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Our head of accounting here at Fanatics Casino has filed another complaint about how rewarding we are. I tenth complained this month. And I quote, I feel it's my duty to bring to your attention the amount of winning that's going on with our fan cash spnds game. I implore you to pull back on the rewards. Bran fromcounting. Appreciate her tenacity. We should reward her mayaybe with a nice fruit basket or something. At Fatics Casino. The house always rewards gambling problem call one hundred gamling. No purose necessary.oid proibit. It must be twenty one plus not avable all states terms applies, Fan Casin O Pilot TV this week, we are back running operatives with Michael Fastbender in season two of the Agency on Paramount Pus and getting all up in yet another missing personersons case with Colin Farrell in season two of Sugar. And that is it. Why? Because of a little thing called The World Cup, which has devoured all shows around it like a giant, hungry football playing dragon I'm James Dyer and welcome to Pilot TV, you're centr guy to every show that matters in a podcast that is delighted to welcome back to the fold, notorious partimer Kay Ribero. Hello K.elcome. Thank you boy. applause, Thank Now I'm reading here in my notes that you took an extended break to catch up on all three seasons of foundation. How was that for you? Did you enjoy that? Was that good? Still a big bast should I say? Yes. Nothing has changed around here. No, I didn't. yes. I was tending to a sick loved one, but I'm back now and do you know what? during my time off, I thought I wouldd have more occasion to watch TV. Obviously not foundation, but I didn't. And in the last week I knew I was coming back on James. I she mixes somewere earlily boy J James. I have sorted up a little bit so I had some things to talk about. Okay good. Yeah good., Bdy. That's what professalism looks like. That's good, doesnn't it? By's also here, Hello Boydy. Thanks. Can I just say you actually not you're wrong about the impact of the World Cup on TV in general. That's not the reason this particular week There isn't much to cover. It's because of embargos. there ares actually quite a load of big shows which we'll get to when we talk about the also on section. Oh, will we? Oh thees. But the World Cup isn't affecting not yet, it will do. When Wimbledon starts, which is in very good God in about two weeks time, less than two weeks time, that's when you're going to see the effect because literally BBC is which's just Wwool Sports It's justool Wimbledon and World Cup But there are be James. But there is some counter programming before then of big new shows. I was surprised myself just how many big new shows are coming back during the World Cup because namesome The bear Correct. Thank you. just That backfired Silos back was sci fi counter programming, which is nice. Howouse of the Dragon which you review? Well, yeah, ironically, both of the shows we're doing this week before House of the Dragon, which we reviewed on last week's show.ly. I mean Yeah, everything's upside down. Yeah. so you know, there is stuff there is stuff happening. it's just it there are some things that are affed by the World Cup It's not everything. You can't blame the whole Boy, Ioo to blame the world C for all of the world's ills at the moment. any of it? Of course not. I'm trying to be as blissfully oblivious as possible. Okay. Yeah. I have been watching committed to watching one match a day and I'm enjoying it very much. Let's me move on to what we've been watching that isn't crucially isn't for b. K, what have you been watching for the last six months? Shut up Rrivals, James, series two We should say you aren you and Boyy are being let off the leash. You're going to be given free reign to chat all things rival season two in the next pilot pllus when you are going to Do you not watch any of it then? series two. Okay fine. Well, it's chef's kiss, no notes, but yeah we're going to discuss it and thrash out all the details, including my favourite episode, episode six But yeah, I've been very asconsing that. Also two weeks in August The stress watch that was two weeks in August. I know you was stressful, wasn't it? Oh my god, Mega stress But I enjoyed it a lot and I just feel like it would have resonated with a lot of people you know experiencing maybe a middle aged malaise and you just like thinking, ye, what we doing with our lives? Whether you're single or imagined. I mean, who among us hasn't microdosed mushrooms an opulent is it Portuguese villa? where is it? Yeah Portugal? Cretan villa cause all the Greek myths remember. That's right. Well, we can maybe we'll look to do that Christmas box Microdace mushrooms on the show. Okay party Yeah That could be like a I mean you You're getting Stetsons and everything in for your spepecial We are called what do you call? we'll get ont to that We will get onto that. So why not get you and Stehan dress up? There may be cowboy attires in the works Yeah, anyway two weeks in August, I really enjoyed that. I thought Jessica Ray in particular was fantastic in it Um, and then O campus Have either review heard of this? Have you discussed it? You reviewed it on the show?? Well, you reviewed it on the show, and no one else watched it recall Steh and I were not given screenings.. So you reviewed it so like. Steph then did catch up with him and she's obsessed with it. Yeah. James, you'll like it because it's rarench she. Is an American Romantic drama. This isnt full disclosure. full disclosure before you This is on my what I've been watching list as well. so. I too have succumbed to the allure. I knew you were off campus, although I'm crucially not watching it on the train for obvious reasonons say Is it an Nor SFW. But yes, it's great. Well, I'm on episode five, so don't do anything. Yeah, yeah. And yeah, I've enjoyed it. and I also think You know, what's important to mention is that it's got emotional depth Right Unexpected. Among other things, Yes. Among other things. Yes. otherther things have a depath to.. The end that is what I want. So But the off campus thing is actually quite funny because I came to it quite late because we didn' didn't I didn't get see it when we reviewed it on the show And there was l talk a friend of mine had dulled in say it was just boobs, bums and willillies all over the place. like it's basically born h and I was like, is see it? So I immediately added it to the social list. But what I found quite fascinating about it, which I guess I didn't know going in because obviously I wasn't listening when Boody reviewed it, is that so this is based on the books by Al Kennedy The showrunner, Louisa Levy is obviously a woman. All of the directors are a woman and this is a very committed female ge show, which I mean we were talking about every year after and I gave it a stirring defence of the female gazays. But having now watched this, weirdly boyy, I've come around and say like this is this does a similar thing, but much much betterter. It's much more committed. It's much more commed. the writings sharp and it's funny and the characters have real depth to them. But again, all the male characters, even like the big like ice hockey playing jos, they're all incredibly emotionally literate and sensive. And again, and there's a real sort of interiority to the characters and it has this very You know, which is why I think the audience has been largely women, and theyve absolutely loved it. It's been a massive hit. And as we said, equal ops in terms of flesh exposure. Yes, that's right. That It has in common with rivals, I have to say. So you know, a lot has been done on that And that arena, and I appreciate it. They even have a discussion about what it is to be boy hot versus girl hot as a woman. Oh my god, yeah. Which I thought was and great observation. And they talk about the male gaze and how she's, you know catering to it, whichich I thought was really interesting. I of lit up. No, I really like it because because like the actual setup for this show feels super basic girl pretend dates Jock to make music guy jealous. Like it's so basic, but the execution is kind of where where Scceed. so yeah. The serenadeing moment was I loveunching. What I love is that this was actually Kay's pick. Oh I don't And you've totally manplained Yeah in classic style.es. I like I feel this moment has been a welcome return to. Yeah. it's like' not been away.' been away. What else is there to know, really Well let me explain these humail gaze to you in greater detail. Oh I back to the doctor who thing you didn't like it. A. I thought about that the other day. But to be fair to me, Kay had drawn a line and stopped talking about it. she said and that was it. So she had finished. Can I just say in his defense, I absolutely had drawn breath You ye Yeah, that's acknowledged preath draw. Okay K pause to breathe. was that was my I add to the man explaining by pointing this I was going wait for news for this, bom What is interesting is What with heated rivalry and this? There's another Netflix's commission, this show called Icebreaker, which is another sexy drama sitt in the world of iceight. It it ps Pud's abound. Yeah based punk based ice hockey based Rom dramas and comedies are spectacularly in. to the extent to which it's almost bizarre, you know that all of this genre has been created, which focuses solely on I here for it. Ice hockey. Yeah. It's a wild sub genre to sort of define twenty twenty six, but here we are So I just thought I' throw that KK to the g Gm exing. You'll be happy to know I've actually now rounded up up my list. So there's no hardcore pucking elsewhere. That was it. No, that's it. You can now, what have you been watching? No, it's Boyide. Oh, okay. Booyid N next Well, I have been watching a lot of the World Cups, so it has taken a lot of my time. The reason you're so angry, by the way. Yes. is one of the many reasons one of the many reasons in a state of anger is because it's affected my ability to take part in, say, you know, a spoil the special discussions of I don't know Paradise on Disney pllus, which was trying to s out for weeks And I have to admit that it has intervened somewhat