Liberty Media and F1 Growth

You are listening to Mr Inkx podcast We live at one . Welcome to Mr Infect's podcast. I'm your host, Richard Ready, but my friends call me spanners . So let's be friends. This week we are asking what if and then and then we're doing like a what if thing. Just nicking it the whole thing from Marvel wholesale, but Carlos Signs delivered his very own What if and that kicked us off? We also have What ifs from the Discord, the Patreon Discord Patreon. com forward slash Mist Apex. We also have some from me and Chr is Stevens as well. This is being pre recorded on Friday, the nineteenth of june because in America and the UK , it is Father's Day and I cannot wait to see what meaningless, poorly made tat my children have bought me at the last minute under extreme societal pressure with my own money. So happy Father's Day to all the fathers out there and the people playing the roles of fathers in their family or their found family. We are an independent podcast produced in the podcasting shed with kind support of our patrons and partners. We aim to bring you a race review before your Monday morning commute. We might be wrong, but we're first. Now over the years I've adopted a lot of the Little Ones and Baby Broadcasters and one of the least objectionable of those is Little Baby Chris Stevens. Hello, Chris. Hey spanners, you know, the biggest what if on my mind at the moment is what if it wasn't one million degrees in my little recording space right now? I'm glad you've given me the excuse to just say to anyone watching on YouTube You do not need to call a paramedic. My face is like this because I've been playing tennis at it is hot. And we don't care about Americans opinions anymore about what constitutes us feeling hot. What if Americans just appreciated that for us it is hot? It is, it is hot. My hair is doing this weird floofy thing at the moment. Doesn't look good at all. No , no '.t I shouldn sort of bad out, but I can't. Thankfully, most of the time people only hear you rather than see you. So we will talk about course the fact that you were playing a very leading role in the Lemon twenty four hour race coverage alongside of some of the most famous broadcast established broadcasters and commentators out there. Chris is a part of his career where if he is slated for a major event, my first thought is, oh no , did someone's grandma die? And I'm just have concern for the regular lineup. But you did great. We will talk about that, but we must absolutely start with the Carlos signs What if? So this is the quote he said. Carlos Nature , I have an idea for F one. Race two Grandpri with each of the cars on the grid during the season. So that means as a driver, you have like two races with Ferrari, two races with Williams. Then the driver is part of F one, not part of a team. He's a client that Formula One hires to drive the car. Then I'd have my chance to do two races with Williams, two races with Mercedes, two races with Ferrari, all the drivers would have exactly the same opportunity to win the championship. You'd completely disassociate the brands from the drivers and that way you'd have a real driver's championship and a real manufacturer's championship. So Carlos Science is asking, What if I didn't have to drive this dude overweight, aerodynamically inefficient Williams ? All right, Chris, this is the one of the most toned things I've ever heard from a driver. I actually I don,'t mind the idea from a discussion point of view, but dude no it smacks of I'm fed up of being at the back of the grid. Hundred percent doesn't it? Like he never would have suggested this when he was at Ferrari for example , I disagree with the idea that it becomes a real driver's and a real manufacturer's championship when you do this because I mean , to me , ultimate drivers championship would be spec series , not rotating between different types of cars because we know that, you know, what if you're you're in the Ferrari on the weekend where oh this track really suits the Ferrari and then someone else gets a Ferrari when it's actually their worst you know it's their worst weekend for the Ferrari. So I completely disagree with the sentiment there and pick many hol es with the execution of this idea in the first place. Well, I think I think I'd like to explore how it would technically work out. I also am anti and it's very clearly he's frustrated at Williams and doesn't see him self as having a chance of winning. It was so strange to go disassociate the drivers from the brands. It was like what you mean, disassociate yourself from the brands that have partnerships with Williams that that did on the strength of you being one of their drivers and that would hurt actually I think if I was Williams and he's publicly going hey what if we all just got to go in each other's cars? Why don't we just give that a try? So yeah, definitely you're right. He wouldn't be saying that if the Williams was doing well, it wouldn't even be on his mind. I think the core problem here is he now sees that Project Williams isn't going to be doing anything anytime soon. He's not a spring chicken. He's not an antinelli coming through and they're probably isn't another pathway back to a top team other than being an out and out number two and going in somewhere knowing that you're a you're a solid number two. It doesn't look like there's a project out there where you go, right? I'm going to join Haz and Haz going to be a championship contender . And so his brain is now, you know, what stage of grief is this? But it's bargaining, isn't it? This is bargaining Yeah . I don't know what comes after bargaining . Hopefully it is not yeah it's not depression is it? That's what I mean acceptance I suppose at some point that this will be his place in F one it's the idea that just make it a spec series is like it's fine. If you want to race in a spec series, race in a spec series, the formula once never been like that. It's only recently that any kind of idea of balancing anything between the teams has come in at all because it's only basically the cost cap and wind tunnel time . But what is the objection to yes, you are good driver, therefore you get good car. Like we should be rewarding people who perform in the midfield with championship contending material . This idea that like oh everyone should have a fair go at the championship that,'s just not Yeah, how it works. Because to be honest, that would open up the paid driver market so much more when you know that, okay, well , would F one want to take paid driver money? That's an interesting wrinkle. Does it kill the pay driver market or does it increase it? So on the one hand, you could go, well now , if you have a lot of family money and you manage to pay F one themselves to cut to be one of the roster of twenty two , you are definitely going to get a drive in a Ferrari. You are definitely going to get a chance at a pole capable car . Or do they go well the FYA go well no, we're not going to make money yeah, no thanks, we don't want that money. Warh drivers on merit. It's not gonna happen, is it? No, it would, it would give people who don't have more money the opportunity. No, would it though because you've already spent that money? By the time you get to F one. Yeah , you've already spent that money . So basically F two teams can start upping their prices and jacking their prices up because that seat that's potential seat in F one would be so much more fun and so much more high profile. So yeah, now they would the battle wouldn't be to sustain your place in F one. It would be unlocking those places in F two and F three that make you look valuable to Formula One. I think just from a kind of mechanical point of view as well , then the F one teams would have to start building a car for every driver. Like, what's the most kind of solidly neutral car we can build? Now years ago, if you said okay, yeah, I mean that driver's doing really well, that car's really well suited for him. The team's doing then working really well together to build a car for that driver, you would have people fighting back going no , actually the team s just build the fastest car. And surely that argument is dead now. We know that's not true. We know engineers, drivers and teams will drift towards one driver, even if accidentally, but we now know look Red Bull are brilliant at doing it twice with Verstappen and Vettel. They were able to really work with one driver with a pretty unique pretty with a unique driving style and really dial in on what makes that driver fast. And that should be rewarded really. And we're seeing with Lewis Hamilton now, it can't be a coincidence, can it? It can't be a coincidence. We've got a motivated driver openly pushing an engineering team that is openly receptive and they've started getting results that suit Hamilton and not Leclerc . Yeah, I think that we'd lose that element and the cars would become almost soulless they'd become like rental cars basically. I don't know. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's rent a Formula One seat for a weekend, isn't it? Which now I can't I can't even like entertain the idea any longer . You have no truck with it? Poor Carlos sign.s Absolutely none. Poor Carlos signs, poor James Vows, poor board of directors at Williams listening to unless this is this is being misquoted . I'm totally just trusting the ex account that I saw on. I haven't done nothing . Matt gave me it. So this is Matt's fault. So Matt, in fact, all the research is Matt. I don't want to lie to anyone. If I happen to see something it goes into my brain , but yeah, it's definitely a good talking point of a what if and it cuts to the sort of the core of what we think Formula One is as a competition and I don't think it's this. But I like our other What ifs because they're more sort of history yeah they're like a alternate timeline stuff. Yeah. Okay . We're in the reality now with Arnold Rimmer, but which one has Ace Rima? Oh, and Ace Rima , guess what Ace Rimmer's mechanic was called in Red Dwarf in the universe with spanners as well. Adders old charm. Here we go. Right. Let's have some what ifs then. Gone, Chris, pick your favorites. Okay , so well, I wanted to start off with one that I had myself. I get the ball rolling here and we do have some that link in actually . So my big what if is what if Bertrand Gaso had not been sent to prison , I need to test my knowledge of So Bertrand Gaso, why do I get the feeling that this is a Bennerton driver? The Bennerton driver who was put in prison and led to Michael Schumacher's debut. You're very close. It was Jordan in nineteen ninety. I forget that Schumacher started at Jordan and then got poached by Benetton. I forget. Exactly. So because Bertrand Gasha basically did chemical warfare with the tax i driver and like sprayed him with tear gas in a bit of a road rage incident in London . Michael Schumacher then got the opportunity to fill in for him because he stood in situ prison. So Schumacher had the opportunity to go and do it. And also, had he not lied to Eddie Jordan as well and said, yeah, I've been around spar before that he also wouldn't have got that seat. But it's so interesting . Would Michael Schumacher have had the same opportunity to join Formula One? Would he have made the same impact if it hadn't been that specific race in that specific car? I then also wonder had his car not broken down like seven lapsed into the race or whatever it was, did that stop him having the opportunity to do something stupid that would have ruined the credibility that he built in qualifying it's all of these little butterfly effect moments. Yeah, I love moments like this because I can look at my own career and say, okay, so for example, I had two years as a gardening host , top rated show on the station, BBC. I'm just saying, didn't know anything about gardening, turned it into the top listen to show . So if I hadn't got that opportunity , I'm obviously incredibly talented Would the next opportunity that came along have been the one I would have seized upon? And I just love this idea of we desperately need a driver for spa . If only we had someone who had experience at driving you. ever Have driven round Spa? Yes . Yes, yes I have you seen that Team America movie where they, you know, she's of course it's where the lady I,'ve been hurt before I,'ve lost. I could only get involved with you if you promise me you'll never die . And the guy looks her straight in the eyes and goes, I promise I will never die. He's like, yes, of course I've done Spa. Of course I've done spa. It's hard to imagine, though, then with the impact he made at Bennington Benning at Bennington, Benaton , where the excitement was almost instant. You know, the commentary teams, everybody was like going , who this guy's a star, in fact, the commentary I think said, I think it was Murray Walker. I think the commentary said, Michael Schumacher is not a star of the future. He's a star of today . And I think he made that impact instantly . He was already well revered in sports car racing because he was with Mercedes. I'm pretty sure he drove that rather iconic C nine Sauber Mercedes at Le Mon one time. Off top of my head, I genuinely can't remember, but it was you're right, it was absolutely instant and he was suddenly in high demand from the word . But it was instant and consistently like there was just no doubt that he was something special in that current crop of drivers and now this is my beef I get in fights with everybody all the time which, is good because it's fun. I like fights is that I think any that that era before Michael Schumacher was caught completely just blindsided by Michael Schumacher's appearance on the scene, you know, fit fast,, intelligent, get brave and just a combination of all those things. And all these guys like from the seventies and you know, looking on cigarette hanging out of their mouth going, what would you mean testing? You know, I don't what do you mean Cardio? And so after Schumacher , that he almost set that as a minimum standard going forward like a huge turning point in F one . For me, Michael Schumacher was the first example or at least the leading example and the biggest shift from that point on in that he was a former one driver that was an athlete and that treated himself like an athlete , you know, before that it was still slightly it was coming out of the, you know, the playboy era and the I do this casually and you know, I still go for massive parties all the time and they do still go for massive parties all the time. But the dedication he put towards being a Formula One driver was unlike anything else. I'm trying to look for pictures of like, did he have a big fat thick ne ck at the time ? Well, he was the most physically fit driver of the lot. That's what was the game changer for him in an era where Formula One was still so physically demanding with, you know, no power steering and huge tyres to have to try and, you know, wrap the steering around and what was it still like twelve hundred horsepower or something like that ? The idea that he could stay ten tenths throughout the entire race , whereas everybody else would fatigue in a two hour grandprix , you know, that also made a massive difference. I'm looking at a nineteen ninety five prom o picture, pretty fat neck. Pretty fat neck. Pretty fat neck dude. Yeah. Strong fit. And then when you go to Ferrari, it's a whole different story and that is like this synergistic relationship between hanger, hang between driver , engineers and ability to have a very, very good relationship with the FIA . Yes. Good relationship. That's all I said. There's nothing legal itigiousness can come from that. So Sam H then asks what if Schumacher stayed at Ferrari in two thousand seven and two thousand eight? What if he didn't retire? Yeah at the end of two thousand six, now of course two thousand five six trouble times for Ferrari. Difficult seasons for them. Yes . Alonzo's victories in two thousand five, two thousand six. If he stays on for two thousand seven, that's Reichen 's championship and the man who replaced Schumacher and then Schumacher would win that championship hands down. That's a canter , I think. So yeah, so by the way, just quickly, I want to say I do w,onder whether Michael Schumacher, I always feel like he changed that physicality, or is it just that that's the direction it was going in anyway and he was like an arrowhead because you did have drivers like Alonso and Reichen and all those guys coming through who were much more serious , dedicated athletes. So I don't know if I put too much weight, but it was certainly the first time we'd noticed it. But Schumacher had already been in Formula One for well over a decade by the time Alonso right. Of course it is. Yeah, and' youre absolutely right.. Yeah Yeah, but you know, you had Coolthard there. Coolthood seems like a pretty I don't know if the jaw makes me think of him as more athletic than he was. Yeah, but he seems like he looked no one's calling David Coolthard unathletic, but and again , slightly behind Schumacher in terms of his arrival to Formula One. Oh, yeah, of course, of course. But yes, when you said, What if he didn't? Thank you, Sam for that. That was unrelated, just a coincidence that you both did in Schumacher. What if? yeah so at both two thousand seven, two thousand eight Schumacher wins now an absolute canter an absolute brilliant we'd be talking about Schumacher the nine time formula one world champions and well I'd still say eight because ninety four There's no way. There's no way ninety four counts in my head when I'm talking about officially