Identity Theft Game and Conclusion

Welcome to Random Book Memorable. Podcasts from One Password. I'm Jaden, Solutions Engineer. I'm Ali, lead of productroduct markarketing for One Passwords Enterprise passassword Manager. I'm Wade, staff security engineer for One Password's Detection Rponse team. I'm Sarah, one of the founders at One Password. and we're the host behind Random but Mmorable. Together, we offer our biwekly security advice, interview special guests from the cybersecurity community and round up the latest in security newews in Watchtower Weekly Plus, we may even play a silly security game or two So sit back and enjoy the show. It's one of those though, where you back things up because you think it's going to be the way it is, but like the reality is like if we lose the internet, like I don't it Armag like what happens I don't know. how quickly does society devolve and we're like, you know, kind at the apes here. Like I don't, I don't know. It's going to be You know, like I don't know if backup passwords and a safe are going work if nobody's phones are working. Noike there's no internet to log into. That's like the modern day version of as a couple, can you put a tent up together or more like if you power, an internet goes out, how long can you last before you? With that great segue, we'll start the episode Hello and welcome back to Random but memorable. I'm Wade. And I'm here with Sarah and Jaden How are you guys doing I discovered today isn't Monday, so that's a start. We had the holiday weekend here in Canada. You did We have ours the week before Americans and so it was a very quiet day. Everything was wonderful and I just assumed it was Sunday for the entire day and missed a hockey game because I thought it was Sunday and the hockey games on Monday I don't know what I'm going to watch tonight, but it's not be hockey I I'm a pat lef. So I Sarah like you, I don't know what day today is tomorrow is, I'm loving life. I just respond to messages and hopefully if I'm needed it I can rock up. so I'm doing f I can't believe you're respond to messages. I have to like purposely log out of things in order to cut off. I am a very much workaholic. so I get it. So why actually why are you here though, Jaden? and if you're ye Oh Well well, fine, guys, I'll leave. get it. No, no, I'm glad you're here. But like I feel are we interrupting like in N N at all. Are you doing like a half and a half thing No, I'm fully off. I funnily enough though, I just got back from one passassword club. We' in the lovely Croatia. So very fitting topic to talk about travel today. So I'm still in somewhat work mode, gotot to connect with some of our peers in the space on a nice boat in the sunsets. But I said Danna before I left, I was like, you know what? I really like the podcast. And Sarah Made, you guys are aright to hang out with too. so I might as well come back and have some chats. So she's one of like three people I put as a VIP that she can, you know, get straight through the do not disturb noise. So don't abuse the that. let me know I'll put you on VIP, but now I love doing this. so I'm more than happy to be here All right We'll at you going above and beyond. I definitely did not All right, well excellent. Well, we've got we've already talked about a little. We got a travel themed episode lined up today But first in Watchtower weeekly, we're looking at why education has become such a tempting target for hackers and how ransomware attacks are evolving. After that, we're gonna keep things practical with a crash course on One passassword's travel mode, which totally makes sense with the travel episode, right? What it is, how it works, why it's useful if you're heading through airports or crossing borders And then to keep the travel conversation going, I'll be sitting down with Gerald Ozer from Simply Cyber to nerd out about all things travel insecurity, from everyday vacation risks to traveling for work and keeping the company's stata safe. Are either of you traveling anywhere nice for worker vacations this year? Jaden, you already went somewhere else. Do you have anything further planned Yeah, I'm on the Atlantic side of Canada and every year we go to PEI. not sure if either of you have been there before, but it is Honestly, I grew up in Australia. I love the beaches there, but one of the best places in the world that I've been to for beaches. It's so nice and relaxing and I'll be driving there W in a couple of weeks, I think it is, but as you said,' just go back from Croatia. So crossing borders left right and center. Vacation stuff, I actually I'm heading off to Copenhagen for Pokemon Go M Yeah. so my mom is a huge Pokemon go player. She shows up and she's like, Hey, so I got us both tickets to Pokemon and Copenhagen. I think we should go. So the nice thing about how she does that is that she bought the tickets. They're about twenty five dollars And I'm in charge of booking everything else for Copenig I love that So she she knows how to play this game and she's done well, but yeah, it's going to be fun. So Sounds like she played you like a fiddle byb on those tickets real early and st you in. She threw her masterball on that one only Yeah Yeah. I didn't stand a chance Critical hit, man. Yeah Yeah I totally. Yeah. Always something but definitely looking forward to traveling and then just sticking everything in one password. I think that's the, you know, like you were stopping in the UK, so you got to get your ETA, you've got your travel things, you've got your passports, you've got all your itineraries, like putting all of that in one password, having it as a shared note, like even just travel mode for keeping things secure, but then also making sure you've got all of your reservation confirmation numbers, everything accessible just so much easier. So I'm looking forward to diving into that a little bit more later on in the show But before we get further into the show, we kick off watch our weekly, we do have our giveaway winners to announce. On our last episode, we celebrated World Password Day. So we asked you to share your favorite one password tip or trick with us. And we've picked three of our favorites who will each win one yearear of one password for free So our winners, we've got Rick Hensley who said, put a copy of ID cards, such as auto insurance, membership cards, IDs, passports, usese the expiration field to get reminders when the expiration is approaching bonus tip, you can add a photo of each document into one password so you've got a copy of it handy which one hundred percent Rick, super smart. Love that. I legit have a reminder in my calendar right now because I want to switch insurances and now I'm just gonna to go switch it up to this. ' this is a great idea. The photo as well actually is a game changer because you do think and Rick I wrote this down on the side to do after we've recorded this because I put all my passport information in there, but they still ask you for an uploaded photo copy and I'm thinking to myself, well, give me you all the details, so Rick, great tip with adding the photo. Andy to have Most definitely Our second winnder is Mike Schindler who told us When I need to share a secret or credential, I make a secure note and then I share a link with a one view limit. Then in an active chat, I can send the link. If it works, access is already killed They can't open the link. I can kill the secret and start over I have to trust the other person will use it correctly, but for my part, I didn't have to paste it into a team chat or send it in an email. Link that's a great way to do it as well The easy thing when copy and pasteing credentials is no one want a raw text credentials. So those links the links are fantastic. Yeah. to also talk about, there's been definitely like threat actors out there who will take those chat platforms and you just search for keywords like password. and then bam There's a plain text password in the chat and they can usually use it. So doing this will protect you from that. Yeah, nothing no plain text passwords, you know, and using a one of view limit, like then you know whoever you sent it to got it and it's done. Like it's It's Fito. So. With that, we've got our last tip from Ltate. who said, let WatchTower alert you of weaker compromise passwords and then actually take that action on them. which, yes, Ell, that's, you know, that's the important part is making sure you see that there's something not great and then doing it. So I love all of those tips. So a big thank you to everyone who entered the giveaway and congratulations to our three winners And don't worry if you missed out this time because there would be plenty more giveaways coming up on the podcast very soon. Actually taking action is the hard part. I tell you what, I work with hundreds, if not thousands of customers doing migrations, the password managers. and it's one thing to put your passwords in there. But the second thing we help you do that next step and show