in my general viewing habits because there are like three, sometimes four matches every day. And you can wake up this morning I woke up to one that was in the middle of the game at seven AM And then and finished about seven hundred and thirty, then we'll go home later and watch the game kicks off at five and then there's one at nine. So it is taking up a lot of my viewing time and I apologize for that. and that is why I think you're being angry. You know it's the level of unprofessional Yeah really strgg with. And now I could launch a full scale, which I'm really tempted to do analysis of the ITV versus BBC coverage of the World Cup, but I thought that would be indulgent. so I'll leave that tool I would like to talk to you about it off po. could talk about Yeah yeah talk about it Whes which one's best? ITVs tonight which is ye, which could be surprising, maybe. Where's the lineup on that Ian Wrightt, Roy Keen, Gary Neville, who by the way, you know, you know our worstw colleagues, Stephan Stel is obsessed with Gary Neill. Did you know about that No, I did not talk about it on the podcast. Yeahes. she fancces in o No Yes she does. Yes. Now listen, I don't is this I'm gonna talk about attention. It's absolutely's. It feels like her love is pure. Now along those lines bard, you have a little sound clip that you wantan to play. don't you. Which is like imagine this is a sneak peek at what goes on behind the curtain on Pilot pllus We're going present it without explanation or context. You ready bady? Yeahep, hereere we go. Do it Dke Van Dyke, Oh, yes, please. Thereere we go. There we go Sak into the mind of Cessalan.. So Gary Neville and D Van D on a list. who let me remind you is one hundred years old. Yeah, I know. Well listen, she's like, she's open to all offers. Axon and Steve, eat your heart out. You know, let me just in terms of name dropping, I do want to say this, which is that Mark Pugach who hosts the ITV coverage, Poogs is his known, Poogs. He accidentally facimed me. What?n Sunday night After the match that was on ITV at three in the morning. No I' keep not kidding it. I didn't know it was accidental Be I was like you didn't mean on WhatsApp. And He wass like, No, no, no, no. So yeah, because we' messaging each other, he messages me, I can message the presenter of live World Cup games on WhatsApp in the middle of the program. m crazy. Isn't that Bri Because basically he's been on A arsenal podcast quite few times. He comes of his name drops you know that is actually quite. I love it so much. literally you'll be shing away about Royy and Ianright on WhatsApp Wh he's hosting the show So there we go. Thats Oh, then you win. And that's the end of the podcast. As for why I've been watching non related to the World Cup Widows Bay. Now I don't know if you oay, but Steph Sealer for some reason took against this show rightight from the start. Yeah, Boyd and I were m We were fans events. And she just thought it was shit. And we massive reverse Ferret and this No actually, regul listers will know that she loved the show, this show from the beginning. Did you two hate it? This is the Matthew We did. Fine. Hey, hey. No, no. I am not letting you on the hook. now this is the finger of accation you have done a reverse ferret. But me first podcast and don't make me pull out a soundclip just just to prove this point. You agreed with me wholeheartedly and you thought it was dreadful. Listen, all I'm saying is I have done a reverse ferret and I admit I was wrong in my review of the first couple of episodes, but you were more harsh about it than I was. You have acknowledge Well,'re just a ferret The level of criticism of that show much you haven't gone back. I haven't So at least acknowledge the fact that I was wrong and I've gone back to complete change my. Anyway, it finished it finished this week and it didn't know we were going to do spot of special part. the spot special. but bloody so Sophie Bloody Sophie Siean Glood go, unbelievable.. Bloody Steph's too busy. Do doing like putting magazines together and shit. Dy woman, she runs two magazines. Sheking about unprofessional. Yeah. She was the one who championed it. and now I'm not going yeah, we should do a spoil special just after it finishes. I literally now today. Do you know what? Maybe you and James should do a spoin special watched it. No, but maybe he need to catch up. W you two hated it. I have conceded that I may have been mistaken, so I am gonna givethough I will tell you this There's one episode, I think it's four, maybe five that you all find excruciating because it is really tough in terms of like whyy did you warn him? So you know, these things could have been enjoyable for us. I know, I know, I know, but it is like the horror in that episode is like of somewhat of a character being just painfully ostracized and you know, it's awkward and pain every scene in it is guardful. ye. But I think it the awkwardness of the first episode, which I found excruciatingly unfunny was fairly strong. So this is more less trying to be funny, it's just quite painful I will say. So is the bottom line that you think it's good now. I think it's absolutely brilliant. And it also gets better and better and better By the time the by the time you get to the ending, it's It's as horrific, impressively scary and horrific, notot scary as the way, but it is because it mixes hot. horror comedy, that's, you know, really difficult things to do but you really it's really haunting the horror element of it And the comedy element of it the judge so perfectly went to deploy, you know kind of not jokes, but funny moments or moments that are so darkly funny, you're kind of like guiltily Does it relieve the tension? Lughing element. What it doesn't know it maintains the tension somehow and yet it also manages to be funny at the same time. That is the incredible joke really I think that he pulls off. and it does use the time oned phrase, stick the landing foright So we will do. Steph and I will do, I'm sure spoil the special discussion at some point in the near future. So that was brilliant. And I just wanted to I forgot to mention last week I think someone else mentioned it. The four seasons, it's also a news story because they've just commissed third season of the four seasons. they'll have to commit to do season seasason of the fourth seasons This Tina Fayes writing on this of how she portrays like a married couple, for example. And's's different couples. the whole premise is different duos getet together as friends and go on holiday together ason I was going to say to you, I've watched it and then I realized you're talking to the listeners.ain Wh why you boyid explaining four seasons to me? I know what it's a you carried on watch it. you watched season two? Yeahes, I watched well I've watched the first two episodes and I have to say I wasn't as into it, I think because I miss Steve's character. Yeah well But I'll go back to it. Yeah. I just think it's brilliantly well written and yeah, so that's been I finished the four seasons, the second season and the third season coming soon. Not soon, but it's been commissioned by Netflix and it's a fantastic show There you go, James Well, as you know, I have watched the entireth season of Yellowstone in the past. goes without saying? But I'm going to get into that here because as Kay has alluded to, we are going to do a Yellowstone special. special by the sound of it. Which we're actually gonna film in the studio and yes, there's going to be an attempt. I'm not sure how successful we're going to be, but I certainly said tooy should try and dress up as cow Boy it's not even I'ly lear Yeah to remove myself from the hole His stetsons and his hat that's just for the weekend. That's not for ex sessions. Yeah ye. That's true. It I mean, look, best case will'll look like Rittenbeth, worst case we willll look like the village people. It's very unclear how this is going to go, but we we're gonna try if someone could donate a that would be helpful. I don't have one. Please get Marco to do a shoot so that people find have it as a poster. I may put the video out. G genuinely may put the video out So we're going to do like a Yellowstone special because some people didn't like it in Pilot Plus, but then other people were obsessed with it. So we've decided go big or go home. so we're just gonna to do a Yellowstone special episode. St's been updating me and telling me she's in a viewing competition with you. Yeah, I wasly. I told her, even if she gets RSI, she just needs to glue those eyes I was like. Have you ever watched Yellowstone, o Nay I haven' I'm I'm going to tell you what was said on the on the me and Steh WhatsApp chat when we were talking about Yellowsen. So I sent her a message as soon as I finished it, I seent her a message just saying D And this was at nine twenty seven last Sunday. She responded, She fuck you. I'm on episode seven season five. Oh, and fuck you. And if you start watching Dut and Runch, I will take you to the train station. I'm so angry right now. She would be furious because she was so desperate to beat you. Yeah. But anyway, so yeah, so keep them peeled for the Yllowston special which will be dropping soon. Obviously I watch off campus as well. And the last thing I watched this week Boyed I finished. Oh my Godd, I think it meant boyd, like, you had a camer.es. I was watching Boy was by the way, there was a character called Boyd in the S Spillbook film, Disclosure D. Did you notice that? There is a boyd. And I went to the screening that I saw it at them. There's a moment early on in it where I think it's Camen Domingo's character says, Boyd, you should do this and I jump. And the person next to you It's you. I was like, yeah That's why. Anyway, carry on. I Finished Tip too Oh Which I know you didn't think I was gonna do. I didn't because amazed Be I kind of I strapped in, I girded my loins and even though it was it was traumatic. Yeah. And just when I thought I'd kind of wridden over most I mean kind of I knew where it was going anyway because obviously you do from the first episode, that final episode is one of the most upsetting things I've ever ever seen on television. and I needed to have a proper sit down at the