officially he chined hill out of the way and shouldn't have won the World Championship officially. That's truth. Officially, he is the nineteen ninety four . I don't wanna hear it. I don't wanna hear it. I don't wanna hear that on this show ever again, young man. Now go to your room. I'm already in my I'm already in my room, Dad. I think you're right, right? Because my thing is, I always think, if you look at Master's performance in two thousand eight where he nearly won that championship, it really wasn't a good performance. Like there was so much low hanging fruit. There was so many flub performances. And you think I've always thought like how good must that car have been to let those performances get as close as that, but also what you lost was Schumacher working with Ferrari continuing to build a car through that era. You have to say, yeah, I think I agree with you. He would have he would have added eight and nine. Good, what if? Not so much. Reichen really fell off in two thousand eight as well. Do you know, I think he won the championship and then suddenly Master was the one who was winning races all the time, not Kimmy. Yeah. And did Richland, I do wonder how much the hunger can disappear for some people. So like Rosberg in a recent interview, he was asked, we all know he quit after he won the championship in twenty sixteen , but he was asked when did you know? And he said, well, when I crossed the line yeah, I knew I knew he must have had that in the back of his head. He's won it and he's going, well, I'm full. I'm full. Yeah . I know yeah, maybe maybe tomorrow I'm going to wake up and I will feel a little bit hungry, but I will have been stuffed from this meal . And if you offer me dessert, I don't I don't want any. And in fact, filling myself full and going to the effort of cooking and making a lovely meal for myself, I'm quite hungry, I haven't had lunch today . It would make me feel worse rather than make me feel better . It's a valid decision to take that as the top of your mountain and then go. Reichener's motivation doesn't seem it seems like he has the motivation for happiness overall in general in life and maybe that championship was just like, yeah, yeah, this is pretty cool. Now I'm just going to be an F one driver and it enables me to do the things I want. And I got the feeling that once Massa was ahead in the championship, Richen was perfectly happy to go, yeah, that well. Yeah, I'm probably not I'm gonna win it now, so I'll just do whatever I can to help. So yeah, I don't think his form dropped off. I think that's just an approach thing. Although, how old were you at the time of that? Like six? In two thousand eight , I would have been eleven. Oh, you're aging fast, Chris. Is there any more on that? What if or should we pick out another we got loads we have got loads of wives? Yeah, no, I think we've covered the Schumacher element of this . The next one from Steve Taylor is possibly one of the most popular what if questions regarding Formula One and it is what if Robert Kubitzer didn't have his rally crash in twenty eleven and have most of his arm removed , because the rumor mill was or it was even confirmed the fact that he had a Ferrari seat for twenty twelve or twenty thirteen , if he had it for twenty twelve, there's every possibility Cubita could have won the World Championship in twenty twelve against Sebastian Betel. I mean that is quite a lot of shade at Alonso though No No, I think that says more about how revered Robert Cubitzer was before his accident. Okay, emails to Chris on racing. Actually do follow Chris on racing everywhere and all social media . I think it did that Ferrari definitely had potential, didn't it? And they threw away a fifty point lead going into the summer if my memory serves me correctly. And that was under the old system. Was that still ten points for a win? eight points for second? No , that was the modern one. Okay, so fifty point lead is a pretty sizable lead, smaller calendar than we've got today . So it was quite it was quite a drop off. So but you are saying two time world champion Fernando Alonso still very much at his peak considered absolute on his way to goat status in twenty twelve, you think Kubitza would have come in and done better than Alonso? I think there's every chance he could have done it. And but then even if he hadn't , you know, Kubitzer would be properly and officially on the map . And so does he then stick around when Alonso leaves and Ferrari has a good car in twenty seventeen, twenty eight een. Does he win one of those titles? Does he move to another team and wins a title with someone else? You know, because then he's a he's an even hotter property. You then have to think about the knock on effect as well because you know we saw we saw like Nick Heidefeld make a return to Formula One as a result of that as well and then he went on to go and do Formula Lea for a long time and I even think to last year when Robert Kubitzer won the Lemon twenty four hours. Would he have taken on Lemon if Formula One had remained an option for far longer than it in reality did for Kubitzer? So he was in Formula One from I've just looked it up two thousand six to twenty ten. So he was only in Formula One for four years and then came back and had that other four year run. And I think that was all at Williams wasn't it? When I had it only was one year. He was actually racing, wasn't it? Okay. Oh yes, twenty nineteen to twenty twenty one. It says he on Internet in the No, he was in the worst car on the grid. Alpha the Alpha Romeo test and reserve driver role. Okay, so you're including that. Yeah, okay, yeah, that's because everybody wanted all in as a sponsor because it was a lot of money. Most Polish racing drivers have a relationship with Orland. And so yeah, I think it was around two thousand six time we had a huge influx of and very welcome they were to, of Polish workers into the UK. So made a lot of Polish friends work with a lot of Polish people, and they were absolutely crazy for Kibitz. He had definitely captured. He was their driver. And so it was extra devastating for Poland as a whole . But it was never really on my radar because I had my own biases and I was looking at things I was looking at and I was still recovering from the Michael Schumacher domination, I suppose . And then when I've looked back recently and I've watched a bunch of races from that kind of two thousand six twenty nine, ten, but like he was really good. It just hadn't, it hadn't gripped me and hadn't grabbed my imagination. But like some of his performances, especially in the machinery he had pounding through the grid, really good at overtakes, very str ong pace. He was a very good F one driver with potential to be a good great driver. There are two big standout Robert Kubitz of performances. I'll go to the latter one first , which was in Singapore and he had a puncture or something and so he comes in for new tyres and this was still on the bridge stones. This is back in twenty ten when he was in the Renault. And so the bridge stone's like, yeah, there was a bit of wear, but you would not have been able to just carve your way up the field on a newer set of ties, particularly in Singapore . So the fact that that's exactly what Robert Kubitzer did and even ended up passing his own teammate as well is what made that particularly impressive. And I think he came away with like seventh or something having been running inside the top six before that puncture . And the other one is Monaco the same year because Monaco that year was all about Mark Weber being untouchable , right ? And then and then it was Robert Kubitzer who I think stuck it on the front row of the grid or the second row of the grid and then finished on the podium in the race as well. Like what was that in your car was that? Performance. That was in the Renault. Yeah , yeah. He also sadly became a cautionary tale where driver contracts would have tightened up. It's like, no, you can't do that incredibly dangerous thing. And I'm amazed that Alonso was ever allowed to do the Indy five hundred that. Indy five hundred indicar open cockpit? Yeah, no. And that wasn't long after Dan Weldon's fatal crash either, I don't think. Yeah, it was only about five years off. Yeah. And like indic is like if I ever slate Indicar and I would love, you know, I'd love to go see Indicar I, never have so anyone wants to invite me and try and change my mind. That'd be cool. It's more of a my thing versus your thing rivalry . I do think the standard is probably higher of the feeder systems through to Formula One than is to indicate when it comes to single seats racing. However, I just need to say that if you have the balls to get into an open seat or cockpit and do the indie five hundred at those speeds, to me that looks like a lot of F one