you the watchtail. Al great tip. takeake that action I try to as much as possible. I always do. I always love it. I like throwing every now and then like seeing a new breach come up just so I know everything's working, right? Like it's the old, good old like, o that password's been leaked years ago and changed. but yeah. ye a proof of la could possible. Exactly. a heartbeat sensor, if you will. That's go hold Well, now, let's get into watchatchtower Weekly, a segment where we unpack what's going on in cybersecurity right now So this week, we're going to talk about a returning topic and we've talked about it before and we'll give you a bit of an update of what's happening in the education sector. Now, it is worth saying that the total number of cyber attacks on schools and universities actually remained static last year with about two hundred and fifty incidents reported in both twenty twenty five and twenty twenty four That finding hides a leap in the number of exposed student records online So we've seen the rise in a number of student information systems, alumni databases, campus networks and third party education platforms be targeted by cyber criminals Earlier this month, a hacker group called Shiny Hunters might ring a bell out there for some listeners, they launched an attack on a major learning platform that caused a disruption for nine thousand schools and universities across forty six countries, which is almost like a quarter of the world if you think about how many countries that is, which is just nuts. And that's just as students head into exam season Maybe some students love that depending on how youre feel about your exams. I don't know. But you've probably seen this story in the news that it didn't happen in isolation Shiny Hunters has also been connected to bridges involving major universities across the world and earlier this year, more than a million people had their data leaked when a university cancer research center was targeted This is all pretty serious stuff. But before we get into it though, do have to take a quick pause and talk about something in Matt's honor, Sarah Shiny hunters. Does the name ring a bell? Where do you rank at your top ten? Could you do better? I'm also curious too. what would you call yourself if you were if you were one person What would your name be? putting you on the spot I am not a neamer. I am not in charge of marketing. I feel like man, I tried. My password would be called Sar' passwords if that was the I'm trying to remember there was something like some I remember we did a One of the one of this hacker games that it was like a seral and it was like It was so boring. It was like boring o. I don't so wouldn't do that. but do I do think that Shiny Hunters have a pretty good hacker name. I think, you know, sometimes they're pretty obscure, but Shiny Hunters is a pretty like you're aware of what that is. So as soon as I saw that name pop up in the news, I instantly thought of Matt because I can't remember if he thought that was a good one or not, but I definitely thought it would it would earn a nod from him as as a potential good naming effort. It's also just a great well rounded circle to your Pokemon trip for deep cut for any reference out there for Pokemon players. anyway a shiny hunter themselves. It's. I believe their logo was an Espion Get out of town. Was it really whichich I feel like dark, right? like's a good it's a good one. If only they weren'ta their calling card could just be living Espion cards around the place. PSA great at ten Spion just left Nice. It' taking a little bit more seriously, guys. I know we're all parents here too. Do you guys have any particular thoughts and feelings about when you see schools get targeted? Wade, you and I have younger kids, Sarah, you have some older children as well. so we can kind of have that spectrum there. But Wade, kick us off. How do you feel about schools and education bodies being? Yeah. Yeah. man. it's a rough one, right? this is One of the things like as a security professional, you can't really build something to detect this. So you have to have a prevention and then a response plan to it. For me, like my credit is completely locked down. Like if I get hit with any type of like social security card, at least like US side, right? And I've been doing the same thing for my child, not even in case like when one of these breaches occurs And they're at school, like we're gonna have to be ready for it. It's just, you can't even do anything against it. L how can I protect am I going sign up for credit credit monitoring for all my children just as right All right? How about you, Sarah? Have you gone through any of this kind of stuff? We've gotten lucky. you know, not nothing yet so far, but I think it's Eespecially once the kids are older, like, you know, university, you're looking at like all of your social insurance like all of your details are in a system now And then it all ties into everything else. So then you know, if you're at school and you use the health services on campus, is that all tied to your file? And then when they have access to all of that, it just sets up that immediate like, oh, there's the honey trarap of the future. L it's a very tempting database for people to get into. And I think oftentimes schools, you know I look at permission for trips for field trips, all this kind of stuff you to fill up. People you ask for way more information than you need and then all of that gets filed somewhere and you have to trust that these systems are being upkept. and it's a really challenging thing. and I know It's it's frustrating because you want to do the best like I think, like you said, credit monitoring, but like Do you really start credit monitoring for eight year olds? but Well else do you make sure that they' no one's taking out a loan with their their ID? You know, it's's a it's a tricky thing I have a friend where his child's credit social security number got stolen at the hospital when like shortly after being born R Yeah, which is crazy, right? Like lot of times at that level, you can actually call companies and argue about it and be like, hey, like this is a two year old. you can see that. like why would you allow this? And then they have to like, oh, okay, like They send it off to Friy, but Are you sure your two year old didn't wantan to buy a porsche? You know, how confident are you in understanding their needs at this time?? I'm just their needs. They need a porsche. They don't want a one. they need one just to get around Yeah But you're right, Sarah, there's so much interconnectivity with them all. and I think that also goes back to that stat of a static number. It still, remain sort of flat across twenty twenty four or twenty twenty five, but the amount of activity behind that because of all these interconnected systems. When attackers hit education, they're not just stealing the files. they're putting pressure on all systems that those students use and teachers and families rely on with all tokens and just signing in with another service, it is so easy to give access to extrapolate a level of systems as well And it's also worth adding We're seeing another trend play out here as well So not just the breach yourself, but the approach taken and how it played out. So instead of going down that traditional ransomware rout, you know lock in systems or encrypted files Shiny Hunter and other hacker groups are now focusing on stealing data and then using that as leverage So rather than saying, hey pay us now and we'll unlock your systems. It's more like a pay us or release this data. And then that shift is becoming a bigger trend in how these attacks work which is really like a bit of a behavioral shift, but Why do you think that is? Wait, do you have any insight of maybe why that's becoming leveraged rather than just your classic unlock? It's not newer per se, but it is less likely to happen. So this is like what we call an extortion, right? So usually a lot of the times what happens is a threat actor will come in ransomware you. And then they'll go back for seconds and then extort you with that data saying, Hey, we're going to release it U Especially with schools, it's a little bit different. and with the recent Shiny Hunters breach, their system actually got hit during finals week which also, great timing, right? If all these schools can actually get access to their particular systems during this week when all these students are trying to turn them in, there's going to be a big, much bigger push to get access to it. So they did lock it down and they also did then once again, extort them for more money It's going to be super common. I expect this to not go away all they did was extortion, it would be easier as well because then they don't have to have all the technical the technicality of having to encrypt everything and then unencrypt everything, right? which is a big undertaking. The scarier part is, though, is like will the data ever get