Best Teammates and Final Thoughts

Hello, I'm Max Rususton, the World Cup is back and foot Weekly is going daily. If you want award winning soccer coverage from a podcast that's been over analyysing the game for more than twenty years and still hasn't run out of opinions or just repeats the same ones over and over again, this is where you'll find it. We'll be producing thirty three daily episodes across the tournament, breaking down all the action, the results, and of course the drama. Can the US make it out of the group stage and into the spotlight bigigest stage, Wc up daily, listen, wherever you get your podcast or watch full episodes on YouTube He's a really serious guy, Harry. You never thought you could see anybody that would be as a prolific. a striker as Alan Sherr. and I think if he comes back to the Premier League in the next year so I think he'll still come in finish off Allan's record. He will become England's greatest ever goals scorer, the Premi Leagues greatest ever goals scorer. Welcome to Rio Meets. Before the World Cup, I've decided to come back to Manchester, where I've invited one of my old teammates to come and spend a bit of time with me And for these interviews, Airbnb have sorted out some amazing stays So let's welcome someone else to the pod G it Do h How you doing? youre? long time No, you know, it's c. Airbnb sorted this out.ice. Yeah, it's nice, yeah V nice.'s there. Wow. Underground house. This is posh, isn't it? What's this is unbelievable it? I need to stay. L seven levelo seven. You know, we must talked about getting your air was thinking Gary always puts himself down Siously you do don't you You're one of the best rightite backacks to play in the Premier League's history But you always put yourself down. Oh't know, really J know why? I think it comes from the fact that there's an acceptance that whichever way you look at it I usually played apart know wasn't if I wasn't injured, for the first probably twelve years United from ninety five through to two thousand seven I played Probably every week, that was fit. But I was probably I reckon if you said to me, who is the least talented player in our team And I don't undersell the fact that I did a good job and before I communicated well and I had good standards But I was the least talented player in our whole team. And that's that's just a fact. That's not like. So if you go through the team and think right Patrice, you, Vida Edwin Skolzy Cars. U Ronaldo haveaz Rud Ronaldo I don't fit If you think about me in that team and I think to myself, actually I am the least talented person in that team. if you said to real Madrid, Barcelona, pick a player And I would see I'd be last pic. I'd be last pic in the school yard, Do you know what I mean? You're my greatest achievement? People ask me what my greatest achievement is and to be fair I don't youly It's the fact that Alex Alex Fergson never signed another write back the whole time I was at the club. Now sometimes obviously Rapfael and Wes and Shazy and Phil We're always holding homegrown products. So there's an element of that But he never felt the need to go and sign another write back And I think that's probably quite a big achievement in some ways that He could have easily gone and sort of upgraded me if he wanted to, but I think he thought he got things from me maybe that he couldn't get from others. So he might have brought in a more talented ride back from an ability point of view. I don't think he thought he could get from them what maybe he got from me on the other bits maybe. But yeah just I was the least talented player in the United team that I played in and I just feel always that I was a supportive member of I think if it like you think about you two, Cle playay Beetles Not many people talk about the base player you know what I mean? Now they're really important, aren't they? But I think of myself as a bass player. Solid, I'm there. but you actually, if I wasn't there one night and let's say I was ill. Another bass player came in Mick Jaggu was there or John Lenon, Paul McCartney or Bono. You'd be al right St stillt get away with that. You what I mean? It's like mean it's that type of thing. I don't think I know my place, I think. I know I know what you're saying, L wouldould you ever last pick at school You couldn't have been last at school. No, no, Phil was. No, do I No, I wasn't. I mean at school, everyone, every football player that I've ever spoken to U They always were a golals score So So I score golals from midfield at school. Yeah Yeah then I play I came tonight as a midfield player. I was midfield from eleven to thirteen and then joined, Skullzy joined, Buty joined Penthorne like Keith Gillespy Gigs was a year older And then all of a sudden I realized I wasn't a midfielder anymore because I just thought the players were a different level. So I moved to rightite back. Jim Ryan mo me to rightite back.ood day He's always a good manager, a good coach somewoneere identifies that and he goes why moved there. I argued with him. I remember going up to the office at the cliff and him saying to me, and he was really quite logical, Jim And I don't pay credit to Jim Ryan becausecause I always mentioned Brian Kidd, Nobby Sttyles, Stralexferg and Eric Harrison, who's my mentor But Jim Ryan, who's my reserve team coach, said to me, He said I'll be really honest with you Steve Bruce and Gary Pallister are the center backs You're not displacing them. You're not as good as those two And he just signed David May So he's not going to put you in there Paul Parker started to pick up of injuries and his ankles so and Pul Pat, I love Paul P a brilliant player. And he said, Denny say he's never going to move at left back and you're not a left back. He said the only place you can ever play for Maners United in my opinion is right back He said, Imost startop playing right back for the reserves. I went, No, Jim, I'm Santa back. I love playing Santa backack And he actually overruled me. And that was probably one of the And I don't think that came from the boss. I think that generally came from Jim And I generally believe that decision to play me ten or twelve games at rightite back in nineteen ninety four in the reseserves. probably change a direction my whole career because from that point on You know I was right back and he insisted I had to play right back and I didn't see it at the time. When you look at and think about what you've achieved and what you've done as a player, post career, what makes you proudest about your life so far? I'm enjoying my post football career as much as my football career. Wow That's mad, that, isn't it? reallyally I love, I absolutely love My life I love I feel like privileged and honored to go and watch football matches to do what I'm doing in sort of like the things that I do I mean, I was obsessed with United when I played for United, but I do love my life. I do love getting up every morning. I've got enthusiasm and excitement about what's happening, I think, right, I've got to go for it again and I feel a responsibility because I have five or six businesses and there's probably five, six, seven hundred people in those businesses and I feel an enormous responsibility if to those people to represent them to make sure that they're okay and I look after them and You know, so there's a lot of big responsibility with that I'm Yeah, I don't know. I feel as much I film my day as much as I possibly can that balance, that work life balance people talk about. I'm not sure if I get it right. Where we're from England, I think it's a representation of England in that People aspire to become successful through hardwest. It's a really good way to achieve things, isn't it? You need a bit of luck, I think, but you wouldn't want to rely on the luck. You want to make sure that you get all stones You make sure you look underneath and you take care of it all. But like people say about your heroes and stuff and you think sometimes your heroes like Brian Robson was my hero growing up But as I get older and I think about my grandparents living to the age of eighty and working to the age of sort of late seventies. My mum's still working now at seventy five, seventy six and she's played netball up until a year ago. And I think Really like that really inspires me. U and actually young people inspire me a lot as well I used to think in the dressing room actually When I was like thirty two, thirty three It was you lads that were inspiring me. It wasn't like I wasn't thinking about players that were older than me or the manager inspiring me at that point. I'd heard hundreds of his team talks. but the likes of yourself and Patrice, the energy that he brought into the changing room inspires their older players. The Gaffe used said, never forget that Gaffe usedter always said that. when you retire you start It starts eating away your life And you say it's a quicker rout they to go down? ye And I've always thought about that. and my misses sometimes to me probably your misses the same to you you're going to slow down at some point and I'll if I slow down I might really slow down and I won't be attractive to you. I mean And life becomes very short at that point, you know what I mean? So you come across as very patriarchic. I know you was patriarchic from being in the change ro review and playing with England and whatnot How important was playing for England for you? I absolutely love playing for England. I feel that I don't know how you feel about your England career. I said at the end of my career it was a waste of time and it was the wrong probably context of saying it, but I felt like I let I feel like I let Not my country down I felt like not winning Not winning a tournament, not bringing that trophy home That was a massive let down that. Do you think we were good enough though to do it? Because a lot of people call us the go in generation, but you look at the teams we were against. It was a