ATX TV Festival Panel Highlights

The official Game of Thrones podcast is sponsored Chase Sappire Reserve for Business. I'm Lonnie, co founder of Zoe Studios. We're aFX company that works on House of the Dragon. Our goal is to create epic TV. Building a business is its own epic adventure. In visual effects and shows of this scale, details Matter, where every minute of screen time equals thousands of minutes of people time. We take big swings and refuse to think small For world builduilders everywhere, the business card that gives back all you put in, Chase staff are reserved for business. Card issued by J.P Morgan Chase Bank, and a member of DDIC. sububject to credit approval terms apply Ours is the flagship We cannot give ourselves to a singular pursuit. We must lead the assaultless it fall into disorder Do you think I sailed across the Narrow seea to win your King's war for you? Welcome to a very special bonus episode of the official Game of Thrones podcast, House of the Dragon I am Jason Conpscion. And I'm Gretta Johnson. There was so much to talk about in the season three premiere of House of the Dragon. that we thought, you know what? Let's just keep this discussion going. So we are back to talk all about the Battle of the Gullet in a bonus episode made possible by Chase Sapphire Reserve for Business We have a very fun treat for this one. We will talk to the director of episode O Lonni Parisere about directing that epic battle sequence. And that's not all. We also have exclusive footage from a panel at the ATX TV Festival in Austin, Texas, featuring showrunner Ryan Condle, and cast members Steve Toussant, Harry Colltte, Bethany Antonia, and Abuba Car Song Alright time to waste, let's kick things off with our conversation with director Lanni Peris Steere We are very excited to be joined by the director of the season preremier Lonnie Periseere. Lonnie, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for joining. I'm so excited to be here with you guys I'm a big fan of the podcast. It's fun to be with fellow nerds because we like we do a lot. Ryan Condall describes the process of creating a show like House of the Dragon in the terms of a chef preparing a meal And everyone eats the meal too fast, but it's like, I feel like that's what this show is for because we can really talk about all the ingredients that go into the thing, you know? Yeah. I mean, I think that's entirely correct. And Ryan very much is a chef and he very much curates the ingredients. And he really wants the entire audience, crew, production, you know all of the ensemble pieces taste the ingredients and it's definitely like the carnival chef situation where you know, you try different things. don't throw that one away, try that one away. and he continually is curating the meal to make it, you know taste so good. You know, It really is that's a great analogy becauseuse he's a really good cook. may not know this but Ryan Cobvel's a great cook. Wow. That funny. H like his like pull pork is amazing. likeike Ryan's a great' been holding back on us Yeah. So Lonnie, you directed this first episode which also just happens to involve an extremely epic battle. Speaking of showrunner Ryan Condll, what was it like to have initial conversations around the scope and scale of the Battle of the Gllet? conversation that began during season two about how to make it and how to get it done. Ryan, you know, the chef was literally working on the page toward something that we could not only produce but produce at a level that would set the new bar for high fantasy high seas action. Like how are we going to do that? And what was it like in the early conversations? You know, the first conversation was, Hey Lon, I really think premiere episode. Battle of the Gullet was made for you. You know, you come from goal Visual effects, logistics, action background as a filmmaker this is for you to make with me, you know, And we as a team, we work really well together, we can have a communicative development process, you know, where we're going to basically put these pieces together with all those folks involved to ultimately make the best product And what he said was just read it and you know read the recipe and see how it feels that first real honest conversation, which was the most incredible gift as a filmmaker I was ever given, which is you're going to direct the Battle of the Gullet in fire and blood. the storied battle that takes place on the high seas, that's for you to make. initially before I read the script, I actually read fire and blood I went right back to the text before I had the script. and so knowing I was going to make it, I started there. So I started in the book with my highlightter pen, you know with my annotations, put together all kinds of questions, and then I went to historical fact and I ordered it's going to sound really strange. You know, with the interternet, you can learn anything, but I actually ordered old school books about the history of naval battles during this period, what it was like to fight under Oar for Everyone from the Spartans, you know, all the way up through to the early Middle Ages. and I just read as much as I possibly could to learn about what that meant And then back to fire and Bood and what was important in that narrative from various viewpoints, obviously, because we've got several narrators in Fire and Blood. and then I got the script, you know, early fall and I read it and I was so, so, so excited because what he had done with an episode one is Instead of just kind of doing that, hey, let's check in with all the characters, he dropped you right in to the most epic battle of the entire series. just dropped you right smack in the middle of it And I had to catch up, I had to catch my breath. It was relentless. The script is relentless action, from the start, right? And I'm like catching my breath. whoa, it just happened. The script had happened to me. And I'm like, out of breath, I'm sad. I'm happy. I'm