end of it. Oh It's on my listp, but I don't know if I can face it right now. It's a lot. Yeah. It is lot. I mean it's extraordinary. but I mean it is so I mean, props to David Morrisy because he is incredible terrifying and that baying group of Anyway fans. Well football fans, yes, indeed, but it's just it's so disturbing and upsetting and brutal and unflinching in what it does. because I you know, in my head, I didn't think it was going to be that ull on I don't know why I was unprepared for the graphic nature of you know, like he doesn't hold back. No, he doesn't, but I think he's making a very sort of important point. and I guess he's absolutely right. you don't make it subtly. You make it by making a lot of noise. And that's literally what he did and I was kind of I disappeared down a rabbit hole of kind of reading stuff afterwards. and Obviously we know that LGBTQ hate crimes are on the rise but I was woing that there's a thing called the Rainbow Map which ranks European countries on their legal and policy protections for LGBTQ plus people. And the UK is twenty second. Out of forty nine nations, and eleven years ago, it was ranked first Really? So that's quite first no. I do not know. Okay. I did a certain amount of research clearlyough No, but that's the most That is wild. Yeah. And so in terms of sort of backsliding in terms of social progress, I think that's quite extraordinary. but also like I felt like you know, this was very much about queer issues, but it felt like a very much a sort of a a microcosm for just social division as a. definitely the polarity of the dialogue and the toxicity of the dialogue at the moment. And yeah, it really, I mean, not me for ses, it really did. It's an extraordinary thing. It is I hate to say it, it is essential viewing But it but it's a lot Yeah. Yeah, I think it's the it's definitely the He is always unflinchy, eta. This is the most powerful and kind of just shocking things ever in. without it Yeah it's on a different level, yeah, from Beuse it's becausecause it's a thrill you know, in terms of the way the way it plays out Yeah and it's very tense and that the tension and the the chill chilling effect of that finale is is definitely way beyond anything he's done before, I think in terms of powerower and importance Side note, youve probablyready have you discussed your big news already? to leave that to news to the news. Okay, we' got to talk about it now, boy. Well we' talkking about justust go. Yeah. We are We areaking the secret for so long. We have. We are now in the presence of the notorious RTD's official biographer. Yes, we are. I'm not sure if that is the framing that has been And now it's for the book but co author, I think it's Yeah co. You wrote book together. We wrote book together. Yes, we have written a book together. Yes. The queerest of folk, it's called My lifeife in teelevision Not your life, life, his life.. surely. We. Yeah. Yeah it was announced the other day and on and it's incrediblyciting, Yes, obvious. It's really exciting. Yeah. O Thursday the eighth October if you want to do a pre order c Listen. I mean, I obviously you' going gonna give me a copy but you obviously as's last time. I know, I'm getting a f copies signed, et cetera, etera. but I will also preordder one. Yeah It's all about the pre audisers, everyone. Is everyone listening to? That's so exciting. So what span of time are we covering? We're covering the whole period of his professional career from nineteen ninety well, even before, when he started out working at Grrenada on soap operas and he created his own science fiction shows and it goes all' Queerous Folk, which is where we first met. I went to the launch of Qeras Folk in nineteen ninety nine, twenty seven years ago. Big champion big champion and Right up to Tipto. and then he talks about tipto and there's qu there's qu, you know, the closing chapter quite a lot about that. And yeah, it's been it's been a fantastic U experience for me to work on it. Boy, just one question. Yes That was sounds great Yeah Did you cover off the most important event in his career? Doctor who? No you're a big fan? Pilot two hundred live. That's right. the live podcast. I hope it's got mention in there b a butterfly chapter. There isn't a whole butterfly chapter. I'm trying to remember there might be butterfly reference. I think there might be. Any mention of the live Come on, it was a great moment for all of us. I mean, I thought it was a career at high point for us. Yeah. I feel Oh yeah he's safe and saying that. Yeah ye ye. I think you thought I think he ever since we did do that dissection of the butterfly show But I feel a bit worried that that might, you know sometim somehow at some event he might meet someone involved. come back and haunt him. So maybe it isn't in the book Yeah in which case, what I would just suggest when you doing book signings on wardstones or whatever, if you could just bring a byyer own and just handwrite it write it in. Yeah that'd be great. Yeahes sure Yeah, absolutely. ye. Anyway the official Russell says lots of fun, some gossip, stories of shows never made and insights into the day to day life of writing for television. The shows, the people, the job itself from CBC to golden days at Grennard in the nineties. How quQer E effoect changes his life, doctor Who twice and all the way up to Tiptoe And do you know what my quite was for the press release It's well good. It's yeah,t pretty much saidone this is as reported in the Radio Times. It says Heat journist Boy Hilton described the process as one of the joys of my life. Wow. Yeah. Second to this. And I declared Russell T Dav seconde to this podcast. And I declared Russey Dis to be a literal and figurative giant of TV drama Brai Boyider. Yeah. G great cross. I think we did that because he's very tall. He's huge. Yeah huge. absolutely massive. Yeah. So yes Exciting. Congratulations. Thank you. to you both. Yes, Thankk you. Well, does. Well done. Yeah. And now we can finally talk about it, which is a relief. Yes, yes, because it has done It's been top secret for a very long time. Don't imply that I've told you something this. you told us in the last week before you announced. Y Yes. meudge nudge, sayay no more. me hours before it was. In fact, I was furious. I said him in a furious text because he it does tr. A week before the announcement was coming out, when he told me originally And then and then I saw it on Instagram, the picture of it, like this manuscript. I didn't know about that picture and so I txted it and I was like, right, we didn't discover Its just the holding cover by the way, obviously. I know it's like, it' literally the proof of it, but yeah, I was just f curious that he hadn't He hadn't chosen to call me to discuss it anyway. Yeah. I know that you now know better, boy Yeah. abolutely. Apologia. Yeah. That is the big news of the week, obviously. That is There's no other news. No that's not another other news. Other than rival seeason three has been Gay L. We just move on to news now, is that the begin of news. No We have a listen to questions to you How long you've been away, K? how longpolog? the things you've forgotten? It wass ambiguous to be f. I thought there was just a bit synergy there because we talked a bit of the news, but no. No T. Tbak. we're going right back to the list of the questions. them. Otherwise, Jay and Newcastle will be very upset with you. Okay. OkayK. goo ahead. This is what Jay has to say. I was recently told to watch the rebooted Play for Tay by a friend, specifically the last episode set in a school, spepecial Measures. My friend said, it's not really you, but I think you'll love it anyway And they were absolutely right. It was amazing and way more tenensese and enjoyable than I thought it would be. Now I'm telling other people to do the same with the same little caveat. It might not be for you. It's on channel five But you'll love it. So Qestion from Jay is what has been your best not normally for you show that you've been recommended and ended up loving? Happy Valley was another one of these types for me too, thatough I thought I'd hateated, but it's now one of my favorites ever. From Jay in Newcastle, anticipating James now doing a bad Geordy accent. I'm gonna to spare you that, Jay out of you know, sensitivity gosh this is new. Soee I've evolved've been away. Yeah. Right Hi I'm going to p be you on the spot? No, you can do. Actually, it's RTD related. Is it? Yeah. I know what this is going to be. The war between the land and the sea, A the sea people. Um, it I you know ordinarily probably wouldn't have watched that just because I don't have any kind of connections to Dr. Who and that backstory, you know, that kind of connection to it. and Yeah, sci fi And then because of the pod, I watched it and I really enjoyed it. So that would be my m show that in recent times that I've come to That's a good chapter Be it'ser as a folk, my life in. you're going to be a nightmare,n' the next few months? Yeah, but no genuinely that is my answer because you guys recommended it, well, on the pod and I continued. That is Kay's one answer. We will Listen, just because I can, want it done trition Always one and done. Always never likes to break the one and done format. Yeah. And then you will come come up with twenty. Yeah and I'll have Despite telling us about, you know, being tighter in terms of time I believe in being comprehensive. Yes, hekes to wax lyrical. Yeah. Gone. See, Bodny, this must be a yky question for you. It is because everything is your Exactly Exactly. That is the point to be made is that I am open to all genres of television and I'm not small minded or. It must be It must be I' come up with Animation. mean you know what? Animation is a good point. I didn't think of that. I should have thought of that. Mind is still sealed to that, is it? Oh yeah, completely. Well, no, you know there is some animation that I do like and admire. I mean, The Simpsons is a brilliant show animatationviously you may have heard It's because I thirty. What a nich reference. It It's very obscure I was reminded of it recently how brilliant it can be because of Cape Fear because the Cape Far says that you talked to Javier