Antelope Hunting and North American History

Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience During my day, Joe Rogan podcast my night all day . Gentlemen, first of all, thank you for being here. I couldn't wait to talk to you. Congratulations on one of the most epic accomplishments in the history of combat sports, and that's not an understatement. I mean, it might be an understatement. I mean, it's not an overstatement. It's perfect. That was one of the greatest nights I've ever experienced of watching anything in my life. It was amazing. And have you cap it off and win the title when you're facing a guy that everybody thought was at least number two pound for pound . It was like him and Islam or number one and number two . And some odds had you at six to one , which I thought was very disrespectful. I thought like this is crazy. Like six to one's crazy. Like Illy is really good, but so's Justin, this is kind of nuts . Like to have you win the way you won in front of the fucking White House Yeah . How's it feel? You know, it's really not real yet. I was expecting to have like an internal sense of relief that like I don't have something to chase because I was always chasing this belt and I was expecting to wake up with like some kind of natural release of pressure, but I don't know I don't feel that. As the days go by every day I feel a little bit more, a little bit more. Two days ago my dad was like, you know, what was it like waking up being the champion? And I was like, I haven't even thought about that . And then I was, you know, on the shitter. Like ten minutes later, I was sitting there thinking about it. I was like, wow , I'm the fucking champion. It's fucking crazy . And yeah, it's just, I mean, I've just been on the grind for so many years now. My dad dropped me off nineteen years ago in Colorado. I knew nobody to wrestle. And yeah, to see where I'm at now is just absolutely incredible. I mean, there's really no way to explain how or why , you know, or like why I deserve it or what I mean , I worked my ass off. I have made mistakes, you know, I've done things the wrong way, but I've always corrected and got back on the path. And you know, I think the coaches, the ment , but mostly the coaches that I've been, you know, in the team that I have around me is a huge reason why I was able to stay on track and just keep moving forward and keep trusting that , you know, I belong in the top of the league . Well, you've clearly shown it throughout your career. And having a great coach like Trevor, one of the reasons why I wanted to bring in Trevor's because you guys have a very unique relationship. First of all, I love the YouTube series, the Art of Violence. Fantastic . And what's great is watching you two guys work together and Trevor, you being like very acutely aware of when to pull him back, when to ramp it up, when to push. Like you're you guys having a relationship like that is so critical because you guys know each other so well. You've seen him perform so many times. You've seen him fight and perform in the gym that you know where he's at all the time . And having that sense of where your fighter is at any given time in camp because you know him so well, boy, that's a giant advantage . It is. Whoa, hold on. Oh my God . Testies test . Yeah, I think that's a huge advantage is knowing your athlete. And 've been doing this for a long period of time, but there's lots of coaches out there that consider their fighters their friends. I do consider them one of my best friends, but I put myself more in like a father position position of I need to know when to tell them the truth and I've got myself in trouble with that with fighters where you tell them the truth so hard that you have to let them go like a child like hey if we were not the same beliefs go live life and see how it is and then when you return , I'm still going to love you . Having that type of thing where I have to be dead honest for your career, not because it helps us now and it feels good right now at the moment. I have to look at that from the time that we start and we talk about what are his goals and then my job is to be an advisor, be a mentor to get him to that place as best as I can because these are his goals and I want to support those . in And the beginning of his career his goals were to be the most violent guy out there, the most remembered the guy that every time someone bought a ticket, they remember Justin Gage selling that show and then it turned into no, I want to have this belt. And that was hard because we did go and not get the belt twice. And you know, it's so cool to be in the kind of those scenarios where it's like, Dan, you had two opportunities. Now it's never going to happen . And that's what life is. Life is one of those things that you keep getting up and chase your goals. You never know how it's going to happen. And yes, you want to dream and you want to have a you want to have a plan, but I'll tell you right now through all the times that I've had championship fighters in business and life , the plans never work. You always have to adjust them, but it's that dream and that vision to get you to the top of stairs. You have to get up each one of those steps. So Justin went out there and wrote a story that I don't think will ever be forgotten and he did it one round at a time. And that's what impresses me because his mindset, I love the mental game. I love to talk about the mental game, even like Illiot, Illia is a special guy with how he uses his mental. The secret, the if I see it, I believe it, it'll happen to a point. You know, it's like I always tell people like if you want if you go on the ice cream aisle and you're like, Hey, I don't know what ice cream I want, you're going to stand there and go that one looks good. That one looks good. That one looks better. The people there are like, I want mint chocolate chip. You get in there, you get it done, you grab that mint chocolate chip, you walk out. Very similar to I llia last' threes fights. He went out there and he demanded what he wanted. His confidence got him through that, but it makes it very hard when you get that stale nasty rotten milk fucking mint chocolate chip and you start to go, oh shit, what is going to happen now? So I think the relationship that we have is me guiding him, me pulling him back at the strictly situation. Hey, let's pull back a little bit. Let's let's focus on what's going on. I don't want no distractions. And having someone and he trusts that I care about him. I love him to death. I love his family. Like our relationship is so strong and I need that with my athletes. And I'm just blessed and one hundred years I say honored, but more importantly , humbled by someone who I've never worked mental with who shows me different ways to the mental game of fighting , which I feel I'm very high level with is it's something that if you put it yourself around people that make you better , this guy makes me better daily, and I'm very grateful for that. This episode is brought to you by Create, the leading brand in creatine. You love their gummies, but now they've also launched creatine plus electrolytes mix, perfect for hot summer months. Creatine is proven to support gains in strength , lean muscle mass, and aid recovery, but it also has cognitive benefits, more energy, focus and neuroprotection. Plus they're NSF certified for sport and third party tested for safety and potency. Visit try create dot co slash rogen use promo code Rogan for twenty percent off and free shipping on your first subscription order. 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And you said you don't have any expectations when you fight that way you don't you don't get thrown off. Yeah, I mean it's huge. I mean my expectations come from my hard work. Obviously, I expect my body to perform . I understand I've trained my mind to and you know, maybe the narcissist tendencies in me love showing off and performing in front of thousands of people on that stage . That's what I love the most about this. And that's what my personality like I'm very competitive. I want to win , but I'm never going to lie to myself. And that's how I 've I've never had a coach in my entire career since four years old of wrestling have to pull me aside and talk about the mental aspect of competition because it's always been so natural to me. I'm not sure if I'm not sure if it's because they see that I'm doing good and that they agree with my approach mentally or they don't understand what's going on or but I've just always been so comfortable and so content my situation of you know, this is the competition. It's the game . You know, I'm very competitive. I'm very petty. I take everything personal . And yeah, when I go in there with I have gone in with expectations and it's I said it before the fight. You know, Alia, like I said so many true things to him and I think it was such a it's such an asset to tell someone the brutal truth, especially someone like him because it pushes them farther away from the truth. You know, he even if I tell him the exact truth and exactly what's going to happen and you know you're making a mistake by having all these expectations and when we go to round two and when we go to round three and it's not going as you predicted it or wanted it to or expected it to , then where do you go from there? And you know, I said that exact thing to him and then that pushed him farther away from it. And you know, I 'm almost like you wanted to prove you wrong. Yeah, he wanted to prove he wanted to prove himself right . You know, and he was unwilling to be open to opin ions and because obviously I don't know him he knows them better than himself, but you know, I got here because I am coachable. I got here because I listen. I use every like I posted yesterday, every person place or thing that has happened to me or for me has ultimately molded my mind and my body to be able to deal with the situation that happened on Sunday night. And you know, I can I can pull so much experience from the past, my losses, my wins , setbacks, failures , accomplishments. I mean, there's so much to learn from you know, every day is a learning experience and I constant ly try to learn and be better. And I don't know why I'm able to perform like that. I think I just think it's who I am. You know, when I when I say I wanted to be the most exciting fighter ever, it's not that I wanted to be the most exciting fighter ever. The thought of that was fucking cool to me , you know, but I was just being me and I've been blessed to be able to, you know, through my through my childhood, through coming from a small town, through having, you know , unwavering support from my family and my friends and my coaches and my teachers and everybody from, you know, for it's just crazy to be able to come out on top. I mean, it's just crazy One of the things I think was a giant factor in the fight is that you have been in wars . You've been in a bunch of wars. Yeah . And Ili really it only had some rough moments against Ji Herbert . You know, use of Zala gave him some problems, but it was nothing serious . The wars that you've been in, these just down and dirty brawls that you've been in , you 're comfortable with the back and forth. You're comfortable with enduring . You know that you're not going to break. You know, if your body holds up, you're going to keep fighting and you can endure. I don't think he'd ever experienced that before . So when you didn't break in the second round I think you made a mistake and I think you're correct about that. You said he made a mistake by going to the ground. Absolutely. He hurt you to the body. I told Trevor yesterday, I think , you know, him hurting to my body was the reason one of the main reasons I won . You know, when he when he hit me when I dropped, it wasn't the first time he hit me in the body. That was probably like the fourth or fifth one. And he had landed some really clean shots and he could probably sense that I was in trouble and hurt. And I think that fact made him dump everything because it was his last chance to take me out and he almost did take me out. But when I went down in hinds always easy to make these decisions in hindsight, but when I went down, you know, he said he's had way more submissions than he has knockouts. And so for him not to have that belief that he's going to be able to go down there, especially with the Kabibi, especially with the Charles Lawre Fight, especially with all the negativity around my grappling. There, you know, I think he would have been foolish not to because I would have stood back up . I would have stood back up and he would have charged forward tried to, finish me. I would have jumped on his legs I would have pulled guard. He was going to end up on top of me no matter what. I wasn't going to sit there and trade with him again. Like I would have front rolled into into grappling situations or whatever. I would have made him cover me. But I think me getting hit is what made him completely blow his you know, Shane Carwines blow his tank and you know, go for the win. And I think that was the choice he had to make because it was going to continue to get worse. I beat his ass in the first round. Like it might have been close in the scorecards. I absolutely took the first round, but the amount of damage that I inflicted in the first round set up the rest of the fight. I do think it was a mistake. And you're saying what you're saying is so correct. But what I'm saying is from a standpoint of him demanding it, he's going to finish you into first two , understanding the damage that he was taking. He took big risks. He got in there. He kept his hands on your collarbones. He was landing really good shots. He had the two body shots before that, that left hook to deliver , that the sound it made was crazy. That last one was clean. It was precise and deep , but you could tell it was already there. But if he didn't put that pressure on hisself, and this is what I mean by mistake is like when you come out, you have to know that you're going five rounds. And he knew that he had to unleash everything right there. If he would have been smart in that scenario saying, Hey, we got five rounds. Let me step back a little bit. Let me do some damage, but also he's like, Hey, let me get you out of there quick. Justin, you know, can't grapple, can't do all these things with a lot of people think, which Justin's a great grappler. And what was so smart about you is when you get tired , that's where the worst decisions happen is that's one of my big things is coaching is we get someone tired and then we make them make bad decisions and then we capitalize on that on those mistakes . Justin was able to stay so composed here with being speared to the body. And when you take a liver shot, it is way different than a headshot. A headshot takings a like shot with your bud dies at the bar. It's like, hey, let's go, you know, but you take a body shot, you're dying. Like your liver shot, you feel like you're dying. And Justin all the decisions he made on the ground from the triangle, from the arm bar, from not being flat . So many good decisions were made in that scenario. And I do think it was a mistake. Obviously, there's so many different ways it could go, but those type of moments in fights are what make fights great is overcoming obstacles . And he had set that up. He had said it. He's like, Hey, I'm going to overcome anything. I'm going out there , put the worst thing out there. Like, what are you gonna do to be? I've already been knocked out of the last second of a freakin huge fight by Max. Like, you can't do nothing worse to me. And that mindset, I think, is something to take away for all the fighters out there that always I love how you say it . Expect a war always . Some of the biggest mistakes that I've made with fighters that I had allowing them to think that they're going to go through this fight easy and then that fight becomes super hard. You think it's going to be a war and then you're like, Hey, it wasn't as bad as I was expected even if it was a little bit of a war. They're not going to help them in that moment. Yeah, there's no pulling them out. That's fighting. Fighting, like fighting is mentality. I look at this. Like there's techniques out there and there's things like that. What makes this sport inspirational and makes someone that want to go out there and beat cancer because they were inspired by a fighter , it's not the technical piece. It's getting back up and it's okay to get knocked down. I love watching people get knocked down because my favorite part is seeing how they get up. And that to me is why I love fighting how people get up. Yeah, how they endure and that was the big story of that second round that you figured out a way to get through it and the change in tempo in the third round was very obvious because the sprint that you have to make like what Illya did when he was trying to finish you that, he used so much fucking energy. And the great Chale Sonin once said that if you try to win by knockout and fail you won't win by submission . Yeah. And a lot of times that's the case because you know as good as anybody , if you fucking sprint hard, you wail in the bag with fucking everything you got for two minutes and then they go time . One minute's not enough. It's not enough . Even in preparation too it is tired after that was crazy in preparation crazy preparation for these fights like I'm doing twenty, thirty , forty second sprints at most. I mean, that was that was a two minute sprint for him. Yes. Yeah. And full out full is no power , everything full power, every punch full power. You weren't even trained for that. Can't you got to have spots. Right. And he didn't . He was just unloading. I mean, that's a young man with a tremendous amount of confidence because he's a two division world champion and he thinks he's going to go down as the greatest of all time. And hey, he might still he might have it was twenty eight the odds . The odds