exhilarated. I kind of feel sick a little bit because you know, this is so awful. kind of what it happens is like, oh, yeah, we won, but we didn't win. We actually lost. It's a rocky story And I'm like, Ryan, this is Unbelievable. he's like, it's good, right? And I'm like, it's really good, It's really, really good. And you know, of course, the next phone calls from Kevin D Lllinois is like, I need you to storyboard this as soon as possible because we have to get a budget and we have to figure out how we're going to make this. You he thought about, okay, we're going to build full size ships on gimbals. We're going to have a dry tank where we can catch all of the action on the sea snake Queener never was We're going to have that same tank perform for Siracco's ship, the Bchfist. We're going to move that boat off. We're going to break up that boat. half of it's going to go ono the wet tank, which is another gimbald situation where we're going to take that tank and we're going to use that to slam the bitchfist into the quQeen whoever was. And he really had thought out the engineering Doty and visual effects with Jim Clay, the production designer. And Kevin really had his time and experience put into this thing. And when I arrived in October Jim had made the old school foam core models, which is what also you know, as Ryan is a chef, he thinks visually to actually have these old school foam core models, we could then demonstrate, you know, what the plan was. And it was a really solid plan. I mean Kevin did make the Titanic. He did produce, S Private Ryan. So like that whole, you know, landing of the beach, you know, where you're with Tom Hanks, like, he put that ship on a gimbal. He was a part of that. So he had successfully done this. So what I really worked on in the storyboarding process was to basically make sure that there was always a point of view. And when you watch the episode you'll be with Alan of Hull. And if you notice, you can always see Corlus If you're with Coraless, you always see Alan. Yeah. If you're wiz Alan during the battle, you always see Corlus and Siracco on the other boat. If you're with them, you always see Alan in the background. and that was the I really wanted to do is like I wanted to make sure that if the audience leaned forward that they were never let go from the action that was happening in two theaters of battle. And on top of that when we bring in the dragons, I also wanted to see them in the background. Even in the early days of the preparation, storyboards and previs, I kept saying, well, if you're on Siracco's ship, where is Jace? You know Wh is Bela? If you're up with Bela, where is Jace? If you're with Sheep's deealer and Ray, where are they And Ryan thinks that way too. So the recipe is Al on screen, all the time, always affected, always aware of your surroundings because that makes it real. You have to see everything all the time. So that's the long answer for, you know how did it all start? Thinking about this battle, I think one of the things that I react to you so strongly about it which I think is what you're talking about is that even through this incredible breakneck action that's taking place land and air You're still developing character through these action scenes. What principles do you use when you're still doing that? Because I'm still learning about Alan. I'm still learning about the Sea Snake, even though there's this tremendous battle happening all around them. Great question And I think again, that comes back to like the key ingredients of House of the Dragon which are the threads of these narratives that in many shows kind of leanly reestablish themselves in a premiere episode. but Ryan carefully constructs web of storytelling, which about the end of season two and what was sort of left unsaid between Alan Abbu and Steve and Corlace, you know, like what's left unsaid and that we felt as we were rowing out to sea at the end of season two disconnect between them because brrother was now a dragon rider. Where do I fit in I don't agree with what my father says. It's all unsaid. And Ryan jumps right into that in the cold of the establishing shots, which are not just establishing shots of the quQueen and never was It's Allen of Hall doing what he does, which is run Corlus not doing that.. lookingoo off to see thinking about the loss of his family and his wife. can't be present can't be as ready as he needs to be And then he's confronted by that And Ryan sets this great scene up. It's not just any old scene. It's about these characters dealing with what's gone unsaid, not only about the loss of Corluses family, but the loss of family in general, that they are feeling together. And what's gone ons which is about Allan's family and my sense of place and where do I go? And barely get a sense of that. And what does Ryan do? He says, Sorry, battleless coming. let's go. You know and it's through the theater of battle that we continue that storytelling. And I think that's kind of what you're getting at, which is that story doesn't stop. It's in the theater of battle. We watch as Corus is distracted you know, Allan picks up the ball. Corus is present Allan is overwhelmed that you see a true you, leader, father son thing working, and it actually kind of really comes together. Additionally, it's like, you know we're picking up Ryna, you know, right at the start of this thing. It's like and she's been out there running, running, running, looking, looking, looking. She's left her only responsibility behind. We know that. It's like, you know, she looks like hell Because like guess what? She like leftgh without any plans She had it all taken care of. She had a whole bunch of people. and she's like she hasn't got any food, She hasn't got any water. She doesn't have like a plan. And she's like, I'm going to go find this dragon because that's what I gott to do. But she's really lost. and that's how we find her, you know, lost and diminished within the