Bartem. I did is. Absolute masterpiece. Anyway, no, but I forgot about my issues with animation, but that would have been a good suggestion but I've thought of a couple of shows that I wouldn't have necessarily bothered watching or getting that excited about until they then arrived and I watched them properly. So Bridgerton, I remember when Bridgerton started. so if there's a genre I'm not entirely thrilled by in general, it's historical period drama like that. Don't you love Downton Abbey? Yeah, but we're both in the same boat on that one. The Dow Abbey Downt Downton Downtown Abbey is Downton Abbey is an example of a show that W wasn't that excited about either. But then you start watching it o, it's incredibly addictive and fantastically Um Exciting show. So but but yeah, I wouldn't it wouldn't be the kind of thing I'd normally gravitate towards. And similarly with Bridggeton even more really, because Bridggeton, I don't know, like T I just thought it wasn't gonna be for me basically. You know, basased on a series of romance novels, you know, probably Basically for reasons of sexism, I probably thought, you know, this is like we always say womomen, ye, I am a rampant sexist. I'm known for it. Thank you. If not, I' misognous. But I must admit I would have thought it's adbed from a Sies of romantic novels. know, am I really bothered by that? But An anyone not watching the video scrunching up his face if he says? But no, no, no I watched and I acknowledgeed that really was a really good, particularly to start with, the first couple of seasons were really good. And the other one I thought of is I remember when this show When it was about to arrive the show, right? And I remember the publlicers, a couple of publishers emailing me, BBC publishers. this is your clue. C you guess what the show is saying, I know there's loads of shows in this genre But this is really exceptional and this is really something special. You just have to watch it and then you will admit Or you will agree with us, even though we're BBC TV publicers that this is a special special thing. Notherland. No it can you give us the genre If if Ill give you the genrey you'll get it.ly that way. I think you'll get it I have absolutely no idea. Its too broad, but ye yeah, okay. Is a terrible the genre. Okay. Reality TV. Oh good God Tit Y O of course Tritors. Yeah yeah. I was like, what who gives a shit? you know, like now you definitely give a shit. It, but you like reality TV. No Yeahah, well you say that. I amt open to real the best of reality TV. I don't I'm not' That into reality TV I don't watch Love Island. I've hardly ever watched it in my life. so I don't watch I used to be watch big Bother and watch was't not anymore. I watched I did. B yeah, literally back in nineteen ninety nine, two thousand when the starff hat. I watched it for a few years. Yeahah. but I haven't watched Big Brother for years. So I know because you're such a snar, you regard anyone who even acknowledges Reality TV can be good or worth watching is a really a fan. but in fact, I'm not really. and you have ay you subscription, don't you? I know you don'. I don't know dont know when you are. I know. But the thing about the traituresors I found, I don't know if you agree is that when it first got presented to us. Yeah, it's not an easy one to explain. Eact it comes across your very dull and you think, o Ohh go I can't be onc. It' the watching experience. someome shows you Whatever the premises and whatever the pub the press release says, they're not going to convey the should joy watching that show. And this was and of course I lied that down to Claudia and I was like oh, Claudia presents it, yeah. but I'm not a big strictly fan, for example, you know Yeah. I mean, that's one of your biggest flaws,? Right. But the traitors just they were absolutely right. And I imedately I remember going they going, watchatch two or three episodes and they're like, you're abolutely this is this phenomenal Yeah On paper, not exciting. Yeah on TV. Extraordinary. Fantastic. Yeah. So I think I've answered the question. Can I give it just an addendum to what you were talking about you know the period dramas. If anyone is like Boyd and you know, a bit closed minded to perod dramas. I would That's my. I would highly recommend the other Bennett ster. Oh ye Oh yeah. so good. reviewed on the podcasts and I loved it. Yeah. Yeah. I'm open to it.' an extra recommendation. Boyd voice like closed mind can be prized open. Saking of which. Yeah, speaking of which The animation thing I hadn't thought of, but you're absolly right,rcane would be the answer for the animation because I loved Arcane. and as you know, I never willingly sat down and watch As Exactly. But that is fantastic. Honestly, so many shows I don't even know where to start. Actually, to be fair, Tim, I know I always rag on him for doing like five thousand answers but he should have five thousand answers. I mean genuinely, because there are so many shows that we have done over the years that I in a million years would never have sat down and watched voluntarily You know, the one that I've used before is Dominic Savage's I AM series, which again would you never this kind of veritee style, social realist, largely improvised drama. I would never have watched that. And it's quite singular and it's incredible. So that was a big one that kind of opened my eyes to things. I mean, even more recent ones like Waiting for the oututs from earlier this year, which again, is not something that I would have watch. Dear England, I never in a million years voluntarily. Do you remember was telling you about I was talking on the podcast about how there's a tr a BBC trader that says that quotes the podcast. Yeah. and it says Empire's pilot TV podcast. And it is' Dear England. Is it? Yeah that's the trade E not at the moment, which is on a constant at the moment in the football. Do just say I didn't hate it. James Dy. It says it's really good or whatever. by, Epire's pilot TV podcast. Yeah. That's a strange thing to refer to a fine that's fine. take. recognize that Yeah. I never would have watched a football thing Even like so I was gonna say off campus, but actually off campus is weirdly something I a hundred percent would have wanted. No not even that' know You love a teen drama. I like a romance, I like a teen drama, so yeah, that actually probably. you look likekes not suitable stuff for the Northern l. Oh yeah, yeah like that. Not suitable for the Northern lind, but su.' vallallyy an attemptable traam some kind of perurvver. Yeah, many times last wee I was watching some something we were like, James, stop watching it on the train. watching the porn on the train. never a good idea. Honestly, both tiptoe and adolescents are probably shows I would I wouldn't have watched otherwise. But anything with Alice in it, Alice and Steve, Alice and Jack, all of the Alice shows. Those are ones that I would never watch. they're just shows wouldn't have been on my very sci fi centric radar And yeah, I have watched and hugely enjoyed. So St no shrinking, James? Still no shrinking. That is not one I would have watched and frankly isn't one that I'm watching. Okay, I'm going to get steff to work on you. Yeah, it's been brought up. But yeah, no it's one of the delights of doing this podcast is that it has opened my eyes to different sort of genres and tones of television that I wouldn't otherwise have done it Obviously Kay, on the other hand, remains incredibly closed minded and has not broadened her. You're absolutely right. The war between the land and the sea is an example of that. ridiculous human being that you're calling Jam to ridiculous. say what you see. Boy Walkerone. Okay, good. oldld school?, that's what we refnce for the you Malhn, yeah catch phrase. Yeahah. Okay If you have a question for the podcast or thoughts for Pilot Plus, do send them in the address once more is post Bag at Pilot TV Pod And now, if you like, we can move on to news. got finally. There we go relief. Ridiculous. No, well, I was just saying that rivals sereries three has beenreen let and that's exciting news. consonsidering we still got the second Tanche comoming in November. Yeah in a while, like it's That is tough. I thought it wass because of the World Cup but it can't be. No, that's why I said, Yeaho, Wh why is it U dont think they' now. Yeah, I just think they're doing to spread it out over as wide a period as possible. seems to be it is frustrating. Okay, I've got a question and bearing mind how much I love rivals, I'm worried that it will have lost its momentum by momvent. because it's a long time. Yeah, it's worrying. I think in the end the fan base will I think they probably think that The more the longer something stays on a streaming service like Disney pllus The the more people are going to watch it. So by the time there'll be more, a bigger audience potentially by the time it rolls around in November. but it is I would saying they might just call it a third season. That could be a firstd season. was They got six part. I mean, I would suggest they just want people to keep their subscriptions, donon't they say thats it's a fairly cynical because people do migrate from streaming service to streaming service incentive for them to stick around Oh, that's anoying I think he's right. Yeah. And I think word of mouth as well because that's, you know, we'll be very positive about it. So we're going to discuss, you know the half the midway pointoint finale episode six, which my list today is terrible I must have bard about this been recent times. It's really annoying. Apologies to listeners. Apologies listen have to part with it, I wouldn't. But it yeah, it's I think the word of mouth will be, o, there's an amazing ending to the first tranche of episodes if I can use the word tranche and I have. And then so word of mouth might build to over the next few months or even longer. James can catch up. Yeah, So people like James can catch up. open their minds to the j. That will definitely happen. It's got boobs and bums and all that. So I don't understand why you're not open Okay. I am not such a s creature that I'm so easily swayed by your pornographic program. burst into songs Okay