before you walk into the house. otherwise you bring that in. So energy is the same way. It's like poop on your feet Bad energy is the same. You're going spray all over the house. Absutely. Your plants are going to die. you know, yourour dogs are going to be like, okay, this energy is not good. Right? And then your family will get it So you enter you're going to enter into this dark energy Th these days on social media, there's so much I'm realizing about the low level Um stuff like You should never hug a dog You should hug a dog. You should never pick up your dog off the ground. Yeah. It's okay to pick up. yourour dog should never be in your bed. Yeah. Y dog should be in your bed. You see all these contradictions, you see the same thing in the health space Yeah. Like you should cunch, you shouldn't call punch, you should saun it, you should like comes down to a basic fact, which is that it's not about the It's principle behind it, the spirit behind it, the energy behind it. So I was tempted to ask you like is it bad to pick up with the dog? actuallyually Strumer loves being held because still hated. Yeah. Strummer he's basically happiest just being carried around. I know you don't I don't carry around too much But it's funny, he just drapes. Yeah. He's so happy that way. He wishes he could go through the world that way, frankly. It's not about carry or don't carry. No. It's about What is your energy? Why are you doing this? Is it for you? Is it for them? What's Okaykay Any if the dog feels because you know, you can ask a groomer or a vet They have to carry that dog. but they can't carry a five flight avoidance. They can only carry a happppy go lucky one or a c surrender one. are So it's nothing wrong hugging a dog. It's nothing wrong putting a dog on the bed. It's nothing wrong. It's what state of mind the dog was in When you did this is more important. Because what abouty a dog is in a flight state and you want to carry him He's going to feel trapped And then the dog was gonna to bite or was going pee was going to scream Right? So you could have prevent that just by now focusing on what you wanted to do is the dog that you want to do that in a calm surrender state, right? Can the dogs stay on the bed There's nothing wrong, you know, sharing your house with the dog is think about inviting versus inviting Okay, so when the dog goes on his own, He's inviting. When the dog is waiting, then you tell him to come over and you tell him where to go, that's being invited So that mind is going to become surrendered. The other one is going to get territorial You know how many times I have rehabilitated dogs who claim people's bed where the husband can't come near Oh bed because the wife and the dog were already there. I done a rehabilitation where the husband sip and the living room for three years Puse She wanted the dogs to stay on the bed. And when every time the guy came into the bedroom the dogs well after. I'm sure everyone is thinking, what did you do wrong? This is, you know, we're living in this time now where there's this projection of like well, he must have done something wrong. I don't I can also imagine the situation you just described where no one did anything wrong except give the dog too much power. cororrect. That there's actually, let's assume there's no problem between the couple. Correct. She would like the husband in the bed Perhaps but the dog is somehow picking up on something. G, No, no, she said it clearly to me. I just don't want him on the bed The husband,. Okay, so the dog is basically taking advantage of the. listen, let's say you guys want to spend twenty minutes on the bed, let me show you how to do it And so that's what I tght the dog just to wait. Wow, right. But she needed to make sure that she agrees with agreement, commitment followed through her. Nothing can happen without agreement. So she needs to be in one hundred percent agreement Otherwise a dog would not do it They really can sense. Yeah, any kind of small fraction of Eergy goes down, they're going to take over. Your energy goes up, they're going to move away Right? Your energy have to be bigger for you to create a follow If your energy goes down, you follow them simimple as that simimple as that. You just have to remember energy Right? And then if you want to lead, this is the animals. You can lead humans lying to them all day long B with animals, you can You have to bring the perfect energy, the right energy An energy that belongs to all of us, right? You' patient energy, you calm energy, you confident energy, you love energy. We all have that. inside of us Right? God gave us all the same things That's up to you to go from the back of the pack to the front of the pack. That's up to you But you have patience, calmness, confidence, love, joy, because that's how you're going to deal with life Right. So with animals is a perfect way to maintain this you know, within yourself. Right? It's like a gym going to the gym every day. But it's just the gym it's mother nature, the beach, the streets, whatever. you're just walking around with dogs in a natural simple profound way And that's it. And then you got to work Imagine if people develop this beautiful habit, Okay, I'm going to do what Caesar says, You know, silence, confalness, confidence, love, joy for thirty, forty minutes and then I'm going to feel the silence the confence, Then I got