World Cup and Trump's Interpersonal Style

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It is Monday. He is back, Eeditor at Lge of the Bulwark, Fourth of July content creator, Eraordinaire illryst. You were working this weekend. A little bit. In between World Cup games, obviously. But it was too hot to go outside. and I was kind of avoiding watching Trump and his attempts to hijack the two hundred fiftieth. So it was World Cup and a little bit of work Yeah, we'll get to the World Cup at the end. I also miss Trump. You said you were trying to watch Trump or trying to avoid Trump? Yes, trying and succeeding in avoiding Trump. Then I had to discuss it a bit with Sam Stein on Sunday, but you know, luckily Sam had watched it. so I was able to just play off him, you know. Okay, well, you're ahead of me because I just decided I'm going dark. I know this is my job And I'm paid value people and entrusted byalue people to watch this sort of thing But It's Midnight So whatever, eleven o'clock on the fourth of July I took my daughter and a neighbor kid. We went up to the roof of a hospital parking garage, maybe against the rules to watch all the fireworks around town. I came home I was like, I'm not going to turn this on. Why would I do this to myself? And the next morning I woke up and I was like, I'm not going rewatch it. Why would I do that to myself? So I don't know how it was And you know, there was much to have been said about it in the lead up and we did It is sad and unfortunate that Our two hundred fiftieth anniversary could not have been more of a unifying celebration. to your point about the Worlds Cup, I do think that it's been kind of just replaced. by you know, there was a vacuum and it was filled Mostly We'll get for at the end mostly by by the World Cup team. So that's do you have any other deep thoughts for people who are desperate for observations about his speech. Just that I think Trump's attempt to hijack it basically failed. I think know ninety eight percent of Americans were ignoring what was happening in Washington or you know, enjoying Slide fourth in a pretty traditional way. and they neighborhoods and their backyards and their local high schools, you know, watching fireworks or like you semi legally on the roofs of garages watching fireworks. seriously, that's what people do on july fourth and they go to swimming pools and it's hot here We went to our little neighborhood, get together on july fourth, it was usually a little parade. littleittle kids in their tricycles kind of thing. It was too hot. actuallyct so they just assembled in one area where there was some shade and mixed and mingled and provided know red white and blue popsicles. But it was charming and it was nice. and I was there about forty five minutes, several people work readers and viewers, I'm happy to say no talk of Trump actually except for the implicitly, I'd say, in the praise for the bllwk, but you know, just chatting about what was people's lives and what was going on and how their kids were and so forth. So that reassured me that huge welcome America was able to tune out Trump, I think Federalist, small D Democratic fourourth of July us in our communities. That feels right. Well, the presresident is back this morning. up early Ringing the bell in the oval Oice, this all just feels so gauche and inappropriate. and Uh it was the first joint opening of the NSdAQ and the DaO to announce the Trump accounts. He just put his name on them in his remarks he mentions Michael Dell attributed to those accounts And he's urged people to buy the Dell stock said that Dell was going to be repaid for his donation The Dell stock surge this morning after he said that last week, we heard right before the weekend that said investment accounts owned by Trump engaged in three hundred previously undisclosed stock purchases. One day ahead of his surprise announcement that he would pause his Liberation Day tariffs There'd been a forty five day deadline to report those transactions. he doesn't abide by deadlines You replied to that story with just a brief tweet that said impeach and convict This stirred me I want to talk about the merits of impeachment, but first degree of grotesquere around this, it's hard to even kind of wrap your arms around It really is. I remember a year and a half ago was like the Trump has admired Orbon, but we can't it's America. We're not going to go that far down that p and people met partly the authoritarian path, but partly the kleptocracy path, the corruption path I don't know Orban's regime in detail, but I feel like we've probably gone further than Orban or at least equivalently far ' kind of in Putin territory almost with this level of corruption, aren't we? And it's really It's appalling. And the reason I just couldn't resist I just tweeted impeach and convict because and I'm curious on your thoughts on this th is that You know, some of the other stuff's a little more complicated. I'm proving that Trump is being lawless or misusing the Justice Department or shouldn't go to war without authorization. I mean, these are all pretty obvious bad things that Trump has done in my opinion, but there are people around who will say, oh, no, it's more complicated. The ceiling is just, I mean, no one's ever doubted that you can be peached for that, right? I mean, that's in a way it's in way the most straightforward it's the least grave of his offenses, you might say, in terms of the future of America as a liberal democracy and a constitutional republic, but it's also the most Glaring and obvious, I guess, I think. I guess I even quibble with Last Grave just because You know, it is the path towards just being just total banana Republic territory. true. This is just how things work from Putin in, you know, great powers or once great powers, former great powers that behave like this that decline to just like kind of random, you know tin pot third world countries. likeike this what happens, you know, the president gets paid off by the corporation that runs, you know, whatever agricultural product they have or you know, they pay off the TV station owner, like this is just how things work in countries where there is no rule of law. and we have kind of declined fully into that Lvel was I don't even mean this like as a majorative to those countries but third world ism in that A lot of times this what