The Rise of Green Burials

On today's show, we'll unpack an uncertain economy. We will, yes, talk about SpaceX And here's a left field question. Would you trust AI to sell your house From American public media, this is Marketplace In New York, I'm Kristen Schwab in for Kayra's Doll. It's Friday, june twelfth, and it's good to be here with you It's been another week of not really knowing where the war is heading, which means it's been another week of not really knowing where the economy is heading As we always do on Fridays, we're going to take some time to try and sort it all out. Katherine Ramampel is at MS now in the Bulwark. Courtney Brown is at Axios. Hey guys Hey, happy Ly ay weekend. Before we get to that, though let's start here. Catherine, we've got a Fed meeting next week. And it's notably Kevin Worsh's first as the new Fed chair Do you have any predictions on what will happen Oo. You know, he has his work cut out for him because he clearly got the job at least in part. because Donald Trump was expecting him to cut interest rates Certainly, the president said that that was going to be a litmus test before he had chosen mister Wars, the new chair. And now it is becoming increasingly difficult. for Kevin Warsh to deliver on that promise or at least expectation given where we have seen the recent set of inflation prints with CPI and PPI, among others, much hotter than the Fed would like even when you strip out things like energy which is, you know, which is obviously driving a lot of the growth And if you look at where markets are expecting things to go U markets are not expecting any rate cuts in the near or even medium term. Instead, the first move, the first change from current levels that they expect would be Probably at the end of the year, and that would be a rate hike So I think Kevin Worschher's real challenge is how does he manage expectations? He has talked in the past about how he doesn't think that there should be as much forward guidance coming from the Fed for the markets, But how is he going to manage expectations For the White House, that's a much bigger challenge Yeah, Courtney, so we might not see any movement next week, but I am wondering what you'll be paying close attention to to get an understanding of Howst may handle the economy I'm so curious how he's going to interact with the reporters in the room. you might remember a small moment from his confirmation hearing that he kind of suggested he wasn't so into doing these press conferences after every Fed meeting, which that is a tradition that Powell started. So in the broadest sense, you know how much color is he going to give Just like Catherine was saying, there is almost like a mini revolt underway at the Fed. We saw at the last Fed press conference, a group of Fed presidents say I'm going to dissent. I want the policy language to be more even handed because right now as it is, the policy language suggests that the next move could be a rate cut and As Catherine we're saying Fed officials don't necessarily agree that will be the case, right? So you know, what happens to that language? Does it get changed? And when you know when Fed Chair Warsh approaches the group of reporters, is he going to take us inside the meeting in a way that maybe Powell did? Will he tell us about some of the conversation in the room and you know, not to get too meta, but will he continue doing these press conferences? That's one question I have Mhm. Catherine, you know, you referenced the producer price index that came in this week that was hot and the consumer price index. Mostly because of rising energy costs. I'm wondering if you think the Fed thinks this is just a one time spike and maybe different question, if you think it's a one time spike That's really the gazillion dollar question, right? Historically, the Fed has said that they would look through what happens with energy prices. I mean, that's the reason why they focus on so called core inflation because energy prices are very volatile as are food prices This time around You could imagine that it may not be worth so called you know the look through in the sense that it could be a very sustained increase in energy prices and energy prices feed through to the costs of other goods. so we' push up will place upward pressure on lots of other things consumers buy There's also the potential interaction between what's happened with tariffs raising costs, raising prices And the Iran war you know, Straight of Hormuz, energy shock, other commodity shocks. u kind of be creating this one two punch that could potentially dislocate or un anchor expectations. and that's really what the Fed is hoping to avoid That's the real way that this could you know feed into trend inflation is if everybody looks around and says, well, you know what? I'm really worried that my suppliers are going to raise prices. I might as well preemptively raise my own prices or I'm really worried that my employees are going to demand higher wages, therefore I'm going to raise prices And it can all feed on itself So that's really the longer term concern If this were just a one time shock and the shock eventually reverses itself and you don't have all of that other psychology working its way through the markets, then sure, the Fed should just ignore it and go on its way without potentially contemplating rate hikes. But we saw the ECB this week decide that they were concerned enough about Rising prices, again, largely linked to these disruptions from the war that they were going to raise their own interest rates. And so the real question is when if and when, presumably