drivers when asked would you do the indie five hundred of gone ? No, obviously not. Obviously I wouldn't do that. So the thing is, I'm not saying indicator in general, but oval racing is a completely different. It is. Of course , of racing. It's a very specialist thing to do in the same way that circuit racing is, you know, a somewhat specialist thing to do . And it's yeah, it's not completely different. I mean, let's look at this. Yeah, Alex Rossi cracked his leg in testing and still managed to race was like, you know, on crutches going to his car. And then it was Joseph Newgarden who, I think, broke his hand during the race as well . So and that's okay. There's an acceptable risk level that you accept. And I've certainly been in jobs where I was quite surprised. The first time I found out that I was fully expendable on a certain jaunt where we wow it's a it's a funny story now. I was trying to I was trying to get evacuated because my buddy was in a state and they got quoted a document and I was like, oh we'd have to we'd have to look like another four like that before the thing got called off. But if you're an indie car driver you have to have those risks in your head. Any difference sport you accept the risks that are presented to you and then you have to drive to those risks otherw,ise you're compromising performance. And I suspect that's what happened with Ricardo. He went those risks outweigh the benefit because I'm already really rich and in my prime and I should just enjoy having a fantastic life looking a little bit like the crazy guy from Brooklyn nine nine. What's his name? Adrian Pimento. Adrian Pimento. Once I was I looked at it and I went when you had the thick beard, I was like, It's Pimento . You can overtake me. You can outbreak me. Nothing is off lim . So yeah, but there are certain there are two events I can think of come to mind now where I go . You are incapable of making a sane risk reward maths thing and actually anyone who accepts those risks is probably I don't think they're in a position to take those risks. I would question their position to take those risks. And I'm happy to stand by this. Isle of Man T and any rally event ever . Rally looks ins ane . It's crazy the margins are so small and the risk is so high . I just, who are these people that can do it? And not just the drivers, at least you're in control. Who's the dude that's going slightly left completely blind fast right handed ? And they don't react. Here's the problem. They don't react when something goes wrong, they don't go, Oh, blindy, they just go, alright? Yeah, I need some new overalls for my knee a couple of scruff on me. Gear one. Okay . So yeah, for an F one driver to risk his career and go and do rally, I don't think that's gonna happen again. Or did Reykin do it? I can't remember. Well, Reiken did it, but that was while Kubitza was also doing it. Right, right, yeah. And I'd imagine it was the following year that Reiken stopped rallying and came back to Formula One . Yeah . So I think the teams will have tightened up on stuff like that. Hundred percent. I don't I can't they anyone who's done rallying obviously people have gone and done other bits and bobs Nikolah was allowed to do the twenty four hours of Le Mon in twenty fifteen, which he won with Porsche and that but those were in the days where it didn't clash with anything, I think. And Forman One doesn't care so much about that now. And the crazy thing about the Alonso one was it'd be one thing to go and let your driver do the indie five hundred. It's another thing to let him miss the Monaco Grand Prix to do the indie five hundred. No, do you know what I feel like? I feel like that was a we're sorry about the engine thing. Do you remember the Honda was so bad? Yeah, yeah, of course. The Honda were also powering McLaren in Yeah, but it's like it was like a well I know the engine yes you're right GP two engine. We get it Fernando what could we do to make just an idea, we do have a car that works in a difference. Would you like to have a go? That's what it felt like to me was like an apology thing. Plus, they still had Button on contract. So I think Button had to do that Monaco Gran three. much again I think Button was very satisfied with his lot at that time. There was one there was one year he didn't qualify for the race. He didn't make it into the top thirty three in qualifying. So didn't even get to start ed then. And the second year was much more competitive. It was probably fighting for a podium and then the engine blew up. The great irony. Yes . Well, how do we get this? Don't go rally driving. It's crushing and that injury, by the way, with Computer he. came When back into F one , they did a fairly good job of like trying to hide it and minimize it, but that looked bad. That looked he was he would qualify for every form of disability and parking and benefit and all that kind of stuff. And you could see the shape of his hand. They had to do a cutout, didn't they in his cockpit at Williams to help it rotate? And you just it was such a brave effort to go, can I can I do this in this limited state? And you go, ultimately, I think no, but you have to admire the effort to try . And he did get to park closer to the circuit, as you say, so is that real? No. No, no, no, I just made that up. Oh, come on , Chris It would have been good. I don't think Formula One even has disabled bays where the drivers parked me amazing. Well, they have special toilets 'cause I accidentally peed in Perez's toilet one year. Okay, we're gonna have it. We're gonna circle back to that one day. Oh, okay. Because I know we're tight on time. No and wow. We're tight on time because I was my face was even redder than this. I'm a quiz , I need my face to cool down a little bit. I want to know about Lemon. I want to know Lemon. Before we go to our next What's if I need to know about your Lemon experience. So allow me to feel to allow me to feel like the most proud. The whole community's so proud of you. Everyone was listening in. They were so proud. I get to feel the most proud because I feel like I've found an injured baby bird with a broken wing and together we put you in a towel, we kept you warm . And you know, we gave you like a platform, you know, not always the best platform, but it's like, just go wild. Just be as crisp . And then we've watched you go into various areas of commentary and we've always outwardly encouraged you where inwardly we've gone, what are you doing? You don't have the wealth to keep failing or to attempt these things when you're not getting paid. These jobs are for rich kids. And I honestly believe Chris that you were too just too stupid to give up on this really impossible, impossible dream. And look at you. You're lined up next to what? Alex Brundel Anthony Davis said, like these rock gods of commentary, a little baby crest . I don't know there was clap, clap, clap . Thank you, man. There was a moment when during like the last practice session at Lamon, and I was saying and hey, look next time you hear from us, it'll be for the start of the twenty four hours. We're going to have you know Alex Brundle and World Endurance champion Sam Byrd is going to be here McLaren development driver Joe Osborne and three time winning engineer Lee gade . And I'm here as well. Yeah, you got to also be and you say it out loud. And I don't know why I don't I don't know whose grandmother is sick. But thank God , thank goodness, thank goodness. Oh, I know personal tragedy the proper commentators having right now. I know exactly why. It's the same reason I did it last year as well and it's because Lee Diffy and Alex Jakes and Will Buxton were all unavailable busy. Oh man. Same thing. The paying gigs I've got where it's because someone's they were out last night and we can't get hold of them and go, oh yeah, I'll do it for money. Oh, desperate are we? Okay, I'll do it if I'm money. Yeah, no but yeah, obviously you're of that level where now people know. People know for absolute sure if the if the first choices are missing , they can give you a ring and you can you can slot in and do the job that. was And always my thing on radio as well. You know, we're always hovering around, trying to show you and every time you get a chance to substitute in, you do a solid job, show what you can do a little bit, show your routine. And it's like the drivers in the FP one sessions. It's not about ultimately quick or super witty or saying a great like crescendoing thing . It's showing the people who make the decisions and the people you work alongside that you're someone good to work with. Yeah, nice . c Therazy thing that we had to do during free practice was try and fill nine hours of on track time. And we were, you know, rocking through guess. If you tuned into the coverage, you know, we had a few drivers