you need to get kind of third world economies up and going and the successful ones are, you know, they inststitute rule of law. The leader of the country no longer can be paid off and cannot like pay off his children and doesn't have his son in law running things, right? Like That's how you build trust in the system. and then that's how you get business and money into the system. this is just kind of basic stuff And like we're going the other way he said about his kids Almost anything they do They have inside information. And he kind of starts rambling and he's like, if they buy a cupcake company, then the cupcake company, you know, has a contract with somebody, and he's just like, we don't have to care about it. We don't care about it. That was like the upshot of this. they're going to have about inside information about everything. And who knows exactly What's happening is why you have to have an investigation. Like whoo is doing these investments? Did they have inside information? That sure seems like it. I don't know. I didn't buy a bunch of stocks the day before you did the pause on the tariffs. So maybe it's luck, but and I do think that like just going into on the pure like financial corruption is to your point, I think, both easy to explain to people as a political matter But I also I think it's just important in like safeguarding the future of the Republic, just to be like, hey, we can't do this anymore. Like this isn't going to be allowed next time. They're going to be held to account for this. just on that level I think that Obviously investigating is important and holding them accountable based on what' found, but that's I think a pretty compelling impeachment case for me You know, I think about it, when the founders use the word corruption, which they use about the repepublic in general, they also mean just corruption. and they understood right from the beginning this is as you say how corrupt monarchies and other kinds of despotism work. It's an aspect of the broader corruption, but Yeah mayaybe I was understanding it a little. It's a kind of important aspect, right? The financial corruption is an important part of the broader political and social corruption really. I think you've been more impeachment me from the start. I don't know if I was if this was about being beaten down by the last time or there's like one part of me that is just a little bit like what's the point?s there's a little bit of that element to it. L is like what is impeachment anymore? Like he got elected back again? Like how is it different than a sternly worded letter? Like at some level like there's that argument that kind of bounces around my head. And then there's like the strategic argument, which I think is not nothing, right, which is you don't want to signal to people if the Democrats get back in power, that their only priority is re retribution against Trump. L you do want to signal to people that the thing that they care the most about, they want to spend time on is ensuring that you know, that their lives are made better. and maybe there's a way to tie the corruption to that, which is, you know, hold Trump accountable so that you can, you know, focus those resources on and actually helping the forgotten man or the working man and woman in America. Both of those points, I think are not totally invalid. I think that that's a worthwhile thing to think about and to discuss if you're hiking Jeffrees and his crew or you know, whoever is kind of making those calls next year, presuming the Democrats get back in power. And I think the point that I was making Earlier just that for there to be any hope for repair, you kind of have to say, no, like there's a line. and It's been well pass crossed And this is how the system works. And just because we know that there aren't going to be any honorable Republicans who go along with us does not mean that we are not going to do our obligation to the law and the Constitution by going through impeachment. That's kind of where I' land. I don't know where you're at in the twenty seconds I thought before tweeting about impeach and convict. I thought it's kind of a division of labor thing. I do think people like us, if Hakim Jeffrees calls me after he watches this podcast later today and says, Well, should I be talking? encourage my members be talking more about impeachment I'm not sure for the reasason you said, I'm not sure I would say yes. And even if he calls me on january fifth or whatever, twenty twenty seven, a speaker and says, shouldould we move ahead on it? I don't expect him to, but if he were to, I'm not sure what I would say because that's a different role. I do think our role is to sort of tell the truth, obviously, and to be a little provocative. But this is being provocative and telling the truth. So I I'm happy to at least get the idea out there. It's important that people understand, I think, that he deserves to be impeached As a practical matter, people deserve all kinds of things and deserve various punishments. and people decide not to impose them for prudential reasons. It's important to bring home just how terrible what's happening is. I guess we don't know how many Democratic senators there are, but they'll end up being. But there's no doubt that there would be twenty Republican senators who would gladly go along with an impeachment process of a deemocratic politician if their son swear invested in you know, fourteen different rare earth mineral companies around the world. and you know, we're doing illegal stock trades with what seems to be insider information and, you know, go on and on. like There's just no doubt that these Republicans would go along with it if it wasn't for Trump Part of it then for me also is when you go back to that strategic question, I think that there's a risk. I think that if Democrats alongside of this strategically need to also demonstrate to Americans that they care about their concerns and not just going after Trump But I don't think also there's a strategic benefit of making the Republicans defend this nonsense. Like really? L this is you think this is okay for the president and his family to enrich himself at levels like totally unimaginable in past White Houses, totally beyond anything that you criticized about Hunter Biden or anybody else, I think that's a worthwhile pressure campaign to put on them And