big teams with great players. Yeah. we weren't good enough for Ro. and that's the thing I don't know. I felt like I was so used to winning at United, so used to sort of what would be coming out on top And then with England, this massive event every two years of qualifying for a tournament and then get in there and the tens of thousands of England fans that follow the country everywhere and then just letting them down and having to do that press conference walking through the mix zone after a game when you been knped out. That was That was a continual low point every couple of years. and I just think that for me, I absolutely loved playing for my country. I know people say at times I didn't sing the national anthem. Janna look back, it's a mistake that. I'm a stubborn You know what I mean? Do you think that makes you more patriotic though sing an lphem Oh no, I don't any more payre. I absolutely love my country. So why was it a m myster. J something It's interesting is nineteen ninety six, Euro ninety six We line up And I had Ro, you know how superstitious but also our routine dial was before a match. So the Obsessed with it. Obsessed with my routine. So the idea of coming out and having to sing broke my routine It broke my routine and I thought I can't I just got to focus my first pass the jewel I'm about to encounter My first tackle My positioning on the pitch. I was I'm thinking about the game And me and Steve Mat Mannaman didn't sing the National anthem in the first game of Eur United six when it didn't get any of the games I always remember an FA counseselor came up to me after the game in the dressroing room. Karen' name no M been Jeff Thompson, maybe the chair. I I remember I m up the glasses on. He said sing the national anthem And you can imagine FA cououncselor coming up to me telling me to see islam. Yeah We can't say the words on the screen right now, sorry. I'm not been told what to do. No, you know what I mean? People might think whatever I'm not being told what to do by an N FA counselil. And I dug my heels in and I was stubborn and I didn't do it. But now so when I was a coach for England And now when, for instance, the Caribel cup final two weeks ago, city are playing Arden, the national Anthem's being sung, I' sing it. So I would sing it now in the summer in England playing the tournament. So now I see the way in which it's interpreted that that's me not being patriotic now I think if you're from Manstter or Liverpool as well There is an element of I was bd playing for England, I was called a Munich playing for England, I was called a Redbastard playing for England. We were sung about all the time, you know If you ate man United, you know, stand up if you att man you and all that sort of stuff. Rember that? O Wemley? The O Wemley. So I've experienced all that. My experience in the early days for England was amazing. It was the best thing in my life, playing for England and United But we were abused for three, four years My brother got abused after two thousand heavily. Becks got abused my best mate after ninety eight Waza got abused was another teammate and obviously good mate of yoursan friend of mine in two thousand six, but every time I saw a United playayer, in a tournent get abused. I just felt a little bit more Dug in a little bit because the United fans would basically back Argentina or all the other countries against us United became p Mansion United at that time became a little bit anti England The thing the incident with you, obviously, I sort of said, let's go on strike J mean to all these things sort of just meant that there were lots of things that I felt there was an antim M united situation with England But I absolutely love to playing for my country. and the one thing I say is I never retired from England. And I always said I would never retire from playing for my country because my country need me, I go So when Fabrio Capello called me up in I think it's two thousand nine just for two friendly. games in the summer, I went straight away. D didn't play a game But for two games I was there for two weeks. I would never not be there for my country. I love my country, but And I hate it when people criticize our country and I hate the state sometimes that we get ourselves in love my country, but maybe at times there not singing of the national anthem, maybe little things point towards me, maybe having a doubt, but yeah, that's not the case. just me being stubborn and backing myself into a corner. You just mentioned it though. I was going to talk about it a bit later. I want to touch on it now about the strike U Obviously my mist drug test, that whole big case and that whole big shenanigans it was really at the end But we never spoke about that I never spoke to you even personally. This is the first time we've actually even spoken about it and I actually didn't know. I was obviously two thousand three. I got banned for missing a drug test I remember a quote that com out from you like it said We would always back a teammate no matter what they did And I didn't actually know anything about this Kir and Dya rang me and said, Ro Your teammate Gary Nevill, w, what I've just witnessed, Well I've never seen anything like it What were your initial feelings and why did you feel so strongly about that? I mean, look, I'd been I'd been the Union rep for seven or eight years at United And I feel like When you played for Sir Alex, there was an element of togetherness and sort of you fight for everything. He was a union man Yeah, it was a union man. And I just felt quite sort of principle that The thing thing for me was it wasn't your ban that actually I would had the problem because you hadn't been banned at that point. If you remember, this was pre tournament two thousand four and you'd not had your hearing. So the reason I was saying this is ridiculous, England suspended you and banned you before the actual hearing, which is post tournament. So my view was if they suspend you after the tournament because' the that's the That's the consequence. No problem. you know full well we have to pay for our dues when things don't go our way. If you get sent up in a football match miss three matches But my view was that the FA took you out before that And I didn't I wasn't a fan of the guy who was running the FA at the time. David Davis. No Mat P Pios, Paios. yeah, I wasn't a fan. What a fan. was I sat down with him on my own onene on one. Id rung Gordon Taylor upon the way and said, Gordon, you need to do something about this.. I said, this is ridiculous. We're banning players before we've even basically had a hearing I said my view is Let real play. have the hearing after the World Cup, after the World Cup, ifrio getsanned for three four months because that's the That's the outcome, No problem. We accept process, we accept due process, no problem at all. Beome literally unilaterally decides to inwate I went had to sit down with Mart Paios when I got there and I said, you an ex player As see if your mate in the changing room basically made a mistake or Midenera, what would you do? Would you just like like turn him in And I justt I couldn't get my head around it. And I said, you need to basically overturn your decision They were never going to do that. So when did you think about right're we're going to call a striker? So basically I went to see Beck, who's the captsist said we need to get all the players together because I feel quite strongly about it and we had a play we got all the players together And we had an anonymous vote We had an anonymous vote and it was unanimmous There are a couple of players who've come out since they' de voted against it. they're lying We had a line that was unanymous. I looked at every single piece of paper And it was unanimous that we would all go on strike Im The problem was We were playing turkey on the Saturday if you remember and if we didn't play, we weren't going to go to A it are Euros. Justin it's a big lesson for me Never start something that you're not going to follow through. And when I think about it now in the end, I could start to see players sort of after about a day or so, thinking other agents were into them, you can't do this, you can't follow through. They look terrible. The med yeah, the med you were coming on top Um And the boss rang me. I think this has gone as far as it can because I can see I can see it falling in around you You're not going to get the support of all the players that're all going to go and you're going to end up ruining your whole career and you're going to end up ruining your whole you're going to be just known for this He said, so you need to basically down And at the end, I spoke to my dad after that. And he said, If you've not got people with you You can't go through with it. And so that conversation with Sir Alex and my dad And it told me something, if you've not got people coming along on the journey with you and you don't think they're going follow through, don't start it in the first place. It's a sort of thing that you know now I would take into sort of any principle. It's almost like saying you're going to hit someone and you don't hit them. Youose what you know what I mean?'re hitting on in life by the way. But you know mean? peopleople are going to hit someone just it's that type of thing almost like threating people but then're not following through with it So Yeah, it's a learning. Big learning But I was adamant at the time to basically stand for what I thought was right Well I've never said thanks, but thanks for that because seriously the. I didn't get anywhere but you know, the fult it's the fault that counts sometimes and the step in that direction risking it's a big risk for a player to do that. But R I' seen Um You may or may not remember Unanited six went over to Hong Kong And on the way back, there was a plane got smashed up and Gaza Oviously it's come out since Gaza madeade some dammage to the play. Im I think it was