are fucking great against that right now because of that loss. I hope he does. I hope he does . I hope he doesn't and I know that he has a skill but I know that he has the skill to be a champion again . However, same thing with Tony Ferguson. I didn't break Tony Ferguson's confidence. I changed the perception of his opponents of him. And that is a huge factor when you go in there like who are you fighting? What do you feel ? You know, before this, he was a guy that would that you couldn't get through, that you couldn't push through, you couldn't survive with. And once I showed people that all you got to do is get through that , then nobody's ever going to go in there with thinking that he's unbeatable now and that was his that was his identity and you know, that's going to be such a tough task for him to fight people that aren't scared of him . That's interesting. That's Mike Tyson in his prime. That's Anderson Silva in his prime where the fight was lost he got in there.. Yeah. Yeah The fight was lost before he even got in there. Physically , now I don't know what the truth is, but all these reports are that he has two fractured orbitals and a broken nose . Just that alone, just the orbitals alone. Like anytime you've got eye injuries, like anything severe with your eyes , long term consequences vary. You know psychological. Absolutely. And your body heal and physical. The body is resilient. Like I'm telling you, I know can bones make stronger bones? Like that is his orbit bones will be stronger. They will be stronger , Justin. The orbital bone , I had my orbital broken and for six months, I'd do this and my tooth would move. And it's right where my sinus cavity is. You remember when you hit me with a spinning elbow? Your tooth would move. Dude, when you push cheek, and my tooth would move. Oh . Summer is great, but it also comes with a lot of chaos, travel and spontaneous plans. So make sure you're taking extra care of yourself with AG one. It's a simple daily health drink that replaces your daily multivitamins, probiotics, prebiotics, adaptogens, and more. Plus, Agi one's ingredients are sourced from quality partners for potency, purity, and nutrient density. Ag one is clinically shown to close common nutrient gaps and support gut health to keep you going all summer long. Wherever this summer takes you, stay on top of your health with AG one. Visit drink ag one dot com slash Joe Rogan and for a limited time get a free morning person hat and an ag one flavor sampler for free in your welcome , K withid your first subscription . That's drink ag dot com slash Joe Rogan. I still feel the soft spot, but this is a very weak area where your sinus cavity is. That's a and you broke both orbitals and the nose. I do believe the bonny is Mirabella Yames. You ever seen Mirab's nose? Yeah. You ever seen the X ray in Mirab's nose? Did I send a jewel? It looks like a spine. Dude, he's got thirty three vertebraes actually. It's live hada levenly fucking crazy. I've had three broken noses. I've had it fixed twice . Yeah, I know you had it fixed. This is one of our bodies. There it is. That's Morob's nose. Oh my God . Oh my God . I mean that looks like a long cocaine binge right there. It took out the whole fucking left side of his bow. He got hit with a sledgehammer. I mean, that's crazy. The nose is crazy. That is crazy. That is like and to fix it , he's going to have to have no contact for like a year. Yeah, that's happening. So he's not going to fix it. He's just gonna deal. Look how turned it is. That the bone I've had my eyes fixed and my nose fixed and my nose was better for qu ality of life. Obviously being able to see was huge, but when your nose is broken, like you have to understand like getting a haircut fucking sucks. You can't breathe through your nose, you mouth open the whole time. You're constantly breathing in fucking ha ir . Like there's so much beat that you do that every time you're joking. Every time you eat food, like you're just , there's something missing . Yeah. Sleep, I wore a nose stripp toed bed for ten years now, you know, now a scab, a permanent scab because of people that take off all the time. Yeah, my nose is used to it now, but yeah, when you got to fix it insane. When you got to fix, which fight was it before the Max fight? Yeah, right before the max fight. And then you could breathe out of it perfectly. Yeah. Is it still good now? Yeah, he broke it, but he didn't break, he didn't fuck with the cartilage. He broke he actually fractured the bone up top so I didn't have to get a face. It's another factor that when we were talking about the fight and you know, people were talking about this matchup with Illia . I said, You have to think about what he did to Fiziv. Fazeiv is a super talented strik . And then you also have to think about the Max Holloway fight because he was pressing in the first round, but he got caught with a jump spinning back kick to the fucking face. And when that was that 's a game changer and it happened at the end of the first round and from that it changed the tone of the fight because it was just dead on. It was perfect. Yeah, and couldn't have landed any better. And the truth of the matter is psychologically I was not , I was not there. I was not prepared mentally for the fight when I fought Max Holloway. It was such a different circumstance. It was, you know, a guy that wasn't in my weight class, it was a guy that I had never thought about fighting It was for fun and that whole the whole experience was so different than any other fight I've ever had when it comes to like being mentally prepared for a fight. What do you attribute that to what was myself, my and us like we took him to fight he didn't want to take the fight and we told him that you're gonna keep the title contention fight because that's what they promised us. That's why he was very one of you guys, everyone who was like, oh something, was different. I was like, well, why didn't you guys fucking say something? He was fighting me. After the fight I knew something was different, but like I needed to know. He told me he said . He's like this. He's like, I just didn't respect him and I'm like, How could you not respect Max? And I didn't catch on to it. So it's like, I'm always looking for flags and things like that. And one hundred percent, I take one hundred percent responsibility because that's how we learn. Everybody makes mistakes. I remember the Tony Ferguson fight, I didn't give any fucking water. You know, like there's like things that we all learn from. But the thing when he had told me that I'm like, how did I not catch that from you? Because he's like, dude, he was a smaller guy just didn't and I was like, dude, Max is like one of the guys that I look up to from the outside that he is talented. I remember thinking what am I looking for? Like what am I afraid of? I kept trying to convince myself that I need to be I need to find what I was to be worried about. And I couldn't find it. So you always need that before a fight. Yeah , yeah, absolutely. No matter how many times you're fighting, right now, right? Yeah. And so like I was, I've never been as present and like, I've never been able to retain a fight and I, you know, before the knockout I was there. Like I was I was in the I was in the in the arena . I saw the lights, I saw the people, I heard the people. Like I've never been there in my life I. think And that I can attribute that to me not being scared and so me not, you know, me not being in a real fight or flight real life or death situation weren't fully focused. You could actually hear the crowd. Yeah, I was like I could hear my thoughts. You know, I had thoughts. I never had thoughts in a fight because I'm so intuitive and reactionary and that one was just so dirty. There was so much and so sure , the kicks, the eye pokes, no, I think I was not I couldn't have beaten that night with the mentality that I had . And that was my last lesson to learn . I've I had made my less, you knowon, my less ons with Oliveera was like, I wanted it so much . I wanted it so bad. And I wanted to perform and I wanted to impress my fans. You know, Rose had a fight that night and she f like abseloltute garbage and I, you know, and I told my coaches like Coach, don't worry. I won't do that to you. He said before we're about to walk 'cause I don't worry coaches. No like that. And coaches pissed and everyone's, you know, my the locker room's all fucked up because Pat's fucking weird. Is that the Carlos Sparza fight? Was that the same night? Yeah I was at home and so there was just and that was again that was my fault. I allowed those things to affect me right and to , you know, affect fighting decisions rather than just being myself . And so that was a huge mistake . Another mistake was winning two or three times in a row and just kind of becoming complacent with how serious what we do is and how dangerous this game is and how much luck and chance are a factor every single night . And so you know, I wasn't doing the extra credit. I wasn't sitting in the sauna at home, you know, and I don't know, I don't know why'.s It just and I made that mistake probably into the Eddie Alva's Dustin Pori fights lost and then I won three or four in a row, and then I completely went back to the same mindset of I'm the best in the world. No one can beat me and I paid for it. And those two mistakes were huge, very, very big learning lessons . And then the Charles Oliver fight, you know, was like, I wanted it so bad and I made the moment so much bigger than it actually was because it's just twenty five minutes in time and it's all I can control is being perfect, my preparation for it, but then ultimately being there for twenty five minutes and being perfect. And yeah, those were the mistakes that I made. I had to learn, I had to make those mistakes. I would not change anything about my career. I think the farther back into my career you go, the more special this moment is . And you know, I think in time, again, this is going to age like my career is something special . The way that I did it , the way that I lost, the way that I stayed on track, the way that I, you know, threatened retirement if I wasn't going to get a title a title shot , the way I called my shots along the way, and the discipline I had. I mean, it's second to none. I've watched this sport my whole life. Since nineteen ninety two, my dad showed me. I remember as a four year old seeing it. I don't have a lot of, you know , great memories. I remember my childhood, but it's like you have specifics. But I remember seeing it for my first time in my dad's bedroom . We were sitting there watching it together and I was and I was enthralled. I was like, this is amazing. I love this. Did you picture that? Hit with like a baby bottle just squeezing it. I watched it and I was a die hard fan. I've been a die hard fan ever since then. And especially in two thousand one, when it came along, I was, you know, probably in seventh or third grade, sixth or seventh grade and just fell in love with it. And then, you know, me and Colle going into college, we'd go and see it above the Wow Wings for six, seven, eight hours, spend five dollars those poor service people . It's just amazing that you've been able to keep this ferocious mentality for so long . Because I remember when you first entered into the UFC, the Michael Johnson fight, I was so pumped for it because I was like, get ready because this is going to be fucking wild because I had been a fan of your years when you were fighting, what was it World Series of fighting? And then that Michael Johnson fight was everything that I thought it would be fucking crazy. Just a wild ass fight. Crazy coming out party. Dude, I giggled so many times in that fight. Dude, when you went against the cage and you were like this, you like look back and you were like, oh, I'm looking for the shot. You're like blocking off the thing. And did you come back with the right hook and then you let him back in again? You hit it with the right hook again off the cage. Dude, there's so many giggles sessions in there. I wasn't nervous because just again, that's the way he fights and I'm like, hey, no one's going to forget this fight. Michael Johnson was swinging swinging and I caught him with that left hand a few times. Well, that's the same left hand he knocked out Dustin. His left hand is so fast. He did it so fast and Michael's power is fast dude. And he was trying to win. I mean, he was going all out . You guys just emptied out in that fight. It was fantastic. And I was like, there it is . The three rounder to get off the backflip took three rounds . He got up there, fell up, got up there, fell up. I was like, you can do it. You're out there . I always get so scared for your knees when you do that. Please don't hurt your knees after you win the time. A hundred percent, baby. We're going to miss you. We're training for Kabib, but we're over at high altitude. He's doing backflips off the cage a cage. And I was like, stop. Do this after the fight. Yeah, he's like, he's like, Hey, no more backflips. I was like, today, today's the day. Today's day I become a bitch . Like today's the day. Look at that moment. He's like, You know what? I turned my head. I was like, Shock. Go ahead. That's kind of true, right? When you get something and all of a sudden you're special, then you started protecting it and then you won't be special anymore. I told him all that is today. It's fucking crazy. Like I never want him to stop being fucking crazy. Like everything about him in life, when you play gol f with him, he's the highlight. He does shit that like you'll never fucking see. Like it's like everything you do is the highlight. Like his life is like his fighting. He's fucking wild. So your mentality you've never had to work on, I mean obviously, you've learned lessons along the way, but you've never had to like sit down and work on this mindset. It's always been something you inherently possessed. Yeah . Yeah, I think it's crazy. I think people just complic ate things so much. Like when you can truly understand that there's there is things you can't control, but it's not everything . You can only control what's inside of you. You know, you can only control how you perceive things , how you react to things. The work you put in. The work obviously the preparation. Yeah , but it's I mean, there's so much , you know, and I guess I always knew that something was coming because no matter how far off the road, you know, like I've made mistakes, you know, I've done I was never thank God I was never an alcoholic and never lived. But I was, I could say I was probably a drug addict at one time in my life . And what drugs ? I don't know. I have never told my parents about this, so I don't know. You don't have to. All of 'em. All of 'em. I want so but it's gonna and I know this is gonna sound stupid, but so I went to school for human services. I wanted to help people . A big part of that is helping people come off drugs and I lost many over a handful of friends, really close friends from drugs, where I come from. We're not far from Mexico and we had the best. We had the best shit coming right across the border before it ever got cut up and it was it was my life, you know, where I'm from was very boring and so like you chase again, you know, we have it so good in this country. We're always trying to create chaos in order to feel something. And I guess that's what I was probably doing . And in college is when I really, you know, I was like, if I'm going to help people come off of drugs, then how can I ever even try to understand if I don't know what they're chasing . And so that was a part of it and also a part was felt good , you know . And so once I did certain things, I knew what people were chasing. But then I always knew that something was bigger for me and better for me and I had something to do. And so that was always it was never a crutch for me. I was always like, that was awesome. You know, I'm not doing it again. What is it in your head that were you always knew that you had something bigger ? Well, probably my faith. I mean I've been my parents, the best thing they ever did for me was make me go to church every single Sunday and create a relationship with God through the Word of Jesus Christ and just trying to live up to those expectations , I knew not that I was going to be a champion or anything, I just knew that I couldn't take the easy way out . You know, um When you're on drugs or when you're when you're living a lifestyle like that, then nobody expects anything from you. Nobody wants anything from you and that's the easy way to live . You know, those right. There's no pressure. No expectations. No expectations, no pressure. And I mean, it really is I can understand how you can let that overcome the passion to live , you know, and I don't know, I just think the passion to live because of my faith has never outweighed my desire to good. I want to talk about the shift that you made in your career from being the most exciting guy in the world , wanting to be the most exciting guy in the world, being happy with performing to the best of your ability, whether you win or lose to wanting to get the velvet What was what started that decision ? It's weird because I don't remember a time or day where I made a change other than I'm not going to get hit. You know, in the Dustin Porey fight in Eddie Albert's fight, I absolutely almost broke them . And it was no different than any of my other fights. Nobody had just ever Same with Elia, you know, like nobody had ever got past it. Nobody had ever been able to withstand the ferocity of my actions for two or three rounds. And then those guys did and I was like, what happened? You know, and ultimately I put myself in a position and I got hit with a shot that that took me out of the fight . And so after those fights, I was like, I have to not take these shots . And that was ultimately all I can say that I that I changed mentally is I don't want to get hit. I used to never care about getting hit because it's like doesn't hurt. Nothing hurts in there. You don't feel nothing. It's never hurt . And so that was really just my mind test. I just need to not let them get me in a predicament where I'm not able to where they have to stop the fight. This episode is brought to you by Simply Safe. One thing you probably don't think about when you're planning the perfect summer getaway is protecting your home. 