Final Thoughts and Closing Remarks

On july tenth Get ready for the family reunion Fom hell From the producers of the horror cllassic Evil Dead, comes a brand new nightmare and the scariest installment yet After her husband's mysterious passing, a widow seeks comfort with her in laws in their secluded cabin in the woods. But as they one by one turn into something much more sinister, she discovers that every family has its demons. Evil deead Burn. Only in theaters july tenth, rated R under seventeen, not admitted without parent Insurance isn't one size fits all. That's why drivers have trusted progressives name your price tool for years. Just tell prorogressive what you wantan to pay and they'll show you coverage options that fit your budget. Visit progressive. com to find a car insurance rate that works for you. Progressive casualty insurance Company and affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law There's no place to escape to. This is the last hot. on the left That's when the cannibalism started It was thered Big day here boys. Big day. Big day. Massive day. This is A such a let's just say o victory. Yeah Victory Yeah for LPN. This is a victory for last podcast and the left. Validation. Validation we I got him the white unicorn. First of all, welcome to the last podcast on the left, ladies and gentlemen. My name is Marcus Sparks. I'm here with Henry Zabrowsky. Pink Unicorn. The pink unicn Henry Zabrowsky. Filled with shrimp. Yeah, and the hairy unicorn. I was gonna say illiterate unorn Just your beard is looking quite nice. haveave you been trimming Yeah, well, yeah, I have a person who trims. It looks great. Thank you. I appreciate it because I was worried it was looking bad, but now it gets another week like this. You really look good in that way, like But the thing is the guy who trims your beard definitely woman. Wow, but he makes you look like an Iranian lord. You know what I mean? I'll take that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah yeah, you do look like a lord of some kind. Hey, you want to get through the straight? You come talk to me. You right? I'll get you through the straight. I'll get you through the game. Ses. I can jiggle something. All right, we got a rough comment here. Rough topic. The big topic that we have today is Okay, we interviewed Joe Hill author, Joe Hill. few months ago. Yeah. Fantastic man. it went so well. And we never we didn't really even say anything about his dad. Yeah, we didn't we said nothing about his dad. We were so cool during that interview. But it went so well that He came back and he brought his father, Stephen King with him. That's right. He was like, I got my dad. You guys talking about me and I got my dad here now. But then he did a whole thing. You'll see in the interview where he's like, My dad'll beat you all up Yeah. And Stephen King stood up and he was like, comeome here, your little F words that five or six times.'ll see Youll it's all there.'s It's all there. But this is our father's Day special. It is because in many ways, Stephen King raised us. He was definitely a big part of my childhood and a very big part of everything I've ever known about horror and novels. Yeah. I'd be know, he's one of the cultural voices of the twentieth century. He's one of the guys who created the The twentieth century is culturally. Yeah, It's unbelievable. I watched a documentary called King in Movies and I was like, o He's like shaped my thoughts completely. Oh yeah. Yeahah, yeah. I'm very excited for this, but let's just get to it. Let's just get to it. Yeah, I finally finally got to ask him about shitters. And I didn't even I just rewatched Christine and I was like Oh yeah, shitter. You should read it in the they tone it down in the movie. A lot. Oh yes, I look at that book on my shelf all the time Let's get to it. Fly from Northway How are you guys? We're doing fantastic. How are y you all doing today I'm good First question out the gate doing well. Wow This is Washingt I just want to say I hate to disappoint because honestly, our dads really wanted to meet you guys too. And one of the hardest things was is that I noticed that when I was bringing them over here, their urn was really loose. Yeah. And so I didn't want to spread them all over the stuff. I didn't want to spread them all over my car. Yeah. Well the urn was loose because when you weren't paying attention, I actually switched out my dad's ashes with your dad's ashes. And so now I got your dad in my house and your dads my dad's at your house How many ashes have you been presented with as a couple Hey H No one's given me their asshes yet I have made an ash of myself once in a while. I was I was at a signing at a library in like Boise. This was years and years ago and a guy came up to me, He was one of the last guys in line sort of a decrapit all fella And he said, you know I loved heart shaped box so much and your dad's books meant so much to me. And I just wanted to give you something to express that how much those books meant to me And he lifted up this leather bag. It looked like a doctor's bag. and I accept as a thank you when I opened it and this stink just rolled out like there was you know I don't know, like a rotten piece of meat in it or something like that and a chemical odor as well And I said, what is this And he said My dad embalmed people for forty years and that was his that was his bag. That was the bag he did for his work And I was like Boy, you shouldn't have. Thank you. Thank you so much. You know, And I will say I will say that I hit him I had him chuck it as soon as like I left the thing. I'm not bringing fucking bag like that on an airplane? No We to bring it to the Hilton. You can you know. Yeah. It's always the last person in line. when you're really tired and you just want to go back to your hotel and c No just somebody shows up with with that Yes, Stephven, what was what was something that sticks out in your mind that a fan brought to you that you were just immediately revolted by Well, it wasn't so much that, but I was at a place one time signing books and This fat kid comes up to me and says, Hey kids. Where's the Nazi books And so I took him to the Ny book, but I'll tell you what, you just can't tell what people are going to do. One guy came up to me and said you know, about Salem's L. He said, you know You ought to write a squeal in that Jenner. And I said Yeah, what are you talking about? He said a sequel in that genre. You know, you know, one thing Speaking of Grotesque gifts, you know, disturbing gifts John Wayne Gacy sent my dad some art back in the day from prison And actually I found that so disturbing, that's in the first paragraph of Heart shhaped Bx. Yes. You know, that kind of hung in my mind. becausecause the other thing is is Gacy wasn't terrible. I mean, he was obviously terrible. I can't underline enough how terrible he was. Well was a fun funny guy you were a funny guy. Yeah You already singled it out. You're screwed Hey, that's gotta be the