released? Like can you trust these individuals? And that comes down to the ransomware operator's reputation. and if they have a reputation that lasts. And usually the thing is they want a good reputation because they want you to pay So we'll see if Shiny hunters actually if this data ever actually gets released But hopefully not It's so challenging, right? It's like it's all in an ether soup. What flavor would that soup be Data O's. I don't know I know. Yeah, right? Like Just the amount of attacks that are going and we're definitely going off the rails a little bit, especially with me going just purely on ransomware. But it's getting wild out there, right? And we're not even like you want to throw in the other wild Zinger. We just throw an AI. like how is that working out with it? But the ransomware stuff is getting is getting crazy. And the best way you can do is prepare. One thing I don't think I've talked about a lot is I actually have a folder. of a bunch of phone numbers and a bunch of lists of different things that I could call in order if my identity were stolen, what to do and being prepared for it, right? Think of it as like that emergency plan. I don't know if anyone's ever worked in a restaurant, but every restaurant has a folder in it that say if there's a fire, what to do and where to go, at least the restaurants I've worked in, I have that for my personal life in Techas and security. Now that I've talked about it a little bit, Jadan, are we seeing more of this data theft first approach across the industry? L I'm speculating Yeah, it's certainly a broader trend were and across cybersecurity. I think attackers are realizing that the encrypting systems isn't it's not the most effective way to get paid anymore. Organizations are going to better dig in better backups, better recovery. So instead, attackers are going after exposed data. which is arguually harder to fix And we all know one Starter is out there, you can't really undo that. If I tell you my favorite color is blue, I can't just take that back from your mind, right? So once it's out there you got to know, you can't really get it back. You can't reset it the same way you could restore a system. and that makes it much a stronger bargaining tool There are also reports that some of the organizations targeted in these recent attacks reach an agreement with the hackers and paid the ransom. but paying cyber criminals goes against the advice of law enforcement agencies around the world as it can fuel further attacks. I believe there's some massive names out there if you just search ransom paid and you'll see some fantastic articles about large names houseold names you be familiar with And it also offers no guarantee that data has been deleted. backack to what you just said, Mate. They want to have a brand for themselves But how do you trust someone that's really stolen something from you What do you guys all think on how companies should respond to like this kind of demand? How do you think a customer or a company should respond if someones trying to leverage them? I am I've always struggled with, you know black m in terms of like what you would do because this is one of the reasons why I like the way we designed one password where we don't know anything. L if someone were to come to me and say, you need to give us this person's password, like I don't know it. I haven't got a clue. can't give it to you I think the challenging thing here is that you've got single point of issue with the software. And so then if you've got grading software. com is the thing that's been breached. And then you've got university A paying the ransom, but not university B, but university C is over here looking at it. like It's not the universities in particular, they're just trying to get their information back but it's grading software d. com that's been the issue. So How do they work together? I think that's sort of the other piece of it. but I think this goes back to me as a company making sure I put as little trust as possible in organizations and then also making sure I don't put information out there. Pay it once and then what's the guarantee you're going to get it back? What's that what's going to happen? And I think that always worries me. and I'm paranoid and I don't trust people. So paranoid and don't trust people. Itounds like you work in security, Sarah Yeah, its it's crazy. likeike there are companies out there who all they deal with is ransomware negotiations Right? Like if you get ransomware, you contact one of these people, they negotiate with the operator. Usually they're in some other country where it's not illegal to pay a ransomware operator too. So they you're skirting the law by by taking a sidestep over it. But what winded up happening is one of these ransomware companies got caught because they were deploying ransomware And like two the guys working there, right? So it's like, wow, like My thing is to believe none of what you hear half of what you see type of deal. and as a security professional, that works out. O the other good ones trust but verify And Sari you said you don't really do well with Blackmail. I think that's a great thing to not do well withia. If you said I'd deal really well with Blackmail, let's s down and see who you's surroundingself.. You wanted to help me out a little bit I prefer not to know anything. so If I don't know anything, I'm not a target. so I think Eactly, exactly. And I think, you know, the big takeaway here is that cyber attacks are changing and not always than the way that people expect It's not always about the systems that are just going down. It's not about turning things off Sometimes it's about data being taken quietly and then being used later and that's much harder to control So for organizations, it's not just about protecting access. it's about understanding what data you have where it lives and how it could be used if it got in the wrong hands. And for the rest of us, it's a good reminder that even the tools that we use every day, like learning platforms, are a bigger part of the giant security picture that's out there. So Speaking of tools that we use every day, this feels like a not so subtle way to transition over to our Crash courseourse segment Wade, I believe you are going to take us through One Passwords traravel mode today, right? That is right. as this our travel special, I wanted to give a quick primer on One Passwords travel mode So folks don't know about it, hopefully this will help you out Before we get started, out of interest, do either of you use travel mode when traveling for work or for vacation And has it changed the way you've traveled? some countries Depending where you go have different parameters of when I go through security. they may say that I'm subject to a random search and they can look at all of my digital content as well. So depending on where I go, I'll play that by ear I've worked with a lot of customers though that do travel to countries where that is a bit more of an invasive border patrol thing. So I heavily recommend it and say, hey What's the worst that can happen? You at least turn travel mode on, you know you're protected. likeike you're always better double down when you can protect yourself. but What you sound? used Will need to use it when you have the pmon gun I it is that is one I keep safe and I make sure I can use that when I'm traveling because I do that, but I actually I turn off the majority of work stuff is all in travel mode. So if I'm head and out on a personal vacation, like I don't even have access to work stuff on my phone just because it's not worth the risk of just having access just in case. it just feels like a nice way to just make sure everything is extra extra secure. So I'm a big fan. It' I know specifically some of our journalism folks have really found a lot of this really handy. so it's a nice thing to have. So I think way it'd be great to learn a little bit more about it for those of the folks out there that haven't heard much about it. Yeah, yeah. I think it's very common to experience a moment of unease at the border knowing that someone could ask to look through your phone or your laptop, right As a security professional, that is literally probably like my way nightmare of someone asking me like walking up to me The reality is that those searches do happen at airports and at other border crossing The res are complicated and refusing a search can lead to delays questions or even having your device taken for a while. So that's the problem one password's travel mode is designed to address. Well, you probably already know that you can store passwords, documents, notes, and even things like passport details that we've talked about or financial info in one password Using Travel mode gives you a way to temporarily remove some or all of the data from every device that has one password installed So let's say that again, Travel mode gives you a way to remove your most sensitive data, not hide or decrypt it, but