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So try the Farmer's Dog today and get fifty percent off your first box of fresh healthy food . Plus, get free shipping. Just go to the farmers dog. com slash rog an. This offers for new customers only. So the shift but he probably from outside outside sources it's definitely there was a shift and it wasn't just like an instant shift. It was the two losses in a row with Eddie and Poorier where he's like, I'm winning these fights and I need to be able to get to the distance and I was like, all right, we got to become a spot fighter because you just drown people and you're what's happening is you're making mistakes. We threw a loc ated he got caught because he baseback lazy with his shoulders above his hips . So I was like, all right, let's be sharp, let's fight in spots. Then he goes on a three fight wind streak where he's finding the right spots and putting people out from Vic to Barbosa into cowboy Sarone . Then that's where he's like and then I sat down with him and I was like, do you want to be a champion? And I was like, this is how you have to fight to be a champion is be smart . And he never said he never said he did want to be the most excited fighter . He would tell me after fights. He's like, I don't even try to fight excited, but look at me. And it's like fucking like it's so amazing. Like it's in him. It's just how do we, how do we get you to sprint fifty yards, pull back for one hundred yards and jog and then sprint for fifty yards and like be able to know your red line? Don't cross over that red line. Don't hold red line. Well, that is again the experience that you've had in Wars. It was so critical . You could do it. But yeah, I don't want to make mistakes . And it is, I think it's crazy. I think again, the fact that they said that he had outstruck me in the first round, thirty nine to thirty two or something. You ran some hard jobs . Yeah, but yeah, there's yours were devastating. We might have toast and I'm talking about the perception . It looks like I'm getting hit. It looks like it's out, but I mean, my I don't have special skin . I am able to see punches and roll with them. And roll with punches. If you watch my , you know, fight frame by frame, I'm not getting hit for the most part. You're moving with the punches. Yeah, it's be like water. Like I'm constantly , you know, and intuitively making these calculations. That's the scoring that when you see that , I don't know who's counting that, but that's like amateur boxing. Amateur boxing if the white glove touches you in the face, even if it's not a clean blow, that's considered that's how you judge. Yes. And that 's where adjusted, I think, where you look at it from a point system , you can't just look at the screen and that's why you know judges can't look at a screen and go, oh, this guy landed more. This is who won. You had the damaging blows. I think everybody knows that. Like I get it. Like I see the way you roll a shot , I see the way that you fade off and allow the shot not to go through your skull and deflect it. Your stead still gets touched to you. So it's considered that they landed that shot, but the damage is like, what you do to people by the way that you hip through , that you drive through people is so different. Like Justin hits unlike any he still I still think to this day we got to ask the UFC, but they did a test on him to see who has the hardest bones of the UFC he had the hardest b ookud.e D, he kicks me and I'm just like, dude, I'm so glad I feel so bad for Luke. He didn't let he don't let me kill you. Dude, Luke could do just me. He has a pat on. Here's his pat on. I kick him and his his nuts swell up. Dude, I get blue balls bro. There's a nerve on the inside of your lake. I'd talk to a doctor about it 'cause I'm like, bro, like he kicks people and they bruise on the inside of their lake and it's 'cause the shock through, but there's a nerve on the inside of the leg. I'd go home and I'd tell my wife, I'm like, baby, I got fucking blue balls. She's like, from me, and I'm like, Joseph. She looks at me like the fuck you got blue balls from Joseph for. One of the things you were doing early in your career that I always thought was so wild was you were leg kicking people from a collar tie. Like you were leg kicking . Oh my goodness. How do no one's doing that? Like you were one of the only guys that I saw that was doing that that was from the clinch was leg kicking . You've got some fucking flexible hips, man because the way you able' tore do that from like right in tight like this and then and not just you pull the leg out your holding in there he pulls them to their lead so he's making a base on that knee and then it's just like you got to stump in the ground and you're just trying to bend that tree he man's, very good at that. Let me tell you something about Luke 'cause I got into the octagon at right after he won and Luke and looked at each other. He was like, Baster. He's like, dude, he's like so he's like, Joe was so h happedy ugg me so hard. He was so happy. It was it was so amazing because seeing all those videos and knowing he's in camp with you all the time and knowing how much he loves you watching the happiness that he had when he won was fucking incredible. Luke is one of my really, really good friends. He y time before and every time before Trevor was in my corner, Luke cornered. He used to go to Arizona with me. I had no coaches. I would just do it in between in between wrestling seasons. And yeah, he would go down there with me and just wrap my hands and he would just be there. Wow. He's amazing. One of the best human beings on Earth. Yeah, I love that man. You tell him about the Sunday. So the Sunday before fight fog. So there was one time I think it was in the cowboy fight where you were you were pummeling with Ben and he finished with a low kick on Ben every time and I'm like, stop kicking your coach. And he looks at me. He's like, He's like, Trevor, he used to drag me back on the mats. He's like, how much ? I was like, you guys got mask. Give me this fucking give me this opportunity to be as ass. So we golfing, Joe and Sunday, we golfing. Sunday before the fight. We get there Saturday, we golfing Sunday and it's a Sunday. We never work out on Sundays and Trevor, not Trevor Luke and Ben got fucking pickled . They each had like three very, very, very stiff mark Merries, Luke bought like twelve beers because we got there and they're like, Hey, everything's on the president. And he's like, fuck yeah, I've never heard that before. If he's on the president, I'm gonna drink. And so like whole ten or eleven, Trevor's like, let's fuck with them. Let's tell him that we're gonna work out later. Well, we're gonna work out, but I'm telling you , they're gonna be the workout. I didn't know we were working out. Put it in. I had no fuckin' Sunday. We're definitely thought fucking with me. We're out there golfing as hot as shit. I'm sweating my ass off. I had no idea we were working out that day. He's like, let's fuck with them. Let's tell him that we're gonna work out. I was like, All right, cool. So I told him I was gonna text him, give the workout because I'll lay out the workout for everybody. And I told Luke he was gonna go three rounds of sparring, full on sparring and then Ben's got to go forty minutes straight, no brakes, just grappling. Not wrestling, just grappling. They're fucking dude. I told Justin and I was like, All right, let's fuck it. And dude, instantly before I didn't text it, we just started talking about it. So we're on the way home driving home and dude , Ben is like, dude, he's like, he's like, I'll just take you down. And he's like, I asked him how times you're gonna take him down as many as I want times I want. Dude, forty minutes . He's six minutes . So they went twenty dude. You got what? Seven submissions on your coach. He drogged them back on the mat. It was so funny because I was like, dude, you got to drag him back on the mats 'cause I got to witness this. It's funny because I got a video dude. So we get home. I go down and take a nap for like two hours and they just stay drinking shit. My YouTube guy filmed everything and they're just talking so much and they're gonna fuck me up. Look, Luke was good though. Luke was like here . Luke's been through it, man. You're really gonna say that? Like, I ain't saying this. Not me and Tim, but they're making a plan how they're gonna team up on me . And so it's funny. Then he got the video there and I'm beating Ben's ass. No, actually I went with Luke first and I was fucking him up. Luke's punching Ben because Ben will jump in. Yeah. He's like, What the fuck Ben? What the fuck man? Now's the time. And he's asking for help, asking for help. I'd be his ass and I did. We had fun for sure. It was great. Great coaches. Our whole team is just everybody so dialed in. Yeah, that whole week is one of my every time we go, that whole week is one of my favorite experiences. You were using the sauna in between workouts as well and before. And so we 're nothing that just sucked. I say it was perfect. You say it was perfect? It was not. It was detrimental to our says yes. Yeah. The humidity was there. I didn't realize it because obviously it's not, you know, it's not something I can worry about right now, but after round one , I just remember thinking, pull fuck , I am so tired right now. How is this possible? And the amount of the amount of fluid I lost was God. Probably lost like fifty 'cause it was in the seventies. Dude. Yeah, seventies with the cool breeze. You know, when you go out there, what you feel is the cool breeze, but just heavy air there. In the fight, man. It was different. Yeah, I hated the fact that it was gonna happen, but I'm glad it did. Again, I would not change again , I think how could you change it? It affects me. It affects him. You know, again, I grew up in the country. He's he's a city boy. There's no way he's not a city boy. I don't know him personally, but there's no way he's not a city boy. You know, and so as a country, country boy from the desert in Arizona, like I was hoping that it would be hot as fuck. Hotest fuck . Like when he sat down in the stool, I was like, oh god, these outside fights kill me. Yeah, you know, he was dude. One like dude, he was sh He was shaking. Dude, he was like trembling. I was like, holy shit . Well, it is crazy to ask people to defend a world title in a completely alien environment that you never have fights in. We've had how many fights outside? We've had the Abu Dhabi fight in like what was that two thousand and fucking nine or something like that Pari Final did what was the setting? I wasn't there. It was when Adysanya did his famous walkout in like it was covered, but it was it seemed like the environment was outside. Parrieg against that in Abu Dhabi. No stand Abu Dhabi with the Abu Dhabi. Well, we did one in Abu Dhabi when BJ arena lost to Frankie Edgar. That was outside in Abu Dhabi . And that was when Anderson Silver Fought Damian Maya is that what they were with that Ferrari building ? The Ferrari building was there, but I don't know if it was in the same place . They had a did they have a fight in the Ferrari building? I think they did. But I wasn't there for that one. I only went to one of the Abu Dhabi fights. Yeah, it wasn't it wasn't that long ago. I would say the last seven years. Remember the dude in Morocco said after the first shout, he was done, he was just trying to survive. He said it was so hot, remember? Yeah, no, I mean, that's what I remember it being over there. And then, you know, once you realize the climate over there and the humidity, it's like, do you remember the fucking Bowdog? Remember Bowdog fight Bog fights him. They had they had a fight outside in the sun. Yeah on the beach . Caesar palace in Vegas. Remember Caesar's palace . They the bo'xreing. We got to fight there Vernon Phillips again. Yeah, that's right. They used to always do it . World two was the fighting around the NASCAR event. Yeah, that's that was crazy. Duran versus empire. Duran versus Herns were they were great, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. That's right. At least Vegas is dry. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Totally. Arizona, Vegas . Yeah, humidity was what I was training for with him was heat stroke. Like dealing with the where you can't breathe this heavy air like so we put in water on the rocks and the snow as well. Absolutely. And so we trained in a hotter gym. I'd turn a temperature at the gyms just so he was getting used to dealing with a little bit more heat stroke. We would spike my heart rate and then I would go in the sound of fifteen minutes, then I would come out and do my track to ten rounds. It was great. We did it. Very smart, very smart because that environment it's so completely different. I just ultimately I think the best way to fight is obviously the way you usually fight controlled environment. Yeah, that's how it should. It was cool, though, Joe. You know why? So cool. So we went and did a rehearsal and I'm like, why are we rehearsing it walkthrough? Like this ain't a freaking wedding. Like, just tell us where to go. The camera guys are always like, all right, you're Mark here. So why are we doing this? And then we go there and we get stuck in this locker room for two hours and a half because of rain . And thank God that happened because then I started to go, oh, because it's all unexpected. And how Eliot said, Hey, I'm a visualizer. I can't visualize this arena. And I visualize a lot too. So I was like, I felt the exact same thing when he said that. And that's when I knew, hey, these are going to be some huge unknowns. And I had told him that night because the rain was coming. Like it was crazy how the storm split around because it was all bright red. I was like, this is thunderstorms. And they were talking about pushing the fight till ten thirty PM. We had planned fighting at the start of the night. Yeah. Two in the morning . I wasn't staying up to like three AM after the rehearsal. I was like, it could be three AM when we fight. Yeah. And I started saying up. But that's what was cool . Like the walkout, like having the soldiers, like just walking through the soldiers, there was that we weren't able to take any of this in Joe. And I can't really speak for him. I know where his mind's up. I couldn't from a coach's standpoint. I was nervous this fuck because you don't know there's no pattern I can take on right now and kind of put myself and breathe to it It was very unique and at the end I couldn't even really smile it was just like dude I',m just like bl own away. Now I can kind of just look around slowly and just try to take in everything because it was very, very hard to go through that scenario with the pressure of us fighting on this stage at the White House . We're the Americans. We're a six to one underdog. That gets to you. That you know, when you hear that over and over and over and over, it's, you know, you can't hear your phone, dude. You caught one . You caught a Marlene. But having left, just that scenario so unique. And then once it was over, then it was like, now I get to enjoy the White House and just being here in this, this look at the minute. There you can see it. What is he reading there? Is that the Declaration of Independence? Yep. So we weren't in the room with him right there. We through the rehearsal, yeah, crazy. He's in the oval office stepping out. And then all the soldiers wal king through so cool like having the two guys next to them and a lot of people complained about this happening at the White House and you don't think this is cool. This is dude. How fighting? How could you not like this? Fight anyone that this shouldn't be taking place in the morning shock the fuck Dude, life is a fight. World is a fight. Incredible to watch. Asperational. It's a wild thing to watch. By the way, how much gold did Trump put on those walls? Look at gold everywhere. Look at these fucking gold designs. When we were at the oval office? First thing I said is I was like, this thing is small as hell. Like when I see it on pictures it seemed so big and I was like but the gold pieces on the wall is the first thing I was like they d,ust that shit every day because dude it was so clean. Well, he put that up there. Really? None of that was there. None of that was there. He was explaining to me. There was no gold. I wanted to have gold. He's got a gold cherub, like a solid gold cherub that's above like one of the doors . He goes, if Putin comes, hopefully it doesn't fall in his head . It's like he's got gold everywhere. It's all him. He redesigned a bunch of the things . You know, he's a builder, right? So that's why he wanted to do the ballroom. That's why he wanted to keep it, you know, he likes everything in gold. He's a gold guy . Was it Austin Powers? Well, watching we were just watching you look at the declaration of independence before you walked out, which is also wild. Like this is never gonna happen again . This is more historic than rumble in the jungle, more historic than I mean, think about all the great fights that we've all watched as kids that were like, like remember that? This tops everything because of the scene , because of the fact that not only is it at the White House, but the American who's a six to one on some books underdog, pulls it off in spectacular fashion and just the seaweed of the fight and forth the back and forth the fight was fucking huge because the second round was crazy and was like oh no it's letting