a massive story And the FA wanted to know who would smash the plane up and they werere going to kick him out of the England squad pre tournament And anyway, Tony Adams got us in a room into a meeting and U Stuart Pierce, Tony Adams. There are a couple of you last Pauls. and's telling Adams went We're fucking sticking together kick one out, we all go out. And we all agreed basically in that room that day They would donate our match fees pay for the plane and to fix it and everything everything like that But basically if the FA kicked someone out, we'd all go And Tony Adams coined the term we're going to take collective responsibility. So we called the FA guy in I he said we're going to take collective responsibility for this. So if you want to kick anybody out and squad, you have to kick us all out And the FA that point back down. nice,n't it? And it was it was a massive show of leadership An another little example united with Steve Bruce I'd not turned up to a wives and or partners and player event I when I was like eighteen, nineteen, and I said I was going to go. and I just felt a bit nervous at the time of just, you know, going to this event. I was young And interobbody came in the day after and he said, you come to every single event and you stay to the end And he bothlled me. And if you remember the Christmas dues, I'd be always got to turn up. You' drink it or you got to I say turn up. You have to turn up. I don't care if you don't drink. I don't care if you don't like Irish pubs. I don't care if you don't like music, think guitars. boooo. You just turn up you be there. and it's just little lessons like that that just sticking together collective element of responsibility thatre always sort of like We're in my head. Honestly, it sounds crazy It's a stupid comment to make But the Christmas d in ninety nine, I think we won the trouble What's it? Is It was that good a night. We were so tight so too closeed. C you tell us why? hu? I had of trouble No but it just felt to me like we've been quite average up to Christmas and we had the most unbelievable. We used to have great Christmas ds and we used to have unbelievable parties like mom Amazing. Th nights that made made They' make good movies, I'm telling you they' be unbelievable. Do you know what? I wasm eighteen What was it like though? You know that going into the manager's office? and asking for a night out off that to go out and have a drink I've done it a couple of times. it was like The walk to his doraw. Do remember me after the u He actually blamed you, really. Yeah Yeah he blamed because I organized it. obviously. He blamed me. I answered him back in the dress room. I said no. he tried he find every single one yourember Yeah two weeks w. Was it everyone other than G He found different other than Jason Park because Jason Park didn't go because he was like he got to do something career like but it was now And I said, boss, that's not right. I said, you know it's me, it's me and Gigsy organized, the party we will take it He brought upstairs into his office after and he absolutely killed me So you never ever question me ever again in front of the players U and then he used all the fine money buying gym equipment. I remember it was a joke. It believe I didn' been going to gym then.' going to doy. I don't know how much he you must have collected. He must have collected like hundreds and hundreds of thousands of poundsll fortunes. People don't believe him when I say to them like, I've jam back to England now. when England games are coming up, what is it like in a change room after the games? especially later on in the season when you were going for league titles and cup competitions and an England game would come out of blue. Well the March game. Yeah. Did any of us ever go? Did any of us ever play in the march game for England? But join Asenal, Michelatat said, there was obvious eleven players. nine players ten eleven players pull. So the year of the treble, the March game, me and Bckets got pulled out of England. No injury No injury now. J told you're just not going So does the doctor say something or do you have to just I don't know how we did it. I don't know what he did. but I just remember we just didn't go. We just didn't go in the march. we just wouldn't let us go T to be fair, you look back now and I've got eighty five caps and you think, well how many did I miss like that one day I got a hundred. But He just basically was so single minded about United winning. He pulled us out, he pulled me and backs out straight away And we played nearly every game that season, so he just said you're not going. Would that have been a dilemma of being like given out a patriot you were? It was Glenn Hodle and I remember. so we had to turn up She made us turn up And then he had a big rabally Glen Huddle in the room Big after did Yeah. Well, on the phone. So what happened was G Glenn all said I said I'm feeling my back a little bit I'm not playing this is Sralex Ferg. I was, are you ringing You ring him not many we rang him that a massive Is it? yeah But basically what I think the boss was saying to him was You've qualified type thing or you don't need them These lads are going to play in, you know in ten games or whatever it is in the next few weeks. We're trying to win the trouble These two have played all season, you can have a couple of the other players and let these two come home and Glen wasn't like that But I mean he's mad really because Your country is your country. England is England, but back then There was that cluby country thing y I don't know. it just felt different. I mean, a lot of us have spoken about it. The rivalries that we had with our club's players. I think they carry into England. overhadowed over overruled almost that together this of bond that we could have built. Yeah, I think you probably would to be fair, weren't like that because you knew some of the adads from twenty ones, didn't you you knew some of the adads from say West Amor leads and stuff like that, But if you've played J for United You had your own table. You just come down early, eat and get out even before some people even arrived We'd just open we'd me Skolzy and Pil, we'd be down at breakfast at half seven in the morning we'd be gone because I thought that's what we did we got up early and then sameilar forritain Like for tea in the evening would'd be starving quarter seven' in there. We're finished by five to seven come in the room. But it's wrong. That is wrong now when I look back. When I think about camaradi and spirit and togetherness and That's not right, that. W wouldould that have changed when you become a coach? because you obviously went ont to coach. Yeah. But I think the lads were starting to get on with each other better anyway in the rivries of Jose A Marinio Rapha Benit, St Alex Ferguson, those sort of rivalries that existed Ars and Venger. They were bit of work the old rivalist Yeah Definitely. Lverpool hated Chelsea at that time Arsenal and United hey, you know, that was a real rival at that time So there's a real thing going on between the clubs and the managers and that just had to that just carried in Just on the coaching, how much did you enjoy that at England? I really enjoyed it whilst I was with Roy. love Royer bits, love Ritater bits. Iceland is still never that'll never leave me, but I should I should When I think of what I live by in terms of my values of committing to things and being obsessed to do things, You know I was working on Sky on the weekends. I was doing my businesses during the weekend and I was just turned up to England. was I wasn't doing the training practice. I never coached a team really. I was always doing like the post match analysis and the pre match analysis. I was doing the video work. But still You know, an England coach. Not enough to go andeveled that No, and England coach obviously I went to Valencia as well and that was something that you know, I didn't really want to be a coach. It's the mistake that period of've trying to do everything and I definitely should stay clear of the coaching Looking back, but you're young and you say yes when you get offered an opportunity, you just say, yeah, I'm gonna go for it. And some other ads have done that. I've seen other ads takeake jobs You know, I've played with sins that they just eagerness or that feeling that they can't say no What I mean one of Roy's best ever sort of sentenceces rememember, nooy is a sentence L los always Remember know a sentence and you know something Getting good at saying no is something that I to probably learn a little bit later on in terms of like say no to things and just not getting pulled along and sort of you know, dragged into things that basically I should have said no to and should have known better There's not loads of people who siter here and say they've been up close and personal with the current England capaptain as a coach I retain what did you learn about him while being in in them squads coaching I'm trying to think of words that would put into sort of like context is professionalism performance levels is seriousness The game is about what football is to him I'm The real thing Ron Atkinson when he signed, Brian Robson from Maner United said This is no risk, this is gold And I think hurricane's gold to be fair, I look back at the signing of you from Leeds and Waza from Everton Roy Keane from Nottingham Forest. their gold They decl them rice. they were gold When they signed you month old When you came from Leed, having played with you with England, when Wazer came from from Everton, I played with him for England then for probably what a year Gold, guarantee absolute certainty. Absolute guarantee. Like almost like It'll look cheap in a few years. It'll look You just knew at the time because I played with you obviously with England and stuff I think Harry Kane He's like If St Alex Ferguson was the manager of Maners United He would never have