The Benefits of Talking Out Loud

Welcome to the Rest of Science I'm Hanna Fryy. And I'm Michael Stevenens. Today is an episode of Field Notes, where we have discovered something made by you and not just all of you, but one of you named Jake I Don't know the last name. I don't know the last name, either. provided. But what I will say is Jake is an absolute legend. Yeah, maybe Jake wants to be a little bit anonymous. His website should not be anonymous. Absolutely not. Inspired by a discussion we had on a previous episode about how many words does a person know and how many words are there to know, he looked into it and made a website that tests how many words you know. It estimates the size of your vocabulary. Certainly does. That's what we're gonna get into today This episode is brought to you by Cancer Rsearch UK. Here's something strange. Y DNA contains more ancient viral fragments than jeans The genes that build our cells make up only two percent of our DNA. and for years, that is what scientists focused on. They treated the rest, the ancient viruses and stuff as junk. But now we know that that hidden majority, sometimes called the dark genome, influences how our biology works and how diseases like cancer It's a reminder that progress rarely comes as a single breakthrough. It builds gradually. Cancer Research UK plays a central role in that progress, supporting decades of research into over two hundred types of cancer, work that's helped double survival in the UK over the past fifty years. For more information about canancer Research UK, their research breakthroughs and how you can support them Visit cancerResearchuK dot org forward slash the rest is science No one goes to Hanks for a spreadsheets They go for a darn good pizza Lately, though, the shop's been quiet, so Hank decides to bring back the one dollar one slice. He asks Copilot in Microsoft Excel to look at his sales and costs and help him see if he can afford it. Copilot shows Hank where the money's going and which little extras make the dollar slice work. Now Hanks has a line out the door. Hank makes the pizza Copilot handles the spreadsheets. Learn more at M three sixty five coopilot d. com slash work When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work, use Indeed sponsored jobs. It gives your job post the boost it needs to be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications, and more. Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Listeners of this shel will get a seventy five dollars sponsored job credit at indeed dot com slash podcast That's indndeed d. com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apppply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for indndeed sponsored jobs. Okay, so the website is called Vocab. Owl which looks like Voab bowl, like Super Bowl. Yeah. It's a little bit competitive. Voocabable. It's Vocabl. It's very fun And you and I have both done it. We don't know each other's scores. Basically, you just go through and you're shown words and then you have a multiple choice challenge. Which of these four is the definition of this word? And you go on like that for what? like a hundred words? Yeah, a hundred word. Yeah. Be there's how many in total, one hundred seventy thousand or so words that you could potentially know that are considered part of the English language? Yes. Yes. I think Jake quotes the OED as saying there's Uh something like one hundred and seventy one thousand four hundred and seventy six. Ooh. That's precise I wrote it down. Words in current use, what the OED considers current use. But Hold on though, if that number is so precise, can we not just make one up and then I'd want to it. We would have to get it into common use. Is A cf in there? Cf Cf is not there yet. I haven't confirmed this but I'm gonna just guess. Let's make couf a thing. Cool We need more cool we don't need more cool thingin here. It's cool this.reme cool. There's a lot of coolin here. But the OED also estimates that most people only know between fifteen and thirty five thousand words. Right We should say actually, if you want to do this test, you should probably do it now because we're going to be saying some of the words. That would be really fun. If you're in your car, it's okay. we're not gonna to spoil anything, Oh, we might because you might learn. what the words are going to be But I don't want people to have to stop. If you can Go do your scause Go take the little test If you can't, just put your fingers in your ears in that off the your ears. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah So How should we do this? Should we share our scores? I want to share the ones I got wrong. Oh there' cool words? My experience of this was you start off and he's got it so you do the cool basics first and I was doing those. and I was like Hey, check me out. It' very easy.. I didn't know it would get harder I was like, I know every word, oh my gosh. But no, it goes from core basics to intermediate, advanced, expert, and then Grandmaster And can I just say Once you get to the Grandmaster worords, the advantage goes to the kind of nerd who has read a lot of those books with titles like sccrumptubulous persononss guide to plex of flby words, right? And I am a person who owns like five books like that. Hey. So it paid off a little bit. Yeah. But let's see. So who's gonna to go I'll be honest with you, I think you've won. From between us two, I think you've won. Be you're an English lit major, right? That's true. I could barely write a sentence until I was twenty five You know? I'm okay. I'm okay Do you think we should have more animosity between us? Would that make the show more interesting? I think it might be you know we won't dog at each other all the time. When we first joined, they were like The producers were like, it is when you disagree, when that's when the real magic happens. I think that they were looking at Alistair and Rory and thought we should mirror that So maybe maybe we should lay into each other a bit more. We could try, but it's always hard because so often with math and science, it's