to work Right And when I come back, not talkouch you, not talk to my contact, send my dog back in her, and then I can do the greeting Th thenen I go for another walk And then you can do the play and explore. No bad behavior would happen in your house. with that simple formula. I love it. I hope that people start to think about their dog and getting a dog as more of a gym as opposed to I we're going to get a fur baby. I have a friend, have to be very careful here. This is truly not about my household, but I have a friend. She's married. They're going through some struggles. They have two kids. and she told me the other day they never had a dog. She's going get two Husky puppies And I said Do me a favor Just get one Yeah in six months if you but they want each other. This is not and the kids are young. There's no and and I know the struggles that they're having and's they're both overworked. They're under resourced. so this is And they love each other very much, but this is like a really hard situation. Right. And I'm thinking to myself want to be supportive. And I said Do not. get a puppy now. and if you do do not get two puppies. Yeah. This is like insanity Yeah. Like you like you want to like it could break your family And she said, I promise the kids break your heart because you have to get rid of the dogs. So this she said it was a story. It's very interesting. She said when I was growing up, my parents would make these promises and they wouldn't do it. And I told and it broke my heart and I told my kids they could each get one. And I said, Well, you have no idea the kind of heartbreak they're going to experience when you have to give them both back because One is biting the kid or one is like and she' like, Oh, I wouldn't want them. And I was thinking myself, and you're already under resource. Yeah. I share this because I'm realizing throughout today's conversation, our concept of dogs and what they owe us is completely backwards. She's a very good person. Yeah. I won't state her profession for st but she's in a a profession of intense service all day long and has I've known it for more than two decades. But the concept is these puppies are going to come here and rescue us. Yeah. This is likeillulfill the dream that I had. Yeah, right with prior to, you know, with my parents. More love just more love can't be bad. M love can't be bad. Yeah. And they're huskies, right? So this is a breed they love to migrate longer than any other breed in the world. Right? So walking is one thing. migration is another. This is why I got a bulldog. You see? I got a bull bulldog breed. I didn't get a purebred bulldog. because they have issues. Yeah they have issues. but yeah, a dog that needs to migrate, how much walking do they need per day? I and especially a pack The bigger the pack, the longer the walk They both work such good. You can also let her know, hey, begin with fostering So that way they get to know themselves as a family Is everybody in agreement? Does everybody understand what the rules boundaries limitations are? Do everybody understand what the responsibilities are? Can we all see our good habits and our bad habits? You know, Do we all follow through So with a foster dog, you're not adopting him, you're just temporarily keeping him in the house. So the dog gets, you know a home and a family. It doesn't necessarily have to stay in the house, but the human gets to learn about themselves before they enter into the purchase or the adoption Right? So to have two puppies huskidies, you gott to have to purchase Right? And so she's going to go into make a purchase and then eventually she realize we were not ready. as a family In my mind I was ready. in the whole pack We're not ready Right? And the puppy hood is from birth to eight months So in a matter of six months, you have it Dg is this bigig who iss an adolescent now Now you gott to think about spay neuter Be if you don't, then you deal with the you know, the hormones and then they can start fighting with each other What's your take on Spay and Nuter? Well, in America it's necessary because dogs are not going to mate. and so and they spend a lot of time indoor So I neutered Costello. ye I Put him on testosterone therapy his final two years U vets that I knew said we would love to be able to do that more, but there are reasons we don't. With Strummer, I thought Keep them intact. ye Then people say, oh, but then they're going m with all the dogs in the neighborhood. You can also give a dog of vectomy. This's very easy procedure. It's funny, we don't do that. I learned that in Australia It's illegal to not neuter your dog in Scandinavia, it's illegal to neut a dog. Yes. What in the world is best? Well, it depends on the place, right? Be in America without a doubt, seems the dogs don't go out as often. They're relied on the human. Th in the country, they're not er But they're not looking for trouble. They're not, you know, they they may win The female gets on heat, otherwise they arere busy looking for food and water So you know, as long as you use your energy for survival purposes, you're not going to develop frustration So so what happens, you know, when a dog is intact and they don't get to walk enough and they don't get to be challenged enough. And then it all goes into the arouse. and the whole day they're excited. And people go, Oh bab the thing comes out. Right? And