Haunting in Flagstaff Apartment

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Are you telling me you built a time machine how about the warrior time is but a stubborn illusion I have a lot of memories of the past people are time traveling within themselves time travel is possible this was all circulating around the base that a giant had killed but no one was supposed to talk about it . I saw three long bony fingers reach up underneath the door, curl up to grab it and then disappear When he came over to me , dude he slithered over to me . And this giant comes out of the cave and they're all fro zen. And he starts running and firing at this giant. So the giant moves, he's got a spear in one hand and he's running really fast and spears Dan and holds him up like this. Somebody else, shoot him in the face, shoot him in the face. They basically decapitate him . Got faster, got faster, got faster. When he got about 15 yards away from me, that raised that 12 gigs not blow this head off I feel something pulling at my leg and I look over and there are two small gray entities pulling it and they're literally I'm getting pulled off the bed. I reached my hand into this bush and I touched air. Couldn't breathe and I couldn't move because I know I'm seeing a monster . Okay , I'll reload it. Yep . Okay, tonight I have a great guest coming on. I have Amy. Amy, how you doing? Good. How are you doing? I'm doing great. I'm doing great. Uh, every time I do a recording on a Saturday, I tend to have a little bit more energy because I'm not just coming home from a 12-hour work shift, so it's kind of nice. Um definitely. You email ed me um actually it wasn't that long ago actually. It was back in April. And uh you have quite a few experience here uh that you listed with UFOs and you also have some more, you know, demonic uh haunting type story you'd like to share. And so let's just start off with the UFO sightings that you've had. Where were you? When did this happen? And uh just kind of walk us into it. Sure. Um so the first time I saw anything I was about eleven or twelve, so this is like ninety-four, ninety-five. Um and I can't remember if it was early spring or if it was like just transitioning into fall. But it was after school and I was um playing I was learning to play tennis and I was taking lessons at this place called Dick Braden's Tennis Academy and this is down in Orange County, California, in a gated community um known as uh Cota de Casa . And uh at this point I had been I'd been playing for like a couple years and I was starting to get really good. I had like hit a new level. And my coach at the tour time, Roy, he noticed this. And so he was like, hey, stay after class and we'll rally. And for people that don't play tennis rallies, basically you're just hitting the ball back and forth without a serve. And so we were doing that and um the way the courts were situated, this is like so it's called tennis college and there's multiple tennis courts. There's a huge viewing deck. There was something that was like um you know like the the baseball practice things they shoot the balls out at you and you hit them with the bat. They had something similar to that. So this is like a tennis compound really. And the court that we were on was just outside the like pro shop and this viewing deck. And my mom was on the viewing deck and the viewing deck like only went out like about halfway over the court. And so she was on the same side of the court as my coach Roy, so they were like both facing me . And I can't r I think I'm pretty sure he hit the ball at me, but I didn't hit it because I was like beyond the courts, there's all these trees and these trees back up to what's known as Tribuco Canyon. And I was waiting for the ball and then all of a sudden like I see this huge light and it was like it had to have been about as long as the football field. It was massive. It was maybe fift fifteen feet tall. It was dead silent. It was totally stealthy. It didn't make any noise. And it was so smooth. Like it I mean I know like when you see a plane in the sky, they look smooth too, but this looked so much smoother in terms of like how it was moving. And it was pretty close. Like the thing couldn't have been any farther than like two hundred feet away. And it was massive and like I just I was holding on to my racket and I could hear I could hear my mom calling for me and I could hear Roy but I could not respond to them because I was just so So wrapped up in what I was seeing. It was just this huge long cylindrical light. Now I was looking at it and I can't I couldn't wouldn't be able to tell you like what the shape of it was. Like sometimes people take pictures or they videotape like something that looks like a cigar. That was definitely the shape, but like whether it was a square, like I was only seeing the profile of it, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. And it was like really, really bright. It was like white in the center. And it was like almost like looking at the sun. Like if you were to look at the sun for a second, it almost had that appearance, but it wasn't like radiating light. It was the light was like contained within this shape. And it probably took like 10 seconds for the whole thing to pass . But I was just like I was just staring at it and they didn't was going on with me. My mom was like calling at me 'cause she thought that I was like hyperventilating or like having a seizure or something like that. And I snapped to it and like I just remember my coach where I was like, Well that's that's enough for today. And I was just kind of stunned. Like I just didn't I mean I I had heard of UFOs, like I I I've always been open minded. My family's very open-minded. I at the time, like I used to like that show sightings or whatever, but I was still stunned because I wasn't ever expecting to see anything like that. Anyway, we we got back in the car and my mom's like, What was going on with you? Are you okay? Are you sure you're okay? Blah blah blah. And I was like, Yeah, I'm I I'm okay, but I saw this light, you know, and I told her about it. And she was, you know, she she believed me. She didn't doubt me. Um I mean she saw it happening to me, you know? L sheike saw what that I was that something was going on, but she would have never no one would ever be oh she must be looking at a UFO. She thought I was like dying or something. Um so we uh we went home and then later that night um on the ne ws, there had been people in Tuston, which was a like it's still a part of Orange County, it's just a town farther north, and this thing was traveling north. Um they people in Tustin had seen some kind of light and I find it really improbable that it would be a different w excuse me, a different one. So um so yeah, that's that's the first one. Um and then it was let me yeah, let me ask you a question. Uh when you saw this, you said it was fifteen fifteen feet tall, about that . Yeah, it must it must have been like fifteen feet tall , but like like three hundred feet long. Gotcha. You know? Yeah, it was huge. It was just this huge light. It like took up like pretty much like all my vision you know it's just there. And so no nobody else said they saw it. I mean your coach he was after that he's like okay I guess that's enough for today. Do you think that he saw anything or do you think he was just like, okay, this girl's acting weird? No, it was behind them. Like I was facing I was facing them. They were facing me, and this thing was behind so like behind the court that we were on was another court, then these trees, these like I guess I don't oak trees maybe at behind the courts, and then the hills. And this thing was behind the trees. So they didn't they wouldn't have been able to see it. But they saw me reacting to something, but they you know, like I'm sure he thought I was just tired 'cause I had already practiced today. I I don't know what he thought. Yeah. Well that's I mean that's that's pretty fascinating that it's happened in the middle of the day and that it was uh you said it was it was light, but it wasn't admitting light, right? It was like kinda contained . Yeah, it's not like um like like okay, so like the trees that are that are like in front of it, right? I there was no light cast onto the trees . It was self contained, like like it had like a how do I describe this? It's kind of difficult to describe. I'm sure. Um Yeah, I I don't know like maybe like a glow stick or something. Like it it's it's lit up but it doesn't really em emit light onto other things. Yeah, or like a um like those uh the like the swords and uh like Star Wars. Like more like that. Like that. Like where you see like the border you see the border of the light and then the you know the the actual light on the inside, but it wasn't emitting light. So it's not like rays or anything. Okay, gotcha. Well I mean, welcome to the world, eleven or twelve year old girl. Yeah. And that's just the beginning of uh some things, right? Yeah, absolutely. Actually like most