also the emoluments and gifts and bribes, if we can call it that, for foreign governments and I guess foreign companies too. That's kind of worth bringing home, right? I th T if you mentioned Pana Republic earlier if it came to my mind as you were talking about about third world countries. I don't know what the origin of that phrase,. Pe can look it up. Obviously these places in Central America, and Latin America I guess ganas, G bananas. But also I think part of the phrase comes from the fact that we, the United Fuit Company or whatever participated in the corruption of their willing corruption, I guess I would say, of their governments, of their dictators by in effect, you, cutting deals with them to get good commercial So we used to be on the side of is something we didn't We were're proud of but we did it for whatever. We let our companies do it. At some point, we passed laws, I think in the seventies to stop American companies from this kind of behavior. But it did happen for quite a while.. But it's bad enough to do it and we stopped it doing it. It's worse to be on the other end. It's pathetic, right? I mean, we're like Qatar is like the old US. and we're like the old, I don't even know what country do in Souve Guatemala or someone who united Fuit hunt bribed A good night's rest sets you up for a great day. Big sleep fan I love sleeping People sometimes ask if I'm getting enough sleep because producing so much content and Wh I prod is content you hear about my the other parts of my lifestyle that I enjoy theay lifestyle, going out, partying, parenting. And the reality is I do get sleep because I hit the pillow And I'm out immediately It's nice. It's a great gift. It doesn't happen on every mattress and there's one mattress that's been ensuring that I get that sleep that I need is our friends at Helix. We love our Helix mattress It is supportive, but still comfortable They've got upgrades for some special cooling features Itot N Orleans nights it's easier to fall asleep and I wake up feeling rested and ready for the day. And Helix makes it easy for you to make the switch too. Helix delivers your mattress right to your door with free shipping in the US. They have a one hundred and twenty night sleep trial and a lifetime limited warranty. And the happy with Helix guarantee means you can rest easy with seamless returns and exchanges. So it's easy to give Helix a try. It's been great and you'll love it too Go to helelixleep dot com slash the bulwk for twenty percent off sitewide. twenty five percent off Luke's mattresses. That's what I got thirty percent off elite mattresses. That's helixleep dot com slash the Bulwark for twenty percent off sitewide. Make sure you enter our show nameame after checkout so they know we sent you helixleep dot com slash the bulwark That is right. To the Qatar point, Trump has now taking the inaugural flight on their plane We get hand me downs from Qutter now. That's that's the state of our decrepit U country And he's flying that plane today uh to NATO summit in AnNkar this evening I don't know. mean I w want to get to do the NATO of it But it is Truly remarkable like this is where we're at. like that Trump is in business with the UAE on his crypto business and the cutter has now given us our Air Force O as a gift, which we've accepted this bribe. simultaneously to this point where We're still embroiled in a conflict Like that involves Qatar, that involves their region where they have interests We're allegedly still working on a final deal to resolve the stupid Iran war that we started. Cutter has a point of view on and If Trump was ever I'm skeptical will ever happen, what was ever to fly to a summit where he sits across the new gay Ayatolla and like signs a peace deal, he'll be flying on the cutter plane. Yeah. I don't have a question.'s just what about that Iran war? That doesn't seem to come up a lot there over the last several days. this thing that Trump went Hget. They were so proud of. This was America pulverizing it, obliterating everyone. We were back. No other president has ever done this. The American military has never done anything like this for two hundred years. Suddenly, we'reving this giant celebration of july fourth. did Trump be I didn't watch his speeches as we were saying earlier. So I don't know if he mentioned it even. I don't hear a lot of talk about it just as well since it was a humiliating def fat, actually, but, um We'll see how much talk about it there is at the NATO summit. I guess it's good that Trump's going Maybe not, though. I don't know. That's the low bar. And he could have just totally given up on NATO by now I was pretty struck The Europeans have been pretty good. and we've had a lot of compliments of the Europeans on Bill and Tim Monday. They've been surprisingly strong will, I think in the Trump second term and sur and they've been stalwart in support of Ukraine and standanding up Trump on Iran, I think was pretty noteworthy Even still, you get the kind of little weak kned European nature comes up from time to time. This is playlbook this morning. I was just reading him. because these are a couple various quotes and senators about the the lead up to the meeting tonight European NATO allies are pulling out all the stops to prevent a Trump blowup The mood in the run up to the summit is poised, but with a sense of foreboding Well, European governments have on paper done everything they can to keep Trump happy A last minute surprise can't be rolled out. European allies will be holding their breath as Trump heads to Acaron Do they have to be do all of this? Maybe Trump should be holding his breath. Like why why are they letting him be the protagonist of the story? He's the he's the outsider Anyway, that was That was a little bit annoying. You know we'll see exactly what they're going to focus on. I'm sure Trump will bluster on spending money and complain about the lack of support in Iran but unclear what like tangible might come of it I mean, maybe these European ambassad just saying things to an American media outlet that they know Trump will read or read about and sort of want to make Trump feel important and that they really want him to be behavave I guess they do want them it to behave. they still they're still in the game, which I don't blame them for if keeping on pard as long as possible. And I do think on