temporarily remove it Since you can't access what you don't have, you don't need to worry about the information surfacing while you're traveling, right Have either of you found having this has taken the stress away from having to travel? I think it kind of goes back to what Sarah was saying of like, if someone asked me for a password and I didn't have access to it, I can I very comfortably say, I don't know. So if someone said to me Give me if I'm going to go through it. and I've got travel mode turn on Like I couldn't even get into it. if I wanted to do it. I have to go back to a different device that I might have at home, you know, keep the safekeepings and change my trarouble move policy. So there's that level of confidence. I think it gives you because it's physically not there I I have a more of a so I scale down. This is like the the scarest moment. If you have a face scanner turned on your phone. what's it called like face ID, whatever Theoretically, if you have that turned on with on your phone and then have it turned on a one password, someone could possibly get into your one password So I have recently turned that on just because with kids and stuff having to type in my password all the time has been kind of brutal And I have been using travel mode in order to lock stuff down prematurely because because I'm like, okay, it's easier for someone to take my phone away from me and then just show it to my face real quick and then get complete access to it, right? So I'm using it not just for like a travel, but for like personal security. My threat model iss a little bit higher. I'm scared someone's just gonna take my phone real quick while I have it. and do something or figure something around with the face modeling. So it's an excellent feature It is one of the most common questions we get from our customers and if anyone's listening out there that's exploring this option for their business, is well, what happens if we lose our device And that's something that you do have to be cautious of. But if you do lose your device, that's a bigger issue than just credential management because Josh knows what happens. So having something like traravel mode where you can remove something from your device it helps take that one step away from saying, well, we still can't really help you if you don't have your device, but at least you know you don't have something on that device anymore you don't want there. Jerry and I talk about that during an interview about if I were to lose my cell phone, it would be game changing for my life. Like it would just take so much effort to come back from that, right How does this work then, right? In one password, your data is organized into vaults Maybe you have one for personal logins, one for work, another for family and so on Before a trip, you can decide which faults are safe for travel and which ones are not safe for travel With one password for business, team and administrators can turn travel mode on and off for team members. So if you're with the business, you got it on your phone. and you want that functionality, you're going to have to ask, probably When you turn on travel mode, anything marked not safe for travel is removed from your phone, laptop, or any device with one password installed Those vaults will also be unavailable on onepassword. com and in the One passassword browser extension If someone looks through your device, the data that you're marked as not safe for travel simply isn't there, right? So big things. That's like I feel like that is such a huge sweep across all of those particular devices too While travel mode can't stop someone from searching your device in the first place, it does let you reduce what someone can find. Instead of manually deleting things before you head to the airport, you can protect your data with a switch and it's easy to switch back to. As soon as you're back home and turn travel mode off, all your vaults will reappear as soon as you're connected to the internet. Do you both find this easy enough to turn on when you're traveling? And when do you typically plan to remember to do it? I've done it both ways where I just turn it off for crossing the border And then when I get to wherever it is I'm going, I can turn it back on so then I've got access to whatever it is because sometimes you're traveling for work. sometometimes it's, you know, it's some of those websites where you know, you're like, hm, I should probably not spend so much time scrolling through these things It's probably a benefit where it's like this should go in time out mode instead of travel mode where it's I need a break from these certain apps. So sometimes that could be another way to look at it. That would be interesting to use for a family account to do travel mode to limit your children's access to things. M. I was thinking that. that's definitely like a time out. I'm thinking how we can rebrand this now. Is it like is this like self control mode? Is this you've just granted the kids in the Wiifi passwords now, you know, time out for them or like The way I use it, right is I have a vault that's like sensitive. And so anything I wouldn't normally want, I just store in that one particular vault And if I'm not home, I turn it I turn on travel mode. Jan, what do you what about you Yeah, I think if I was going to be turning it on and off and when I would be doing it and it's when I'm applying for those Sarah you've said it before. I can't remember what it's called, but you go to like the UK and you have to apply for the visa wai I find it's a great time to once you've submitted and done all your paperwork Maybe you're about to go out the door. mayaybe who knows, but that could be a great time to be like travel mode, Th credentials are involved that safer travel, tryry to remember a cred habit of it. because those things are handy to have as you cross the border. All right, so there you have it. That's travel mode in a nutshell, a secure, easy way to protect your sensitive information while you're on the move and possibly lockd down your children And one final thing before I forget Travel mode is available for every one password subscription. Admins in One passassword business account can even apply it for a team members for things like work trips, conferences or offsite meetings, so it's super convenient whether you're traveling for work or on vacation Any final comments from you guys The main thing is just you can use this always like spring cleaning as well. So like when you kind of go through and, you know, decide you're going to clean up things or you know, listen to our earlier tips from earlier where you're like, okay, let me add a picture to this or add an expiry date to that. You can always go through things. You can always use tags, use that as a temporary way to sort of say, tag is safe for travel, tag is not. And then you can organize things, put them into vaults, and then come up with a vault that's like, this is my safe for travel vault And then turn it on, turn it off. As always though, you know, check out our website. We've got lots of tutorials on how to use all of this stuff One password iss just a really, you know, I'm biased, obviously. but like one password iss just a really great way to store so much of your information and there's so many ways for you to be able to go in and do that so highly recommend that everybody check it out Yeah, so the more we talk about things like travel more, the more you realize how much there is actually to think about when you on the move. So this feels like the perfect time to bring in someone who can talk more about this. I recently had a chance to catch up with my buddy, Dr. Gerald Ozier He's a cybersecurity educator and founder of Simply Cyber And we had a useful discussion about how to stay secure while traveling without making anything overly complicated or too stressful. We get into everything from the biggest risk people overlook to what actually matters when you're in an airport, a hotel, or public wiifi, whether you're traveling with your family or for work where the stakes can look completely different. I think you'll be able to get something from this conversation. So let's jump into it. Joining me on the show today is doctor Gerald Ozer. Jerry is a cybersecurity educator and the founder of Simply Cyber, a YouTube channel and community dedicated to making cybersecurity accessible to everyone He's also a mentor and advocate for growing the cybersecurity workforce, helping thousands of people get into the field. Whether he's breaking down the latest cyber threats or teaching foundational security habits, Jerry's approach is grounded with one goal, empowering the people, taking control of their digital lives One of my good friends, one of my mentors, I would say and people that I look up to, Jerry. I'm really glad you're here. How are you doing? I'm great, Wade. Thank you very much for that kind introduction. And yeah, I look up to you too, so it's very it's very reciprocal