allowed Harrry Kane to be anyway, he'd literally made sure he came to Old Trafford. And Decklam Rice would have been the same. I don't think Decklam Rice would have gone anywhere other than old traffic from West Aam. He'd have been all over those two. Exactly the same thing I'll say. Yeah. So those two for me are like gold in terms of sort of an English player that you think you can build around You know, in your spine, difficult to get Ra leaders in their own way. And I think, you know, Roy Keen was like that, obviously at United. I'm You were like that. Waza was like that Christiana wasn't obviously it was very different at the time, but players like that were just certainties. Do you look at that now united and going that there's a lack of investment in English talent now in that sense. when you look at those players being allowed to go to Arsenle allowed to go to Bay Munich at critical times. Yeah, but I think like the signing of Vamp Persy doesn't mean it has to be English. It has to be somebody who's established in the Premer League that you know is going to deliver for you. So I do like the signings that they made last summer of Kuna and Bermmo because they had that grounding in the Premier League they were gold The removal of risk that they played in the Premer League. they were hungry They were stepping up a level to a club that they knew they weren't sort of like stepping down. from a club that's in Europe that like you' thinking they're coming for a little bit of swan song at the end of their career. They're still young and hungry. They've got things to prove and they've actually shown they can handle the Premier League. So I do think those types of signings are good But you're right, there are very few players that you think you could sign that would be cut the stock coal Palmer That looks like a sing that could be gold. If he was, you know, if you come to Old Trafford, I don't think it would happen, really. I think Chelsea Hangong really But there are very few signings like that available. The like once every four or five years are that these types of players become available You mentioned those players are grow keen especially and you know all the players look up to them and you can see that respect. Is that the same for Harry and the Engishw And Harry will Harry will very different than say a Roy Kan or a Stuart Pierce when I was Englland or Tony Adams But Harry I think would if he said something with the players, it would stick It would like if he said something, it would go Lads were doing this and the doll go, okay because he wouldn't do it I He would do it sparingly with thought and intelligence, but seriousness. He's a really serious guy, Harry I thought when we wasisiting with England like really like focused on what he's doing really You never thought you could see anybody that would be as I A prolific, a striker as Alan Sera Hurricane is Yeah he's that. And I think if he comes back to the Premier League in the next year so I think he'll still come and and finish off Allen's record rec. Yeah. I think I'll be amazed if he's not playing until he's thirty eight somewhere getting that record He will become England's greatest ever goals scorer, the Preier Leagues greatest ever goals scorer.. He's having a little bit of a holiday, I think holiday but he's having a little bit of a soare in Germany, which is great for him and he's got experience over there. But the fact he onone to Bayy in Munich, I don't know what you think about buuying Munich, but I think of that as a really professional serious level when we played his By in Munich, he was like . This is a struggle They rem mightind be of May United in Jal Yeah. So for me, Yveenters and Bay and Munich were the two teams when we were playing that were like really serious football clubs in Europe. Barcelon and Rib had always had that bit of the Git and gl glit and glamour and the sort of special spirit. but the real serious professional clubs that he felt like Juventus, Bay and Munich. And I felt that yeah, you're right. Bayyer Munich is a similar club to Manchter United in that way I felt Did you see Balandor in him like? No, I didn't see that in him. I didn't think he would get to the level that he had Do you remember that season where he went from being a brilliant goalals scorer to all of a sudden being the best passer in the team When did that happen? It was like when Joseie was talking them or something Yeah. But Jimy kept dropping in Yeah turning and playing people in. What's going on? And everyone thought at the time this was sort of like him aging and not being a striker anymore. Everyone put it down to O he's dropping in No, this was him like taking his game to like the next level. his passing is Unbelievable I'm Absolutely and I never saw him at that level at the level he's got to know and the consistency nowhere near that But he's a serious professional ands gold in terms of his attitude and the way in which he approaches the game. What made you make him take corners out After all that. As you under my reasoning for it is if you think of dececkl and rise taking, Deckl and rise is six foot two He should be good in the air and why is' he not in the middle for arsenal? Because his delivery is exceptional. So we had a real problem with England. So basically we had a choice Wazer or Harry to take corners. They were the only two players who literally could deliver a ball I did two things basically One was looked at who scored the most headed goals from corners and also just need and Waza brillant in the era. An act who was a great goal score and scored more goals from corners, Harry I think had scored one goal I think in the previous eighteen months from a corner wow Tottenham and he prolific goals scorer. And then the other thing is we bet especially on the trading pitch sent them both out to the corners. and let them take some corners Harry's delivery you've seen Harry' passing since. That's ridiculous. His delivery is unbelievable. so we thought, if we can get that delivery in there that sort of whipped in like it was. That's going to bring us more goals than someone looping it in and Harry being in the middle. Yeah, I actually understand the reasons for doing it. J But it's obviously it can be laughed at and people can discredit lau. It became something that was mocks, laughed at, discrediteders Cach maybe or whatever But the thinking was if we don't get good delivery We're not going to get goals on set pieces. And we had no one in that team that could deliver set pieces. Honestly, if you just look through it, I can't remember the exact team There was no one that was naturally a cornertaker for their clubs. W was the only one and we just felt that wasn't right I bet you wish I hadd by train Alexander Arnold? No. Well, even he doesn't get a game. Yeah yeah,. I mean obviously Dacklland takes them brilli Kosaker brilliant corner. So you've got but Kayosaker on the right That one in the middle And there's probably others in that team that can take them as well, but there's really good there's really good u peaceakers now in the squad and Gareth changed that enormously just in terms of the set piece play. if you remember he did the Yeah Is it the love train stuff like They started paying a lot of attention to set pieces U but yeah Trent Alexander Arnna I mentioned I can't have a conversation with you about talking about him because he's is probably one of the most talked about write backs that we've heard about for years, especially in our country. A as a pure write back How highly do you rate him? What's your first thoughtaults when you think about Tre Alexander Arnold? exxceptional talent, like exceptional different level that I've never seen anything like it from a point of delivery from a full back position I was probably one of the first commentators pundits to give him a hard time for his defending being not as serious. I used to say to him he's going to have to get serious about his defending or it's going to cost him. Explain that a little bit elaborate, because it's quite easy. I understand what you're saying, but I think people watching and listening wouldn't necessarily justust tidy up things on your side, make sure I mean the saying that you used to say to me before ever about nothing down your side. So make sure that your left winger doesn't get joy, Make sure you're really lowing Sometimes Trent would go and close down a play, not necessarily now, but in his early days in the first team in the first two or three years, he would amble over to a left winger quite slowly and he'd be quite upright in his body. You can see him, can't you quite upright? And that's he's like when he's on the ball he's quite upright and he put As a defender, you need to be like that So you can go in there or you can go there because if your left winger is going to go past, she needs to be able to go that way Re start to get alert and start to get really busy in terms of where you're looking at sort of like you defend look like you're sort of serious about your defend and you look like you've got that tenacity And I never felt he looked like he had that tenacity and that sort of Like he pl that much importance on it. And I don't think he ever win the ball went past him. I don't think I ever saw him looking like he was getting back in rint and getting back in It's hard to do that. It's getting back in. Yeah. You know what it's like if you're play it united and that ball goes over your head, you can get back in to that nearpost and you make sure you sprint back. You've got to make sure and imagine that you're going to get back in there and stop something. and he wouldn't do sometimes. He'd almost let his right center back come out behind him and then he wouldn't sprint back in and he wouldn't get back Things like that, which are the basics of being a fallback. He didn't do his early first two or three years. We had some bad habits But I went to meet him, I did