of the things that have happened have happened during the day. Um so like the next time I saw something was like years. This is like eight years ago. So I was like twenty-seven. So this was a huge gap. Um I was living in San Francisco at the time. I was living on Hate Street and Lyon. Um and I was living with my friends. Uh I'm gonna give her a different name. I was living with my friend Amanda. Um , and uh I was like in the bath and she was out on the deck, and I started I heard her like screaming bloody murder. I was like washing my hair and so I was like, oh my God, like I think someone's attacking her. So I like leapt out of the tub and I ran out there. And I got like soap in my hair and I'm I run out to her on the deck and she's pointing up in the sky and she's looking up and she's like, what is that? And I looked, and it was just this this orb, this blue orb, really, really high up in the atmosphere. Like like when you're out in the country and you're stargazing, you know, you see the satellites, you know, it was like way up high like that. Okay. But it was this perfect blue orb. And it given the distance, you know, this thing, this this thing must have been huge. Now it to me it looked like a blue orb, but I realized like m I don't know, make perhaps that could have been something metallic, but it was just sitting there and we were like , you know, watching the clouds go over it and it would stayed there, stayed stationary in the same spot, and then eventually some clouds passed and and it was gone . So that was like the second time I saw something. Um the third time, this one to me is the most interesting because I I haven't heard actually this is part of the reason why I wanted to share because I was thinking like maybe somebody else out there that listens to your show has seen something similar to this because I haven't ever heard anyone describe something like this. Um but I was living in San Diego at the time and my dad lives in Scottsdale. So I was driving out to visit him and this is like I don't know, ten, eleven at night, something like that. And um I got this feeling to look to my left, right? So I'm headed east, so I'm looking north. And in the northern direction, there's like this strand of dark blue lights, um, like royal blue, okay, like really, really blue. And they're it's not like um they're not like evenly spaced apart or anything like that, but the way this thing is moving, I wanna say maybe it's like thirty feet long, something like that. Um and the like tail end of it would splay open and then shut. And when it shut, it would project itself forward. It would like shoot forward. It kind of reminded me of like a water bug or something when they spread the legs and then they squeeze them together and they shoot forward in the water. That's how exactly how this was moving. And this, you know, I also didn't hear any noise and this like shot forward like several times and then it was just completely out of sight like maybe four or five times . So that was the third thing that I've seen. And this that's the one that's at night and then there's another one at night. But the next one that I saw, this was during the day, this was broad daylight. This is in like on the flight path for um the Phoenix International Airport. I was at this is like four years ago. Um, so I was attending Mesa Community College and I had a science class in the morning, and between my science class and my science lab, there was a break. So typically like I would go to my car, I'd eat a snack, I'd fiddle around on my phone, whatever. So I was sitting in my car and I'm yeah, I get the feeling. I get the feeling look out the window. So I look out my windshield and you know it's a really bright blue like typical Arizona day. Sky is like sunny, there's no clouds, nothing. Um and I see this blue orb and this blue orb is probably like 200 to 300 feet uh up in the air and then pretty pretty close to me. Um so like meaning that like it was two hundred to three hundred feet off the air if you were to like step twenty feet in front of my car and then go straight up. So I'm watching this thing and I'm like, wow, like, what is that? And it looks like perhaps it was the size of like if a if an average size person were to or average size man were to like hunker down and get in the fetal position real tight or like do a cannonball in the pool is probably about that size. Okay. So it's it's pretty large. Um but again, this is like a blue light. It's like a like a it's kind of like the white thing, the the first light that I saw, but it's blue. Okay. And I'm watching it and I am out of my car at this point. And then all of a sudden this other orb just appears. It just appears out of nothing. Um and they continue to fly in like this south western um trajectory. So like the thing about this is like I so I later that day I gone home um I was I was living with my dad at the time and I told him about it. He was like, well, maybe it was just an airplane or something. I'm like, no, because I, you know, Mesa is east of the Phoenix International Airport. So you see airplanes flying in and flying out all day long. Like it's really common sighting. I know what a plane is. And then on top of that, Mesa Community College is right next door to a hospital. So there's these helicopters constantly going in and out and they make noise. You know, they've got some very distinctive features . That was not this. Plus like this the other one just appeared out of nowhere. And you know, these aren't like I don't know, they it doesn't they didn't seem like craft, but yet they were intelligent because they were you know, it's like they the way they were flying, they were flying with intention. They were going somewhere. Um and I feel like they wanted to be seen because otherwise why would you be appearing like that in like a really busy metropolitan era area unless you wanted to be seen? Yeah. Um so like so yeah, there's that. Also if I if you want me to slow down or you want to ask any questions, that's fine. Um No, go ahead. Continue. Okay. Um so that was that one. And then um so later later that same year, um I decided to go to this um meditation retreat in Hawaii um to study this style of meditation known as the Pasana . And uh at this retreat, um you it's basically silent, silent meditation for 10 days, like you meditate all day. Um and I was like, cool, I'm gonna do that. And my friend um had also recently moved out to Hawaii to the big island to you know buy a property and stuff so I was like cool I'll see her too so I'm there and um this is a this is a retreat where like they did have some housing on there, but they were like really primitive structures. But the majority of us were camping. Okay, so there was this main house on the property, and that's where the kitchen was. So like every all the meditators, everybody there that's there for the sit , they eat there um, you know, three times or twice a day and then, you know, then nobody none of the meditators have anything to do with that area. That's area is really more for the volunteers that keep the camp run ning. So the women and the men are separated. So the women's camp, you know, we all had our tents set up under this this tarp. Okay. And we're also in the jungle of this area of the Hawaiian island known as Pahoa. Um so it's just like it's everything's off the grid. Um you know, it's really dense, really lush, beautiful, beautiful place. Um there's also not you don't have like street lights and stuff like that out there. There's not there's really not a lot of light pollution um on the island in general. So um one night and I like I don't know, I feel like this is like several days in. Um you know, I was exhausted. Like you'd you'd think that sitting and meditating is not exhausting. It's totally exhausting, especially if you've never done it before and I had it. So every night at 9 30 when the day's meditations were all done, you know, I would pass out and I'd get my sleep, you know. Um, but this one night , um it always so this is a rainforest and it rains a lot. Um and you know, when when it rains on a tarp it's it's pretty loud. Um but I had, you know, grown accustomed to it now, like it didn't bother me, but it this one night, like it was like somebody just cranked up the volume, you know, they they turned it up to eleven and uh and I just shot up out of bed. But when I shot up , you know, I was in this light and it was a really, really bright light. Like it looked like um like stadium lights, that kind of brightness . And I'm listening and like every every person in my camp, like I hear snoring , you know, like nobody's nobody's rustling around, nobody appears to be awake, but there's this fight. And I'm like, huh. And then it dims out. And then like a minute later it comes back on again. And I was thinking like , that's really weird that they would put on like the the people that are running this meditation retreat, that they would put on lights that bright, like in the middle of the night, like one one