All right. I'm sure, Jerry, you're the you're the man though I'm over here ll I'll try to add a couple Jerry guy jokes in here at some point or Okay for the simply cyber crew. So today we're going to be talking about like travel mindset and we're really going to tap into like what how to stay safe, secure, resilient and stress free when you're around the world traveling, right? If you have your phone on you, with your boarding pass, or your computer. Like some tips and tricks all about that People are traveling all the time for vacation and business trips. We all know that cybersecurity is important, but it's the last thing on our minds when we're packing the suitcase So when you look at modern day travel, what stands out as the biggest security risk You know, within the world of cybersecurity, like if you've worked in cyber for more than an hour, you've learned about the CIA triad because that's like you' your, you know, your Amu's bche of your careers menu and a lot of people want to In my opinion, a lot of people want to paint confidentiality. of confidentiality integrity and availability is like the big spooky one to be mindful of. in while you're traveling. And for sure, it certainly is. But in my experience Availability really is the one that I'm most conscious of and We depend, you know, modern people depend on their cell phones so much. Like you said, online boarding passes, mad convenience tap to pay. So it's like literally your communication vehicle, your finance vehicle and your, you know, logistics to be able to access things vehicle And you know, if you're out and about and you're not mindful of the battery on it, which I know sounds super mundane, but guess what guys? Some of the best security is just foundational security So I think a lot of people don't give as much attention in mind to managing their battery and can end up in situations or just having backups more, you know hardcore and we could talk about this later, but like paper backups just for business continuity or personal life continuity because if you drop your phone in a pitcher of beer which has happened or, you know, you beent over to flush the toilet and whoop, there you goes your phone. These are reality situations, but I really think the availability vector is the one that people don't pay as much mind to because they're like, oh, you know, I carry this phone every single day. What what, you know, what's the difference? The difference is you're traveling and you're in a way different environment horror story I had. I got off the plane at Heathrow in London, right flew over to England to realize I no longer had my wallet. Oh my good and never found it. Right? And luckily I had backups on me with my cell phone and my passport Call the airline, called the airport, no one ever found it. It was like one of the more scarier moments I had immediately cancellled all my credit cards was pretty crazy But yeah, it's always having that backup, right Exactly. And I mean, that's even an inverted version of the backup where your phone, you know, is the backup. But the important thing is that you have businessiness continuity or DR planning and being able to know which credit cards you had in there and being able to know what phone numbers to call and stuff like that So if someone hasn't thought about travel security beyond just locking their suitcase, maybe setting their password to one, two, three, four, five six What should they care about Get right Yeah, I think One of the things that you need to be mindful of is setetting yourself up for kind of worst case scenario. and I'm not saying like you sit down and do a tabletop exercise of like, all right, like I lost my phone. now what do I do Having your main itinerary, right? whereere you staying What's the phone number? Wh's your key contacts that you need to meet with or whatever, if you're doing business or whatnot. And just having that printed out and for me personally in a carry on backag. like like something that's on my physical person. so I know I can't lose it. including emergency numbers The other thing is being mindful of securing your key accounts before you go. So like you shouldn't wait until you're about to travel to turn on MFA or multifactor authentication for all your things, but Imagine if you will that you' on travel, business or personal.re you're touring the Louvre, right? All of a sudden. And then you get a notification that your your main Gmail account has been compromised or that you've got this massive fraud on your credit card. Well, now you're in a foreign area dealing with things that you are not your creature comforts and you're trying to figure out what to do and how to do it. Whas if you had just prepared in advance to make sure that you had those protection capabilities implemented then you know, you're less likely to do that. It's basically, dude, I mean, if anyone listening has done incident response It's like the worst, you know, it's the worst unless you do it all the time and you're just naturalized to it. But if you do it all the time, you probably work with clients that don't do it all the time and you can see that they're anxious, they're emotional, they're reacting and that you don't want to be that person as your personal life is getting dismantled by some threat actor while you're in a foreign land. So to me like really is about sting and protecting kind of those key core elements of your own personal life before you go so you can essentially reduce the risk. Again, I'm a GRC dork, right? So I'm always thinking about risk and risk mitigation, risk aversion You know, even going as far as having like a burner phone or a burner laptop in some some extreme cases, if you're going to like a foreign country that You know, they're going to take your device at at immigration and disappear with it for a minute, right? Like that's okay. like and what are you going to do say no? like good luck with that U It's why one password has a literally a setting for that, which is wild. There's a setting. so if you're traveling to a hostile country, it'll like some secure functionality around one password. Oh that's fool. Right, right?'s It's crazy that stuff like that is needed, but Definitely especially in modern day technology where Next thing you know you're in a room and they just plug in all your devices and have a copy of everything. So yeah, we're going to talk about both vacation and work trips today. Are they very different when it comes to cybersecurity best practices or should people be following the same advice and the same mindset That's an interesting question I think a lot of the foundational stuff, the cyber hygiene stuff Eespecially as a cybersecurity professional, you kind of bring that automatically to your personal life and your work life I would say that there is a bit of an additional layer of security when it comes to business. So you're doing all the foundational stuff personally But on the business side you know, you do have to think through U you know, you're handling assets that could be very valuable that are not yours. So then you you begin to introduce liability and risk to yourself, potentially your your employment if things go really sideways. One thing that also, you know, I don't you see in the business world, but not on personal travel is like physical copies, right? So if you print something out which is not uncommon I don't really care If like I leave my itinerary in an Uber. am I do I want to do that? No. I'm not super happy about that. You know, the risk is pretty low on that one. But if I print out contracts or proposals or intellectual property and I accidentally leave that in Uber. Well now we've got a real problem and that's not something I can easily manage. Now You know, the Uber driver probably doesn't care. they're just going to clean out throw in the trash, but it's a risk exposure, right? And then if we get into u controlled you know, legally regulated documents like, you know, PHI, for example or privacy, if you're in the European Union, that type of stuff, you could introduce real financial regulatory penalties which would be gross. So to me, it's like all the basics h hygiene across the board, But then on the business side it escalates a bit When you give consideration to that data specifically Definitely that like you hit all the points that I would normally think about, right When I'm thinking about traveling too, like of course you're your first end goal is like cross country lines, but if you're just traveling for work in a car, right? You don't want to put your laptop in a visual location. You want to keep it in the trunk and then even in the trunk in some certain places, it's not safe there. so you got to take it with you Yeah, one hundred percent. And again, this gets back to I mean, essentially availability, right? Be if you have your laptop, hopefully you have full disk encryption and you know, it's not you have passwords to log in and whatnot. I mean, that's pretty