when, other central banks, including the Federal Reserve, may follow suit for similar reasons You know, something different about this spike in inflation, Courtney that you wrote about this week is that rising prices are actually outpacing Wages, which is the opposite of what happened during the pandemic. How important, Courtney, do you think that bullet point is and what does it tell us about inflation I think it helps explain, right why consumers are so Um They feel so ained by what's going on, not only are, you know, prices at the pump, you know, rising really quickly and that's a very salient price in the economy that consumers will feel immediately because of the war. You know, overall inflation is outpacing whatever gains they're getting in their paycheck. So in real terms, they're essentially getting pay cut And there's a bunch of different ways to measure wage growth. but if you look at average hourly earnings, which comes out in the jobs report and you compare it to CPI, I mean, yeah, there's a big gulf opening up. We had some reporting last week that showed that when you look at real wage growth since President Trump took office, they've essentially all of the gains that we've seen have essentially been So in the span of months wiping out a year plus of wage gains. And that's really meaningful not only because of the pain that consumers are feeling, but because you know this wage measure we're talking about, this is the one that the Trump administration, this time last year, was touting as a sign that their agenda was working. And so now that the opposite is the case you got to ask if there are questions inside the White House worrying about what the consumer impact will be, Do they pull back on spending, things of that nature We will find out Courtney Brown is at Axios, Katherine Rampeel is at MS now in the Bulwark. Thanks you too and have a good weekend Thank next for you Wall Street today, SpaceX maybe a deal with Iran. What's not to love? We'll have the details when we do the numbers. As if you haven't already heard, SpaceX went public today. shhares started at an offering price of one hundred and thirty five dollars and closed at just above one hundred and sixty one dollars Anyone can now own a piece of Elon Musk's rocket company, but not everyone can sell their shares yet Marketplace's Sabrie Benchure has more on why early investors, the ones who stand to make the most, are locked out of cashing out, at least for now The people who bought stock in SpaceX today are not the only ones who own a piece of that company, not even close. There's a whole long line of people who got there first. people who had the stock before it was public Lis Byer is founder of IPO advisory firm Class five Group. So like Elon Musk, obviously, owned shares of the company before anyone else did. He actually owns forty two percent of all SpaceX shares There's also venture capital firms, early investors, also employees get shares as part of their pay. There are an awful lot of early investors in SpaceX who have made unimaginable returns in short periods of time A lot of them would probably love to sell on day one of trading to make a lot of money That would look Really bad. state management is selling the shares, that's not cool U don't don't they believe in the company, right? Penett is a partner at consulting firm Eisner Amper. Not only would it freak out new investors to see the old investors and higher ups suddenly selling It would also just take some of the air out of the whole entire IPO Everybody starts to sell which then starts putting a lot of downward pressure on the stock price Not to mention, insiders selling their shares on day one would kinda invite insider trading. Jay Ritter is director of the IPO initiative at the University of Florida. when a company is going public insiders in particular typically have some information that outside investors might not be aware of So for all of these reasons, the OG investors are contractually not allowed to sell their shares at first. It's called a lockup period Commonly one hundred and eighty days Could be ninety days, could be less. SpaceX is releasing its OG investors from selling jail gradually.. Complated likeike they can sell a little bit after the next earnings report, a little bit more. if the stock is doing really well, a little bit more later Basically, it's a way to let investors and employees make some money. without rocking the whole boat. In New York, I'm Sbe Bineschure for Marketplace College graduation season is coming to a close, and graduates are entering a tough job market The unemployment rate for recent college grads, that's people with a degree ages twenty two to twenty seven Their unemployment rate is nearly a percent and a half higher than it is for all workers. some context here. Historically, the unemployment rate for recent grads has been lower than the overall rate All this, plus the rising cost of living, has young professionals thinking hard about where they should move According to a report from the Payroll prorocessor ADP, the best spot for college grads is not in California or New York. It's in Alabama Here's WBHM's Olivia McMurray in Birmingham. About twice a week, Sierra Perine goes to her favorite coffee shop, June Coffee in downtown Birmingham What are we thinking today? Okay, can I just do ice still have water Byina is from Arizona, and she says she wanted to leave the state for a new experience during college. I always joked growing up that I wanted to live somewhere green and fluffy, and I describe Alabama as that. But after graduating from the University of Alabama