an interview with him, and I was so impressed by him and I was shocked by the fact that I' read him wrong. The love for the game, the games he watches, the questions he asks me. I really enjoyed the conversation with him And I do believe from what I hear I spoke to people that he does do quite a lot of defensive work in terms of like, you know, one ones and getting out to the ball and people that the people I've spoken to is they does do a lot of that type of work Did he ask you about any defendant or a tips? He did. he did. did he did ask me loads of questions on camera and off camera and it was almost like a two way interview. It was really like quite good just speaking to him And I thought right, okay, so Part of me half of Mel thinks we're mishandling a generational talent And it's same old England. How can we not get a player with that level of ability into our team That' that's what part of me thinks And then part of me thinks World Cups are about being the best team defensively. We know that the teams that win it ordinarily the best teams defensively Obviously they've got to have players going forward, but they tend to also be really good at keeping clean sheets and If you're going into a major game against France and then Bape was on the left You're going to play Kyle Walker. You're probably going to play Rehese James because he's a bit physically stronger There's two things. One he's obvious got a problem that he's had Kyle Walker An incredible right backaton particularly defensive in his speed. Rese James is a bit of a blend of Kyle and Trent in the sense he's got the actual delivery, but he's also got the sort of power in his running that Trent's not got. I think the fact that Kir and Tripia played games in front of him And now Jed Spent or, Liv Rento or tryrying to think of what this call conza What if a marginal gain unlocked greater performance What if an insight in data could change everything at a RAMco Our focus on detail helps us deliver reliable energy to millions across the world. because margins aren't marginal They' where we can truly push the limits of what's possible A RAMco. an integrated energy and chemicals company. Learn more at arramco. com Hello, I'm Max Rushuston the World Cup is back and footbot Weekly is going daily If you want award winning soccer coverage from a podcast that's been over analyzing the game for more than twenty years and still hasn't run out of opinions or just repeats the same ones over and over again, this is where you'll find it. We'll be producing thirty three daily episodes across the tournament, breaking down all the action, the results and of course the drama. Can the US make it out of the group stage and into the spotlight on the biggest stage? World Cup daily Listen, wherever get your podcast or watch full episodes on YouTube I think you can live with Rese James and Kyle, because they're two exceptional fullbacks, you know, Rese when he's fit But I think now when you've got Ca played in front of you and Liveramento, good, I think they're really solid good players. that But that's a real This is now Gareth Southgate It's Thomas Tukell. Are they both and you start to ask the question, A they both wrong So I'm s now a little bit stuck in between the idea of we're mishandling a massive talent who should be in England squ an accountants and now he's not in a twenty six. It's ridiculous to Are they both wrong? The managers Why? and you've always got to ask yourself a question Why would a manager leave a player out if they thought that they would make them better to win a World Cup Thomas Tuull and Garth Southgate definitely want to win the World Cup and the European Championships. We know that. I' going to take the players that they think are best. They're going take the players that they think are best equipped to do it So they're not doing it because a personal dislike or anything like that. they're doing it because they don't feel that Trent will be I'm contributory towards basically a tournament success There's also one other thing with Trent. I think if he was on the bench You know what's going to be you know not me and you are going to be saying in the studio for ITV or BBC. We're going to be sat there If England are playing someone, and you've got cons are at right back and they've not scored a goal where they saying get Trent on. And I don't think sometimes England managers want that player that it's so obvious. that you need to get them on. tr. So there's a bit of that as well. I'm ask you, what do you think? How do you think England are mishandling them or do you think they're actually right the man? because obviously you know. But I do think about The aspect you mentioned about There's some basic fundamentals in a defender and non negotiables Like you say, the recovery runs and the switching on concentration And I liken him to myself at West Aam. Yeah West Arm, I thought about being on the ball. I thought about what I'm going to do with the ball. How am I going to hurt or just do a skill against the forward and didn't think about the weakest part of my game that I actually needed to think about. I should have reversed it and thought about all my defensive stuff. Really focus on that and my natural ability will take care of itself football on the ball. And I've always thought if he'd done that but Leed's got you ready for that then it a little bit. Leed's buildill. The other thing Ro is giving the goal away as a defender is a massive problem If you give a goal away, that is a big problem If I give a goal away which did we both did by the way, of course with You would sleeping that you were struggling that night You know, if we give a goal away, we were like going into that dressing room like I wouldn't be on social media. No. You're going under I'm going if I give a goal away because that's my job. the only thing I have to do is stop a goal going in and stop the man scoring. look that didn't happen all the time. You did give goals away and I did. But I wonder whether there is that, not not necessarily with trend, but I wonder whether there is that care to making an individual error or not You know I me? I just wonder whether there is that. And I know he cares this is not related to Trent Alexander Arnold, but I wonder in his early years at Liverpool whether He was setting up goals. he was scoring goals. me's a cis record iss a joke So you think to yourself I wonder whether that was just sort of a massive almost like focus for him and the actual defensive side of it wasn't as big of a focus because Jurgen Klop to be fair built around him a little bit. he had that relationship with Salar on that right hand side, which was special probablyably the unbelievable partnership if you think of like me and Beckx together. then two the assists and goals they scored in a five six period on that right hand side was off the scale. So I think there is an issue with that and Who would you have? So the question is if you add If were Thomas T cool, sorry, you're real Ferdinand Y right centre back for England Are you picking Kyle Walker or Reese James to be rightight back? orre you picking Trent Alexander Arnold I think it's game dependent component dependent I think if I if I'm if we're going to have audible, Group stages you Youre putting in trent? putting trent in But if I know that they've got their super strength in their team is their left winger I'm going to play Carlo or R James Yeah. But I think I think If if that narrative and you build that narrative within your squad to make them understand these things, and you're all going to have huge value. Yeah. That is something that I think the players today because they're so used to being brought in and out. Yeah the should be okay with that. Yeah. Our generation wouldon't stress down to. That's a big bl slap in the face. You'd want a solid backfall, wouldn't you want that backfall to be consistent Yeah. I look back at players sometimes in our in sort of our football careers with England U Skolzy Mat Licer maybe. there's always one show Co Yeah in a those lads that were really talented And you wonder whether they would have got more games playing either today or in a more progressive nation and think about football slightly different than we do. Yeah, definitely. I agree. If T was if he was Spanish, he's playing all the time if he was Brazilian. Yeah He is Kfu really in some ways, mean Kafuair was good defender, but he is a bit like Kafu in the sense of that sort of type of fullback. He could be a Brazilian. Trent. Yeah, not definitely with the way sees the game Just just talking about the World Cup is on stay on that. I think it's People that understand the importance of family in that time d in that little window of a tournament. How important was family for you during a tournament Yeah, my mum and dad would always come out, Emma would always come out. I do think we got that wrong in two thousand six Ro. it was a circus on it? Wags the wag stuff. Yeah, it was a circus. It was just ridiculous The media sort of what would be were honing in. there was a new set of media which is concentrating on the wives and girlfriends And then you had obviously a sports media journalists that was concentrating on the team But they seem to merge with each other. And then in two thousand six in Barden Barden, They put the journalists in the same hotel as our parents and wives.belieel, you're talking about a cocktail shit there, aren't? That is a shit sandwich if you've ever seen one. If you want a shit sandwich in a tournament, you put the girlfriend one fifty parents, wives, girlfriends seventy English journalists and paparazzi in the same hotel. S mad cocktail, out it. And in amongst that you're Carag's family. I know you'll take that in the right spirit. Just fueling the horror. They were allowed them they were allowed. knew they were about know. Ters were in to. It's mad. Do you know what? this is more of a personal thing, I think