landscape. You know, Denivillenueve, you know talks a lot about in Dune how he wants the landscape to swallow the characters. And you know, Ryan and I definitely, we were of the same school. It's like, especially for Reyna, we're like Let's find her as the smallest, most unimportant thing in this vast landscape And then there's this dragon. right So you hinted at this a little bit, but I'd love to talk about it more because before you were a director, you were a visual effects supervisor And I'd love to hear more about how your VFX experience influences creating something like this The good news about having worked in a business doesn't exist except within the context of your imagination is that over time and experience you begin to see it all around you all the time, even when it's not Yeah. So when you're reading Everything is present. so you're reading Ryan's recipe, you're not just seeing the screenplay. you're actually seeing the final edit in final picture and that's what The visual effects experience does because you're constantly working with things that are not there. So in the Wayback machine, you know, working on Firefly and Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Battleestar Galactica, those were scenes that were written in the script that did not exist but were also character and story driven. so you have to see that. So I think it's definitely a super power, you know, to see that and it's a super challenge because oftentimes, you know, you guys are listening to me talk right now. I to oh, then this c thing happens. and then and then the ship fires a ballast day and then it explodes on the deck and then the wind comes and this it's like and I do that on set too, but I have to do it quite slowly because I need to actually show Abu and Steve And hey, you know everybody like what is actually happening and they're standing against a blue screen with nothing really happening other than wind and some fire and effects and stuff like that. And so what you have to do is you have to kind of take a step back and remember that you know they don't see the final picture, but that's the advantage of having come from visual effects is you definitely do see it preree visualization in the storyboard process spend a lot of time being very meticulous in leading logistics so that Every step of the way, it allows me to describe visually storyboards and previsualization to the crew and to the actors. So we did a tape out, for example of Queen never was and the bitchfist on an empty stage next to that tape out We brought the models that I mentioned, you know, the full scale models onto the stage In addition to that, I put the storyboards up on the wall And I would walk the actors through, this is the direction of the ship This is its relationship. to the bitchfist This is where, you know, Jace's This is where Bela is visually. And so in the rehearsal, literally where nothing has been built, no ship No blue screen, nothing. We started just kind of brass tacks, you with the actors and using that visual effects process, I was able to kind of like walk them through you're here. This is what you see. And I would literally stand on the tape out and I'd be like, I'm standing right here. and there is Jase coming around on Vermax. Ready three to one. There he on the other side. get on the Godmike and I would say like and here comes Baramaxi swinging around. He's coming around. There he is And he passes. And here he comes he goes and three to one, drorus, you know, like that's going to happen, you know, And I'm calling that out and you know over the fans, over the noise, all that. And of course, physically, I'm sitting there like the funny person that I contend to be on set. And I'm like,, Dorus, you know. That's how the visual effects really informs defefinitely given me an advantage Inting productions like this together, it certainly worked for the reed sewing too where the dragons aren't there and you have to perform for the people and you have to actually show them. So I really feel like It's an inclusive process. So that recipe is like you keep showing, keep showing, showing, showing, showing. By the time we actually got to picture, Everyone knew what they were doing. Itid't matter who you were, where you were, everyone knew exactly what the end game was so that yes, not only were we cooking, but it was like a cooking show. And it was like Bobby Flay versus Wolfgang Cuck. And like and there's Ryan Condle and I on the deck of the ship going, there, there, there you know go go, go. And it became a bit of like live action craft, which which is really cool. Again, all in the planning It was like a height of adrenaline, which was really really fun to do Yeah someone you really respect It's so interesting to me to think about like you have the skill set of like the knowledge base of the VFX, but then how important it is to be able to communicate that to everyone who doesn't necessarily have that visual and imaginary framework that you do. It's really cool. Lucky. veryy blessed. I wonder if you could take us into to the beginning of the process a little bit. You get the script comoming to it with the experience that you have, do you have a set of like a grocery list of priorities, Okay, why I must start here? Something that's complicated. I have to start with this. Yes. And in the beginning, it has to be creative only That's probably the scariest moments. I have to kind of disregard all the limitations, all the logistics, all the things that you know, and you just have to make the best version of the script that you can. And that's how I move into the storyboard process first, which is I sit with multiple storyboard artists and the previous team, Dotie and the visual effects team, and I just make the coolest thing I can possibly make. And that thing is unproducible. It's over budget, it's unwieldy. You know, but that's how you have to start. You can't start by restricting yourself. You have to begin in an