Okay, can't you see Very good. Okay Oh dear ye Yeah, so that was my Anyway, Rrivals is back for Yester.s That's the leap, by the way, that is the least surprising news, isn't it? I mean Yeah, of course. I know, it's still something ago for saying it. Can I ask a question? Yeah, off course not. Can I ask a question? You can ask whatever you than you. Rivals is an adaptation of one book Right? Big Big long book though. One book Yeah. And so what we're saying is not only did the first season not cover off the book, the second season, both parts, will also not cover off this fucking book. No, I think they will about that. I think they would have done. I think they will then have moved on to you know, Was there a sequel? It's part of a ser this sort of Rutshire chrony but do the characters persist through the other book? I think so Okay So it's not like they're not freestyling, just they are actually. Okay And anything would have been with Dame Jilly's, you know ission. Yeah, yeahah Yeah yeah Listen, I'm going mention my second bit of big news. Okay I'm sure you have chatted about it extensively in the last couple of weeks or actually last week where the news broke. Is it something to do with the Great British sewing bay No, it's not. but close, No. It's about the announcement that Edward Blumill will play a cule. Oh yeah. Oh yes. Now what did you say about that? You must have been very excited for you Or maybe you weren't. Maybe this is blasphemy. Right. Okay, so truth be told, I was like, it doesn't need to get remade or you know, we don't need any more hands off cule. Yeah, because David Suchet is is the absolute best version of Hkibi. But actually, when I saw this announcement, if it has to it has to be made, and a younger version of Pori Edward is perfect for him Edward. Yeah. Edward. or have Eddie Yeah Edie Edward. Well, his name is Edward. Well, I Mr. Blomore. Mr Blom Be form more, and respect a little bit more Mrter Bloomore Mrter Blom Mr. Blumell. Yeah, sorry.ave you met him, Have you done any Q and A's with him No, but I think I'm allowed to use his first name. How dare you be so untoward and familiar? I am scandalized. No I moved on. I just thought you might have. I think I have by Car. I think I have. you see? Okay so he's been in this, my lady Jane No, I don't think I have I thought he's in another Agatha Christ. My Lady Jane, but I think I did Rob Ryden for that Rob. Yeah. oway, but yeah, he's he seems a lovely. anyway. Young Acul Yeah. Now you are the one we need to know your Yeah because you are the Pirot Yeah obsessive on the panel because young young like they don't also go that well. There's the young element. and also remember, you hate it and I think that's not too strong It doesn't go straight, It's not strong enough. You hated Ken. And she we both attended right, the world premier of wasas it em Mer on the Express or the first one? Yeah, the first one? Becauseuse he was running in it Yeah anyway yeah. at The Royal Albert Hall. and Great venue. Great venue K was like my plus one and she dated right from the word go as soon as he arrived on screen with his elaborate tw. I got I' set up right in my chair. The knles have been right I'm not going to go through it again. L longt timee listeners is going to be bored of this, right? I don't think Timers is going to remember the moment we talked about No bang on about Porright like about Kennyby, but like Honestly, anyone who has read the books who loves that character knows that certain things are true of Pir, which is that he's a dignified man, he walks very sl in a very particular way. he's very particular about everything about his appearance, about the way he beh. Yeah, he's fidious, right What he does not have is a gigantic ridiculous mustoustache. He doesn't run, particularly on the top of a tril the running He would never be disheveled to have his you know tie or bow tie, you know a sute. It was ridiculous. It was blasmous, It was awful I love Rounting. It's so annoying and he brings it up It's hilarious though. Did you watch any of the subsequent Ken P? I watch I think I watched one more and it just it makes me now too angry. I did watch one more. Okay. So I tried to be open minded, but I just think if you love, if you love it Fny though I watched Death on the Nil Death on the Nil was on regular TV recently. No no I love the Un ofiverse. Yeah. the Ken Brand of Dath on the Nil And it's got so many inappropriate canceled people in it. Oh yeah Well you forget a wasash with. Yeahost the bras in it. Yeah. Army haamers Army hammers in it. And you're like, Ohh my Godd, what were they doing? This casting is extraordinary. Yeah ye. So that was one interesteresting together. It's also a kind of quite aerrible fm It's not the best is it haunting in Venice? Yeah Ven.' the best one. Yeah. That's really good. I did not watch that. No Anyway, so you are pro Blueel in this From just from the announcement and the pitch Iviously haven't seen any of the does his mstache past mustuster I haven't seen in character, its it was just a.. Okay, fine. So But obviously a lots riding on the voluminosity of the mustouache. And what if he breaks into a light job? wouldould that be a deal bre? think he wouldn't be Well, actually, I don't know what a young chor was like, because I think he might be more energetic in his youth. Well he was an officer, yes. Also, possibly even a sprinter Well, let's not go too far. I know I'm going to get in touch with the writers of this young F I think. Can you just put a bit of running Yeah? Just I pasted you, and you're so welcnected it can happen. But listen, I am excited to see it because also we're going to be exploring the early friendships with Hastings And Ted Hastings extraordinary Captain Hastings and with Inspector Jack. so yeah. I'm looking forward to see how it plays out. and I will you're in favor of the project. That's a Po. It wasn't because I wasn't because there's no need for it. But if it has to be done, there's no need for it. I mean, you know any reboot or you know, even this podcast. acccurate. belie. No, if it has to be done. Yes, then I was nervous about who it' be ust looking at the picture of Edward, like I can see it. Yeah. Okay. It's got round eye area. He's got it aroundound eyes, He's got round the eyes. It's a sign off from me. Okay. they've got your sign off. Kay says yes. Yeah. Okay, in fact. Moving on. Other news? Yes Only murders in the building. Now I know that I would say that interest in this show as it enters its sixth season has waned a little bit Both on this podcast and, you know And elsewhere. You could say generally, but actually it's a massive success for Disney plus this show And and I still really enjoy it. I enjoy, you know, it may not be you know the most urgent watch. But can I just say? so the next season is based in London I'm excited about that. But the car, haveave you seen the cars? they've got lightined up for this thing Honestly It is Ariana Grandin? No never made that up. U hold on, Iven't even got to that bit yet. Sorry, Karam. Itn' something we say not something. I remember. Right. This is who they've announced so far. Martin Freeman Jerry Hollywell Horner. That's it Jamie to meet you Derek Jacobee, Jane Horrckx, Jennifer Saunders Matthew Beard, Sheryl Horgan Divine Joy Randolph is obviously all always there and she's back. And then just recently they've added David Tenant, Nicola Cocklan Jie Whittaker, what Jim Broad bent Richard A Ai Katherine Hunter And more It's who' who. It's a who's who? I mean, you have to o Tet go actually. Yeah, that is an exciting cost and they are investigating A murderder in the building Saturn Sy devil they venture across the pond continue the investigation to the death of Cinda Canning, as seen in the season five finale. So yeah, I like it when in American drama's London based. Do remember when you came here? Yes That was a great season of you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, there go. I think yeah, that does add to the excitement notot only the fact they're filming here and there are lots of if you look at their Instagram, there's various people involved, there's some lovely stuff for them being hanging out going to dinner in London and I Which restaurant is that Martin Short with, you know other members of the cast and Meryl Streep having dinner somewhere other. Yeah. But needed an injection of exence. good injection. Let's just say it's good injection now Did you see there is a trailer for the new series of Vigil and it is Vigil in the Arctic Yes. and cold vigil. That's another time of a show that' yeah needs to kind of reimagine itself? Well, I mean, the big the big shift obviously was between seasons or series one and two wasn't it? becausecause you know, it's not set on the fidgil anymore. So ye, needed rethinking. But now all bets are off, you know, whether it be drones, you know, do it in the Arctic, whatever you like, do it underwater. it's fine So you were a fan. Yes, like V vual. Visual's great Saran Jones and Rose Leslie, people have forgotten, but it's very good and she's like she's an investigator, isn't she? Yeah It was first season, she was sent on a submarine. and then there was a whole drone false flag attack thing and the second season of this one takes them to the snow That first episode of season two was was brilliant done was with all the drones and suddenly turning around and attacking their own. It was like Doneal drone attack never good. Droneal drone exactly what was bad. Yeah, b So I mentioned before the ice hockey Romantic Jonathan. The new one. Yes, I'm going mention the actual details now. Get ready and I know J. I'm going to make. I' exc. Netflix has found its own sex on ice series is how Variety puts it. The streamer has ordered a series version of Hanah Grace's novel Icebreaker. Icebreaker is the first of three novels that Grace has published in the Maple Hills series set in the fictional University of California, Maple Hills Iceberger has spent seventy consecutive weeks on the bestll ofist.ich is amazing. Cing, I've never heard of it. Why would I necessarily? I'm twenty twenty two The show is described as she's the transfer gunning for Olympic gold. He's the campus star chasing the