not like, no, the square root of four is two and a half. Like what how are we going to disagree? We can disagree on interpretations and which facts to weigh in which way I think we're similar in a lot of ways too. It's true. Al Bluntly, I just quite like you. So you know, I don't think it would be I might I might tease you jest Just ubby around the edges a little here and there. No, it's f Yeah I like you too However Let's compare our vocab. Okay. According to Jakes's Voocab Owl. Vocab Owl. Okaykay. What are we saying? Do you want the number I got correct out of? No I want the estimated number of words you know seventy three thousand four hundred Iton't look me like that. What was yours seventy two thousand two hundred and fifty. W Wow. Wow. Congratulations. Congratulations to you. Well, that's a lot of words. So you know a thousand more words than me approximately. Wh are they? who knows? Probably British ones like Chim Chim Cheri and And Jim and I don't know them. Jimminy Cricket. Jim I know Jiminy Cricket. I like that. I say that when I'm upset. Jimy I say Jimminy Christmas Ten words wrong I got nine wrong. Oh, but maybe we got them wrong in different. I think that's what it is because the way the website estimates your vocabulary is by saying, okay, in the English language, there are this many words that are of intermediate difficulty or intermediately known And if you only know two thirds of them, then you only know two thirds of those words of the I missed more from lower down the chain Yeah, you must have done. And fewer up at the top, but there's fewer to know at the top So you have a larger vocabulary than me E I think maybe I'm lopsided. I think I think you've been reading too many of the scrumptedlyumptiousous. Yes, and not enough Wdy books. Dick and Jane Jack and Jill went up the hill. Jack and Jill went went up the what? I don't know that one, but Borborigmus, I know that one. What wasays did you get wrong?an I tell you the first word I got wrong? Yeah, I was annoyed about this actually. Okay. It was the word Zenith Oh, meaning like the top I thought it meant top But apparently it means strongest point. Oh Well, strongest and top can be related, but you know, it kind of depends on the options that you're given. Absolutely pinnacle of something. Uh I thought it was the highest point, but it mean apparently it means like So which option did you choose because u There wouldn't have been highest and strongest. No, I think I sort of marked up a little bit. Yeah, okay. well, that's fair. I mean, that'll happen I don't think any of the ones I got wrong were unfair. I'm a little bit embarrassed about one going but I got the first one I got wrong was Zephyr Zepha Now I knew that Zephyr was a kind of wind, but I was given two options. It's either a violent storm wind or a soft gentle breeze. But then they get quite crazy once you get towards. They do get crazy because then this next one, I think I should have known Laconic Lakonic. Laconic. I said, oh, that means being lazy and slow But no, it means using very few words. Yeah. Did you know that? I think I did that. Yeah, I bet you did. Laconic is a great one. It is a good A, the way she describes things is so laconic. No wasted words. just Okay. shouldhould I go through what I've missed or should we trade? I don't have a full list of them. I'll be honest with you. I found this test quite painful. I don't like getting things wrong. Yeah Well, me neither. actuallyually, no, I did like getting them wrong. I mean, look at me, I've written them all down and I've put them into sentences and I'm like, I'm not going to get these wrong again So I'll share my list then Yeah. Okay, Lgubrious. Lgub. I got that one wrong. Now I've heard the word before I decided that it means looking or sounding happy or gay But it means looking or sounding sad and dismal. I think I got that one wrong as well, you know? Oh, really? H, Lgubriious. So that's a a sad way to be. Oh, his lugubrious pose. You can really tell in the way that you're saying it. When you say lugubriious, it sounds I often children with their lgubriious play. But no, lgubriious play would be very sad. Okay.ctious I got that one wrong Well, can I just tell you this one, I also got this one wrong, but I actually got this one wrong particularly because I was sitting next to producer Lauren, who was like, Oh It means delicious Apparently not It means excessively or irritatingly flattering. That is cool. I would not have guessed that. I guessed that it meant dry and rough and rude. unctious. U, this drink is unctious, but no, to be unctious means to be like like a salesperson is unctious. They're like, oh, you have such great tastes and oh, this is you know what's good and you're You know, it's just, o, stop being so flattering. I was a bit anxious earlier when I told you I liked you You said it not me. And now we all understand it This one is the one that I wish I'd not missed. Innervate. Right. Innervate. It does not mean to cause someone to be filled with energy. It means the opposite. It means to cause someone to feel drained of energy. That's a tricky one. That is a tricky one. I think quite a lot of these actually You know when you see the word, you roughly know what it's to do with, but as to whether it's in the positive direction or the negative direction is actually quite stight words The words that obviously go in one direction or another, they're more common. It's these weird ones like Innervate. Innervate you would think it means like, oh, yeah, you know that speech really innervated the crowd Yeah. But that would be a bad thing for the speech to do because Heat innervates you. It makes you r sluggish. It feels wrong Yeah Um, I guess did you get noisome right I don't know. It's noisome is a Do you know what noisome means? Not now. Not now that you're asking me without multiple choice privacy of my own room. Itt it sound like noisome might mean like noisy. but it actually means G Bad smell. But it's got the word noise in it Anyway, I was really proud that I knew that one Um, Okaykay, then what about