point to sell this episode. John Wayne Gacy was pretty good. You know, what he did a real mushroom,'s a fun guy Yeah. Yeah He could he could do a passable he could do passible like Disney characters and stuff Well, he used to do paint by numbers. He used to go and get the like he would have a whole system of other serial killers, including one of the the guys from the Chicago Rippers and he also had the guy that killed everybody to avoid the earthquake in Southern California. Yeah the Herbert Mullen. Herbert Mullen. he had other serial killers working for him on an assembly line painting these paintings for him That's not true. Yeah. it is. Ist true? Yes, because he literally was a job creator. He was a executive manager. He was a project runner. That's what he did. He was a project manager. So they had an art club in prison It was kind of like a chain gang Like literally, you' kind of force them to do stuff and then they would bring in. there's a whole story about how John Wayne Gacy was sort of gamed by this young man that called him and pretended to be really into him. And so this young man started arriving to visit with John Wayne Gacy. and then the two of them would talk to the other serial killers like they were his little like Like was u his little brothers. So don't feel that honored about the art. Is it like that? It was like hair club for men, but with art. Yes. Yes. Do you find that in speaking of terms of collaboration, because you guys worked together because John Wayne Gacy can really run that type of collaboration. I'm sure you guys really you guys put some really good stuff together Like because in the tall grass was a great thing. like how do you guys feel like when you're together working Ah We've only done it twice. We've only done it twice. we wrote in the tall grass and we wrote throttle and You know, I mean, I feel like when I the times I've written with that You ever seeen like the the Warner Brothers cartoons Why are we coyotes He climbs on an ace rocket and lights the fuse and then suddenly it takes off under him.. That's what it's like writing with my dad. I feel like I'm just kind of hanging on for dear life, you know? I'd sort of like sweat and pull my hair out over like three pages or something. And then I'd email it to him and like forty five minutes later, he'd be like, it was great Here's Here's five more pages. Shes Chist. I wrote five I wrote five and keep it up. Well, you know, was there was a time when I was chemically assisted. by some of those things. in the books with Peter Straub in the early days, but u Those days are behind me now. Yeah. now it's just what S Alis. A lot of snappple. That's what I do. I crush up my salus right into the right into I just do it I do it line by line each day just to get me going to do podcasts. Yeah and under the lit of those snapples, they got funny little things. You can just slide right into the book. You know if you want to so man, if you say so. We had a pretty good movie made out of in the tall grass. Oh, it was so It's so good Yeah, that was pretty cool. That was pretty cool. And u For a while For a while, Sylvester Stallone was talking about doing throttle behind the scenes. And like as a guy who grew up in the, you know, I mean Me and Dad went to go see all those rocky films and everything together and wow, what a blast that would have been, but it didn't happen. I just want to say right now, Sylvester Stallone as the guns sllinger. Cant it just like, let's just do it. Ependable makeake it expendables. I don't think that would really work in his age. I mean, Chuck Norris could have done it. I mean, Chuck Norris could have just wiped that shit out entirely. guns at all. He could have just used his hands. I always saw Daniel Day Daniel Day Lewis was my guns slinger in my mind. Who do do you have a guns slinger that you wish besides I mean, I love Idris, but you got a gun slinger in your mind that you wish you could see walking around? Tin Eastwood back in. Yeah. backack in the day, it would have been great It would have been great. I mean, I got the idea for those books in a large part because of those Sergio Leonian Westerns. You know, I saw them in the theater because you know, I'm old. and. So you know, they were just widees screen men and It was st Eastwood was so quiet in those movies, you know, He wouldn't say shit if he had a mouthfulull. so that was great Yeah, they didn't even give them a name The man He was literally the man with phonan the right How did you respond, Joe? L do you are you as big of a fan of the Dark Tower as the rest of us? I'm sorry Marcus. I'll get you your questions. I'm just sorry I just started the Dark Tower and it means its actually means the whole world to me, but you've seen a lot of fat guys that say this to you. So I'm sorry. I'm sorry I'm doing this at you. just I love those I'm a big Stephen King fan. I love all those books. and I mean, the thing about the The Gunslinger books is is I always think of them as the Gunslinger books, not the Dark Tower books you know, and they're kind of like the unified theory of the Stephen Kang of Stephen King worldorld, you know, and And because it picks up so many threads from all the other books and And it's almost like a nervous system running through the whole body of dad's work Um And they're just such great reads. They're just so much fun and such a terrific cast of characters. and and it is a little bit in some ways, it is a little bit surprising. there haven't been an you know, well, there was no no there was the interest there was the interest film, but it didn't do very well. It's because it needs to be twenty five hours long. It, I think good either I want to do so, but They talked for a while about Javier Bardem doing That's sexy. That would have been great. Yeah, he's sexy. That would have been good. I mean, I think there is an attempt right now to try to make it five seasons, you know, to try to do a TV thing, but I'm not sure how far along it's gotten Have any of you guys seen Cape Fear, the new one where Have you had Bard M placed a bad guy? Not yet. yet, I'm very excited for it, though I am too. Is I am right? It looks like I can't wait. Harvey Bread M scary as hell, man. But Steven, earlier, you mentioned that you know, the sppaghetti Westerns were a big influence on the Dark Tower series. When you know, you were writing All those iconic works, how much inspiration did you take from other mediums and other genres for your own stories? I mean, I was a big fan of Western movies, period And I tried to get in a lot of the things that those Books and movies were based on, you know, that that the idea that The guy has to be alone and he has to be a hero and Although in the early books, Rowand isn't very much of a hero P He's actually kind of a bad guy. Yeah He is is and then he changes then there are other worlds in these. I think about that this, and I'm so happy that you brought that back. I'm so happy you brought that back for the next book. I'm so