o'clock in the morning or something. And um so I was like, okay, that's that's weird. And I was like trying to ignore it, but it just this light kept coming on and fading off, fading on and fading off. And I had a little camp clock and I started to like time it. And these are not like um it wasn't you know like you have a light on a timer , so like okay it'll go off at this time and it's it's really regulated. Th the way this the the pattern of it coming on and coming off was not at all regulated. Like it was always approximately a minute in between, but it varied, you know, it'd be like, oh, this is like forty six seconds and now it's back on again, or it's fifty four seconds and then it's back on again. Or it's off again. Whatever. Um and I just like I don't know, I kept getting this feel ing like something was outside and something wanted me to come outside. And it felt dark. This is the only time I've ever like aside from like the hauntings and stuff, this is the only time I felt like if I had gone outside that something would have happened to me. That not not necessarily that whatever was outside was evil necessarily, but just that something would have happened to me that would have been foreign and scary. And so I did not go outside. And I and I eventually eventually I got back to sleep. And so breakfast the next mornings at like 6 a.m. I go to the the kitchen window and I knock on it because so it's a silent retreat. You don't talk to other students that are studying with you, but you can talk to the people that are running it in case you need anything. So I knock on the door and I'm and I want to ask them about the light. Um and I really want to ask them about it more because I just want to like make myself feel better, like nothing weird happened. Um so I was like, hey, I just you know, I just wanted to see if maybe you guys could keep the light off that, you know, was turned on last night in the middle of the night 'cause it was so bright like I couldn't sleep. And the girl that had met me at the door like twisted up her face gave me like a weird look and she just walked away. I was like, okay, that's that's a weird response. And um then uh she came back and the manager was like , there's no light. There's no lights anywhere on the property. The only lights that are in the property are right here, like in this building. And the distance between the building and where our camp was was Was like hundreds of feet apart. Plus, there's like hu ge trees and bushes and flowers and stuff in between. So there's no light on this property. There's no light on the road. There's there's no sl no light anywhere on any of the surrounding properties. It's it's kind of primitive out there, you know? Um and I just like I don't know, I my heart kinda sank when I heard that 'cause I was like, damn, like that something really was there. Like something was there . Um so yeah that was that was the last time that I like saw anything I mean I that wasn't like a a sighting like out in the sk y, but it was I don't know, like I guess on theme for what's happened with me, like these encounters with light in some form, you know. You know, with these UFO settings that you had, uh I wanna ask you, it's usually one of the last questions I ask people, and I want to ask you this right away. What are your thoughts on what UFOs are to begin with? Oh , you know, it's kind of changed over time. Um it's actually changed recently, actually on account of listening to listening to like your show and like other shows out there. Um I used to think that That these were crafts that were made by other intelligent civil civilizations outside the planet. Okay . But like I started, you know, listening to other people's experiences and stuff where where things would just appear out of nowhere and like I've I've seen that before. And then like thinking about okay, this is like interdimensional. Um and then I've heard things where it's like they're not light they're they're not like beings from other planets, these are like demons. You know, this is like a spiritual thing. And that that kind of m got to me 'cause I was like, well , you know, it's true. Like I never saw a craft. I've only ever seen light. You know, and like if if uh if you know Lucifer is the bearer of light, you know, I'm like, I don't know. Maybe maybe that is what the maybe this is a spiritual thing and not uh an extraterrestrial thing. Or maybe it's both. I mean, I I don't know. I don't I don't know what they are. All I know is that you know, four out of the five times I did not feel anything malevolent. It was it was just fascinating. Like I was something inside me told me to look, something that something inside me wanted me to experience this, you know. And then one time it did feel malevolent and so I didn't want to participate. So in in that way, like I do wonder if if maybe it's spiritual, you know, and not not the other thing. Yeah, and I I've definitely heard that before with the whole spiritual aspect and and it's hard to wrap your mind around when it comes to this kind of stuff because you know if it's spiritual , how does that even work? You know what I mean? Because it's just so it's so like um different. And you know the fact that you know you you said that the four out of the five times you didn't feel afraid or anything like that. Uh and like you said, I mean it might be both. Maybe there are uh UFOs that come from other galaxies or something like that, and uh that's real, and maybe that it is also a spiritual thing, too. Uh when you saw Yeah. Those lights that you saw uh was it like one straight line of lights and then at the end it kind of s spread out. Is that how you how you described it? Yeah, it was like it's just a line. But then if you like if you were to like split a hair, you know that the tail end yeah the I guess the back end that was closer to me would open, but not curl, you know, it it would just open. There was like a slight bend to the arc and then it would snap and it would shoot forward. Would you would you think that um all right, so you know, we talked about being extraterrestrial, talked about being uh spiritual. What about organic? What when you describe what you're t telling me me. To it seem,s like it almost has its own I don't know, motions it the the motions it has is almost like it's in charge of itself. Uh almost like like you said, like a water uh what'd you say? It was a like a water spider or something like that where it shoots itself. Like a water yeah, like a water bud. Yeah. Whatever they're called. Yeah. Yeah. And so like and I I don't know. I mean it's you know honestly like I think anything's possible. Like I've always I've always had an open mind about all kinds of sort of stuff like this because I feel like so many people report on it, like it has to be real. Not everybody's a liar. You know? And like but within that we still don't know. Like those of us that know that stuff exists, we still don't know what it is. So like to me, it's totally open for interpretation. It could be. I mean, heck, everything that I encountered could be , you know, a living organic entity, I guess. I I don't know. I really don't know. Like I definitely always got the sense that this was intelligent. Like every single one of them I felt intelligent. There's there's some there's some kind of force behind it, you know, and and you know, intelligence I believe has a spiritual basis and I also believe it has, you know, an organic basis as well, or expression. You know, so maybe maybe what I saw was just the um the spiritual like I I I don't know. I guess I I think I get I feel like yeah, it's it's intelligent. I don't know if it's a living entity or or what . Okay. I wish I could answer that. Yeah, no, it's fine. We're just uh hypothesizing here. Uh sure. But you know, that that whole experience you had with that, you know, organic looking stream of lights, did it just disappear, or did it just move off out of the distance? How did that whole situation end? So it just kept progressing forward until I couldn't see it anymore . Okay. And it was like within five like bursts , it was gone . And it was like, you know, going progressing like along, it was headed east, you know, 'cause the highway highway eight runs east west . So it was just like shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot gone. So it moved pretty fast . It did, yeah. It was um yeah, wait, way, wait. You know, I was traveling probably like 80 miles an hour and it was like it schooled me like in this matter of seconds. So yeah. Wow. So yeah, I was picturing it moving slower. some For reason I was thinking that it was it was slow moving through the sky. That's really interesting. I wonder if it I wonder if anybody's ever seen anything like that. That's really interesting. I I don't know. That's that's that was the first that was my first inclination was like I should like I should contact that show. Uh 'cause I kinda wanted to see if like anybody had ever said that 'cause yeah, it was it was really it