come in , a few team bosses , you know, quite significant names that we were able to to go and get in and then the race itself was a bit of a blur. To be honest, it's amazing how quick twenty four hours goes by. When you're living your stupid, stupid dreams, yes. I know . And at the same time, it kind of felt like a long week as well because we were on air from Wednesday all the way through to Sunday aftern oon. Number one highlight of commentating on the Lemon twenty four. And then if you if you if you want to share what went wrong anything many things went wrong spanners . things Many went wrong , but the beauty of it is that as the consumer probably don't see well hopefully don't see most of the things going wrong because that's just live television , isn't it? That's the nature of the game. Did you just have a moment where you went, Oh my god, oh my god, what am I doing here? I nailed that bit and I'm on TV commentating on the Le Mon twenty four that I've had movies made about it. No, after my first in stint the race , I came where I was like Charlotte Cler. I was like, No, I did a job. You know, I did a job and I had to be like consoled a little bit by some of my colleagues because you know, they've all been there. They all know how it goes . Because it was alongside the exceptional talent in the Coms box, we had Rachel Stringer, Laura Winter and Alexa Rendall with us as well who are all just amazing . Are they pit lane or what were they doing? The presenting pit lane , like going in chatting to fans and things like that. So yeah, there is a moment where I'm standing around and I'm going, What the hell am I doing here? I don't have a place in all of this , but the pretty exceptional moment was probably during qualifying. I was like we didn't do the qualifying last year . So we got to call like the moment that initially we thought was going to be Cadillac getting back to back poll positions and then a bit of post session controversy and they're celebrating poll position and then they get the news actually sorry, it's now BMW who have got the poll position for the first time ever . So that was pretty pretty cool to be a part of. Just in general, you know, working for Eurosport Warner Brothers Discovery. If you're watching on YouTube, you may just above my head be able to see the remnants. I'm going to pan the camera up a little bit. It's I have seen all the commentary booth sign . I stole the sign from the door of our commentary . You're admitting a crime . That's fine. They were done with it. Okay , well, we'll see if that has any immediate and serious ramifications. Congratulations, Chris. You jobed well, you jobbed well at your job and you do have the spirit of do the job professionally have fun and occasionally that is that is funny. We're all very proud of you and a little jealous. And just remember if your profile does ever significantly challenge mine as a beloved internet and Netflix personality, I will shuffle you off the panel and forget you ever lived. The name Christ Stevens, it'll be illegal to mutter it in the chat, it'll be an immediate ban. I'd expect nothing less. And I can't wait until the day that that actually happens. I get to do things without people being sick no good. It's a good actually being a general like super sub, even in sports, I love being a squad player. Pressures off. You know when you're in there, everyone's supporting you. It's good. Like it. No, I'm all about. This is my this is my one shot one of the opportunities. Do you want us to start everything I ever want us to start undermining the careers and credibility of some of your colleagues to make you a choice? A higher choice? Oh no. Can we just spread a rumor about Alex Br undel that he uses the racing line on the simulator on our racing . No, no, we can I do have to say poor Alex literally poor Alex because he wasn't feeling very well throughout the entire week. And so he persevered on, you know, ibuprofens and like throat sprays and things like that. And he's just come off the back of recovering from a massive short oval crash as well. He had a short like it was like a almost like a demolition derby and I've watched them in real life. They're crazy races and he got stuck in and got absolutely I think he got T boned or was the T boner and so he's like, Yep, welcome to Short Corse Ovals. So he posted it himself so I'll try and find that for reference. Right. What's our next What if Chris? Our next What if? This is quite a big one. Okay , from Stuart by Colez , what if Honda didn't quit formula at the end of two thousand eight this does have pretty serious repercussions that we would still feel to day because as many people know, Honda became Braun won the two thousand nine World Championship, and then Mercedes bought Braun thinking that they were basically buying a world championship for the next couple of years as well and slapping their name on it before realizing that actually oh this is a massively underfunded and under resourced thing because it was bought for a quid , you at know, the end of two thousand eight or beginning of two thousand nine , even so it wouldn't have changed anything in the short term, the very short term. They still would have won the two thousand nine World Championship, maybe a little bit more easily because that car would have actually been developed. The year question This is where we're missing our live chat. So who developed the double diffuser that gave Mac Ha,onda or Braun that, massive head start at the beginning of the two thousand nine season. Honda. Honda developed that yeah. Honda made that car and then everything bought by Ross Braun. You know, it was it was still the core, the same core group of people at Braun who were at Honda . So it wouldn't have changed much for two thousand nine. If anything, it would have made yeah their job a little bit easier. So do they have the same kind of the same phenomenon where their their diffuser works really well. They get those first six races where they are they've surprised the entire field and then of course Red Bull get it catch up other teams start having their own versions of it and then they are no longer the dominant diffuser car going into ten, eleven, twelve. Does that work out the same? No, I wouldn't say so because the problem that Braun had was that they had no resources to bring upgrades to the car throughout the year because they were a skeleton crew. They just lucked into the fact that Honda has built an amazing car here and we've just been able to fit a Mercedes engine and gearbox into the back of it , right? And it's turned into a pretty amazing package, it turns out , but they barely did anything to the car throughout the whole year because they had no money, they had no resources. They had a small factory, they barely had any staff in comparison to a McLaren or a Red Bull or a Ferrari of the time , right? So Honda staying in Formula One full chat and not withdrawing because of the financial crisis , staying full chat they would have had upgrades, they would have had more resources. So you could argue they would win zero nine convincingly and had a proper crack at championships in twenty ten, twenty eleven. Well, here's a question then. A Jensen button wins in two thousand nine and jumps ship . What or does he win multiple titles with Honda? Does he become a two, three time ? No, but why did why did he leave in two thousand nine? Why did he take the McLaren drive? Well , that's the only thing he led because he wanted a new challenge going up against Lewis at McLaren. I can't have been I mean that's a he must have thought that McLaren was the best option to continue world championships and looked at Braun. Okay rem,ind When did Mercedes by Braun were Mercedes from twenty ten ? Yes, yes, but he but ton left Braun knowing that it wasn't going to be a world championship winning team because it was under resourced and Mercedes bought something that needed significant investment and then needed to be built up. That's why they didn't win races for the first couple of years. Well that that problem doesn't exist if Honda had stayed on. They win in two thousand nine. Now he's up against Baricello in twenty ten and a resurgent Red Bull. So we've got Red Bull and Vettel and Weber versus Honda with Button and Baricello, presumably That's your fight . Maybe even you know, a younger lineup as well because obviously then Rosberg joined what then became Mercedes probably because they wanted a German driver , but then you have this whole thing of, well, what does Mercedes do? Does Mercedes enter for one at all? They were evaluating it because there was tension with McLaren as their engine supplier. So buying a formula one team was a bit of a power play by Mercedes . So what do they do? Do they start from scratch and build something? Does that then