excited mister King. I'm gonna go, I'm gonna to show up at your house. I'm sorry. I'm sorry, sir. Can I No I won't. I won't I'm sorry. This podcast is brought to you by Squarespace. Squarespace is an all in one website platform that helps you stand out online. Yes, that's right. You don't have to smash your face with the hammer You can just start a business. It's got everything you need on Squarespace from securing your domain to building a professional site and showcasing your work all in one place. Let's say you want to show everybody how you can carve your ribs out of your lower abdomen so that you look more like a Kendall. That's amazing. You can bring your vision to life with AI powered design or curated templates flexible editing tools that helps you create something that truly reflects your style. especially if you are somebody that is trying to corrupt the young men of America. That's what Squarespace is really gonna to help you. Squarespace makes it easy. It makes it easy for you to put all that together and you just go to Squarespace and do it all Thanks, Braden Head to squarespace d. com slash left for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, use offer code left to save ten percent off your first purchase of a website or domain This is a paid ad by Better Help Oh, I work myself to the bone You should see my bones. thick Get small And when I work really hard I can see my bones I work down to the knee bone, the foot bone. And even down to my mind bone. And that's one of the hardest parts is when you get down all the way to the nitty gritty of your mind bones. becauseuse not everyone thrives when life gets busy You may catch yourself feeling drained, even during things you usually enjoy like ski shooting or Feeling bones And realizeed you've been pushing yourself more than you need to. and you have. I can tell I'm looking at you And I love you It's important to take care of yourself when things get busy by resting Rchging and saying no when you need to. Like I almost said no to doing an ad today, but I didn't how important it is for you. Therapy can be a good way to get out of autopilot, get a solid reset. And therapy with better help may help you better understand your needs. feele more confident setting boundaries and creating a rhythm that feels sustainable. like this. BetterHelp is the world's largest online therapy platform. Just take a short questionnaire to identify your needs and preferences and BetterHelp will handle the initial therapists matching work for you. You can also feel confident knowing Betterhelp therapists work according to a strict code of conduct and are fully qualified. Take a pause with therapy Better Help can help life feel manageable again. Sign up and get ten percent off at betterhelp dot com slash last pod. That's betterter HLP dot com slash last pod Mit moobile plans are only fifteen dollars per month Wondering what's the catch? There isn't one. There are no gimmicks and no gachas, just unlimited talks, text and data, fast reliable coverage on the nation's largest five G network, and an award winning care team. That makes MintMobile a catch. And you know what's nice is we have MittMobile hooked up to the studio iPhone here for three months and it really is Quite remarkable. Great service, extremely cheap, and we gotta say since switching to Mint, we've saved a lot of money. So will you. So get over there. Hit your new wireless plan for just fifteen bucks a month. goo to mintMobile dot com slash lpoo. That's mint moobile dot com slash lpoo. Cut your wireless bill at fifteen bucks a month at mintmobile dot com slash lpoo That's it, There's no catch. forty five dollars upfront payment required, equivalent to fifteen dollars a month. New customers on first three month plan only, spepeeds slower above forty gigabytes unlimited plan. Additional taxes, fees and restrictions apply, CMint mobile for details B from your brain. Joke, I've been watching a lot of interviews to prep for this between between you and your dad and I gott to say onem sorry. ye. you know, it's'm I'm I'm getting a taste for them. Joe, my question is you seem like your father seems so proud of you. What's that like Moving Um I'm sure there's a joke here somewhere, but but I can't find it. You know, you know, Um J Just pretend I'm not here, Joe. Yeah. I know, right. I mean, like I already know how to talk about it. I have a great relationship with my dad. We love a lot of the same things. You know, Owen and dad and myself, my brother Owen, Owen is a wonderful writer. He wrotees, Sleep and Beauties with dad and Owen's last novel, The Curators Absolute you know, stunner. The first two pages of the curator are better than anything I've written in my whole life. That's great. You know, and the three of us have both a playlist and a message thread And we talk to each other every day and mostly what we talk about is rock and roll and sometimes what we're watching on on TV and You know, Dlan and Bob Dylan and meatloaf, we talk about meatloaf a lot We talk about meat a lot, you know, we'. And you know it loves meatloaf One time meat and Jim Steinman showed up at some place where I was shooting a commercial or something like that. And they were wearing these white clothes, man L, light Disney characters, you know So Now they're both dead, but I didn't have anything to do with that. The white glove should have been a sign of the afterlife. It should have been Yeah. But Joe, you say that you and your dad like love a lot of the same things. Did you have to watch the shining in a friend's house or something? or could you watch that at home that took me to a screening of it before the film was theatrically released like a day or two before or maybe it was the premiere night when it opened in Bangor. And I was just like six or something. When I came out, I was gripping his hand and I said, I know, I know, I know, but it was the seventies. it was different. I know know we're the same. We're all the same. I mean, like, you know, U When I came out I said, Wh wrote all the great dialogue And my dad said me. I just thought that was that thought had never crossed my mind. That was kind of like this unbelievable realization, you know that my that my dad was a guy who invented fictional people and then put them into terrible situations and stuff. Somehow I hadn't really realized his connection to that material Yeah I mean, also saw also we also walked Salem's lot together When I was way too young sit out window Oh, this Salem lotot. Yeah You know, Joe played a part in in creephow You know, he was a little kid to stuck pins into the doll and His father was kind of an abuser and beat him up. It wasn't on the screen, but it was off screen so that when he shows up, that They had done makeup so that there were a couple of bruises on his face And one night the shooting wrapped made And Joe said Could we get a hamburger? Could we like drive through McDonald's? And so we drove through McDonald's and Here's this little kid that's up