this one ZinzZ ZenzZ Zinc , I got that one You don't think you got you would remember because this was a ridiculous one ZzZ ZinzZ Zinnk. Did you get the hippo buub, buub, buub, buuba phhobia If I did, I got it right the one about the fear of long words. Sesquopidalian also means really long words M. But then yeah, like hip hip, buubub phobia. I don't know the word off the top of my head, but I think when I saw it, I'm like, it's gota be one of It's a hilariously long word What's the word for when something describes what it is? So like The word describing fear of long words is in itself an extremely long word. Yeah That would be u Autological the word describes itself. Th is I think there's also quite a big difference between seeing these words and being able to take a good stab at what their definition is. That's a skill in and of itself. And then the opposite which is to be able to conjure these words from the depths of your mind and use them correctly in a sentence. Yeah, and there's a certain point where It's impressive that you can use them But you still shouldn't because it just makes everyone feel lost and confused. Like if I started talking about, ah, yes, but as we all know, that requires math in the Zinzy, Zinzy Zenic variety or whatever, that's an old archaic way of saying eighth power of a number. Okay. Before superscripts were used It's the German spelling of the medieval Italian word senso, meaning squared Zin Zic And so So the power of two to the power of two to the power of two is to the power of the eight. That's why Zinzy, ZinzZ Zink meant to the eighth powerower. And yet, if you start using that word when you're describing to the eighth powerower, people are going to think you're a bit of a Zenz Z. No aren't you aren't even describing things better or more richly, just archaically You you know, one of my favorite things to do in the world is to just pick general words completely innocuous words. and use them as insults for children.. So for example, you absolute bing. you know? You absolute b Bing beinging Yeah.h, okay, this is an automopia, you know? Or like stop being a Pinky You know? Right. this kind of thing. But just like almost say them with the venom that you might deliver us way. Sure, I thought you meant words that were really common, like you absolute table. Oh, I mean, you can do that a bit Ly and being are kind of They're kind of theyre kind of cut Well, you know bana is like the standard one, right? Can you stop being a banana? Han a banana, of sure. Sure. Yeah. You absurd chair leg You absolute democracy U I use nerd a lot as an insult because I am such a nerd I just think that it's fair. I think it's fair. I'll be like, yo, what up nerds? Yeah. But like actually I'm the one here who's like, well, actually on page seven hundred twelve of the Lord of the Rings, Gandalf says this. You can't see steam That's not steam that you're visibly seeing you know like the fog that comes off of dry ice Yeah. I'm always the first to say, that's actually water, That's not carbon dioxide. The cold gas is causing water vapor in the air to condense into a cloud So the white stuff that you see off of dry ice, that's water Yeah, no, I think you're allowed to callool lot other people. Okay. there's three more that I got wrong. We're going just cover these quick Pogana trophy. Okay. that is not a trophy hunting sport that is Growing of a beard. Yes. I got that one wrong You clpped? Yes. I think I' got that one wrong as well. But see, that's literally an archaic word. It's a way of saying called or by the name of. Ah, yes, the lady climped Jessica Come on. If someone said that, I would I would not go, Dang, you are so good of a communicator. I'd be like What does your Cpt mean? Yeah Finally, you Caligon. Caligon means a neighbor whose house is on fire. Oh yeah, I got that one wrong as well. You know what there's a lot of overlap in the ones that we got wrong. Yeah. I think maybe I got an extra one or two wrong like Zenith in the early Hang on, this doesn't make sense You must have got one of these right Yeah, one of the late ones, right? Yeah. yeah. For example, I don't know why you don't remember this, but the Zinzi Zinzi Zenc Maybe you just guessed right I actually did this test fifteen minuteso. so it really is extraordinary. I did this like three weeks ago. So maybe the deal is that like so many new words have been invented since then that possibly changed the curve. Um, So Caligan That is another like ridiculous. It's a character from the Iliad whose house was burned at this one point and it became an eponym for some reason. L in literature, authors have written things like, Ah, but who is this youkaligon? meaning who is this neighbor of mine that is suffering I've never needed to use that word. No, fair, absolutely fair. Just looking at these stats that he has here on the website. Actually, the number of words in each category increases as you go up the difficulties of the category. So core basics U In terms of the frequency of words that people use in the English language, there are only actually around three thousand core bas words U seven thousand intermediate words. tenen thousand advced words And then it's twenty five thousand expert words, he describes it. and then forty thousand obscure words.. So the words so the harder they get, the more obscure they get. Not only are they harder, used less commonly and so on, but also there's way more There way more of them Do you have your actual final results page open? we could compare. I wrote down How many I got right in each category? Okay, go for. It was twenty for twenty in core basics.. twenty for twenty in intermediate. I got nineteen Oh, interesting. I was eighteen for twenty with advance. seeventeen. I was seventeen for twenty in expert. seventeen. And I was sixteen for twenty in grandmaster. Sventeen by. Okay. so because you knew one more grandmaster word than me whichich might have been the ZzZ ZenzZ Zennc. That's my guess. It could be That meant the algorithm estimated you to know a thousand more words Not that I'm gonna to be stuck on this