in twenty twenty two with a degree in engineering, the twenty six year old says she's surprised to still be here pututting down roots One big reason she's sticking around her job Brian coordinates the vision of architects with the practical concerns of mechanical engineers for Brassfield and Gory, a Birmingham construction firm She interned with the company while in college and was hired after she graduated She had other offers, some with higher salaries, but For me, that wasn't a huge deal because Birmingham was so affordable and it's what I knew I wanted to do. The next year, she bought a house. If I look at what I would have been able to get in Scotttsdale versus here, it's drastically different. Alabama's largest universities are pulling in significant numbers of out of state students, many of whom, like Perine, stay after graduation Tom Spencer is a senior research associate with the Public Affairs Research Council of Alabama. We are importing a lot of talent from around the country. We have strong demand for new employees and yet not an oversupply Spencer says that as demand for workers grows. Industries are having to increase wages In Birmingham, median annual wages for recent graduates rose more than sixteen percent over the last twelve months accccording to ADP Trevor Sutton, Chief Economic Development Officer for the Birmingham Business Alliance, also points to quality of life factors attracting young professionals, like award winning restaurants, concert venues, and plenty of parks and green spaces They're like, this is what I really liked when I visited Atlanta and Nashville, but I also didn't like having to drive or wait in traffic for forty minutes. So I think that's been really resonating Government, business and community groups in Birmingham are working hard to recruit young people. and to narrow economic disparity in the city by developing and retaining those already here About a quarter of the city's residents live in poverty Often, wealth inequality in the metro area breaks down along racial lines The city of Birmingham is almost seventy percent black and residential areas and schools are still mostly segregated, not by law, but by practice The city is funding programs to help local job seekers and partnering with universities and employers to provide scholarships to graduates of Birmingham's public school system At a kickoff event for Fuel Alabama, which provides networking opportunities for college students doinguring summer internships, more than half of about seventy interns gathered at one of Birmingham's hip breweries were from out of state But locals were there too Birmingham native Morgan Escott Holmes says Atlanta and other big cities are options for launching her marketing career, but she's made connections with employers here I feel as foundation wise, I will be here in Berbam I just feel as th if we with' in the community that I built that I just would want to be here. I wouldn't see myself anywhere else. Choices like that could help Alabama's largest metro area reduce its poverty rate and keep the supply of college educated workers flowing In Birmingham, I'm Olivia McMurray for Marketplace Coming up, that pile of sticks is worth three hundred dollars, A you kidding Boiler alert, it is not just a pile of sticks, but first, let's do the numbers The Dow Jones Industrial average added three hundred fifty three points, seven tenths percent to finish at fifty one thousand two hundred two. The NASDAQ crept up seventy nine points, three tenths percent to close at twenty five thousand eight hundred eighty eight. and the S andP five hundred added thirty seven points, half a percent to end at seventy four thirty one. For the week the Dow gained seven tenths percent, the NasDAQ also rose seven tenths percent. The S and P five hundred improved six tenths percent Sabree told us all about space exploration technologies, it soared nineteen and three tenths percent. Bonpell, the yield on the tenure tenote rose to four point four eight percent, You're listening to Marketplace This is Marketplace. I'm Kristen Schwab. People are quickly becoming more comfortable with AI. Maybe you've used it to draft an email, search for a deal on a new vacuum, or plan a vacation trust the technology enough to let it take the reins on a much higher stakes task R Thompson recently used a chat bot instead of a realtor to sell his family's home He wrote about the experience for the New York Times, Stuart, thanks for being here Nice to be here So I have to start with An obvious question the first obvious question I mean, he used AI to sell What is your biggest asset? What were you thinking Well, I was basically trying to save money and trying to get the most value I could out of our house. We bought it at the peak of the pandemic, essentially, like peak of the pandemic housing boom And right after we bought it, we watched in horror as Zillow showed our home value falling. and I wasn't sure how much it was worth. And I started talking to realtors and they didn't give me a lot of confidence that it would sell Well So I think that was the major impulse was like, let's try not to lose too much money on this And what parts of the process did you use a chat bought for I would say basically everything. and theres it was very surprising how much you kind of need to know or how many different kinds of questions you encounter when you're in this process. there was the listing itself, like how to write it, what to emphasize We had one buyer who said they were going to put in an offer and they drove around the neighborhood and came back and they said, You know