that somethingomet that leinks us both Um, is losing like hugely important figures in our lives We've never even spoken about this Iithve. but my mum obviously passed away and your dad. Your dad was always somethingone I always say to people that he was a life and soul When we won trophies, we had parties Yeah. when we were Christmas party sometimes you'd be the beginning bit in the pubs in the Irish pubs. you be there at the beginning be there. But he was the man for the sing song. A Some of the songs are kn new and learned at the club was because your old man was stinging at the pies Do I mean? how important obviously was he, but also then in terms of when he did pass away How was you able to cope and continue being you? It's interesting because just before I go into that, obviously barred and barden Do you remember the picture of my dad? Yeah. So I was I was feming. so basically I don't remember I'm fuming so I say right We've got to getid this circus out of time. You you just explain the picture though So basically my dad There's a picture of my dad on the back page of I don't know, it could be the mirror peopleople News of the world or whatever it was back then withith an inflatable World Cup with all the players' wives. He's on a table with an inflatable World Cup singing It's coming home. It's coming on. And the headline was, Neve Neville embarden B. Unbelievable. Oh my got ad justust I screamed him. said I was fuming because I was really sort of not happy with the whole sort of wag's thing, the families thing, the circus that was going on, but yeah It is My dad to be fair was the life and soul of party Obviously He loved United, but he loved coming away with England. I It was a massive influence on my life You know why? you know I coped with it when it when when he passed away I knew he would pass away like that. I knew he would pass away like that. I knew it would be instant. And you know, my dad dad goes to Australia, my sister gets appointed to England u netball coach Like literally about two weeks before I think they sort of sack the England coach and they she entered the worlds in Australia Conwellustria Ws in Australia Typical mum and dad straightway they book a flight to Australia, they're there within literally ten days. twenty four hour flight He gets there He does forty length in the pool because he useds to swimm a lot. but Dadam's a good swimmer, believe it or not He's a big bloope. He's a good swimmer comes up and then obviously he just collapses I mean mum hits his head against the bedside cabinet her mum sees him been called and obviously he's gone When we flew I flew all this straight away. u But I knew that's how he would go I knew that he would always have a heart attack and that sounds really sort of quite graphic, but I knew the way he lived his life, the stress The relentless. Relentless, the nonstop that he drank, he ate You know, the last time I saw my dad, was about a week before that ag gotone away on holiday And he just met my sister's new partner Wh she's with now, Michael. They've been outntill three o'clock in the mor in bolting in the pub And I saw him the day after And he's there. And He's got a pint isan or he was the Gym Tonicatch, I think at the time You know, at the public like h one. And just he lived his life to the absolute full and you couldn't maintain that level of sprint If you sprint like that You're just going to go out and fall off the edge of a cliff. So I always You know, obviously I was upset, I was devastated, but I just knew that I cope with the fact that How hell Yeah, you get if you accept the fact that your parents are going to die whilst you're alive and if that is going to happen I always imagined that that was how my dad would go that he would just let him hit a brick wall and go It's myadough. I actually when it happened to my mum, I never I've never thought about my mum passing away No I don't know if I think about it a lot, but I always imagine what what you know it's interesting, I don't know if it's something that you want to keep in or not. but when my grandparents passed Always for three of them I was there point where they passed had to be there And then to be fair, when they're in the sort of, you know, when theyre in that period between the sort of the passing and the funeral I go and see them a lot So I've go to see my grandparents a lot and did the same with my dad I going see them a lot, talk to them sort of try get emotional and other people say they can't go and see them. They just people do it differently don't they? But I think in that period between them all passing and then obviously the funeral, which is usually ten days, two weeks And my dad it was like three or four weeks because they had to get getting back from Australia I remember going seeing them a lot and just getting upset in that period Im Yeah, I just sort of maybe sort of psychologically getting used to it. of thinking about sort of how it would happen and then how do you cope and how do you move on and Oh, so when you were seeing your grandparents, that's when you was thinking about your parents Yeah. I was thinking about mum and dad and thinking, well, what's how' this going to been? And my dad was just a cha fire cirert to hit a brick wall at some point just the way in which he lived his life. And so when it happened Obviously I'd say I was devastated, but there was almost like a realization that I knew that was going to happen I knew that the way in which s of my dad was the way in which he lived his life to the absolute full and unbelievable life You know, he's watching my sister sort of play for England for netball over a hundred times. watching me and Pil play for United and Everton and England hundredundreds of times. He had an unbelievable life and he traveveled everywhere and watches all the time, but he always had a good time. That a smile. B big smile smile Great time. always happy Ltely opposite of me. have was sa say Gumpyev like what's happened there? So yeah, just Yeah, I think that was the reason that I think people cope obviously all the time and you've had to cope with the incredible things, really. And I just think that's how I coped with them. It's like talking of coping the morning of The funeral, the researchers behind the scenes told me You went to a business meeting that morning and your sister led England out of a that ball Yeah. so basically my We went over to Australia. My sister carried on coaching When we got there, the basis said that they were just keeping him alive by the machine and um I remember I remember My sister on the game the next day. And we agreed that basically we'd turn the machine off after the game she'd finish the game and then she'd come back and when she came back, we'd over there me Philippp and Tracy, my momum And basically we turn the machine off So we made that decision that we had to turn the machine off at a certain point and Tracy, but we said, let's not do it before Tracy plays. Let's do it. So Tracy went into that game. The team didn't even know A team didn't even know when she came back And then basically we turn the machine off and we sort of that was it then at that point I'm There is it, to be fair, I always remember the doctor coming in and sort of sitting down with us And you have to fill in a form like and My mum got asked a question A Would you like to donate any of his organs And all of us went quiet and I didn't whet my mum was going snap I didn't really say anything for once in my life. And my mum went Dude the bloody Eld would want that lot. And I just thought, you know something. My mum's amazing I thought, you know, that just summs my mum up. The idea of just getting on with it. And mum went we went back to England then of we had to wait. But yeah, and then the morning of the funeral I'd had this event booked in with the cououncil where we werere going to launch our project in Manchester. But there were people flying in from Asia, there were people flying in from different parts of the world And I wouldn't I wouldn't let anyone down. so I went and launched that project nine thirty in the morning And then my dad's funeral was like at half eleven. I went straight up there. Be your something then There is a little bit of the abnormal about, I think a player who played under Strillx Fergs, do you think there's a little bit of something a bit like abnormal Yeah I remember lads sometimes there were sometimes lads who had the parents pass away or they had sometimes Chrishan know his dad. Yeah. And sometimes they had lads who maybe their wives were. I remember Nicole Someone came into our dressing room and this is probably ninety five, ninety six. And I remember someone saying U that he was having a baby. hisis wife had gone into hospital to have a baby And he said the team's been picked. I'll play the game, I'll go You said, the team aren't been picked, but the team's been picked. I I'm playing. I always remember that So there's a bit of something about You know, that dressing, I don't know if it comes from that the idea of you have to continue, you have to carry on. Is that with the manager? the manager, I think Yeahah there's an element of I think just that just that thing just of you got to you've got to carry on And I was thinking about football player, a lot of them have things going on before matches on a Saturday But in the seventy five thousand in Old Trafford Manchter United can't lose a football game because you've got a personal problem.ad d it. You can't.ad. So you're going out onto that pitch? That crowd that don't know about your personal problem, it could be a relationship break, it could be someone's ill in your family I'm sorry, you cant go out onto that pitch in front of those fans Let them down. Use that as an excuse. And use that as an excuse. You've got to make sure you're right for them and that is it. So there's an element of that I think runs through sort of the dressing room and