was really weird, unique uh experience. Absolutely. It was it was unique even in terms of what I've encountered, so Yeah. Um you mentioned that you were in Hawaii and you were on a type of meditation, you know, retreat, and you said that you weren't used to meditating and you were exhausted after the first day. Uh what and I'm just curiosity is you know getting to me. What about meditation exhausted you on the first day? Because I mean my assumption was meditation's relaxing, it's chill. But uh what about it that puts you in in a a state of mind where it just takes so much energy ? Oh, it takes a lot of energy. Um so so I had uh I had gone out there, I had found the Possumat, because I watched a movie called Um Dhamma Brothers, which is basically these violent inmates were exposed to this style of meditation and they healed, you know, they became remorseful for the things that they had done. They had uh their lives improved dramatically even though they were still in prison and it was very effective and I was like, wow, if it was effective for them, it'll be effective for me 'cause I I''veve had had depression actually since I was around eleven. I've had really, really severe depression. And so I was kind of desperate at this point. I wanted to to go and try it. Um and to sit at home and sit for five minutes to an hour in meditation, that's one thing. But this is you you go for ten days and you become a monk. You eat twice a day. There's no talking. You meditate basically from 4:30 in the morning until 9:30 at night with those two breaks. Um and you know, when you're alone in your car or just with yourself in general, you're aware that you're thinking, you're aware that your mind is always going. Okay. But when you're in that environment , the silence is deafening and that the the voice in your head, the thoughts, it becomes so loud and you're trying to focus and you become you become acquainted with what's known in the meditation community as the monkey mind. It's just always going, going, going, going, going, and and you just keep trying to bring it back to your breath. You keep trying to bring it back to the sensation. And it's just trying to to to calm the mind, trying to get accomplished what you're trying to accomplish can be exhausting, especially if you have never done it before. And I had I had gone from never meditating nada to meditating for 10 days, you know, over 12 hours a day. Wow. You know, plus like you're sitting there and your your body gets like you have pain. You know, you you have you're not used to sitting for sixteen hours a day on the ground with your legs crossed so you like the back hurts, like it's it's an intense experience. You're um you're learning a new type of mental exercise. That's essentially what it is. It's just mental exercise. So it's you wouldn't think that it would be . I mean maybe other people don't experience it that way, but for me, I was like, yeah, 9 30, I was like out . Just done. I'm sure I'm absolutely sure. I mean, once you said sitting cross-legged on a hard ground for that long, yep, that's exhausting to me because I got a I got a horrible back. And I if I sat cross-legged on on my couch for 30 minutes, I'd have some severe pain. And to do that for that long, holy cow, yeah. I now let me ask you this question. I know this is off topic, but and we'll get back to the show in a second here. But I want to ask you this question. Uh with meditating like that, it is tiring in the sense that did you have a hard time not falling asleep? Because I think I would . Oh yeah, no definitely. There were it was yeah. There's so yeah, it's it's interesting, like I think I think everybody should should do these courses 'cause they're free and it has nothing to do with religion. People of all religions come and they practice this this style of meditation, but it is a mental exercise and it's funny, like when you as the observer, okay, as the as the observer of the person that is thinking all of the things. So there's the separation. It's like like becoming acquainted with your soul. Okay. And you're you're now looking out at the activity of your brain from your soul's perspective. Your brain will start doing all kinds of things to make you stop. It's like uh it'll make you tired, uh you'll start getting cravings for things. You'll you know, y th you'll start really battling with the pain in your back or wherever it's going on in your body or you'll you'll start itching everywhere. Like there's your your brain will come up with all these distractions. You know, so that's just that's just part of it actually. Like and even when the ten days were over, when you finally get to talk to the other meditators, you find out that, man, we're all so much alike. Everybody goes through the same things. Everybody's mind was driving them crazy. You know what I mean? They're just yeah trying to trying to learn this new technique. Um so yeah. Yeah. Does that answer your questions? Absolutely, absolutely. The other day I was driving my truck and I was kind of thinking about similar things. I was thinking to myself, I wonder what it would be like if I took a week off from work, like a vacation week, and I went away by myself, you know, up in the mountains, you know, in a cabin, no no I wonder what it would be like you know mentally for me because I move so fast and I have I do so much stuff and I it's just constantly mov ement for me that I wonder what it would feel like anymore just slowing down to the point where I have literally nothing to do for seven days straight and it's just me by myself and my thoughts. And it actually terrified me. It actually terrified me to think that I'd be alone by myself that long and I'd actually have time to think about my actual thoughts. And it's like that that's kind of scary to think about when when you're so used to going through the motions of day day in and day out, run, run, run, run, run for twenty hours a day, get four hours of sleep half the time and you're back at it again. And uh, you know, it's it's yeah. Anyways that's good. Yeah, no, it's true. It's it's really it's an interesting uh I think I think you know w like if you were to do that, I'd highly recommend going to some kind of um meditation retreat because it gives you the discipline. There's a discipline in examining those thoughts. Let's uh keep it moving here. You've had these haunting experiences and it's it's pretty fascinating, so why don't you just walk us into how this whole thing uh started for you? And this was all these happened did the all these happen after the UFOs or they kind of overlap each other? They they do overlap. Um so all of this kind of started out at my grandma grandmother's ranch or my grandparents ranch um when I was a kid. Uh so this is in um this is in the an area of of Arizona called Tolome, Arizona. And they had a ranch. It's like a 60-acre ranch. And uh they had multiple buildings and um I loved it there. There were tons of animals. There were peacocks and a donkey and ducks and cats and dogs and just tons of life. And um in the house in the main house, you know, there was a like a long it's like basically a long rectangle. And the kitchen and the dining room are kind of in the front half, like where you would enter the house. And then there was this tiny little room that we called the ante room. I I don't know why it was called that, that's just what it was called. And there was a doorway, and once you passed that doorway it would open up into this long hallway and all the bedrooms were off this hallway and the living room and whatnot and at the very end of the hallway was the bathroom. Um and that door was always kept shut 'cause there were some cats that like couldn't go outside and you know, some animals that didn't along with each other, so it was just a way to cord in the boss. So that door was always shut. Um when I was a kid though, like I I loved this place. This that everything about this place felt great except the end of that hallway. Anytime I had to go in there by myself, I just like dreaded it. That was something that always stayed with me up until the the property finally was sold to another family . Um so flash like I'll and also I'll mention this. Like when I was a kid, like I had heard stories about, you know, there was um there was a period of time in the seventies and I think it was this was a popular thing back in the seventies where people were like experimenting with the occult, like at parties and stuff like that. Well, my grandparents, I guess, had you know developed a curiosity for it and they had um they had like Ouija boards. My grandpa had a crystal ball. And I guess during this time, um my grandmother started experimenting with something called automatic writing. Um do you know what that is? Yeah, I know what that is. It's like when you Okay. It's like when you kind of go into an altered state of mind and you're and you actually write something out, right? Yeah, or like something comes through you and writes it out. So apparently the story