stop them winning world championships in the turbo hybrid era because they're building something from scratch. Do they buy a completely different team and have completely different successes? The whole face of the twenty ten's changes on the basis that Honda stays in Formula One. So Curs are a bunch of Americans sold toxic mortgages . We're that's how we get Mercedes in as the powerhouse in Formula One. Here's the thing though, Mercedes were a relatively new in reincarnation by the time we get to the engine thing, the engine hybrid thing , right? Who pushed for the hybrid engine to come into Formula One. That would be a question for me. Like do we even get hybrid engines at all if Mercedes aren't there? Yes, because Mercedes were still supplying engines. Oh, they would know that question for it. So when it came to though, that from that time on, Mercedes have been there all thereabouts as the best hybrid engine manufacturer . But then okay, so let's say Mercedes doesn't enter their own formula one team. They just stay as a engine suppli er. They may well still have the best engine in twenty fourteen when the turbo hybrid era comes in, but it's not Mercedes winning the guy. Maybe McLaren becomes the one . Oh they would have they would have remained the de facto factory . And who was driving for McLaren in twenty fourteen? Johnson Bunny Kevin Magnuson . A Titanic tussle between Bunt Button and Magnuson. No, it wouldn't have Magnuson was a rookie that year. Wipe the floor with it. Yeah. And also that just the peakiness of Magnuson in general, the peakiness of performance, you put your money on button, especially when you look at how he performed in twenty eleven, you know, with a with a raggedy loose headed Lewis Hamilton that you know, button ran away in that teammate battle. So that is actually a really complicated what if I do feel like it's hard to imagine that Mercedes didn't have that opportunity to buy Honda or Braun and just went ah, do you know what leave it? It's a hassle. Like it seems like they went in there with a plan, they developed it and they did really well. I can't imagine I'll do leave it. We were into it, but we're over it now. But it becomes it becomes the opportunity to buy your way into Formula One because we also but there was three new teams that year as well . Now do they do they okay, here's an idea do they buy Sauber because BMW had withdrawn from Sauba as their oper ating partner , do they then buy Sauber and say you are now going to be the factory Mercedes outfit? It would have been completely different. I think traditionally if you bought Sauber it,'s because you were you right, okay, we want to do commercial things. We want to maybe build an engine, we want to maybe decide drivers , but we need you as a racing outfit. So Sauba was the racing outfit and under those conditions, that felt like that was the business model with Sauba for a long time. Like what names have Sauba had I'm wearing the shirt today? So steak, kick, F one, Audi, Alpha Romeo. It's very much been eight, look, I get you want to come into F one. Don't worry about all that difficult racing stuff. We'll sort that out. We might not be at the top of the grid, but it will be solid and we won't embarrass you and you'll be up there in F one. Yeah, but does that change your Mercedes are the ones who want to hide it? It's the wrong team's wrong team. It's not a good fit. Why would Salber g go, no, oh, we want us to abandon our entire business model and just have our stuff. Like no, no, no, we'd like being in F one and we like selling our services. They're like the golden company of Audi . They're like the seven sons . They eventually did it. They eventually did it. But if you look back to that time, I don't know if they would have. But they hadn't. They hadn't done it seven times by then. This is sixteen years ago. We hadn't seen alpha Romeo and Steak and whatever the other ones were on that car yet. They'd only just split ways with BMW as the BMW factory outfit . So it would have made sense to switch over to a Mercedes. Yeah, well look at the forces behind it as well. So it was still Mat Mataschitz it was still Ross Braun right these were the still the figureheads of the people trying to get into F one in some way under a Mercedes banner. Well, now Braun was already Braun transferred over and then got very quickly ousted, didn't he as well? So shoved out. No, I wouldn't say quickly. There was a deadly trio, wasn't there? Who was the Toto Toto Nicki Lauder? Yeah. Oh yeah, there we go. Yeah, and Ross Braun. And Ross Braun for a while. And Paddy Low, Paddy Low. Paddy Low's more engine size. Yeah. I think it's inevitable. So I think if Honda stays in, I think I was like, yeah, what do what's it? Yeah., you're right It was a good toe hold, wasn't it? It was a good you swung the hate. I thought I was arguing against you and then I've ended very very good Christopher, very good . Yeah, I'm with you then. Without Honda leaving, there isn't the same toe hold for Mercedes to go in, and I think that throws into doubt that period of domination that they had subsequently in the Hybrid era. Very much, so how much time do we have left? Well, I mean infinite really. I think I think I could probably make like seventy seventy five . Like my lifestyle generally like is fine , but and I do exercise and I'm relatively fit, but there's no history of like cancer heart disease. So I think I can get to good seventy. So I reckon I've got thirty years left . How much of that do you want for whatever topic you're about to talk about? Well, we could take up a year with this okay I'm going to do it. I'm going to reprioritise here Spanish and I'm going to get to the ones that are at the bottom of the list because they're a bit more interesting in ten minutes ten minutes ten fifteen minutes is the real answer. Okay, for my life, I hope. Like that episode of the IT crowd, like he's gonna die at three o'clock on Thursday . Okay, that's due a rewatch. You've just sparked that off. What's the life? What's the world ? So there are two hit two kind of related ones , one from Joey Forbes. What if Daniel Ricciardo stayed at Red Bull for twenty nineteen through to twenty twenty one ? And subsequently, I think this is related from Jay . What if Piastri went bean ? Does McLaren and Lando still push forward to be World Champions without having a little healthy competition? So I just lost your audio a little bit. What if Piestri What. if Piestri went to Alpine ? Oh he was at , yeah. So yeah that part one, part one , Ricciardo stays at Red Bull . Yeah . I don't think he challeng es Max Verstappen for the World Championship in twenty twenty one, for example. I just don't. I don't know what Daniel Carlo's family was doing at that time. Probably supporting him in a loving way. But what the advantage was there, I would imagine Josh Verstappen is a massive part of it. I will never know the internal politics unless there's a book, but I imagine Jos Verstappen was very much a big, he seems like a very big voice in the paddock and able to impose his will and gun. You know, and there's this kind of maybe there was an unwritten rule at various times about being a teammate and being good teammates. And yeah, it's a bit of a British attitude. It's like good luck. Let's both go up in our spitfires and may the best man win and the jolly rotter who loses disappear into the sea in a fiery ball . And I think that Verstappen the Vestappen camp was like no absolutely not. We need to get a grip of the team. We need the car to support the team behind us. And then he saw that in that Baku incident where it's in my mind stampen caused a crash and then the team were like, I think the team were like, well, that's fifty fifty. We're kind of angry at both of you where really they should have been Max, what are you doing? But they wouldn't do that because it was the Verstappen train already by that point. They'd identified Verstappen as someone they could build with, someone they could work with, and they were right to do that. That decision has proved to be a fairly good decision. Like they have been vindicated . They did quite well after that point and I think that is the way that you should go racing. Clear number one, do everything you can. Find a find a driver who your engineers can develop towards , not just build a car you think's pretty good and then see which one of your drivers does better. Red Bull are ruthless at doing that. And at the time there was a very recent example where Mark Weber , no one told Mark Weber he had to figure it out by himself. Not bad for a number two driver. If Vatal breaks a front wing, he's gonna get your front wing. That is crushing Not getting a grip of team orders , really, that multi twenty one was like, yeah, he doesn't have to those no, those rules apply to