Elicitation Tactics and Human Behavior

Joe Rogan, Experience. Tin my day, Joe Rogie podcast by night. All day . What's happening? How how are you? Good.' been really good. Just got in awesome last night. I watched these videos of you describing this intravenous DMT experience. And the first thing I said is I need to talk to this guy about that. Like that seems like one of the most insane descriptions of anything than anybody's ever experienced Yeah that I've ever seen online. Yeah. So tell me about this experience. So it's DMT and This guy makes it and they put it into a pump and it's like an anesthesia pump that you'd have in like an operating room And Essentially, they can adjust your like milliliters per hour dose. likeike they would use for anesthesia and They launch you off. you're laying the space is beautiful. They hold the space really well. and They can What you mean by that? They hold the space really well? Like It's a beautiful space. like there's this amazing place where you lay down in the middle of the room. It's like on a really soft pillow thing and great music on and like it's very calm. and these people are just unbelievably calm and good human beings to take you through the experience and The cool thing about this pump is that you can adjust your altitude So like you could be in the middle of this and say, I need to go up more. I want to come down. if you need to take a pee break They'll like pull you down, you kind of go onto the runway And then you go pe and you come back and you launch right back up as high as you want to go as fast as you want to go So It's Five and a half hours And we did I did one pee break It is It's DMT And like The highest you can feel on DMT, like the most you can see on DMT, but it's five and a half hours of that And the next time I go back, we're gonna to mix Alzheimer's drugs W this. Why to see how much I can bring back So see if it improves like the retrieval. L because you know, like when when you're in the DMT space, you're like I have access to all this stuff like, oh my God, I wish I could bring this back. I want to bring this back so bad And it seems like we're protected from bringing it back. It does. It does. Like a dream. Yeah. It'ss there's real similar comparisons to the dream state Yeah, the dream state is very strange. I've had like profound dreams and or really bizarre dreams. and when I wake up they're so crystal clear. And with I go to take a pee, I have a cup of coffee. Yeah, I can't remember them anymore. Yeah. I barely barely can grip them. They just slide through your fingers. It's like we There is a protective layer there. It seems like it has to be because if there was anything that you experienced in the regular conscious state that was that profound, you would remember it forever Just think of a great thing just USC fight this weekend. I remember everything Oh my Godd, it's like drilled into my brain And that is like Nothing to a DMT experience Yeah. And it just seems like I've never met someone who's done DMT that would just Oh yeah, it's a psychedelic. It's a hallucination I've never met anybody that's actually done it and then we'll just go back and say, I hallucinated something. There's a few people that say that. I've actually I've read this one piece by this guy I forget his discipline. I forget what was serious academic and his position after, I think he did like one hundred DMT trips And his position was that this is all being concocted by your visual cortex and your brain, and your imagination It was his position, but I mean, why wouldn't you why wouldn't you go to Walmart on a DMT trip then? target? I don't think that's what. I just think You know, it's because it's very disorienting and, you know, you really should sit still. There's contrarians. No mean in the DMT space, why don't you just see a target or a seven hundred eleven or something? Right, right, right. I see what you're saying. somethingomething that your imagination could concoct. like a dream. Like in a dream, you might be a target. Yeah. And you had on Andrew Gallimore. Yes I hear. Yeah He talked about this world making part of our brain. Yes Man, that really hooked me in. And during the six hour journey ience, whatever you want to call it at the end of I mean, it's DMT. like you're Like it's just reality's gone Like you like everything, oh yeah, you see all the stuff that you think is real It's like everything's gone And then at the end of this, I On camera, I asked if I was dead thirty nine times I wasn't concerned what the answer was. I just was like, amm I dead and Coming toward the end of this experience, was bawling. I was crying And it just felt like I had to wrap myself in some kind of ego in order to just return back here. to come back There's no way for me to come back and not have some little ego thing and it made me so sad coming back that I just didn't want to come back at all. You know I'mking about? It's like Avatar depression times a million For people don't know what I'm talking about When the movie Avatar came out, it was so wonderful. exper these people seemed like to live such a righteous, peaceful existence in the forest People came back and they they were depressed that they don't live in the avatar world It was like a psychological condition. was it was happening with so many different therapists that people started calling it. Avatar depression Brilliant It's got a name. Like in the nineties there was the Truman Tau syyndrome. Right, Right, right, right R into that. But I mean, how bad ass is your fucking movie it creates a psychological condition in people that wish that reality was like your movie. Yeah I love that It did feel like that. times T ten million or whatever it is. Yeah. One of the things that I didn't know happened. wasas my wife was with me, Michelle And the night before when we were at their house, they just said, you can pick a vial and I said, let Michelle. pick pick a vial and I was in the other room and Michelle was with this guy who makes the DMT And he said, wouldould you like to pray over this DMT And Michelle did that. and I didn't I didn't even know she prayed over it. And the next day, And I'm not saying there's anything here, but When it started, the first thing that happened was like these alien beings or whatever kind of pinned me down on this table and ripped me open pelvis all the way up to my neck, like all the way open And I could hear my organs kind of moving around inside my body and they're doing something in me And the second thing was they pushed my head back up on the table and they this big drill bit went up inside of my nose, like all the way to the back of my head. It didn't hurt. There's no pain or anything And they were doing that for probably forty five minutes A long time And it was freezing cold. And then after this journey, I I told Michelle about this and she's like, that's what I ask them to do. I asked them to fix your heart and your brain. ' I have a heart thing going on and I have a brain disease which is why I was doing this in the first place And that was the first thing that happened on the journey I'm not saying there's causation. Did you get looked at afterwards to see if they did anything I ha it because they have to do a pEet scan And it's so much radiation Oh it's like it's so much radiation I can't even hug or sleep with my wife or my our two year old for like forty eight hours It's a ton of radiation What fuck that. What is the condition that you have In the brain, I have mesial temporal sclerosis. Yeah, we talked about this the last time you were here. Yeah. And I had a seizure like the night before. This is the thing that you said that methylene blue It's really helping you with. You know how many people have ripped that out of our show and like made commercials for their company and stuff out of it. Oh, I'm used to that There's so many ads for me selling everything. Yeah, from coffee makers to hard on pills This episode is brought to you by Create, the leading brand in creatreatine. You'll love their gummies, but now they've also launched creatreatine plus electrolytes mix, perfect for hot summer months. Creatreatine is proven to support gains in strength, lean muscle mass, and aid recovery, but it also has cognitive benefits energy focus and neuroprotection, plus they're NSF certified for sport and third party tested for safety and potency. Visit trycate dotcoO slash Rogan or use promo code Rogan for twenty percent off and free shipping on your first subscription order This episode is brought to you by Dodge. The new Dodge Charger Sat pack is built for people who still believe driving should be exciting. You wantan to talk about performance? Let's start with a twin turbo six pack gas engine. All gas, no mercy F hundred and fifty horsepower, zero to sixty in just three point nine seconds and a top speed of one hundred seventy seven miles an hour. 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And I'm telling you this stuff is great. My brain works on another level when I take it. There's never been a better time to try it out yourself and because when you order now through my link, you get thirty percent off and you're automatically entered to win a pair of custom MMA gloves signed by Kyone IQ co owner John Bones Jones and gold medal wrestler Gable Stehvenon Go to ketone d. com slash Rogan today, claim thirty percent off your first order and enter to win some autograph gloves. And if I don't take methylene blue for a couple days, I'll go back into seizure territory. P quick really. Yeah But I will say, just to go back to this dream thing you were talking about the way that I like get people to help like understand this. Like if you're in it I'll walk you through this really quick. Let's say you're in aream right now And I'm just here in your dream. We're chilling out hanging out and Let's say you don't know it's a dream yet. And I look over and I' say like what is that UFO spaceship over there. how far is that from your face right now? And you look over at that fly saucer thing,'d be like, eight feet or something like that But then if you know it's a dream and I ask you how far is it, you're still going to say, oh, it's eight feet And then I asked, what is it made out of? You're going to say, Oh, it's aluminum you know, whatever that thing's made out of But there's no aluminum in your brain. And then I ask again, like what is it made out of And eventually you'll get to a place where you say it's made out of me. It's made out of consciousness And then I say, what is the distance made out of that entire eight feet of distance is also made out of your consciousness And then I say, well, why did you have to manufacture eyeballs in your dream to see out of And then what are the photons? Like you're seeing colors and all the stuff in your dream. There's no photons bouncing off of stuff in your dream. The entire body is fabricated, your eyes are fabricated, like you're seeing all this stuff without your eyeballs at all. but you made up eyeballs to see it all through And then the distance, like from you to that flying saucer, you say it's eight feet. The distance is zero. L there's not eight feet inside of your brain. So it kind of walked people in to show that everything that you would do like not in a dream, like sitting here in the studio to prove that this picture of water is real. you could do Ididentical, you could do everything in a dream that you would do in waking reality to prove that something is real And then you realize that the distance between you and that thing is A made up of consciousness and B doesn't exist Do that m sense? It does make sense. It does make sense because we assume that because we have tools to measure distance and sound and touch and all those different different senses that we possess that This is what the world's made out of And it makes sense So like and there's dream logic, right? So like if you're all of a sudden riding on your rhinoceros to the pizza factory and you're like, oh yeah, it's normal So that if you look at like a galaxy, it matches the shape of DNA. If you look at the toroidal shape of like gravitational stuff, it matches the shape of a red blood cell. You look at an eyeball close up, it looks like a like a nebula And if we just look at as above so below, like any of that is even remotely true Dreams might tell us more than we think about what's going on here in this what we call reality. Have you ever seen the comparison between the universe itself and a human neural tissue It's bananas. Is it like's identical. an image? Yeah, it's like an image of the known universe with an image of is it a brain cell or a human neural cell. I forget which one was But when you look at the two of them together, you're like, okay, is this whole thing a giant fractal inside of a fractal inside if that's an infinity is. You know,in,'d like to think that like this is what it looks like. That's a brain cell and that's the universe Good Lord. what the fuck I mean gosh, it's the same thing. So it's If at least it looks like the same thing, right? Um, You know, when we think of infinity, we think of what we are here on Eth that there is no distance that you could travel where you find the end that the infinite universe just keeps going on. But it's way crazier than It might be that the entire infinite universe that doesn't have an end. is actually a part of a cell That's in another being It's in an infinite universe that has no end that's actually just a part of a cell Yeah It's in a part of an infinite iny goes on and on and on Yeah. And we have some evidence That might be the case just in the weirdness of these supermassive black holes that are in the center of every galaxy So these Super massive bllack. We had Michelle Fowler on the podcast the other day, Fascinating woman. She's an astrophysicist and discussing all the strangeness of the universe, the more that we experience it the more the deeper they look, the crazier it is. It's like the further the James Webb telescope goes out, the more shit that they find. they're like, what is going? What is that? How is that there? This is not supposed to be there They think that There's a real possibility that inside every black hole is a completely new universe. that it's some sort of a passageway. So if there's hundreds of billions of galaxies just in the known universe and every one of those galaxies has a supermassive black hole inside of it in the center of it. You go through that and you are in hundreds of billions of new galaxies all with black holes. And then you go into those fucking universes and you find creatures with brains and you get to their brain and their brain looks like a universe. And if you get closer and closer and closer, you might see hundreds of billions of galaxies each with black holes inside their fucking brain cells. Yes That was well said That needs to be a short. But it's infinite. So there's no end to that process. It's not like there's us and then we are a part of a brain cell of a creature. No, we're part of a brain cell that's a part of a creature that's a part of a universe, that's a part of a brain cell, that's a creature that's a part of a universe. And that's what real infinity is. There is no end I agree with that We need less certainty about this shit y so many people so I have this figured out. What you said about coming back from the DMT trip about how your ego tries to kind of reclaim reality for you I think that is a genuine problem with human beings today in which they cling to ideologies, to political parties, to ethics, morals, religion, whatever it is that they they connect themselves to inseparably I think part of that is just being afraid of the vastness of what this experience really is. And the way to shield yourself from it is to pretend to be sure better. It just gives me a little blanket of I've got this figured out. I know what's happening little security blanket. Yeah But it's it's We need less certainty in the world. Yeah. We need more people to say as far as we know before they say some shit Yeah, sounds sciencey. As far as we know, why can't we just put that phrase in front of more things If you're doing DMT, it just Or if anyone does DMT, maybe it's a hallucination. Tererence McKinnis described it so well when he said death by astonishment. and There's no words. at the moment you try to like label anything that you see in the DMT space, it's like you're destroying, it's an act of destruction, almost. There's no words for it. They don't exist. because wors words are sounds that we make with our face to describe known reality. And there's no words for that experience. Yeah. Th we invented language for trading chickens and spices and stuff. That's what language is for Yeah If you just look at like one little sciencey thing like that's weird, like quantum entanglement And then somebody says, we can't explain how this is like faster than light or anything. Well, we can explain it if we go to a dream and then say the distance doesn't exist Distance isn't real. I think that's I want to know about the UFC fight at the White House to get away from super woo woo for a second. It was insane This episode is brought to you by BlueCew, the number one brand for betteretter sex BlueCew just drops something crazy, Blue chew gold. BlueCew has made it easy for five million men to get hard. But now they've made it easier to get horny too. Blue chew gold gets your brain and body on the same page fast. Other options just help blood flow, but gold combines four ingredients into one tablet that works fast Two ingredients increase blood flow and two boost arousal and intimacy. So for a good time, go to blueCew. com and we've got a special deal for our listeners right now. When you buy two months of BueCew gold, you get the third free with promo code Rogan. You also receive an additional