Ukraine, it's a practical concern that they just he seems to be annoyed at Putin. He seems to be less intent on damaging Zelensky and Ukraine, that's the one thing the Europeans have stepped up the most on, and it's the most important thing So I give them a certain amount of leeway here, but yeah. when bristles is one one reads that, but And Ukine I think Ukraine will be the big story. I mean, how much do they do for Sansk be there? How much do they do for Ukraine? How much does Trump get in the way second story after Zelenssky is MagGar being there, I think representing Hungary. So I guess I said this in morning Shs, you know, I'm going to listen to Zelensky and Maggar speak for American ideals and kind of just try to avoid listening to Trump. Supposely Trump had a call with both Putin and Zelensky in the lead up to this, I thought that was interesting The telegraph reported this The sourcing on this is a little shaky. I think it's worth at least mentioning. the United States has supposedly warned Poland that Russia could be preparing a military provocation aimed at testing NATO's resolve and weakening Western support for Ukraine This is kind of single source to a Polish outlet through a Polish source Uh so it's kind of thing where it's like Who in the United States did this? It's kind of unclear, like kind of. how high level this tip off is I don't know, just gave me a little flashback to these types of stories were sprouting up before the Ukraine warar U where we where our intelligence services were warning Ukraine this was real. and some people weren't taking that seriously in Europe and even in Ukraine. And then you know, we saw it happened. So Like Russia is just getting obliterated on the front line And there is there's been some reports that thingsings inside the Kremlin maybe aren't as happy as they were It doesnn't seem crazy to me that like Putin would try some other gambit to try to change the narrative change the momentum around what's happening. I mean I gather from some friends who are more in touch than I am with European diplomats or even European intelligence officials and so forth, they've been to Europe recently at conferences that the Europeans seem pretty concerned. I take it this is partly based on their own intelligence. about Putin trying to recover from what's happening in on the front with Ukraine by doing something either in Poland or maybe in the Baltic States and maybe not a full fledged invasion, but you know a lot of troublemaking and false flag type operations. This may be a subset of that, you know? Yeah. I just think that's important context in the lead up to the NATO meet summit in that It's kind of one of those obvious statements, but it would be nice to like know for sure that the United States president was aligned with Poland and aligned with our European allies in the event that something like this happened. because You know, Putin doesn't have the guys for a full invasion of we're just seeing what's happening in Ukraine. they just couldn't do it successfully what could be successful is provocation that yields Trump and others of his ilk starting to be like, well, this isn't worth it anymore. We can see the escalation is happening. like it's time to back off right. that would be the the gambit and confidence that Our president would not to that gambit. Um Y'all know that I'm not really the DIY type when it comes to home improvements. It was this home improvement show I was watching with this gay couple from Detroit, Dang, I'm blinking on the name of the show. but they're from Michigan then they did a New Orleans season. And I'm jealous I wish I was a DIY gay but I'm and I still like the redesigning part of the house. I still like Z Jing It's like making things nicer and more fresh and Do the shopping part, not the shopping part. The DIY part, not as much And our friends at three dayay Blinds Give me everything I need to ensure that I can do the shopping and enjoy it and not have to do the execution. What a win Th Day Blinds is the leading manufacturer of high quality custom window treatments in the US. And right now if you use my URL three day bllinds. com slash the bulwark, they're running buy one get one fifty percent off deal We can shop for almost anything at home. 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I admit when I'm wrong, I'm wrong often You know, where I'm learning, I'm trying to have guests on who are smarter than me on things. I'm learning with the audience There are a couple things that I have pretty astute air about. I do want to mention them because they both came to a head over the weekend. first is My friend Mallory McMorro dropped out of the Senate race in Michigan She was I don't know maybe three months ago now And it was basically a three way coin flip. and I had had lunch with somebody I don't know, in the spring at some point is very deeply involved in that race, not in the McMorow camp. who, you know, understood all the polling and at that time They said to me It's a three way coin flip. it's totally even like I could hear, you know, the argument that McMor is leading or not. Around War starts. Abdul al Said starts really leaning into anti war stuff. He has Hassan Piker and some other DSA types come to visit. Third way puts out a demand. candidates condemn Hassan Piker and condemn these people on the left that have said things that At Aican or ceta,atever And u Makmorah does condemns Al Said for having Piikeker there That was like one small kind of internet thing, but that leads like this broader skirmish of kind of a left right attack where Stehvens is not being attacked that much the more the Chuck Schumer supported candidate, the APC supported candidate and McMorrow and So you'd start attacking each other. And if anything will have no effect, worst case scenario will boomerang back on the candidates that you're trying to pressure. like this is, even if you're right in the principle Like even if you grant everything they said about whoever else that he campaigned with and that they're a bad person, it's still a dumb strategy And that obviously bore fruit and turned out Democratic voters right now are like not interested in hearing their candidates decide that they want to pick fights with people the on the far left flank. Like it's not that there will be a time for that. There'll be a moment for that. like