eleven o'clock at night and he looks got all these bruises all over his face and drive through call the cops. Yeah That's so funny. It's like that alost like is is because of creep showhow is Father's Day a thing in your home like because of that like is there a Where's my cake? likeike is that does that come from your own personal experience, mister King? Like is that the did you not receive your cake Well, Yes, but I didn't get my cake, but Nobody came out of the grave, you know brought me the cake. So, you know, that didn't happen was make believe. Okay, God I know I know. I know. I believe. I know I documentaries. You're ruining my life, mister King. You're ruining my life. So you were also in creephow, The lonesome deeath of Geordi Verl. Now your performance in that, wasas that intentional Or did Well, we won't even talk about that R. stop. You terrific. It's a terrific comic turn. I love that. Thank you. When I When I watched that the first time as a little kid I got teary. Oh yeah. I was so sad what happened to What happened to Jody Var rem just come ded because you were a better actor than your father A lot of times people will come up to me and autograph lies and say Pay Meor shit Yeah Yeah, ye, like three honestly, I just watched Sleepwalkers the other day and As a comedian, your commitment too that awful joke is it bombed in on screen over and over again I love a comedian that really sticks by a bad joke. So I appreciate you, man. The mother and son relationship in sleepwockers. Is that anything similar to what you experienced in real life? Oh yeah, it was just like my h. Yeah, yeah. Did you, mis. King, did you get with Tabeta two breed authors Is the goal was for you guys to get together. Was this like a program that was like a king based? to install Let me just rephrase just want you I just want to remind you guys that I'm sitting here. Yeah. I just want to I you just asked was Steve, did you get together with your wife and brereed? L I don't wherever that question is going. It's already gone someplace I don't want to think about. Okay It's science. We're talking about Southern Freud Chicken here. Yeah Sill, you know, the thing is My wife is a writer and I met her in a poetry seminar And so we come by it quite naturally. We're both writers and She he's as good as I am or better in some ways No' Like what? five Joe, five books, seven b. I think six. Everyone in the family takes the manuscript to her first Yeah, you know, and U I tell you a story about my mom. I u My third novel, Nosferatu had a really bleak ending. Dark and dark, ugly ending you know, where, you know, hopeless. And I'm like, and I'm not changing a word because I'm a fucking artist man. And just rub their face in the hopelessness and futility of life. You know, when I was dead set, like I'm staying with it And the first person I sent the book to was mom And she blasted through and she called me up, you know, a week later and she said, Joe, I finished the book and it's just So wonderful But that ending really won't do. And I said Okay, mom, I'll change it. So that's how long my artistic integrity comes. And you know, the other thing about mom and I think it's given us everyone in the family sort of tough skin when it comes to reviews and stuff is she writes all the bad reviews first. When Dad finished it, she said The critics are going to say you left off two letters And when he finished his omie, he said, Ohh, I can see the reviews already Stven Kings insamia cur. She talked a lot about misery too. She said the will say whole review is written in that one word, misery. Misery. Well, I mean Was she the one who came up with the phrase it sounds like it came up the phrase kill your darlings Be because for me that that is one of the best pieces of writing advice that you've given is that, you know, kill your darlings. It's so Difficult. Is there like a darling that you have, like something that you felt was just so Beautiful but just didn't quite fit that was, you know, that you had to kill that sits out in your mind. Yeah going back to Tabby again I wrote a book It was published last year called Never Flinch. And number three main stories in it. those a Dog npping which I finally got in another book, which is forthcoming And there was a serial killer and there was a dope thing. Tabby came to me and said dope thing has all been done before. You know This is so fucking boring. I mean I fought for it. I fought for it, but in the end, she was right. She usually is I've seen that a few times too I've seen Dad gnash his teeth for forty eight hours because M said something didn't work But then He always makes the changes. You know, you' really never, you've really always felt in the end that that actually she was probably right and that was the right direction to take stuff in. So there's been a There's been a fifty year collaboration of ideas there of, you know. Yeah, she changed the whole ending of other worlds in these In fact, there was a point where I thought to myself I would really like her to write a chat book. about all the sub chararacters in that in that book She said You know, somehow You have to bring it back around to the kid He was, you know because Jack Try your starts are in the talisman all those years ago And Jo What a great opening that first book had The talisman on the beach outside rotting in It's my favorite. It's one of my the first times I ever cried in a book was reading the talisman when the I on your foot, right? Yeah ye. How do you feel like Because you've said this, like you don't know what's going to happen. And you guys are both kind of said similar things where you don't quite know what's going to happen to the characters you create when you start to kind of go in a way. But when you write something like that Like in the talisman, when you kill somebody beloved Do you laugh? like do you laugh to yourself? Like are you being like, oh, I got these fuckers O are you like or are you sad? twisted do you think I am? Sir, I think you might. I don't laugh Joe, do you think ahead Do you know then characters are gonna die or does this I mean S sometimes I know I'm working towards a big scene. Sometimes sometometimes I have like a set piece in my mind and so I'm working towards that Um, A few characters died in the last one King Sorrow Yeah. And when when one of them died It took me by surprise. I didn't realize that was going to happen And I felt a little bit shaken up by it. What's funny is when Ryan, my twenty two year old, read the book He said Oh, I knew that character was going to be the first one to die. You you really gave that one away way in advance and I thought I did because I had no clue Yeah Fascinating. How? How far along In the writing career did you get when it was like that or is it a thing that you have to have? likeike the idea that you get to the point where the characters just live whereere you create the characters and they just live in your Is that just natural? or is there a thing is there a craft