ten percent off plus free overnight shipping on your first order. Visit BlueCew. com for more details and important safety information. BlueCew is number one for a reason Was the temperature make everything different? It was perfect. No, the temperature was perfect. I was very concerned about that I was really concerned that these guys are going to have to fight in the heat, but that was not an issue at all. It seemed like it was in the seventies And it was The storm like miraculously just past us There was all these weather warnings at one point in time. The fight was supposed to start at eight PM And at one point in time, one of the weather experts wanted us to start at ten thirty because do ten thirty at night, which would have been a disaster. ten thirty at night. would have been a disaster because it's a six hour show. Yeah, you know, or close to it, whatever it is Um, I' say I guess it was five hours someomehow or another the storm just like almost like went around the White House I don't know Mysteriously. I don't know what that is. I don't know if that's science or if that's consciousness. I don't know what steered the storm or if it's just random luck. It could have been all the above Um All my fears of the weather getting in the way of the fights were It didn't mean anything. And then there was this long sort of, u ceremonial thing where they had jets fly over and you know they played music and all this different stuff. So by the time we got to the actual fights Dark out Perfect The weather was perfect. So that was an issue at all And it was just magnitude of the event. I know people saw it on television and it looked insane, but the magnitude of the event being there live. so there's The event that's taking place on the lawn of the White House and that has thousand plus people. The main of it. Yes. Yeah. So the the actual UFC. So there's There's a bunch of military guys that are standing up in the back There's like a thousand of those and there's three thousand plus that are seeded. All these people are seeded Then. behind that that far like a hundred yards, two hundred yards, whatever it is. I guess it's more than that. Maybe three hundred yards. There's the ellipse The ellipse has eighty five thousand people. This is all got in for free Yeah, it's like in the whole White House ecosphere, whatever it is. Wow. Yeah. so this area, they have giant screen set up and they have, you know huge speakers and sound. And so eighty five thousand fans are watching the fights live on the screens and they can see the lights of the fucking this claw dome in the distance. and they can see the White House in the distance where the fights are taking place. But they're watching it on massive screens with commentary And it was insane. and you could hear them roar So you hear the crowd from here and then you hear eighty five thousand people in this f Godard You can hear it in the distance. It was insane It was insane. Just a magnitude of it was insane. Unlike anything else you've ever beyond. I I mean I'm a hyperbolic individual and I'm always like this is the greatest, this is awesome.ike That was the wildest experience that I've ever had in my twenty whatever years of calling combat sports. There's nothing even cle Nothing even close. It was the greatest night of fights of all time. And it was the only night in the history of the sport where every single fight ended by a knockout Did they all? Every single one Seven fights, seven fights Every one of them ended by knockout Wow, which narrative is unprecedented. unprecedented. It was like Perfect experience for anybody that had never watched the UFC before to see it that way att the White House like that. I mean, it was it was nuts A huge experience for the fans. They got to be there in the ellipse and I mean I saw videos these guys. they were having so much fun. And It's like everyone's in there for free. You don't have to pay for the tickets. There's eighty five thousand people out there. They're all screaming and cheering. The drinks are flowing and it was wild. I mean, just absolutely wild two hundred fiftieth Yeah, for Wow. And it's a sport that was like banned just what? fifteen, twenty years ago or something. twenty plus years ago. So when the UFC so When I first started working for the UFC was in nineteen ninety seven Back then, you had to watch it on direct TV. I had direct TV just because that was the only way to watch the UFC That's why I didn't have cable. And then Zoofa purchased it. So the Fertita Bothers and Dana White, they started running it in two thousand one. And that's when I came aboard again. So I had quit in ninety eight W worked from ninety seven to ninety eight. and then I quit and then they brought me back in two thousand one And when That was going on. It was banned from cable. And they slowly started working it back. They got it on Foxports Net, which was the first time I ever commentated for the USA That was UFC thirty seven and a half, a very special show that they put on for Fox Sports Net try to introduce people to the sport. And so that was the first time it was on like cable again. And then they started getting pay per view buys and started growing and gathering steam. but Even back then It was like you were doing porn or something or snu films or you were doing something that was damaging for your career You know, and people would like look at you like, why you're working for a cage fighting organization? Why would you do that? to twenty five years later. It's on the lawn of the White House and it is one of the most watched sporting events in the history of the world. Yeah. I don't know what the total overall views are as of now but I know that it was like Well over, I think it was one hundred fifty million by just by Monday Unbelievable J justust by Monday. So that's like the night of and then people that watched the replay that weren't there when the fight took place because they heard about it. But now between now and between then and now Now we're dealing with Tuesday. like it's probably another fifty or sixty million people who have watched it I'm not Paramount plus just to watch it on YouTube. I'm sure I don't know, thirteen bucks or something that it was But man What a hell of an event Yeah it was an amazing event. I wish I would have stayed up longer, but I watched the first few fights, it was fantastic. The main event was the greatest fight of all time It literally was the greatest fight of all time Because the guy that won it, Justin Gagey, was in many books six to one favorite six to one underdog rather. crazy odds for a guy that was an interim lightweight champion, fought the best of the best, one of the best ever do it, BMF champion. I mean, just super durable, real dangerous guy That's how good Ilia Taporia is. That's how good Ilia Taporia is. Ilia Taporia in many people's eyes is the most skilled of the new generation and the new generation is the most skilled of all time And Iie was like the top of the mountain And most people thought that he was going to be too much and he was too much for a while. and he almost took Justin out in the second round And then Justin rallied. and then Ilia It looked like he got really damaged in either the first or the second round. he was having real trouble seeing out in one of his eyes. and then Justin started landing bombs in the third round. Ilyia had slowed down quite a bit. It looked like he had really tried to finish Justin in the second And sometimes when you try to finish a guy, you just hit the gas way too much and you can't recover in between rounds And Justin recovered and Justin started battering Ilia in the third and fourth and by the end of the fourth round Iia quit on a stool He couldn't see out of either eye he had got knee into the body to the body real bad when he was on the ground. Like you Justin like literally Justin had him down with his two hands and just smashed a knee into his rib cage and he could see him go like that. and that was the end of the round and then he had to retire on his stool and mean like think you broke a ri That probably could have happened, but I think maybe More significantly was the eye damage. Both of his eyes were swollen shut. his nose was fucked up. He had taken so many punches to the face and it looked like perhaps orbital damage like maybe he had a fractured orbital because his whole thing had just swollen up on both sides. It was unrecognizable And you know, the guy hung in there as long as he could, but when you can't see, you can't see and when you're you're that battered sometometimes it's smart to stop and he's a very smart guy and I think you realize like there's I can't defend myself right now. I can't see This guy' smashing me It's called a day. is what it is. It's preserve my body and my brain and rebuild and come back another day. But for Justin, it was like one of the most epic things I've ever seen in my life. For him to win like that when everybody had counted him out. He was saying it was going to be his last fight. It was like a retirement fight. thirty seven years old, been in the game forever You know, fought who's a who's who of all time greats in the sport and this is going to be his last fight And he's like, what if I can win the title at the White House, What an ending to a career. And that's what everybody was saying. like, yeah, but You're not gonna because you're fighting Nelia Tporia. It was like, all right, we'll see And he pulled it off He pulled it it was insane. It was epic Absolutely epic What do you think what do you think the mindset is between somebody who You know, you walk in as an underdog and wind up winning, even though your skills may not be more proficient than the other guy, what do you think the mental differences between like somebody who loses or wins? Well, there's a lot of factors. One of the factors is that Justin has always been incredibly durable I mean, it might just be a genetic thing He even joked around about it. L science needs to take a look this hard ass skin I have. he very rarely gets cut at all. And he's like, I got these hard ass bones and hard ass skin. He was joking around, like science needs to study this And it's true though. I mean, he really is insanely durable. He's been rocked and hurt before and he's been stopped in fights before. He was knocked out in the last second of the last round by excuse me, Max Hollowway in the BMF title which was an insane fight The guy is just, he has zero quit in him. It doesn't exist. Like if you're looking for quit, you go into a room, it's empty. The quit room has no one in it. There's nothing in there He's not going to quit. He can lose because he's a human But he's not going to quit. And he's also been into the deep trenches before trenches of these five round chaotic insane battles And oddly, he thrives in those kind of battles. He's a guy He's described as the most violent man in the most violent sport. That's We've all talked about him like that for years since the moment he burst onto the scene when he fought Michael Johnson. in the UFC at least He just he's an extraordinary dude, just a very extraordinary dude and not the most technically skilled like Ilia look technically better than him But it didn't matter. Justin found a way to land shots, found a way to like persevere from the early early rounds where he was in real trouble and just Shocked the world. It was amazing One of the coolest things I've ever seen in my life. That's cool This was fucking amazing. I was there Oh my God. I talked a bunch of people into going. that didn't want to like Shane Gillis was thinking about not going. I'm like, bro, you gott to go. It's going to be epic. It's going to be a once ever thing. notot once in a lifetime. onnce in anybody's lifetime It's never happened before. It's probably never going to happen again Probably not. No But yeah, that's something you have to see and experience. Yeah And it so many people are trying to make it a partisan thing. L they're mad at people for being there like, o, you support Trump. Like it's a fucking fight at the White House Does't mean you endorse foreign policy. likeike shut the fuck up That's pretty much. Please stop And again, it's this thing, the ego thing where people are just they just want so badly and on both sides for sure You know, the right celebrates this as a win for masculinity and patriotism and all these different things. like, okay, settle down Everybody settled down. We should all be together I mean, One of the things that I wanted to do when we went to the White House try to push through psychedelics for therapy, for veterans and people First responders, people struggling with PTSD is You need to take these steps to give people a path changed their mind I think that's the title of Michael Pollin's book and it's a great way to describe it change your mind Yeah, change your whole perspective And there's no better way to change your whole perspective than a complete dissolving of your ego momentarily. justust at least for a while, just lock it all away Push it out and then you get a chance to see what it actually is doing and the effect that it has when you let it back into your life Yeah, how much of these clothes do you want to put back on? Right.. I described it as like control alt delete for your brain And then when your brain reboots, it has one folder. And that folder is just labeled my old bullshit and you have a decision to make. you go back into my old bullshit and most people do at least a little. I do a little. Yeah But for sure, you recognize that it's your old bullshit instead of thinking you are who you thought you are And it's a lot of stuff that wasn't didn't really belong to you It's like we act like decorator crabs all throughout our lives. we're just kind of grabbing these little things Yeah, and you realize that. And I think that We just talking about this politics thing. I think separation is the number one greatest deception of all time. The biggest problem with the biggest problem that we have and the biggest deception that we have. It' like we are separate And the one thing that you see and you do it some of the and I mean this therapeutically. I don't mean you're like you're taking mushrooms and going to a concert When you do this like therapeutic psychedelics, the first big realization you have is like, oh shit This is all me Like we're all kind of connected. We might be one thing, but there's something here that's connecting all of us. Whatever that is Wh you want to call it consciousness or our souls are connected or something There's something where we're connected. We're kind of denying for some strange reason And I think that that's one of the reasons Um I think you maybe would agree that we're in a loneliness pandemic right now. L we have more rampant loneliness around the world than we've ever had before If you look at how this has evolved, I didn't know it So if you look Cheer, sir. Thank than you, man If you look at this loneliness, And People you could stand in a room full of people and still feel lonely. For so many people, the majority of the world right now is in this loneliness pandemic So what's really going on and this is my opinion, feele free to toss it, but in a place that's becoming more and more performative on a daily basis, just fake, artificial, let me say what people want to hear. let me act how people want to How I want to be perceived? Sure. which means that if I'm even If I'm a little bit performative, no matter who it is, my best friends are put my hand put their hand on my back say Chase, you're a great guy, you're a good person But in the back of my mind, I know that I'm performing I know for a fact that probably not even my spouse has ever seen me They can't like me. They can't love me because That's not me, right. And I think this hyper performance world of I don't mean performance. I mean, like Let me act out this thing. I'm going to act a certain way. Let's look if you look at our ancestor, I had to worry about like you and I were maybe eight, nine years apart, But when we were in elementary school or middle school, we did some stupid shit. We had to worry about twenty people making fun of us And now we got to worry about twenty million And that is a That is an existential difference between those things. So we get better at hiding shame pretending like we don't have it And then what if now going back to separation Now this is what I call the disease of specialness of I am special, which means I'm the only one here pretending and everybody else has got their shit figured out And then that isolates you even further. and not realizing that everyone has this, everyveryone has this little going on and like it The fear that people feel of like if I just be real, then I'm going to get made fun of, I'm going to get rejected I' to be kicked out of the tribe. It's not real This episode is brought to you by the farmer's Dog. 