unwieldy, more than is ever producible, more than is possible. You have to have a reach that exceeds your grasp. You must reach for the stars because you're never going to get there unless you take the moonshot and what ends up really happening is you basically kind of a creative waterfall or a crashing wave that allows you to kind of sort of see all the seams in the ship. And what was good about doing that is then you're able to challenge it. So Ryan was like, Okay, this is unproducible. Let's talk about a plan. and we start to whittittle it down in the way that Ryan's like, well, let's find something that is producible inside of the script. And that became one of the most unique collaborative experiences in my career at this point. because Here, you know, Ryan Condal, who I know very well and have done great things with, is basically saying, let's collaborate to make something that is your vision that fits within the confines of Kevin's ility from a financial standpoint and what ultimately I want this to taste like when it's done. Where's my ozabuco? Let's figure it out, right? We literally talked every single day and we began process of creating what I'm going to call the Wikipedia of the Battle of the Gullets, which ended up being like a two hundred page document. Wow. And that Wikipedia became the basis of the final screenplay And also what you know, ultimately became known as the super cut, right? So we started to create from the Wikipedia, we took all the storyboards and all the prev is. And we edited them together, you know, with sound and dialogue and we watched it all kind of come together visually see what ultimately we absolutely needed to have, but not only needed to have wanted to have on screen. L what did we want to see? What was the priority? And it didn't end up feeling like cuts. What it felt like is like the proper way to guide your way through a very big battle in three fields of battle Land C and air. Yeah. You mentioned that collaboration. I wonder if you could take us into that a little bit. I think people have a perception of a director from the movies and an idea of what maybe an executive producer does or a showrunner does Tell us how that collaborative process works across all these departments, with the actors, with the stunt team, with the visual effects Well, it does start in the small room, you know, with Ryan And Kevin and Jim Clay, the production designer. it's a small party to like, what are the ingredients that we actually need? And when the supercut gets to a place where Kevin's like, this feels like we're in the zone of something we can produce. You start to open that up beyond the small group. So Visual effects starts to come in further and we bring in the construction team and we start to share that and we start to talk them through. And in that collaboration, you know, Ryan is very trusting and he basically says, this is where you communicate and lead. You know, you're the admiral of this ship and I'm the king over here. So I'm sending you out to battle Admiral, let's go and we start communicating in small groups beat by beat. So it opens up, you know, from ore production of what are we building? Like that's what Jim Clay does as he builds with Malcolm, the construction coordinator. Then bring in stunts. How are stunts going to interact with what we're building? How many stunt people do we need? Obviously like Liam, the first AD is sitting over my head like going Oh my go, I got to get that thing done. I gott chase all that. If I have that if I have that, oh my God, if he says that and I have sixty two stunt guys, then those guys have need to get five costumes made, I got. And so then that starts to onion out because Lam doing his great job of like peppering that information through. So it starts stunts, then that opens up to thoseose next conversations of collaboration with hair and makeup and wardrobe. And again, that collaboration is on every level, you asked about the difference between you making a feature film and making a television series. Ryan has to make eight great episodes and all of them have to be an exceptional meal. So he's got to serve eight great meals, you know, down the road. But ultimately, it's his meal. It's his table to set The difference between film and television is Ryan would basically be like the guy who wrote the recipe and I would be the chef. On television, we're kind of like chef and sous chef. It's an absolute collaboration like all the time to make it great. That collaboration works because we have a level of trust that works there. And what that means is that all the way down the line even to the details of how bloody the deck is. That's just like a line of dialogue, but kind of tracking that through Over the course of a seventeen minute battle as it progressively gets higher and then washed away and then put down, and then who's on there. Those are the details that we have to continue to collaborate with because cut, Ryan and I are looking at that going tracks When you look at the show and you look at the episode, you'll see the bloody deck get bloodier and bloodier and bloodier, but purpose not just like, oh, throw more blood on the deck. It's actually purposeful. We said, okay, there was a ballastade that hit over here and it exploded, and these guys died. And then they dragged the bodies down over here and they put it down the hatch. And you know, that's all thought out in the collaboration, and Ryan's involved in all of that Good Lord, is it really only seventeen minutes Yeah That it's seventeen minutes of ship and direct d. I mean, I shouldn't say only like it's pretty wild to me like it's just so packed. Yeah. It's so packed. in you in a win the Supercut first came out part of the process of collaboration. That Supercut, I think, was twenty eight minutes of seea battle, you, in both theaters And then we whittdled that down, you know all the way through the editing process, not to lose anything. And it's not