you. Yes, we did write those rules. We should have clarified only applies to you. And so there was a very recent history of it. Plus, you could probably just see the talent side of it too, that Verstappen was this phenomenon coming through. If he stays, he becomes the first of the cursed red bull number two drivers instead of the one that got away. Reputationally , he did do the best. That was the best move. Forty million a year contract at Renault . Yes, yes, he made the right move. So does he then still go to McLaren and have quite a difficult time there? Because I think if he doesn't, if he stays with Ribble for a little bit longer, he doesn't then maybe desperately end up at Alpha Tauri and end up breaking his wrist potentially. I think reputation gets destroyed. So this is where you talk about the heavyweight boxer comparison. You know, it takes a heavyweight box a long time to recover from a loss. And if you've got a good fighter, you protect him, you build up properly , you know, make sure he's on the right cards and then and you're making your money out of that and then you get to a point where they're the number one contender now. Let's take our title shot preferably to a champion that is at the end of his career that we think is vulnerable that we think and then you get your bouts and then that's the big money, a couple of defenses and then you're out . But Ricciardo, it was like he was facing a big knockout blow against like they neither of them were champions . And so he's not even going to feature as a contender. He's going to get shown up on that contender title card as not being well prepared and dropped down the order. So he has to leave. He absolutely has to leave if he stays . Look what happened to Perez's reputation, Gazley, all those really fast quick guys, yeah, he gets a battering if he stays . So well the interesting if he did stay , then Gazley's reputation is saved, Alban's reputation is saved opportunities in the big boy seat, do they? Some of them might, some of them still might because Ricardo would have I think Ricardo would have been gently let go after a couple of seasons anyway. Maybe okay. Well then the interesting part the part two of this if in the timeline where Ricardo was at McLaren that's all happened. He left he left Red Bull, he went to Renault and then went to Clarence. So you mean our timeline? You said in the timeline as if it's like an option. No, in this timeline in the reality in reality Earth C one hundred and thirty seven, right? It's our earth . What's that? What is the Rick and Morty original universe? That's what I just said. Worst Rick and Morty I never. Okay, gone. Carrying. God , honestly. So in our timeline and he's at McLaren, but he stays away. He isn't ousted for Piestry Piestri's gone to Alpine. He's been given he's been given the thumbs up like out like Alpine announced like, yeah,, Piasi is going to be our driver and Oscar goes , yep, all good. I'm doing that in. Yes, Sir Rib , right ? Does Ricciardo challenge Lando for the title in twenty twenty five . No, no , but no. What evidence would you have that he would it wasn't going well? It was a question. But it really wasn't going well. Ricciardo won a race and Lando did not. Did you watch that race? It was Monza. This is , but where was Lando? He was behind Daniel. Did you watch the race? My God. That doesn't matter. Our race was so much quicker. It was unlucky it was unlucky and Norris is like, okay good, I'll just go and overtake him because he got called off. It was like, no, bring it home. He Norris was called off and stopped from fighting Ricciardo in that race. He was faster in that race. He was faster the entire time they were together and the one race winning opportunity that they had Ricardo finds himself ahead McLaren fair play to them they find themselves one too suddenly they go a. Nobody breathe . Nobody breathe at all. We want to take this home. No, there's no way. There is no way on earth Ricardo gets it together in time to challenge for what the twenty twenty four twenty twenty five championship. twenty five . You think he's going to survive another five seasons of the kicking he was getting from the media and from everywhere ? Well, okay, let's say let's say he did and it's Ricardo it's Ricciardo and Norris at McLaren in twenty twenty five . Does that then mean McLaren actually walks the championship because yeah they're not taking points off each other. And in twenty twenty four, he's a lot closer as well. They should have called Piastri off way sooner. He cost they cost Norris a win probably in Monza again. Like Piestri's move that Norris avoided meant that he went down to third, I think, behind Leclerc and and he was having to buy and all that stuff that went that was happening with the team orders and Hungary where Norris had to give up a win or there was that twenty twenty three and then there was yeah there were there was interlagos I think it was one of the late sprint races where they they had Priestri going win instead of and they called Norris off on that one and said don't push don't overtake Yeah without Papaya Rules, they're way closer in twenty twenty four as well. Plus he's not kind of been undermined. He's not having to think about this teammate battle. He's been definitely favored by the team by that point. Like what is Ricardo's role in the team at that point Score points. Some points. He would keep a stapping behind. But the thing is Ricciardo was a superstar personality and driver . He was never gonna be reduced to a number two role . So he was he was always going to be replaced. It's a bad what if scenario because you were never going to get Ricciardo staying there. He didn't have a chance of surviving and he didn't want to. Farona? Who's what if was that? Jays? Hi Jay, thanks for contributing . Look, so in your mind, Daniel Ricardo stays at McLaren and Lando Norris is a two time world champion. Okay. I think if McLaren had really lent in, I think it was a problem. You know, we talked about the Josh Verstappen element at Red Bull , Mark Weber coming in and sticking his oar in and I think that relationship eventually fell down. That caused papaya problems that perhaps McLaren just weren't anticipating. And McLaren have this ethos of being nice and fair between the drivers , which is lovely . And that is the sort of attitude that gets you invited to my Christmas table, but I don't think no one's ever going to do that again in a Formula One team . That papaya rule stuff. She's squeezing a quickie, should we squeeze in I was just gonna say, I think we can squeeze in one more. Tea Frost . What if Liberty Media never bought Formula One in twenty seventeen? Day, one thing. One thing is for sure. Formula One still would not be on Twitter or Instagram any social media. Bernie had never heard of it, honestly . If I owe Liberty media a lot of my livelihood happiness. Well, I could I could still I would have just I'd be in defense right now. I would be doing I'd be telling baby engineers of your thing will heat up and explode and they will went crying to their equally inexperienced managers who've never set foot outside the office and then we build their thing and then it overheats and explodes and somehow no one ever goes Oh yeah you were right Rich. Yeah. Maybe we should make things that don't overheat and explode. I'd still be doing that, circling, I'd still be circling that drain, Chris. And you're absolutely right. They saw it as much more of a we need to see this from a business media point of view that brands will be attracted to. And this is something I've been learning so much over the last couple of years. And I now speak to and have meetings with brands. That's the kind of grown up thing I do. They're always exploring possibilities. Several brands are aware of our exist ence and be like, Oh, well we might use you for this, we might get involved with this kind of stuff. Those brands would not exist under the old, they wouldn't be here in the same number under that old system. You're absolutely right . They used to go around content creators making sure they weren't, you know, oh never utter the word F one, you know, never, you know , it was so restrictive and now obviously like obviously free advertising for your business is to have podcasts and communities around it. Drivers would have a lot less freedoms in terms of their own brands. So you think like Lando Morrison, his quadrant brand that wouldn't exist. Daniel Ricardo's wine wouldn't exist that basically no F one themed alcohol would exist like Valtteri Botassis vodka as well. That wouldn't happen. And we should say drink responsibly and often. Drink. Have fun, just have fun. You know, there would there be would be way less money. Way less money in Formula One. It wouldn't look as nice and obviously drive to survive