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In partnership with Draft Kings Casino, Gambling problem called one eight hundred gambler must be twenty one or older. physically present in New Jersey. elligibility restrictions apply. non withdrawable spins issued as fifty spins per day for twenty days valid for select games only and expire each day after twenty four hours. See terms at casino dot draftkings dot com slash promos, ends july twenty second at eleven fifty nine PM Eastern time It's not real, but it can be real depending upon your circumstances. So if you are in a very enclosed ideological tribe, And there's no There's no Tolerance for any deviation from whatever the narrative. You know, this is a real problem with social media This is a real problem that it wasn't like that. I mean, I know I'm like one of those old people that's like back and Mder, but When I was young, you were allowed to have different opinions Like It was normal. I had friends that were conservative And I would make fun of them and they would make fun of me. And it was normal. Like you kept those friends because no one was telling you to get rid of those friends. There was no pressure to be a part of a group There's no there's no silence as violence bullshit There was a bunch of people that thought differently and you talked about stuff And we weren't as informed, That's a fact We didn't know as much about how the world works. That's a fact But now that we do, one of the things that we should all be acutely aware of with us spending so much time interacting with each other online. is that a lot of the people that you're interacting with are not real. and not a small number If you are on X You know, look, there was an FBI analyst that he before it would be bought real Bots likeike an actual not human AI bots. Okay AI bots is a big percentage. and then there's actual humans who work for organizations that push narratives. You can hire an organization to push a certain narrative You can hire them to support you. or you can hire them to attack your enemies. You can hire companies that will artificially create a movement of people that agree that this person's a bad person, that this project's a bad project, that this is a good idea, that he's a good person, that he's a good this is a good politician Whatever it is You could So it's you're not dealing with genuine thought. You're dealing with bullshit And here's where work it gets really I think it's natural And I think everything is nature And I think this idea that this artificial communication that we've developed through social media is what's really fucking everybody up, I don't think that's the case. I think this is a natural progression of nature. The idea that our stupid fucking creativity and intuition and teechnological ingenuity, it can bypass nature. I think's horseshit. It is nature. It is nature. Yeah. And I think nature creating this Convergence. It's creating this very bizarre convergence of humans and artificial intelligence through bunch of ways that are unproductive and a bunch of ways that are productive, but all of it like gathering together in a device that's like almost impossible to resist. If there was anything else that you use six hours a day or eight hours, if you're a good person If you're good with it, like a lot of kids are around seven, eight, nine hours a day. Yeah. Like if there's anything else like that, you would think that person's got a horrible addiction But for us, we've accepted it as a normal part of society. and that Whatever that interaction with it that we have, that deep connection we have is only going to get deeper And it's ultimately going to lead to some sort of hive mind And it'll probably not be a hive human mind only I think it will be a human AI hive mind. And I think One of the things that's happening to us is there's this weird like movement to This is a weird move to discredit traditional femininity and traditional masculinity. And there's this bizarre over celebration of outliers, of weird gender people, of people that are confused with their gender. And I think that's because if you play that out, this is a new thing Again, I'm an old man But when I was a young guy, that what did not there was cross dressers. There was guys that got off on wearing women's clothes. There was was there was always stuff like that. There's always been people with gender dysphoria But there was never like this. And this is also coming at a time where microplastics are disrupting our endocrine systems. Big time. Big time So testosterone levels are dropping. We're like, oh my God, it's a crisis. What do we do about it It's natural Our use of plastic is probably natural. It's probably all somehow or another connected to take us out of our territorial, primate bodies and move us into some new stage of existence. Like some post biological Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. I think it's inevitable And I'm not fighting it. Does Elon agree with that? Like we're moving toward that direction Well, he most certainly thinks that we are moving into a direction where we converge. And I mean, he said about this is what I mean the dude's literally cutting holes in people's heads and shoving fucking circuits in there. And doing a lot of wild shit with it. I mean, people are using their eyes like aim bots and a paralyzed gentleman that we haven had on the podcast was the first neuralolink patient. Ill watch that. Yeah He he said it's like a cheat code. likeike because he look where he looks, that's where the cursor goes and he just shoots people.ow. You know, like he's shooting people with his mind Fortnite in a video game playing video games with his mind and he's like excellent at it Well, you've got to think, well, eventually you'll be able to move your body that way And then eventually you'll have all sorts of other tools that didn't exist before. And one of the things that Elon has famously said is you're going to be able to talk without words. That's the hive mind We're moving towards that This gets us into all this weird UAP shit Like what are these aliens? What are these experiences that people are having? Like what is this all a mass hallucination? Is it us from the future? Is it us from the past? Is it another species that's far more advanced than us? It's come down here to monitor us and shepherd us through our very difficult time U whatever it is, they seem to be what we're going to be if we keep going in this direction Our brains are far larger than monkeys.. Our bodies are far weaker, pound for pound than any of the other primates So what do they look like? They look like these fucking spindly things with no muscles and giant heads They communicate telepathically Universally, like everyone from all over the world, every planet or every country rather that has experienced these creatures They all say the same thing. They all say they communicate with them telepathically. That's where we're going, which is exactly what you experience on DMT and like you can get a test drive of what that's like. Do you know that the original when the original scientists or I guess wh theyre anthropologists or what kind of people were studying Ayahasca when they first went down to the Amazon U They wanted to call harmine telepathine They didn't know that it had already because of the rules of scientific nomenclature, it had already been named So they They didn't know. So this substance that these people had created One of the aspects of it, they wanted to talk they wanted to talk to it as telepathine. They wanted to refer to it that way. So that was what they were going to call it scientifically. Wow because they had experienced these telepathic moments while on it But because it had already been named, they weren't allowed to rename it. so they just stuck with harmine. But harmine had a real chance of being called to lepithinee. It's beautiful Wild. Yeah. Yeah. And It just seems like consciousness is coming to the forefront of every debate right now. Yeah. the telepathy tapes. shot out of a cannon. like Nobody's ever heard of that stuff and I think you had the director or something on the show Y It just seems like The level of certainty that some people have about consciousness is adorable. Aorable. Yeahah to me It's like we're these little hairless monkeys. and we're like, every generation is like, o yeah, we didn't know a hundred years ago, but now we know. We know now. R It's just ridiculous. Yeah, but that's that's the ego, right That's the certainty. Yeah. We need that certainty. I think We're at a place where curiosity Maybe except for politics. Curiosity isn't really dangerous anymore peopleeople are scared to be publicly curious or to public question something Like why is this here? whyy is that there Do you know who Igas Simelweis was He was a doctor. Back in the day. no idea what year it was, but it was very, very early days He was the guy who said, Hey Maybe in between these operating room patients, what if we washed this blood off of our hands How I go do this next operation And he got laughed out of the room and then eventually thrown into an insane asylum where he died for questioning this thing. And it seems like so much of what's going on with like psychedelics research evenven though like doocument after document is showing it's the most effective thing for PTSD and anxiety and depression and addiction and all this other stuff. I'm not a champion researcher in any of this stuff, but it seems like coming out, peopleople are getting the same treatment as this guy did. when they're coming out, even though like it's been documented so well. And it's still a schchedule one drug Well, I think now that's changing And I think there's an I think one of the things that's changing it is the acceptance of it by the right And one of some of them at least, the old boomers, they don't want to let go. But the young guys, like especially spepecial Forces guys, SELals, Rangers, those kind of guys, they come back So many of their buddies have experiences and then recognize when one of their friends is struggling and take them to have these experiences and that word's getting out. Sean Ryan's responsible for a lot of that because he's talked really openly about it obviously has a huge platform But Marcus Latrell, you know, him talking about it. And then Rick Perry, the former governor of Texas, Republican governor of Texas who hated marijuana, hated psychedelics, thought it was all just a bunch of hippie bullshit He had brain atrophy, natural age related brain atrophy And the doctor said, Ohh, it's just pretty normal, you know, standard, you're fine. gooes and does this Iibogain session Rick did himself. Oh yeah. Yeah. yeah. a couple. He's done a few goes and does this I againain session comes back, the doctor says, you feelt like it's twenty five percent approval improvement, rather in your brain atrophy So then six months later, he goes back again for another scan, his brain atrophy is gone. It's gone. He says he feels different. He thinks different. He feels better L his mind works better. So it's not just an experience. I beain in particular It seems to be neurore reggenerative in a profound way. But if this was a drug that you could patent, pharmaceutical drug companies would be all over this shit. Yeah. and it'd be that it's proving to be one of the mostost effective drugs ever tested. if you're looking at like efficacy versus like a sample size, it's one of the most effective ever tested Andy Stump and I just did a show about it We talking about this stuff. and he's brought a lot of awareness to this if I think if we could get a little bit of awareness to it, I think we could a lot of this stuff, but I think the number one thing is like, is there a way that we can help get this faster to people And they're working on it. Brian Hubbard and Rick Perry, I mean, Rick Perry hass said openly that this is my life's mission now. You know, really? Yeah I mean former governor, Republican governor of Texas. Yeah, hisis life's mission is to promote psychedelic. I'm so glad. Oh, I'm so glad. This is another IBigain is the best one to start out with because IBigGaine has zero recreational use It's zero You it's not fun. Nobody likes it. It's not a good time. You throw up, you shit yourself, you freak out for twenty four hours. but when you come back, you're a different person. And if you're willing to do that, if you're willing to do that, you can change You could you could do a lot of fixing all that's and also maybe even more importantly, be aware of what these little traps, little these little deeply carved grooves that you're conscious and it seems to comfortably slip into over and over again, whether it's alcoholism or gambling or whatever it is. it seems to just shut those down. Yeah in a very profound way that You can't get anywhere else Yeah, and it's just it I think it zooms you out to where you're like, oh, shit, I thought all that was important Like you're talking about zooming out on these galaxies within galaxies and black holes and stuff, but it gives you that perspective of like, whoa I thought I was really special.. I thought I was super important Yeah. Yeah. I mean that is one of the things that most psychedelics do is they remove that idea tely go this is you've got to get rid of this. This is tripping you up. You're carrying this fucking weight around everywhere and it's really stopping your progress. Yeah. And it's kind of like It's like you're in a video game and then somebody comes back and be like, Hey, man Here's the way hereere's the shit you need to actually worry about. You don't need to do all this other stuff. Right, right, right. Yeah, like a little helper guy in the video game. Yeah. guys, got to come with me. This is the wrong room. Yeah. They're coming. We got to get out of this room. Don't do that quest. Yeah That that's what it is. And I mean, I'm a I'm a hypnosis Uh guy studied all the brainwashing, interrogation kind of stuff This is the fastest way I think and I've studied every possible way to change human behavior that probably has ever been researched. and this is Bar none the fastest. And I think the one of the reasons that it helps people so much and I don't want to this is going to turn into a two hour psychedelics discussion, but it's your show. I don't care. Okay I think it's because perspective shifting is what happens. L if you're looking at life and you have this little GoPro is your consciousness and you're looking at this level just snatches that thing up and zooms it out and puts it in another location where you're like, oh my God, I had no idea it was like this. Right It seems to be that the perspective Just the shift in perspective seems to be the number one thing that psychedelics produce therapeutically. That's the thing that like cognitive behavioral therapy is trying to get done over the course of like ten or twelve years or however long it takes But it just seems like it does it so fast a profound way And the stuff is non addictive, non toxic. You're not going it's not a street drug. You're not going to see people out there on the street selling DMT capsules. and DMT, I would say similar to Iberogain, it' not recreational I think it is. You think DMT's recreational? Yeah I think there's a lot of people that recreationally do it. I think that would be your thought. You know, oh, I'll just do this and have fun. And then once you do it, it's no longer recreational. it's too profound to be just purely recreational. Yeah You've heard people getting banned. Yes I have. Jie and I were just talking about this. Yeah I knew a guy who was a tattoo artist who got banned You can keep taking DMT. like you can go take ten hits on a DMT vape pin or something and you're not going anywhere. Isn't that nuts? It's insane. It's like they just decide. Yeah. No, no, no You're doing this for the wrong reasons. Yeah I listened to one guy describbe it and he's like, it's basically like you're knocking on the door of a nightclub and like the little thing opens up. It's like, no, you're not coming in You got to think like what are they doing wrong Yeah, I think maybe going in with ego seems to be one of the things I see that's in common and people try just treating it like a little recreational thing. The ego thing is a problem even within psychedelics because there's sort of a carve out that happens, which I always refer to as spiritual narcissism There' a bunch of people that do it that somehow or other want to be a guru or a leader and to show you that they're somehow or another better. because they have had these experiences, they know more and they pretend they know more They pretend they know more and then they get a whole bunch of people that are you know very suggestible And those people sort of listen to them and then that's how you start a cult. And this There's something to that There's a specific type of narcissism that occurs from regular psychedelic use when people want to like lead groups of people And I think if you go into a A journey or two with no ego. Do you know what you learned less You're less certain every time. Oh yeah about the world. From the moment you get in there, you're like, o How does this real How How how is this available fifteen seconds away from normal reality? Yes And I definitely We're moving forward. If we move forward with psychedelics, our species is going to move forward. Yeah Yeah, I agree. Yeah, agree. And I think I think all the time, what would have happened if that sweeping psychedelics Acts, the Controlled substances Act seventy hadn't beenacted. If this stuff had been available, people. for the last, you know, fifty six years. What would that be like? Yeah, what would the ninety four Ford Taus actually look like dope. It look like a sixty nine mustustang. Yeah. ' those are the people that were doing drugs. Exactly. I mean, there's no There's no other explanation in my mind why cars started looking like shit And music Yeah down we still changed good music. We had some good music like the pesh mode. because there's bunch of people that still did drugs. But there's there was a giant change between nineteen fifty and nineteen sixty with automobiles, with music, with everything And I think A large part of that, if youre really being honest, a large part of that is psychedelics. Absolutely I mean, you look look, have you ever gone into a huge mosque St up at the ceiling. Oh,'s incredible It looks like exactly like what you see on all this stuff. Yeah. I'll go no further on that topic, but And just all the ancient artwork it's so psychedelic and beautiful. It's like They got written out of history somehow. And I think, o There's a difference between drugs and medicine. M Can we take a pee break? Sure, sureure. goo ahead, take a pe break. I'm good, but I'll hold I they used said coffee. Yeah I'll be right back This episode is brought to you by Uber Eats. 