Writing Process and Future Projects

I'm Greg Richard. It is hot outside and now it's time to cool down. At PC Richard and Sun, we have the largest selection of air conditioners all at the guaranteed lowest prices. Come see our knowledgeable salespeople to help get you the right air conditioner today. Have you been to Burlington? Our stores are looking hot for the summer. They had a glow up, so you need to show up to save on the latest trends. From dresses and sandals to swim and beauty, Brlington has something to make every moment of the summer one to remember Let's Ch choose just one style. With our prices, just get it all Your summer Delight starts here. Burlington. Dals? Brands? Wow I scream, you scream. We all scream quuality, science fiction and fantasy content. for an extra scoop of sword in lazery goodness Go to patreon. com slash sword and Lacer Hey everyone, welcome to the Sword and Laser. I'm Veronic Vmont and I'm Tom Mr Cord Laser is a book club, but it's so much more. We bring you news from the world of science fiction and fantasy. Ah! and awesome discussions from fans like you and author interviews. Y! I should have done the old intro. I forgot to do the old intro I could have done the old intro today because later in the show, we are going to talk to Wesley Chu, author of The Les of To Yeah Yeah, this is this is going to be great. So we'll have some questions from the audience, questions from Tom and I and probably just talk about some some random stuff like like my beef Are you going to bring up your beef? You're gonna bring up your bef,n't Yeah Yeah It's been a long time coming. I've been cooking been this beef been cooking. It's some good old fashioned Chicago style beef It's 'use he used to live in Chicago, so I get it. Yeah. So Chicago beef, that's a sandwich. Yes like from the bear Yeah, right from the bear, the original leaf. Yeah A watching it' Yeah. Oh yeah. sure. Yeah Good stuff.. Where do you get the right there? Is it on Disney pllus or is it on like Crave or something Canadian What is it on it's on HBO isn't it Be Yeah, what is it on? thought it was Fuloo Hulu, yeah, no weeVPN We VPN as though we're in the United States. That' how we watch our TV. Gotcha. Okay when it worked. We watched it on Disney pllus because everything on Hulu is in Disney pllus now. so I think of it as Disney plus but it's a Chat Chat is just like a wall of Disney plus, Disney plus. right? But I didn't know. I like You have Disney pllus in Canada, I assume I don't know. I don't know I don't know how that works Disney Yeah. Yeah Sometimes my Netflix decides not to work, sometimes channels stuff that's on Disney pllus in the US. is not always on Disney plus in Canada, sometometimes it is. right here. I have a a whole thing with my you know. it's confusing. It's a weird world up here sometimes Um But let's jump into what are we nawing, Tom? What's on what's on your plate today? Had a little spinach ravioli Mellicious. B part about it, there was spinach in the ravioli with the cheese And then there was spinach and che'ese over the ravioli on the outside So it was like an exploded Rvioli It was like ravioli deconstructed over ravonstructed. That's the word I was ask for. Yeah. Alex exploded. I think that's what chefs should start saying. We're serving it's an explod. cheeseburger Tom andom says inside out Ravioli. I would I would say inside Audioli A you would say that insside Audioli. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's the kind of belly button some people have Um, I am I am I'm doing a what are we drinking tonight? very I'm drinking these straight and narrows Have you a can? What is that? It's in a can. It's an alcoholic vodka cocktail Oh, okay. So what's the cocktail? Is it just sparkling water or It's like this one's a black currant hysuckle. I don't like it No I've had two. It sound sounded like it would be good. That's disappointing. It tastes disgusting. You hate it. you've had too No, you don't have drinking problem. you're fine Oh my God Well, I had one. I had one a while ago. I had one like when I got home Like that was like three hours ago and then I had another one for the show. Yeah, I think you're okay. You're not hid. You're not hiding between current flavor you hate around the house or anything. so I think you're I did kind of hide it in my sweatshirt pocket because I didn't want Ryan to see it and judge me for drinking the second one. No. So I did actually hide it Was that because it was an alcoholic drink or because he knows you don't like it No, because it was alcohol Oh I' see that. Just a little just a little He didn't even come downstairs. I was like Oh I don't want him to give me a give me a like June June Need another one? Like, yeah, I have to record the podcast. I'm talking to Wesley too with about our. Everything's fine. I need a drink. I need to be angry. Yeah You don't call it mommy juice or anything dud. Oh no, now the chat room has concerns about me h thing is one of the signs. That's not a good thing. Well, it's