in that way that you learn? I know you guys went to school but it's like, how do you guys get to that point where you could just be like, yeah,, I don't know what the character iss going to do Wh do you write books? write books. One of the things that, you know, you talk about characters that died U A little boy died at the end of Kujo. You know, in the novel in the movie, hezes spoilers. I mean Joe The pho looking fifty years old almost G reujo. Anyway, the little boy dies at the end of the book, but in the movie, he lives He got licked by the rabbid dog. so I think he died horribly of rabies after the fadeout. but You know, the thing is when children die or adults die in books U That's one thing Don't Let a dog die. You know, I have heard more about that. I mean, Greg Stilson kicks a dog to death at the beginning of the dead zone. I I've never heard the end of it. That's that's an automatic one star off your goodood reads rating. You kill I killed a cat in a story called Jacknife and I have eaten so much shit about it online. You know My My mother's dog who I took in Totsy, she actually passed away yesterday out of complete, you know, randomness. She was only nineteen years old. So you know, why she could almost buy a beer. Why does she go so young But so we did a wonderful thing with her. We took her up and we put her up, we brought her body up a hill and then you know, we put her in the ground and there was a beautiful rock structure on the ground. It was like some kind it was gorgeous. and then we were putting her in the ground and was it was thin soil, it was sour. and so I'm hoping when I get home She'll be there waiting for me. Pet cemetery, yes Go and go down that roll. Loud how.ee, I don't think Dad's better. I'm sorry. Was that your Jud Craall? Tom Hod. Dad's better out. I hope that your routine doesn't depend on the quality of your impersonation. Oh, he was good He was great, belieievable. He was But I have to ask about Pet Cemetery because like you, I am a massive Ramones fan, massive, massive Ramones fan. And you know in the story goes that it's been told that you know, you invited them over to your house when, you know, before Pet Cemetery was being made and Deeee Ramone took a copy of Pet Cemetery disappeared for an hour and came back with the song fully written Did that did it actually happen that way Okay, great How did it actually happen? Yeah I love getting past the musician storory.. I said they would they write, you know, my idea was that they would do the soundtrack for Pet Cemetery and that didn't fly, but they did do that song I don't want to be buried in a pet cemetery. And that was what you talk about a great line buried I don't want to liveemetery. There you. I don't want to live my life again. That's such a sad little. Sab little You know, But every lanky nerd boy knows that feeling. They're just like, I don't want to go through junior high again. That's what it's about. Yeah, always get a whole album out of ACDC. Yeah. Oh yeah You know, they did they did the whole soundtrack to maxim overdrive. I just saw that movie to prep for this. Do you remember directing any of that, Mr. King U yeah, I remember too much of it, but ye You know, the thing is I didn't know Dino said is Stehven this is Dino Dino Morenz is Steven B. I think u What we want to do is make a movie and You're going to direct it Well, I'd never done anything before. I hadn't been in film school or anything, I learned I as I went along, I could actually Do a pretty good job. next time but it was a blast. I have. I also feel a lot of it's because you have such a deep understanding of movies because you guys were both big media head. you guys watch a lot of movies. When you guys are writing novels versus like our screenplays like Easier than a novel or is it like like Iose sometimes you're retrofitting from one of your other previous works. L what's the hardest thing that you do? What's the thing besides getting up in the goddamn morning That I mean, going to the dentist, I think. Yeah and Yeah probably having a proctological exam. but those are I mean No Is it easier to write scripts or books Which one is I mean, books, I'd want to write books any day of the week over writing screenplays, but I do write sccreenplays because that's how I get my healthcare. So I try to write at least one script every year You know, you've had a lot, you've done a lot more in that space. You've written whole TV shows, you know, like not just like the pilot or something, but like every literally every episode. I think you wrote every episode of Golden Years, you wrote every episode of Lisy's story, you wrote every episode of Storm of the century. But does it suck to go from being able to be lord and creator in your own world of writing a novel to like having to go talk to a bunch of suits in a building and trying to tell them what your ideas are. Do you just you just not care orre they just like, Oh, whatever you want mister King No, I mean, it isn't that way really, but what I do because I have this wonderful pushing I don't have to write for the rent every month and that that's a big Fucking deal as you guys probably know. Yeah. The thing is I can write a script on spec And sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. I did a series of scripts U for a show called Storm of the Century. Yeah. And that's my favorite one. reallyally, you know, that really turned out well And because I had a good relationship with director You know, Well, it's also really glad I'm glad to hear that the only fans is really working out for you guys and then that thatad is really paying the bills and I just really I think that that's really great for you guys. It's regular I've noticed that you have the same director do your stories, you know, like your multiple movies. Is there a certain director you think that understands your Y your stororyies better than anyone else Mike Flanag good. Yeahah Lpe of chuck He's good, but who's the other guy? I want to say he's got like a name like Jack Holden or something or like maybe he directed the hitcher. you're talking about or Jack Jack Bender, with JZack Bender, thank you, you just saved us.. He's a lot of your stuff dad Jack Bender is terrific. and he's somebody who can do things that are just wonderful O on Oh. a low budget and short time and he's fantastic at both of those things It doesn't look phoned in. You know, that's that's great Call me a squirrel because I'm covered in acorns. That's right. So many people are focused on where their money is today. And acorns is the financial wellness app that cares about where your money is going tomorrow. Let acorns work for you corns in the ground and you're gonna get trees tomorrow. That's right, investments. And with the acorns potential screen, you could find out what your money is capable of. I always do that. I'm like, I want to invest in something that I like, let's say, cheeseburgers. Okaykay? That's kind of hard to do Corns will help you find a cheeseburger that