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How about the location I mean, that looks super DMD. I've spent time there. in that mosqu, but in that. What is that one Jamie to the upper left? You just you scroll up left up left corner. Yeah What the fuck is that? Is that three D? Oh, you know what that is, dude? I think that's Alex Gray's place Is it? says it's an I. Okay. Oh my God. Well, you know what Alex Gray's doing? Do you know Alex Gray, the visary artist. Yeah. So his Chapel of Sacred Mirrors, this he has a real church. they built based on his artwork. It's incredible. Non denominational. Yeah,'s like like a Rothco like a Rothcoach chapel. You know, he's one of those guys You know what I was talking about with spiritual narcissism, running a group?''s the opposite of that. Yeah is he's pure. And his place, like this is his artwork, but this is his place. And if you look at the outside of it, that's the outside of the place. That is so cool. So the outside of the place is basically like three D printed artwork of his that they've constructed into a building I don't even know how he did it. It must have cost a fuck load of money. A bunch of people donated. But the inside of his I think That is So he used to have a place in New York City that was like a gallery that was the Chapel of Sacred Mors So where' that? His daughter does a lot of painting. So that is it. That's on the Hudson. Yeah, in the Hudson Valley I mean He's incredible incredible artist and his ability to capture that experience L that one, if you go back Oh, actually scroll down the lower left, right there, the Egyptian looking one, lower right there. Bam I've seen that, dude I've one hundred percent seen that. I've seen that too, but go back to the other one that we just looked at No, that's not the same. That's the one I've seen. I've literally seen that I've seen that those and they move and change and morph He's just able to nail it I don't know how he does that He's incredible. One, he's a good artist, but two, being able to bring that back with coherence to where you can kind of show someone Yeah what it's like I remember seeing that face. I was like in the DMT space, I was like, is that me? And right when I said that, the mouth moved exactly like my mouth. And I was like That is me Well, you're it and it's you and you're everyone You're everyone and it's everyone Yeah, it's the weird thing is with the mosques. if you go back to some of the images, please of the mosques, the first one that you pulled up the ceiling What were they doing Not that one. the original one that you pulled up. that one, yeah Like that's very, very dear So like, what were they doing that they saw this? And is that Was that a part of their religion at one point in time? And has that been forgotten? L what is it Like why why did that exist? Go back to the one the first one, please. It had to That one I Sims Oh really, you think it's AI? Yeah. I just just seing so much I stuff from last year. Right. Look could be the rest of them Well go to that that website up rather. I mean, the photo just looks a little I say first up. Go to that website where it says fifty mesmerizing mosques If it s is where it is, then I told you there it is where it is I's seen Iran, we probably blew that up already. God I hope man. I hope not too. I mean, didn't Israel blow up a bunch of like ancient Christian places in Lebanon I believe they did. I don't know This is the same place. So that's whatever that place is. Is that the same place? Yeah. that is a very psychedelic place. Okay, look at that one Nut What What were they doing? Is that three D? it's like a yeah, it's a three D photo so manipulated it and our we Okay, under. So that's like a fish eye. Right. But either way Just the designs themselves are the actual designs. So like what were they doing that they wanted that to be represented And is that missing There's a great book called The Sacred Mushroom in the Cross. ever read that? Joh Marco Legro book. Yeah. So John Marco Allegro, who was an ordained minister, but he was agnostic. and he was a guy that studied theology and his conclusion after even being an ordained minister, his conclusion was that like it's Probably not any one religion doesn't have it right And so he was one of the people that was brought on to decipher the deead Sea Scrolls. He decipphers it for fourteen years. He works on it, and he writes this book called The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross, where he believes that the entire story of Christianity is connected to the consumption of psychedelic mushrooms and fertility cults Have you seen like Jamie, am I allowed to ask Jamie to pull something? Sure Like one of the original paintings of Jesus was him with a bunch of mushrooms. Right. And Yeah. well the Adam and Eve, the fresco in France. So that Adam and Eve Fresco that's painted this C on I want to say it's at least a thousand years old It's painted on this wall in France. is Adam and Eve and the tree of life and the tree of life is mushrooms It It's the tree of knowledge Yes the fruit of knowledge. R ight It's not the tree of life. It's a frit of knowled But this story of it. like that Like what is the actual reference to why in the Bible? I don't want to paraphrase as to why told them not to eat. from the fruit of that tree. I put that into perplexity. What did God say to Adam. By the way, everybody blameing Eve. Adam was the only one to talk to God We don't even know if Adam told Eve He might have forgot to tell her and then blamed the whole human race suffering forever I didn't know that. Yeah. read that read that over and over again. I'm like, whereere does it say that Adam told Eve? It doesn't anywhere. God told Adam he eat from any tree in the garden except for the tree of knowledge of good and evil, and that if he ate from it, he would surely die You are free to eat from any tree in the garden, but you must not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. For when you eat from it, you will certainly die. Okay. And what does that mean You will die what? ego death Because if that's what it is And then the weird thing is that the whole connection between the Aminita Mascaria and the psychedelic book or rather the sacred Mushroom and the cross book is that the Aminid Mscaria is a red mushroom that looks like an apple And in fact term like there's like confusion as to whether or not the term apple is actually meananing a red thing. and then it might not actually be an apple, but it might actually be the original version of it. it might have been the Amanidia. And then you have to think How many thousands of years is this been around that it took how many different people have translated it? How many different people have passed on the story? L what was the source? What was the original story And why delete it R How does this get deleted? so pervasively. Oh yeah, around the whole world. H you heard the Christmas traditions as well? Oh yeah. Yes. Santa Claus is a mushroom. wow. Oh my gosh. And it's the same mushroom that amanate a mascaria The weird thing about the Amida Mascaria is it doesn't like not a lot of people have had psychedelic experiences on it I It's very weird mushroom. You think it evolved maybe over time? It very well could have. McKenna had some thoughts on it. They said that it could be seasonal It could be location, it could be like where it is, it could be genetic variations. It could be very could be a bunch of different factors. And if you consume it byy way of reindeer piss. Right. Yeah. Well, not only that, people drink their piss when they consume it and it gives them like the second dose, the second burst Apparently the psychelic compounds come through the urine and if you drink it you just get a full straight blast. And reindeer have been known to like knock shamans out of the way to drink their their piss Because the reindeer are addicted to this mushroom Yeah, which is why they fly. in the Santa Claus story. Yeah And I heard the story, the shamans would go around pulled by dog sleds or something. and the snow was so high that they would drop the stuff down the chimney of those people that was fresh mushrooms or fresh almanita or something. in order to dry it out, you'd have to hang it by the fire Right And you hang it over the trees too. that people would put it on trees. Yeah that's where the decorating the Christmas trees. Also those mushrooms, the Ainated mascaria has a myorhizal relationship with coniferous trees I didn't know this. Yeah. so that's where they grow. They grow underneath the trees just like the brightly packaged presence that are underneath the trees on Christmas This story is It's a crazy story. It's like what did we what did we forget? Yeah How much did we forget? What's been revised? Right. Well just think about what we're just talking about inside of our generation. So the nineteen seventy Controlled Substances Act. Now that is a That's a government that's restricting its citizens and trying to control its citizens. And one of the ways it does it is limit their psychedelic experiences. Yeah. That's not the only time that's happened, right? That's the Ilicinian Mysteries. That's from Brian Murr Rescu's book the immortality key. like this is what they did back then. They banned these rituals. Why? Be It's very difficult to control people when you realize that we're all one. Yeah. You know, it's almost impossible. It doesn't work. They don't want to listen. You don't want to do it. You know, you start getting your lawmakers and your military people start doing it. Well then wars becomes impossible abbsolutely impossible att that point. that's me. I'm I'm hurting myself. Right doing all. Exactly. Yeah Ban, it' insane It is insane. I want to I wish there was like on a Google Doc how you can look at revision history I wish there was something like that for our race, our species. Right Rright Just so much has been changed and modified and We have historians, but they're studying somethinghing that's been permitted and something that's been officially released and This is more certainty It's just more certainty likeike o, oh, that reindeer story, that's bullshit because I got this book from Yeah, they don't know it's bullhit. Liechtenstein or, you know, whatever. this historian plead through authority that you have the answers, But you don't have the answers. Yeah. You definitely don't. You can't It's not possible. You can't have those answers. Yeah. And we're at an age where This is proving to help with So many other things And it's not just depression, but it's like Alzheimer's dementia, Parkinson's Myasthenia Gravis, multiple sclerosis U autism It's helping with. Yeah Did you see that woman that had dementia that took five grams of mushrooms and slept for like nineteen hours and woke up and then she could talk No. You didn't see that story? No. Yeah. It was a recent story. There was a woman. She was non verbal. She couldn't communicate, She couldn't dress herself, couldn't walk, couldn't do anything. Five grams of mushroom, slept for nineteen hours, came back, started communicating, looking at people in the eye, was able to change yourself, was able to walk around How beautiful razy. And then with subsequent doses or condition improved even more You had u I think it was Paul Stamiton and he helped his mother through cancer I think. like stage three cancer with Turkey tail or something. I can't remember what it was. Well, there's a bunch of mushrooms that help with inflammation. there's a bunch of mushrooms that help with cognitive function You know, Lion' Main is famous for that. you know, there's There's some weird relationship that we have with fungus. And one of the interesting things about fungus, we think of it as like a plant It's not it breathes air But he's there like people do It's a weird thing. and it also can survive in a vacuum It can survive in the vacuum of space. Yeah which is the pansperermia notion that mushroom spores wor came here riding on an asteroid, slammed into the earth And it might be one of the reasons why we're people in the first place. That's McKenna's idea. Yeah This episode is brought to you by Netflix. The TMobile Home runun Derby is one of those events that reminds you of how explosive baseball can be. It doesn't get better than watching the game's biggest slugggers launch baseballs into another dimension. Home runs only one night to make history just raw power on display as they chase Home Run Gory. Watch the TMobile Home Run Derby live on Netflix Monday, july thirteenth at eight PM Eastern five PM Pacific. This episode is brought to you by Zip Recruiter. If you're looking for a new tent, jeans, gear, or anything really, there's millions of options to choose from And finding the right one can take days or longer. At least when it comes to hiring, Zip Recruiter has a solution. Check it out for free at ziprecruiter dot com slash Rogan. Zip Recruiter uses powerful matching technology to find exactly who you need fast. And their latest feature introduces qualified candidates who are very interested in your role First through the standard to the standouts with Zip Recruiter. fourour out of five employers who post on Zip Recruiter get a quality candidate within the first day and now you can try it for free at ziprecruiter dot com slash Rogan. That's ziprecruiter dot com slash Rogan meet your match on Zip Recruiter of how we separated from our ancestral, like Crroomagnon. Yeah. I mean, this whole idea that people were created by aliens Yeah, maybe Mbe those aliens are mushrooms I mean, or maybe mushrooms is the way the aliens created people. Yeah. You know, it might be just how you add a little bit of fertilizer to the tomato plants to make them awesome. And it's just every generation like this generation says, oh, we're in this computer simulation right now But you know during the Industrial Revolution, the universe was a machine And we started doing electricity and the universe was energy and vibration. And how we invent computers and all of a sudden the universe is a computer. It's just every iteration So I tend to think that any theory that assumes humans are super special I'm a little skeptical. Yeah Be it assumes that A. these ancient like way up high beings. have like a MacBook that they're trying to run this shit Right. And they're like, well, the hard drive would need to be the size of the solar system. Like just assuming that they have the same shit that we do. Right. It's unbelievable That's that's a funny comparison. They used to think the universe was a machine. It's apt. It's so dead on. It's we always want to try to figure it out. I think it's way more complicated And I think the more we figurered out, the more we realize it's way more complicated. And it is all connected. L people are super special. We really are, but sos everything else. Exactly. Everything's super special. is. And everything is weirdly connected And even if you look at regular ass science, just basic ass science And you look at an Alan Watts quote of like, we are the universe experiencing itself That's just regular science. If we are the bigig bang then we are the universe and we are experiencing itself. And you don't need to do any stretches of imagination for that to be true. And Roger Penrose doesn't even think the Big Bang is the start of the universe thinks it's a series of big bangs. Oh really? Yeah, I think it's like a never ending cycle. Did you have him on? Yeah, a long time ago. Wow. What year we have Roger Penroses on Isn't it sir, Penrose now? Yes. Didn't he get sir. United? I'm American though. Yeah, I tend to shy away from those s foolish night mean that's another thing Oh, he's a knight that a king Oh You don knowt Did I I don't know if we talked about last time.. Have I told you that like I figured out a way to edit memory? No, Like you can do it with hypnosis So I know that you can introduce false memories into people's heads. Yeah. And I know that people create their own false memories. Yeah So you found a way to do that different than that Yes I make videos similar to this on my YouTube channel. But I wanted to walk you through this process because I think you would love it. Okay So if I want somebody to be able to edit a memory. I need to make them good at that skill first And we already edit memories. Every time we touch a memory. like if I think back to my wedding right now, I'll edit something and I'll do it unknowingly Right. So our brain is already an expert at making these changes, and then like before, I stopped thinking about that wedding My brain automatically clicks file save And then so the next time I look back on it, the memory is going to be there, but it I won't see it as an edit I'll just see it as that's the memory No matter how many times I change it Does that make sense? Yes, okay So first we need to get them to start doing some of that stuff consciously. So if you take somebody back to, let's say, a childhood bedroom when they're Seven Okay and You do it very vividly with hypnosis. So like you're goingo in their file cabinet, you let them explore the bedroom, the details, all this kind of stuff. You make it extremely vivid and coherent And then you have them pick up like a pencil a really sharp brand new pencil, maybe from their pencil box from school or something And they go over by the light switch in the bedroom and just make one dot on a wall And I figured this out talking to game developers And I was talking to game developers about how people figure out ways to exit the map to exit the playable area of the game because it kind of feels like that's what psychedelics do This' like it let's us kind of exit this little playayable map. temporarily So one of these game developers