it go on again when it's to our corner all the coaches were like dude they,'re, gonna stop it and I was said out loud. I was like, please let it go on . And I just wanted a like a like definitive ending. Dude, because that would have been a point where it's like especially with him going Hey, I want to go and continue and then we have got her come out and say you are God for Mark God dard. Yeah. Okay, because if it wasn't for Mark Godard if another lesson he wanted out for me . You think you did? He wanted out. Yeah. You don't you don't you know for a fact you do not ever as a fighter say I cannot see. It's over . And he was counting on that. He said he had already stated. He didn't need to say it again. He did not think there were. I don't think he thought there was that he called Godard a turkey internally. He was like when he said, Oh, you're going to go hey, I was playing that moment. He just like, I've done, you know, I've tried and it might have been like, you know, the little devil on his shoulder trying to get him out. And then he reevaluated and rethunk it and under stood that he had to keep fighting. Did you say thunk? Thunk it. Rethunk it. That's a one idea. That's the real word. I stopped. I stopped him twice. I stopped him twice that night there's no doubt about it. That's it. I loved it. I loved it. This episode is brought to you by OnX Off Road. Ever wonder how to reach these epic mountain lakes, they're tucked away, dispersed campsites With OnEx off road, you'll find legal open trails around you and even better guided trails mapped by real off roaders. Each one includes photos, terrain descriptions, and difficulty ratings, so you'll know if your vehicle is capable before you go. Unlike other apps, OnX gives you turn by turn directions on the trail and their new dispersed camping layer shows where you can legally set up camp. You'll also get private land boundaries, public land overlays, and the ability to download maps for offline use so that you're never guessing even when you're off the grid. It's a powerful tool built for serious off roaders . Try on X off road for fifty percent off, go to on X maps dot com slash Joe Rogan. Well it was a big factor that God ard let it go on because then we got to see that epic fourth round, which is fucking crazy, which was just in the end when you landed that knee to the body, that was like the final landed that heavy bee that he just starts chopping it where he got the helmet . Yeah . And then he has to quit on his stool . And if God had just given to that referee or that judges or the doctors rather des ires, here it is. I love how you punch right here, right on the spot. Yeah, I saw. Oh, right there . Oh, right where I just laughed . Yeah, he did not like that. And that was the end. crazy fight. I mean it's crazy how different so again being a fan of this sport I've got to watch you know I would have usually watched this from and yeah it would have been the most fucking incredible team ever being the fighter you, know you, really're not appreciating any of that because you're so locked into it's like golf like you don't know but golfing is like certain swing thoughts you know and nothing else can come in, nothing can creep in . so And me looking at the Declaration of Independence, I was looking at it, but I didn't I didn't take it in as this being a declaration. I was sitting there like, okay, got to reset his feet. Gotted, cont gotrol to, gotta move left, gotta move left, can't get against the fence, you know, and those were the thoughts I'm having as through the whole walkout. And so I'm really not taking any of it in it as it, you know, as the show or as the theatrics of it ? Of course not. Watching it in hindsight, obviously is fucking awesome. There was something special about you warming up with the American flag around your shoulder too. We were watching that. There was something special about watching you shadow box before all this with the American flag on. I was like if he wins , good lord . If he wins tonight, it's gonna be fucking insane. And it was the feeling of like joy through out the building, throughout the grounds, like the happiness that everybody had seen had been there to see such an incredible event and such an amazing cap to that event with your fight. It was just nuts. It felt like a whole arena to me. It was crazy for the amount of people that you could see. Here it is to back flip in front of the fucking White House Dude flag that's gonna be a studio flag. That's a sn takeake picture. I rolled out of here. Hey, wait, hey, tell me, tell me what was it? Tell me , what did you use? Newton's law, News first law. Object in motion needs to stay. I just stayed in motion. Stay in motion. No, it is. Look at the size of that fucking crowd that was outside . So you could have seen this crowd like I couldn't see this crowd but hear them and you could feel them. You could feel the energy. I mean, even though there was only four thousand people did not did not feel like four thousand people . It felt like a hundred thousand people because all those people were behind us . You know, it was different. How many people were in that plane? eighty five thousand plus. Yeah. I mean so fast. The size of the group outside was insane . Yeah. I mean, and they're watching on these giant screens and freaking out like a concert. Yeah. Weird the way it is, it was like, dude, that's what I pictured like Woodstock being like, Dude, I looked and I could not see the end of the piece. Yeah. No, it was the Wayans were nuts. When we first walked out, I was like, holy shit, this is crazy, but it just shows how hyped people were for this event. You know, I mean, it was an incredible event. I mean, the UFC production team, they just knocked it out of the park and then more importantly, you knocked it out of the park. It could not have got the cap. It couldn't have gone better. And the most important thing was that you did have to overcome that we did see a real back and forth and we did see the skill s that led people to believe that this guy is the number one pound for palm farter in the world. I mean his fucking boxing is elite it is charming shooter and I mean my coach is a fucking genius. I mean, when it comes to like again, it's really hard to you always sound right in hindsight, but the strategy we had was so perfect to fight a guy like that. I mean, if you I think if you ask him right now which way was Justin moving, he's gonna think I was moving right the whole time because my head is so so heavy and I lean over to that side but I was moving left the entire time. And he's so pointed that you know, he's powerful here, but when you when you put him here, like nobody can push and sprint like he's not ever going to take off sprinting that way as fast as he can. He's gonna have to gather and reset and then point and then go. And I constantly kept readjusting him. And it was so subtle and that's what fighting is subtle subtle movements , but I mean his game plan was and then his game plan, his mind my ability but really it's my athletic ability. Like if people don't understand how athletic I am, and I think that is what surprises every opponent I've ever fought is how you know hurkey jerky, twitchy, how explosive and how athletic I am. And I think that's the biggest asset that I have. Why do you think anybody be surprised by that at this stage? Why do you think they're surprised? Because the 'cause it doesn't look like that. No, you're I, Justin, I think you're looking into the patty fight. I feel like the patty fight you because a lot of people are like, oh, you look older, you look because the way we fought. Like our style our game patterns patty fight. How squeeze is that now? I mean, if you watched the patty fight, you would never expect you would only expect punches coming from here. That's exactly through because he would pull in and I had to like wrangle them in wrangle them in and this guy no shots like palm strikes like we need to palm strike him. We need to keep him inside of our loop and if they're throw stingraight shots at Patty, Patty will disengage very, very long with his upper body. So he was throwing wild shots and then long upper cuts. Like stay on the outside when you're throwing upper cuts because Patty's got very good knees coming in, so we can't get too deep with the head. Very simple plan, but also it was like make it chaotic. As most chaotic as you could be to be able to do that because Patty his blitzing was very fast. He's a very good blitzer. He'll blitz past you and almost like running type of punches like old Vitor Bellfort , but this fight is a lot different where it's now ewes in. We have to be tied in these types of positions and we need to step to his center and get on his back foot line or outside of his back foot l ine. And that was like a key factor to this one is because Illy is very front heavy and will bounce back and forth. So once he goes to this angle, we need to attack the rear shoulder and once he starts to reset, now we're going to be able to jab and stick the jab at the rear shoulder where your jab was landing. There's my favorite part is the jab wasn't landing here where Ellie's got a very good slide . We're jabbing outside so you're not doing an inside jab coming under, you're jabbing from outside your shoulder which is pushing him on his rear foot. And then once we started to pressure, my favorite part is the jab pause right hand. His left foot, Justin's left foot, when we go has to be has to be outside his rear foot like right there. He opened his lead foot and he got his foot outside and that's also in case the right hand counted that was a giant moment in the fight giant of that to his sound of it was almost yep. Oh, that was such a hard job. Do that one more time, Jamie and watch his lead foot after the jab. Now watch his left foot after the jab. Outside the rear foot, boom . And that because he's got a high shoulder. If I'm throwing a right hand down this point, if you were looking at me, Joe, if you're if I'm here, if he gets his foot out now the shot is coming from here. So we're going to put him on the back foot and find that over because Dali's got a very good shoulder tap. He also dropped that right hand down. Yeah , it was beautiful. It was beautiful. It was such a giant moment in the fight. Like look where I started. I started with my back to us and look on left, left , left , left . But if you go out to the left back,wardss where that' where Illiot to me is the best. How we stop Volk, where he'll throw at you and then you go and then he readjust his lead shoulder almost to a salpa. Super dangerous there. That was one thing we talked about. We cannot go backwards to the left because that's where we get square and Illiot dude he's very front heavy so he will attack you quick and he gets there fast Well if he can recover from this it's going to be a big lesson a big lesson learn and you know I wonder if he'll still have those celebration dinners the night before there's no way he better not dude his team that's up to his coaches to be honest with you. It's amazing Hub is an amazing thing. Like people love that kind of confidence, they love that belief in themselves. And when someone pulls it off, people were talking for days about the Olivirifi. You know, he celebrated the night before, isn't that great? And it didn't work that time and it worked great for . But the lack of experience being the nail , so much experience being the hammer all expectations. He never thought he would have to be here. But you keep saying I wanted to go back to this thing that you said that people don't think you're athletic and I don't agree with that. I don't understand I think that maybe watches the Michael Johnson fight even when I think you're got to college. I got to college, you know, my freshman year of college and I did a cartwell to a back flip and these guys one guy was like , I would have never fucking guessed you could do some shit like that. Like I just don't understand. You know, if you look at me, I don't look like an athlete, but dude, you weren't rarity. No, I know you wanted to rari. I know how athlete I am. I just talked about your perception. No, no, no, your perception's crazy. Listen, you look like an athlete. What the fuck are you talking about? He sent me in this picture when I first met from he went up to do a clinic with his coach up in Granby with Ben Charington. And he sends me this video. I don't know why I open it up. And he's got a soccer ball and he's in this audit orium with the pads out of the ground and he's got his phone set up on the pads that are against the wall. He throws a soccer ball up in the air and he does one of those bicycle kicks. Everybody played just like one or two years . He did a bicycle kick, landed on his feet and the ball knocked the phone off the freaking thing, dude. He hit the freaking phone. It was the coolest thing I've ever seen. I was like, well, you are nuts. This guy snowboarding when we snowboard because I wrote professional when I was younger, got taken out of high school for it and this dude , he would catch things so fast and his tumbling. There was one time we were watching him, he was in Moguls in Mogul Suck on a snowboard. He does this three hundred and sixty, catches his edge, falls to his back and bounces off one of the moguls to a back flip right back into the Moguls and dude these people on the side thought he meant to do that shit. They look dude! I was like, Bro, his tumbling skills, dude, you're freaking dutts. You are an athlete. I think everybody knows you're an athlete. Well, you're not built like Paulo Costa. If that's what you mean. Yeah, you know, it's like you're not you, you know, there's there's guys that have less body fat than you and guys have more prominent muscles than you, but nobody looks at you fighting and doesn't think you're athletic. That's crazy. I think it's the experts after the patty fight saying, oh , he looks sloppy. And so those fights got to be sloppy. Those people retarded. Yeah, that fight you like chaos. Look like you were going to press him and you it also looked like you were kind of disdainful of his ability to hurt you. Yeah. Once you know exactly. Yeah, once once I didn't respect his power, I was like, I'm fucking walking through. Yeah, and that's what it looked like. It looked like you were just trying to make it as chaotic as possible. You was making it sound like you had like a water boy. Like someone was like the water sucks and he's like making a noises there No, you don't belie youve but that's also probably a good thing that you think about yourself that way , you know, because it forces you to rise above and beyond anybody's expectations of you. You know, and I think one of the things about this fight that makes it so important is because Illia was so dangerous , you had to get like deep in the zone. You couldn't have a moment like the Maxfight The Max Fight got me here. Without that I would have never been as hungry . I said it was gonna happen and it didn't happen, didn't happen, didn't happen. Then it happened and it's like, okay , now I can never let my parents see me like that again. That was was that a driving factor. Like I can never let my mom. I remember getting knocked out, I don't remember getting knocked out. I got knocked out. I don't remember anything. I don't remember him getting his hand raised and it had to have been forty minutes to an hour. And then I just my first recollection is being in the ambulance and seeing my mom's face. Can I tell you that? Can I tell that story? Yeah, yeah, tell me what I did because I still don't know. So we're in the ambulance, okay? You never know too. You were. I came back. Your mom's standing outside the back doors and we're waiting for the driver. There's a medicine in there with us, but he's good. But he keeps asking the same question over and over. I don't remember any of this. That I'm worried about like, you know, everybody's parents are different on how they react, you know? And his mom was just cool, just like, I was so impressed. I was so impressed with her just spirit of seeing that happen . But Justin's laying there and he's like, he's cool and everything he does. So he's got like this cool like he's like, you know, just got stopped and he's laying there and he's like he'll look at me and he gets like his head he's like I got knocked out and I was like, yeah this is like round . r Whatound ? And I said, last second of the fight, and he goes , good for him. Dude, we go , dude, I'm telling you like two minutes to go by and we'd be having a normal conversation and he'd look at me . I get knocked out? And I was like, Yep. Dude, it happened over and over again over and it happened with Fighter. Yes, but him saying good for him. The way he said it every time that he came back to it , like that's the type of person Justin is. Like if he loses in competition , the better man won that night and that to me is something that stands out to me. That's character character of him saying when he does it, that subconscious traits that you have. That's also the character that allows you to reach your full potential. Absolutely. Because you're not being held back by any bullshit ego things. Not fake. Because there's a lot of people that are held back as good as they are, they don't ever reach their full potential because they have some bullshit ego problems. Absolutely . They care of what everybody thinks. And in that situation, losing that fight in the last second of the last round and having that reaction, that is the truest test of character that a man is ever going to go through. Yeah, that is true as a test of character ever in front of the whole world. What I remember first is seeing my mom's face though. I saw her face and I saw no concern. I just she was worried about me, but she was not concerned. She wasn't freaked out. No, she wasn't freaked out at all. I was like , and that's when I never I never reset and asked if I had got knocked out again after that