goes, and I actually later confirmed this with my grandmother when she was still alive. She actually did do that . Um and it freaked my grandfather out because it was actually fruitful and she had in like some really old school like like gothic style writing had basically predicted what's happening in the Middle East right now. Um and it freaked my grandpa out. He crumpled up the paper and like basically threw it out. Um the crystal ball and the the Ouija board ended up in another building on the property that had was the library basically had all their books. Um so that's I I feel like everything that I encountered was because of this, what that that what had happened with them long years ago . Um so when my my grandmother passed away um maybe five years ago, something like that, six years ago. And um my mom was basically she had prepared the proper ty 'cause her so the property went from my my grandmother to my mom and her sister. And I had I told you before like my um my mom didn't want anyone to get hurt because there's a lot of hunters that will just like cross through people's properties out in out in Arizona. So hunting quail or whatever. And she she was always afraid of a lawsuit that if someone were to like break in on the property or someone to walk across a property and there were all these bushes a round, you know, that a snake would get them and bite them or whatever and then they'd sue her. So she she went in after my grandmother passed away and basically ripped out, you know, all the vegetation. Everything was just gone. So it' justs like this it it looked like a dead place. Um and so at the time um that I go out there um where this you know story kind of initiates , um I was with my boyfriend at the time. His name was Drew. He was, we were going to go to this sensory awareness workshop, which is, I guess, kind of a meditation technique uhto un itself. It was for him and I it was in Tucson but I was like, well, we were living in San Diego. I was like, well, I I'm let's let's go, but I'll I'll take you to my grandmother's ranch, we'll swing by Scottsdale, see my dad, and then we'll go to your thing. And so we drove out there and you know, the last time I had seen the ranch, you know, there were trees and animals and you know, it was teeming with life. Well when we got there, everything was ripped out and it was just like this dead place and it just had a bad feeling and but regardless I was I was just like oh it's just because the plants are gone um and anyway so we got on the property and when you first get on the property, the the way the road is laid out it's like an L capital capital letter L that's been tipped over on its side. So on the right hand side there's what was called the block house, just like this little square house. There was um and then to your left, there's a longhouse uh where workers used to live. Um you make the right turn, and there's the library, what was like grandfather's office, and then the main house. But we we drive, we park at the gate, we start walking, and I'm kind of showing him this is the blockhouse, blah blah blah. This is where this happens, etc. We get to the main house, and the curtains are drawn, everything's locked up. I wasn't talking to my mom at the time. Um I didn't have a key or anything, but I just wanted to give them a kind of an outdoor tour. So we get to the area where the kitchen was, and that's on like the the short end of the house, um, meaning that it's a rectangle so it's on the short short end. And like this is the dining room, this is the kitchen where my grandmother was and so behind the main house is like another house. So you're we we turn the cor ner and we're between the two buildings . And so sorry, I hope I'm explaining this right. Just beyond the kitchen and the ante room, the first door on the left was my grandmother's room. So on the long side of the house, it would be the kitchen and then my grandmother's room. And um, so we turn that right corner, and I'm like, this is where my grandmother slept, and like we're taking a couple steps forward and then we just stopped. Like we both stopped for absolutely no reason. I don't even know why I stopped, but it was like we just stopped, uh like we hit a wall. Um and then that second, the window, um, my grandmother's window, and I I know the sound of this window, I've opened it a million times in my life, it just shot open like I heard felt I heard the grating of the metal, and then I heard this like really guttural snarl. Um it was deep and nast y and it was not an animal, it was not a person. Um, you know, I everything was clear in my field of vision . This is not you know it it was coming from inside the house, but the house is locked up and alarmed. Um Well, we're just like silent and all of a sudden I felt like this is territorial. I need I need to say right now that this is my place. So I like puffed up in response. And I was like, this is where my grandmother slept, this is where my grandfather stored the work boots for the the men that worked out here. I was trying to to to verbally claim the territory that I I was that I wasn't a trespasser, that this was that this was somehow affiliated with me, this is my place . Um because whatever it was, it it felt like like it was telling me that it was its place. Um so at this point though, like I'm puffed up but I'm like what am I dealing with in my head so I start kind of backing away. I'm still talking still talking to Drew and I start leading him back off the property. Um and he kept like kind of lagging behind me and peeking his head back as he was trying to see something. And I was like, okay. And so we just kept moving him out and we finally got into the car and we closed the doors and I look at him and I'm like, Did you hear that? And he was like, Yeah, I heard that. And I was like, So you like you know, you heard that that like snarl and growl and he was like, No, that's not what I heard. I heard like a horse whinny in a like the expulsion of the the air, like the that kind of thing. So we both heard something. We both heard something entirely different than the other person did. Um but we both felt it like you know, we we we continued to talk about it after this. Um so anyway, we leave there, we go to stop by my dad's place, it was like a surprise thing, so he wasn't there, and we head headed on down to Tucson. Um so I was in the hotel room and Drew is, you know, doing his uh workshop. And luckily, the woman that was running the workshop, you know, told him like, oh, you know, she doesn't have to pay for it. J letust her come on down so she's not locked up in the hotel room all week. And I was really grateful for that because the whole time I was in the hotel room I got the same exact feeling that I did whenever I was in my grandparents' house and I was faced with that hallway 'cause it always felt like something was watching me from the end of that hallway. And when I was in this hotel room I felt that same feeling. Like something something was just staring at me. And and it wasn't, you know, it was just like this And um so you know, that whole weekended, we ended up going back to our apartment in San Diego and um like you know stuff like really hit the fan at this point. Um and then honestly to backtrack a little bit like when my when my grandmother was passing away, my mom was taking care of her. She had um uh dementia and so my mom had moved out there to to take care of her and everything. Well you know, there were several buildings full of like furniture and stuff like that and um this is before I was dating Drew so you know I was I was living alone and um my mom was like hey you know if you want any furniture anything just like feel free to come out and get it. I I made several trips to go out there. I helped take care of my grandmother on the weekends and stuff like that. So um I ended up coming back at at one point with like a dresser and I had my my grandfather's watch um and then just like some other random things from the ranch um so before that visit with Drew I had some haunting things that had happened with what I had brought back. Um so the the dresser, I always kept my grandfather's watch on the dresser. Well as soon as I brought that into the house, every night at about three a.m. and it was never like three AM, three A. M. it was like three oh one, three oh two, three oh three, something like that. But it was around three AM that I would wake up to the sound of a clock. I I did not have I didn't have a clock in the house. Um all I had was that watch and my cell phone. The watch, however, was dead. There's no battery in it. Um but was what was really weird to me, is that the sound that I heard of this clock was actually the exact sound of the clock that sat next to my grandmother's bed, this like old white plastic clock that glowed orange in the dark, and it just had this particular plasticky kind of sound as it would tick along. Well, that sound was coming from my dresser where my grandfather 's watch was. But the thing was