like we have a director's cut hanging out there with more battle. We actually like whittdled it down collaborative wee again, is collaboration between Ryan and Visual effffects and us to try to make the tightest version of the story we could, and we're ultimately very, very happy with where that whittling land Do you have a favorite moment from the from the episode You love all your babies, right? I think it's The intercut between Alan and Lohar's final moments bowels of the sining Queen and never was, just the They' sort of epic scale of the massive battle that's going on outside that comes down to pure vengeance between two people as the ship that his father has built is being sunk by Lohar even though she dies actually won the battle. Like I feel like character standpoint That was like so fun to manifest because it didn't matter that Alan of Hall kills Siraco Lohar because it doesn't bring Corlus back, you know, in that moment. And it certainly doesn't mean that they won the battle. In fact, it's very clear that they lost. And so that's what. The Battle of Gallet ultimately is all about And then the second big moment, of course, in that whole thing is that Jace dies. And you know, we cut to that. You lose and you lose when you use nuclear weapons And boy was that crushing? like you,' kind of filming Harry knowing You know, those are his last moments and knowing how how hopefully you guys felt it. Did you guys feel that? Oh yeah like you know, it's like you feel the loss of Verhrach. like I hope, you know, it's know Yes. By the way, Dottyy and Dottyy, the visual effects supervisor and are very sentimental. We're very much Spielberg, you know, to Ryan's Kubrick. And so like I was very happy when, you know, we were able to have like the Verrmach sort of sinking, you know in the foreground in his point of view because Ryan he' like Don't too sentimental, but that one is like, you gotta, you gotta do violins. Yes, You got violins. Well, and I think that is testament to the VFX that you feel so strongly for these creatures that you know aren't real.. Wow, Doty is talented. That's what happens when your visual effects supervisor used to be an animator, right? That's it ool He's an actor, like Dotie is an actor. so he is performative in his animation. Yeah, I think that scene too, you get a sense of the scale and scope of like sure it's great when you're on a giant dragon, but once you're not, You're just a very small person again. In a big sea. I'm just I just gave me shivers that you said that because that was also the feeling. I wanted you to be with Bela And I wanted it to feel like You know, that great moment in Dunkirk, you know, when the plane goes down and it's like and Verrax goes down. It's like, here I am on a dragon And there's Jace, like this tiny little dog like and I can't do anything about it I can't get him out I think my favorite moment was the ship smashing into each other. It was so cool to see. I feel like that something, it was one of those moments where I was like, oh, of course that must have been how it happened. But I feel like you never see one ship like really cleaving into another, you know? Did you expect that No, but it was amazing. It's good that you didn't expect it. and it's good that you thought it was amazing because we talked a lot about that moment because it is a big moment and it just shows you how far LoHar is willing to go Yes. likeike any cost it's sort of like that moment when Russell Crowe and Gladiator says, like, you know, don't move the cavalry. The losses are acceptable. L in her mind, it's take the ship no matter what. And we ed a lot about foreshadowing that and what I'm calling the Turner opening shot of the battle, which is the based on that master painting, the Battle of Trafalgar. You know, the Battle of Trafalgar opening scene, we wanted to see in the background some of that collision But we were very careful not to step on the collision. So the fact that you said that that's your favorite part and that you didn't see it coming, that's really important to us who like thought about that a lot, which is like, how can that be big anie, I have to ask who do you think won the battle? Lohar Jase is dead The losses are Owhelming Corlus is missing You know, it changes Because ultimately, what has happened is the Tiashi pirates have been spread about and there's work to be done. I guess the answer is it's both because for Corless and for Alen of Hull It's a loss that they never recover from maybe throughout the entire season. Yeah, I mean, I think The answer might just be nobody wins.ob Yeah, nobody wins, noobbody wins. Ands all that's what the season's all about is nobody wins in a nuclear war. Well, Lonnie, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and for directing the hell out of this episode Thank you so much for having me. I really enjoyed it That was a fantastic conversation with director Alanni Paris Steere. I loved talking with him about this massive battle. There's just so much to unpack there. So this was a great conversation. Now let's see some exclusive moments from the panel at the ATX TV Festival in Austin, featuring showrunner Ryan Condal and cast members Steve Tussant, Harry Colette Bethany Antonia, and A Buba Car song The official Game of Thrones podcast is sponsored by Chase Sappire Reserve for Business. I'm Lonie, co founder of Zoe Studios. We're aFX company that works on House of the Dragon. Our goal is to create epic TV. Building a business is its own epic adventure. In visual effects and shows of this scale, details Matter, where every minute of screen time equals thousands of minutes of people time. We take big swings and refuse to think small For world builduilders everywhere, the business card that gives back all you put in, Chase Sapphire reserve for business. cards issued by JP Morgan Chase Bank, and a member of DIC. sububject to credit approval terms apply. Ryan, creatively if you could speak about where things