moment. I don't think. No, no, what it happened for probably I say you probably asked it six or seven tim es. And then once then we were cool for about five minutes before we went to the hospital, they were totally cool. The cool part about this, Joe is those are some of my and it sucks because he's taking a shot like this, but me as a coach and as someone that just loves fighting and loves the inspiration and what these guys do is those are my proudest moments. Winning a fight like this, it was proud and you know take it, in and you're going wow,, this is a cool sp ot to be in, and you have to be grateful for it. But there's times where I'm caught smiling when my fighters are down like when Kamaro got kicked and I stood next to him with the biggest smile just because I'm like , dude, you went out on your shield, you were looking so good. And this is the way you stand up, again, so important to meet Justin Sallas one time with Tim Means. It was one of my proudest moments just to see his subconscious. Like I love the mindset knee dude, Tim means hits him with a knee and he fights through it a little bit and takes another knee and he goes down and he's on the ground and his right leg is still like moving and he's like still punching and he's out . And I'm like, dude, that's a fighting spirit. Like there was no quitted, like you're fighting through being knocked out. And subconsciously, he's still in the fight and his body is still reacting that way instead of shelling up and being like, I just got rock toed. I'm going shell up. I could not wait to get in the octagon and they're like not trying to let me in. I'm like, let me just get over to them and sit next to him and put some ice on the back. When we stop guys, I'm always over to the other opponent first . To me, that's that's the coolest part is being able to see someone go out there and do their best and then to watch them come back. And that's why I'm very excited to kind of see what happens with Alia. This is going to be a hard one to overcome, but I hope he does because he's he's that talented. If he takes the right lessons, that's going to be a super inspirational thing to overcome. It's going to be hard , but I sure hope we get to witness that. This episode is brought to you by Traeger Grills. If you enjoy food, and I mean really good food. Traeger is a game changer. This isn't just a grill. It's the ultimate way to cook outdoors, delivering unbeatable wood fired flavor thanks to the all natural hardwood pellets that fuel everything you grill, smoke, or bake. That's it. Just wood and fire and flavor. And what's truly wild is how easy it is. Just set the temp, load the grill, and let Traeger handle the rest , grill steaks, smoked ribs, even baked pizza, all on one grill. If you're into fire, flavor and doing things right, check out Traeger Grills. This episode is brought to you by Squ arespace. Once you've got a great name for your business, you need a great domain. And Squarespace makes it easy to lock in a domain. You just search the name you want, buy it, and then you're ready to build. No hidden fees, no weird upsells. Go to squarespace dot com slash rogen for a free trial and when you are ready to launch, use the code Rogan to get ten percent off your first purchase of a website or domain . I wonder if he's gonna stay at one hundred and fifty five. There are big guys at one hundred fifty five . And he wasn't that big for forty five . You know, you think about weight cutting in the modern era . Like you were you're considerably bigger than him. When you guys were standing next to each other there's a big difference . I've also really focused on getting bigger last three or four fights. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I were eighty nine in a patty fight. one hundred eighty three in a patty fight so he was I touched eighties this fight . We waited on Saturday eleven, Saturday when I went to bed, I think it was one hundred eighty four. Oh, wow. And then I think when I woke up I was like one hundred seventy six. That's how much water we're floating. It's crazy. Our bodies are crazy. Right. Especially because all the weight cut out. I think when I got there, I was pissing so much . I was actually too hydrated for the drug test, so I had to piss three times. I couldn't drink water. You were too hydrated for a drug test, how's that? Yeah. So if the piss is too diluted, then they make you do it again. Really? Yeah. That's why, you know, doing it after a fight. Like I used to do it after the fight all the time . But your adrenaline's going so you don't pee. So it takes a long time. Like we've sat in locker rooms for hours waiting for the piss test. But when you're doing it after like rehydration, that's a shitty thing because these guys have to hydrate. Everybody's fucking taking as much fluid as they can. So that makes it tough. But with the weight cutting piece with him going back down, I agree with you. I think Eli is a smaller body, but he's also a big advantage for Iliad speed . And when you go up and wait, that speed is a huge factor. If you see a lot of guys go up like with Max, Max kept kept his speed when he came up . He when he went back down, I think everybody was like, Oh, he beat Max. He beat a drained max. Yeah, I think that weight cut down to forty five for him was grooved. That's and this is where from like a coaching standpoint, if it is hard for you to make it at that weight , I care about the longevity of a person. And I've seen guys get dropped with jabs because of bad weight cuts. Yes . And that going back down in and that's to me the scariest part in this in this fight game. Well, I think there's two things we have to change the fight game. One of them is weight cutting and two of them is your gloves. You fucking class it. But the weight cutting thing, don't you think that we need more weight glasses? Or I should say that I should say do you think we need more weight glasses? I think there's there's many ways like I think you're going to have to have some type of a weight class and there's different ways to do it like maybe you have where you can't go over a certain amount of weight after you make weight and you weigh in a week out where you can really recover because I think guys are gonna do it anyway. I think for me I want nothing to change. I mean, we are grown ass men and women and we're making these choices . Right, but you can make fifty five and it's good for your frame. Now we're understanding how hard it is for me to make fifty five. Sure, it's hard. No, no, no, I'm not thinking it's easy, but you can make it. You've made it over and over and over again . But like think about guys that are in between. Yeah Like. shoulders sixty or sixty five or like a boxing . Seventy to eighty five is crazy. eighty five to two hundred five is bananas . And then two hundred five to two hundred sixty that's those week classes are already watered down in a way. And so you're just gonna water it down more. So these are my thoughts and my research that I've done that it's I've talked to Dr. D about it and I want to get some exper t, some doctor who can actually talk to me about this because when I started researching boxing, why is there so many deaths in boxing ? What stood out to me almost every death in boxing in the last ten to fifteen years . Columbia there's every once in a while from a punch where they get dropped and they don't get up. And they get hemorrhaging Almost all of them are past the ninth round, especially the ones I'm talking about that don't take a punch . They're past the ninth round and it looks like they start to get tired and they're just like, Hey, I need to take a knee and lay down. A lot of these guys are winning the fight and not even taking a lot of damage . And if we're cutting weight the day before te youac'rehing your body to sweat and sweat and sweat , to me I believe because I've had a fighter Camaro and his last fight we were crapping so bad, so scary, so freaking scary calling off dude. I was within like minutes of calling and I talked to the whole team about it. But if you dehydrate yourself, think of my lips. If they get dehydrated, they crack when I smile . And if you dehydrate your brain and I talked to doctor D. I was like, could that be something if you dehydrate your brain? Who caused something? He's like, Absolutely. And then I started to research that. But if you go back and look at all the boxes and if we can get someone that could do their true research that understands this stuff , that to me is like what scares me about weight cutting because you're training your body to lose that amount of weight. And when you start to do things in patterns , you just took all the nutrients out of your body and then you're going hard in a fight like that. And that was like the big thing with a Tony Ferguson fight that's kind of fun ny now, but it wasn't funny to me. I didn't give him more water for a five round fight. That is crazy. And the longer you take your brain to that point of dehydration, why didn't you give him what you just forgot. Dude, yeah. We were locked in. This guy don't train with water. So I was like, I don't drink water. I trained water practice 'cause everyone was like, why don't my water for pussies? No, I don't want water. Talk about the Marijuan. I don't drink any water in training at all . He'll drink afterwards. Like, we did this fight. They made me that we did. Of course, so do you think that loose water? No, because I doesn't it can't because I'm fucking working right now. I'm locked in like I might not get water one day. You know, there might I might want water . Even when you do in strength and conditioning, everything. Nothing. I never drink water . Wow. So you make sure you're hydrated before you get in there. I drink a lot after once you're in there, you just go. Yeah, this fight was different. Yeah, that's crazy. Crazy. That's me. You hear me guys . You know, Ramadan's nuts. Like, I know Bala was training with no water and you know, drinking no water during the day and then training again at nighttime . And you know, that's that's got to be so hard . But going through hard training sessions and no water . you So do it, but so there's two things going on. One, one I would think maybe you could do more work and get more reps and more of this if you're rehydrating. But then the other thing is like would you? And how much mental toughness are you getting by not water? Right. It's a crutch. And the mental toughness thing ultimately won you this fight. There is a lot of fucking human beings at the top level of the sport that would have folded in that second round. You did look the happiest at the Tony Ferguson. Now that looked you gave me a contemplated not once not for one second. Did I contemplate that I was done? No, I mean, you that's that's how you hit me. I was like, oh fuck You can't get to hear him at the corner Yeah. He goes, dude, that was a good body shot. I was like, yeah, that was a sweet body shot. Dude, who does that? I love who sits out is like, dude, the look at his face wasn't like eyebrows like a like an a frame cabin. Well, even after the fight you were talking about how skilled he was. Yeah. You were you were talking about I mean I could go I could go so many different ways with how I react to this fight. I just want it to be known how disrespectful he would have been if he beat me. If he put me to sleep, if his, I mean, can you imagine how shitty he would have been and I mean it would have it would have if it was the world world the world would have been fucking shit like they're not doing I was fighting for so much crazy. I was fighting for so much that night You know, I'm never gonna let people from what I know how special what I've done is and it would have taken all of it away with a loss . And I wasn't gonna let that happen. How about the people called Hit his loading gloves you. see D theid pict image? There's like rocks in his head. We were so stupid. What a compliment. Have they not watched any of his fights? Yeah. What a people saying I'm juiced, what a compliment. People saying I got bricks in my fucking gloves. What a compliment . People are silly. You can't read the internet. There's always gonna be someone saying something. I know but again, you go I got here 'cause I was petty. I read comments. I read comments , they fuel you. They do. They do. I've talked to him. I told him not to do it because I'm like, bro, this fucks with so many people. We had a conversation outside. Like it'll cause your mind to go crazy. And he's like, I love it so much. David Goggins takes haters and he records them on a loop and then plays it to himself while he runs. Yeah, I mean that's crazy. I don't need to have it . I don't need to have it on video. I know., right I know what they're saying. I knew what they were saying every fucking day. Right. And that's, you know , partly why I won. Well, it's, you know, that Teddy Roosevelt quote about the man in the arena , you know? Yep. That's what it is. It's like there's always going to be people on the sidelines that are talking. You're never going to make it impossible especially at that level that you're fighting as ambitious as you are, you can never make everybody happy. No it's hard to be a champion. It sucks the pressure. You know it really is Detriment al to like overall what you're trying to achieve . And it's just so hard . Well, you can't make everybody happy because some people are just not happy, period. It's not like you being awesome . Yeah, but some people are not, they're not healthy. They're not mentally healthy. Their brain isn't right. They haven't done the right things in their life and they see success as being somehow or another , it steals their own personal joy . Other people's success is bad because they compare themselves to other people and they realize that they suffer. I love seeing things happen. Good things happen for people. Beats when Max knocked me out I was like good for him like I'm fucking imagine what he's feeling right now. Yeah, but because you have given everything you have . You've truly maximized your potential. You've made mistakes, you've made great decisions and ultimately you wind up winning the biggest fight of all time. To exceed , but that's why you can be happy for other people . To exceed your expectations from twenty seventeen, to exceed his expectations from twenty eleven to exceed my own expectations is I mean I cannot describe how special and how good that makes me feel, you know, in general. Like that was my goal You didn't exceed a man. You I always had a feeling that you were going to do some wild shit. And after the Tony Ferguson, you couldn't have said I was gonna do this. No one could have missed this thing. There was a lot of conversations that I had with people that were counting you out those , I don't I think you can win this fight one hundred percent. I mean, I said it on the podcast. I even said it to Ili like Ili was saying it was I've seen that podcast and he was so wrong so many times you know, not just the whole, he has zero chance against Patty . He said something about I probably sleep during the day more than I do at night because I party too much . And it's like yourself, you don't remember him saying that? He's in it. He says something about weed and you're like, I don't care about weed. Yeah . But for him to think that that's true is fucking insane. And you have five looses ? Dude now. He's got one lucid. He's gonna have to go. I was like, wow, I was like, wow, what a fucking idiot. You know, like to think that I got here by just being a guy that drinks and , you know has fun all the time. Like that's fucking crazy. My life is so boring. I don't go to bars. I mean, I don't do any of that. I sleep I sleep eight to ten hours every single night. I was sleeping ten but it',s too much. So now I have to sleep eight, but for this whole week, I was sleeping twelve hours every single night of the fight week. That's nice. It was so fucking nice. That is nice. You know, it's just one of those things. If you wanted to watch your you have a YouTube channel, you could watch well and hearing also something to be said about how I knew he was watching. If you go back to my other like we always show spawning. We'll always show me hitting Mits. I didn't show myself hitting myth ones time this camp. I didn't show myself sparring one time this camp. Purposely. We were switching up the game plan big time. Like the tight lunch he had expectations, but they were none of them were based in reality and I contro lled that. That's awesome. Yeah. And then we know when I did make the when I did make a comment about his wife, you know, it was in a in an interview like this where we're just fucking around and I said it in just I didn't it was a hundred percent true. I was like he's so fucking annoying I couldn't imagine being in the same room with him, you know , with his pompous attitude , you know, and you just trying to like hang out with the guy but he's like constantly stealing all the thunder and it's irrational . And it's like I would leave him too Like I mean, if that's my part, like that's why I broke up with my girlfriends is because they were somewhat like that . I mean , and so I didn't mean it in a mean way. Like I would never dig at somebody in. I would never make fun of someone 's personal experience, but that was like that was just my honest take. You were the honest guy. And it was joking, but it was true. You just say what you think. I said so many true things to him. I said the Sony I, told him that he's going to go to the second round, go to the third round. You're going to be fucked because you're not going to be able to pull yourself out of this. You know, with the way that you're thinking, there's no possible way you can have these expectations, face adversity and then come out a positive way. There's no way it can happen. You're good. You could dig deep and you could be even more of a narcissist and it might work , but you, you know, you're going to