Comparing Sutherland to personal family figures

I see you. Avatar Fire and Ash is now streaming on Disney plus. It's the film critics are calling the best Avatar yet. A true epic and completely jaw dropping. This is the only pure thing in the world . Return to Pandora on Disney plus. There will be an adventure for the whole family and watch the Oscar winning phenomenon at home. This is sad . Avatar Fire and Ash, now streaming on Disney plus rated PG thirteen . Whatever your thing , it could be anything . Canva helps you make that thing a thing. Canva is a simple online tool thing. It's a way to design with our Magic AI tool things . You can social media your thing, generate images or videos of your thing, make decks for presentations to show your thing. Whatever needs to be done for your thing Canva can make it an even better and bigger thing. Canva, the thing that makes anything a thing . Study . Come together on a Windows eleven PC, and for a limited time, college students get of both worlds. Get the unreal college deal, everything you need to study and play with select Windows eleven PCs. Eligible students get a year of Microsoft three hundred and sixty five premium and a year of Xbox GamePass Ultimate with a custom color Xbox wireless controller. Learn more at Windows dot com slash student offer. Law supplies last and june thirtieth terms at aka dot ms slash college pc Welcome to the screen rock podcast, the podcast where we discuss the weirdest and worst content that's been wrote on our screens and indeed , I'm ch onats, everyone subscribed to us over on Apple, Spotify, or YouTube. You do us a big favor, but not as big of a favor as the patrons who pay for this podcast, the Freemasons who pay three pounds ninety nine a month for that. They get an extra episode like this every single week. They get access to the the rock bar, live stream show we do once a month. They're also getting priority access to tickets. Not quite as much priority as the Illuminati ninety nine top tier they're getting a free hat on their heads and access to our Mad Group chat. Shout out to Eugene, who runs our Twitter account. He may be sent by God , and he will soon be going on paternity leave. Good old huge and a big shout , a big winter of kiss to the ladies who listened. Yeah, please. And I said, last week by say again, I cannot stop looking at them and how gorgeous and sexy they are. They are the most gorgeous and sexy women in the United Kingdom and I'm here with Jake Farrell. I need to stop saying that because I've wound up my misses a lot recently. I don't look at them . Despite what I just said , despite what I literally just said, everything I said in the last episode. Be shout out Eugene by now. Hopefully, him and his partner, the recipient of a bouncing baby boy. Eugene , of course, will not be getting I believe he is, yeah. I believe I believe they know that. . Eugene, of course, not being paid for paternity leave. He will be expected to be tweeting from the hospital bed. That's a joke. We are paying him, but we're not we're not doing that scandy shit where he gets two years in a fucking gets two days he's having like a week or so. He's only tweeting. Yeah. And we can still ring him any time of day on night. I never tweeted more than when my kid was born. So yeah, take a week off if you weren't Eugene. I'll see you in the group chancellor. Louis was born during first lockdown as well, right? Yeah, yeah. So it was double. Was that nice to be you had to have any distractions, nothing out in the world? Obviously, you had the existential dread of COVID, which isn't ide al . But other than that, was it how was it? Rina was ideal. Was it? I don't mind telling you. Rhina was ideal. Yeah, the existential threat of COVID because what happened so my missy is a midwife. She was pregnant at the time, the hospital because you remember like the first bit of COVID, it was like, Oh, we're all gonna fucking die. Yeah, twenty eight. Yeah. I had no idea what was going to come next. twenty eight days later Ammy's on the brain. There'll be a poster on YouTube somewhere I've passed. And yeah, basically she got like they were like, fucking hell don't come in, you might die to they just wrote her off work . The misses off . And then with me my work changed and I was just doing a lot of remote podcasting so I was at home a lot. So that bit was really good. Having the kid in lockdown was kind of sweet, kind of fine . My mate Andy, they had their first during lockdown one and him and his wife got incredibly into online poker yeah. And they were both just playing online poker on their phones because I think a lot it's just feeding and sleeping really during that time, isn't it? You just napping the baby's the baby's kind of like a little slug and you're just you just try to try to keep it going. Description for a man who doesn't really want children. The baby's like a little slug. That's right, Jake, yeah, yeah. The love of your life. Yeah, yeah,und ble of joy that's for many of a miracle. But I will say it's like it's a little slug. You can't play online poker with you at that. No, no, no, not yet. I don't think it's legal. Yeah, you were if it could, but it's just legal. I think Eugene the time you need. Yeah, take all forty eight hours a day. You think we'll see him on the group chat? I might imagine that we'll be getting a few bits of pieces from this. This is quite a special episode of Screenwrot in the sense that since episode one we've been talking about our hairlines. I think a clip from the first episode that did quite well, the first ever episode was us saying how we get our haircut, which is we get a sort of skin fade on the side and with the top do what you can. Yeah. I was still asking Bruno from I was about to name him the Barbers there's kind of doxy which is not? It's really near my house. Where he is now then yeah if you name it now You could have been like that bulbs to travel for hours to go to you . At the time, I was still asking Bruno to kind of reconstruct a line for me, a kind of crop at the front. I wasn't fully. You were still pushed forward. I was still pushed forward. It wasn't in my kind of go back to Walton Goggins . I'm still pushed forward . I think I'm going to be pushed forward for a long time. Because in three days , I fly to Istanbul ? Istanbul? What's that? What's that? That's how they say it. What do you mean? Istanbul? Who says ? The Turks? Yeah. Why do they say Istanbul Ottoman Empire? That's where horrified . It's just so weird the Ottomans who have occupied Istanbul . That's where I'm going. Yeah , to get a hair transplant. I'm going on Sunday. I just mentioned the Ottoman Empire on the pod. Yeah, it won't be the last . I can't wait to see the Ottomans on Sunday. No yeah, I'm going on Sunday. And I have to say, I'm fucking dreading it. You're going for a sponcon hair transplant? Yeah, so this is it. So it started off as a thing true Geordi . Yeah, true Geordi's organized football show I regularly do. From the mad libs of your life. He was true George's organized Jacob a hair transplant. Well, it was, it's not anymore. He's doing a discount code. He would do like a discount code for a hair transplant clinic. That's like real, that's real end of the world stuff. Isn't that good stuff? I actually got twenty percent off my on my hair transplant for the true Jordy football podcast gave me a disc Anyway, and I was chatting with him and he was producing and I was like, You're gonna get one Brian? He's like, No, I look good bald and he does look good bald. So I was like, I was sort of jagged off fucking get one and they were like, Would you? I was like, yeah, and they were like, let's talk to the clinic. So then it became a thing of like, yeah, okay, you can have a free hair transplant. And I was like, wow . And then things sort of moved developed , I'm talking to a journalist called Tom Asher who's making a thing for Joe Credit UK about going bald. And he was like, You guys joke about it a lot on your podcast? I was like, yeah, and he was like, Could I come and watch you get a hair transplant? And now it's become a thing where I don't mind saying and it will become apparent when you see my Instagram that I am I'm getting paid to get a hair transplant . I will say the dynamic has shifted. I've been saying to my misses ever since I met her I need a hair transplant . As soon as it was like, we will pay you and it's like contract signed flights, books you go in. Yes . I really don't want a hair transplant . Yeah. I really think I'm okay. It's a boy the crywolf situation we're in. And what I will say, I've had a few people be like 'cause we've promoted a product called Dents on this show. Yes . Which is a topical finasteride spray you put on your hair, it stops your hair falling out . I've been using that since we started this podcast eighteen months ago. I believe it does work and it stops my hair receding any further. I've had a lot of people like to wait a hair transplant and it's like I'm getting paid and it'll bring it forward. The nice thing is the people who do dents the company , they're actually a former hair transplant clinic who now have gotten into the pharmaceutical side of things . The guy who runs it 's called Ash, lovely bloke, he's been facetiming me, telling me what to ask for. Right. It's like knowing someone who runs who's like, Oh, you going to have a Vietnamese? I've never had Vietnamese food before. Get the foe . Yeah .u Gineenly, I've got a list on my phone of like the things I need to insist upon when I'm getting this transplant. I'm speaking to the surgeon tomorrow. So one thing basically I lived in Vietnam for a while. You really, you really want to go for the and go heavy on the basel with the foe .'s the That areas Mind if you bazzle with Vietnamese. Yeah, I have that on a ragu. What a podcast. So basically I've got to make sure what happens sometimes is they'll put two hairs into one hole. Got to make sure they don't do that . I've heard about that, yeah . Two hairs one whole Study. I've got to make sure that they don't leave the hairs out of my head for too long. I think that's fair to say Yeah. You got to get them out and back in again as fast as possible. Should be fine with me because I'm having a really small procedure. I'm not having much done . The other thing I've got to be certain what kind of time are we talking're? Like within twenty four hours, scorebo within thirty seconds and fuck. Well just as soon as possible the sooner the better. Right. He says do you come back in five days or see if we can get you in an alarm? I'm only going I'm only going for like a day and a half. Okay. And I think the procedure is only a couple of hours. I don't know. I have no idea. I'll be doing, we'll be recording. Yeah. I've got the mics in my bag. Let me know . I mean, like a few days after I get back. Okay. And the other thing I've got to do is make sure could you be skimmered at that point? I'm not shaving it. Right. I don't need to shave it. Okay, 'cause they're not doing that much on me. The other thing that I've got to do is I've got to make sure they put them in in the right direction. How are you gonna do that? That's what I said. 'Cause you know like your hair, you've got a bit of a cowlick at the front. A bit, brother. Yeah , if this is cut down, it's insane. It's going four different directions. One sticks up. Yes. I've got to make sure he doesn't do that to me. You could end up with a cowlick. If they put him in at the wrong angle, that's fucking amazing. It's amazing isn't it? Obviously, I want you to have a good result from this. If you come back with a ginger cowic and we both look the same, I'm going to be buzz ing. Well, what we are going to do and I've promised this already, I am going to make a patron special like a do cumentary. I'm going to do loads of video blogs. I'm going to film myself. Yeah. I don't know how good that's going to come out. I've never made it. We're going to face time each other. We can do a bit of that's a great idea. Yeah, do it of chance you go to bearing up. So yeah, out I'd say pretty soon will be maybe out already will be the Turkey special . Ottoman call it the Ottoman special. That sounds like a kebab, doesn't it? If you get the Ottoman special? I love the Ottoman special and a can of sprite that's too she one of those nice coffins, isn't it? Did you hear about not hear about? I recently became aware that I think the Black British community are really into sprite. Were you aware of this? I thought they're like ting. What's that? You never heard a ting? No. Oh, is that like it's like the mango fizzy what was it? No, that's the pineapple one is it? What am I thinking? It's just how they say Ruth, it's just happening , you're right. It's actually great for it. It's great for you. That's only interesting. You weren't aware of this then? What? The Sprite Full Sprite. Yeah. Never heard that for my fucking life. Okay, writing in television. I pretty sure I saw it in a rear. Was it not on those unc Pleercy for Uncle Percy Reels. John talk about Uncle Percy quickly. Uncle Percy. Have we not talked about Uncle Percy already? No. Not on here. Oh man. We've become friend we've become fans of a comedian called Cane Brown. Yeah, this is inverse screenwriter. We're not getting we're not sending you telling you bad stuff now. This is we are the funniest thing ever so fucking funny Kame Brown. He's a really good comedian. He's basically people just find this weird when this is explained to them that there's a thing in the comedy industry called the Black Circuit. And I have talked about this. I swear, maybe not in a main episode. You're like, I've felt this discomfort before . No. And it's we've been here before . Some people call it the unquote urban circuit. White people call it the urban circuit. It is the black circuit. And I actually think it's weirder if you tiptoe and call it the urban circuit if it only happens in cities . But like the black circuit it is what it says on Tin. It's like a circuit of black comedians perform ing largely for black audiences. And it's incredible because there were people who were like huge on the black circuit, but because they're not on what people call the mainstream circuit, you won't know who they are. Cain Brown is a great example of this. Many people wouldn't have heard of C Bayrmown. I fucking tell you now, he can sell more tickets than white people who are like quite unquote famous on the mainstream TV service. Right, right. Anyway, this Cayne Brown guy, he does his own podcast. It's called the Rated eighteen plus podcasts. It is so fucking funny. I recommend you watch it now. One of the funniest things and I'm not sure if it's actually his uncle or if it's just like a guy called Uncle Percy, but he's got a he's got a, I think a rust of fairy and uncle, it's fair to say. Yes called Uncle Percy. Again, we don't know if it's his uncle or not. But this guy, I think there's a reason why they have to hide his face. Yeah, we're not exactly sure why that is speculative. It could be that we don't know, but you can't show uncle Percy's face. For some reason what they do, they show his hands, but they also can't let you see his actual hands. Yes. We think 'cause he's got an identifying tattoobes. May tat het'ooss, maybe there are things on his hands that identify him. So what they do, like when Uncle is a podcast like this in a really nice studio , you'll see Caine Brown being funny they were like big nasty or something . Then it'll cut to this Rustafarian guy. You're not allowed to see his face. Yeah . You just see his hands wearing gloves. Yeah, wearing these white gloves. Looks like a snooker referee. I mean there's a clip it's so fucking go and watch the episode with Big Nasty on where they're talking about they're talking about analingus. They don't call it that. Well, they're talking about food and like Caine Brown is just going I eat loads of food. I've got a big appetite. I eat loads and uncle just goes, I don't eat what you eat . And he's like, Pudden, he goes, No, listen to me, I don't eat what you eat. And he's like, He's like, What do you mean? And he goes, You eat ours You eat ours? The phrase why we pump them that they use at some point. Eat pump pump? I just imagine you turning up for your spitting image audition . Jacob, who are you gonna do for us today? I have actually got a pitch perfect uncle person from the Argentinator. It's a thing in that that culture it's some people don't like