standard and twenty twenty six but the availability of it being stolen is veryer, very disruptive and crimes of opportunity are you know likely to happen if you provide the opportunity like leaving it out in the open versus a motivated threat actor who's going to try to jimmy open your your trunk or whatever that All right, let's shift gears a little bit and go with leisure and consumer travel. so Before you leave, what are some of the most overlook security steps you think people sk There's a couple different dimensions. As far as the most, I mean, I mentioned, I think it's incredibly valuable to make sure that your main email and other kind of critical accounts. MFA on them I think it's about all preparation as well. I know that This is a bit of an obscure one But When we are preparing to leave, you know, if you're if you're traveling with family or whatever, I always like to provide some type of I know this is going to sound way over the top, but trust me. Youll you'll be happy. okay. I provide some type of packet to an individual that's not traveling with me. So if it's just me by myself, going to bllack hat, I'll give it to my wife. If it's the whole family, I'll give it to her mother. And it's basically like, here's where we're going to be. hereere's all the contact information of where we're going to be. Here's the flights we're going to be on Because if, you know, you get some deep fake phone call or you hear something in the news or whatever Um if there's any issues, if if there's an emergency Again, we're focused on the traveler here, but say there's an emergency back at home Be able to not be reached because no one knows where you are, what you're doing. is problematic, right? Maybe you get sometimes guys, your cell phone is in a dead zone. You know what I mean? And like you're not getting a call because you're on you're at Fort Mead where there's like an entire blacked out region around that thing. So being able to provide information and actionable you know, intelligence for an independent party to coordinate with to me is super valuable. That way you you kind of circumvent any kind of deep fake voice cloning type nonsense that goes on and it gives you a guaranteed authoritative sense of trust or you know that you can work with An one, if we want to get more technical and nerdy that I like, again, both professional and personal is they make these like travel routers. I have one right here. If you're listening on audio only, I'm just showing it right here. I'm not going to name a specific brand or anything, but this thing is about you know, the size of a cell phone And it's a full Wi Fi six router VPN integrated you can plug it all up and configure it. But the nice thing is you show up at a location. You know, whether it's a house rental, hotel You're on a cruise ship, whatever You fire this thing up and you connect it as a client to the wireless network and then all of your devices connect in through that thing. It's going to give you two things. One, if you have kids, They just turn on their iPad and all of a suden they're connected because you've already pre programmed it for this device no matter what network you connect to Secondly, you know with confidence that all of the communication is encrypted. You can VPN back to your mothership if you want. Of course, you're going to have bandwidth constraints. So maybe not everybody can stream all the things You know, that level of network layer security is peace of mind. I'm a big fan of like risk avoidance, right? So if I can just mitigate the risk all the way down, I don't have to think about those particular elements. when I'm, you know, executing whatever personal travel or business travel I have And then finally In my opinion, no matter where you stay, whether it's a hotel, Airbnb, a friend's house Your physical space is not guaranteed as secure. A maid can walk into your thing. whoever owns the Airbnb can come in U you know, your friend is has access to the house. So like you are introducing physical security risk to your assets, your laptop, your phone, whatever, if you leave them around So you have to do the risk calculation at that point. Like if someone were to get in here and get on this, what's the what's the likelihood of that? and then what's the most extreme impact? And if it's unacceptable risk, You better get a backpack that can carry a laptop because you're taking it with you The travel routers part is really interesting. think from like a cybersecurity perspective, right? I've seen users use those in order to fool locations on where they are, right? Sometimes there's a fingerprint form But then on like my side when using them, theoretically you only have to pay for one device to connect to the interternet and you could have multiple devices, but That's probably against the terms of services, then you shouldn't be doing that. Yeah. J definitely make sure you read that splash page love before you do it. Let's talk about a little bit during travel. So what are the high risk moments of the average traveler? you think like airports, hotels, public Wi Fi, festivals So with this particular one you know, I think public wiifi is something to give consideration to whether it's at an airport or whatever couldould be interesting. I mean, there's been numerous like at most like Black Hat and the larger cybercons. You've always got some knuckle heads that are standing up look alike SSIDs Um to to trick you to log in. I will say that I am the guy that if I'm at a conference and I want to join the wireless network, I will go find the poster There's usually like posters with like, here's the network name and ID, or I'll take a picture as I'm entering the conference. Um, So I definitely verify what the network is. I don't ask my friend, what's the network. I go find the poster now If a threat actor wants to print out a malicious poster You know, or malicious QR code. okay. I guess they've got me this time No, making it a little bit more efficial. It totally makes sense, right So let's go to what I think would be my total disaster. if you If your phone gets lost or stolen on a trip, what determines whether it's a minor inconvenience or a total disaster? All right. well Here's what you got to think about on how nauseous you're going to feel when you realize your phone doesn't exist Number one is it got any access Do does they have secrets on it, right Um, if yes then you're actually kind of probably because it's highly likely enrolled in some type of mobile device management solution, which means you can call helpp Desk and get it remotely wiped So by virtue of it being higher risk, you have additional control for it. So what I would say is As far as like, oh my go or u Number one, can it be remotely wiped? Corporate, probably personal, unlikely Second law Um By default, when you on Android and OS, when you configure it with a pIin lock, which I don't know why you wouldn't have a pin lock at this point in your life or biometric By default when the phone is locked, the hard drive is encrypted at rest. So if you do lose it You know, unless they know your pin or they're going to somehow get into it a different way through like, you know, some one of these Cellbright tools or whatever which I don't even know if those work anymore. U you're probably fine. It doesn't make you feel good because you don't have peace of mind, but you're probably going to be fine. So that's kind of like the risk of unauthorized access. Now flipping the script on availability This one is where I'm nauseous because numberumber one Oh by the way, you should also ensure that you've configured your phone's settings so like notifications are not displayed when the when the phone's not authenticated against From an availability perspective, dude, like my phone has my credit cards, my license It's how I call people. It has it even has, I don't know if people think about this. It has all my phone numbers. Dude, I'm forty six. When I was a kid, I could tell you everybody's phone number. I don't know anyone's phone number now because it's in my phone. Right? So you lose your phone. Wh how are you going to call somebody My biggest thought would so all my MFA tokens, of course a lot of I all are on my phone, right? or all my MFA is tied back to the phone in some sort of way and to reset that. be such a such a task where I do not even want to think about it All right, so that's vacation mode. We'll move out of that. But for a lot of people, the stakes get a lot higher when it's not just your data, but like we werere saying, it's your company's data Write the business mode When you have to start thinking about where you're setting your laptop Like how does the risk profile change the moment you're traveling for work instead of leisure When you're traveling for work you have elevated risk because not only do you have elevated data, elevated Um, you know, information that has more value than your own personal information very likely does typically engaging