said, Ohh, you just if you can get somebody to modify one pixel, then they can modify the entire map If one pixel is glitching, then we canitch you can glitch all kinds of stuff. So I thought maybe we can do that in humans I've done this hundreds of times. So you just make a mark on the wall. with a pencil. And then you kind of fast forward their life. So like you bring them to like say they were six, now we're going to bring them back into the room when they're eight The bedsheets are different, Maybe the wall color change, something like that The one thing they can do is walk over there to light switch and see that that tiny little dot is still there So something and now you're starting to see that there's permanence through time Makes sense of Yeah We can get them to do that like fifty times, tiny change. You doing it through hypnosis? Yeah I mean hypnosis is such a loaded crazy word. They're relaxed, they feel safe and their brain is in theta brainwave state most of the time, which is around seven hertz. Yeah, I've been hypnotized and I thought it was going to be like I didn't know what was going on. I was in another world. no It's it's a very odd state of mind. Yeah It's kind of like guided meditation or But you feel very conscious. It's not. And I remembered it. It wasn't ye, didn't wake up my pants off. It was pretty normal. Yeah It's a pretty comimenturian candidate As far as you know, As far as I know. Right If you can do this fifteen, twenty, thirty times of one pixel at a time and show that it's permanent through time, then you can go back to other events. And instead of editing the memory itself, you teach them how to shift perspective. So now you take them through thirty more events really quick, true events, a birthday party, a dinner, adult life, children, doesn't matter. And now like let's say I'm at a dinner party. canan I jump from one body to another and experience the event through that lens. So first we make them an expert at editing memory and seeing permanence in time. Second is perspective shifting in real memory. So I can jump across the table, I can be at my own wedding and maybe be somebody in the front row and like just shift their perspective in memory The final layer is exactly what psychedelics do So the final layer is go back to that event when you got kicked in the nuts and everybody laughed at you in elementary school or whatever you can reprocess that memory in a very short amount of time as an adult perspective of an adult So meaning like so if you had a traumatic event in high school where somebody beat you up in front of everybody and everybody mocked you and it just like destroyed your year and destroyed your confidence, you can go back and shift this person's experience And instead of modify the memory, like, o, that never happened The memory stays, the perspective changes So now now you show permanence over time. So that has downstream effects. for all kinds of stuff later in life. So this is when a script got written of I've got to be tough, I've got to be loudder or somebody's going to hurt me, or you know what I mean? Like one of these little childhood scripts So you get the downstream effects. so you can go in there And there's probably you could probably edit memories. I've always been nervous to modify stuff that's way more than like a pixel or something insignificant The memory stays the same, the perspective is what changes and you can show that it's got a deemonstrable effect downstream of that. Their whole life can be different after that day And it's just like a mushroom. That's exactly what psychedelics do This is this massive perspective shift on memory And so is this something that you're actively doing With clients, I'll do this on occasion. But now is anybody else doing it? Maybe a few there's probably a few people doing it. And is there any like times where you guys get together and discuss techniques and what's effective and what's not effective and there should be We don't Right because it seems like this it's kind of a big deal. and it seems like someone could Fuck it up it has the potential for Delusional perspective shifting. There's a Yeah It mean you' got to be responsible about it But nowadays, I think that psychedelics can achieve a lot of that without having to go through some like I need you to go back to the original event and like having me vocally take you back there using this archaic stupid ass language that can't even describe a psychedelic experience with this language. Right This is what I was doing mostly before psychedelics. And you know how I got into psychedelics was the spirit Mlecule movie that you did the voice overver for it And that was what kind of introduced me to the entire the field of everything where I thought, wow this It just just doesn't seem like a recreational drug. And that was the big shift was watching that documentary for me Yeah, my big shift was reading Rick Strosssman's book I still haven't read it. I need to Yeah. He was the first guy to get FDA approval to do psychedelic studies and the way he did it was very clever. He did it to prove that these are damaging and dangerous. That's how he framed it. Let's so it really He's a very smart guy I mean, you werere talking about a guy who taught himself ancient Hebrew Oh wow. Yeah, over sixteen years taught himself to read and speak ancient Hebrew so that he could really read the Bible in its original form. Wow. Yeah He's fascinated by prophecy and ancient religious stories and You know, he like a lot of people that have had DMT experiences. you Once you do, you look at those old stories and you go, okay, what are these stories Really What was the original what was the original event It's so hard when you you're like Moses and the burning bush. Well, there's scholars in Israel that think that burning bush was the Aacia tree that the Acacia tree is rich in DMT And that might be what it represents. this experience of meeting God through a burning bush is he smoked DMT whichich for anybody who's done DMT, they go, Oh, that makes sense L got did I mean, these scholars, I don't think these scholars are freekss. I don't think they're psyedelic heads. I think they're just religious scholars that are trying to like figure out like what was the origin of that story I've never heard of that. Yeah Acacia. Yeah. Well, Aacia tree, very rich in DMT, but falaris grass, very rich in DMT. Mimosa. Yeah. plant. And for people that don't know, the reason why well, DMT exists in probably thousands of different plants You can eat those plants and not experience DMT because of monoamine oxidase So mono MAO is what your gut makes to break this stuff down so it doesn't become psychoactive But when you take an MAO inhibitor and the psychedelic, then you get IasCa. That's what IOSca is. That's why it's an orally active version of DMT. Yeah Which methyle blue is in it MI Oh, interesting. It's a pretty light It's a pretty light form of it. But if you're on methyle blue and you do Psychedologics, it's going to deepen I can imagine. A lot of people are very hesitant about methylene blue. They don't like the idea of it. They think it's very dangerous or potentially dangerous that we don't know enough about it. We've been researching it since eighteen ninety, something And it's in every emergency room Is it really? Every emergency room. Have you ever heard of anybody having bad experiences with methylene blue or side effects? or There are some contraindications. So people that are on a high dose SSRIs. Okay. And if you're taking an MOI, you can't eat aged cheese and wine because of this chemical called tyyrosine That's in there. Oh E cheese. Yeah So something about the Fungus. No it's old? Yeah, maybe there's Rd wine and Age cheese both have tyrosine, which when you mix tyrosine with an MOI, it can cause a hypertensive crisis Sounds like a super blood pressure issue I haven't heard anybody having a bad time with it, but you got to stick to the right dose to obviously you got to talk to a doctor about it. Well, let's ask AI. put that into AI that into perplexity. See, what is the negative consequences of taking methylene blue Maybe there's something that we don't know U Huberman's a little bit hesitant about it you know, Yeah. and I've talked to other people that say it seems like for a certain metabolic conditions it's very beneficial. But for people that have a normal metabolic your whole system is working fine and perfect It might not just not be necessary, but might cause harm. But they were very vague about what that harm would be. I don't think it's for everybody. It may not be for everybody. It saves my life for sure. which I mean, I could stop taking it today and I'll have a seizure within forty eight hours. That's wild You said you had a seizure at last time after you visited here The night before I came on the show. Wow Okay, Methyene Blue, this is our AI sponsor of Perplexity Methlene blue can cause a range of side effects from mild nuisance symptoms to rare but life threatening reactions, especially at higher doses or when combined with certain medications Common short term side effects, headaches, dizziness, nausea, vomiting, andiarrhea. Nothing. don't be a pussy. Yeah, My soilets are actually stained for pee. Yeah. Yeah, it does make your pee blue. swweating, feeling hot or cold, muscle twitches, harmless, blue, green discoloration of urine, sometimes stool or skin, serious risk. sererotonin syndrome, when combined with antidepressants, just like you were just saying, or other serotonogenic drugs, SSRI's, SNRIs, MAOIs, some opioids, Staint Johns wart G six PD is a big contraindication there Methylene blues in ERs because of meth hemoglobinemia, which is like when you hemoglobin can't bind to oxygen really well And it's also The only cure for cyanide poisoning is methylene blue. Really? Yeah Cyanide. It will stop cyanide in its tracks. Whoa probably says that on Interesting. safety for chronic low dose experimenting for anti aging or cognition is not well established and is not currently recommended without medical supervision H I know a lot of people that take it I know a lot of people that take it. I know Bobby Bobby takes it.. Yeah One of them A lot of people that take it that say it improves cognitive function. It's supposed to Also, when you take it with red light therapy, it's supposed to greatly increase the effect of.believably so. Yeah Really? I mean number if you want to go into it for just a minute here, sure. Methylen Blue has what's called a neuronal affinity. So they used to like you stick it on a microscope slide with a brain cell, it sucks into the neuron like automatically And it does the same thing in your body. So if I know that I'm basically dying all of my neurons blue And I'm not just talking about in your head. L we have neurons everywhere, our whole body So if I'm dyeing a lot of my neurons blue and I see something that's blue. metethylane blue is blue because it reflects blue light also means that it absorbs almost all red So if my neurons are dyed blue and then I go into a near infrared and infrared light I know that I'm getting way more absorption in there. Let's fucking go And that makes sense. In the third stage of cellular breathing. We produce this chemical called cytochrome Coxidase and cytochrome is like cell color, cytochroma where our cells can start running, essentially running on photons. is Beautiful and amazing. And if you get a good red light system And I have no plug But you get a good red light system. it'll penetrate through the skull up to like four inches through your skull in good systems Whoa. E lasers they make laser beds and all this other stuff Yeah, I have one of those red light beds looks like a tanning bed. I bought it up from Gary Breakast Company. It's very expensive, but it's pretty profound. I don't need reading glasses anymore I used to have these fucking things everywhere all over my house. I used to need them to read my phone. If I wanted to read an email, I don't need them anymore Wow. Yeah That's nuts. And I don't bring them with me anymore. If I would go on the road before and I had to do a trip for the UFC or whatever and I didn't have my reading glasses, I'm like fuck. Now I got to make everything big. I can't read anything. Not anymore No, my vision got better from red light therapy I don't doubt it. for sure. I also Don't close my eyes I keep my eyes wide open. say like, Oh, you need goggles. you like like you're fucking staring at the u some nuclear bomb or something. Yeah. It's not. no. It doesn't seem to bother my vision at all. And I've heard so many doctors and obviously none of this is advice for anybody. I've heard so many doctors say throw the safety gggles in the trash Look right into it if you want to. It's going to help your eyes. There's so many stories of people with macular degeneration and glaucoma and eye conditions and stuff that's gotten multitudes better than it was. Obviously, my story is anecdotal, but my vision was shifting in a a real bad way. I was using three Three power ones, you know, those cheap these cheap. I buy them off Amazon. but I use three and I started with one, like one power and then I got to two power and then I got to three. I'm like, Jesus Christ, I'm fucking going blind. I can't see shit. Yeah I don't need anymore. Now, my vision' not perfect. It's not twenty twenty. It's not what it used to be So when I read things, it's like maybe slightly blurry. and if I put reading glasses on, it look a little better, but I don't need them anymore. and it keeps getting better I also take loutine and a bunch of different supplements. I take this No affiliation. I don't work with them or anything, but it's called Pure encapsulationss Macular supportu They have a supplement for it those I've been taking those steadily. At the same time, I've been doing the red light therapy and It works At least it works for me You know, it worked for Whitney Cummings, sameame thing with her. herer vision got way better. she's very diligent about it, She does it every day. There's something there Yeah, somethingomet there Well, There's for sure something about staring at a fucking phone all day that's really bad for your eyes Staring at a phone, staring at a tablet, staring at a laptop, staring at a computer screen. It's not good for your eyes, pereriod. There's no way. There's no way. Yeah. When I look at my phone in bed at night if I do It hurts my eyes. Yeah You know? like if it's dark in the room and I'm like, let me check my email real quick. I get to my email, it's like It's like it's bright If I go to a website that's like a white website, it's like, oh It hurts. yeah Evening, buuyers remorse. Buy a new car I'll be bo Let's get started. Sorry, I think there's been a mistake. I bought it from Carvana. You what? Yeah, great price. I even have seven days to love it or return it. So there's no No, no buyer's remorse. More like buyer's rejoice Guess I'll let myself out Congratulations. I mean it. Buyers rejoice. By your car today on Carbana. limitations exlusions may apply Senior Sunday return policy, cararbona. Did you know you can change your iPhone Like if you go into accessibility It's like color overlay. I forget the name of it, where you can make the whole screen red. I have seen people do that. I have not done that I've tried to do it on mine It's tough But I did it on our two year old's iPad. Nothing is addictive anymore. Like she won't sit there and stare at it for more than three or four minutes anymore. Wh. Yeah, and it's just like I didn't buy some special device or you just go into accessibility and make it red. And it used to be that she would just sit there and hold the iPad I'm an anti. Electronics guy I wanted to try this experiment and The moment I turned it red. she didn't complain about the red. She got used to it within fifteen minutes and never complained again. Her iPad has never gone off of the red mode. And she doesn't get hooked into shows anymore . She'll watch it for a few minutes and' like, okay, that's great. putut it down and then she'll go play What? So it's worth an experiment. If anybody's got little small kids out there Or do it to yourself. It's amazing that they provide you with a tool to escape the addiction that they've created That's so true man. Be it's a pretty intense addiction. I think they feel like Good luck, you never getting off this hook This hook is sunk in deep and the barb is strong. T. It's so strong and that it's the production tool of reality right now. If I want to alter reality, I've just got to engineer how you see it and that's the way that we see realities. What's on my phone?'s Yeah. And that's the problem that a lot of people have with tech companies is that you're giving these people that aren't particularly wise. They might be intelligent. They figured out how to code these things and make these things and market these things, but it's not like they're monks. They're not these like profound visionaries that are more educated and enlightened than the general population.. No, a lot of them have autism. no empathy. They're out of their fucking minds. and they're optimizing the software continually to people to engage with it they want you to , I mean, that's that's the EBITDA. That's the bottom line Revenue comes from ads and how many ads can I show you? and if I know I know data, how much data of yours can I sell? Yeah. It's nuts J just why like I think it's so important for people to be Literate extxtremely literate in What's going on with your phone? What's going on with your brain and pci opops like The shit that we see coming out of the news right now I'm the guy that trains SIOPS. In two days after I leave here, I'm going to Fort Bragg to train the United States Army SciOPps Division I'm the I'm the guy. What do are you train them man? Are you allowed to say? In