potentially if you want to have that fight, maybe it'll be the twenty twenty eight primary. we'll see, but like That is not what they're interested in. It was stupid And we lived through this. I said this the whole time, like we lived through this Again, if you're taking outside the morals, you're just trying to win like all this is is your interest group is trying to help the candidates that you prefer ideologically win Who did well in the Ta party time McCarma Mitch McConnell did well, not the big not not the people in the party that decided that they wanted to go take a full on head on fight with the Tea Party people They lost. Eric Canter lost. Like how did McConnell survive? McConnell survived by like being strategic, being smart sometometimes adapting the, you know to appeal to the Dea Party right, other times picking spots to find weak opponents to go after on weak topics. like going after the DSA left on over war in Israel, like right when Israel is getting us into a stupid war It was moronic. was you were fighting from your weakest possible perch at the worst timees. anyway, okay So they're out, and I think it sucks because I think that Mallory would have been the best candidate I think that both Esid and Haley are imperfect candidates for different reasons. And You know, I just I want people to be smart And and I don't think it means that they have to swallow their principles or not say what they think, but it's just like The Democratic voters right now are looking for people that are anti status quo, that are going to fight Trump, that have their eye on the ball, that are focused on the real enemy and They're looking for people that are demonstrating that they're going to be against stupid wars that they're going to care about their economic concerns. Like that's every focus group ser does says it, everyvery poll says it And like picking this factional fight right now, is both dumb strategy and it's just wrong. L it's not it's the wrong fight to have right now, even outside of kind of the more Machiavellian political concerns.. There's my rant about the Michigan Senate race. I'm It's in sorrow, not in anger that I talk about Mallory getting out of the race. and I think she'll she'll come back. She is fine. like herer personal brand, I don't think is heard. and I'd like that she can run for a statewide office in Michigan in the future and and be fine. So I don't do you have anything to add or rebut No,' of the general, um, People should come down and accept that it's a big party. The R for Connell,, example interesting. I stking back to those years. He at times accommodated the Tea Party. He at times fought them raised a ton of money to defeat some of their candidates in key senate races. remember that Mississippi race rooms that I was use example. Chris McDay Cochran, who was not Cochrane who was not at point It's like Chris D was a racist talk radio host. and it's like they went at him and they went at him aggressively and they used very smart strategy. It was kind of a pincer attack. They brought in some black voters to vote in the primary to defeat him. And it was a very sophisticated strategy to go after like one of the weaker Ta Party people. And's like you mentioned, and there are other times where they just endor the I think it was a couple of senators points. they were able to save Cchrord at that point. And then if I was thinking about twenty ten, I think it was twenty twelve. a protege of McConnell's, Treay Grayson, who I knew slightly at the time, ran for the Senate, the open Senate seat, I guess it was against Rand Paul. And Ian Paul Cabert McConnell's guy Grayson in the primary. And then and McConnell wasn't thrilled about that. But you know, he decided, Okay, Ran Paul's my colleague from Kentucky. I don't I don't love him, but you know, got to make the thing work and Ca was a pretty effective Better or worse majity leader, minority leader, then majority leader for the next, I don't know, ten twelve years and had Rand Paul's vote when he needed it. I don't know us everything think except the what issues where Paul really, you know had a partnered with Rand and stay and this is the same thing with Rubio. Rember like again, it was like they had Christ initially at the time and then and then Rubio runs as a tea party person and it's like, you know, Mconned didn't you know, go whole hog going after him and look at where Rubio is now. right? So just yeah, like there are times to have the fight . this was not the right time, particularly given the topic of the war and els you again say you want about him. like has been run a pretty effective campaign. and Mike Murphy, who is much more irassble and grumpy than me and much less willing to kind of hand it to the left side of the Democratic Party and he still is a Republican standing. I've been watching I've been listening to his analysis about this. and he's like I'll say it is the best Pitician in the race He doesn't have the baggage that like some of maybe those House candidates in New York did from the DSA side. You know, Murphy's not rooting for him, but it just as an analysis standpoint, It's like you have to look at the field and say, okay, you know, maybe I'll say this is going to be offensive to both sides is more of a Rubio, you know, and less of a Chris McDaniel, right? And And so then you have to, you know, assess it from that from that vantage point. So you also have to know what kind of year and what cycle it is. And I think that in a different year I think I'll say you to do a pretty risky bet in Michigan. I'm like less convinced that that's the case this year. like in the first Trump midterm. I mean, is he slightly more risky than Stevens? Probably slightly more, but I don't I'm not convinced like a lot more, and I'm not sure anybody's like demonstrated that Yeah Mike know Murphy knows Michigan. well, he grew up there and ran the Englo campaigns there and the Sence Abraham campaign. so he knows that Keeps a close eye on that state I like that your idea that you're what would you claim you you're mostly right or sometimes right a Yeah. I'm going to be occasionally right. S one not sometimes one not below you. say, you know, JVL up there and always below. claim to be always right category, but in my occasionallyally right persona I've always thought Stevens was a stronger candidate than people thought