NHL National hockey League. But when an accident forces their teams to share one rink, Anastasia Allen and Nate Hawkins collide Anastasia Allen. Yeah Nate Hawkood names. Good extraordinary America. Yeah. for names. I thought you said campus, but you said campus, right? Campus? Maybe the campus as well. I don't know. Yeah. But bearing in mind he said rivalry series two will arrive and that it's it's hockey mat. Off campus is coming back as well, I'm sure. Yeah Exciting It's a good time to be on the ice a holiday on ice if you will. Very good Anyway, Any other views No, I've mentioned my most important news. Okay and obviously we've already talked about Boyd's book W there any other news you I think No. There hasn't been loads to be fair, it's not been. and that's because the World Cup Boyie is a devouring football playing dragon that has consumed all media, TV and entertainment in its path. I mean listen, a lot of people are watching it. okay, You just have to deal with it Thatn't stopped before. H hasn't stped lot of people are watching something. No know By the way, I forgot to ask you, because you didn't cover this in the we've been watching section. How many episodes of Howouse to the Dragonot you watched? fourour The four that we were The four that we were given. Yes. they They've not given me the rest, but I watched the first four. Right. You sounded like you were about to accuse me of No, I was intrigued because I was I wondering whether they'd sent you more or with it? yeah But you know, we diss that becausecause obviously, I'd said that I watched them all last week. so I did not watch them this week, so that would been that would that would' have been a lie, boy. would have been disinger li. Never liying. Never lie. We must be trutaceful. Okay. All right, fine well, if that's the end of news, which will move on to this week's reviews, all two of them. And first up this week, we have season two of the aggency. and this is the espionage saga fromrom the Butterwors. And this is itself an adaptation of the critically adored French political thriller Le Bureau de Lejnd created by Eric Rochamp. I apologize. And this stars, Michael Vaspender as Martian and he's a CI asset who has been recalled to a desk, a desk, I tell you, in London after last season's events Boody Remind me how we got on with season one of this show. For the life of me, I can't remember what we said about it. I recalles, people were quite mixed on it initially and I seem to recall it's because there was kind of it's like it's very serious. And he's I think he comes across as quite neurod divergent, which I think wasn't necessarily clear from the first episode but became apparent As she went on as I recall And I was thinking it was quite talky is very. There's a lot of talk. There's a lot of chatter in in the CIA London office about who the moole is, who the There are a lot of cod undercover lots of code jargon. So it's quite, but my feeling is you just let all that wash over you Yeah and you just kind of enjoy the vibe. I really like actually my favorite thing about The whole show to go straight in is old guys sitting around talking about all of this stuff. because especially when those old guys are played by Jeffrey Wright, Michael Faspend obviously the lead. Catherine Wteron. Richard Gear. Richard Bloody Gear. I was thinving that's last dramatic effect. Thanks forining U and Richard Geere No ye. I mean, so and I absolutely do love Richard Gere. He's in a lot of my favorite films. I listm sure of course. So I love that that's my favorite thing about her that is just these long meetings, meetings they have where they kind of people shout at each other and accuse each other of being of not working hard enough to find the undercover person in their midst or even inventing the fact there's another undercover person in the midst and then him going to Mel Fasnder, going to secret meetings with other MI five people and having even more long discussions with Hugh Bonneville about what the hell's going on. And I love all that It's actually the whole milieur of it that I think works really well. And I believe I remember a friend of mine told me about Lebureu, the original French versus. and the thing that he loved about that show was the authenticity of this is what it is actually like People sitting at desks looking at their computers and trying to work out what's going on ph in a blurry photo, which you get a does your friend work in the bureau? Oh, no, no, no, but it feels's more of the feel of it. There's more excel in this than in for example, spooks. There's spread in galore, exactly. And you get to see, you know, you get to see all the different levels as well of the operatives. to the people who are just like nerdy guys fixing the photopy photogopy etceta. who then suddenly have to present to the big wigs what they've learned and all of that I love all of that. So I really like this show and I think I'm pretty sure I got to the end of season one because I didn't need to remind him what happened at the end. So he was obsessed with this woman played by Jodie Turner Smith, who you see right the beginning of this the first Sene in this is an action thrill of secrets where she's in the boooot of a car. she's been kidned because she's been regarded as like a traitor even though she's justessent of a university professor. So the constant thing driving him is to get her back and to rescue her from her captives. But at the same time, he's given various tasks to allow him to help make that happen. I'm trying not to spoil the detail of it every element of it every element of it seems to be really, really authentic. and I have no idea if it is. It's just it feels that way Yeah. whether it's that scene in the opening, where they're transporting her around and they're, you know, she's going through this terrible experience or whether it's Michael Fasbender, his meticulousness in his home, as you say, like it feels that he's on the spectrum somehow Um I really I really love it. I think it's a great show. It was one of those shows that you can almost forget. I know when you you were saying what did we think two years ago I think since we when we reviewed it. And you can't forget how good a show. This is like this cast This talent of writing And directing, it's just incredible think. this's not even like considered like a major, you know, show in a way. It's almost slightly blown by the way.uality drama. Absolutely yeah. we do agree? Yeah, I do. I recall us reviewing it originally. and I recall what we thought. I thought we probably all enjoyed it But I didn't continue. That's the difference. So I had to do a bit of research and I wouldd say anyone who hasn't watched first series, I mean, obviously go back and watch it, but if you don't have time Just just do a quick Google search and then jump straight in because it is possible. that's the thing. things I mean, there's, I would say there's some catching up, spepecifically the codenames are quite bamboozling if you don't know anyone is. We need code names by the way, We definitely need a codes. We'll have to think of that forot us. Yeah. You are, of course, Ferret And you two have been reveredert actually, I don't know. Maybe you've stolle my crown We've reversed ferted. the Agry Ferret has ceded the crown Yeah Eactly. But I thought it was great this first episode and I didn't find it too discombobulating figuring out you all the cod names in the background, but I had Googled. And I just thought it was super tense and taut Obviously you've got all the stuff with Sammy, the Jodody Turner Smith character, but also the character of Danny I think in Iran and the stuff that happens with her and she's put in a very difficult situation. the holyranus sur torn from that herrific. Yeah, doesn't it? very you know, she's put in a, you know, it's very heiry over there. She's been in a very difficult situation. And as you say, the Richard Geere and Jeffrey Wright, they're cockah hootp because they think they've succeeded in getting an asset into Valhalla, which you know, let's just say it's complicated. Um So yeah, the double crossing, the treachery, I thought was very exciting to watch. There's a scene in this where Fastbender is reacting badly to the fact that Sam something bad might have happened to Sammy, right? And he's driving at speed. All I would say to you is it's so palpitation inducing and also to me, had a reminder that that once, I mean, not to the same level I once had an incident in a spiral car park, notot to the same extent. Was this quite triggering for you? Yeah. Well, it just reminded me that I was very nervous about going up this spiral car park because of hill starts And I was with her friend. And of what she like at the time said to me, Oh my God, what's happening? Because basically where I got nervous, I just ended up going faster. She was like slow down. What's happening should never be allowed in a car. why going faster? I said, Oh go, I don't know. I just might. So you were speeding up the spiral con I did not want to go slow and you know, yeah, if had to stop for any reason. I just my speed was creeping up. Let's just say he takes it to thest. I was going to say now we should say Michaelfast Bnder here, his character has been trained by MI six and therefore is reasonably confident with his heill starts. Yes. So me on the other hand, not so much. But anyway, bottom line is I really enjoyed this and I recommend everyone watches it. Do you know what? it's really compelling to the point I'd almost forgotten quite how compelling it is because it does take itself incredibly seriously, but rather, as you know enjoyed that. has soon. Buts like it's like the anti mission impossible in a way isn't it? Because it's not about spectacle. I mean, in this case, he's literally at a desk mean we just mentioned the carpark. I mean, it's true. There was a high octane action sequence where he drove at a unsafe speed in a public car park. no hill starts required. But it it's you know, I think the writing' really good. I think the plotting is quite dense and convoluted and I suppose what it looks at more than anything else is kind of like the cost of espionage work, L what it costs them to do this