then and then the dog gets excited. How many I don't know if you've ever seen it, but I' seen a lot dogs humping They're owners. others humping furniture in the house. I mean, Costello tried to hunt me once It never happened again. I just I just made it very clear that was not okay. and I used isolation. I just put him back in a thing. I left cameame back. Yeah I Sent him the message mentally energetically That's never happening again It was very stern. They has to be clear. they want So that happens and they w one. But a lot of times people go, Oh no, no, no, so they more celebrate that Right. And so they end up in a celebration and they end up funny But the dog ended up becoming more and more aroused about the humans. So now he's mounting, which as you know, is isosexual and his dominance, you know behavior towards the humans. In America, definitely a dog needs to be neutered more more often. pllus we have an overer population Right know, millions of dogs die every year because it's an overpopulation problem and that's taxpayer money who pays for the killing of dogs. So it's important that we regulate My d Is that the only way you can regulate that I see these crazy things on Instagram. Someone says when you pet your dog, it should be slow No, when you pet your dog, you should rub. I'm guessing Do doesnn't matter it's the energy behind it. Yeah. I mean, you obviously don't want to push against the fur, but somebody was saying, you know, all people are like petting their dog too fast. They don't like that Is this just people making stuff out? Look. so if a dog is doing agility and a dog is like excited because he's doing an agility, pet him hard. but and fast 'use you want him like that But if you want the dog to be in a restaurant, pet himself So it's depending what you want the mind to feel You see what I mean, you don't want to pet Fast in a restaurant you know, and slow and agility So it's not the action is why are you petting? Makes total sense. makes total sense. I mean to a soft st calm, you know calm. Ra means calm. Agility means calm Yeah.' wor it, right. It's like what FIFi is doing right now everyverybody iss excited. Nobbody's like This is With barking, I learned from your book, like if Costell when he was a puppy, he could let it out. Yeah And The temptation is to say no. Why would you shout back to a dog that's vocalizing? So I would just walk away And then when he was quiet, I'd come back and you go. And then pretty soon he realized Nobody wants to be around a bargking dog And somehow he knew instadually that if there was a threat If someone, you know, he sends a threat a bark, he only would bark once. He had this I mean, he had this like I mean, man, his he was a beautiful specimen. I have to say. He was just so beautiful. but his barks were like Bass drum. But it was one. And then we just but he would never just sit there and bark. I think a lot of people, their dog barks and they talk to their dog. So presumably The dog is barking because that's what gets them some sort of feedback attention.. That's right. O or the dog is also his only way to drain energy Right? Like when my dog obsessively bark how often do you walk once a week, twice a week or whatever. So the barking becomes a way of draining energy. or like destroying your house, you know, destructive behavior. Why would a dog destroy where he sleep Well, because he doesn't do much with his body and his mind. so he has to drain that energy. and that's what we call destructive behavior. But peoplee don't understand that we not we're in a way practicing destructive behavior by not doing what we're supposed to be doing, which is walking a dog every single day. At the moment they wake up in the morning, they stretch The second thing they want to do is walk Should you wait for your dog to get up? What if you have to go to work? Should you force your dog to wake up and walk I certainly would. They're daytime animals. so the biologists definitely as soon as the sun comes out, they should go. you know, they should go. This is what we do with Strummer, even though Bulldog I mean, they'll sleep till ten AM, but Um we we have to work so we take on No, take care of it. It's easier It's actually better, right? because it easy is like, I got it. But then you drain the energy quicker. Yeah, it's way better because you want them to stay waiting for you in a resting state. So it's five b emotions the animals do. They stretch as soon as they wake up Right? Walk, run Rest sleep So a lot of times when you don't walk the dog around the dog and you want the dog to wait for you He can't go into a resting state You see it? So it's very important that we follow the five body em motions every single animal. as soon as they wake up, they stretch. The bird flies, right? And the dog walks and the rest of the animals, the water animals they swim Right And so that is u um a formula that they have. So we want them to wait for us, we have to leave them in a resting state And they just that's the meaning of waiting state. That's it. they can't wait or rest if the body in the mind has not been drained And another another reason why the walk is so important Because the walk is the only activity from playlay and Explore that gives them calm surrender. Play and Explore gives them an excited energy. Do you recommend walking them on the same path, novel path, giving them new