you're going to walk yourself into a situation that is going to fucking be detrimental to you. And this is detrimental to his psyche . And this is ninety percent mental. Well again, I want to see him good. How he adjusts to the loss , but you know honesty will be with himself the strategy has to change . You can't just hit the gas like that and we've seen that with boxers. We've seen that with all kinds of fighters. They just think they can just hit the gas . Well, obviously you had to make your own adjustments. Yeah . You know how he overcame the maxpike? How he adjusted Bret did you guys know ? Didn't you play golf every day every year? That's like six months straight, wow. Every year every day, dude. This guy got really good. Yeah, DC was raving about it. He's like, I've seen anything like it. He goes, this guy's playing golf like, he's been playing for years. That's crazy.. It's really good Really funny. It's well, you know, that's the mindset that's coachable. That's coachable mindset, competitive and also objective. You know, it's the same reason why you think you're not athletic. It's like you could look at yourself in a critical way and then see what adjustments you have to make where a lot of people are delusional. Yeah . And that delusional keeps you from getting good at you delusional. What you perceive dude, you got pers itpect,ive is everything. Like how are you seeing things? And you always got to see it from the internal, not peaks in valleys like this right here. Like we come home and even through the airport, we're like, there's no celebration. I can see it is what it is. Meaning afterwards, it's like peeing that creepy celebration at the air. What we did . Someone was buying us drinks. Like we got there, we got there a little bit earlier. It should have been a fucking parade. No. I know I don't want that . I know. I know you don't. I don't . I don't but I have to do it because I do need to take advantage. Like I am the champion. It's crazy. Still can't fathom it, but I am the champion and I need to I need to be the champion ill and be the champion enjoy being the champion for a little bit and you need to look at yourself in the mirror and be like there's times to sit back and have bliss where you're like man I freaking did it like there's times to really watch it I thought that would come down. That you me runans down fucking yelling out different brands of mayonnaise with no more fucking blows on how to make bad decisions. You're like, what was that for? Shit, dude, we did fucking three fifths of fucking vodka . Are you gonna continue fighting ? Right now, I'm planning on it. Yeah. Every 'cause you were doing about that. I don't know. Again, there's not there's not something natural in me that feels like it's over. So that's all I can say. Also after a performance like that . Yeah, I mean, I'm obviously either either way out the best either capitalized because the financial financial capital. Yeah, but I'm in a I'm in a place where it's like I deserve to be compensated for what I have done one hundred percent not for what I'm going to do or I don't I shouldn't have to fight next to be caught UFC three hundred , UFC three hundred twenty four and now this. Those are the biggest stages that the U FC needed somebody to do something phenomenal. And they picked me every single time and I delivered. I wasn't the main event of UFC three hundred, but Colman event still stole the show, even though I lost . And so I think I need to be compensated for the for what I've done. That's where I'm at. So you talk about the future for like a next fight. Like yeah, renegotiate no No, no , no, I'm not talking about for the next five. I'm talking about the UFC should make a company and give me equity in that company and you know, so I can build passive income like that. Like I'm not saying that's what have you talked to them about something? No, no, I would I've never asked luckily I have a personal assistant now. So she asks for things for me but I've never been the guy that asked for things . I wish I wish people that were opposite me that asked for things and get all kinds of things . I wish I was given those things without asking because obviously people know that it's appreciated and I like it, but I'm not ever going to be like, I'm not taking this truck from fucking Armin. There's absolutely no way I would take a truck. He never shook my hand. Oh, this is Armin Tsarukin. We should explain that. So Armin Tsarukin, he bet a million dollars on Justin his friend and won he won like five . Five seven. Five seven is what I did. Yeah. So seven. Say you're gonna buy me a truck. I mean, I would kind of truck . Wow, now I just saw yours. You get a raptor. I have a shelf. I have a shall be wrapped? Those are I think now that I've seen your truck, that will be my next truck. Also, it has USA on the side. Yeah. You see the wrap? I love that. So that's that you didn't do that wrap. Do that . Tennessee's shirt. I want that truck. Oh, you need that truck? Yeah. Tell Armin buy you that fucking truck. No, I'm not taking a truck right now. What the fuck if I was Armin, I would force it down your throat. I would deliver it to your house and give you hug. No way. You want him five dollars around in a fucking truck that a dude bought from me every day. I don't know. No, I just go that truck. You won that truck. We didn't shake on it. I don't give a fuck. Take that guy with you, Joe. Yeah, take the truck, dude. It's first of all , it's cool. Yeah . And he might also be your next opponent. Yeah . I mean, that's possible. That's possible. That's the guy. Yeah. He's the guy that's up. That's the guy. I mean, if there's anybody else in the division, that is the guy. I mean, now that Islam is up at one hundred and seventy , who else is there? That's the guy. I agree . Yeah, and what a division. I mean, holy shit. And now Charles is saying he wants to do that. He wants to fight you division has BMF and the lightweight title on the line. That would be crazy . So there's fights available. Yes, there is. Big . What do you what are your thoughts like when you're thinking about competing? Who do you think it will be? You think it'll be Armin ? No, no , I can't say that I have a name . You think Eli is gonna try for a rematch? No, he doesn't get a rematch. He can try, but he doesn't get one. Wow. He quit on the stool. He quit twice. I stopped him twice. What else do I have to fucking do? Plus , his next challenge can't be me. He needs to fight Patty or someone like that. Does Patty have a fight scheduled? I think fighting . Saint Denis. Yeah. That's a tough fight. It is. Yeah. Ben was a beat. It's a fucking crazy game. It's a crazy game. It's the craziest game . This episode is brought to you by Blue Chu, the number one brand for better sex. Blue chew just drops something crazy, blue chew gold. Blue chew has made it easy for five million men to get hard . But now they've made it easier to get horny too. Blue chew gold gets your brain and body on the same page fast. Other options just help blood flow, but gold combines four ingredients into one tablet that works fast. Two ingredients increase blood flow and two boost arousal and intimacy. So for a good time, go to blue chew . com and we've got a special deal for our listeners right now. When you buy two months ofue Bl goCldhew, you get the third free with promo code Rogan. 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If you've been thinking about your next pair of boots or hey, even your first pair, go check out Takovas in store or online at Tekovas. com that's TECO VA dot com and right now get ten percent off at Takovas dot com slash rogen when you sign up for email and texts. I mean by far Think about where you were when you lost to Max and then where you are now. Just like think of the highs. It wasn't that long ago either. It was not that long ago. Now you got the BMF champ wanting to fight you . I have every belt like I have three belts, three reel ts, two interims, but those are fucking real belts . A real belt, the BMF belt, and then UFC two hundred fifty belt. Yeah, the USC two hundred fifty belt. No one knows how cool dude. So heavy. I mean it's so heavy. That's shit is free. Being a fan of this sport, like what do you want to come in here and do things that are not easily attainable? Yeah. And I've done a few things that are impossible to obtain attain . Nine bonuses in my first seven fights . Sixteen fights in the UFC are probably what like twelve main events? Yeah. Seventeen sixteen fights. And to be put in the main event of a UFC fight is fucking huge. Like you go on the poster , not many people get to experience that and I've done it almost every single time . And so I mean, yeah, I mean, I've done something unattainable. It's got to feel good. It feels great. It feels great again . As a fan fan it's good as a fan. As a fan, it feels good. Right. As a fan of yourself. As a fan of the sport. As a fan of the sport, getting to see what you've done . Yeah. What did you think about Cyril Gon? We didn't do so. We get to see it. We were in that. We were in the locker room like you guys are gonna go to a different staging room as soon as Bruce Buffer starts announcing. So they took us into a room with no screens . That's probably where the video of me shadowboxing with the flag. Yeah. That's where we were there. We were in there for like thirty minutes before I walked and we could hear , you know, you 're a little bit. You hear the I heard the ding of the, you know, the end of the round the horn. I was like, okay, was that round one? Yes. And then you hear nothing and then I didn't even hear the finish. Like I didn't hear the crowd roaring, you couldn't hear the crowd. And then I heard and And . Yep. Right? Yep. Because he was no, no, no, they said and new because they were both going to be new. I thought I heard that Still No We heard gone. We heard gone. Yeah, they heard gone. I was like, oh, fuck you won. That guy moves like a cat. That's it's crazy. Yeah. He for a heavyweight, I love watching heavyweights that can move. Like the remember the Mike Tyson era, just watching I was I love watching Mike Tyson and just watching all the guys he fought av.y Heweight boxing was so good at that time. People used to jump roll yeah. Now it's like I'm not going to say that all heavyweights are lazy but you know my knees are bad. I'm a big person. Like those guys can move and Syril Gon is one of those guys . Well he's the most so fast thing about him as he start ed out as a basketball player. So think about basketball. It's all these plyometrics you're constantly changing direction and moving and jumping agility. Yes, it's all agility and that translates so brilliantly to his striking style because you got a guy who's two hundred and forty eight pounds who moves like a middle weight or moves like even lighter than that. I mean, really moves like a walterweight almost. He's fast and just very agile . And when you notice it's like 'cause you know how good Pereira is and Pereira getting lit up on his feet like that and then drop with a jab . It's like woo . Yeah. Perfect times. And it's heavyweight. It's like those are big dudes. Yeah, like, obviously Prayer is put on some weight, but it's frame size. Yeah, that's, you know, and Prayer's got a big frame, but it's there's levels. Your body's been that weight for a long period of time. Like it's again that, consistency. It's's it MMA guy going into boxing. Yeah, they're shorter rounds, but you're hitting sprints every round. Like it's a different like there's there's you have to do it for a period of time to be able to adjust to that. That's a different it's everything that you do. You have to slowly go into those positions. You can't just jump into it. And when you think about how big he was at two hundred five , it maybe would have even been better for him to not really put on much weight. I agree. One hundred percent like Cyril Gonza'sra gppler and you got to be fast. Yeah, you got to be fast. Like your speed's a factor. It's a giant factor. And he's got insane power. Yeah. I mean, his power has always been heavy . Absolutely. He's not going to lose his case. He was so big. He was two hundred and fifty one and I was thinking, man , now it's like even though you have more power, you're also moving around with extra weight on your body. Like you're weighed down more by gravity . I mean, Gon looked so light and so loose . He's just like that style for a heavyweight light on the toes like that is so unusual and not allowing Per to set his feet No, never. Like that's very smart. And even like feigning taken it's not like you committed to those, but he's got them thinking about it drops him with the bottom of it. Now here's the question because one of the things that Pere is saying is a lot of there's an illegal shot. A lot of the shots were illegal into the back of the head . But a lot of them were told close or close because anyone naming Yeah . Yeah , it's a two inch line down like a Mohawk. This whole apron right here , but it's like this is legal . This is legal. Yeah , this is legal, this is illegal. Legal, illegal. And a couple of those shots definitely landed illegally, but there's a hammer fist hammer fish for sure you'll see him drop his head down to the hip. Exactly. So you're moving. You know, that's legal. That's a illegal . Yeah, there's a couple illegal ones. There's probably three or four right, but it's also movement and chaos . It's not like he's not trying to deliberately. It's like poking someone the eye on purpose. Like if I was that good, I would touch their chance . Right. How was the fight? This is a lot like targeting. Was the fight stopped there on the ground? No, no, it kept going This is actually the finish of the fight . That was a fish caught him with a big elbow right here and rocked him. I mean, Pere was in real trouble. Yeah. I mean, it was he got fucked up and Cyril Gon did a fantastic job. He really put it on him. Should you ever stop a championship fight? This is right here . That was it right there. I would've. At that point, it looked like a stoppage. I'm not saying it wasn't. I haven't watched the fight here. Here's the stoppage right here. You can see I haven't either and I'm just watching this. Yeah, that's like he was a true . It was so many blows . Maybe he could have taken one or two more after that for sure, but Pere is pissed off at Herb Dean and he's saying Herb Dean should never referee again because he allowed those shots to the back of the head. I mean you're in the moment. I mean fight but that's natural for a fighter to do like well if the situation you want to first off you, got brtinga awareness to it, so they're not, you know, you have to always be aware of, hey, I could have did better here because that's how we all grow. So we need to do we need to talk about it. But from what I just watched here and I haven't watched the whole fight, was the fight competitive at all? Yes. Okay. The first round was very so that would change a little thing. But from what I just watched right there at the end that was that look like a good finish to it. The Refs have such a tough job . I've been doing I'm notorious for being really hard on these refs because I mean it's they you expect them to be you you need them to be perfect. Their main job is to protect you when I fought Michael Chandler I,'m still and again I only speak about it now because I've never had a retraction from the referee. Whenever you poke me in the eye and then didn't get in between us and he let him hit me with a huge shot and then he doesn't give me my time to rest, not rest to recover. And there was only five seconds left in the round so it turned out that I got a break anyways , but he goes in there. He says, Are you good? I said, No, I'm not good. He just poked me in the fucking eye. And he says, Okay, well are you good? And so then it's like, can I still fight? So then I said, Yeah, I'm good. And he says, Okay, go. What referee was this? The guy with a braid that he puts in his Mike Belt Trump. Yeah, Mike Beltrum. And so I was very upset that he let Michael Tanner in that shot . And I know why he was so scared of the fucking heat we were throwing that he didn't want to jump in there and get in the middle of it. But his job is to protect me and he failed. He failed so bad right there. And so like after the fact that I need you to acknowledge this so that you do not ever let that happen to another athlete in there because you fucked up so bad and you know he's trying to justify it. And it's like, what the fuck are you doing? How can you justify this? And so for me that that pisses me off. And then the decision not to give me my time. Like I need an explanation . You know, I need to know that you are going to learn from this experience. And for right now , I still believe that he doesn't think he did anything wrong . And so I'm still upset about that. Well, once you say we're petty, we're petty you know , you should be in that situation because you say to someone, you got poked in the eye, are you good? And you're like, yeah, I'm good but I got poked in the fucking eye and then you're supposed to say two seconds. One two seconds, but are you good? I said, Well, yeah, I'm good. She said, Okay, go. Are you good is not the right quest ion. You have five minutes. Are you ready to fight? Can you see you need to bring in a doctor? There's a series of questions , but you have five minutes is very important for a fighter getting poked in the eye, you have five minutes to recover. Yeah. I didn't feel like I didn't know. I didn't know at the point. I feel pressure in my face right now. Like I don't just feel you're not gonna know for a couple seconds. Yeah, I don't you're gonna you're gonna blink a little bit move around, a little bit. All right, I'm good. And that's when you're it's supposed to be very clear. That's when you're ready to re engage. And that's what I'm saying. That's the mistake he has to learn from because it was such a and after the round