dead. There was no battery in it. There was it was impossible for it to be making any sound. But sure enough, every night, 3 a.m. I'd wake up to this this ticking sound. So eventually I actually had to get rid of that stuff. I just like gave it to the the salvation army because I didn't want it anymore. And as soon as I did that, that activity stopped . So going forward again after I had returned from uh Tucson with Drew , like first of all, I don't think we were ever supposed to be together. So it's it's fine that we broke up. But I think things really took a negative turn as soon as we came back. Like things just got really dark between us and just weird stuff was happening in the house. Um I was waking up with like severe and I didn't think about this until years later. I didn't like put it together. I mean, I've always bruised easy, but like the backs of my legs just looked like somebody had just taken a bat to them. Like I was bruised up and down. It just like I was painted with bruises. Um and that happened several times and, you know, we were always trying to figure out like what it was and I was just like, I don't know, maybe it's like we've been going to the beach, maybe it's the waves like crashing on me. I don't know. So that was one thing. Um another thing that happened was uh I woke up one morning and I walked into my living room and um there were like hundreds of flies on the wall. Now I always you know there were screens on the windows and I keep the windows shut at night. Um, so I have no idea how hundreds the flies would have gotten in the apartments. But this was the other weird thing is that they weren't like flying around, they weren't moving, they were still. And they were just sitting there all over the wall. And I like walked out of the living room and my my heart and my stomach just sank in my body and I was just like oh my god like what am I dealing with here and so I you know went to the went to the store I liv'edd right next door to an Albertsons, walked over there, grabbed a cannerade, and like proceeded to to kill 'em all. Um but that was that was like really strange to me. That was like an omen. Um there was another time that uh Drew and I were like sitting on the couch and the way our apartment was situated is like where we were sitting on the couch, we were looking out the front window. And out the front window you would be able to see anybody that was that was walking up to the apartment. Um we were on we were on the second story. And so we're sitting there and we're like talking about like getting some ice cream or whatever. And all of a sudden there's this knock knock knock knock knock knock knock knock right on the window, right in front of us, and there's nobody there. There's no one there whatsoever. Um and I was just like, okay, you go get ice cream. I'm gonna jump online and try to figure out how to deal with this stuff. Um because that that you know, that wasn't the only thing that was happening. Like we had a cat at the time, Mr Paws, and he was a really good kitty. Like some cats like they're up all night and they're, you know, they they meow a lot. But he cuddled with me every night. And there were several nights though that I would wake up to him yowling at the front door, not moving, just looking at the front door and doing the same repetitive meow over and over and over again. Meow, meow, meow. Like just and I I couldn't get him to stop. Um there was uh also something else that kept happening where I would be like in the bathroom getting ready for work or whatever, and I would see like this shadow critter out of the corner of my eye leaping and bounding around in the apartment. And when this started happening, I I just thought, oh, the cat is jumping up on the couch or whatever. But I would turn and look, no cat there. And then I'd go into my bedroom, cat found asleep on the bed. But what I was seeing was like and the reason why I thought it was a cat was because I saw like hindquarters and a tail, like a really sharp tail though um and it was black and shadowy but I never saw the front end or the head I always saw the the back end of this thing like jumping around on stuff. Um there was an another night where um Drew and I we had a really bad argument and I got this really like dark feeling and I was just thought like if I stay here, I'm gonna get h urt. So I got a bag together and I told him I'm gonna go stay at my friend Allegra's house. And so I drove over to my friend Allegra's house and I stayed the night there. And I had a really hard time getting to sleep that night because I was sleeping on our couch. I was laying there and I I couldn't sleep because I just felt like something was staring at me. That that same really familiar feeling. Um and eventually when I did go back home , uh Drew was like I I kind of told him like, yeah, like I had a you know I couldn't sleep. Um I told him a lie and he was like he was like, Yeah, well, when you left that night, Mr. Paws and I watched this shadow figure walk after you. Wow. And yeah, just like um so eventually like eventually we split up. I ended up, I needed to like re-collect my myself and life. And so I moved out to my my dad's place to like get back in school and stuff like that. Um and I had not like I'm a Christian now, but I had not yet become a Christian . Um, but I had started using the Lord's Prayer and I had started calling out to um to Jesus and the archangel Michael. Um I'd read somewhere a long time ago that Michael's the protector of of Rachel in the Bible or something. So um I had started doing that and I did notice that there was a dissipation of activity. I had also put salt in the windows um particularly after the knock ing incident, um, put salt in the windows and stuff like that. And that that seemed to help a little bit. Um but then I I moved. So I brought my cat out to my dad and um and things had really subsided at that point. Um, but there was still like I feel like some remnant energy. And also I should say like the night, the night before I left, I said I I told whatever it was that was there, like, you can't follow me. You have to stay here. Um, so I don't know if that was something that helped. I'm I'm not really sure what helped. But anyway, I'm at my dad's house. I still have some of the items from my um grandparents' place. Like I have some paintings that my grandmother had done and uh I had the one of them up next to my bed um and that thing would rattle it would rattle on the wall like no fan no air conditioner going , just it would just start it would just start rattling. That creeped me out. And I I lived with that for actually a couple years until I I had a I was a Pilates instructor and um one of my clients was a Catholic and she had referred me to this priest and he had um given me I don't know what it is but I I'm not Catholic um but it's like a it looks like a ribbon and it has the the cross um stitched on it and he kept it it was maybe like a couple feet long. He had it folded up in his Bible, like a Bible strap or something. I don't I don't know what it's called but So he gave it to me and he said, you know, put this, put this on whatever's disturbing you in your home, and if it doesn't go away, then we'll you know we'll take other measures but just put this in put this in your home put it on put it on whatever the object is and until the problem ceases so I kept it for about a week and it sure enough it stopped. But another weird thing that happened there was uh well I moved out there, I had a MacBook Pro and it I was starting school and it was it was too old um to like accommodate a lot of the software that I had to use for my program. So I had to get a comp newuter. So I had a brand new MacBook Pro . And these things work perfect, you know? Yes, they do. And I was it was late at night and I was like watching some video and a commercial came on and I hate commercials so I put it on mute. So I put it on mute and then my computer kisses at me like like that . And I was like, oh my oh my goodness, like what am I gonna do ? Um so that was probably that was like the creepiest thing that happened at my dad's and then I did I did awaken one night to knocking at my door. Um and I had asked my dad if he had ever had anything like that happen and he said he did, but he said uh he said he just excused it like, oh I was just you know, probably just dreaming or whatever. And and then he also had said something like, Well I think if you talk about these things that you're you're inviting more of it in , you know. So I was like, oh, I don't know, but it possibly maybe that's why stuff happens to me all the time. Um so that that's that's that kind of period of time. Um I've had other things happen like uh a long time ago I was listening coast to coast to coast and there was a gentleman on there who wrote a book um called Adventures Beyond the Body, the out-of-body experien ce book, and he basically spells out like how to do it and he had received all this benefit from doing it. And I was like, Oh that sounds