going down on women. Some people definitely don't like eating women's barns. Uncle Percy just goes , he eats shit . Uncle Percy's not fan. It's so funny. The funniest bit of it is they and it it's funny how this came to us. It's our friend John Kerns. Yes. It's like you got to watch this show. It's so funny. And like if you've seen John, you wouldn't imagine he's a massive like imagine John doing the black circ uit in Croydon. Oh, I've done black circuit gigs. I reckon you do five at those. I think John's acts I don't think translate. I have no John's just funny. John could do anything. I haven't done a gig on the black circuit in a very, very, very long time. When I was new, I did. I think you might remember when I was new, I used to do a bit of material about nationalism about St. George's Day. Yeah. How silly Saint George's Day. Right. And the thing is it's quite like I think if you do it to a white audience , it's like a sort of knowing thing about growing nationalism. I was doing it just after Brexit, right? Right. Whereas if you do it in front of a black audience and you're like, My family loves A George . You just sound apologetic. Do you know what I mean? And I remember I used to I used to do I remember doing that gig I did a gig once at the Stratford Theater and it was like black act me died on my fucking ass because I was like obviously sometimes wipe it . I was shit. I was so bad. And then there's a geezer called Lenny Sherman , you know , is this guy a big fucking geezer, ex Milw igan, this comedian 's called Lenny Sherman . And he now's into he's like a real he's like a kind of reformed character isn't he meditation and yeah exercise fucking lovely lovely man he will say I was driving to a gig with him once in Skunthorpe fucking long way away. And I think he'd mind me saying he spoke about this a lot, but he's and he's a lovely guy now, but he has been to jail in the past lately . And I fell asleep. He was driving me home from a gig in his van and I fell asleep and I don't think he realized I'd fallen asleep. I sort of drifted and woke up and as I woke up he was talking about beating up a pedophile in prison but 're just like me on this podcast every so often I nod off and then you're talking oh fuck you talking about killing one of the I was doing this gig with Lenny and Lenny I like this apologetic guy and then Lenny did some material I mean he's got this joke about working with Muslims , which I think some people are like, Oh , good , I think when he does it at white gigs, Lenny, right? Other people are like good bloody tense. He's talking about stereotypes of other people of different heritage . Where is it a black gig? That is that is what those gigs are. It's like Jamaicans be like but Gharnayans be like this like fucking massive middle working class guys like Muslims be like I was like, this is what we learned to do yeah, this is right this is what our comedy is. And he does all of that stuff I think Lenny with a good deal of affection and wrong is he's off the bottom not that racist community. He's alone. Let me be very clear. He's not a racist community. No , the jokes are like well informed stuff and you know, relies on stereotype in the way that any joke does. Often the stereotype of him being a hooligan is actually now he's a kind of meditator. I mean , one of his jokes Lenny is people often ask me they go, Lenny, I was your Millwool fan, Brita Regisa. What's your view on Muslims? I say, great, I got a penthouse overlooking a mosque. That's cool. That is that? That's funny . Adding on to that. Yeah, so go listen to Cambridge . Also, how about this for a watch this for a gear change? I've got another recommendation for you. Last night I was lucky enough to go and see the new film The Ballad of Wallace Island by Tim Key and Tom Baston . It is unbelievable . It is one of the best comedies I've ever seen. It's definitely one of the best romantic comedies I've ever seen. It's gonna be absolutely huge . Do yourself a favor, go and watch it. I saw Tim Lewis there as well, the only nice man in the comedy industry. Yep. Time is a nice man. Tim is a nice man. He's a friend. I saw him on Sunday. I rarely bumped into it, but he was wearing the same train as my daughter. That's good stuff . But yeah, go and see it. I think it's out next week when this comes out. What I just said to you then that gen'suinely like off pod . I thought we were recording. I was like, no, that's nowhere near interesting enough for this. I just do another mate wearing the same shoes as Mike. While we're on the subject of positive recommendations, go listen to Caine Brown and the Big Nyas talk about eating ass and then go watch Tom Baston Yeah, really good stuff. A comedian with a very similar name to Tom Baston who got done for nonsense I don't know. There is today I'm talking about anyway T,om Baster not been done for fancing. He was there last night. It's all fine. He's doing it by the Q and A after. Right, let's get into it. This week, ladies and gentlemen, we are talking about one of the most requested subjects in the world. The most requested subject we've had and one where I'm like it would have been easier just to get him on because he all he does is podcasts. Yeah, that's true. He's a podcast guy. Ladies and gentlemen, the king of marketing this week we're talking about Rory Sutherland Rory Boy, get on this please . Rory Sutherland What a name that is by the way . Well, it's there's something about Ruby Sutherland that reminds me of a character from Wind in the Willows . And it's also the name is exactly what he would I mean it's like mister Sutherland. It's somehow evocative of his vibe, isn't it a state on the country? Yeah, it's just If his name wasn't Rory Sutherland it'd be like Percy Wynbag or something like that Percy Wind The Lord of Wyndbag Manor Rupert large trousers I don't know how I say we suddenly unks be pontific . Unks is yapping If we were waffling there isn't fucking wafflin . This guy basically makes a listen to everyone. We'll see you next week. Robby Sunday and it's actually quite a beautiful story of how he's become a viral sensation because this guy just popped up out of fucking nowhere and now he's been on every podcast around. He's I spoke to Chris Williams, the modern Williamson, Chris Williamson. I always get his name. Yeah. Liam Williams, Chris Williamson. Both in Northern Both moaning in different ways to varying levels of success. Chris Chris Williamson, he's been on Chris Williamson's podcast nine times. Yeah, right. He's been on Jamie Lang's podcast. He's been on like food podcasts. He 's been on every unkn's do be yapping. Yes, fucks it's waffling . Basically , this guy this guy eats us . He eats tools ? Yeah, I reckon he eats us. I reckon he fucks Second episode . I know I reckon he fucks yeah he actually read about. I mean I've been I've done a lot of like listening and watching of this guy over the last couple of days since we decided to do him and he does say some pretty horny stuff he's got to fucks yeah oh yeah he fucks yeah this unkn's fucks man ks be fucking unkn's be fucking that's me standing up at a gig in Croydon. What did you know about Rory Sutherland? Unkn's be waffling, right ? Get off get Cane Brown on He y so he's a marketing exec and he's been a marketing exec forut a very long time through the kind of boom of the nineties and forty ' s, through now he's still an executive lunch guy would have had. Yeah, he's still an executive like a huge marketing firm now . And basically he 's like a laugh at this sentence for a second . He's been talking for years. But the first clip is him doing some kind of like talk or speech or presentation. Yeah. He's been doing that for fucking years . Yes And what happened was a young guy started just getting clips and just of his talk of his talk without without him knowing at conferences, yeah. At conferences, he like something like Ted talks but more in the marketing industry, just he's just been fucking everywhere chatting for fucking ages. And some young guy started just clipping it up and sticking it on TikTok and it was going mad he's kind of perfect for the moment. He talks a lot about marketing and how to like create and sell a product and I think at a time when like grind core right you know everyone's a bit of an entrepreneur at the moment and also a premium on like heterodox or like contrarian thinking. Thinking outside the book it's actually everything you know about this thing is wrong. So he does those two things It's kind of like observations on human behavior from a kind of as you say, I know you think people do this, but here's what they actually did. Yeah. He does that, which appeals to a kind of Joe Rogan Peterson audience. Yes. But then he also has got here's how you sell a product which appeals to a kind of Simon Squib makes some money, quit your job and buy some crypto audience. So it's like the two kind of big things of the moment . He's actually just been doing it for years and what happened was this young guy went and just clipped up loads of the shit he's been, you know, where Unc's has been waffling And it went viral will never not be funny to me. It went viral without him knowing. Right. And I think it was his daughters. He's got daughters in their twenties who were like, Dad, you're famous on TikTok. You know, he's been popping around saying this shit for years. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then he was like, oh shit, I've got this massive TikTok account. It's all me. It's not actually me doing it, right? So he bought the TikTok account. Wow. Yeah, he bought the TikTok account. And now it just it just unks is waffling. It's just it's just going and and it's it's it's fascinating it like what he says is really interesting and then you kind of go is it? Yeah, exactly. Like you do know what I mean? is it? I'm going to get to my observation, my kind of theory on him in a minute. There's something quite beautiful , but it's like he will watch the first one and the first one is quite a spe cific it's like okay this is a marketing executor we'll start there and then we'll get onto some of the other stuff he says but I think it's very interesting when we discuss this guy his vibe what, he look s like, what he sounds like . And why we all want to listen to him? Yes, because I think it's quite interesting. So this is classic classic Sutherland, I guess, vintage Sutherland. Here he is talking this is what so to interrupt you. This is what he's been doing for a long time . For a long time, he's been going around, fuck knows where he is at the moment, talking about product, marketing, advertising, that kind of thing. What's happening now is you'll do Chris Williamson get specifically nine episodes and it's less about how do you sell a car ? It's more about why do we sleep on a certain side of the bed and should we do the carnivore diet? Right. And it's kind of tailored to the audience of it. But yeah, exactly. But the amazing thing is and this is like this is real when you know someone's a good podcaster and I put him up there with like the porky parrots of this world, he can talk about fucking any Oh no unkn's could waffle my gunny. And what you realize with this guy and I realize I'm ironic because I've had my headphones coming off everyone about ten minutes away from it. But the thing is I've had my fourth caffeinated drink of the day and I'm doing this now. Yeah. Look, I watch ed I didn't know what to watch to research him. So I watched, I don't know why I went for Jamie Lang, but I was like, fuck, I'll watch that one. I mean, I don't watch loads of Jamie stuff. He must have put his feet up halfway through the episode because it just doesn't stop talking . Like and I don't know what they would have briefed him . Like I don't know whether he's coming with stories . I don't know whether they said we really want to hear can you talk about this like he turns up he turns up like this guy how, old is Sutherland? Like fifty five. Yeah, he must be in his nearly sixty fifty. Maybe older than that. He turns up with a lost Mary. Yes. And a fucking mouth. Yeah, he just did it verbal. He just with it absolutely. At one point , you can see I watched it on YouTube. You can see Lang within five minutes just sits back in his chair just goes to be an easy one. Is he at the office ? Doo beappings. This is Rory Sutherland and he's talking about Red Bull. The most successful attempt to compete with Coca Cola by Miles is Red Bull . And it comes in a tiny can, it costs a fortune and it tastes disgusting. Okay. Now, when I say it tastes disgusting, that's not a subjective opinion. They researched it and they went to a company which only researches I promise this exists. It only researches the taste of carbonated drinks. And they ask people, what do you think of this drink? Where I think you've launching this drink? Okay. Normally research would come back with a failed product. They actually say this is the worst drink we have researched in the entire history of our company. Normally research respondents bit sweet for me. Robinish es bit cloying not really my thing no. In this case they came back with phrases like Cloydy or Drink this piss if you paid me. Yeah, didn't happen. And weirdly, the drink is so successful that they can basically run a Formula One team on the profit for the lols. Okay. That's how successful it is. Now, what I mean by that is the opposite of a good idea is sometimes I don't care about one thing you said so well. It's brilliant. It's kind of contradictory. Now, let me explain why I think red bulls successfully, which is n't actually a drink in the sense that Fantas a drink. It's actually a kind of placebo. Or you could say it's a drug. Now, if you think about it, if you want a nice drink, you want it to take it up. That's why Fantas quite popular tastes like orange, we probably have a strong evolutionary propensity to drink things that taste a bit like orange. Yeah, okay. On the other hand, once you frame it as something with psychoactive or psychotropic powers , all the rules change. All the things that are a disadvantage as a drink are a strength as a placebo. Okay? It's expensive in a small measured dose which suggests to unc ouronscious that it's really really, potent. It tastes weird. Now if you think about it, nearly all drugs taste weird . Amazing. It doesn't even finish his point. No, that clip has had six million views. Wow. Like and I'm asking you , did you enjoy that? Because I really did. I loved it. And I'm definitely compelled by him. He's telling a story at all times, right? There's always a piece of information that he's withholding from you that you have to watch to the end of the clip. And I think a good presenter or a good storyteller or an aura . I think that's I mean he reminds me like he reminds me of Uncle Percy in that sense in that case Well, yeah, I mean, I mean in a different maybe he is our cultural uncle Percy . Rory Sutherland is the uncle Percy to the privately educated community . But yeah , exactly. Right. Exactly that. They have to put him in gloves because he's got tattoos on his hands. Like if you listen to what he's actually saying there , it's It's nonsense. Yeah. It's complete nonsense. It doesn't even finish there's like a kernel of a trick. There is one competitor to Coca Cola. And it's red bull. Now let's take that as a let's take that. It's disgusting. All three of those things aren't true. And they actually went to a carbonated drinks questiona too. And this is true, by the way. And they tried it, and usually it says not to my toast. They said that as the most disgusting pitch I've ever tasted. There's a kernel of truth in the end . If he said to me in ten seconds, like, I reckon the reason people like Red Bull is because they're just so desperate to be caffeinated that the small can works in its favor because of this unconscious thing and the taste works in its favor because you're imagining it as medicine and the taste all of that kind of thing. It's like okay yeah fair enough but like that bit's not backed up by anything . There's like this there's this kind of apocryphal study of like they did this study and everyone said it tasted like piss and at one point he says that's literally what they said well they talk about who ? But it's just this pithy story boiled down that he's a cadence guy as well, right? He talks like a horse racing commentator. And that's part of the reason you're drawn to listening to him as well is