Advocating for Women in Historical Narratives

Hello,. I'm Aissa Adworney, and you're listening to NnPR's Book of the Day. As we continue to celebrate the two hundred fiftieth birthday of the US, this week, all week on the NPR books pod, we are revisiting some author interviews on important topics that speak to US history. Today we have CBS News senior correspondent, Nora O'Donnell She's talking about her book, We the Women, the hidden heroes who shhaped America Mary Louise Kelly from All Things Considered Nearly two hundred and fifty years ago, july fourth, seventeen seventy six, dozens of delegates got together and signed the Declaration of Independence. signigning was a huge risk. Having your name on that founding document of the United States was treason. Even if you're just the guy who printed the document Actually, the guy who printed the document wasn't a guy. She was a woman, Mary Catherine Goddard. At the very bottom of one of the official versions of the Delaration just under John Hancock and all the other male signes is Goddard's name. She is one of the women profiled in a new book by CBS News senior correspondent, Nora O'Donnell. The book is We, the women, the hidden heroes who shaped America. Nor' dropped by the studio to tell us about it. Hi there. welcome. Thank you for having me, Mary Louise. Start there. We're talking the eighteenth century. We're talking a moment when a lot of women could not read, could not write. How did Godard land the gig of printing the Declaration of Independence? It's an incredible story and one I can't believe we aren't all taught. in school. Dclaration of Independence, the founding document. And we know a lot of the guy's names on it. I've Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson. You know that phrase, Put your John Hancock here, right And it turns out that the first official printing of the Declaration of Independence was done by a woman. Mary Catherine Godddard Why? Because she owned the publishing and printing shop in Baltimore where the Continental Congress had moved from Philadelphia when the British troops were moving in on Philadelphia. And they say, well, we need a copy that has all of the fifty six male signatories on it. We need it done in two weeks. We need it printed out perfectly. She gets it done. She gets it done. But what's I think really interesting about this story is that she was also a publisher of a paper there, where she had her name as M.K. Goddard On the Declaration of Independence, she puts her name as Mary Catherine, Goddard. She wanted to be remembered. She wanted to be part of this founding document. And as you point out, it was dangerous and treasonous to put your name on that document And I think the larger story is Why don't we celebrate and know the stories of these incredibly important women in American history. So I want to ask about another name. another story. This is again back Revolutionary War Deborah Sampson, who, to sum up in a nutshell, Deborah Sampson disguises herself as a man, joins the army, goes off to fight the Brits, gets shot at least twice during the Revolutionary War What's her story? Think about this, women had no rights at this time Deborah Sampson disguises herself as a man to fight in the Cental Army Turns out she's probably the first woman in America to take a bullet country And I think the point is is that women have long been revolutionaries Women have long been patriots fighting for their country and never gotten the recognition or the pension that they deserve. She actually died with a musket ball lodged inside her. She after serving, she then went on the speaking circuit in order to get her pension and you was even supported by Paul Revere in that effort. But just think about them. there should be a movie about Deborah Sampson But I think as I tell in the book, there are so many other examples of women who served who didn't get the recognition that they deserve. Okay, go back. I'm just obsessed with Deborah Sampson. do we know is there anything in the archives and the historical record why she thought this was a good idea or how she got away with it for as long as she did. Well, as I write in the book, Deborah Sampson had a difficult upbringing And so I think she probably was one both looking for a job because it paid well to serve, and also because she was a patriot. She was also a tall woman. She was five, seven and as described at the time, she had quote unquote masculine features. So it was easy for her to disguise herself as a soldier. And she was pretty good at it, you know? And she almost died because she didn't want to be discovered She wanted to have that job And I think that's what's so relatable too. How many women want to do a job that may only be reserved traditionally for men O how many women would take a bullet for a country in which they do not have the right to vote. Yes, And it turns out that many women throughout history did exactly just that. I'm thinking Deborah Sampson might have something to say to the current leadership of the Pentagon about their views on women in combat. But moving on In the book, you cite a statistic that I found sobering. This is according to the National Women's History Museum which found that women are featured in less than fifteen percent of all history taught in the United States The stories of women of color are even less well represented. Tell me about Mary McLeod Bsoon Mary McLlouod Bethoun. I just got the chills even saying her name. She's one of my heroes Mary MacLeod Bethoun was born to enslaved parents. She was actually born right after the emmancipation proclamation Okay And as a little girl, she went up to play with a white girl that lived on the property and picked up a book and the little white girl said to her, You can't read, put that down. And Mary McLeod Betoun said it just stuck with her. And then here she became one of the great educators of her era founded the Bethoun Cookman College, which still exists today. It was the first institution of higher education for Black students in Florida. In Florida.. And she becomes one of Eleanor Roosevelt's best friends She becomes the leader of FDR's black cabinet Mary McLeouod Bffoon. is the reason that women and black women could serve in the U. S Armed Forces. And she did radio addresses at the time so you can hear her great big, booming voice. She sounds like a female version of FDR. Democracy is for me. For twelve million Back Americans of gold Our nation is marching It is a dream You have two daughters, am I right? I do. What kind of conversations do you have with them about what is possible for women Tod about gender equity or lack thereof, because it's still real in this country as you know. You know, women crashed through the educational glass ceiling more than thirty years ago Now also they're the majority of medical school graduates, law school graduates. So Education is no longer the issue It's gaining power And when I look at my daughters, one of the many things that gives me great hope is they don't have the same self limiting doubts that I think my generation has. What do you mean? I think that as a young girl, so many people still And I'm fifty two told us that there were certain careers open to us or certain behaviors that were appropriate for us. certainly not my parents But I mean the culture and companies and others and the institutions where we went to school those Doubts, whether self limiting or imposed by others, don't exist to the degree they did in my generation. And so I'm hopeful They just charge ahead. Younger women charge ahead. I work with a lot of young women. They run circles around everyone. And so that gives me great hope that the equality that's talked about in the Declaration of Independence. that that younger generation will push through on that front, not only for women's rights but minority rights and more to live up to the promises that the founding fathers and mothers put in that document P to the founding Fathers and mothers, Nora, thank you Thank you very much. Nora O'Donnell, senior correspondent at CBS News and author of the new book We, the women