cool. Like I'd like to do that. So I followed his uh I followed his his teaching, which is basically like every night you say before bed you say m a mantra like I'm out of my body. That's it. And then you go to sleep and within thirty days it'll happen. Um well s true. It that's all it takes. Um and I did that and uh it was the I forget what year it was, but it was the year that the movie Monster came out and the reason why I remember that is because the night that it happened, um, I went to see that movie with my friend Matt. And uh so I came back from that movie and it's nighttime, and I I go to sleep, and I I say this time I say I'm out of my body, now I'm out of my body, now I'm getting help, getting out of my body. Okay. So as I'm falling asleep, I felt like if you hold your hand up to somebody else's hand but you there's a space, you can still feel the heat of the hand, you know? Right. I it felt like the heat of hand going in circles above my chest this night when I fell asleep. So I wake up and this is why I know this is not a night terror. Okay. I I had never had night terrors anyway, but this is not a night terror because I got up at one o'clock in the morning. I'm totally awake. I sit up, I roll over, and as I roll over, I in my head I was like, oh God, it's happening now. And so one of the things that he describes in the book is this phenomenon where it's like your soul is separating from matter, and that you feel this like really intense vibration. Well, that's no joke. That's exactly what I felt. And it was overwhelming. But I thought I'm I'm totally awake, I've rolled over, and I'm just feeling these waves of the most in intense vibrations. I've I've never felt anything like it in my life. Um and it was it was like these waves. It was like I had invited something to help me. I don't know what that is . You know, I wasn't specific and I, you know, kinda learned my lesson. Uh whatever it was, it did not feel benevolent at all. It kept it felt like it would kept trying to force me out of my body. Um and I just was like trying with all my strength to call for my father down the hall and then, you know e,ventually this this took minutes and that's a long time when you really want something to be over. Um, I finally got it off of me. But I I'll tell you this, like even to this day, it never happens at night but it to this day sometimes when I take a nap I'll feel that again and actually this is kind of funny. Um my so my my my dear one, my love Colin , like he he does not like to wake me up because I'm not somebody that should be awakened ever. Like I really like my sleep. And um one time I was like I was napping and he was like playing video a game or whatever on his phone. And I felt it. And the again, this is like another situation where it was like all my strength. And I was like, help me . Help me. And he like looked at me and he looked away and satisfying his video again because he didn't want to he didn't even want to bother waking me up. So I had to kind of live through that one. Yeah, so like that happened and then uh yeah Colin and I lived in um in Flagstaff, Arizona for a while before we moved up here to Washington. Um and we lived uh down the hill from um this observatory. I forget what it's called, but it's like it's a Catholic observatory. I think it's the only one in northern Arizona. Um it's a really beautiful campus, it's foresty, forested woods or whatever. And so we'd leave our apartment and we'd we had a dog at the time and we'd walk her um up the path and we'd go to this observatory. We'd just go to the nature around it. Anyway, we'd always pass this neighborhood. Um and I always just got a dark feeling. I I just didn't like it. And we were walking back one day and I I told him, I was like, I just feel like somebody's yelling at me. Like every time I come by here, I feel like someone's shouting at me like they want something . And the the the person that I always imagined was like um like an average like five foot ten male um kind of bulky and shaved blonde hair and like blue eyes. And um we had found out that there was a cop that was actually gunned down in that spot. Um there was actually a memorial for him. And I so we came home from this walk and I just wanted to draw. I I just wanted to draw up this person. And and I looked up who that guy was. And that's the person that I drew was was that man. And I feel like he was just that once I figured out like that's that person, I was like, he's really upset about how he died. That's he's like wants he wants somebody to know what happened to him. You know? Um there was another time in that house in that apartment where we were lying there before going to sleep and Colin was like, Do you feel that? And all of a sudden like on my face it was just ice cold and I could not get it off. And I was like, Yeah, I can't get it off and I like waved my hand and then it was gone. Um there was another time this this one I really that I felt really violated when I heard about it. Um I was sleeping and Colin can be kind of a night owl so he was up doing whatever he was doing and um he picks up on things that I don't pick up on. Like I think I'm I'm pretty sensitive, but he's he's sensitive in another way, you know, and um he sees like I don't really see stuff. I don't see like spirits. I s I kind of saw a shadow critter, but I don't, you know, like some people see apparitions. Like I think he'd be the person that sees apparitions. I I don't. And I think that's because God knows that that would really scare me. I just don't want to see it. Um but anyway, that this night, like there's this there was this like black like cloud. There was something something up on the ceil ing. And Colin had um the uh what's it called 'em? You know, they're like you get you get the apps on your phone where you can like communicate with the spirits or whatever. Like the T kind of thing. Yeah. So he had something like that and he was uh he was like asking it um you know what are your in intentions here and all of a sudden I out of my mouth comes I'm here for the soul uh for the sole purpose of helping. You said that? Yeah, I was asleep though. Like he asked this question and then that was the answer that came. Direct response to him, but through me . Yeah, that felt really creepy. Like that made me feel violated because I was like, I'm not open, I'm not open to this. Like, you know, and I'm and even now like in my life, like I'm really trying to like I you know, I pray every day, like I I'm trying to build this relationship with with my Lord, you know. Um so so yeah, like I don't know. This is this is pretty much everything that's happened to me. Um and hopefully it's over. Uh I started so I found your show through like um fast watch chronicles. Okay. And uh now that I'm in the Pacific Northwest, I'm like, well considering everything else that's happened to me, like I'd bet, like I'm sure like I'll probably see a fastwatch too. Like that's probably just my lot in life, but I hope not. Well if you do I'll be envious 'cause that's something I would love to see one day . Yeah. But you know with all those paranormal experiences that you had and stuff and you mentioned in the beginning when you first started telling these stories about your grandparents. Do you think that maybe you are I don't want to say haunted, but maybe like a a family curse or something like that ? Um I don't know. Oh, w there's one more thing I had to tell you. This actually wasn't my experience, it was my mom, so it has to do with the ranch. Okay. Do you want me to tell you? Yeah, go ahead. Okay, so my mom well actually so like the way my grandmother passed away, like she ended up in hospice, but my mom had was living out there with her . Um she my my grandmother was at the end of the hallway that I didn't like. She was in the bedroom off there. My mom was in her bedroom and my mom woke up at like three o'clock in the morning, the sound of my grandmother screaming, and all the furniture in my grandmother's room was like turned over. My grandmother was little and feeble and there was no way she could like lift I I could barely lift some of the dressers that were in that room and I was young and able, you know. Um and she had been tossed out of the bed and then quickly her health like just went kaput. She was in hospice and then she passed away. After my grandma after my mom had like clean up all the property, my mom is is on the more paranoid side. So she locks every window, she closes every blind. She is habitual about this kind of stuff. So she told me, like after after the stuff had happened with Drew, I called my mom finally. We hadn't been talking. I called her and I was like um and I thought you know this what happened out there is it really creeped me out. She was like, the day that I left that place and I'll never go back, that I had cleaned and um closed the blinds and locked all the windows. I alarmed the house and then I left. When I got into my car, because our car was facing the living room . She said the