I think runs through sort of like the club and that you don't let your teammates down. you don't let each other down, you don't let your family down. got was big on that whenoney. He wass massive on not letting people down, not letting your teammates down, not letting your fans down. So I think there's an element of that and then then So there's an element of that when you sort of your dad passes away or your mum passes away. What choice have you got? you've either got to stop? or you've got to continue. And the only real choice that all of us have really is to continue. Yeah no. I was the same I threw myself into work. out all the time. I need my kids to see me being up trying to be positive and being a good example in that sense or being an example in that sense Well, you know what, your podcast, I've seen Kn and Tina taking the mick out of you every now and again Every time again. Every time trying to keep it calm. But just you being on the go all the time, and given what did happen, has ever ever looked at it?' thinking I'm gonna tojust this a little bit. Roy did say that to bit, I think on the podcast last year. I think I had like a little rash hair and ye I need some creamo. I need some I can' rem what it was now, I've got it r it's you to slow down, Gary. And when he does when he speaks, it matters, you know what I mean? You need to slow down. so sometimes it does Hit me a little bit T. But it's difficult It's difficult because Yeah, it's difficult to slow down. Yeah, it's not what I am It's not what I do. so is my th it You are just it's like The word relentless is you and that is you Relentless is just constant. But it's the word that sums up, I think, all of our lives the reason I call my business relentless I did it because I thought, Jo, what's the one word that I think? Most represents my last twenty years United. No matter what happened every single day Win lose our draw you had to come back the next day Nxt season, if you w in the Premier League, got to come back and win it again. It was non stop. There's never a point whereby you were able to relax and sort of say, mayaybe when you won a trophy for a couple of days or something like that, you might say But you were never allowed to sort of like come back the next season And I think that's just the life that everyone's living It's become normal, thent? has become normal. I feel a bit like that like I say to it, when are you going to stop But if when you said when I heard that you were going to live in Dubai Now I wouldn't do that and I don't think I could do that But I actually was a bit of admiration for the idea of sort of saying R I'm going step away from it a little bit. you know, when you said I'm not doing the television anymore and I'm going to sort of go away and sort of I thought Yeah, that sounds great. I'm not sure it would I could do it or and I wouldn't do it, I don't think bold to actually sometimes make that sort of that sort of decision to say, right, this is going massive change and people do it all the time because it with work Well I just think to be f, I don't think I've got that in me I live in Manchester, I'll always live in Manchester Because I feel like I do feel like I ownwe my city. I feel like I ow the people there. I feel like I need to be there and I feel like it needs to be there for my businesses and I've set I've set things going on the track If I'm not there, how can I expect them to work for me? If I'm not there I can expect people to turn up every day with enthusiasm with desire and commitment and love what they do If I'm not there, that's how I feel a little bit about it. So I think no've got I've committed to them, so I'm going to stay with them, you know what I mean? I wasn't going to go into this, but no you said that that. An incident a lot of people have seen, it's actually gone viral now in this clip, crazy. You was walking through the city somethingenthere with your wife I think on the way to a concert. A man who's been telling us now just sitting here now You absolutely love this city fight for his city, is loyal to his city He's always going to stay here How dod you reflect on that type of incident and the actual response that you've been getting recently. Our view was if you get criticised, you get sung about from opposition fans all far in love and war But I do think there's a line when you wes there. I agree And at the airport, my wife was there and my kids were there So I think if I'm on my own You could argue, some people might say, you brought it upon yourself. Okay, no problem. have a go at me know City fans maybe at Weble, I think at Jemm the Caribol C final city fans behind me. Yeah, that city fans having a go at me. I used to play for United. you understand that? I understand the point. compleomtely get that. You know what I mean, I smile at them, I go like that it's a bit of That's fine, no problem at all I think if you're actually in the street U and you with your wife or you with your family I'd expect a grown man to say, okay, not today But then Yeah, he didn't. Asa filmed him. He cut the camera off at a point where I think he started to make himself look a little bit silly So he's short on the video. It's actually that video. He followed me for two minutes.? Yeah The video is about thirty seconds So basically after that, I started smiling at him And he started getting really aggressive and sort of even more aggressive and to be fair's cut that a bit off, he sort of left it in a bit of a thing, but I love my city and I'm not going to leave my city because basically a guy He's having to go me on a Saturday night. Y Ema just walks away from me. No She's fright. She's frighting. there's a lady. got. The guy's got an aggressive dog with him. It looked like an aggressive dog. It might not have been, but look it looked a bulldog And I thought at one point, you just let the dog go I genually thought he was going to let the dog go at one point he didn't do it to be fair to him. so you know I accept that. But he was really light. He thought, is he going to come over and hit me? Is he going to come over and have a go? Is's going to let the dog go and You don't know me I'm walking into a concert I'm m to watch James play Gandalf M It's Saturday night, seven o'clock, eight o'clock in Manchester. It also it's very rare The amount of love and sort of conversation and sometimes humor. Yeah's normally humor. bit back.'s the Liverpoolan aity. Liverpool fan always has a quip. Oh. They can't walk passedout saying something can. Nge notch. Yeah The Evert fan you think they're Liverpool fan for a minute but then they're Everton fan and then they sort of make joke with him because you know, Phils played from City fans. Spot city fans a mile off. Spots oneight. I just a mile Th spot a mile off. You can spot them by the way they look at you. You just know this' a city fan. And ye they usually to be fair I don't think I've ever had any aggression. I've never had any aggression from city fans in Manchester. You know, generally there's a humorous, there's a banter element to it. There's not an aggression it You know what I mean? that type of I used to hate you and all that type of stuff Do you care what people think about you as a pundit now? mean it's a change profession. Do you have any care at all? No, it's got to a point now where I mean I got killed at a lot. probably It's a good thing though, when you're getting killed, you're being talked about in any particular way. It means you're actually you're in people's eyesight. Well there's the United flags that traveled with us everywhere home and abroad hated thed but never ignored And there is an element of You're either going to be hated or adored But if you're ignored, it's the worst.. So that's the one I genuinely think that saw Cara somehe ag got Cara Ev. I see that Yeah. seeee that some It's happening a lot someh they got Roy obviously at Arsenal like a year and a half ago ' puting quite a lot now at grounds where The fans are sort of like starting to get a little bit I've never had at a football ground. I've had abuse but I've never had it where that com has come up to me. No. I've never had a city fan at Brighton awayay and the last day of the season when they won the league F or five years ago throw a beer over me I I reckon if Garn Eville ran through a group of city fans. I reckon I probably I remember walking out and thin, oh my God, I saw them And I was expecting a beer to be. Yeah It didn't not fun Yeah. No if you threw a beer over me. Oh was exact on Camera. you guys on YouTube, you can find it. it's a video. They videoed it. I ran through a load of city fans to get up to the sort of compound at Brighton. You're behind the goal where you walk up them steps. And the city fans it' the way end and they'd won the league So I think I was quite lucky to get away with just a baby th that, you. I was expecting probably a bit worse than that. You know what I mean? There's an element of It genuinely has no act on me whatsoever. It did do when I was younger when I was a player like twenty three, twenty four, twenty five and I went through a bad time. And I remember sort of at the time thinking it really got to me pre two thousand euros But beyond that, I've been pretty good even Valencia, to be fair, that was a horrendous amount of criticism deserved U so you know, there are a lot of times where I've got criticism and I just think Yeah. I think Pro probably had that during my life really during my career. me and my brother every time we went away. the wayground if the Nvs can play for England, so can I we were mocked Jokes about it wasn't are' it? It sm. No cane I spoke to a few United fans before you arrived I'm just talking about just I' doing therev and sometimes I throw like this and give me a few questions or whatever Yeah know Qite a few of them were saying to me As him why shows we think less passion and positivity about us That was a fundit. Yeah It's a