job, the human cost, yes. U and that I think is is already interestil is high. It is high. Yeahah and what they give up to do this job and the reasons that they do it But I mean, you love a spyriller, don't you? It' a nutght espionage thriller. And this has lots of twists and turns, not just in the car park Okay. And yeah it's great. Do do you think you could be a spy No I agree. I'd be terrible at it. You absolute. I can't lie. It yeah It requires a level of dissembling that I'm just not capable of On the other hand, do I think would be spectacular isn' it They've been like they're my so Agent Hilton, haveave you or anyone you know, written a book in concert with Russeer. Eavis? No? No, I don't know what to talk about Absolutely. And if I did, I wouldn't tell you Yeah. whichich is how he has been for how for many months. Oh yeah. Interesting to point out, by the way, that you know ten episodes, there's a lot of episodes and they're all seem to be written by the Butterwthst Jazon. Really? John Henry ye Yeah, every single of them. Do you know what? I'm kind of obsessed at the moment with siblings writing together and how that works because you've got Harry and Jack Williams who do assassin as well And obviously it's probably no different to any other writing partnership. But you know, siblings. Oh, I think it is interesting. No, I think it's really yeah. Harry and Jack, if you talk to them as I think we' both hosted C andays with them, they're really funny about it. like how different they are as people and how it's interesting it's an interesting wayay of working out exf broth.s Get in touch. Let's know. Well, I'm sure we can get them on them part Yeah, but it's excellent The agency, which has begun airing now on Paramount plus, has it not Boying? Yes I think all episodes are available now, which that is a good binge. That is a good binge just what I' saying By binge ab It landed on Sunday yesterday, sorry. Next up, we have Sugar and this is the second series of Apple's hard boiled detective drama. Now Oh God, a word of warning. So season one of the show contains one of the most Gonzo twists in the history of television, which drops about what halfway through the series, something like that. If you do not know this twist and you want to watch sugar and you havent you've somehow missed hearing it on social media, you may want to skip this review entirely Still with us Ready Okay, so this is a sci fi cry show, in fact, in which thank you, is this is Steph Calen subcategory. in which Colin Farrell plays a private detective who specializes in missing persons except, Wait for it He's an alien. But of course he is. whichich is not something you find out until halfway through the series and there's nothing that anyone really saw coming. The second season sees an entirely new missing person's case. And so you know who could we turn to but our own very own sci fi cry expert, Steph Sealan, who has parachuted in to this podcast, even though she had the day off to tell us That's suugarism right there. That's right. Would you give suugar season two one lump or two That was nice. Okay, firstly, I didn't have the day off.' I had the day off this. The day off of us. So I'm so excited ' I' to see my beloved Gabby. Right. now, okay Yeah, if you didn't, I think we were talking about it on plus that there are some, you know, when you have like a catch up of a show and like, this is what this is what this show is all about. That's the word recap. well done, well done you. This if you haven't watched season one, if you haven't watched season one and if you or if you have, like me devoured season one, you still need a recap because you are going to forget. So when we left John suugar, okay? He has revealed midway through season one, an alien private investigator in this genre bending series. o. Okay.ready I don't even need to know what I can tell. vibes. Okay shows like this define banana crackers. C. Okay. So when we left on Sugar, okay The aliens that were studying the humans on Earth in an undercoa n Yeahah, you're right, okay, but I'm try and get through this had decided to go back to their planet, okay? He had discovered that some of the aliens were complicit in some bad shit that was going on, which again, I don't w want to spoil for people. And he was like, we need to get to the bottom of who the bad aliens on Eth are, okay? So from his tribe, who are the bad aliens, his overriding quest is to find his sister, Jen, right That's the thing he really wants to do. He needs to find Jen. That's the thing that kind of for the heartbeat of the show. He really wants to find out what happened to her. And the only person that he believe knows what's happened to Jen was Henry, who was his alien handler on earth, who is now dead, right? OkayK. All right, Henry This is not a spoiler because it happens within the first five minutes Henry's dead and then you'reve under a bit of cloth, Henry's blue alien he returns, I know. Whyin't know' blue by way. D't he' weird?ike know, Avatar they're blue. Thereere we go. Boy's Avatar bashing back Anway, carry on sorry. I don't know that is a good There's a lot of blue aliens But this is the piercing blue eyes. So when in season one when it's revealed that he's an alien and he looks the mirror and he gets You know, the piering blue eyes, which is an amazing change. Yess, much like me. Yes. Wow. It's starting to connect in my ps now, o So yeah, so now he's taken on this news. So the first one, as you said, was a mystery. He's a PI And the second one is another mystery. There's a boxer whose brother's gone a bit wayward and he's tryed he needs to find out what this box is up to and what he's doing. Now. If you do not do a recap and you decide to start for some unknown reason in season two, you will be saying, this show is fucking nuts. I don't know what is happening The only thing we probably will all agree on is that Colin Farrell is absolutely delicious and he's even more delicious W. Objectifying much justust saying, Okay, am I wrong Look, he wears a suit nicely, I'd say that Yeah.am me with faint praise, I'. I don't think ye. ye. You're not feeling the faro. No, no, I figurative. Noight Yeah, don't get any lawsuits. He No, he looks good in a suit I think this is, right? For me and I've already set out my store that I love the show. It's classy, it's original. I love the way he they intermixed his like the Bogart references and all those scenes. He's a cinenif fire. Yeah, he's a fire And and there's a little bit of humor. There's a great kind of scene in the first again, five minutes which adds the humor where he's with a pack of dogs, which obviously is going to appeal to me and he's thing getting a ball It's a clever scene. And if you don't know he's an alien, which I don't know how you could have bypassed the fact that he's an alien. Anyway Unraveling mystery, that's a yes for me. I love the music and the way it's filmed is just it's sensational to watch, I think. I also really love I'm not generally a fan of narration, but I'll take Colin Farrem narrating anything. His narration is really need if you can do a hard boiled detective show, you need a narrator. Yeah. ye. So Yeah, I mean, this series is about he's all alone. He's gone back to California, he's all alone. this is about how he's going to navigate E without any alien act. Be it's kind of a reboot and it's sort of a soft reboot, if you because essentially the cast has entirely changed except for him. Yeah. And And he fell in love at the end. He decided to stay and it opens with I've decided to stay. He fell in love with Earth. and you are seeing Earth. This is a journey through John Sugar, The Alien PI's Eyes. And I know that sounds bad, shit I love it. What's interesting to me about it is that and I think we reviewed this without knowing the twist. We did Yeah we thought it was a fairly standard. Yeah, but I really liked it. I remember I really liked it. It's enough. This series could be absolutely enough. Colin Farrell as an LA detective who's obsessed with film noir likeike, you know, the Baogot films as you say and there's there's aul Newuman's in this one in the hustler, There' clips to the hustleer when he goes to play Pool. That is enough That's enough of a concept to sustain a really good show, especially one that, as you say, is as well shot and well written and acted as this The whole alien element of it does not need to be there at all. Now not criticize the alien element, but just imagine this show would work perfectly well as him as a private detective investigating crimes in LA in an incredibly stylish way with the additional ray funny fact that he's obsessed with old crime movies. and he's a subscribber American cinematographer and he's a filmit P A do cinema, but not Bucially Empire magazine. Well I'm sure only a matter of time. Only matter of time But you know what I mean? It doesn't need so it's b and yet The alien element of it adds a whole new level of stuff that makes it even more interesting and compelling. But it's such a difficult show to talk about. You cannot talk about it without talking about the twist. And at the same time, we were talking about how there I bet when this goes out on Apple, when it arrives there will be a recap at the beginning. I can't see The way we never get to see those recaps on the preview websites that we review the stuff. It's the same with a lot of Netflix stuff though they put recaps at the beginning for their ongoing shows without us seeing them. There was a recap at the beginning of the agency Yeah, you're right, there was. Yes, that's true. Y. But oftentimes they won't. we won't see it, but they will put one. Now to me, I'm fascinated like, you know How they negotiate and read all the press releases and stuff kind of acknowledge the twist for season two But we've had to warn people about it as well, of course. But there is no official formal recap that we saw. And yet it still works. It still works. You dont I cannot say often enough. you don't need it. but the fact that it's there does add the other layer makes it even more It's satisfying and interesting. questestion.. If it didn't have the alien element, would we all be saying, is this is great. this is just