is right for you So sign up now and accorns will boost your new account with a five dollars bonus investment. Wow! Join the over fourteen million all time customers who have already saved and invested over twenty seven billion dollars with accorns. Head to acorns dot com slash left or download the accorns app to get started Paid noncient endorsement compensation provides incentive to positively promote accorns. Tier two compensation provided. potential subject to various factors such as customers' accounts, age and investment settings. does not include accorn's fees, results do not predict or represent the performance of any accorns portfolio. Investment results will vary. invvesting involves risk. Acorns Advisors LC, an SEC registered invvestment addvisor. view important disclosures at accorns dot com slash left Summer schedules can get busy fast with camps, vacations, sports, family time, and you know, every single time, Karmi, eats block of dark chocolate. We got to take her to the emergency room. you know how many how much time that takes All right I excel makes it easy to keep learning part of the routine in just a few minutes a day I Excel is an award winning online learning platform that helps kids truly understand what they're learning, whether they're building math confidence, strengthening reading and writing skills or reviewing science concepts From pre K through twelfth grade, IXL offers personalized, interactive learning that adapts to each child's level and pace, which is great because Carmi has been really slow in biology and Wendy has really been struggling with American history mostly just because she doesn't agree with the way it's being taught So it's really important. You makeaking an impact on your child's learning. Wendy, as soon as she gets her chicken, she is ready for all of her lessons and Carmi just really has to eat five or six bites of liver, beef liver, chicken liver. and then she can really get down to I'm hoping this is the year she reads to kill a mockingbird. So really, IXL, thank you. Make an impact on your child's learning. G IXL now. And last podcast and the left listeners can get an exclusive twenty percent off IXL membership when they sign up today xLl dot com slash left. Visit xL dot com slash left to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price In the United States of America There's a break in every twenty six seconds That means somewhere right now an intruder is getting closer The problem is most security systems only alert you after a break in has already started That's too late. Choose simply safe. to secure your home Using the oututdoor Camera series I and advanced AI alerts simply safes US based live agents, identify threats on your property and help deter them stopping crimes before it starts That's a real peiece of mind. They've got a really great security system Make sure people don't get in your house where it makes a big noise And to me, that's a big deal for me is that it protects All of our yelling with a siren in our studio, which is one of the most important things That can be protected I don't care if thieves come and kidnap us They don't care if marauders come and steal our staff and bring them to another country against their will As long as our words aren in't affected, as long as their precious data isn't affected When simimplySfe does that And for that, I say, God bless you simply safe Bless you. God bless you, please. Good bessing Experience greater peace of mind with SimpllySe, now available with an exclusive discount for our listeners. Right now you can get fifty percent off of your new system by visiting simpllyae dot com slash lol That's half off at simpllyafe d. com slash L OT There's no safe, like simply safe. That help from your like speaking of you know things that you've written for the screen, like one of a massive influence on me was the TV miniseries for the stand that, you know, came back in nineteen ninety four like that, it blew my mind. when I saw that when I was a kid. But you with writing that and also writing the novel, which is also of course, incredible, when COVID came around in twenty twenty Were you surprised by how people acted? or were you pretty much like, okay. This is what I expected to happen when a plague hits Well, one thing that did happen is this is horrible to say, but The book went through the roof again, right?. It's like with that story like other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the plague? Yeah? Well I mean we did a whole series in twenty twenty one on the Black plague, like the history of of the black plague in Europe. And one of the things that really struck us was how similarly people acted back then they reacted to the black plague in medieval Europe as people reacted in, you know twenty twenty to to COVID. Do you think that people are Basically the same always in in a Days of the Black Plague, did they have like arrows in the supermarket so that people would only go one way. Yeah, that was a huge thing. It was a huge thing and they had it was a lot of Zooms Yeah call ye. There's a Dutch researcher named Matthias Clawson. who wrote onene of the best nonfiction books about horror is a genre. It's called why Horror seduces Um, and he's really the he's really the sharpest, you know, the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to you know, talking about the genre And he co authored a now fairly famous paper that showed that horror fans dealt with COVID psychologically and emotionally better than people who don't enjoy horror You know, that if you consume a lot of horror films and read a lot of horror novels, that you absorb the emotional shock of the COVID years at a higher level at better. And and like to me, that makes sense because we've all read the stand. And so we've already got our action plan for when Captain Tripss hits. Yeah. Yeah. and I have you guys seen Brooms. We're on our way. We're on our way. I got tickets to see it tonight. I'm very excited I've seen plenty of the YouTube videos.ke toan. we spoke to the boy himself. We spoke to Kane. I almost I came this close to going to see obsession last night, but Jillian's got a sore throat and I didn't want to I didn't want to dump the kids on her when she wasn't feeling well so I stayed home. Obsession is amazing because obsession does a great, which is what I think You guys have just destroyed. You guys have this ability to do, which is take a simple ide L like a kind of like a flatter idea and then explode it out Joe, I was just you guys have an idea, like There's a scene in an obsession where the girl smiles for about twenty seconds. so good. It's so good She's so frightening. She makes h So frightening. I mean, so it just seems like it seems like you still keep up on you know, pretty much every horror movie that comes out still. There's so much good stuff out there right now, right? I mean, Oh yeah. Yeah. There's so much like, I mean, Kars Rosson had that great novel Coffin Moon last year. Nat Cassidy had when