that kind of I know they did this thing, of course, right. But then obviously after that, what happened after that was this? You have to listen to me. But now I'm about to tell you something that you haven't heard before. And that's this and it's this constant, it's almost like set up punchline stand up really When I was when I was watching him, I was like, This is Stand Up. Yeah, yeah. It's not funny. And I was like, actually, it says it says something about Standup. The thing with stand up is ideally you do it in rooms with quite large amounts of people . And I think in a large group of people , you feel comfortable letting the person know that they're not funny. Right. Because you've got other people around you who are kind of like you can sense or they agree that's not funny. Whereas with this guy, because it's quite intense and he's often sat one to one with a podcast . You have to nod a lot. You just have to nod. It reminds me like you go like a country pub. Right. And there'd be a guy dressed like that. Yeah. Who won't stop me that ? Yeah, who won't stop smoking? Toad of Toad Hall in a three piece suit that he hasn't taken off in nine days. By the way, William Winbag d did you get the servoin steak? And you go, What? See what my miss is, you go, But did you get a sirloin steak? You know it's not as flavorsome as rum, don't you? You know why that is? Well, it costs four pounds more, don't you? But the reason they serve you sirloin is it's an easier markup for restaurants. You knew that about the restaurant industry, didn't you? You're saying that 's actually not the most flavorful cut. Why is that not the most flavorful cut? Well, they don't get it from cows that have been grass fed. Right. Now watch the way you're talking. You know who you're close to? Peterson? Exactly. Yeah. You this but is the thing. And it's not a million miles from Joseph Falenta. Right, right, right. You could put you could get a script of what he's just said about Red Bull and you could put it in Peter's blog now the thing with Coca Cola . There's no competitors ob,viously . The closest they come, Red Bull, but it doesn't taste nice. But here's the thing. And here's the goddamn thing about Red Bull. It is both a drug and a placebo at the same time . And you're like, this is fucking nonsense. What's he all about? Like similar with Joseph Valente, you can imagine him bumbling through something like you know the interesting thing with Coca Cola is the only competitor in the Red Bull And like we would sit here . And of course, the king of them all . This is the thing with red bull and coca color books. They say it has wide competitive, but it's not very nice. It's not very nice at all. That would get tipped up. Everyone would go, What the fuck is he talking about? Trump's gone mad again. They say piss. Peterson, we're sat here taking a piss doing impressive everyone's going, this is the thickest man on Earth. Old Itonian. When Cuddly grandad money does it , when Cuddly Uncle Isa does it, when Uncle Isa says all this stuff, we go uncle Isa . Let's let's get him on. Let's get it on Chris Williamson for the tenth time. He does say things that are the opposite to what I think. Yeah. But this is the thing with him. And it's like he is. And I've like, I've watched more of him . And I've really like my thing with him, I'm like, why do I want to listen to you? Yeah Yeah., because I don't think I care about anything you're saying. Oh no, I don't know. And the more I kind of we can watch the next clip now, right? And this one , I mean it's got loads of this of like I think this is the one it might not be this one. There's one where he's just moaning about service staff trying to close cafes early and he's like put them covered getting twenty minutes before you're about to leave and you can tell that they're mopping up and you feel bloody r,ude, you don't want to go anymore. It's just a problem. It's like it's because they're only like seven pounds an hour. He's wanna fuck you over. But like, we watched this one and it's a similar vibe. We're going to have to do a drip check on this in a minute as well. But yeah, here's his uncle uncle, Percy Winbag talking about Starbucks unclear an hour before a Starbucks close at a major UK railway station. I had luggage because we'd just come back on the Eurostar. I obviously thinks that they take huge suitcases in Starbucks. So I sat down at a table outside the Starbucks where my luggage wouldn't get in the way of anybody else and sent my wife and daughter to get coffee. And while I was sitting there twenty five minutes before the restaurant closed, someone made me move because they were clearing the tables away. I absolutely lost it. That is an abominable thing to do. Now I don't know and I'd like to know is this because coffee shops pace inadequate overtime and therefore everybody feels that effectively they're on the clock for the last half hour yes and they've got much cleaning done in the last half hour of the day as they can. That's it. What I'm saying is that someone looking at the sales data from a coffee shop might get completely the wrong impression because they think it's the time of day that's diminishing demand for coffee drinking coffee behaviour of the restaurant itself as it nears closing time. See that is an example of the kind of like there's so much of a premium on what he says on like being contrarian. So they might be looking at the data and they might be thinking that the people sell less coffee at five PM because people want to have coffee in the morning. It's not because of that. It's because the staff want to close up too quickly when I'm sat there with my wife. No, it's actually not that it's like it's actually not that. But this is the thing though. Like and the kind of ethos behind what you're saying is like I don't really care if you're about to finish a bloody shift, don't make me move my back. Yeah . And the amount of people who I know who are like, you know vaguely left wing who are, yeah, workers right and yet they love this guy. Yeah, right. And it's like, what is it? And I think I think that's so interesting that and I think this says a lot about the country that like if that was, if that's Joseph Valente san we going you nasty fucking capitalist shmugs. Yeah fucking bastard. We cloaked in this like psychological insights data driven vibe that Rory Sutherland presents it. But I don't think it's even the fact that it's data driven . I think it's that it's cuddly old Uncle Letonia and it's like he's got his Rupert Bear Cardigan on. Do you know what I mean? I do think I mean like the typical trope is we all have a kind of racist, nasty uncle or grandma . I did have one of those. Right, right. My nan's husband , my nasty old nan, her third husband , who sadly passed away three or four years ago, guy called Bernard , who ostensibly was my granddad grand Bruges. My biological granddad died when I was like literally a couple of weeks after ward and my nan's husband Bernard was in my life from like the age of three. They got married when I was three. I went I was the page boy that went a little secret . And this guy he was so similar to Royal Sutherland. Right. My nan got with him because he was the landlord of her local pub. What sentence that is, by the way? And she used to and when he was alive, they would joke about this, which was difficult at dinner, but they would joke about how they would sneak upstairs while he was on shift to drive it off the shag. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Class by them. But he was this guy. He was the loudest man in the pub . and He it's like you go around his for dinner and it's like you would have to accept that he's gonna fucking talk and you're going to fucking listen and was he always did he always have the nicest views No , but he was just so good at talking. Compelling. Like it's kind of like Boris Johnson syndrome like he's a fucking good talker and Farage is a bit like that as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I don't want to say like Monas , he wasn't like, he wasn't that bad, like ly, he wasn't like out he never said a slows, never outright the closest he came and it was quite funny because there were times I remember being like a teenager . I had very long hair. Right as a teenager. And And I do have now, but I very much did then had a very quiet of like a feminine face. Right . I just look like a girl. And my Bernard, my nancaster be like, Jake, you gotta cut your head. You can't walk around like that. He looks like a woman for goodness, shake, Eileen, that's my name. He has to cut his hair . And so I remember like , I always loved him, but I remember at the age of fourteen, and that's when you first started get a bit like left wiggle over. Yeah, yeah. I remember being like, well, I don't know like Burnett and he 's not my granddad right because he was at me to cut my fucking air. And then the best thing happened, he had like a like from a previous marriage, like a biological granddaughter, right? Who was a few years above me at school and she came out as gay . Right . And he hated like that he couldn't he didn't like that. He wasn't happy. Right. He was not fucking happy. And I remember at Christmas ones winding him up sat there because we'd always go around his house on Books and Day. Right, my nan's house and his house and have dinner on Bookson Day. Me and my dad still laughed at we're winding him up here like I think his granddaughter was called Sarah or something like that. So you seen Sarah's new block , you ever met a girlfriend and have you burned he was round him up by the robbery My mom was like, Don't say anything else Bernard. You're gonna say something, you're gonna regret just don't say anything. They were like, No, no, no, I'm fed up with it. It's just bloody buggery I've sat there full seed experts on let's beans the at time Well, it's not that . You like one of things, but it's not that. Yeah, you I think you tried to be nasty, you're just not even factually correct when they close. Yeah, no it's not I think they can. But yeah, I'll be yeah guessing go strap on if you want he's an example of like that Royal Southern guy he's a Tory . He must be yeah a Tory No he is we can watch the next clip. He's a fucking tory like watch the next clip he's talking about going to a befer . And he literally says I mean we'll get like he talks about how right wing he is. Initially you go raving and I be fori No, I went and there was a gnoying background noise. I remember that you simply opened I was trying to sit on the head. Whereby did you stay? I was staying in the Abysa Grande hotel for a marketing conference and then we went into town which was very, very interesting. Anthropologically it was kind of interesting because to me it's very very weird. To be honest, I'm I'm slightly claustrophobic and also I'm too right wing to take either this idea of just loving everybody indiscriminately strikes me as just you know it's a step too far. I want a drug where you sit in the corner making snarky comments about the next day. Rather, you're suffused with indiscriminate love for your fellow snow in the smoking area. Human nature . But like is it like and I'm not saying being right wing is anything to be ashamed of just it's so interesting the kind of people that we know who really love this guy are people who if anyone else was like on right wing they're like with people it's like old cuddly old grand adory. Yeah, he's all right. And I think yeah, he's the acceptable face of kind of that ism, pull yourself up by your bootstraps, thatcherism. Also, there's this kind of thing where it's like I don't think there's anything wrong with him . Like politically, I don't think he said anything particularly objectionable, but I guess it's like this kind of the primacy of the company or the corporation above anything, right? Like all of these problems he doesn',t touch on like he's supposedly a guy that's about like big ideas and like big way like behavioral change and behavioral economics. How can you nudge people into doing what you want? He doesn't apply that to like a social context in any other way than like how could you get someone to buy more of a fizzy drink? Do you know what I mean? Like I know it's the it's the extent of what he's saying. Right. But I think when you boil down a lot of what he says about advertising and marketing . H basisic point is it's less about the product and more about how you present the product. Which he is in a nutshell himself. Exactly . He is marketing . He is the exact kind of product people don't like , but because it 's presented as cuddly old uncle Rory. Yes. And I'm not saying we shouldn't, by the way, I'm not saying there's anything fucking wrong with you. Yeah. Like I don't think you should have to hate him just because he's a capitalist. I can also forgive him. I can also forgive him for saying stuff that's like bollocks or less insightful because like you said, he literally is a podcaster now. That is bollocks and it's really good at it. Yeah, it's really good. And it's like if you're on nine hours of podcasts a week and every one of them wants you to do like a pithy anecdote on how to like make a cafe that sells only bacon butties and why that would be good or whatever. Yeah, you're going to end up saying like I wonder why coffee shops sell less coffee at five o'clock in the afternoon. He's porky parry but he takes himself seriously. Yeah, that's true. That is literally it. But he's really good at it. I listened to the Jamie Lang one and he does this long bit s like of all the things to like nail your colors to the wall about He dies on a lot of odd hills. Yeah, yeah. So one of those hills is he goes, No, I believe Jamie, most of the things we do are based on how we feel about ourselves whilst we're doing them. And it's like, that means nothing. Jamie Lang sat there like, yes, yeah, yeah, of course. It's like watching fucking Peter Pan and Hook. Yeah. Yeah. And he goes, Oh, I give'll you an example . I like wearing shorts . And Lang's like, yeah. And he goes, Yeah, I go on holiday. I always wear shorts. And James like, ah . And he goes, you know, in the U K, it's rarely so cold that you have to wear trousers . Lang's like, apart from seven months of the year. Yeah, yeah. Lang's like, you're right. Yeah, I mean my home is like ninety degrees , right, you wear trousers, don't you? Because shorts look a bit silly. Yeah. And James Lang's like, yeah. And he goes, I believe if we could do whatever we wanted, we would just wear shorts all the bloody time. But we can't, because we're ashamed of ourselves. And that's what it comes down to. That's the human condition. It's like, that's the human condition. He does have an air of the hypnotist about him, or he has an air of the he has an air of the policeman that's trying to force a confession out of you You'd wear shorts all the time, wouldn't you? I'm not sure that I would, actually. You would. You said you would. He goes on, he goes, deep down, I think we'd all bloody naturists if we could, and Leng's like, well, I don't know about that. Do you want to get your cock out, don't you? I'm not sure I think that's what he said. He goes, He goes, Picture this, Jam.ie If you were in a villa alone, swimming pooled outside, you wouldn't bother with trunks, would you? Trying to confess it's like, I guess, I wouldn't know he's like, You got your lovely wife with you. You got a nice wife haven't you, Jamie? You wouldn't want her to wear a bathing costume, of course she's beautiful and he's like, well no, I guess I'd like to sleep naked. If I came around to your house, Jamie and I had the body of a seventeen year old Vietnamese prostitute in the back, a lovely boy called Fountrank, you'd help me bury him, wouldn't you? You would do that for me, Jamie. You convincing. He's suddenly yeah, I agree. They're going yeah, yeah, I mean , there was one point. I think it was directly after that. And he goes, I mean, people often ask me what I think of trans people using women's toilets. I'm like, come on . This is podcasting. Yeah, here we go like, here we fucking go. And what he says, he goes I mean my theory on that is I think you know gender toilets are ridiculous because I think deep down as men if, we add our way, we'd just piss anywhere. I was like, I think that might be the smartest thing anyone sees. I've had to pay . Yeah, I was thinking about it. I was like, why to myself? I was like, What are my thoughts on