never would have happened. We wouldn't have had the massive popularity boom, which kind of goes hand in hand with the popularity boom that then brought in the more sponsors and the more money and therefore more opportunities . You'd have far fewer people going to Grand Prix, you'd honestly, Formula One would look so much different. It's been like it would be in the dark ages. It would have been like it was before where you would never bump into another Formula One fan in real life. And if you found a Formula One fan, it would just be that the best day because you could just and best friends, instantly best friends unless they supported the wrong driver obviously . And then when we started doing F one podcasting, it was like, Oh my God, I get to talk to other people who were into F one. This has never happened before. That's brilliant and obvious foundly we the mistpex community and it was building before when did Liberty Media take over? twenty seventeen. So yeah, twenty seventeen, twenty eight, it was building anyway with the existing fan base, but then when Dveri to surv ive kicked off and I don't know is that an accident or did Liberty Media make Drive To Survivor That was Liberty That was Liberty All Liberty Genius Absolute Genius . I would say that was probably the single biggest thing for increasing viewers viewership, popularity and brands and stuff. And a lot of the listeners to Mr. Apex, listeners to the Ringarf one, people who I meet when I'm at the track and go there's that turnip that we listen to on the podcast. None a bunch of those, well, I would say most of those are so called drive to survive fans that people slag off like how dare they have only recently found our sp ort. It's been wonderful . The second biggest thing in that as well, which is often overlooked official F one E sports, that never would have happened under CBC. Yeah, I mean, that's fizzled a little bit post COVID, but I mean it's still going. It's still going . It's it's still going it's going it's that it's not ballooning. It's not mushrooming in the way that it looked like it might do at one point. I mean it would help if the game was any sort of good , but Sim. Chris, I disagree. I think it's a great game. Experience the thrill of Formula One from your home. FY IN, buy it, sponsor us. It's great. It's great for you and me just like on a controller did or look whole fun. In terms of a serious eesports competition, it cannot handle it. Yeah, I saw that even with Lan, even with cables all tied together. They were having issues there. Yes, I think it had legs. I would love Esports had a moment and then and then that moment never blossomed, which makes me sad because I love Esports. Yes. But it's still a massive winters bringing in an audience because gaming is the biggest industry in the world . So yeah, you just it's it's massive if Liberty never buys it. The sport just would not look the same. We wouldn't be going to a lot of the tracks we're going to now. That is for Daniel. You mean me personally, but yes, I'm never getting to go to race tracks with no okay, not being funny but you wouldn't be. No , I'm saying I wouldn't be. Yeah , it's same we wouldn't have these tracks on the calendar and people like you certainly would not be people like you people wouldn't be invited people . Well, I only really get there with brand money if a brand wants to play with us. But where's the brand coming ? For Miami in Miami, I got there for being a beloved TV streaming personality. Thank you very much, Christopher. That was the first time it wouldn't have happened. No CBC. A hundred percent. And the American adoption and fan base around Formula One, definitely that explosion has been the bedrock really of why it's able to do what it's doing now. And also I've been wanting the all of F one has been wanting the Americans to come in and go, well look, we've got this. Be a fan of our stuff. And we've got so many American people in our community and I've met so many of them and they're great. Now I can't stand the gatekeeping is over of DTS fan. And in fact, I'm gonna gatekeep. If you're the kind of person who says Urch DTS fan, then you're not a proper sports fan. Because a sports fan community is about welcoming people in at their own pace at the level of engagement they want to engage in and helping them if they want to have help , arguing them in a fair , you know, noble way . But you guys who just like dismiss people's fandom because they came to it via the drive to survive or that kind of era. You're ridiculous now. You sound ridiculous now, you sound like get off my lawn commudgins. Your commudgins is what you are. Well said. Al I'coll gethol it get it tired of it. Yeah. No, I couldn't agree more. I know I hate it's such a snobby thing to do. Like how insecure are you in your fandom that you that's your thing that you are lauding over people that you were watching a thing on the tele before a TV program that made somebody go, Oh, that's cool. I also want to watch that thing. It's such a loose , small minded. Oh my god, I hope half our audience don't feel like that and go, wow, if that's how you feel Spanners, we're out. No, come on. How many, how many people in our discord are DCS conference? Yeah, yeah, of course. Lower . How long does it really take to catch up on how sport works and be as not you can get to ninety percent in one season . And then you take an interest in the history and the context. And then by the time you've been watching six or seven years, you've got most of their relevant history and context because you've got seven years of recent history. It's also far easier to learn about previous races now because you just go on YouTube and type in F one Mad moments or something like that and it's just all it's not like used to work in twenty ten when I started watching Formula One properly they BBC had an ar chive of like the fifty minute highlight shows of all the races they did and even like fifteen minute highlights of five live coverage from the ICV era as well . So you could go over and just watch all these like classic races with five live coverage and like that's how I learn about the two thousands. You're not relying on Jimmy from the Pal u. Story from my childhood in the nineties and we were in a pub back then, yeah, you know, you'd let kids in the pub. I was there with a pint and a cigarette and you know, we were talking about how you know cultures could never match Ipswich Town. Colts could never match Ipswich Town and then there's like there's a creak in the corner I remember nineteen seventy two and an old person is speaking and he nineteen seventy two , round three of the FA Cup. Two won it were, the winds blew in from the east. You know, that's how you found out that oh yeah Colstader did have this little couple under there yeah and we beat it switch down yeah whereas now that archive is all available . Like if you want to gatekeep, unlucky, it's very difficult to do so. Christopher , people should follow you everywhere at Chris On Racing for now everywhere. Instagram, TikTok, what's your biggest what's your biggest follower base Instead Instagram. How many is how many? How many on there? Oh, I don't know. Come on. Some show me yours. You know, I know you know and you know I know you know I don't know. sixteen hundred. Okay, that's great. Hey, that's god to that. Follow Chris on Instagram, add to that. I'm just saying I've got more than you. I've got like four thousand. I've never disputed that. You use social media a heck of a lot more than Is. establ ishing that I am still I'm still a bigger deal than you, right? So we're not at the point where your marine. We're not at the point where you're a threat, for example, twenty one thousand on X. So what you're saying of these days for one of these days you shall be in your castle and I shall fight the mighty guards and enter the throne room pierce your heart with my blade, take the crown from your head. I think you're I'm like kiss your forehead my very small crown and with my with my dying breath, I reach out and I'm proud. I'm proud to have been skewered by you, sir, and you kiss me gently in the fore head as I frayed the peace of the darkness You dismit like obi Wan Kenobi. It's just like your robes that just flush up to the ground. We should never be allowed to record without adult supervision and without the live stream to make us stop doing this . And not in searing heat that makes us delirious. Let us never speak of this again. Until next time, work hard, be kind and have fun this was Miss Apex podcast. Of course we have to follow it up because we've got some really good what ifs there. In fact, we'll just do it immediately. We'll just do it in the week when we're bored. Join us for the next Austrian Grand Prix preview, which will be coming up in the week. Goodbye