for the rest of my life, but that might be what happened. I think that's probably what happened. But anyway, Jake Thank you for me Thank you. And please, everyone out there, go check it out. There'll be a link in the description. I think there's also something quite positive in that that if you want to learn a new language, I mean, the idea of learning seventy thousand words, one hundred seventy thousand words feels extremely intimidating. But actually you can get really quite far with just three thousand words. I mean, that's nothing. Thats right That's right, with just the grammar in three thousand words. Like learearn ten words a day. you can do it in a year. Yeah. mean you won't know how to put them together, but Go try this out Vocab Owl and let us know in the comments what you got and we're all gonna to compare and we're all going to support and love each other ct of you. I just don't want people to get all judgmental and think that they're better than each other. okay? This is not about the value of you as a person, it's about But having fun. It's about the value of this podcast. It's about the value of this podcast. Yeah at the bottom of the page it doesn't even say the name That's why I don't know Jake's full name. made by Jake Mo.'s just inspired by the rest is science with Professor Hannah Frery and not Professor Michael Stehvens. That part isn't there, than not professor. But whenever I see those together, I'm always like, oh, I don't get to have anything in front of my name. rofessor Hannah Fry and Mr. Michael Steven. Anyway, coming up after the break, we're gonna answer some of your questions. This segment is brought to you by Cancer Research UK. Now most cancer stories begin at the moment of diagnosis, but today we're gonna start much earlier before cancer has even had a chance to begin. You can think of it like a biological time machine. If you go back far enough, understand what's starting to change, you can help save lives and spare people from ever facing diagnosis treatment and what follows. And that is what cancer research UK scientists are exploring. How the ecosystem inside of us has changed over time And what that could reveal about a cancer's earliest roots. So today, we are asking, what if the key to preventing cancer is by decoding what is already inside of us? Here's a fact that you may already be aware of, Michael. You are more microbe than human. The average human adult has about thirty trillion human cells But about thirty eight trillion tiny bugs inside of them. mostost of them are in the gut microbiome. This biome's not just digesting your dinner. It can influence your immunity, it can influence your mood, it can influence how you think. In general, you have these sort of good bugs inverted commerce that help you to protect against toxins and that train the immune system to behave. And then you have some bad bugs They produce toxins that damage your cells, your bowel cells and potentially can help tumors to grow. And normally in a healthy adult, you would have the good bugs out competing the bad bugs for resources and space. But as you get older, our microbiome can end up changing and the number of good bugs declines over time, and so can't crowd out those bad bugs. and some of the chemicals that were once beneficial to us would end up start behaving a little bit differently. Now we call them bugs, and what are they little microorganisms, bacteria, they have completely different DNA than us. They are not us. and yet they outnumber the cells you and I are made out of. If you wanted to count every single bacteria in your body. One every second, It would take you a million years. Wow. A lot of these bacteria are good, but harmful shifts in your gut microbiome can create the ideal environment for bowel cancer to develop and grow. But cancer research UK scientists are now screening a library of around one five hundred approved drugs to see if any of them help stop the shift from helpful to harmful bacteria. But here's a question. So we know about the link between age and bowel cancer. Why is it becoming more common in young adults? Okay, well to try and answer that question, cancer Research UK scientists are tapping into one of the world's oldest bowel cancer archives because hidden beneath this hospital, there is tens of thousands of bowel cancer samples that have being collected All the way back to the nineteen fifties, right? And what cancer research UK scientists have been doing has been hunting for essentially genomic scars, right? littleittle bits of DNA damage inside of the tumors. becausecause different causes of cancer can end up leaving different scars in the DNA, and you can now use whole genome sequencing to map All of the DNA of all of those tumors, and then by comparing the different scars in the DNA in these tumors from the nineteen fifties all the way through to now, scientists can investigate what are the environmental factors, right? Because essentially you can see in your DNA the sum of everything your body experiences over a lifetime, right your lifestyle, your diet, your pollution, your stress and then how it ends up affecting your biology. And if those bad bug scars become more common over the decades, then that's a really strong clue that targeting these bad bugs specifically could help to prevent bowel cancer in younger people. So by using the past to protect our future, we can help to stop these harmful shifts before they even start. And that's how Cancer Research UK is creating a future where fewer people hear the words, you have cancer. In the past fifty years, their work has helped double cancer survival in the UK and saved and improved millions of lives around the world. And in the golden age of cancer research, we are finally unlocking the secrets of time to stop cancer before it can even begin. For more information about Cancer Research UK, their research, breakthroughs, and how you can support them Visit cancerreesearchuK dot org forward slash restest is science Hi, this is Garal Linka from Goldhangers. The restest is foootball. This episode is brought