another no, no, being wouldould we be saying this is great, but it's just another fantastic crime show. It's just another fantastic Andould we be saying that? I suppose Instead of us saying, Oh, it's and I agree with you. I don't think it needs it, but it does, to use your favourite word, elevate it. I think we would be saying that, but we'd be say what makes it special is this really interesting film obsession he has That's enough. Well but you're right because this has two hooks. Yeah. It has its hook that's on the face of it and then exactly up turn you half or through soers and give you another hook exxact a hook. Yeah where you were just like And this is a proper moment where you're just like, what's the fuck have I just seen? Guys, I'm gonna run against the track. R. Okay, I'm ready for this. I just C you enjoy it. Yeah Can I just say I love you? Oh Thankks very much. Love that. Iewew didn't Colin Farrell she was just all she would say was, is I really love you. Col Colin Har Farrell hate her. No. Lve Farrell's an actor. I think he's great I don't think he's great in this. Oh As then I think he's like. He's going through the motion because he's having to there's too much going on here, right? They're trying to too much much. Okay, so you've got the I mean the alien twist, which is like cuckoo bom. Then you've got the black and white, you know, the film inserts It's just too much. and the narration is just too much. It s a bit overload for you No, I can handle it. It's just like it just it's just trying to do too many things and not doing them well. Like I'd say strip back either one of them like get rid of the narration or get rid of the alilen twist and just like because I would I would enjoy it as you describe. You you know when you're like what would you think if it was just like the, you know, movie loving PI Yeah, I didn't really enjoy it. I think yeah. I can I can totally you enjoying this is a classic ic cop show. You you know what I She doesn't. I'm still enjoying it. No if you didn't have the alien Lle stripped out and it stripped out the even the narration I find it a bit irritating. narration is qu jaring, you know, of that era of you know, Baogart que detective films. films, obviously not nothing. There is more of it than that though. That's the interesting thing is. so it of course is it has got that noir style narration, but it's almost his entire internal monologue. Yeah There's It's almost Yeah M My doesn'trate this you know, this is so I know what you mean. I happen to I think I think his internal monologue is so kind of funny and endearing And interesting though, it's fine by me, but there is a lot of it. I mean, as. Yeah So anyway All I'll say is it didn't hit the sweet spot for me. Oh nice, nice. Appreciate it ye. you guys loved it. Did you I absolutely love it. And it reminded me I forget what I loved about it the first time R what my voice went very I forgot what Maybe I'mian. Maybeian. I'm grounding to a halt. you' percing blue eyes, that's what gaveing away. One of the things I love about is its use of LA locations is extraordinary. And ones you don't often see normally. There's like downtown ones you know, he goes to Korea toown. That scene was really funny when the woman takes his car and everything. And then then he's got this fantastic new house in the Hollywood Hills. Boyd when that scene came on, that property p scene, I was like Boyd and I are gonna both love It's not Bosch's house. It's not Bosch. Bosch has got a great house. It's still lush and la. I love Bosch, but you cannot bo bring Bosch into absolutely everything.. don't know me as well as you think. The LA Vista is. The thing that really influences, I think the film that this is most heavily inenced by is one of my favourites of all time, which is the bue of course,. your favorite R favorite buye that is massive on the infuts on this in every single way in a good way Wow.., it's great. Yeah's I mean obviously you had me an alien detective, But yeah I like I love all the noir tropes. I think he's a great character. I really enjoy the monologue but I like the sense of humour to it as well, which is quite subtle and understated, which is how I like my humour. Yeah, I think it's great. I think it's fun When we first reviewed it, I was initially like Yeah, I quite like the detective stuff, but for me the alien thing is obviously it's the opposite of K. The alien thing has made me ten times more interested than I would be without it. So The alien thing is a hundred percent going to turn looads of people off, I think. but Other people I think the pilot listener is going to love it Do you think so? Yes. I think if you've watched it like naturally play out You know what I mean if you watched this week by week of the first season, and then you got to the end I think it was episode six, that It was external.. I think that's not going to put you off at tour. I think that must be a fabulous experience you know, to genuinely get a twist. Yeah becausecauseuse it's an instant alien, isn't it? Yeah Yeah. But Al also, do you know what weirdly actually, if it was just the alien thing and not the I would have I could deal with that. It's just the fact that it's the I think it's it's all things I like so it's aliens, it's film clips. Yeah. It's a viceover. made for you. absolly made for. It looks incredible by the way. it won the Primeime Emmy for outstanding cinematography by righty. It looks. Apple, by the way the visuals of our shows are Kate F spaining on about that. How it looks most beautiful. This is' equally stunningly well shot. it'sine. And Sam Katlan has taken over a showrunner who was on Breaking Bad and Preacher. and I think even from the first episode, you can notice you can notice that So yeah. Give us some sugar, baby. And it's on Apple TV at the moment. It's started hasn't it started It started on the nineteenth of June has already gone by What else is out this way? Well, the bear is back. the bear, the bear all covered in hereir, but not covered by us because it's embargo. Heily He heavily embarged. We're gonna do that in Pilot Plus. Yeah. I've already started watching it. Have you inde? Yes. Yes. You've got access. I have Yeah, I haven't started watching it. All episodes arrive on the Disney pllus on Friday, which is very exciting. Yeah the final season, of course, we'll see how the finale goes How the Dragon is onls today reviewed it last week? We reviewed last week, yes that cheekily, but we were allowed to because of the nice can I just say shout out to HBO Mac. Yeah for allowing us to watch a show in good time and not have annoying embargo. There was an embargo. but it was one that we'd perfectly happy to. Yeah. We were able to do it a week early. Yeah It was fabulous. Now the MVPs of Screener Yes. We know our favorites. Yeah. Yes. Then we've got Avatar L dayir Bnder. Yeah Yeah. That's back on Thursday. I mean I thought you liked it. No. that's on the Netflix. Oh fine. That's on the Netflix on Thursday, the twenty fifth And there's a Rick Mail documentary on Sky, which I will definitely be watching, Rick Mail Magnificent Bustard on Sky documentary is Thursday the twenty fifth at nine o'clock There's a Prime Video South Korean Rom comom could S you at Work, James on Monday out todayay on Priday. Sounds like a threat when you do It does It does sound like a threat. Fair enough. And that's about it. There go Okay, Well no, wa a minute. I was about to say you missed out the Harry D one. about talkal about missing out the main thing. Jesus Christ. Larry David's new show. but the reason I missed it out is because it arrives on Saturday, which is just weird. What? What exactly? What channel on Netflix? HBO HBO Max Life, Larry and the pursuit of Unhappiness is a seven part sketch show The history of America on the two hundred fiftieth anniversary of its independence, produced by Barack and Michelle Obama. the front door. It's the dream. That's got something we all like from James. I have inquired as to whether we'll get screenens for this. and hopefully we will work at some point where we just haven' got them.oy takes back his praise of HBM immediately. It's a roller coaster. This is going to be the test. It is the test. but we're hoping hopefully we willll get it. But yeah, lifeelare in the hast have stops on Saturday, this coming Saturday on HBM. And it's produced by a Barack the Obamasam Jun, do you remember Kay when you were asked consistently to get an interview with W Oh yeah, this might have actually and was actually said to me seriously. I have to pastence in a form request. Yeah ye. I love being fach cizer. I've tried get an interview with Bill Clinton once And I tried to get alcohol. and I got alcohol? S I didn't get al. yourest wing epic What we know about? N words thinges, you know. That is a good get. Thank Anyway, anyway what's our pick of the week? The agency Yeah, yeah, actually I like both of them. Really? interestnteresting. Steph, I'm gonna to say Youre in the sug? I ha' seen. I haven' seen the a. So it is then. So okay. said I'm going gonna go with steh. Sugar is my sugar agency. The sugar e really su. We're recommending them both. Yeah. Okay we've had a very full house this week, haven't we? This is weird having us all in one place. I'm not sure I like it. But maybe I love it. I don't know I can't tell.. you two are off the leash, like you're unchained when you're together. it's dangerous. But look, he's able to tell us apart, which is good, kind Usually he calls me staf when you're not Oh you did that to us.. You called him boy. don't I guy Cough okay, you her back a c. My friend, all right? Well just say it's's easy to understand confusing us two since we are both Middle Asia white Bald man. Listen, you said it n us So Although I'm more midlation than here too. Sitting next to me makes me so happy, K.itt being in your orbit makes me listen. I'm gonna to c up. Being in your orbit. It does. it m what she's say. Maybe trying All right, let's keep let's talk to off that, shall we. Everything comes back to off campus with It does, it really does. Anyway, that was it for this week show Please leave us a five star rating on whatever platform you should so choose. We'll be back next week with