blinds were up . Like someone was looking at me. I had just closed them and they were all the way up. Totally open. And so I think that everybody's I think ever ybody's sensitive. I think there are some people that just don't want to that they want to close their mind and then there's people that have an open mind and I think that's really what the difference is. I do think that my grandparents, whatever they were experimenting with , I think that kind of unleashed havoc um in people's lives that were there that were open minded . You know, 'cause I don't think my mom's haunted to this day. Um I I'm I don't feel like I'm haunted right now, you know. I feel like I've kind of spent some time battling this stuff, but I don't know if it's a lineage thing. I I don't think so. I think everybody has it. I just think some people want to be shut off to it and some people don't. Yeah. Well, uh absolutely I agree with you. And there's a lot of things that go on that people just they either don't want to acknowledge it or uh they're they acknowledge it, but they they're scared to contemplate about it. And th this this kind of stuff is it's deep. It's really deep and it's it's hard to kind of wrap your mind around. That's why we talk about these things, you know? Mm-hmm. Yeah, definitely. Yeah, it's it's you know, I feel it's nice to share it too. Um and I I'm really grateful for your program too, because like, you know, uh I I always felt kind of weirded out that like I had all of these experiences, these different experiences. You know, like if you like watch TV or whatever, it's like this person saw a UFO once and this person had a haunting here, but it's not like this throughout their whole life. But like being familiar with your program, like I realized this it's actually really common that people have a lot of experiences in their lifetime. Yeah. You know multiple occasions, different things. Exactly. And that that's why I conduct the show the way I conduct it, because I'm I'm not a stranger to the idea of people having multiple experiences throughout their life and the you're always gonna have people out there that, you know, they're like how, can one person have so many experiences? Well, people do, and there could be reasons for that. There it may not just be that they were in the right place at the right time so many times, but maybe that they actually there's something to do with them personally that leads to these There's so many questions and uh there's so many um baffling things to think about when it comes to these types of events that there shouldn't be anything left off the table. And that's why I do the show the way I do it. That's why I don't limit the person that comes on. I let them share exactly what they want to share. Because I think that is what helps a lot of other people kind of make sense of what they experience because you know, I've seen it myself so many times throughout on on the line online community and stuff, you know, people are like, Oh, how can one person have so many experiences? And it's but yet they do. Uh and but it's funny because sometimes I was in uh I was in some kind of forum, I forget where where it was, this is a while ago, but they were talking about this very thing and they said about you know people having all these paranormal experiences and all this different types of stuff. But the very person that was complaining about it went on to talk about how uh they had a lot of miraculous things happen in their life. And I'm like, Well, wh why is it any different that you can have miraculous things happen in your life where you saw angels and you've your body was healed and, there's a couple other things, yet somebody who has uh hauntings in their life, and maybe something that's not as you know, happy go-lucky as miracles in their life, they can't that they can't they can't be telling the truth. And so it's one of those things where it it's it's frustrating for me sometimes to to deal with, but that I won't ever change the way I do the show because that's there's so many people out there that have those kind of experiences where they're one after another and it's like they need to be able to have an outlet . Yeah, sure, totally. And um yeah, actually so the way I found the way I came to to God uh or became a Christian was Colin and I uh were at this church in uh New Mexico . Um I forget what it's called. It's like a really famous it's a really famous church. Uh there's actually two on the complex and it's known because the Spaniards when they came here as conquistadors, they had gone through this area and they had found a cross. They had picked it up. They had gone on their way and when they came back there was a cross there again. So they built this church and this church is known to like heal the sick. So like when you go to this church, there's all these like leg braces and stuff on the on the side of the wall, and there's all these pictures of kids that you know people are praying for healing and everything. Well we went into this church or I went into this church and he was like walking the dog and I was looking at Mary, the stat it's like a regular like side of the road, you know, this the ceramics um shop that you see on the side of the road, like on the highway, and they've got like the the guy leaning up against a burrow or or like a cactus and then there's the the statue of Mary. This was a regular typical painted ceramic statue of Mary and someone had shoved a plastic bouquet of roses in her arms. And the way the light was coming in through the front doors of the church, it was casting the shadow, but the shadow it was casting was the exact profile of Christ with the crown of thorns. And I like jumped up. I ran and got called and I was like, you have to come see this. Somebody else has to see this. It can't just be me. And uh and that was kind of like what what like what led me to Christ was that moment because I was like that's impossible. Well yeah it's like first of all I always felt really connected to God and like you know and I've had all these experiences like you know like I really truly feel like I encountered a demon. And I feel like if I encountered a demon, then the opposite is also true. You know, and then when I saw that like the shadow of Christ from Mary, which is a whole poetic thing in it in and of itself. Like sure. Okay, that's what that's what I'm supposed to do. I am supp I was I was born and I am meant to be a Christian. And you know there's a reason why like when you call call to him in times of darkness or you're being haunted. There there's a reason why that works. And so I just finally decided to trust it . And and so that's why I I became this way. But um but yeah like I think that like people I hope I hope that people will become more open minded and people that are open that encounter these things that um you know that they'll also become like open to Christ because if you are haunted like trust in him and it it will go away and there's a reason why it works. Yeah that's what I would say. It's it's really cool to hear that. I mean uh you know , people have these different stories of how they, you know, found Jesus. And uh, you know, it it's just interesting to hear people's different stories because everybody's got a story, you know. And uh, you know, I've heard things like just recently uh friends of ours are missionaries and they are here in the States for a little bit, but they're from they they go to Egypt for their their work . And they told me that no they didn't tell me, they told my wife, and my wife told me that when they were over there, they saw a lot of crazy stuff, a lot of crazy stuff that here in America, people don't people don't talk about. I'm convinced that it happens here, but people don't talk about it. And where we live our lives in such a way where we have these blinders on where we probably don't even notice it half the time. Uh but like this this one instance, uh this guy who's a director of whatever they do over there, um, this Christian organization, uh, was cursed by somebody else and he got deathly ill, deathly sick. And he's in the hospital and he sees Jesus. Like he like he said, I saw Jesus Christ. And at that very moment that he saw Jesus Christ, the guy who cursed him was at work and dropped over dead. It's like Yeah, I mean it's just like when you hear these stories it's like wow like but you know, here in America we don't really talk about th these kind of things. I think we have a lot of blinders on and we don't really acknowledge it happens around us and it's just this kind of stuff is very real and uh, you know, the it people like you who experience these different types of things and stuff, it just takes people like you coming forward and sharing your story. And I appreciate that. I appreciate you having me on, honestly. So thank you very much. Absolutely. Well, Amy, I will talk to you later. If you have anything else you'd like to share with me, feel free to get a hold of me. Okay. All right. Thanks. Bye, Tony .