left off, how you intentionally let us up to where you let us with the end of season two and where the action will pick up in season three Yeah, and everybody was totally okay with that Um yeah, we're we're at the we're at the the cusp the precipice and it felt like you know, season one, we sort of designed to be very much this Uh we had to kind of introduced this very complex, multi layered family, three generations of this family, sometimes with multiple different actors playing the characters so that everybody understood all the underpinnings of this kind of generational feud that was in the slow boil that would lead to Alisent and Rhaenyra and their sides of the family really kicking off this war, but we wanted to We didn't want to have everybody kind of talking about that past tense. We wanted to show how that all happened which is why we did season one sort of in two parts. And then season two was the kind of the slow boil to war. And I think the thing that the show contends with that original Game of Thrones did not contend with, at least until the very end is this idea of there are nuclear weapons in play. and there are nuclear weapons in play on both sides. So really you have this kind of classic sort of Cold War standoff of mutually assured destruction. Of course, the characters in the show would not have those words, but we as a modern audience looking and see that. So the the war does really kick off in season two, but it's done in fits and starts because nobody wants to make the big move that is going to bring down the wrath of Vhagar or of Daemon because they realize that if it goes too far, you could just have ash left over But of course, that builds and builds and builds. and at some point you know, the cork comes off the champagne bottle, and that's where we begin here in season three And at that point, off the races, you can't put the champagne back in the bottles. You described it as this violent sea battle as, quote, arguably the craziest episode of television ever made. Now those are big words. In what way these things during you know, you're being talked to for an hour and trying to keep things exciting and interesting. Nickooked it out of you. I realize that might now be written on my tombstone Um, But no and I said arguably because I think you could make the argument. But I do think really just from a process perspective, really is this amazing achievement of filmmaking on an artistic level from all the crafts and crew that go into it. But then I think the fun of it is go and watch the house the Dragons built and see how we made it, and you'll see how much stuff we actually had to build. And I think that's going to be the surprise to everybody We live in this era where really you can kind of do anything on film. And I think a lot of our brains just go, oh, well, that's all just CG, and not that's y either. But so much of this episode is practical. You're in the water. There are multiple ships interacting that are real physical sets and the fire and the dragons and all these things knitted together to seem like it's all happening in the same place at the same time. And that's sort of what it meant from it like a production process. It's of course up to the audience to decide what they think of, you, think of the episode, but just the things that we had to engineer and figure out how to do just to make this episode of television where it was prettyt dn craz So that's production. fromom a story perspective, Take us through really what is at stake here because this is not something that we're building to all season. you're starting with it. So then how does it set the stage for the rest of the season Yeah, I mean, I've, you know, when I read Fire and Blood in Galleies back in I think twenty eighteen this thing leapt off the page to me because I just sort of thinking about it creatively, wow, that's really incredible and what an exciting sort of turn of events and everything. But then my producer had sort of intruded and' like, well, how are we going to really do this? And I was kind of thinking about it both ways. and It became clear to me that really this is the This is the sort of defining turning point of this war of the Dance of the Dragons. and there is the time sort of before the Gullet and then there is the time after the Gullet. And that just meant that we really had to figure out a way to really honor it and put it on television and show it in all of its glory. You know, we couldn't we had to figure out, you know, how to do it. And I think the the thing that's You know, so exciting about it is that it's it really is the point where it feels like the horse leaves the barn court comes off the champagne bottle in a big way. and it just feels like The skirmishes that have happened on the fringes of this thing here and there and we've seen you dragons die and things like that. But this is really where it just goes all out. And then there' there's a snowball effect that results or as the events of this battle that will then kind of ripple through the end of the end through the entire end of the war and then into the rest of the Targaryen dynasty. And this is that defining turning pointint. I've referenced Battle of Helms Deeps in, you know, in in the two towers, it feels like that sort of happens at a similar time in the narrative as to this. And there's the time before helelmmss deep and then the time after. And yeah, it's this it's the bloodiest naval battle ever fought in the history of record recorded history of Westeros. So It's big. How much did all of you know about w and whether this battle would be part of the series Oh, well, I didn't know entirely because I hadn't bothered to read the book. Okay, me put that another way. I decided not to read the book. Atist agrees. I didnn't want to be spoiled. Yeah.. But I do recall You can tell me this now because I'm sure that somewhere either around the end of season one or season two, you guys were saying, Ohh yeah, next