ends, I walk over to I'm like, dude, get your fucking hair your ass. What the fuck are you doing? He's like, go to your stool. I was like, No, what the fuck are you doing? Like your job is to protect me. You just let me get hit with a huge fucking shot. What is going on? And he's like, Go to your stool, go to your stool. And I sit down and then boom, never thought about it again, but still pissed off about that one. You should be. I mean, that's that makes sense. I mean that's a mistake Who's the ref ines Kabee after the fight, he corners me in the hallway and he's like, you know, I know you I know you would never tap. I was like , I tap three times. He's like, no, you would never tap I'm like, Dude, if from the horse's mouth, I'm telling you I tapped. And he still was like, No, no, you wouldn't tap. And I was like, What the fuck? How can we get through this? Like I tapped three times I went sleeping and you went to sleep. I've seen that. Yeah, I tapped three times. One hundred percent you tapped one hundred percent and he's like, No, you would I know that you with your the way that you cope Who's the referee? What's the guy's name? I hate to talk. I don't even want to th herrow zog. I don't even want to throw under the bus, you know, because it's like his insight . His intentions were good for me . He believed I was he gave me a chance. Gave me a chance, but like I fucking tapped, man And I went to sleep because of it. And luckily there's no detrimental and chronic , you know long lasting problems because of getting choked out. So I'm not there's no repercussions. Yeah, there no' conscusssion, there' no TBI. Like it really is not detrimental at all. As long as you don't hold it too long and I die, as long as I wake up, I'm good. And so I was like, okay, like the repercussions aren't as severe and so like whatever, I'll just let this go , but ultimately, he didn't even when I told him, he didn't believe me. That was the first thing you said when you jumped up. You went over to him, and then you guys had the conversation afterwards, but you went over to him, saying Dude,, what the fuck I tapped? Dude. He's like, he did it. Then we see him later, but that was n't. I was like, Dude, I tapped three times . I tapped three fucking times. Yeah, it was pretty obvious. Like mistakes and they don't ever go Oh, you said, you know, you're some kind of fucking you think you're some kind of superman, why would you tap? It's like when your life is ending , you know, you're a fool if you don't understand that. Like I knew I was dying and that's just where I was,. yeah So that's not crazy you are to everybody he's at their eyes are like, No, dude. I know you better than you do. You never tap like you kind of fight like that . That's what I mean. People think the best that's how he progressed the best thing up to this moment is people don't give me credit for my intellectual abilities and I've also played into that and I've also understood how big of an asset it is for people to approach me like that. You know, thinking that I'm just some animal that doesn't think or feel or whatever, whatever people think or think I'm retarded. Well, I think what it is is when you are such an animal, people think you can 't be smart because a smart person would be aware of the consequences and wouldn't have the courage to fight the way you fight . That's all it is. And they and people who don't have that kind of courage , they like to dismiss people that fight like savages because they go well, savages can't be smart. That's not right. That's not correct. People it's like you see a really hot woman you go, she's got to be a retard. Yeah. Like no, some of them are really fucking smart and also hot. You know? Like the world is confusing . And you can't categorize people and put them into things little , you know, little fucking boxes just to make you feel better . Yeah . That's all it is, you know ? And you're and the thing is I never signed up like when we were walking out to the press conference, there's like twelve, fifteen thousand people out there. I look at the guy. I was like, Dude, I never, ever signed up to be a public speaker. What the fuck are we doing here ? Like I never wanted to be in this where I talk in front of this many people like that. What I prepared myself for ever . And now I'm in this situation where I have to, you know, every single word I get I say before these fights is analyzed by the world. Like the whole, you know, my father is my dad. Like sometimes I get tongue tied. Yeah. Sometimes I missed whatever we do too and I talk for a living. That's why I mean if people understood if had to listen to themselves, they would understand that they also make mistakes and so it's like fuck, man, like I can't be perfect. I'm sorry. I really didn't mean my dad was my father even, though, you know , it fucking makes sense and it's true . Listen, you're dealing with a bunch of people that have to write stories. They have to. It's not writing a story because something's interesting , they have to make a story no matter what it is. Their job is to create content. And when you your job is to create content, you make content out of nothing . And that's not usually it's usually not good . And that's what they're doing. If I could have been mentally coached, it would have been in that aspect. Public speaking? Just like I think you speak very well. No, no, it's like I guess there's no lesson to learn. Like you just have to do it through experience. It's like fighting. You just do it a bunch of times and you get comfortable with it or you're naturally talented like Connor. You know, who the fuck is that guy ? Smart guy. Yeah. He's great at that. Like he's fantastic at that shit. I mean, that's where he shines. You ain't lying. You are like Tom Petty . Tom Petty the Heartbreakers, you are petty. Dude, who cares what people think? No, I think he's being great, right? I like, you know, I like to see what people are saying about our interview and you know, 'cause I want to see the perception I want to just keep inspiring. But the thing is you're asking for the perceptions from people that you would probably never fucking talk to in real life annoying. What? You know those are people that are most likely gonna comment. Yeah, the people that are most likely going to, you think Michael Jordan's out there leaving YouTube comments? No, right. It's not people that have their fucking shit together and have big goals on one hundred people percent who are really dialed in and really fucking disciplined and the people whose opinions you'd respect, they're not leaving comments . Yeah. They're certainly not even shitting comments. You nailed that. That's just the reality and I'm not hating on these people. I'm just saying like I would have been one of them. If you if somebody give me a fucking YouTube account when I was seventeen, I'd be posting the most horrible shit about everybody , right? Everybody would. You're a kid or you're a dumbass. You don't have your life together yet, but that's the type you can't listen to them and take that as gospel because it's just not. Just seeing him walk through the airport and just everybody's perception when they see you and meet you is so great, dude. Like it's like people did like bro, the haters the haters met you like bro, I'm a big fan. Yeah, but still but it's but one of those things is like the inspiration on people like everybody comes up and they're your favorite fighter . Like have the brand that you're the favorite fighter, favorite fighter. Like that is unique. Yeah, that is like such a cool thing. Like keep inspiring and very proud of me. Be you. You should . Should be so proud. Should be. Yeah . So I asked you after the fight if you're going to fight again. You said you promised your mom, you weren't going to make a decision . And so it just settled in. I mean, where today we're here it's Friday. The fight was Sunday just so it was five days ago. So now you're just like fuck you how do you not after that? I mean you're the fucking champ. It would be great to go out like that. It'd be an amazing cap , but also great to have at least one more . Yeah . People like to watch chaos the highest level control chaos . You know, it'll never be that chaos again because it'll never be like it's hard to understand flyovers and it's hard to understand how dangerous this game is if you don't do it. Right . And so it's impossible Yeah . Yeah. So that'll be a huge factor. There's a lot of variables that I have to contemplate when it comes to that decision. Do you have a timeline in your head ? I do know so you can't remember a time I've fought two times in six months in the UFC. I've fought two times this year already in less than six months and so I'm going to take the rest of the year. I need my body to be healed I mean, I have what's the fuckin' diagnosis. I have a severe bone endema in the tip of my fibrilla that happened on Christmas and I have been dealing with that since Christmas Day. So a bone bleed like a bruising bone bruise Yeah, it's in the bone marrow of the tip of my fibrilla. Tip of my fibrilla clacked against my femur and it caused a huge a deep deep bruise and I cannot get to heal because I went, you know, I was going through training camp. It really hurt after the paddy fight. When are you leaving ? When are you leaving today? We fly out at like six thirty . It's three o'clock. I want to see if I can get you into Waistlet. Let me text Brigam and see if they could jam some fucking stem cells in there before you I've gone to Vegas, I've got stem cells multiple times. How about PRP special place? PRP me on crutches. It was crazy and then I did a coronal shot the Friday before I left. Wow. And that helped a lot . Well, not training is really what it needs, right? And have you been doing any hyperbaric chamber stuff ? No, that's huge. You have no idea how against my process you guys would be. I mean, I think I got two, I probably had two massages this camp . That's amazing. Well, it's really funny if you look at the difference between Iliotoporia as a YouTube channel as well where it's fantastic. It really goes into depth, but they're using like all this high tech neuro stimulation headgear and he's doing all these different things and it's all you see in the video. It's got him doing that and then me taking a four hundred twenty debt . Exactly. Did you see our video ? Where he had the dog chalker on his forehead? Every time he got straight with his legs it got flat, I hit the butt. Do you wanna? Did he bent his legs again? No, we 're covering our eyes covering our eyes and two balls at each other. Yeah. Trying to tap into those intuitive abilities. Yeah, right. Yeah, with your eyes closed. But I mean you're funny . I come from the fucking dirt . You know, my parents fucked up. They didn't put a golf club in my hand at four years old. They threw me in the dirt and you know, I became comfortable with the uncomfortable . That's a giant factor though. Being comfortable with being uncomfortable is a huge asset. Yeah. It's such a it is with everything in life, with everything in life. Life wrestling is definitely definitely has the biggest variable when it comes to my success. I mean the mental, the mental side of it like nobody can it's very similar to fighting in the fact that nobody can help you . You know, it is against all the blame is on you, all the success goes to you and you can never somebody else as an excuse. Any team set, I played football, I played baseball, soccer, swim team. Swim team's a little different. But you know, there's always a justific ation for why you failed or why you lost when it comes to those and you could always point to somewhere else or at least a piece if. it E'vens one or two percent somebody else 's fault, then you can justify it , the loss. Yes. In wrestling, that's never the case. Not only that, it's a combat sport that's acceptable in high school . Like it's a combat sport that you take in junior high school, you high taken school and kids learn like there's there's guys out there that are different. They're working harder than you. They're more aggressive than you. They want it more than you. Yeah, they put in more time than you . And that's a learner that's a lesson that's very valuable when it gets kids get delusional about what their abilities are, how special they are, who they are. When you get fucking flat lined by some dude just fucking picks you up and slams you on your back and pins you and you're like , he can do it anytime he wants. And this is the reality of training with this guy like over and over and over again. You're like, oh great. He later drops you in front of the whole class. Oh, great. Like this is this is reality. Now, you're either going get to better or this is going to keep happening to you over and over and over again. And the mental toughness that comes out of kids that grind it out in wrestling and learn how to wrestle uncomfortable, learn how to cut weight at an early age , all that shit 's terrible for you, but the mental aspect of it is fucking undeniable. Think about how many great wrestlers have become great MMA champions. Absolutely. It's the most important factor great business people. Like they watch Ied a study a long time ago they said that the boxing and wrestling created the best employees because accountability you know and again the cutting the weight like you're responsible like that this is what I love about Justin is what makes it so nice to train him is high level people like I've had the luck to be able to train some high level guys lately and I don't have to deal with any shit like you know and it's if I hold myself accountable then there',s we don't have to have these deep conversations or get our feelings hurt that we're just true to it. His accountability for everything is just there's nothing like it. And I credit that to his parents. His parents are just such amazing people and the way that they had raised him to hold, you know, because he screwed up a lot as a kid. I told him if we were hanging out when we were younger, we had a lot of trouble because he reminded me of myself super hyper so like making super bad decisions, but getting punished, getting grounded, getting not being able to go out late at night, like strict parents and that being able to understand that there is rules in life and you have to be accountable. If you screw up, you got to deal with the punishment. And that is it comes from your parents indeed. I agree. I wonder my parents being such good people . So my mindset has always been since I was a kid, I have looked up. So the reason I take comments on line and I read them , I've always looked up and given every single person I've ever interacted with the benefit of the doubt of being good . And whether it's what they're saying, what they're doing, their actions , everybody's been my role model . I've never looked at myself as a role model. I've always looked at whether no matter what even strangers like I trust that they're going to that they're good . that And's where I start that's where I start everywhere from. And so reading comments online like I truly take into account what I'm reading, you know, and I don't know why because I know it doesn't matter a lot of the times a lot of these probably fucking thirteen, fourteen year old kids, but I in my mind they're fifty year old, you know, men with experience and I just try to use as much and as much of the readily available information, comments , words, action as I can from a place of like I feel like a child in a sense when it comes to interacting with people . And I don't know, I don't know why that's how I take it or that's how I do it, but it makes everything , you know, a little bit better and I'm not as disappointed as much because like once I learn that they're not that or they're not good and they can't help me , then I don't be like, Oh, that's a bad person. I'm just like, okay, I'm not gonna have that experience again . Well, that's a good perspective. It sounds like you use it then and that's everyone's different. And if you can handle it and you don't get mentally ill from reading comments, dude, that's a rare, you're a rare person. We had many conversations in different places. That's what my I went to school for human service. I love to help people. You have no idea how much joy it brings me to assist people, to make people's life better, to lift someone's spirit . I mean, those that is what makes me feel alive . And that comes through my faith and through my parents. You know, my parents are such good people. They deserve so much more than most parents because of their actions and their example that they showed for me. And yeah, I'm just so grateful be the person that I am because it makes life easier. Life is easy. Life is so easy when you're not concerned about what people think, when you're not worried about things that you can't control.'s Well it also easy if you're a good person but I couldn't be a good person without the example of my parents. You have no idea how good and naive my parents are. And when I say naive it's in such a good way because they haven't done the bad things that most of us have done. And I failed him . And the last time I ever did drugs , I woke up in an ambulance and I'm pretty sure I died . And I was like, I will never fucking do that again. My parents do not deserve that. And that was probably twenty sixteen. Wow. And I was like, I never've touch thated again. Ever. My parents do not deserve that. And that was that's why I'm here. Good for you, dude . That's awesome. And it's great that you have such an awesome relationship with your parents. And it really does seem like that that attitude you have is very freeing in a lot of ways. It is , it really is. Yeah. Golf , weed . Trevor, let's talk about those gloves. What the fuck do we have to do to get your gloves into the UFC? It doesn't make any sense that we're using inferior gloves. Obviously, I want to talk about this, but the gloves I fought in this