what, the garden isn't really big enough for her dream retirement garden And I was so confused by that. What do you say to that? What should I push and try to get them interested I went to the chat bot and it basically said, they wanted out. they didn't want to go through with it. and they're just saying, something, you know, they just coming up with a reason. It's not probably the real reason They didn't like the neighborhood or the drivers too far, stuff like that. So it was really good at processing the information that was incoming Yeah, you know Selling a house, it's a bit a bit of science, a bit of art, no. I mean, how did the chat bot when it came down to negotiating with those three offers you got It was also very good at that. I think like in every part of this process, I had to bring in my own kind of like thoughts and ingenuity. And that's maybe one criticism against the process. The chatbot's not gonna give you anything unless you give it something to work with. I came across this idea at the very last minute, I didn't wantna pay the listing agent. And in a normal transaction, you pay three percent to the realtor you're working with as the seller, you also pay three percent to the buyer's agent typically And I just said, like what if I made that part of this negotiation? and it gave me the confidence to move forward with that request? So told me what to say it, how to say it. Yeah, it was a great process Yeah. so what were the numbers in the end? didid you end up making more than you expected Yeah, so we thought we list at the house for around five fifty. All the offers came in at around six hundred five ish I didn't pay a realtor on my side. so I saved fifteen thousand dollars roughly And I didn't pay a realtor on their sideite either, another twelve or fifteen thousand dollars. So I think all in, we probably made ninety thousand dollars more than if we did it the usual way selling it for the price that everyone had expected You end your story saying that you typed into the chat bot saying You need to buy a house. You're doing it without an agent. Where do I start Have you used AI on your for your home search I have used AI. I have bought a home actually, so we've relocated, we purchased it. I did use AI as a big part of that process. I used a flat fee realtor. so I didn't have to pay the three percent, again, trying to save money. But when you use a flat fee realtor, they're not as involved necessarily as a full service realtor. So I used AI for a bunch of things to help assess the price of a home, to help pick a bid price. The AI was there for me once again, saved me I think a ton of money on this side of the process And yeah, it was another good experience Stuart Thompson is a reporter at the New York Times and he sold his house using an AI chat bot Stewart thans again Thanks so much. When we talk about climate change, we often talk about the life and death of products like water bottles, sweaters, and electronics, But have you ever thought about the life and death of yourself A little morbid, I know. But the demand for green funerals, those are burials that have a lower carbon impact, is growing. That brings us to this installment of our series My Economy My name is Mary Lauren Fraser, and I live in Montague, Massachusetts and I weave Willow coffins for a living I was traveling in Scotland and I met this woman totally by chance And her business was pretty new. She was a coffin weaver my friend took me to visit her workshop and we walked in and I saw a woven coffin in progress. was like, I have to do this. I just felt like a full body reaction to it So I asked her about apprenticing. It was weaving full days, six days a week, and then at the end of the apprenticeship made some coffins It's been four years this year that it's been my primary income. I've sold between a dozen and sixteen coffins a year They're handmade, but they're also one hundred percent biodegradable. so they make a lot of sense to use for Greenbury all. eleven years ago it was stillill very much a baby. A lot of people had not heard what Green burial was. They didn't know what it was That's still the case, but it's really grown a lot, especially in the last five years I guess I hit the scene a little early, but primarily use willow and then I use some pine to supplement Part of it is that it's cheaper. Part of it is that I love working with pine U part of it is that The willow can be hard to get a hold of some years because there's only a few farms in the US bundle of willillow which if you put your hands together and make a circle. That's well over a hundred dollars. To make a coffin, it's several bundles of willillow People often are like, what? that pile of sticks is worth three hundred dollars, Are you kidding One thing I've offered in the last couple years is people can come and do a little bit of the weaving on their own or their loved on's coffin And what I hear is that it gives them a sense of autonomy and you know, a process where a lot of us feel like we don't have any So there's been really special experiences that have come from offering this work That's Mary Lauren Fraser in Montague, Massachusetts. We want to hear from you, write to us about what's happening in your economy at marketplace d. org slash my economy No time for a final note here today, too much chatting. Our theme music was composed by BJ. Leederman, Marketplace's executive producer is Nancy Fargali. Joanne Griffith is the Chief content officer. Neil Scarborough is the vice president and Gal manager, and I'm Kristen Schwab. Have a great weekend. We'll be back here on Monday This is APM