not Okay, all right, fair. That's fair. Yeah, That's fair. I can also I can Iide doesn't mean you have a problem either. So don't, you know, Don't freak out. I can admit when I'm doing weird things. Yeah. It's good to behavior them out my behavior is sus was Iiously more concerned knowning you're in Ryan's dynamic, I'm more concerned that you're drinking the one you don't like. Like why are you drinking it? BeCause there was only one more. and I was like, well, I have to getid. I just tryed it. You're a completing this. I might as well finish it now andt have they don't have to be in the house anymore. It's like you're finishing a quest. Yeah I just need to kill three more hog hogs. It's exactly, that's exactly it. Yeah. I'm just I get it. I'm cleaning up. I'm cleaning up It's got to get it off my l. Yeah Now it's done. Now there's no more and I never have to think about them again Totally Burns. let's jump into them Jan wrote Blinks Well, damn, I finished the inevitable ruin. seemeems I am out of the dungeon So On the other hand, this means I can start posting quick burns again. So, it seems a romantasy overlady is continuing to conquer the world, or as the Hollywood Reporter puts it, a court of Thorns and Roses author Sarah J Mass has signed a worldwide deal with IMG licensing for apparel Beauty, lifestyle, home decor, home decor, wine and spirits, food and beverage, toys and games, collectibles, cosplay, and immersive fan experiences for her entire fictional universe. This notably excludes film and TV rights It's a lot of things. Did you do you ever watch hacks So you know how the main character in Hcks Deborah has the apparel business at the QBC. That's what that made me think of when I saw this That's good. That's good. Does she have a a line of cauldrons I would be interested in If that were the case. I bet she will. I bet she will. cauldrons. So here's a thing. So I just want to note this in case people don't know. But apparently and I need to dig into this more, there is some problematicness with Sarah J. Mass. And I am not informed enough yet to say exactly what it's about. I'm going to do some research I have heard there's a little bit of problematicness that I need to learn more So I'm probably going to chill with the with the Sarah J Massitude for a little bit and like You know, I enjoyed the works, but I also want to be cognizant of the fact that people are uncomfy with some things that apparently show that are done. So I'm just putting that out into the world You don't want to appear as if you are comfortable with the things that those people are uncomfortable with And no Licorice said, please don't tell me that she aligns with JK. No. I do not believe that is the case. Jng cook Oh different for Jake differentiffere JK and not not Simmons either. Just to be clear No, I don't think it's she's she's not a turf as far as I know. So there's Okay Yeah. All right. Something else though, I'm not sure what Anyho, let's move on to more Ywnisms as well as the lives of Jason Reeds, who said the twenty twenty five Loccus Award winners have been announced. Winner for science fiction novel is The Man Wh Saw Seconds by Alexander Baldazar. for fantasy novel, A Sorceress Comes to Call by T. Kingfisher And for a debut novel, Someone you can Build a Nest in by John W well Continuing with the loocust theme and the Yon theme, Yon writes that Locust Mag reports. The British Fantasy Society has announced the shortlist for the twenty twenty five British Fantasy Awards nominations for Best Fantasy novel include Long Live Evil by Sarah Reese Brennan, Fathom Folk by Eliza Chan, A Shadow Over Haven by David Green, The Green Man's War, Julia E. McKenna, and Masquerade by O O Sango Yomi Nice, very cool Man, I just I got to I really want to read a source was Comes to callall by T King Fisher, just going back to that earlier earlier post I just really have enjoyed Taking Fisher's work, so Maybe that'll be a future Have we evert kingfisher? I ask, because every time I think we have, I find out we haven't And I did we could swear we did Yes, we did. We read Net and Bone. Netal and bone. It's been a minute.s good one. Okay so this all have to be a Veronica. Side, side quest. Gcha pererhaps All right, Ywn, Yon Yan is yawning tonight. Jan says there is a tra trailer for Momo, the newew English language movie adaptation of the hugely successful children's fantasy novel by German author Michael End or Ende E ND E of the Nevernding story about a little girl living in an amplphitheater fighting with the help of a turtle and the power of friendship against the Gay man who oh sorry, grey men plural who literally steal time from all adults around her, it seems in this adaptation by distributing some sleek technological gadget that all the adults are linked to, which is definitely not a very heavy handed metaphor Joon says. release date in Germany is October this year. It seems there is no announcement regarding any international release dates Uh the trailer look great. Did you get