In the beginning, yes, then the same path is important. that create trust to the environment, but once they know it very well, you have to change it Yeah. and you don't have to change like even going in a different direction. You can just come outside and put food on the floor and tempt the dog to want to smell and correct them So that creates a challenge You said so you learned to ignore food in the floor. You see so you start creating your own universal studios So your whole house or your whole environment becomes your own dog psychology center, where you're challenging your dog. you know, to u to not get bore. because they learn a pattern really fast. and once they learn it, there is no growth So then then the mind gets also frustrated, bore or confused because there's no growth love it. I trained Strummer to run on the treadmill. Yeah for a little rewards here and there intermittent reinforcement and he loves it. He runs now he jumps on, he gets on that thing. Yeah. It never occurred to me to do this, but I realized that We're in California it doesn'tin too often, but even when it rains, I want to have something where I can get his energy out. If there's fires again, I want to be outside anyway U So glad to hear that the treadmill is okay. You know, the first treadmill I saw remember the show, The Jetsons? Yeah. Without Judson. Yeah. Yeah. That was the first dog I ever seen on a treadmill. and I was a kid Then I come to America and I see a whole bunch of treadmills You know, in people's garage and say, do you ever put your dog on the treadmill I said, no, can you put a dog in the termmil? I learned that. by watching the Jetsons. veryery cool. Then I came and practiced it in America because people just had the termmial, but they were not using it. You know, so that's when I started putting dogs on the treadmill blah. And people were just fascinated. But I say, listen This is not for you to stay lazy, right. This is just for emergencies Okay, and for you to challenge the mind and and, you know, and that's it. But it's not's not so you don't walk Yeah, I do a walk with him then bring him back and then if he still has a lot of energy and I have to go, I get him going fast on an incline Yep getet him right to his threshold and then play with it a little bit. done. Like I've been trying to share this thing with him like This is our thing. And now he loves the treadmill. He dying to get on the treadmill. If people become more like personal trainers, they will challenge the dogs a lot more like a personal trainer. You see? So they will be able to, you know challenge the mind and challenge the body, challenge the mind, challenge the body. as a personal trainer, right But people don't do it, you know, they don't do these other titles Right? I just want to be a dog lover or the mom of this dog or the father of this dog. Yeah, you can also be a coach. you can also be a religious coach You know what I mean? a spiritual coach intellectual coach. I mean, don't forget that there's four worlds. It's not just the emotional world. and that's the only one you want to practice because that's the easiest one Right? To love a dog is so easy You know, to challenge him, you know, spiritually and instinctually and intellectually, that's requires creativity That's a great relationship..'s awesome. It's good for you. Yeah. Beause if the dog is doing great, that means you did great. So it's a reflection of you Right? The dog is a reflection of you, your energy, your philosophy, your actions. So every time you work out with a dog, you're working out with yourself It's just in a natural, simple profound way That's it, you know, which is about trust, respect, love, saaith, peace, love, body, mind, heart Just simple stuff Right? And that creates the off leash That is, you know, the ultimate we should all accomplish And you shouldn't pay for it Right? I'm not trying to get my, you know, colleagues the dog trainers not to get jobs, but It it's kind of Silly that you hire somebody to teach a dog off leash. You earn that. That's something we have to earn. It's good for us to earn You know, that that trust, that respect, that love. It's good. It's a good exercise,s a good workout. That means you use your spirit, your instinct, your heart and your mind every single day of life, That's why that dog behaves that way They keep you in track just to live a natural or symbple profound life. And when you're having a hard time in life, that's where you want to go. to your natural symple profound You know, never let this one go So to have a good relationship with a dog is automatically let you have a good relationship with God They're together. We're the only one that separates them. We're the only one that separates everything to create chaos We make a lot of things up What I'm hearing today over and over is that You obey the spirit You obey the instincts hours and These animals, dogs in this case, put that first Then all the other stuff about bad, notot, bad, pet, notot pet, like all the other stuff falls into place. But it's a moment to moment thing. It's a daily thing. There isn't a, well, I love my dog, it loves me. that's a story that's partially true. but there's actually if I editorialized a little bit. there's There's actually a fair amount of abuse of the animal in that situation. It's very self serving abuse of the animal. But when we align all