the wolf comes home, that was incredible. U Widows Bay is great. I love that movie weapons. Yeah J and I a like one ike I feel thrlled by all this stuff but also a little bit challenged and stressed out. L O of course I kind of got to step up my game to keep up with some of what's coming out now because there's just there's just so much great stuff Well, I honestly wonder if that's a question you can ask your dad because think about that like you have changed formats too, mis. King. You also do like you write some crime, you write some drama. and like, obviously, Joe, you're in the same way. You got you you go into fantasy, you go into sci fi, you go into horror. One of my favorite stories you ever wrote, Joe was the one where the guy's trapped on the cloud so alft ye That just scared the fucking shit out of me. just 'cause it's so but it's so simple. Like how do you take an idea that might be like you say this, so it's like an idea that might not work out. I listened to your anecdote about the ladies room story you were working on, mister King, where you talkking about how you spent ninety pages, you never figured out what happened inside that fucking bathroom, right When does the idea tip? How do you know when the idea is going to tip to become a novel versus I've just spent a hundred d D I've just spent a hundred pages doing nothing Joe. I mean I mean, I I don't know. I mean, I can when I have a really great concept, I can usually write on that for a couple days. But if I don't have a great character after a couple days, there's got to be someone I give a shit about. You know, there's got to be a character who who I want to spend a few weeks or a month or a couple years with You know, someone who's got some stuff inside them that seems like it would be interesting to explore and whose way of interacting with Fredady seems interesting and a little bit different You know, if I can latch into a good character I feel like I'm off and running. Then I, you know then I'm really excited to see where the story goes. When stories die on me You know, usually there was a good concept there There was some it had a clever hook, but I just couldn't find anyone interesting to write about. It didn't seem to You know I don't know. what about you, Dad? I mean, you know, what I mean I start with an idea, something thats that's interesting to me U sometometimes it's just an image But it has to connect with something else. I mean, it's like an engine without a transmission It's got to be two parts, you know, it's got to be an idea and then it's got to be some nuts and bolts that connect it all together. and then man, I just go And I hope that everything's going to turnurnout. pretty good in the end. you know, it's like shooting off an intercontinental ballistic missile If the warhead is big enough, it doesn't matter if you really hit exactly the spot. Yeah Yeah Every blows up in the end. so I just try to do the best I can and, you know, you got to try to be honest with the characters and you can't You can't bullshit, you know, like say oh, guess what? It was all a dream. hate that. I hate it Sake those work You know, like like the other thing though is like Dad's first drafts are so clean. You know, he he I came across something, I was cleaning out the basement. I came across an old enttertainment weekly where he had written a book review for Entertainment Weekly, but he had written it. He was in New York at the time And he he wrote the review on a ruled yellow legal pad. Long H And then had it sent over to the Entertainment Weekly offices by couourier Entertainment Weekly was so shocked to receive the manuscript that way that they actually printed the review, but they also printed a scan of his days before email. Yeah. I hear the wagon wheel. There's no strikeout There's no every sentence is clean in first draft. There's no corrections or edits or anything. It was just It was just this sort of perfect, you know straight from straight from your mind onto the page. and maybe he ever reads that way. None of my. Maybe he's a demon. Maybe he's a demon and he needs to be exerciseed. I don't know, man. ' that scares me. Hearing you say that Joe scares me Yeah, I certainly need exercise. I could do well. Well with something like that, like when you get back a manuscript or review or something like that with with no strikethroughs, you nobody is giving you any notes, do you ever ask yourself like Is this good because it's good? or is this good because I'm Stehen King No. Yeah. I I always that And you know, what I always think is I'm going to send this manuscript into the publisher and they're going to call me up and say Steve This doesn't say anything. It's just blah blah, glub glub blah blah, you know, Have you ever read that feeling Joe that it's not good that it's No I always figure I wrote it so it must be pretty great. Every word delicious. Yeah, it's so nice to have that confidence. I love it too. I never doubt. I'm just like everything I walk out of, I go, man, I was fantastic I. Okay You know, one of the things that excites me is the audio version of Other worlds in these Lewis, u Pat Oswald. Oswald is going to do the the recording of that and he' a character in the book who's a stand up comedian who was kidnapped into this other world. so God I think that I can't wait for to hear that. Are you guys both big Are you stand up guys? Do you guys watch standup? Do you guys are you into stand up? Like or do you have you go to comedy clubs M not really not really I, you know, I I had some of the, you know It sounds so old fashioned. I had some like comedy records. Oh wow. Yeah. house Yeah I love my Milton Burl. I was this my old. That's of my favorite. Burns and Allen I am old enough to remember hello, mother. Hello. Hello F I'm done. I like I like comedy. Particularly, I like lame jokes. I like jokes that make you go, o, shit. You know, you know, it's interesting to think that stand up comedians are also writers That they', you know, that they spend time writing and they're building up material and that it is the same process as, you know, writing an essay or a short story or a piece of fiction. My dick is so small and does not work. Heads in a basket Dick small. Yeah. byy the way, basket full of heads. It was full of heads. Yeah. Yeah. I had such a good time with that. I got Now do you have to talk do you talk to your dad about refferencing Shawshank and Derry and stuff like that or does it all live in the same world? or is that just you throwing an homage in there Um Someone asked me about that online and I said, I just thought it was like you know Dad me go in the backyard to throw the ball around Not that we ever really did that because I'm I'm I But I'm not much of a baseball play I like to watch it. Owen was the one. Owen Owen's little league team went all the way to the play.. There's other balls, you know, you could see him Yeah around but we played games and we did a whole bunch of shit, you know We had Fisbee. I guess wed throw