just because she's such an experienced and tough cand tough minded candidate with a good team and all that. And I kind of think she's I mean, if I had to bet, I'd bet on her defeating. I'll say in the primary, but In a way McM if you were designing things, McMare is the kind of the best of the three because she's she captures a lot of the young change side of things without Als, you know, being so far alive. So I don't know I don't know what's going to happen. I hope well we'll see what happens, right? Yeah. And the B black vote is another thing that is subtext to all this, you know, which is You got toa be well with bllack voters in the Democratic primary and And I do think M Moro was struggling there than I think that's kind of unrelated to that other tactical element that I was talking about You know, I think that's something that people are to be continually reminded of as you head up to twenty twenty eight discourse. Okay, Tim is sometimes rightite number two U, Michael Cohen Donald Trump's fixer Uh a a resistance star for a while. resistance certain resistance outlets loved Michael Cohen and they wanted to you know to welcome him in and talk about how great he was and give him shows He's back in Trump's good graces who could have predicted W eight Ib WABC owner John Katsim Matitas said Cohen and Trump have smooth things over He offered him a radio show on WABC. Kather Matas says, I checked with the White House. they had no objection. What a wonderful world we live in. You're running a media outlet. and he just says as if it's of course, I checked with the White House to make sure they had a problem. Cohen gave a quote. I was told the president gave me a glowing recommendation for this gig because he believes I'm going to be the next Rush Limbauff Um We have our weaknesses.. We like being told that we're right, you know, We like having our biases flatered or this is benefited at something the Demrerms. I'll be honest about it. It's a lot of Democrats like coming to us that they're like, C. One of the things I like about this is C. Bill Crystal, who I always used to agree disagree with when he was on this week now says I'm right You also have to use your judgment. I'd never had Michael Cohen on the show. I will have people on the show that have Trumpy views. I might this week as a matter of fact As long as they're not bullshitting We should not have people that are completely full of shit that have there for sale sign up that are obviously going to go back and forth depending on what is convenient. that was true about Cohen. Cohen was not like he got lumped in with us. This is why maybe it's a little bit offensive at times. He's not like the never Trumpers some of us never supported Trump, you and me, or others who like reluctantly were on the outskirts and then came around or people who are young like Sarah Matthews who went in there and then saw it was gross and came out. That was my my co was Trump's fucking bagmare He was his bag manan like he was doing Gross, disgusting, illegal corrupt things on behalf of Trump for decades I was never was never really convinced that that MO had changed, you know, and then you go on the shows. it's like it's the end of Trp. It's like, okay. All right He is what we thought he was. So Michael Cohen off. So if you ever wonder why hasn't not Tim had random resistance superstar on the show? Maybe the Michael Cohen lesson is one of why. Any other thoughts on that before we move on? You know I don't know if I was ever on anything with him. Maybe there were one or two like shows I didn't control so to speak where like Zoom or whatever, I found myself on with him and I guess drill enough. But I do recall, I worried some will double check this and maybe I once went on. He asked me to be on his He had a podcast, I think And he asked me to be on a billion times. manyany, many, many times. it was kind of offended. I was just politely said, I think I'll pass. You know, I didn't say anything about why. And then it got kind of fristly, as I vaguely recall, from our brief exchanges on DMs, I think on Twitter or at the time or whatever was. I think I never went on a show. So I'm with you and being that one too. you were good, you had good sense on that My summer vacation is almost here. I can't wait. I need the time to relax and unwind I'm going to shut down the Twitter machine. You guys are going to have to hold me accountable for that. I want you looking, I want you spying on my Twitter account Seeing if I even do any retweets, retweets are also not going to be allowed. So one thing I'm trying to do is I prepare for my restful no Twitter European vacation is a little bit of language work, some fun with our sponsors at Babel If you're traveling the summer, here's a real travel hack. Don't wait until you land to start learning the language. Inead try Babel. Even just ten minutes a day with Babel can help you start having real conversations in as little as three weeks Instead of memorizing random vocab, you're learning phrases you'd use ordering dinner asking for directions or talking with the locals. stuff you can actually use to make the trip smoother and more fun and more fulfilling I like to babble to real life, no vocabulous or verb charts, just real conversation practice. Lessons are quick practical I' built by more than two hundred language experts've been doing them the dinner table when we gotone to a restaurant with my daughter period between ordering and the food getting there can sometimes be dicey with children abble is a nice way to fill it. Now we're learning French words together If you've got summer travel coming up right now is the time to start so you can actually use what you learn on the trip. Babble iss offering listeners up to sixty percent off. G to Babbleot com slash Bllwork. That's BAabb eL d. com slash Bllwork For up to sixty percent off rules and restrictions may apply Speaking of just really on on the media corruption thing, you mentioned with the WABC reminded me. There's another story that's been kind of happening in the background Um, which is there continued to be a right wing effort to take away the licenses of these local ABC TV stations. this' all kind of First into public over the Jimmy Kimill element, right where Brendon Carr was threatening. One of the, I think the most pernicious part about that is he was threatening