in like more, you know, business activity, right? So like when like when you go on travel with your personally you know, maybe you carry a laptop around and stuff like that, but For the most part, when you're traveling for business, I mean, you're like carrying all your assets all the time and you're setting up in random offices, you're setting up in random coffee shops and stuff like that, doing real work Not to say that I shoulder surf on people, but it's pretty obvious. If you're looking at a slide deck or Excel, or you know, some type of Zoom call or whatever. Like it's very obvious you're doing business So depending on what a threat actor's intentions are, you're more likely to be disclosing that you're doing business when you're doing business than personal just because of the virtue of what you're be doing. Like if you're on a fun travel, you're probably doing touristy stuff or hanging out at the beach. you're not You're not like cracking open multiple monitors and doing all that stuff Let's think about like during travel. like what are the biggest real world threats business travelers have right now peopleeople underestimate And do you think, is there any of them being more complicated because of AI So I mean, when you're on travel you know, your entire Itinerary is in your email, right? So like where you're traveling, who you're traveling to see, like what what all that you're doing it if someone gets in there It would be trivial to Paul spoof my number and say I'm from Hurt's Rntal car and be like, Hey, what's up U you know, we've got a problem with your rental car that you're supposed to be picking up in Atlanta or in, you know, Kazakhstan or wherever. you know, let me, let me, you know, get with you and begin essentially some type of like social engineering attack. sameame with like the flights like, oh, hey, your flight's going to be canceled unless you pay this fee or whatever. Like that's more of a a small time petty thug financial one. But you can imagine that you can manipulate somebody at that point Also, hey, like this is Wade from the help desk where we noticed that you're devices coming in from Romania right now Yeah, I'm in Romania Yeah we know that you're in Belarus or you know, wherever, but we're actually seeing it come from you know, a different spot in Romania or whatever you know, like let's do some checking. you know, like let me log into your computer really quick and fact check you again, when when someone is traveling They don't have their comforts. They're not in their home and it really tips the balance in the favor of the threreat actor just because of all of the unknowns that you know, humans are comfort creatures So when you remove all that comfort, you've got a really soft target O One of the things that my family does, which I'm pretty sure I've talked about on this podcast before is we have a password. And that if anything anything gnarly were asked or done we have to verify that password with one of with one of our family. We all have the same one Since talking about it, I have actually added it to my one password So I could theoretically share it to someone and be like, Hey, this is the password we're using. Like if I especially me if someone who there's enough YouTube video out there to completely takeake my voice and make some fake AI versions of me, right haaving that is very important, I think, and nowadays I would one hundred percent agree, I feel like that should almost be a standard business practice, you know, within within your team. I tri to implement that with my family because there is Thousands of hours of me online, right? Like people even make deep bakes of me in their talks to demonstrate how to do it I believe I tri Yeah. I tried to set up a onene of these passwords with my family and I have two young boys, we couldn't get aligned on what the word was I wanted the word to be meatloaf sandwich, right? because I was thinking who' I'm never going to say meatlofandwich, but it's a funny GI Joe meme And my son's like, that's the dumbest word. No. And I'm like, what do you mean? He's like, I'm not saying meatloa sandwich. I'm like Come on, dude, just like it doesn't matter. You probably never need to know it, but it has to be something obscure and weird. So like No one will say it by accident and it'll be easy to remember. He's like, we'll pick something else because I'm not saying meatloaf sandwich and I'm like, all right, we're just We'll back away. We'll just have you be deep faked that I've been kidnapped. Thank you You needed to drill it in at a younger age. I think my parents first gave gave me this password at like F grade. Yeah, no, no, I love that. I mean We do that with Uber nowadays, right? Like you have to say the first name. That's a very good point, which brings us to another great topic. Is there anything people should be mindful of when they're actually taking taxis or local transport? Oh man, um I mean, Uber, you know, verifying the license plate of the person that you're going to be connecting with, verifying the name. For me personally U I always will get in and say like, you know, I know that the driver knows we're going to the airport, but I will always say like Hey, like, hey, thanks for picking me up Wade heading to the airport And they're like, yep, like no one's ever said no, but like the last thing I want is to be taken somewhere that I'm not. U expecting to go Yeah Wh Where do you see people prioritizing convenience over security in ways that could seriously backfire? If you're doing a group trip whether it's work or usually more personal, but like People will share credentials, right? Like I don't do this, but like, oh, hey, like here's my verbo creds. likeike that way you can log in and see all the stuff or like you know, o, like convenience of sharing creds. Well, a couple things. O There's typically a paper trail now, or digital paper trail of like your username and cred somewhere T, if you're reusing those credentials, you've kind of like blown out All of that That's certainly one and then I mean, what else about convenience? U I can fix your password once likeike More One passassword products. the shared functionality within O passassword is actually pretty good. So like, if you could make a folder, it's like the travel folder and then give everyone access to it and be like, hey, here's all the passwords, hereere's the door combo to the Airbnb, right and all this stuff. Yeah, I feel like a lot of times convenience is typically around speed, right? So like ye setting up the travel router, like, okay, but if it, you know, it's easier to just jump on the the wireless network and just do your thing like, oh, okay, it's just a quick second or whatever Srubbing like scrubbing through those networks. like you might even get on like a rogue wireless access point And not even think twice about it because you're just trying to get online and do something really quickly. So we often think is one password is almost like a digital fanny pack, right? A single secure place for credentials, documents, credit cards, you name it Do you think that this is a helpful concept for travelers, right? Like if you to throw all your data into one password? Like it is a little scary because it's in one single area, but now you at least have your passport and all that stuff and at least in one spot That's an interesting concept. I hadn't given consideration to like, you know, a digital fanny pack or a digital backpack But I like the idea. I like I like seecure convenience And what I mean by that is like that's a single spot where you can put all the things And some of them are like long term, like your copy of your license, a copy of your passport. Some are more transactional or ephemeral like your itinerary for the upcoming travel, the Airbnb confirmation. But it would be interesting to be able to easily share like one folder with trusted people and then be able to like remove that access after afterwards. So you're you're like really treating it almost like cleared space, if you will, which which I, you know, I really like. It's almost like conditional access. You can share items and stuff across. That's the big one, right? Like I've I got my wife to buy in on it and that's how we share a lot of our stuff is via there Uh likeike if I have an account that she wants to loggin into, I'll share it to her via there O she'll yell at me because I forgot to put it in the right folder usually. Yeah. No, no, no, I love that. and honestly the convenience too because it's It's not uncommon Um I mean, this is more of a convenience thing than anything, but it's like it's not uncommon when I'm on travel for my wife to call me and ask me for like the Disney plus password because I'm the one who's captured all of them on you know, being able to share that in a more, you know, easy way inststead of like she texts me and then I text her the password back. likeike that's, I know it's end to end encrypted now, but like it's still not