trans people using Trans I'm like, I think don't care. Do whatever makes you feel comfortable. There's so few trans people just do whatever the fuck you are. But then I was like, well, if someone said to me, Oh yeah, but if you heard about someone got attacked by blah , you know, and I thought about it , oh God, well maybe share. But then I was like, that is the best way of answering that question. It's like, if someone says to you thoughts about trans people, you can talk , I'd like to piss on the floor . I'd like to piss anywhere. You've won. Yeah. did like have you watched Madmen, no. So Madmen is the central figure in Mad Men is obviously Don Draper, played by John Ham. And the story of that is him coming up in rooms full of these squares, basically these like Roary Tung. Exactly. Yeah. Well, no, no, so he Rory is the kind of out there thinker, the avante thinker gun draper. Exactly. In the room in the room of kind of square businessmen, just desperate to be told and insight a kind of it's like him and Malcolm Gladwell does this as well , just like actually it's the opposite of what you thought kind of thing. And the story of Don Draper is that he gradually gets less and less interested, more and more disillusioned, more and more ready for his own death effectively . He can't really be that guy anymore. And then at the end is this series of pitches where you're used to seeing him come in early in those things and like smash it out of the park and then he's coming in and he's like got food down his front and he's drunk and whatever . And it's like I'm surprised that I think if he keeps podcast ing, there will have to be a moment like that. Do you know what I mean? Where he gradually this guy this like, oh this guy's a brilliant thinker. I mean, maybe he's been doing it for like twenty five years and no one's really called him on it yet. But if he keeps coming in and being like, actually , coffee shop should open at night . It's like someone you have to be like, Is Worry Right? I don't think you would. I think it's that he is perfectly presented and this is the irony is he's so perfect ly marketed as a marketer. That's the irony that he's so well marketed as a marketer. Yeah that like I don't think like I saw a clip where he was like a lot of people think the best thing to do if you can't sell a product is to put the price down, they make things cheaper. Why not put the price up? It's like, well, I guess the other part about this is that I think the corporatization of our own lives or the corporatization of sel thef where you think of yourself as a business , right? Like it's kind of attractive in those terms as well to think about these case studies that he gives or these kind of like you say, these completely counterintuitive things. You want to sell more of something? Put the price up, right? But those things work for kind of like very specific products or luxury brands or whatever. We all want to think of ourselves as Rolex, I guess, right? I think our lives are more like pound land really, where if you buy it in enough volume and just follow the basic rules. You don't need to listen to Rory Sutherland talk about marketing. Just price it low enough and just churn it out and people will buy it. Like that's the simplicity of our lives. We're not all these kind of like counter intuitive moral lessons about like you say putting the price up when you want to sell more or whatever. I think that's the thing that's attractive . I know what you mean, but I also just think in a time where everyone is trying to do that like , you know, there's that kind of tate thing of like I've got to be the leanest, most effective productive machine I can be in Ashton Hall wake up at three A . I think it's nice when Uncle Is just saying something a bit bananas when Unc's is just waffling. You know what I mean? It's like one hundred percent agree with that. None of this is like this is not dangerous. It's not ruthless. No, no. He's not asking you to be ruthless with yourself. No, he's an old man that stinks of vape smoking cigarettes that wants to tell you funny stories about adverse. Yeah. That's why yeah. As long as he doesn't start saying like, do you think you'd come into the toilets and knash me off? Like there's no like and I do hope he never, I hope I don't know there's no suggestion of that I've heard, right? No, no, no, no it is just Unc do be Waffling. Unc is just Waffley. Yeah, and the thing is like he is not a self appointed. That's what I quite like. Yes, is this all by accident . He's just been pottery around chatting fucking rubbish. Uncons has been waffling for ages and we made him king. Yeah well apparently it was a young guy called Hugo who made TikTok account. But the point is he's been paid off by somebody . He was in that world. He had done that job. He had been successful at doing that. I think I would question sometimes people use like, oh this person has been successful in advertising or PR as though that proves that they're not a stake oil salesman, do you know what I mean? It's like is not often evidence of a truthful success, but there you go. But it's when they say it about themselves . Which he hasn't done so much. I mean, he says like I've been doing this for a while, but he like in the same way that a lot of Gary's economics is like, okay, I was obviously like the best trader in London Bravo. You know, in terms of like stock market, here's another swaffling. But he appointed himself that. Right. He went , I was the best trader in the city . Now I'm going to tell you why finances fuck the market if you go Yeah no whereas he was just in a pub somewhere ch,ewing some por couple's ear or they're having their one state . I tell you what I did when I was working at Volvo because they were a funny punch and to fucking kill myself. I came out for stake a bottle of red wine. I just want to have sex with my wife later and this fucking cup won't leave me alive and basically someone started filming him put it on TikTok and now Unc's is famous now Chris Williams is flying into America and I've just been saying this stuff in the garden of my local pub for the last twenty years and now people want me to say I'm all gardening. I've been pheasant saying this for free. I was bawling the fuck it is off those poor Starbucks workers who were just trying to get home. They cleaned up an hour ago, but I'm telling them about how I got the Volvo contracting noise again now . And it's like I think ultimately and I don't want to go too like genius observation on this guy but I think it's that it,'s like he says something about ourselves rather than what he says about anything else. It's like if you want to listen to him talk about fucking red bull you can . If you want to if you wanted him to tell you why it's better to drink coffee at six thirty in the evening, it's so he can keep fucking talking . That's why he drinks coffee. Imagine this guy on gear. I mean, I don't want to cast aspersions on the advertising industry in the nineties, but from what I hear it wasn't a clean living matchelate trance rave sober, trans rave kind of place. It was a Go to Lunch at eleven AM, get home at two AM nd rhino kind of place. He must have had some conversations over some he's he has bored the tits off some fucking strippers in his life he has he has told some sex workers some things they do not need to know about contracts. Do you know what the shoe the shoe company Hush puppies did then? You would have thought they would put the price down. No, they didn't. They put the price up. And what's really interesting about that, here's the thing interesting thing about that is that actually it made it made it more desirable, would you believe, Sweet Lader. And when they were more desirable, then they'd kind of wear ed different by a class of people . I'll still be waffling. Hello, I'm Jori Alansky from Origin Story. And I'm Ian Dunn. We're the host of a podcast that tries to tell the truth about the political terms that we use today. None of the tribal bullshit, none of the irrationality, none of the hysteria, just accuracy and laughs as we try to understand the world around us. We dig into history to tell stories that explain why we are where we are today. And we're very excited