these local ABC affiliates where the government does still have licensing power, and saying, hey, if you don't take him off the air, like, you know, we're going to challenge these licenses and then Kimel gets back on the air Part of it continues And you have this like media research center who has like one of the stupid Boseell kids that runs it. They're well funded though on the right And they have like a lawsuit against these local stations or a challenge against these local stations saying that they're doing communist propaganda and you know who the hell knows what else? And It's just worth noting that like that pressure from the White House on media outlets where they have powerower is still ongoing And you know, Brendon K is a good example. I don't follow very closely, but I know tiny bit about what he's doing at the FCC This is the term they use a stuid term. I all of government. We have it all of government foreign policy on whatever something, youll get the treasury Department and commommerce, everyone's involved in some effort This was used a lot during the early days of the warar in Iraq and the war on terror and then and then to some degree, Ukraine. and it's true. It' just the phrasees a little bit as a pretentious Trump has't all of government assault on his opponents. It's not like it's only the White House or Stepven Miller or you know, or Blanche's Justice Department. reggulatory agencies that we don't think about a lot and they're mostly have been pretty they were ineffectual over the recent decades, you might even say, they're involved. And as you say, and each of these things adds up, right? Brendon Carr is not quite as scary as having the FBI or Justice Department chasing you down or maybe having our friend there at ODNI, you know trying to find you and prosecute you. But it's nothing if you're running a local TV station, right? The degree to which they have done re prettyty good job from their point of view But again, this is Orban is, right and Putin ish. Every part of the government, they're going after you from many different angles at once. When I John Ganz on, he had this joc creep theory of fascism, and we're noting that there are a lot more jococks in this administration than creeps, but Brendon Carr definitely fits in the creep category I don't sure how much there is to say about the story, but it's like so shocking I have to mention it. So this is Bullark podcast G's trrue crime. An Idaho mother was charged with the murders of her eighteen month old twins a year after suggesting their deaths were the result of vaccinations. Days after the kids, a boy and a girl were found dead Shaw and her husband appeared on a podcast produced by RFK's Children Defense Fund, the anti vaccine organization I mean that is just horrifying and astonishing that that is now the Secretary of health and human serervices Like what Well, that's another aspect. The going after opponents is pervasive in the government. I don't know what to call this exactly. I don't know the right word for this is, but the being adjacent to true truly detestable and despicable actions, not to say criminal actions That's also pretty pervasive in this in this administration, right? It is. And it also just is the danger. This is Oviously something that is much more acute on the right, but occasionally, you know we see in left media that I like to comment on why this is important, like Participating in conspiracy theory culture is dangerous in ways it's hard to predict just is And like you get into this world where You have people that are you know are mentally unwell and like they attach onto your conspiracy theories And something like this happens. I mean, like This is not wholly unconnected kind of what the situation was with Tina Peters. obviously Tina Peters didn't murder somebody but what was The underlying corrupt act in that story, Well was that she was like so convinced that the elections were stolen that she tried to rig the machines herself, right or going to the machines to get proof of it, right againgst the rules, right? Like That type of thing happens, right? People become so convinced of something, they try to make it through. It's not it's pizza gate, right? It's the guy showing up to the basement of the pizza parlor with a gun when like you participate this type of conspiracy culture and advance these conspiracies. you know, it should not be surprising what. In Orlando, meetings reach another level thanks to a growing list of award winning restaurants, a world class convention center, a great hotel community, easy access for the airport, and of course, the weather. Andrew Moyys, VP of Fanxpo HQ had this to say about Orlando Orlando really can be that destination where you can innovate, collaborate and look into the future. And that's what makes Orlando Unbelievably real. Learn more at Orlandoverorbusiness. com Hi everybody, It's James and Andy here from your next favorite podcast, No Such Things A Fish. Yes, we are two fourths of a group of people who love facts and we love to find new facts and we come here every week and tell each other about them. For instance its Andy, did you know that one of the world's oldest cycling road races is getting much harder because people keep stealing the road I want to know more already, but I'mead gonna tell you my new fact, which is that some ancient coffins from the seventeenth century have faces. The coffins have faces. Really c. Not just on the inside. No. Wow, if you like the sound of those facts or indeed facts in general, then come and find those noisings of fish wherever you get your podcasts comes of it Do we end with soner Are there any of the burning stories that you have on your mind that you want to cover? No, we've covered them. So great England Mexico game last night was very fun to watch The Brits now head against the Norwegians. I noticed in your Twitter feed There's a historic reference about the last time the Brits and the Noral Legans met. What do you know about the Battle of ten sixty six? The the Battle of Hazes I don't, but some Brit needless to say, was talking about how they lost that battle. they defeated the Vikings in that battle. They then lost to William the Conqueror coming from France, so they still have to make up for their French defeat, but he's hoping that they defeat Norway for the first time in a the leting