to you by Wise. It's only when you start moving money between currencies that you really think about the exchange rate, the fee and what might be hidden away in the small print Whether you're living abroad, paying someone overseas or just trying to manage your money across borders, you want a fair exchange rate an easy transfer and no surprises along the way. Wise keeps things simple WS is a smart way to move the currencies you need around the globe. It works in more than one hundred and sixty countries and with over forty currencies. Most transfers arrive instantly. WS uses the mid market exchange rate, like the one you see on Google, with no markups or hidden fees. So when money needs to move, you can see the rate Know the fee and get on with it. Join millions saving billions on hidden fees by downloading the wise app today. Be smart, get wise, Ts and Ts apply So good, so good. New summer arrivals are at Nordstrom Rack stores now. Get ready to save big with up to sixty percent off brands like Rag and Bone, Levi's, Adidas, and Free People. Join the Nordy Club to unlock exclusive discounts, shop new arrivals first, and more. Plus, buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for free. Great brands, great prices. That's why you rack Okay we're back with a question from Andreas from Sweden who says, I recently listened to your episode about microwaves and fridges, and I've heard that if you stand at the right distance from a nuclear blast, you get a perfectly microwave pizza Is that really possible or is it just nonsense? Okay, I want to imagine When I was listening to this, I was thinking of it very literally and it's like, if you stand just far enough away, you get a perfectly frozen pizza. Like it just falls out of the sky. A perfectly cooked pizza. You have to be holding the pizza to begin with, I think is what he means. I mean it becomes cooked because of the blast. Right. Is that true? No. is the short answer?ue. But the slightly longer answer is no But in an interesting way, I think. Okay, so the thing is is that you get almost no microwaves from a nuclear bummer. I would have assumed it'd be a lot. Yeah. a lot of everything, every kind. All across the electromagnetic spectrum. But no, but what it is you get five percent this gamma rays, neutrons, the sort of initial nuclear radiationation thirty five percent, this is from the nuclear destination. thirty five percent is thermal radiation. so infrared visible light UV, the kind of great block. fififty percent is kinetic energy. and half of it is just a pressure wave through matter through the air through. wow And then ten percent of residual radiation the kind of fall out. And I mean, there's not that much microwaves in that list, right? So it's almost all this flash of infrared and visible light but also flash is kind of the operative word there because It's not lasting long enough, you know, you're not it's not sort of like you put your frozen pizza in the microwave that's how you' cooking them. No, yeah, rightight. Now I wouldn't do it that. No no me neither. but fine. I ask this question, I've got a lot of suspicion. Someone from Sweden it all make sense now. But yeah, it was right, you're not gonna you could put your pizza in the microwave and shoot microwaves at it for minutes and minutes A nuclear blast is going to ionize for years, but it's gonna blast for second. few seconds exactly maximum. It's like but it doesn't cook in the same way. It won't cook in same way. It's it's more like you're standing next to the sun for a second. Yeahight. It's sort of the difference between warming yourself by the fire and warming yourself in the fire. That's the difference. sort of the fundamental difference of what's going on here Also, I mean, the other thing is that the heat that is coming through isn't gonna distinguish between the pizza and you know, your face. true. Because I was just about to say, look, you could thaw the pizza. You could thw the pizza. If you stood next to enough sequential atomic bomb explosions Just a blast of heat, another blast of heat, another blast of heat eventually, it'll be room temperature. I would say overall, an inefficient way to do it. Don't do it. Yeah. Yeah, because you're getting cooked too. You are getting cooked.. Yeah. And if you survive that bit, then the blast will come through immediately afterwards and knock you off your feet So so yeah, I'd go with no Generally. o. oververall Okay, next question This one is for you. This is for Mark It' sat in a bar in Portugal and there's a lively discussion on why human needs their haircut, but monkeys and apes don't. Yeah, this is one that I've asked a lot and we don't know the answer. The question is why are humans the only primate that just kind of keeps growing hair only out of one top place by the way. Now You call them orangutangans or orangutans or Oangangans. Okay, so orangutans have pretty long hair. They do. Uh Chimpanzees don't Humans The theory goes lost most of our hair because we needed to be able to sweat We walk and move and especially run in ways that our tree dwelling ancestors didn't. And so it was really helpful to have less fur and more open skin so that we could cool down through throughing. cool. But we needed protection on our heads because of ultraviolet light from the sun then For some reason, we not only kept fur hair on our heads, we also started growing it much longer Like the growing phase of each of our hair follicles on our heads is really long. It can be years But for a pubic hair, it's like weeks. Yeah. For an eyelash hair, it's weeks, but like not many Yeah, like six weeks M. And that's and that's why the hairs are as long as they are It's not that the body knows to stop growing after a certain length on my eyelash versus my head. Well my head doesn't know what to do. But the point is that they fall out eventually and new ones grow in and they only grow for a certain amount of time Why it would be that humans would have longer hair than a lot of other primates is up to just guesses. It could have been sexual selection. It could have