that we get to do this on stage as well. And soon we will be doing it at our biggest ever live show. Yeah, on september first in the Union Chapel, London, come join us there for a night of laughs, maybe a few tears , and just a general feeling of moral vindication. There's a link to my tickets in the show note, and the good news is if you're a patron, you get a fairly substantial discount. So if you've been thinking of signing up, now's a good time. We'll see you there Hunks is waffling. I don't know if we've done onks we've done it. We've done plenty. Talking of hunks that be waffling. Yeah, I genuinely and I think ultimately it's what do you want your millionaires to look like? Like will hide in plain sizes exactly. He will have his detractors . I think this is this is what I don't find him harmful, toxic, nasty. Yeah . I don't think there's anything deceitful about him. No, I find it boring, I guess. I thought I did. And I fucking got through the episode with him and Jamie L and like that. I honestly I was loving it and I can't tell you what the fuck. I have to I got really excited when he started talking about trans people and toilets and I thought it was going to get a lot spot I just don't just I mean, I guess this is why I'm not an entrepreneur into this kind of thing'.s just It I don't think stories about like how a Japanese car brand turned around their fortunes twenty years ago by doing something counterintuitive. Like I just don't give a fuck. You don't think it says something interesting about the human condition? You don't think it's less about cars and more about people I do think that like because that's the hook. I do the hook. I do think it's fun. This isn't marketing. It's psychology. Yeah, the other part is actually I think that's marketing. The other part is like we can all remember Wikipedia, do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah. Like this is the thing that does as much as this guy. Yeah, Unc's has been on Wikipedia. And it's like sometimes there's not much insight. There's just interesting anecdotes like him and Gladwell and on the rest of his entertainment just reading out anecdotes from Wikipedia. That's what happened with James Bond and blah blah blah. It's like anyone could do that and I don't really care about the topic of like products or business enough. I think that sometimes he's insightful. I think he's a very, very funny and interesting talker . I will just listen to him on the basis of that alone. And I don't think he takes himself too seriously. So like you say, I don't know there's inherent harm there, but like I say, I'm not bothered about whether people drink phantom or not. That says about you though. Right. Because you do listen to the rest of history sometimes. Well, sometimes rather every week. Right. Yeah. Now and this is the thing, yeah . I'm a capitalist . Wow. I like money. How many minutes in that? Yeah. No, but I'm a capitalist. I like money. Yeah. I don't mind it either . No, no, no, well, I really like. Okay fair enough. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm do I care what actually happened between the Romans and the Ottomans a few hundred years ago? I mean, it was the same time period, but okay we'll check next week when we see what the Ottomans done to my hairlines I wish I had a Robin hairline. But you see what I'm saying? I don't give a fuck . I'm this guy. I like this. You like stuff. And yeah, yeah, I like things. Marketing. I like belongings. I love a products, man. Yeah. I've got load zone. Gotta be loads of I want to buy some more But never seriously, and I think actually, I guess all I generate, sorry God. Well, the only thing I was going to say specific and I think what you could say about our generation of like , we're all listening to anunk n.own It just depends on what your unk is talking about. Choose your flavour Mine is old uncle money . You like old uncle history. Yeah Some people, what are the other ones? Uncle Oldeny? Yeah, well, old uncle politics. Old Uncle Alice Campbell. Old Uncle War criminal. Yeah, yeah, yeah. One of the worst things that man ever did is that fucking irrqual, Alice Campbell. Yeah, and then he did his daughter as well. The other he made us . But that's got a go in it. What? That no , I'm fine with it. I thought you wouldn't be. Yeah, anymore. He's committed one hideous crime that will stain the shores of this nation's landscape. That was the podcast. And then he did the Iraq war after that. But no , and I actually think I was thinking about this. I think there's an alternative universe where it didn't really work out for me in comedy. I couldn't make a living out of it. I think I would have gone into advertising. Drecken? A hundred storytelling creativity No, I don't want to say but waffling. Yapping. Yeah, youngster. chatting shit . I think if you can't make money in this industry as a chat shit merchant , advertising is the way to go. Yeah, they talk about chat ship merchants,. Yeah there's a lot of loads of booze and you just chat shit. And you tell other people what shit. Yeah, and every so after you get Marcus Rasher to put your shoes on and then you'll go home. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. Could you see me in advertising? Yes, I could. Yeah. I could see you in that kind of world. I can see you wearing more baseball caps, flat peak baseball caps. I could see you wearing unbelievably expensive night trainers, yeah, camouflage, cargo trousers. Oh yeah bathing ape t shirt. Oh yeah yeah and I could see you again going in to pitch why you should have J Hus advertising SIF bleach to a load of squares in suits. I think you should . Yeah, exactly. Oh man, I talk to you about activating and creative activation and that kind of thing. And then I'd like the idea of the arc being that you do that you and let's be honest, it's a bit of a fucking it's a bit of a nasty industry. You're being financially exploitative of the public , right for your own personal gain. Then you do that for thirty years trying to manipulate them, yeah. Yeah, you did have a thirty years, buy a house of the evil money . And then and then you retire into becoming this kind of philosopher who says it's not actually about money, it's about how people think. Yeah, actually. And when he was advertising British American tobacco for probably fifteen years during the late eighties and early nineties, that was really about how people felt when they were cancer. It's about cigarettes as such. It's about how we view ourselves. And here's what we did. You'd think the Cambodian children wouldn't want to buy the cigarettes. It turns out they do . Now I've got a lot of like am I tuning into the extraordinary Southern podcast? Maybe not. Am I what's a clip on of him? Yeah, one hundred percent. I am. And it's because Unc's be fucking yapping, man . And just like how the Caine Brown fans want to want to, by the way, Cane Brown is one of the funniest things about that guy. He does live shows. I think I've shown you this that they bring Uncle Percy. Yeah, on behind a screen. Which is beyond the wall. Yeah. What they do is they build a set on stage and they put Uncle Percy beyond the wall. They don't put his arms through the wall. They just put two holes in the wall. They could put his arms through his glove . At the live show, we're going to do that, but Uncle Moneybags is going to be behind there. Roy . We've got Roy Sutherland did. We've got Royal Sutherland a little bit. Lost lost Mary land. He used to sick . I like him. He reminds me of my nasty old grandadaddy thought that lesbianism was considered appropriate. Buggery. Sodomy. If you see any unks out there, it could be Dominic Sambrook, the history unk, it could be old Percy Wynbag, the money unk , it could be Percy , the R seating unknown. The Restaurant Arn's eating , do stick with them. Give them a bit of your time because you never know. They might teach you a lesson about why hot dogs are better than burgers. They chat so much shit they are the monkeys with the typewriters and every now and then do they say something particularly intelligent? Not really, but it's just about clippable and I hope we've been screening our podcast . See you next week. Up the writers Because I'm telling you