balanced storyio, isn't it? It's like On Sunday Churkey scores covering the biggest game in the country It's an unbelievable goal. I've got to make sure that I generate some fun for what people know, I've got to generate some for myself. Do I want sitity to in the league? I absolutely don't want sit anywhere near. I'll say it on her now I don't live Pool or city to ever win a game of football again. I genuinely don't. I genuinely But J something to be a professional and sort of do the very best. And sometimes maybe I don't get the balance right with Un United are the hardest games I do too get the balance right. Now if you remember, If scores the goals it C you are in Bermmo onn the counter atttack against Magterity to Ecourage first game, Michael's first game. Oh my go, Bruno, it plays it through. is Is it a bmo? or is it It it a boomo's a bmo Real, I I've screamed onn the camera, listen to the goal. I scream You can hear me in the background. That's me that's my microphone down. I'm literally, my veins are popping out my neck And the amount of complaints that came in about that were unbelievable. How was it? Yeah, massive. The thing that might to be fair P might think is that I'm more critical of United when I They don't play well. sometimes I think over the last maybe ten years, the balance maybe I've not got it right Sometimes I think This may be unjust Sometimes you're not just saying what you see Last week I got I think I got I think some of the guy who Basically I speak to sometimes about my social media, particularly my LinkedIn stuff. He said to me, you got a load of criticism from United fans after the leads game But I went Ied really badly I said, we were shocking. I said, But if you go watch the commentary of the in Arsenal Games in You know, Michel's first two match, isn' it I was like That's an unbelievable performance shot. I mean, so I don't know. likeike I say, United is definitely the hardest games for me to do to get the balance right. because there's a lot of criticism comes my way if I over the enthusiasm and there's a lot of criticism comes my way from United fans if I sort of get it a little bit like If they feel I'm not sort of getting that sort of Sentiment, right? but you know if you said to me, donon't covey nighted games for Sky, let me just sit in the stand and watch them. I'd say, yeah all day long. but I don't you, I do I still do the games. It's difficult. All right, listen, we've had you long enough. and it's finished with one thing we do with all of our guests and we need them to create a farers side team of the best players that they played with no goalkeepers because we don't really Gkeeepers on No goalkeeper. No no football is e there Oh Christiana Ronaldo, Wayne Rooney, Roy Keeen. Paulse Ges, Ryan Gicks If you just elaborate a little bit on a couple of those kinduff and Ryang Gigs, what was so great about Ryang Gigs? Ryang Gigs from the age of sixteen to the age of forty as play that a level . there for like Well how many is that? twenty three years, twenty four years Is games for Man' United, is trophies for M' United is longevity is fitness, is adaptation to being a liively winger to become the center forward to be the number ten to be a sitting midfield player. Dictating Dictate and play If you think of sort of like Bernardo Silver on Sunday for City, it might Gigsy could be like that, you know a little bit. We weren't that type of team that youd go back and get it off the back for, but he's that type of influence at the end, wasn't he it and Unbelievable that career and Could you argue he's the best forer player ever? J him Definitely up there in the top three, top five Premier Lague players have a hundred percent G Skullz Skullzy, I love Skulls playing with Skullzy Unless you I think there are a lot of people who don't get the sort of love all the I the admiration, the importance of Paul's goals partarticularly in that last six or seven years when you played with him. Very different than the first six or seven years when I played him, but the last six or seven years from probably two thousand five six through to twenty twelve He r the biggest football matches in the country and in Europe in midfield He was Jaffe, he was Pelo There are very few players I've seen dictate the place and the pace and the rhythm of a football match And I think unless you've played with someone like that or understand how that works. And really, you talk about courage of getting on the ball in the most difficult games. If you're going to the Burnabau or the newew camp and the all traffic games against massive You're a bit edgy aren't you, but then you have a player who sometimes just give it here You know, you got spread out, by the way. stop stop shringing. We want people to come closeer so we can give it to him. He's going, go away so and take whisky part. And he wants that. Yeah. So he used to say to me Yeah. T he'd snap at me literally three or four times a game. if I didn't split Be he knew then that that would pull their wide midfield players that which would get spaces and open pathways into him. And unless you've played with that and then the ability to switch play at a different sort of what would be pace and interjection of sort of like passing to a game,out the one around the corner the accepts it on the half turn and deep and Honestly, I think that he is H The best player the most important player that I played with at United in the last six, seven eight years Yeah, I just think he ran the whole team And then Michael Carrick alongide him was brilliant as well in that period of balance Well what about what about Roy Roy the high standards and Biggest influence I've ever seen in a football team In terms of influence on the pitch, influence off the pitch, the standards, the demands The intensity The u I've never seen anybody as influential on a football pitch as him. Do you have any rys of him if you on in commentary way but was before UK Yeah an ext tch in the cross I put in the ro. I've spoken to him about it a lot, but I've never seen anybody as compelling, driven I' in turns set the standards, everyverybody else sort of You think about sort of like hard is working. One of the best players, the first in the gym, the hardest working in the gym which means that everybody else then follows behind it and it sets that example of standards and intensity. and nonstop, never giving in. He had all that. I've never seen anybody with that level of influence And is there anything about Christiano that you saw or you was a part of that, you go I've not given that to an out spoken about or that was like super special I have said this before, but I always remember Cristiano being a young player actually being when I look back now quite mature, I remember Carlos giving us loads of runs after training. and Cristiano going up to Carlos and saying, Kylos, too much water kills the plants. Oh He made me stop in my tracks at the time. and think How do you do Fight it for everything you like And I thought that was a good message to me. You know I mean we send it to Carlos But Christiano from two thousand six to two thousand nine Ive watched United since nineteen seventy nine. I've never seen a player play football like that. I know people say George Best and Duncan Edwards when I talk like this, but I never saw George Ben and Duncan Edwards play I've never seen a player for three years play football like that with a red shirt on I've never seen it. that three years from two thousand six to nine You know How many European cups do we get to two thousand eight, two thousand ninetine. two Yeah, three European cups Multiple titles, the most successful period in Manion United's history is that five year period from six to eleven And he's there for four or five years of that And I've never seen a player play at that level in a red shirt for three years. It was absolutely mesmerizing. And then when you throw Rooney and Tez into the mix with it and gigs, Honestly, it's we need to watch. It is not a myth. Sometimes you say like, you know, in my day it was better Act I can talk from a point of view of I didn't play in that team for that season in two thousand eight. If you go and watch the clips of those three and gigs and Sulls and you watch the speed of attacks and obviously they didn't get the numbers of these sort of pairs, but I think of Baail, Benzemar. Ronaldo at R Madrin, I think of Messi Name A Suarez. those three that you think they could be the best three players in the world all in the same team There's a bit of that about Tavez Runi Ronaldo in that sort of two thousand s seven eight season like What we were watching, we were watching something that's like h would never going to happen again I just think that was unbelievable that what I saw for those two or three years in Christiana in that time, No I' never se anything like that. And then Waza is' the Basswazer Wh is the best center forward? So people say to me, whoo's the best striker I might say Rude Vanistery, Alan Shan, if you say whoo is the best forward that I played with at United It's Wayne Rooney The best tackler, the best header, the best goal scorer, the best assist maker Runner. the best fighter, the best runner, the best He was an aggressive He played football like he was in the street still as a kid It was the best forward I ever saw at Manchester United as I played. I'd never seen anybody could do all this. It was a mixture of Mark Hs Rud Van Derrooy Canonargh. Eric Canonargh. Pul scs in the pocket and on the half turn It was a mixture of all those players pulled together Dwight York It was a mixture of all the best of those players that were amazing. He could do all of the things that they could do. He could drop in level to level to that level. He could pass. He could find a pass. he could finish, he could head lefte foot, right foot. he could sprint back and defend Honestly, he's the best forward I've ever seen at all traffered in my time