been that human populations around the world just liked it. They just thought it was pretty and they chose partners who were able to grow longer hair. It could have been a sign maybe of health to them. We don't know. couldould be about thermore regulation Though it doesn't quite make sense, even the sexual selection guess doesn't really make sense because there are populations where people grow much longer hair than others And there are papers where researchers have said, well, it's definitely sexual selection. It was up to us and our choices and who we made it with, and that's why those selections were different in different places. Okay. So in like the tropics that there was ' still a preference for longer hair, but there were other things that were more important. And so that's why you'll have shorter hair here and longer hair there. Yeah, it's amazing how little we know. I mean it could also be that there is no reason, you know? L evolution doesn't have a trajectory, It doesn't have a direction that it's heading for. Sometimes you just get features that appear for no reason at all. There is no pressure on it one way or the other. That's right. Either it it helped in some way. or it didn't help or hurt. and so it's just the way it is. BeCause I think the other thing that's worth saying is that actually the length of our hair is in part because we have the conditions in which to be able to take care of it, right? If you imagine instead of taking a modern human and making them wild in inverted commas where they're kind of like moving around, you know, sleeping in different conditions, it's probable that the hair would break beforefore it got to its full length, you know Yeah So it could it could also just be there is no reason at all. Yeah but it wasn't getting in the way I for one, I'm glad it is though, ' Look at is my greatest feature. Air care companies sponsorship opportunities. Astonishing that they haven't already, frankly. I mean, look at this. I want to mean the hell really. Look at this. Hello. Bween us we average Half a good head of hair. Between us, it's like one good head of hair. ' you've got like more than, I've got less than. I wouldn't consider one negative I I then on average, each person gets h Iish o, you were sharing. I w. o, okay. I was sharing. Okay. I've phrased it wrong though. I appreciate it came across that way. Okay, all right. last question, This one from Meghan. who asked why do we talk to ourselves? Oh This is good. Okay, first off You know, not everyone does. Yeah. Some people do not have an internal voice. I don't know if I believe them Really? It's very hard to define and talk about things like this. They don't have an internal voice What does that mean to them? What does it mean to have an internal voice? I When I silently think It doesn't feel like it's a talking Do you feel like it's words Yeah, I words would be the best way to describe it.m They're not fully spoken Oh, I think might not. I talk out loud to myself a lot. That helps me to figure out what I'm thinking and feeling In my own head, like let me just try Give me something give me like something to a difficult puzzle Yeah Okay, the only pz that sprangank to mind is the last one you told me. Hold on. let me let me get one. let me get one Okay I am an odd number takeake away a letter and I become even What number am we? Eleven I mean, that didn't evolve very much. No, it didn't. but here's what I'll say. it still gave me some insight into what's going on. It's very visual. There's one other h hold. Oh, there's another answer. Okay, so it's I'm an odd number. take away a letter. Stew. I don't know what is it? Seven Shoot. Yeah. Of course seven. Okay, now tell me what happened in your mind. So what happened in my mind was very visual. It was more about images. Wh you were looking for a riddle, I was thinking about, what did I eat typically for breakfast as a kid? And in my head, I wasn't thinking, well, usually I had this food. I just saw images of them Interesting What is it like in your head? Oh, she will not shut up She is constantly chatting. and it's verbal Verbble h. It's verbal The people who don't have this instantly, people who have the inability to visualize images in their mind. Yeah, I've heard about that.. There's a sort of standard spectrum that you see, which is you imagine an apple Imagine a juicy red apple in your head And some people will see essentially a photo realistic version of this app. That's what I got. Yeah. Is it? Oh yeah lucky thing. Like It's like I'm remembering a photo of an apple I saw once. play very very with a lot of detail Even before you ask for the detail, it's there. Like I'm noticing things that are there. I'm not looking for them and then confabulating them Whereas for other people, myself included, it's much less like a fully formed picture. It's sort of like there's maybe the feeling of the shape of an apple. Yeah, I know what that's like too, though, because if you say, well, imagine an apple and a strawberry, I don't think too much about them. Sure. But if you really make me Imagine an apple, I can get it all Fully photore realalistic. Fully photore realalistic. Oh, it's red and green and it's very ripe. you know. I don't think I can quite get there. you would to say, Michael, imagine you had eight apples and you needed to share them with two people don't see eight photore realistic apples probablyb see like a half half image, half word kind of thing and that's all I need So now this is the slight difference actually, because if there was one program that I did where they put me in an MRI scanner and then asked me to do a number of mathematical calculations. Okay. Some of them were just simply arithmetic and some of them were about the movement of surfaces. Some of them were about some calculus basically trying to solve these quite long complicated equations And over and over again, regardless of the problem that I was being given, the part of my brain that was lighting up was the visual cortex. Right. Okay. And that I think matches it's not like a photore realistic version