year, you're going to be in South Africa shooting. And I was like, Ohh my Godd, yeah, the seas the warm seas of South Africa. And then when we came back, he was like, No, no, it'll probably be Wales. And I was like Okay, Wes, Wellld is good. And then when we finally came back, he was like, A not going be welles. We're going to build it in the back lot and you can just do it all there. So I kind of leared as we went along, basically. But in terms of that I think the only thing that you guys said to me about this character was they said, we're going to take the character who's got everything and slowly take everything away from him. That was my arc Sorry, Steve Was there anything particular you guys were kind of warned about? And maybe if it's something that happens this season, you know, careful what you say. But yeah, no, well, I mean, I read the book But so I kind of knew, you know, what was going what was going to happen and what was, you know, I think for me it was very much a sense of like, oh my Godd, how are they going to do this? Like I think that was the big thing for me. But we did it.. So yeah, I don't think there was really anything I think the thing that surprised me was just how they were how the whole team were able to make it happen I think, I think that's because it it's epic, it's huge. And you know, especially for something for like TV, it's a challenge, but oh man, it it's crazy. Harry, Bethany, anything anything that you got a heads up about? Yeah, I mean would know what would happen in the story and everything. but it was just a matter of when. And yeah, like Abbu said, it's like How are they going to do this? Because I mean, even when you see all this stuff happen in the scripts, it's like, yeah, it's on paper, but like how are they going to turn this into a real thing? you know? And even like being on set, going to watch the monitors and there's like temporary visual effects in place. And I'd be happy if I saw that release now And it was no one even started drawing anything yet and it was just a mock up, you know But yeah For me, every script is a surprise. It's like, where has Brian managed to sneak her in, you know? Beause in the books sort of left unsaid what Baylor and Rinna were doing for a lot of the time. So I had no idea. So reading the script and seeing that she was a part of this was really, really cool and exciting For the two of you who were filming on these ships, I understand it was so realistic the rocking and all of that There was some seasickness? I mean, yeah, some people some people did get seasick. Yeah They were weak and died first Um Yeah It was it was definitely it was you did get you did get sea legs. once you walked off the actual ship and like on, you know, on land, you did still feel it, which was u which was very weird. But again, it's just testament to how well it was Well it was crafted and done. You also had to remember to pee because they would to turn the gimbal on, they would have to detach the bridge that attached you to dry land and all the facilities and the AD was just trying to get his his you know, shooting hours in so he would not bring the bridge back until he was basically forced to. So you had you had o, the bridge is going out. Either get on the bridge orre you're on this ship for an hour at, you know, at least while we uh, while we rock and roll. You guys, a lot of you like you may just have your scenes with one or two. people throughout the season. So are you then watching episodes basically like us as audience? You're going back just to see what everyone else got to do Obviously keeping thatory. I mean, Season two, I was just on the docks. It was In my head, that was what the House of the Dragon was, you know, just being in the docs, then I suddenly see more casts and I'm like, o, okay No, yeah, no, but it is, it's really exciting because again, we do the read through. You read the scripts and you're hearing these other stories and you're like, wow, okay, I can't imagine how that's gonna to be. And then when you're doing the actual, you know, you're in production, you're filming it all, you really only see your part, right or your story. So it is exciting then to kind of all come together at the end and actually see the finished product. It's like seeing it new. like, you know, like like the audience is kind of taking it on, right? So yeah, it's a really cool experience to be a part of. K what's going to happen, but still be surprised. we would have these moments where because As Abu has said, we would all be in little silos, so at the beginning, Abu and I were together a lot because it's the battle. But you'd bump into someone else. I might bump into Matt and he's someplace else and he's like, Ohh yeah, I heard your battles looking pretty good. Th then I'd see you and Yan's like, yeah, I just got someone's thro. It was great. And I'm like, Ohh my God, keep forgetting there's so much other stuff happening Other than this massive ship. Ewan or Aymond did that Well, I couldn't possibly comment I realize I forgot to ask you guys specifically with the filming of like on the ships and stuff. What was the most challenging aspect for you guys Sing bitch fist with a straight face. I like comoming up and being like, it's the bitch fist. It was was That's the name of Lohar' shhip. It was yeah. No, it was it felt fitting To be honestly, the whole thing was a challenge because it was so likeking cool. It was like it was insane. Like I describe it as like being in a theme park ride, but you are the ride. Like it was so wild. being on a boat that was moving, explosions, wave machines Like it was incredible. And and I say this before, like I remember the first time seeing all the stunt guys like clashing with one another, like for the first time when they hellld action. And there I am thinking I'm gonna be like really cool and get myself ready. And then it goes action and you just see everyone clash. and it's like this mosh pit And