Sci ops I just train them how they work and how to do it. Yeah, like how I'm the body language like people reading guy. I don't know if you' ever seen our YouTube channel the behavior panel.et me in a couple. You got a great YouTube channel. It's awesome. Re. Thank you. Thanks And I have another one with three other behavior profilers. where we break down videos of people in interrogation and stuff like that I think it's so important to be literate in a lot of this stuff and how does our brain work? How can I be compromised and So I created a tool And I gave it to Jamie before we started the show. That will give you a one to one hundred score on how likely something is a scion And is it an app or is it like on a a PDF And you can run anything through it and you can run it historically and see what's asybe and what's not Hm and It's kind of subjective, but at least you get a standardized score for everything And you can see like if you went to Um like the invading Iraq Initially. Okay. That's a good one. That would score a ninety eight out of one hundred for S ups just on this tool here So like it kind of goes in layers. So step one is like this pre ignnition. L I have societal stuff going on. There's moral panic then operational, are there drills happening that are kind of similar to this, military ramping up the regulatory Obviously it's pretty there like bills getting past at two in the morning and five thousand bills. in alignment. So like people suddenly aligning different news agencies And then authorities, celebrities are starting to come out with the same messaging and stuff like that. And then media. J just kind of flooding little slogans and stuff. So if that kind of score's kind of high, you don't even need the numbers right now. Th we move to the next one So has this happened before? the precursor anomalies? Have they done this before? Well, a matter of fact gave people LSD against their will at MKltra or, you know, whatever. likeike is there some precursor? Right And then identical phrasing across unrelated outlets. So we see something on MSNBC and Fox saying the same kind of phrasing or something. That's kind of suspicious. and then introduce villains that are pre packaged prettyt obvious injecting symbolism and then the manufacture urgency. like if this bill isn't passed in the next seventy two hours, we're going to face a national crisis and all this kind of stuff. And then you could just kind of go down the down the walkway and it'll give you a predictive score of how likely something is a sci up One of the biggest things is if you don't want to like This is a lot of crap to memorize, but Are you seeing authority figures resonate with each other and is nuance not being presented to you And that's like if I'm not seeing nuance, if I have a left versus right issue and there's a prepackaged villain U, that's a style If you just look at those couple of things is then nowadays we have a death of nuance where no one's getting presented any nuance to anything.. It's either you're on this side, you're wearing this jersey or this jersey which is really toxic to our whole entire country whole world. And it's accentuated by clips and these weird little things. Yeah, and if you're on the lightout nuance let's say I'm on the left when I log into social media, whatever it is, they're going to show me the dumbest shithhead morons on the other side that they could possibly find.. And the same thing if I'm on the right. They're going show me the biggest idiots And the only goal is being like me thinking, oh my God, these people are insane And it's me thinking that's all of them But like if you go to Target right now and see somebody that voted differently than you You want the same shit You want your kids to be healthy. You want safety. You want to pay less taxes. You want the government less and less involved in your life. They're not all insane, but the goal is to make you think all of the other side is insane, right? That's the ultimate s So then at the end here you kind of get a one to one hundred score and I started I bought a TV station D that takeape with us? No I was going to text you or I was going to send you an email about this. I bought a TV station. We started our own a daily news show where we run the day's events all the way through the SIuPps index every single day And we show, here's how you're being presented. Here's how you're being made to feel about this issue. Here's where a nuance has been taking out. everyvery single thing that's like truly going on Here's the bill that got passed that nobody's talking about that has a lot to do with this. Here's the they're saying the Strait of Hormuz is going to open, but here's what Brent Crude is predicting oil prices at. So the insurance market has a lot more info than the News is going to give you try to give you every single day. Here's how you're being made to feel. hereere's the actual news Here's what theyre left is going to say, H's the right's going to say. and here's where they're killing nuance. Here's where you're being presented a binary choice and I think I'm trying to like I want to make Sciops irrelevant. And what we have to do? What are the steps we have to take to notot really inoculate people from SIcies but just to make them so visible that it's just obvious. and Yeah, they're going to have to invent something else and they will. But at least for a few years, people are really wise to everything. Like this is very obvious because like all the things that were up on that sheet right there, If you look at that a few times it starts to become irrelevant And like my goal is to make people more expensive to influence. Mm I think it's possible. I think if this gets out there, the more people are aware and just can piece it together and the more that narrative starts getting pushed. people start repeating it like, let's pay attention to this. When say you bought a TV channel or a TV station, what do you mean like an actual station. physical station with a news desk and Where does it air U It's on YouTube right now So where didd you buy this place? Where wasas it just like ten minutes from house? So it was a former TV station that was like going out of business? Yeah, we retrofitted everything upgraded it. But it they' probably a fire sale on TV stations right now. Yeah. It was we got a good deal Nobody's watching TV And that's great. Yeah, we retrofitted it and like it qualityities like Fox or anybody else, like we have a daily show. What's the daily show on YouTube called? Station one. Station one. Yeah risisely that wouldn't takeen. It's a new channel pererfect brand new channel We have like Most of the subscribers were my mom, I think, for the first month for growing now. So you just started it off and No fanfare, just try to get feet on the ground try to kick it off And it's You know, I do it with my YouTube channel, which I've got two million something subscribers on YouTube and It's cool that I can make these documentaries, but you know on YouTube Like you can't change it up on people. Like there's the algorithm punishes when you change things. So we had to start a new channel. Like you had interesteresting. Like you guys started JRE because you can't like back in the day, the algorithm said you can't do short form and long form stuff. the algorithm kind of punishes you for that. So you had to make a new channel for it ro probablyably what Jamie did or the team did I don't remember what the initial reason was. I think we decided it would be good just to have a second channel as well anyway, just in case because there was always the threat that YouTube was going to remove us. Okay, which I do think that if it wasn't for Spotify And it wasn't for the fact that I was primarily on Spotify. I probably would have been removed during the whole COVID. thing Oh my go, yeah. Yeah Because we were regularly questioning a bunch of different things that could have got you removed We're regularly questioning regularly questioning the COVID lab leak. We're regularly questioning whether or not there was any danger to taking these vaccines, regularly questioning alternative medical care And that that was maybe the The biggest side up of our lifetimes for sure. And now now confirmed That woke up normal people. That woke up average people. Oh yeah because it was so obvious Woke up a lot. someome of them like they just can't shake them. They're on fifteen ambians fucking They're just they're going to stay. I've got family members that are very trustful of government. and they're like, No, Chase, if it was going to go bad or if it was this thing, they would tell us. And I was like, theseese are the people who gave you the food pyramid And told you to eat sixteen loaves of bread every day And yeah, it's it's the idea that the government is here to help you is like That's the dumbest. That was Reagan's best line. Yeah There' the five Yeah. We're the government and we're here to help. Yeah Yeah, that's u It's interesting how people will believe in the government if it is convenient than if the other people or the government then it's one hundred percent negative People are so ideologically captured And that's why people are completely unwilling to look at anything positive that one of the other members someone from the other side Exactly, which is what I found really fascinating about the response to the Trump thing you know, that Trump passing this psychedelic initiative push through Ibigaine and Silocybin and All these different methods that people have used to overcome addiction and treat all these different things that we talked about before. They didn't know what to do with that. That was a weird one Because they tried to find all sorts of negatives. I saw people trying to find negatives because it's him. Yeah Which is so crazy. And there was also negatives because it was pushed by me And could the ide was Joe Rogan helping mental health policy in America? Is that real? You're the green guy who takes horsepace though. Yeah. Ain't a dragon believer. Yeah, it's it's an interesting time to be alive You know, really is. So emmotionally for you. I think if I saw myself edited like that on CNN or something I feel like that would wreck me I feel like that would emotionally make me feel like shit for such a long time. Were you just like over it Oh, it didn't make me feel like shit for a second. I started laughing I thought it was hilarious. Okay. I was also very aware that they weren't aware that my show was way bigger than See, the thing about Mainstream media is that mainstream media had ruled for so long that they had gotten delusional. They'd been like a champion that didn't think that he had a train anymore And then some new contender came along that had been, you know in the mountains of fucking Siberia Yeah. You know what I mean? someone came out of the blue and just fucked them up. and they were They're so bad at this thing that they think they run And they're also they also are very They're very unaware of the actual playing field So the actual playing field that they exist in is so limited that they cannot ever achieve the kind of acceptance or interaction or trust that alternative media can. Yeah So there's too many people involved T many people will most certainly move things and water things down to like what you were talking about before, like here's what I want people to think I believe, right? Yeah. whichich is most of what mainstream media produces. It's here's what I want people to think I believe. You don't believe any of those people reading that teleprompter because none of it seems sincere. Y mind registers This is a person reading something that's been written. doesn't register. And then when you see them talking free for like on those panel shows on CN, you're like, oh, you guys are fucking retarded. Like this is you guys have some of the dumbest opinions. You're so uninformed, you're so ideologically captured. This is so not compelling. They've turned CNN into a fucking group podcast That's a lot of the shows on CNN are bad podcasts with like shitty guests. who, you know, they're no nuance and they're yelling over each other Exactly. It's a terrible form. No no nuance whatsoever. It's also the problem that they have to break for commercials Oh yeah. And then there's a problem that Funding for those commercials, a giant chunk of it is pharmaceutical drug companies. ge Yeah. and as Mike Benz and Kalie Mans and a lot of people have talked about. They don't do that because They want to sell drugs do that because now the news will not criticize the pharmaceutical drug company the pharmaceutical drug companany is responsible for an enormous part of their income Yeah I mean I wouldn't say definitively that that's happening, but I mean, you're the if you're the CEO of the president, you know exactly where the money's coming from one hundred percent. And if you get a phone call that says, Hey, you know what Maybe not mention that O man maybe attack someone who's got a narrative and turn them green and do all that other. But like I said, for me, it was making me laugh I thought it was funny I thought it was funny. It was like, this is such a classic mistake Like you guys are completely out of touch. Delusional Not understanding the backlash of that of just doing open In your face. Like there was no like, hey, look over here. R. It was just in your face, Sion They're not just that. they're also You you're making a green version of a video that exists on Instagram first So it's already out there You don't think the internet is going to see that there's a difference in my skin tone on CNN than on Instagram On Instagram, I look rosy and healthy. I wasn't lying I was making a video. I was if I was really sick, I was outside I was outside, having I was like, I feel good. I felt shitty for a day. I was being completely honest. Nor did I ever think that it was going be controversial to talk about Ivermectin I had no idea. So Iyvermectin was not a controversial substance before I talked about it in that one video. Yeah It was It was normal. You could get it at a pharmacy. Your doctor could prescribe it to you. Mine did, but he also prescribed to me a ton of other stuff. Exactly. Yeah it's so much other stuff. like Fen Bendz old that's now getting a into the same category as Iver Mchton was. And Mel Gibson talked about it here with you. Yes. of that combo There's a study now that shows, I think it's from twenty twenty two cancer treatment like a new Right What the hell? I know. It's not patented. So it's it's a demon It's a demon and these news stations are all complicit. They're all in bed with the pharmaceutical drug companies who, again, are responsible for an enormous part of their advertising budget And that's where they make their money. Yeah. And they don't have a lot of people that believe them anymore. I think they lost a lot of their credibility during the COVID epidemic Oh Med news media. Yeah. Yeah I the government and the government most people are aware like, oh, this is a SciOop. And then of course The final straw was Elon purchasing Twitter and then the Twitter files. So when Matt Tyee and Michael Shechellllenberger and all these different people got a hold of these files whereere you could see the emails between the federal government and these social media companies where they're asking people to censor true stories And you're like, what? And then when Zuckerberg was on my podcast, I explained how the FBI had contacted him and told him that they wanted him to censor stories and censor the Hunter Biden laptop story.'serrifing It's fucking crazy. This is This is literally banana Republic shit. So have you heard of proroject Mockingbird? Yes. Operation M mockingbird? I mean, it's not new So I mean, somebody says like, oh, I can't believe the governments doing this and' like, wait a second Just go just look at history. Right. And Dr. Phil uh, u says one time is a pattern And if you go back, there's way more than one time, this has happened in Operation Mockingbird, Walter Kronkite It was a CIA asset. Yeah Jit CIAS. So's Anderson Cooper. Is he? Anderson Cooper worked for the CIA when he was in college. I didn't know that. Yeah. lookook that up, Make sure that's true I'm not nine percent sure. Ny nine percent sure, rather. Julia Childes Hmm Did you know she was love,autul. She was in the CIA teaching people how to bake I think she did that hand to hand combat course Bck people able put to a rolling pin Was the Andersy Cooper thing correct I believe he worked for the CIA in college Andiston Cooper interned the CIA for two consecutive summers while he was a political science major at Yale University He did not pursue a career in intelligence, wink wink, after graduating, later describing the agency's desk work at Langley as less James Bond than I hoped it would be Well, I think It's all less James Bond It's it's more money It's more money and influence and what do the people in power want people to believe But he's not the only one. Walter Kronkei. There were hundreds Yeah hundredundreds and half So much it was every network and There's no direct there's no declassified document that says here's what we told them to say or here's how compromised they were But they were compromised completely and most likely told exactly what to say or what stories to suppress. Does Mike Wallace have some sort of a connection? I don't know ee if Mike Wallace had some sort of a connection with the CIA. But it's a bunch of prominent respected trusted News anchors Yes all over the place. Yeah This was through the fifties, sixties, I think in the beginning of the seventies until this thing called the Mike Wallace is famous for his probing investigative reporting on CBS's sixty minutes regarding the CIA, most notably a landmark nineteen ninety three report call titled The CIA's Cocaine exposed