of what I'm manipulating, but it's definitely like the visual cortex is definitely doing a lot of work when it comes to mathematics, you're kind of manipulating things But the people who are who really struggle to create images in their mind. There's quite a big overlap with them and the ones who do not have an internal monologue whatsoever. Oh, is there? Yeah to not have an internal monologue People are still aware of the thoughts that they're having and they're just normal people from the outside. They insist that What when they like debate something in their head like, oh break from studying right now. What do they It just doesn't appear in the form of words. Right. I mean, I think I mean, I'm not one of these people, right? But yeah, they say it appears in your head in the form of words. Yeah For me, if I'm like hould I take a break? I imagine what I could be doing during the break? I imagine benefits I get from not taking a break As like experiences, like I feel them and I'm weighing them. I definitely aren't The words break doesn't enter into it own until I take another step back, if I want to talk out loud about what I'm trying to decide, then it becomes very verbal I think we should do a whole episode on this, you at some point, because I think it's really, really fascinating all of the different ways that you can test, because it's incredibly difficult. I mean, this is like the hard problem of consciousness, right? It is like understanding what the experience from somebody else's persive. And how difficult it is to describe your own internal world, your own internal mledel? Yeah, becausecause I don't even know if I'm describing it the way I should be It's hard and I don't know if I should trust other people's descriptions of it U I've always loved this hard problem of consciousness. What is it like to be someone else's mind I just read a Greg Egan story where this couple wants to get closer. They just feel like they they don't know why they got married. like they don't really So they decide, well, maybe we need to be closer. and through all these various steps, they eventually They realize that they cannot swap minds because as soon as they swap minds or bodies Just learn what it's like to be in the other person's body, but not what it's like for them, for their conscious awareness, right? So this doctor has an idea. What if I take both of your memories and pool them together so you have each other's memories And then I'll knock you unconscious and I will put your brains into exactly the same physical mechanical shape. Your awareness is still there. and then when I snap my fingers, you won't be each other, but you will both be for a moment the same third person. And this makes them so close that they get divorced because they realize that not knowing the other person is exciting And they're so close they're like, this I don't care for you anymore. You may as well not be there because I already have myself. That's such a great idea. It's kind of cute. Yeah, I like that a lot In terms of why we all do this, by the way, in terms of why we have this voice or where this voice comes from you and the experiments have been done on this where you look at three, four year old children, at that point, all of the voices are external for them. They're narrating everything they're doing. They're like, I'm going to put this block here and then I'm going to do this here and then they're chattering all the time continually. And the idea is that essentially you just stop doing out loud. It's the same voice that's going on, but you just do it in your head instead of doing it particularly out lou But speaking out loud, by the way, I mean, so many people do this. It's way I mean, people do it in Brivver because it's associated with something know with something that people who've lost their minds I know. I know. But people do it all the time. it's really difficult to find people who don't do this ever at all. And' good it's kind of good. It improves your performance on particular tasks. There's one of my favorite The studies on this is from twenty twelve where they were asking people to find particular items in a supermarket. and those that were told to say the item's name out loud were much faster at finding. Really? others. Yeah. That makes me feel better because I talk out loud all the time. evenven in the grocery store I know that I can't, so I'll like mouth it. And if you look at me, I'm going And I'm always afraid someone's going to like record me in public and be like, he's losing his mind. You're optimizing. I'm the old man muttering around the store being like under my breath going, well, would those be in the the Thai food section or the potato chip section. I just want prrawn crackers, come on seeee, I am doing that, but I'm doing it's all in your Yeah. I think that I never gave it up as a kid. Right. I never internalized it. so I have to externalize it in order to form the words. But I'm always doing little shows and stuff too. Like when I'm alone in my hotel room, I'll be like Ah now When Ill literally talk out loud. I'll be like, you know, I think that the warmer, it's like I'm on the podcast even when no one's listening. The warmer soda has stronger flavors, but it's not as refreshing. And I think it's because of this. you really? Yeah. On your own. And that I think is why I'm such a loner 'cause I know that I can't do that around other people I like that I work in my office by myself and I'm just sitting there basically performing a whole thing, externalizing every single thought I have out loud with words Can you do it in front of your wife? Uh, no I'm terrified that she'll walk in on me and I'll be doing this and she'll be like This is adorable. You are not on camera, but I'm like this when I'm all alone So you on camera is the most authentic version. It the least authentic is this version Wow That must feel quite Suffocating then, where you need to continually talk in order to process thingses. So I find myself in your head. No, especially when I'm traveling, visiting my wife's family and we're staying