the Frisbee around. So it's like that. So it's just it's just, you know I mean, we did have one thing when he was working on Doctor Sleep and I was working on Nosferatu at some point we both realized we were writing books about vampires that steal energy from people steal their souls. basically, his antagonist and my antagonist operated along the same lines And when you realize something like that is happening, there are two things you can do You can either run from it and try to obscure the simularity, or you can run towards it and kind of embrace it. And just I just think it's yeah it's just better to embrace it. So So he stuck my bad guy and Doror Sleep. He stuck Charlie Manks and Dctor Sleep and I stuck the true knot and Um Nferatu. which just makes it seem like sort of a way to You know Acknowledge, you know, sort of acknowledge in passing that there was a similarity there wasas there like one horrible person that both of you met at the same time that made you think like I need to write something about Eergy vampires? It was I guess an editor or a publisher. I don't know, but you know, I remarried in twenty eighteen and my wife and I had twins You know, and around about that time Dad. wrote a story about a haunted pram I wrote a story about one on T. I wrote one called the Pram. and what was the one you wrote Rattlesnake Rattlesnakes was it called? Yeah, you know, and and Neith of us knew what the other one was doing and then we found out, I remember saying to tellelling, what are the odds that we both write? that the two of us would both write stories about you know, haunted baby strollers at the same time and she's pushing the baby stroller back and forth with one hand to keep the twins asleep. And she's like What it fires you. I can't imagine. Where you guys come up with? Wh I come from? How scared are you two of cars? What is to do? Yeah what you guys That is the truth. In your work, there's a lot of scary cars, A lot of haunted cars, trucks, evil cars. You know, the cars are part of our lives. you know, they're just everywhere and You know that if you're going to get into an accident, a serious accident, it's probably going to be in a car now Of course I didn't have an accident while driving a car. I just had an accident while I was walking along the road and I got hit by a car. Yeah. But you know, before that. The cars were there before Yeah, ourur cars are a part of our lives, you know, so That's it. I want somebody to do good a good story about a good haunted GPS story Haunted GPS story Think about that guys. Oh yeah, it just keeps leading you to John Wayne Gy's house. Yes. Honestly, that is it's not a bad idea. obviously it's ' it comes from mister Stephen King That is guysys that is pretty good. You know, every time, you know, you program the GPS and you think it's taking you one place, but it keeps taking you back to the same place and it's some place you didn't want to go. there's something interesting there. That's. I keep working on that. Yeah. I's keep working now I like writing about cars because it's like a shortcut to letting you know something about the character. Yeah. you know, becausecause when you think about it, the biggest purchase a lot of people make in their lives is their automobile, you know after and it's such a reflection of, you the things you think are cool or will make you look cool or we'll meet a set of objectives O of personalities, right? Joe Yeah, absolutely. Yeahitely I mean, that was the whole thing with, you know with Christine, the car makes the man And I loved Christine, but for some reason, I became obsessed for some reason with the The insult shitters that was used I have to ask, man, like shitters What's up with shitters? Be I You're so good at coining a curse word do I remember the best line in that movie was the guy says I'm gonna sell this shitole and buy a condo. I love that I was poping this line So good a question. All right. now in Full Dark No Stars the story nineteen twenty two. You guys wrote about you wrote about mis. King about a father and son. Hiding the body of How long are you gonna call me Mr. King? Mr. King Ste, mr. Stephven. Steven baby. Mr. Stephven. He Stepven. Is that something that you guys want to do Do you guys car ny together? Yeah, is that something that you've ever thought like if you really thought about putting your strengths towards crime. U I'd be scared to go to jail No, I get all out in my imagination. Yeah. Yeah You don't think you'd do well in jail You know, for a guy, I have to tell you, for a guy who writes Fiction for a liivving two, I'm a terrible liar. I think I just confess whatever it was, I wouldn't be able to I wouldn't be able to get away with it. I just, you know, I just blob everything the first time a police officer looked at me sideways. So yeah. Now bestame best best to leave the murders on the page I understand. Likely story. Yeah,ard that before somet. You guys are also creators because this is a part of why we had this and I want to say thank you guys an incredible amount for doing this with us. Part of this was because it was about it's Father's Day. Right, Father's Day is coming up We' all And you have created some of the scariest fathers that have ever existed. Bray, You guys have both together created some very scary fathers. Who is your favorite father figure in media? Like if there's like a there's a dad like either look up to a dad or you don't want to be that guy I said to my dad once when I was a young dad, I said I just I just wanted to be like Gregory Pck playing Aticus Finin to kill a moocking Bird. and I am just I'm just so not able to rise to that level then Dad seemed very perplexed by that and he said Joe, you know Gregory Pack had a script C you tell Sary's stories to your children Yeah, I did. I did but I told them funny stories too because I did funny to go to bed with you know, a scary thought in mind. I mean, funny story would be U You know, Goldilocks and the three bears, but At the end, Goldilocks doesn't get away. she's eaten by the bears. That is funny. It be very funny to me. Would you never threaten him with like Pennywise? You mean like, you know, I made up Pennywise. Like Pennywise is right here. I got Pennywise likeike, you know Henry's dad used to say like I I got Santa Claus's number. Did you ever say? I got Pennywise's number? I I call Pennywise No, I mean, Pennywise now is out there. He's not in my head anymore. so A You know I'm fine, you know, kind of like Fuck you, you know? And actually used to say He used to say when I was little He would sometimes say, if we were just being crazy and you know, the house was in chaos and stuff you' say hey Soont maybe you go put my ass kicking boots on And I remember looking in the closets to try to find them. speulating. We were looking, you know at shoes and boots and, you know, sort of speculating about which were the ass kicking pair. put on. J would come after me. I'm very ticklish and he would go, cellar dweller. B. I I don' know