So he's the opposite So he worked to expose CIA stuff. The report exposed a covert CIA anti drug operation in Venezuela that allowed hundreds of millions of dollars in cocaine to be smuggled Okay, this is Iran contra affair Okay, so it's opposite But with so many things, like somebody's like, oh, I can't believe COVID's doing this. like, Well look at history again. Like we dosed millions of people with LSD against their consent, against their. W the millions I think well, there were experiments with aerosol. forms of LSD that were in cities in What I didn't know about that. Jamie. Aerosol LSD in cities Somewhere near Like Vermont or Boston. somewhere in like the New England area U What kind of a psycho do you have to be to like get a crop duster plane and fill up a tank of LSD and just spray it on kids I don't don't I don't get it. And then you go back to when we dosed don't know I don't know how many African Americans with syphilis or we like grouped them together. they had syphilis and didn't treat them and gave them fake treatments and stuff. U.S government has never openly sprayed LSD from their air over entire cities. However, during the Cold War, intelligence agencies in the military did conduct covert aerosol and mind control experiments on the public What does that mean? It means you did it. Yeah, notot from a plane though most likely. They were like they probably out a fan and a bucket C CIA's notorious project MK Ultra sought to weaponize LSD and use it for mind control CIA operators are sent to San Francisco to spray the air with LSD twenty five at an unwitting party of guests. Oh, I did hear about this. The result, The agency ultimately abandoned the specific aerosaol at the last minute because the summer weather was too hot They keep the windows closed and their specialized aerosol device malfunctioned. There we go. Nber two, the army sprayed thousands of unsuspecting Americans with Aerosolized chemicals. Yeah, military released a fine powder called zinc cadmiian sulfide over thirty three rural and subb urban rather and rural areas Scroll up a little bit, please The targeted cities affected cities included Stt Louis, Minneapolis, Winneipeg, Corpus Christie, and Fort Wayne. Staint Louis was deliberately chosen because of its population density and the terrain were similar to the Soviet targets like Moscow something else You know about this Why the fuck did Dan Rather and Donald Rumfeell buy a New Mexico ranch together in nineteen eighty one? That's the same year he was promoted the news anchor at CBS Evening News. Good. It's also like right next door to the Epstein ranch Right and Epstein famous got that to be close to Los Alamos, right So he could lure those scientists over. with Puss Unbelievable. Yeah. But I mean, like you go back through history, this is Everybody's like, oh, the COVID was crazy. It's not new It's just we hadn't experienced it so blatantly before because they had never tried something like that during the age of social media And they used a playbook that relied on putting a letter in the mail They're sending a telegram Yeah, they use a playbook also that required having control over the narratives that were being pushed out by the media. Yeah. And the media had lost its luster, It lost its impact on people. At the same time, the rise of podcasts had happened kind of under the radar and they didn't recognize it. They missed it They just overestimated their position Yeah, and during COVID, you had more viewers than CNN. Not only that, when they turned me green and all that cancellation, I gained two million followers on Spotify in a month Yeah. Wow peopleeople were just like, what is going on that everybody's trying to cancel this guy? Like what is he doing? And then they'd listen and go, Oh It's just a show where they talk to people What are they trying to hide from us? And then you have guys on like Dr. Peter McCull and Robert Malone and all these different people that are Peter McCullough is the most published doctor in history. In human history, in his particular field of study And they were trying to make him out to be a quack. And then you see what they did with Jab Batacharia and all these different people. And onene of those guys was the inventor of MRNA. Robert Malone, He has nine patents on the creation of MRNA technology. And he should never be out there telling people that it might not be safe. Not only that, he took it and had a fucking serious, horrible reaction where he almost died Really? Yeah, which is what prompted him to try to figure out what the fuck is going on Be he was assured by everyone that it stayed local. It's not going to cause massive inflammation and you know Myocarditis and all these different things that it eventually absolutely causing. You know, And then there's, you know, they're trying to hide now the impact that it's had on children You know, the impact that it's had on children that took it and how what giant percentage of them that died after taking it died within days of the injection. Yeah. And they're trying to ignore the signal And there's so many gaslighters all over Twitter. There's people that are paid to gaslight on Twitter That's a fact. they there's pharmaceutical drug companies, just like a lot of other companies will pay people to post pay people to attack. They'll pay people to be the voice of authority and reason so you can assure All the brainwash boomers that they're right all along and everything's fine Yeah, and If you just look at basasic manipulation and mind control The number one fear of human beings is supposedly public speaking, right Um That's not it. It's the judgment that might come from public speaking. It's not the being on stage. Right. It's like, is somebody going to judge me? Am I going to get ostracized So the way that they control a lot of this and gaslight people is to use the fear of social punishment and social enforcement and If I can get one celebrity to go out there and call these people a name and just give them a name as if it's a group of people. You know, like anti vaxer, conspiracy theorist, dragon believer. That kind of thing, we give it a name and that makes it easier for other people to socially enforce. and it comes from an authority figure So you get the tribe involved and all you got to do is Fuck up a few people like Robert Malone. and And they're like, hey, I've got I can I can take this guy down Yeah. What do you think I'm going to do to you And you just get that fear out there That's all you need to do. And you kind of gaslight people because now I'm scared enough, but I won't say I'm scared. I'll say, now, I'd rather not just say my opinion So now my identity gets tied into it. Now it's part of who I am. I'm just not going to say anything. And it gets normalized. likeike the absolute just let me mute myself and take my mouth shut so I don't get punished. And then there's a bunch of people that attack and do the work for the man because they don't want to be lumped in with the other side. So they'll go on social media and call the antiv vaxcers, you know plague rats and all these different things. Yeah. and also say the wildest shit. like their children should be taken from them. they should be locked up, isolated from society And this is something called category warfare. Have you ever heard of this I know the expression. This guy, I can't remember his name. He wrote a book called Women, Fire and Dangerous Things. It was the first language categories that we had for language. was Women, fire and Dangerous stuff. I think his name was Laken. George Lacen or lake offff But If we If I frame something using a category, I can change what the allowed behavior is So if I say that me and this other person are having a disagreement Your brain automatically has a list of what a disagreement is and what's acceptable But if I say we're having a fight Now there's new stuff on the table. And all I did was change how something is defined in your brain. And we don't consciously process that our brain is getting permission to do things because of a category. But if I say, I've been at war with these people For a long time, now war is way different. Or if I say like, I disagree with Rogan, That's one thing, but if I say Rogan is a threat What do we do to something that's a threat? right? We have to neutralize a threat R. So just small words like that change what our brain says is permissible in that moment. And that is really what's going on here. So it's actually two layers. if I can go into this for a second or Number one is this category. Let me just get a category out there to make your brain think one thing is permissible The second thing is, I create the idea in such a way that you get to feel morally superior for adopting it. and you don't have to have any new morals or anything else. You just have to adopt this idea and you get to feel better than other people And that's it So I changeed the category, it means like I can do something differently. So in a legal argument If somebody says we're at war with the other side, this is my opponent instead of the other person. What do we do with an opponent? We have to take them down, It's a fight, there's a winner, there's a loser. There's always assumed competition there That is one of the biggest things that I hope everybody can look out for as the influence SIOP expert And I'm not immune to any of the stuff buy stupid shit on off of an Instagram ad as much as the next person But it's important to know when it's when something clearly presented to you And it's easy to feel emotional about it. you're being manipulated something clearly presented and it's just like, here's this one thing and it's really clean and it's easy to get pissed off about or it's easy to feel comfortable about or whatever it is, if the emotional thing is easy without having to dig into it, you're being manipulated. and That's a giant percentage of what most people consume It's yeah all day long And it's It's compounding. So if I just consume a little bit, that's one thing. But now I get a little bit more, a little bit more, a little bit further into this rabbit hole We get in these obviously, everyone says this online, but you get into these echo chamber of social media All of a sudden, can you can find your people anywhere you can connect with your people. If you'd like to make knitted yarn vest for hamsters You can find other people that do shit like that So back in the day, if you had a bad idea, You couldn't find a lot of other people that agreed with you And now it's easier to find people to agree with you when you have a shitty idea there's a niche, there's a whole separate niche. And on top while you're They are getting told that your ideas are relevant and normal. They're not abnormal because there's so many other people. It normalizes bad ideas The second part of that is I'm with all these people, but then I go back to normal social media and all I get told all day is I'm right about those people. I'm right about those people. I'm right about those people. And it's just It is so sick. whichich goes back to what we were first talking about, how performative our world is and like Now All of us conceal this shame so much that we can't ever be seen by anybody. likeike we'll go to the grave and feel like My wife has never even seen who I truly am And then the other thing is nuts is people have this complete inability to admit when they're wrong or change course. They have connected themselves. They've connected their their their whole being to whatever their thoughts are whatever this thing that they've agreed is real And once they've defended it They never want to go back and objectively look at it and go, wait a minute Oh, I believe this and that's not the case. Oh this is the case. Oh I'm wrong. Oh no. I got a I got a course correct. No dig in and they try to find other echo chambers that agree with their initial position and other people that and there's plenty of people that provide those services for you Plenty of people. if you want to live in your echo chamber, plenty of people real and digital that will provide you this escape from your ability to learn and grow and a sycophantic AI will do will help you. Oh, they're the best. They'll tell you, you're wonderful, Darling. You're doing the best I always tell people, you're not your ideas. and it's one of the most important things that I've ever learned. You cannot be married to your ideas. Your ideas are just ideas. And as soon as you defend them, And as soon as you connect yourself to them and as soon as you connect your identity to them, you're in a fucking trap You're in a real trap and it's very hard to get out without admitting defeat. Most people don't want to admit defeat And that's how they look at it. Look It's like a battle for their existential existence existence is completely tied into their belief system. Yeah And then we call that cognitive dissance, right? So I either have to say, I'm a dumbass or Those other people are stupid. Right Like when Biden won the election That was the same thing people on the right either had to admit, wow, I'm stupid and I underestimated what our country's doing or the other people are just idiots and they don't know what's on. Same thing happened when Trump got elected. Either like the whole country is stupid or I have to admit that I didn't know what was going on and I'm out of touch a little bit. and maybe there's something good You just I'll just say they're all stupid protecting our identity is so It's ingrained into us. It's the ego. thing I don't want to be wrong and If I am wrong and I'm wrong in public, then I risk ostracism again. So it's like it's getting kicked out of the tribe again. It's going back to the same fear. And people love to do that too. They love to attack people If they're wrong, loveve to destroy people and ruin all credibility that they've ever had that they've you could have been a public figure for ten years putting out great information. you fuck one thing up People want to banon you forever, especially if you don't admit it. especially Oh, you're running for office? What about that You took a nude when you were nineteen. You took a naked photo. fuck. And that goes back to everyone's pretending like their like everyone else has got their shit figured out. and that's why everyone thinks everybody's got it figured out and I'm pretending. I'm the one hiding everything.'m. Everyone's got that shit. Everyone who thinks like, oh, they're going to find out my skelet. Everybody's got skeletons everybody's got stuff like that it's we're in the age where We're comparing ourselves to highlight reels. and you know, Dr. Phil talks about this all the time. But we have to realize that There is people want you to be human And we don't enjoy fake shit. This is why people are attracted to your podcasts. This is why stuff that's real is trending so much more now. Like we're attracted to things that are human and flawed. That's why we buy shit that says hand madeade on it. We don't bu like, oh machine made. No one celebrates that, right? R We like the humanness of things Um Even when I say there's a loneliness epidemic going on right now, everyone will nod their head, and no one will raise their hand Everyone will say, oh yeah, it's affecting all those people But no one will say, it's affecting me, but they'll all notod alone I think we're getting to a place where Maybe we're coming out of that. just maybe it's me, maybe it's my echo chamber, but I feel like people are waking up. I feel like more people not just through COVID, but just Now just the way the world is. they're like, well, you know what? this doesn't really feel. It doesn't really It feels weird for me to hate and feel hatred towards one of my neighbors who didn't vote like I did. That feels weird Yeah just to hate someone For that reason I think people are waking up that Maybe the plan is going too fast. Maybe they're taking it too quickly. They're trying to go through all these steps too fast. is what it feels like to me. Well also I don't think They're competent. I don't think they're good at it And that's part of the problem. G at what good at projecting narratives. I don't think the people that are necessarily in charge of propaganda, at least people at a government level I don't think they're particularly slick. No, And that's part of the problem with all this. It's like when you're at a middle school sleepover and the dad comes in trying to be cool. It's like, Hey kids, what are you guys doing? That's the government trying to run this shit. This is when you get syringes dancing on stage on a late night TV show.ight. That was nuts it's also a person who seems completely insincere You know, Yeah, that that version of him. it's weird because the version of him that was on the the Daily showh was awesome. Like it was this character and irreverent. Yeah. it was raw,reverent. Yeah But you realize, oh, that was just really good wriders They have really good riders. created a fun repepublican character that was a buffoon But like a hilarious fone. And then he went and did a TV show and you're like, Oh, the real you is weird I think our saving grace is what you're talking about is that they suck at this. like yeah When your teacher announces there's going to be a pizza party and expects everybody to be super freaking out about it, like, yeah, it's pizza But the government's like, hey, guess what we got for you? Yeah We got this new data coming out, this new data. and The Sci ops are working less because of the spread of information. So people say, o, social media is bad. You shouldn't be on social media Some of that is what's exposing this stuff. Yes. And we have people out there that are that are like you and I'm not kissing your ass here, but you're willing to say shit that sounds preposterous at the beginning of something