get my spouse Battle the Stanford Bridge Yeah. That Norwegian dude Holland is a beast though. I've been intrigued by that. So the joy that has been brought to the World Cup, similar to the Nick joy Yeah. Donald Trump obviously has to try to ruin everything and like involve himself and everything. We cannot There is no part of the human existence that Donald Trump does not want to get his little tentacles onto, his little tiny little orange digits. He wants to touch everything and make Everything tainted by his burnt orange aura And's as such it has happened here American player Its I don't fucking know. I'm not a soccer person. seemeem like a pretty ticky tack red card to me. If you get a red card, you can't play in the next match. Um, peopleeople, I think seem to be rightly outraged about this to me So he was going to r out for the game against Belgium, which takes place this evening The FIFA and which it gave Trump, you might remember the FIFA Peace Prize I don't know if they've given anyone a FIFA prize for literature or science yet, but they have handed out a FIFA Peace prize to Donald Trump. U they rescinded the red card. it only happened one time before in nineteen sixty something to a Brazilian. And Trump is now taking credit for this kind of cheekily, said that they called IF There's been of conflicting reports on how many times he called aggressive he was, etc I kind of don't care, but You know, it's unfortunate The right thing to do, somebody that does not a Megalom andic like Trump, even if he did call, the right thing to do would be to say he did not If you were to say that righteousness prevailed here, you know, that that the player had not committed the red card. And so it was smart of FIFA to rescind it and honorable and fair That's that's not what they're going for fair play So anyway, he's back which is good news for the Americans. But I don't know, it's, you know, similarly to Trump showing up toame game four of the nextix is my comparison. I mean, I seemed like a tiky taky red card and we joked in the warorning shots, I think on Thursday, morning Trump's whatever was Trumps a m boss, he should be arranging this stuff. We didn't really think he would. I mean, if you were incidentally if you wanted to do this and way that didn't make one kind of conflicted almost by watching him here. because you know it was really, even if it's a bad call, they probably should have let it gone by the rules of the game once the call was made and everyone was preparing for a game in which you wouldn't play If he was going to do it, he could have done it through an intermediary and that head of FIFA is such a tool and he's such a know, Toty to Trump that he probably would have made it happen anyway. But Trump can't resist, right? He has to let it be known that he personally called and he's been on top of this and all that. So I think that's They had a FIFA that guy theyve out I gott to say the World Cup was terrific. So someone, some people of FIFA know what they're doing Guy who runs it whose name is escaping me He seems like a total creep and Some someone had a funny comment on Twitter Maybe this is Toby Petor or someone like that or one of the guys from one of the Obama people. Did the contract with Fox require that we have a that they move, they show us this head of Fifu, no one caresino ino Watching the game from the stands every thirty minutes. It's really like ludicrous. You know, they go to him more often To their credit, they don't seem to go to politicians. They don't interview politicians. and you get a pretty straight ninety minutes of soccer football, as they say, and you get good commentary by former great soccer players That inf Fantino guy could do without, you. It's kind of how I feel about Ruda too as we go to NATO. It's like I understand that sometimes as part of your job you have to deal with this asshole that we our country elected president twice and that there's certain things that you need to do to kind of make things move along Some people suck up to them with a little too much relish. And it's in the eye of the beholder, but for me, both Inantino andruda have fallen on the wrong side of the relish line And it's like they seem to be enjoying it They seemed to kind of like it in the end and maybe even like Trump S these people come to like Trump. And it seems like that happened to Bill Mher. like they they get there and they're There's something about them that appeals I'm lucky don I don't have that gene at all. I can see it. He was a successful C manan for all those decades and Cman always have some ability to get people to like them, right? That's how the con work fors, I think And the one time he called me in twenty fifteen, after I wrote the initial weekly standard editorial, saying we could ever, of course, support Trump, but I actually that arged this was his Jun July twenty fifteen I suggested that politicians probably could learn something from Trump's success. There's more of a mood out there than some of us realizeed that was one of the few things, one of my occasionally correct points. But I said, of course, we could never support Trump And Trump called me, I think I told this end you know, Oh, you'll come around, Bill and all this. And you know, he has that kind of jocular backslapping kind of New Yorky manner on the phone that I wasn't deeply moved, I wasn't moved at all by it. I will say but. I remember thinking when I hung up or put down my phone that, you know, I could see how we can sort of get people to Th God K he's not a bad guy, you know, kind of a back sllapping sort of type of thing. Just objectively, that's a good interpersonal trait is somebody like you and me who write about people in the public eye or tweet about people in the public eye occasionally There's a much less appealing trait of other famous people, which is when you do that to call and like bitch and moan and talk about how unfair it is and try to work you over And it's like, okay, and like that's That's a turn offff And if you're somebody like me when someone does that, that makes me want to shit on you more So it backfires. And so Trump does it in a way that's like he's also hurt he's also complaining, right? But But like you said, the jocular, it's just a better interpersonal way to handle it. And so he does I just by all accounts, like in private, he wins people over