week were different . They are. They felt it was n't different . It was the same, same glove, the leather was different. It was a little bit thicker, I think . And so it was softer . And so every time I've ever fought I've had the most excruciating pain in between my hands right here, and I didn't feel that at all this fight. they were thicker. So it's like if you have a thinner material going through, it's gonna cut through this skin a little easier. Tighter . It's a tighter material. This was looser because it was thicker. It was weird. So it was better. Better. Better for that feeling that all fighters. Better for comfortability. Yeah, like you guys have no idea how uncomfortable we are when we were always pulling on the glove to pull it back. It's like getting the hand wrap too tight and you get those little things on the tongue here. So you make your fist harder squeeze it is harder. But this guy's a genius. He can fucking make anything. So Hunter reached out to me three weeks ago, four weeks ago and said he wanted to ignite the conversation again. So we'll see where that goes. But you know , from that first position that we were in , a lot of things happened in a great thing. I always told you it was going to be timing, timing's everything and they did the right thing and tried to make what we had spoke about. You know, we had an NDA and we had a five year and they moved it to a two year. Took a lot of great notes and I'm very grateful to be a part of those because they did go out there and use a lot of the ideas that I had , but they just couldn't do it to the level that I could do it. And I thought it was super cool that they were trying because it was it's a problem that they don't really see and understand. So I think they're they're in the right mindset and you know them helping the athletes. I thought was a great thing to do . But during that time when I was going to talk to, I actually brought the gloves and it was when you were fighting on three hundred . We were out there and I had a new patent that I had been working on so we could go opposite direction if they want to hone it. It's a separate patent from the patent that I had that goes in all of our products, the internal strapping. This was a new patent still with internal strapping, but a more dialed in for it fight glove . And then we had those two options and then when we got there, Ollie had told me that they're releasing a new glove. And so we have , you know, two versions now, which is super cool , and yeah, I think it 's great. Here's the conversation though. What are you trying to fix ? I pokes. Okay, I pokes and bins. That is not possible. You don't think it's possible to make less eye pokes. You could make less . You could make less never stop. Well, of course you're not going to stop because the fingers are exactly the issue is the athlete the issue is the comfortability of the athlete and the performance of the athlete. That is where ambition has to lie when it comes to making the glove better because the gloves we're fighting in now are fucking terrible . You have no idea they it's hard to make a fist. You have to use your entire muscle of your arm to make a fist. And so by the time we get to the fight this is already formed exhausted exhausted and then the pressure in between your fingers is like something you can't replicate . When you're a small business owner, you're always looking for the next big thing. Whether you're a gym owner looking to expand, a store stocking up for busy season, or a restaurant owner planning a new menu, you'll always need capital to grow . But traditional banks are making it harder than ever to secure a small business loan. That's why thousands of business owners trust Cardiff for same day funding . Their online application takes less than five minutes and won't impact your personal credit score. With over two decades of expertise, it's no surprise business owners keep voting Cardiff America's favorite small business lender. 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Do you think it's possible to make something that's like a mitten? Something that covers over the tips of the fingers? You would have fucking eighty percent less eye pokes . I do think you could do that in time. I don't think that's change is hard for everybody. Joe. That's a huge change for grapplers and things like that. But your grappler. So your grappl er, most people are going to say, well, if that's going to affect this or my certain locker they try it, but again, it's it's it. It would enhance it. The problem would be like rear naked chokes, like getting the hand be thathind you have more thickness. Like it's regular gloves are a problem already. But is it more of a problem just to have the fingers covered with the regular glove? I think it's the same. It might actually even slip in better. But the thing is it's like covering the tips with like a mitten like those old school everlast bag gloves. I think it's a different sport now. But why? You could still clinch, you can do everything. That's what I'm talking about. Take guys to the ground. Everything's the same. We can still grapple. This is telling me so much right now. Like and if you take the time from me, yeah. Right. Like that is a that's a huge factor when it comes to intuitive abilities. Okay, like explain that to me. Like, what are you feeling with your fingertips that you think we be'd missing? Well, it's not the fingertips. It's when you get to my hand, like he moves away. He moves in any direction. Like I can make that read. Now he's father and now he's there. Right. And I think if you're take going to touch away from us , that would deter our intuitive abilities. I wonder. I wonder how much I also think you start you have to understand . Where as a fighter, for me, it's like when I am relaxed, when I'm relaxed and if my hand can be in this position when I'm relaxed , then I'm okay. Then there's not gonna be as many eye pokes. But when I relax and it goes like this, right. Like now force your hand No, I have to do this. I'm naturally you're never going to take the human reaction and instinct away to protect yourself and the instinct to protect yourself is no that is the instinct the instinct. It's natural. It's intuitive and it has to be that because you're trying to get your chin tucked behind your shoulders so that you don't get hit . But the uncomfortability and like the strenuous effort it takes to make a fist is fucking stupid. That's stupid and this is the difference between your gloves and the current UFC gloves. My gloves are making your hand. My gloves are one of those things that it promotes a natural natural position, a better grip , better fist position where I'm not, when I squeeze my fist and I have the wrap on it, doesn't pull my hand up like this. And when you see guys touch gloves, they're usually like this. Not like this. Right. And it's lining the bones up for, you know, again, they they said that the last gloves were causing less knockouts. Our gloves were going to cause more knockouts because of better hand position, better grip strength on being able to have holds. Like if I'm holding someone's protection for your hands less appropriate hand and internal strapping. Like that is a huge thing. Like my goal at a certain point would to have where you can't have hand wraps on. Like if you have a glove that's actually protecting your hand, but you have the glo ves on that now it's equal one hundred percent because if you got one person that adds more padding more less padding double layers tape, like there's many different things that you can do. And that to me it,'s like if I if one fighter has tape wrapping their hands and the other one has house wrapping their hands, they're wrapping differently which one's better for breaks, which one's better for punching or like so having that's would be really cool and that's that's the difference with like our gloves. I'll show you that. I've never broke my hand when he's ever taped my hands . Like his tape job is I can't wait to show it off to the commission every single time. I'm like, look at that. Tell me you've seen a better one than that tonight. And every time you're like, I don't think so . You got gloves ? Of course you did . Of course you did. They're my favorite by far. And ladies and gentlemen at home, if you're just listening, the difference between Trevor's gloves and everybody else's gloves. One of the big differences is that you can see, if you look at it on that, let's see how they're curved folks like a hand. The regular gloves from the UFC are not , they're straight just like this. So these gloves promote a natural punching position. Look, without even putting them on, they're already in that position. And then when you put them on, they're damn near perfect. The padding is amazing. They're fantastic . They hit the bag with . They're just fucking awesome. And more importantly, look, what they promote. My hand is totally dead, relaxed, and it promotes a closed fist position. The cool part, Joe is this. This is what I was talking about. So this is he's doing the internal strapping right here. The strap is coming from over here. So that's gonna pull this in . As you notice, we got pad on the side so there's no like all the other gloves to paddle. Right, right, right. Coming down on a single knuckle, but again, this strap is gonna really see you in it. Oh yeah Then this one so useful. Oh, so these are better than the last ones you brought here. Oh, this is fucking fantastic. Have I've been dialing in finding the right product. Oh my god, you don't even need hand wraps. Well, you had told me before that when you hit the bag with his gloves, his bag gloves I haven't grabbed my hand since twenty fifteen. Piper doesn't fight with hand wraps on, which is crazy. Yeah, and it gets to the point if we have the right precipitation . It's awesome. This is so superior to the USC gloves. I mean, the fact that this isn't being used by the UFC right now is fucking crazy. We're gonna get it done. I hope it. Try it so hard. I stepped away from like the business part. I'm the visionary now. So I got the right people that know how to make deals so good. It's right. And the UFC's gonna be happy with you. We were ready. Yeah. Dude, I'm in there like dude, you know, I don't that was me versus Kabee. I take all responsibility. No, I believe it. That I didn't know that you could do deals all these different ways. You know, when they'd say what they wanted to do, I was like, yeah, that's not how it works. This feels so good. It's so better. That's how better. It's just much better. It's like where you put it on it hit something. Well, this is one of the things that I love about you is that you're so fucking creative with stuff and you're constantly trying to every single piece of equipment I have trained with the last week you're training back. Yeah, that's that's what I train in. Yep . I hit pads in that. I've never wore hand wraps once. there, but how you can open your hand to go straight out . And then the pointer knuckle. Protecting that pointer knuckle is so big . Yeah , that's it, right? Yeah, oh, that's so nice. Then you wouldn't but you can still grip. Right. You can still grip. But your fingers grab things. It hardenchokes. And the door knock you knuckles. This is what's trying to with those. I bet you do. You gotta go palm to palm, right? But still those are yours. Fantastic. Oh, thank you. And I got you another pair of X factors too, 'cause you got big hands. I remember I give you the sixties, you're like, bro, these are work for me.. Yeah I got a big chance for a little dude. Unusual. Yeah, well we'll get it done, but I mean , anytime you want to do it, I'm so happy. I'm so happy you're gonna get it done because I pushed for it so many times. I brought it up to Dana, brought it up to everybody . I was like, Listen, yeah, what the fuck are we doing? You guys spent a million billion dollars trying to make these new gloves. You got rid of in three months. That's because this could sound bad. That's 'cause they've never never thought about the fighter. But they did. They tried they tried to make they tried. They tried they tried. They didn't fuck and try do they know how much money? I'm not gonna tell you how much money had a lot of money. They did. To do what? Give me the same exact fucking process. They were making a bet. They hired the people . I hired a company that works on food . No change in their glove, but they don't know. They took the ideas. At least they tried. They did. I will give them one hundred percent credit. They did try, but I remember seeing the gloves when they tried and going these sucks. These are not as good. Right away, I was still uncomfortable. Still hurt my head said to him right away. Why don't you just get Trevor's gloves? What the fuck are we doing here? No, these are good. These are good . Get the best gloves exist. They're already made. Like there's only a few people out there that are willing to like really get creative and redesign and engineer gloves and then when someone does it to the extent that you've done it, like God. So Joe, when you think about that , that's that's where I think I fit in well with this because I want to involve with the company. And if we change one thing, like my first thing I want to do is help a performance. I don't want someone to hurt their hand where all of a sudden I hurt my hand on the top of your head and I'm just left handed now and everybody just, you know, there's no paper view now, but I pay to watch these fights. And now the guy that I wanted to see fight can't continue because he hurt his hand. Right. So we fix that problem. We fixed longer, better grip strength for the grapplers who are going to need to have risk control when throwing shots. I want to help athletes perform. And as we go, let's slowly develop and test with the athletes and find out what because it's about the athlete. It's what works for them. And when we can get gloves on people and try something like you were talking about , that'll take time. You have to train it and go, Oh, I actually like this better. And there's a pros and cons. There's pros and cons, everything. Right. So it would take time. And that's where I'm passionate about is let's find a problem and let me think through solving it. But I need to know what that problem. And we send everybody a new website. Is it Onyx? Yeah, ONX Sports on Yep. A lot of people spell it with SL OVES the best shin pads. Thank you. You have the best equipment. It's fucking phenomenal. There it is right there. That's the website. Onyx sports , it's fucking fantastic stuff . I mean, it's really obvious that it's a high level coach who's developed all this shit. I mean, everything you make is top of the food the best tester in the world . I fucking break everything. I'm sure. And I can't , I cannot break these gloves . I cannot break these loves. I have to switch every like six months because I wear the foam out so much so I don't ever want to hurt my heart. But you got two or three sessions of training every day. For a typical person, these gloves are going to last well over Corey had his shin guards for four years. I had my shin guards for like three years. Yeah . And when you think about the amount of damage that that three years entails,. Yeah that's pretty much absolutely incred ible for people with a leather with foam. Yeah. You're almost fuckin' soaked with sweat. Everything's getting broken down and moisturized and drying out again crap. That hey, that's the bags that were up there. Dude, we got connectors for the shin guards and the knee pads on the outside so all your equipment's on the outside of the bag to dry. Oh yeah so that's really cool too. So just trying to rethink how things work. So that's what I love about the way you approach things. You're always like fixing the problem. I can't stand when we're not even working on kickboxing and someone's kicking. And it's because they're fucking gear you. That was the worst thing about fixing my nose . Fuckin' smelling people. I was like, oh my God. You know how the gym is? Especially with geese, right? Yeah. Like the dudes who don't wash their gheese. Those guys are that's their real problem. That's a real problem. And those are the ones always give you fucking cooties too. Right? So nasty. Yeah, it's nasty. Listen, Justin, I just want I'm so glad you're not gonna fight to the end of the year. Like for whenever just enjoy that because that was a fucking masterpiece. Sir. It was beautiful to be there . I mean , I felt so American American . I felt so hard to represent this country because we're such a melting pot. Yes. And I think I have done it. I think I achieved that. And so I'm very very proud of that. Dude, you did it in Spades. You did it five stars. It was fucking phenomenal. It was one of the greatest events that any sporting event has ever put on. I mean, maybe the greatest sport event in the history of the world. I said it before this is going to be like a miracle and I shit. It was man. I know it was. I knew I knew I knew I had the opportunity to do something special. I did it and then here come town . Yeah, I wanted to see my family. It was incredible. That was so cool. So look how cool that is. Yes so cool. Look how cool that is. That is so amazing. That's so fucking amazing. It was an amazing night, dude. So happy I went. I'm so happy I was there to see it live. It was a really I was honestly really nerv ous, Joe. I was like, dude, there's like just again being around everybody and something could happen. The drones that, you know, that they stopped, like again, I wasn't knowing what to expect and then till after the fight because again, we couldn't take it in. it was a beautiful thing And Justin, I was like fucking if I get taken out in the middle of the cage, how fucking legendary would that be? I said to Trump. I go, I hope we don't die in a terrorist attack. I said to Trump. I hope we don't die in a terrorist attack. He goes, we got to go somehow. I got