and just make an observation that's real And you're willing to just the way that Ive phrased this in a lot of our training at the my training is called NCI The way that we phrase this is like the first ingredient of confidence is the willingness to receive social injury And we need more of that We need more people willing to receive social injuries. Well, the position that I was in during the COVID thing was very unique So It was almost easy for me. because I had already I hadd gotten such a head start. I was so far ahead of them. they didn't realize that my ability to say, wa is This doesn't make any sense. L none of this makes any sense. And also, why am I green? And also why are you guys lying? Why are you lying about all sorts of different things? Why are you measuring troponin levels when you're talking about myocarditis and not the actual scans of people's hearts when you realize like young people are getting legitimately fucked up from this vaccine. Not all of them, but some of them Why why aren't you looking at that? How come you guys aren't looking at vaccine injuries? It seems like a significant thing that people are talking about. You got soccer players dropping dead in the middle of the field And no one's bringing that up. You're trying to gaslight us into thinking that that doesn't make any sense I was in a unique position to be able to do that because I had like almost like quietly Knuck up to this had this large audience that they weren't aware of So when it happened, it was just It was was like, I couldn't do anything other than what I did. I had to just keep doing it the way I did it And it was the blowback was crazy. They tried to crush my sponsors. They organized campaigns. There was packs involved. It was there really. Oh yeah Oh yeah God I was on Spotify And thank, Spotify is not an American company. And also, it helped that I was number one in like ninety countries and not number ninety in one country Yeah, that helped. Yeah, that helped a lot the size of it. was it was like it was so big that as big as they were, they're like, o And then there's the streiceand thing. like you try to silence something. Youre you're just going to make it bigger. If I went to if they kick me off of Spotify and I had to go to Rumble, it would have just blown rumble stock up and it would who have helped everybody I didn't know that there was that much shit going on your life. I can't even talk about it, but there was Presidents involved and former presidents involved that were contacting Spotify. Oh yeah Oh yeah, trying to get me removed for vaccine misinformation. Yeah. wow that turned out to be right All of it, not a single fucking apologize interviewing the dude that invented MRNA. Oh yeah and the most published doctor in his field. N a single apology. Not a single apology from anybody. notot a single retraction, not a single you know Mia Culpa, not a single we were wrong And you know, I lost a lot of sponsors. I lost a lot a lot during that those days. It was interesting It was a there was a there was a time where it was working. I didn't know there was that much coordination. Oh, there was coination. Oh people are going be don't I don't talk about it too much because it's retty It's pretty deep It was nuts. But it didn't work Right? But they tried And they try to they spend a lot of money Oh It wasn't a small amount of money. It wasn't a small amount of people It was a lot of people and a lot of money Good Lord. ye. That part was spooky But the turning my face green was hilarious. That's good Its also, I'm a comedian. You know what I mean? Like I'm a shit talker. Like that's what I do. If you talk shit to me, it's like, you're not gonna to hurt my feelings that much. It's like I'm used to it. It's normal It is a part of the game that I play So, you know, especially if You're doing it and there's a video that's the real video that's available for anybody that goes on my Instagram page. L fucking retards like is crazy. It' a stupid checker move It's so dumb. And I think that that what we see is authority hasn't changed in two hundred thousand years. but I think that what we consider to be social authority been modified just kind of in the human side of things. Yeah likeike it used to be Oh, this guy's got a suit and tie on. Now all these CEO's are wearing a hoodie or a t shirt or something. Like the visual Deinition of authorities changed and The social definition of authority has started to change now. where it used to be mainstream news and now we're moving into like a post News era of something. I don't know what the next Wells going to be. I mean, what Elon always says is you are the news now. and the the rise of independent journalists and what you have, what you're selling What is your currency is authenticity and Honesty. Yeah. and as long as you don't break from that As long as people don't find out, oh, he's secretly getting all this money from APAC, secretly getting all this money from Russia, secretly getting all this money And you know, oh, there's meetings where they've had, where they've told people what narratives to push. and then you see people on Twitter that are you supposedly new influencers And then you see them almost cut and pasted the exact same message over and over again And then you find out, oh, theres actual campaigns where you're paid large sums of money If you have a large following, large sums of money, like significant amount of money be a person who pushes narratives online. That's your job. You are literally a paid propagandist. And on people find that out You're going to lose a lot of your people that are paying attention to you that take you seriously, but there's going to be enough that don't know about it that just see the tweet and like, oh my God, is that true? Yeah like oh my go, that's crazy. enough casuals where you're going to get some traction, but you have sacrificed the one thing that you need to survive in this environment. and that's authenticity and honesty. If you don't have those two things, you're fucked Because when the mind reading software gets uploaded and everybody knows You and me will be all right. Yeah They would probably look at some of our brains and go, dude You're fucked up But you're fucked up too. Everybody's fucked up. We're all fucked up. It's like how do you behave What do you do? how do you manage your fucked up atness What do you do What do you do with your time? What do you do with your life Yeah, we're going to know. We're going to know And we're going to know a lot of people online are just demons They're just demons like in the real sense of the term. like if if you thought of what Have you had a demon And if you were a demon If if actual Demons were real What would they be doing What would they be doing? Well, they would most certainly be trying to ruin people's lives. They would most certainly be trying to spread hate Spread misinformation, confuse people. You can compare yourself to other people. Oh yeah, destroy you psychologically. G you to take medications that you don't need Make you think that you're not enough. Yeah Yeah. make you think you're not enough. takeake money to and sacrifice other people's health and safety just for whatever financial compensation you've got you've been given to push a narrative It's demonic. It's separation. All of that is like you are separate from these people. They don't matter. You shouldn't care about them.' separate. They are different things. you're not connected, you're not the same thing. And that's how people justify bombings. Yeah, you know, That's how people justify war. That's how people justify all sorts of horrific behavior that human beings still engage in What did George Carlins say? I think he said, Conspiracy is not required when interests all align he had so many He said it's a big fucking club. Yep. and you're not at it. you're not He had so many bangers. Yeah, he did But there's a few people that are in the club. That's what's interesting You know, S people to get in that fucking club And you know, and then all of a sudden their opinions change. Allden they soften up on stances or they get killed on a campus. Have you had somebody on your show that you thought was compromised? Oh yeah you have to name names but. Yeah ye, yeah one hundred percent. I've had people on my show that I guarantee are here to try to push a narrative Yeah one hundred percent, no doubt And my own, you know, my it's I think in some cases, it's obvious And my job is to just keep them talking and let the internet do its job Can I teach you a tactic right now? Sure that will be good for these people. yeah. All right. how much time do we have? Well got time. Okay All right, so this is a CIA metethod called elicitation And it was invented by this guy John Nolan And u The basic premise is you're going to get the more sensitive information you need out of a person, the less questions you should be asking. So here's how it works You can get sensitive information out of people betteret with statements than questions So there's a few different types of these statements. So the first one is called a provocative statement And the provocative statement is just making a commentary on what somebody said. So let's say I just went through X and Y and Z and you're like, so, so basically and then you kind of recap what I said And so no question. and then I'll kind of yeah, and So I'll kind of I'll keep giving you a little bit more information The second is triggering a need to correct the record So let's say, you and I are in a grocery store and I say, Joe Um Let's say you don't get recognized. Let's say go over there. I want you to within sixty seconds, I want you to find out how much the girl that's stocking the shelf over there makes per hour So you might go over there and be, hey, how much do you make an hour, but instantly you're weird. And that feels like an interrogation, right But if you went over there and you said, Hey, I just read this article. everybody that works at Whole Foods got bumped up to twenty six dollars an hour, that's fantastic. Congratulations. And she's like, what? We only make twenty two And now she doesn't feel interrogated And the answer came from correcting the record Does that make sense? Yeah. So now you're not a weirdo who's asking how much she makes. Yeah. So now you got the sensitive information and it felt like it was just a flowing conversation. So the third is disbelief So somebody says something and you don't get Jamie to pull up anything The disbelief is like they say, oh, and I've even worked with X and y and zer. I've done this one thing and you're like, what There is no way. that just sounds impossible And then they're like, no, and and they'll keep going because there wasn't a question. So imagine if someone started telling you something sensitive and you're like, yeah, tell me more Tell me more about that It seems like you're kind of wanting to pull things out. So the more that you can use statements The more they're just gonna keep feeling completely comfortable giving you stuff. What's interesting is I don't know those methods, but I do all three of those. You do a lot of that stuff. Yeah. I just wanted you to be able to consciously grab onto it. I just do it instinctively Yeah. I do I mean. I smell bullshit. Yeah. My instinct is go hold on. So what you're saying is And you just give a touch of incredulity, just a little bit of Little bit of skepticism. Yeah and then allow them to kind of like expand on it and go okay, so you're saying that this. all right. so are you sure that that's the case? becausecause a lot of people think this No, no,. And I do it sort of naturally. Yeah Because the most important thing is to listen as much as possible and keep them talking And don't interrupt too much But sometimes you have to. Sometimes you have to like you're pushing hold on. This is hors shit. Like this is like I'm going to get grilled for this online if I don't like stop this right dead in its tracks because I know and you know say you're lying Yeah. So let's And then but you also got to like keep them on the hook. So like like you don't want to submit them yet. You got to like, look you got out of the arm bar. crazy. And a couple of those, you make them correct you and you also say like, well, that had to be challenging or that sounds fascinating And just those tiny little comments that just kind of keep them pulling along The Russians did this to America during the Cold War the a submarine would pull into Singapore or Thailand or something. and one of the some KGB guy would go up There's a nineteen year old sailor at a bar and say like, well, we just Russia already has all these specs and It's amazing that Russian submarines are faster than U S. submarines because our propellers are nineteen feet wide And the say was like, yeah, ours are twenty one. like Just justust correcting the record. Just a tiny little thing, correcting the record, and some nineteen year old kid gives away top secret information in thirty five seconds. Wow So that's where this stuff came about. And When you're like a if you work in the nuclear field, you have a top secret clearance. You have to go through anti elicitation training before you leave the country. and go spend time with some foreign national companies. I hope so And you know what the number one thing in the first day of counter intelligence school The first thing they say is If you're a four, And she's a ten And she's interested in you. She's a spy That is the most primal and effective of all tactics is hot women. It is. And also we see with James O'Keee, Chatty gay guys You see a lot of like hot guys Y. Yeah, you get chatty gay guys give up a lot of data. Yeah. They give up a lot of fucking information way more than I would ever think. Oh, it seems like the chatty gay guys are worse even than the guys that are trying to impress the women Yeah I wonder how far they have to go. I wonder how many guys they have to sleep with I don't want I wonder, I mean, for sure there's been a straight guy or two unless they recruit gay guys for the job. You know because gay guys wouldn't feel nearly as bad. for having sex with another gay guy to get information out of him, I think than a woman would A woman would feel like a whore. You know, a man who fuck some other guy that youd probably fuck anyway That's probably no big deal You know, Go feels bad about that. And have you ever read Red Queen? No, it's about. biological behavior. It talks about like adultery. females occurs during ovulation most of the time. and Re Fascinating stuff in there But one of them was that women are reluctant about sexual activity because they face the risk of raising a child alone. M It's not a conscious thing like there's some biological driver that says If I am not careful here, I'm going to be stuck with this child alone. and if I and two hundred thousand years ago, if you're If someone abandons you and you're pregnant. and then you're raising a child and you're kind of off the market And and no one's bringing you meet. No one's bringing you. You know, fish out of the river and all this kind of stuff I thought that was interesting and that may be one of the reasons that it might be easier for dudes to Go do something like that. Yeah. Well, we'd have to ask James There's there's got toa be a reason. Well, it's also I think especially in politics There's a large amount of in the closet, gay guys that are in all sorts of levels of politics. all sorts of levels of government. M no doubt. Yeah. I think it's been that way since Rome though. Oh yeah Yeah Um it's a very peculiar person in the first place that wants to control all the other people. Yeah, Well, you know the difference between today and Rome is the concealment of the shame about it. And I think most people don't know the difference between shame and guilt I think they Shame is a destructive force. There's nothing good about it. There's nothing positive about it But Gilt is focused on understanding the behavior And shame is focused on the person, the identity of the person who did it. And there's nothing productive like beating this shit out of yourself emotionally It does not make the other person who you've harmed any better. It doesn't make the world any better. It's a down. I made a video on my YouTube channel basasically giving a review and a tutorial of Planet Earth as if it was a video game And like what's that video called U I think it's called Earth is a game Ooh. So it's basically like a twenty minute like withithout breaking character, like I'm giving a review. I'm actually in the game right now and I'm making a tutorial and a review of this video game. that we call Eth One of the things I said in the video is like the developers don't tell you Like what the main goals are of the game. like how do I get on the leaderboard? What's the way that how do you win We went through like ten different metrics, but at the end of the day I think what gets you on the leaderboard is, were you an upward force on most people's lives that you encountered? Did you leave people better than you found them About it That's about fucking it. Wow. It's like am I a downward force on other people? Am I pushing people down constantly? or am I just doing something else And you remember like that The moment you launch into a DMT, you're like, oh my God, I was worried about taxes. I'm seventeen black holes away and I was worried about my I nine form or something. I thought that was such a big deal. And it's the same thing that people Like I think if you want to learn the number one and this is my not rambling, but The number one lesson I think most people can learn is from people that are dying People on their deathbed, there's no better book you could read about how to master this game, about how to get good at Earth is reading the regrets of dying people