you're just like, okay, this is so cool. You're trying to keep a straight face and show fear and terror, but all I can think of is, oh my Godd, this is awesome. Like yeah I think for me it was because what we did, I think at least I want to say like a month of f choreography? Yeah. So we would meet and going to this big gym with these wonderful stunt performers and they would take you through the choreograph of the fight And then at some point then Abigail joined and we would then choreograph our fight together and it all looks wonderful and sexy. And you're just like, ye, I'm gonna look so cool. This could be great. Because you've got all this space and they bless them are making you look good. And then you'd get on the set And it's tiny And it's moving up and down and there's water and blood and you're slipping around. And suddenly, all those moves that were like this And you're just hoping that the stunt guys will make you look good, which I think they did. Otherwise I don't think I'd be sitting here. That was. Mind you, I can remember there was one stunt guy where because there was a lot of blood as well. and this blood is like really like kind of sweet and sickly. so there's lots of wasps. And I remember I remember one time as we were filming This stunk guy as they said cut, this stunk guy just kept moving. And we were like, what's going on? Did he not hear? It's ' he had a wasp in his armour And he was just like flailing. I remember thinking, God, this guy is so in it. I in it. I was just trying to get this wasp out. So yeah, it was you won't see that though. And honestly, that might have been the biggest battle he fought. It definitely was. Yeah, yeah. wouldd be curious to hear from each of you. if you could sum up perhaps in a short phrase, a few words or just a word you're Character's arc this season Be very careful, right I'm gonna try a couple of words for Corlis. I think this season I would go with Evolved. and redemption Um I'll say determined and wet. Good. Wow She liked that answer. Wow. Bam cononggratulations, Harry It's a naval battle. Calm down. No, I'm getting I don't know how can talk that. I'm not even gonna Someone scream for Abu, please. Dry Y. Goddamn right No, I'd actually I'd actually like seriously I'd say maybe like reborn. I think that's a good one. Yeah, reborn I would say Bravery and sadness and drama. I mean, as we establish off the top, there's a lot of sadness throughout the that's And that's fine. Yeah. we know everyone's not always happy. So we get it. What is something that you guys have? veing able to do as part of this show that as you were filming, you're like, well, this is the first time I've ever experienced this on a set or got to do X, Y or Z. Definitely the whole naval like battle. I think something that Lonnie said was which has really stuck with me, It's like we will probably never ever do something like that in our careers again at that scale And it really showed because it was incredible organized chaos. And I think like that's why it felt so magical at the time. And I think, yeah, I just I kind of keep looking back and thinking like, was that all a dream? because it was so mad It was so it was so wild and yeah, I just don't ever see that kind of happening again or that kind of magic happening again, you know? I just think like pretty much everything like I've not done half of the stuff like in this show, like even like it all goes down as well to like the sets like I've just never seen anything like it before You know, it's cool to have finally have a role where I can, you know have a sword and a dragon. And you know, I've just haven't done anything like that sort of fantasy before And also just like even in seeason one, learning how to sword fight and then going like home and being like Yeah, this is crazy. L this is actually my job, you know U But yeah, like Abu said it a once in a lifetime job, you know and it's going to be very rare to get that on anything else. I think like obviously the dragon riding is unbelievable and it's something that I never thought I'd get to do the work. But I think the most impressive thing for me is we just have the luxury of time, it feels like. You forget that. You go onto another job and you're like, we're doing how many pages in what? And on this show, we just get so much time to rehearse and perfect and make the details so specific And it feels like a real privilege to get to do that every day. I think I would echo everything that you've just heard. I mean, I'm not even sure if this answers the question, but I think what I like, I shall answer my own question. I think what I like is that I just absolutely like everyverybody that I work with And I've been around long enough to know that can be quite rare to walk onto a set and just go, yeah, yeah I can hang out with that person. I can hang out with her or him or whatever, to even like my boss. Yeah, it's amazing. So as these guys said, it feels very much like a once in a lifetime thing. It's been an absolute joy. and then you we get to Cut people's heads off Not a bad day at work? No. Again, thank you all so much for being here. Please join me in thanking these guys for making the trip Enjoy ATX. Everyone get home safely. Thanks guys And that's it for this bonus episode. We will be back this coming Sunday right after episode two airs on HBO and HBO Max. So don't forget to tune in in. And thanks to our partners at Chase Sapphire Reserve. Business for making this bonus episode possible. It is the business card that gives back The official Game of Thrones podcast is sponsored by Chase Sapphire Reserve for Business. I'm Lonie, co founder of Zoe Studios. We're aFX company that works on House of the Dragon. Our goal is to create epic TV. Building a business is its own epic adventure. In visual effects and shows of this scale, details Matter, where every minute of screen time equals thousands of minutes of people time, we take big swings and refuse to think small