those things and we start from Sare it now all kind of falls into place. Yeah. But we have to be vigilant and we have to basically train ourselves.. This is all about training ourselves. That's why I train humans Reameditate dogs. that's my job I traink humans, rehabilitate dogs. You don't have to have a dog to talk to me Because, you know,, learning how to be with a dog is Learn how to be in life, period. Right? It's good for you to be a pA member, a good pAC member at home You didn't need to know what is your position and just contribute to the family. Try and bring good energy, good philosophy, good action, evenven if you're in the back of the pack. of the middle of the pag or the front of the pag. It's not only the front of the pack, it has to have good energy. Because he's in that position, he has to be the fittest Right? Fitness not only physically, but spiritually. Sinctually, emotionally and mentally you know, with the body to take care of all those four energies Right? So otherwise, it doesn't matter what position you are in the pack. Bring good energy, good philosophy, good actions Right And one way that you can achieve this every single day is having a great relationship with a dog It just makes you a good human Everybody wins that way It's not about training the dog, it's about training the human to be a good human And then that human is going to have good everything because that's what his energy and philosophy and actions are all about imagine if the world is led by good humans Yeah, that's a beautiful image. Yeah Well, Caesar, I I'm immensely grateful for you coming here today. Thank You are incredibly knowledgeable, incredibly wise. Y energy is tangible from the moment somebody meets you. It's a real thing. I can say that having experienced it in the room. I'm sure people listening are hearing it and feeling it as well You also have an incredible relationship to the the spiritual of animals and humans and a real what I hear is a wish for humanity and for animals and your relationship to things that are timeless The past, the present What happens it's really incredible. I said it before, I'll say it again three different different ways. the multig generational purpose of it. you're the man You're also incredibly wise and you're a virtuoso of bringing together information in practical ways that people can not just learn how to take care of their dog and themselves better, but as you pointed out, be a better human. So you're a special one. Thank you so much. Thank you Thank you for joining me for today's discussion with Caesar Milan To learn more about his work, please see the links in the show notote caption. If you're learning from and or enjoying this podcast, please subscribe to our YouTube channel That's a terrific zero cost way to support us. In addition, please follow the podcast by clicking the follow button on both Spotify and Apple. And on both Spotify and Apple, you can leave us up to a five star review. And you can now leave us comments at both Spotify and Apple. Please also check out the sponsors mentioned at the beginning and throughout today's episode. That's the best way to support this podcast If you have questions for me or comments about the podcasts, or guests or topics that you'd like me to consider for the Huberman Lab podcast, please put those in the comments section on YouTube. I do read all the comments. For those of you that haven't heard, I have a new book coming out. It's my very first book It's entitled Protocols, an operating manual for the humuman body. This is a book that I've been working on for more than five years and that's based on more than thirty years of research and experience. And it covers protocols for everything from sleep exercise to stress control protocols related to focus and motivation. And of course, I provide the scientific substantiation for the protocols that are included. The book is now available by presale at protocolsbook. com. There you can find links to various vendors. You can pick the one that you like best. Again, the book is called Protocols, an operating mananual for the human body And if you're not already following me on social media, I am Huberman Lab on all social media platforms. So that's Instagram, X, threads, Facebook, and LinkedIn And on all those platforms, I discuss science and science related tools, some of which overlaps with the content of the Huberman Lab podcast, but much of which is distinct from the information on the Huberman Lab podcast. Again, it's Huberan Lab on all social media platforms. And if you haven't already subscribed to our Neural Network newewsletter, the Neural Netwk Nsletter is a zero cost monthly newsletter that includes podcasts summaries, as well as what we call protocols in the form of one to three page PDFs that cover everything from how to optimize your sleep, how to optimize dopamine, deliberate cold exposure. We have a foundational fitness protocol that covers cardiovascular training and resistance training. All of that is available completely zero cost. You simply go to hubbermanlab d. com, go to the menu tab in the top right corner, scroll down to Newsletter, and enter your email. And I should emphasize that we do not share your email with anybody Thank you once again for joining me for today's discussion with Caesar Milan And last, but certainly not least, thank you for your interest in science