something I want You know, you're introducing it to another medium Switch topic to something we haven't talked about, which is risk transferral. How do you feel about travel insurance? Do you think it helps mitigate risks I think a lot of dimensions of your individual you know, requirements and needs, insurance can meet some of them. but from a cyber perspective, I mean, if If I lose my phone or I leave documents in an Uber or I join a malicious wireless network and they sniff my traffic and steal my cards or something like The impact and the blast is so much more significant that insurance isn't even going to make me feel better. L even if they gave me like ten thousand dollars or whatever L like I'm still dealing with a massive cleanup. Like this isn't a money, like money isn't fixing this problem. money is nice But like I'm dealing with real problems right now. and like like and you probably get the money in like six months anyways, right? Yeah All right, to wrap us up today U Where can folks go to learn more about you and check out simimply cyber videos or what are some other things that you got going on Well, this has been a great conversation. and if you're still with us listening, I hope you got value from it and just enjoyed. Wade is an absolute delight to listen to and get his opinions and takes What I would say is we have a lot going on at Simply Cyber for sure, but I would recommend everybody check out the daily Cyber threat brief every weekday morning at eight AM Eastern time. Free, five days a week And it's live on YouTube. If you go to YouTube d. com slash at simimply Cyber or just look me up online, Gerald Ozer. you'll you'll find simimply Cyber. You can even go to cyber threat brief d. simply cyber. io. It's got his own dedicated page now. It's pretty doped. I mean, there's like Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds, including Wade. cyber professionals joining us every day live for the threat brief that I lead, but also to engage in networking and community relationship building. It's just a phenomenal experience going on over there. So check us out Every morning, eight AM Eastern time weekdays, cyber threat brief d. simply cyber. io Awesome. Jerry, thank you so much for joining me on the show today. It was a pleasure and I hope you have a going. Thank you, Agg All right, well, and just like that, we are nearing the end of our show. Thank you to Gerald and Wade for that great interview Appreciate all of the information and sharing those pro travel tips with everyone. If you'd like to learn more about how to stay secure while traveling this summer, we can make sure to link the One passassword blog post in our show notes And then before we get into identity theft or a reminder that if you have any questions for us, please send them over to us by emailing, podcast. at one passassword. com We'll be sure to answer them in a future episode So with that, it is time to finish off with our game, Iidentity theft.ft Fire a yes or no question for security and catch. Alright, so welcome to Iidentity Theft, our identity guessing game. Before we play, here's a quick recap of the rules. I, the host, have stolen the identity of a well known person, celebrity, or fictional character Jadden and Wade can ask me yes or no questions to narrow down who I am any point When they think they know who I am, they can buzz in buz in they can show single factor or multif factor. They show multif factactor, they have to give me my name and at least two correct facts about me. If they can do this, they'll earn two points. If they show single factor, they just know my name and that's cool and they'll get a point It's a pretty cass portrayal of multi tack authentication actually works But you know, we're doing the best with these fun games. So Those are the rules, and now it's time for me to give you a clue on whose identity I've stolen today The clue is, I live a double life M, you're shaking your head. Are Are you lost here, mate? Do The first person that comes to mind is Hannah Montana. That's I love that. Yeah. I was thinking some while this are. The answer to that is sadly no. No It's kind of good. guys, I'm piping hot for a win here. I tell you what, I haven't going on my belt Wh? I'll let you ask the ph question though. All right, all right. are you a person? you or human. how will go arere you human I am a human, yes. I have to ask that from the last questions now to very All right, are you Are you tied to Hollywood A yes Hmm, sayay it with less confidence Yes. Okay Are you on TV Are you in TV shows Yes in the TV in the computer. I'm in the TV. TV shows I b Are you female No H Male, double life. Noan to watch, it's not even gonna be male either. I feel like at one time I want to have a claod on in the background listening to me so I can Have you been popular in the last ten years Yes How many ten years old someone struggle here? The hard part is asking the questions without giving away too much to the other person Um I know. I't I done that ten years. Are you North American Um, I believe I am, yes Are you a children? Are you a children's character Now Camp Recap tied to Hollywood where we identify as a male that believes they're North American and they're associated with TV shows in the last ten years I think you guys are leaning towards like real person like I'm played by a real person But I am o. I am o. Yeah. Like I feel like I need to narrow it that way so that you know o. Okay You're not going for the actor. You're going for I was going for the actor so I appreciate that. I was not H' and Hences Hannah Montana. Well, you say Hanah Montana Similar similar It's a similar situation. Okay, okay. Dual identity, I believe, is that would be a good comparison. I watch a lot of TV too to tell you guys the truth, like it. Are you a spy? I am not a spy do you want to give us that clue there or I work in a similar industry to all of us. I am in a cybersecurity industry I thought you had an aha moment then for a second way I and't panicked because I don't have that aha moment. I'm in cybersecurity I'm not a spy Are you mister Robot Did you want to say single factor Single factor yeah, because I single factor, Mrter Robot. Yeah. I am indeed, mister Robot. Thank Thank getting that Do you have any facts aboutis with then? Yeah, yeah. I can list a couple of really good ones. The show itself is actually has a lot of good accuracy to cybersecurity U there's one famous scene where Remy Malik He actually states his name is Dave Kennedy who is a well known person in the cybersecurity industry who was like an actual like a person they asked for help on cybersecurity. There's an episode where that of fries and fries no longer exist, which is always sad Yeah, man. I think my gang guys guys. Well, if you've never watched the show, so some of us haven't seen it. so I know when Anna gave it to me, I was like, h So Remy Malik is the actor and Elliot Anderson is also known as mister Robot, dual life cybersecurity engineer who lives a double life, protecting systems by days and hacking them by night. So the show follows his involvement with a group trying to take down powerful corporations, including Evil Corp Mr. Robot and Ramy's performance in particular is widely praised for the realism with hacking based on real life tools and techniques, making it one of the more accurate portrayals of cybersecurity in Hollywood. Anyone who's trying to get into cybersecurity, that's one of the things. like I always preach to try to like consume different media for it and like TV shows, movies and stuff. and Mr. Robot is always on that list. It's Really cool. Yeahah ye. I add it to my pat leave nap time, you know, list of things to watch. definitely No, it is definitely on that. Okay. I expect a full report when you come back Geez, I'm gonna ext seend my pat. Niceice. Love that. And that's the end of the show. If you listen to this far, thanks for sticking with us and continuing to choose random and meemorable. And a special thank you to Gerald for stopping by and joining us for the show and to help make travel security a little less overwhelmed And if you're loving the show this season, please do leave us a review. Let us know what you think on your favorite podcast app, or you can comment on any of our episodes on the random but memorable YouTube All that said, the only thing left to say is both Untill next time N lot. Thank you both Have a good one Thank you so much for tuning in this week. If you're enjoying the show, we'd love it if you could subscribe to the podcast on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. You can also leave us a rating or review. It's one of the best ways to support random but memorable, and we always love reading your feedback. We're also a community led podcast, so if you have any questions for us, topic, requests, or even guests you'd like to hear from Please send us an email at podcast at onenepasswordot com. 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