in their house and I never have a moment to myself. I'm like, I don't know what to do. I can't I need to sit down and go A! Why is Susan always saying that? I think it's because I need to just do that Wh'd you say that too myself? and it's embarrassing becausecause it makes it look like I think that I've got an audience all the time No. The first time I noticed this was weird is when I was on vacation with my family and they went down to the pool and I was going to go join them. And I just started talking out loud about why there was this sealed for your hygiene. seal on the toilet and I was like, out loud, I just said, they do that so that people feel that the toilet is clean and I realized that no one was listening and that it wouldn't be an interesting thing to listen to. And yet I was compelled to do it See, see, I think I am having very, very, very similar conversations But I'm just not doing them out nowoud. What it for you. Sometimes I'll be like narrating I mean, it's almost like there's two or more conversations going on simultaneously. So I might be like, oh, this hygiene thing, it's so that people blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then the other person will come in and be like, Either good job or you're an idiot. That's sort of That goes on a lot. Oh, there's like a conversation. Oh, there's a conversation. And sometimes it can be this is the one that I find U the most disconesting. I'm sure other people have this exact same experience. But I can be on stage and having giving an entire talk, right? a full presentation, especially if I know something reasonably well. And I can be verbally delivering the words and there will be an entire conversation going on in my head about something different Do you like this other voice? She's really annoying. Okay. But she's part of you and it like informs what you say out She this She's called Colin. Where did this name Colin come from? She actually is called Colin. Well, maybe I'm giving away a bit too much for myself. Colin is the nasty part You know? Yeah, because I think it's just when when when When Colin is just like, wa, you're a bit much today, Colin. It feels very useful to externalize it. To externalize it, give it a name. I'm definitely talking way too much. this reminds me of the Carl Jung thing about like as soon as the unconscious becomes conscious it loses its power And I think this is also a thing for another episode. but This is one of those silly reels from like the I'm a Navy seal teaching you how to be a man. But there was a one that I thought was actually really, really insightful. And it was that to disarm someone Wh's who's ot the upper hand, just mention Good they are So like, if you're being interrogated One way to disarm them and to kind of like make them second guess themselves is to actually say You're really good at this interrogation. Like I can tell that you have been trained and have a lot of experience Once it's spoken Now they have to live up to that And he was like, if a guy comes up to you and shakes your hand like really firm He's got power over you so long as you're going, o gosh, okay. But if you go, wow, that was a really strong handshake, they say that that's what alpha men do Then the guy's like, o. Oh now I need to be an alpha. Yeah, and now it's out there and it's been named and it doesn't have power. It's not fate if it's been said, rightight? And I think about that a lot Beyond just the like strong handshake kind of thing, but just in life, it's like as soon as you name it and you've said it, it's just not scary anymore. No, it's just not scary anymore. You know also though speaking out loud, I mean, even just beyond naming the things that otherwise go unnamed, there is also some evidence that it does help with emotional regulation, that there is something really positive about this So there's one study where they were like lookingoo at people who would mutter to themselves, you've got this, Sarah. likeike you can do it, Claire. You know, as they were doing that time. Yeah Yeah, yeah. And they actually like it reduced their anxiety. It reduced their stress. You know, And want I think that that's so true, but it can come in different flavors, all right? Like for someone like me, I don't think you got it, Michael I externalize myself This is very common, I think. likeike when I'm playing like basketball, you know in the backyard, I'll be like, and look how well he does this. It's the announcer saying it. And then if it doesn't go in, I'm like, o, we'll do that again. Now look at Michael never misses, right? It's like a third person describing how good I am But it does make me better So I don't know who asked this original question. you got a full got you basically got more of me and Michael there than I think either of us have ever given away on anything. But I think that ultimately, you know, the reason why I like talking about these kind of things is because I think every single person is extremely weird Every single person is extremely weird and we have been taught and sort of societally expected to hide our weirdnesses from each other. And I think let's not do that anymore. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it doesn't help because it makes us think that other people like have just nothing weird about them, that they have no trouble waking up in the morning, that they love getting all their tasks done. and it's like guys It's called a task rather than having no name because it's terrible. Yeah. Yeah. We're all in the same boat. We're all in the same boat You're weird, Michael. I'm weird. And so are you, ourur listeners, each and every one of you. So stay weird And please yeah, reach out to us. Jake who else? We had Meghgan as well Megan Gys, you are great role models for the rest of the audience. Snd in your questions. The rest is science at goalhanger. com. Can't wait to hear from you Or you can leave a comment under the video which you're watching now or the podcast which you have downloaded. We read all of them and we love your questions So thank you. We'll see you next time