a chance to look at it yet I did not. Yeah. It looks really interesting. So I'm hoping we get an international release date Ywn also points out And We're not even close to done with Jon. No. It's really good to have you back, Jan There are two romantasy novels coming this July at the same date that are both reworks of successful Dramone fan fix. Fan fic with the ever popular Harry Potter ship of Hermione Granger and Draco Malfoy that were snatched up by big publishing houses. If it took you a minute to figure that out, it's Dramione. I said Dramion because I didn't realize what we were talking about when I read it I need to make it's got to be a drama mean and joke in there somewhere. Draco and Hermione, Dramione, I get it. that's the ship name. This is really niche. Tw romantasy novels based on fanfix. So this is like fifty Not even the twwilight. Manacle is the big one So there's this already exists. Okay.. called it's called Manacle. and I don't remember the author's name, but that is also ionic And was this is just. This is a whole genre now. This is a whole sub genre. Wow. And I don't know what this sub genre is going to be called if there's already a name for it out there in the world But yeah, mananacold was a huge hit So july eighth sees the publication of the irresistible urge to fall for your enemy by Bridget Knightley and Rosen Chains by Julie Soto Yeah, it's a whole sub genenre. I had no idea I would be very happy to hear if people were profiting off of JK Rowling's empire somehow where she doesn't make a dime. So more, more power to you those put those fan fics out there in the world and make your bank All right, Yan also says from Locust Mag and The Guardian, Annie Bot by Sierra Greer has won the author Arthur C. Clark Award twenty twenty five for B science fiction novel first published in the United Kingdom in the past year. The Gardian describes Annie Bott as an intense novel about a robot abused by her boyfriend. O U and so that Is the Arthur C. Clark Award winner? Oh And finally This is the last post from Y Ywnism today. Not the last quick burn, but the last from Ywn Amazon MGM released the first trailer for proroject Hail Mary with Ryan Gosling As the star. This is the novel by Andy Weir. You still have to wait a little US release date is march twentieth of next year That's so good It looks so good. Did you watch Did you watch this? Yes. Yeah. I'm sorry, I got delayed because I noticed I didn't have the link in the in good in the uh the rundown. and I'm going to try to find that. But yes no, this looks great. and I like Ryan Gosling. And I had no doubt When I heard that he was cast that he would be fine because he's an amazing actor. I'm like, yeah, I'm sure I'll pull it off really fit That worked for me. I don't know about you. Yeah. No, I mean, he is an incredible comedic actor He's a great he's a great serious actor. He's a great comedic actor. It wouldn't have been my first thoughtought, right They work. Yeah Yeah. I think the tone is right. I feel like Licorice and no, I'm sorry, Chris Kay and some other folks I saw in the comments of that video the trailer noted that it gives away a number of the big beats Of the book I think that's okay Um It didn't bother me. I think A lot of people were mentioning Hmm. Okaykay. well now the problem is, do I talk about the thing that people felt the trailer was spoilering Is that a spoiler if I do that Well if it's trailer trarailer, it's not a spoiler It's in the trailer People may not want to hear it or see it in the trailer, but I'm tr that the the trailer. You know, ye, like sure, people put the trailer an entire trailer is a spoiler. So if you're thinking, well, that's a spoiler, then maybe the people who made the movie are like Trust us, that's not the spoiler. Yeah Okay Talking and showing Rocky, I don't think is a spoiler. Rocky's like sixty percent of the book. Yeah. likeike its it's a big reveal. It's a good reveal, but it's I can't I feel as though people if they didn't include Rocky in the trailer, people would be like, whereere's Rocky? Right? Where's Rck Rock said Rocky's basically the coast store So he's not's Rocky. Yeah They're not going to show Rock. they're not theyre there's no. Yeah. So that's my feeling. No no deed goes unpunished. goodood, bad or otherwise So I really That's these straight and narrows talking, which by the way, straight and narrow should be in the name of a non alcoholic beverage. You would think, right? That suppos to be a play. We're in a post ironic world now. Stop it. Anyh. Anyhow um I'm very excited about the film. Uh it feels, it feels very much Martian vibey also, which I guess makes sense, Andy weir, but it's I'm here for it. I'm here for it Hpless white guy in space, I'm here for it. You know, it's Here we go again. Here we go. I' gotta watch it. takeake my money Um But yeah, I'm excited for it Did I read the next one? You do But you haven't yet. Stryke says the home of Alfred Bester, winner of the firstirst Hugo Award for the demolished Man, is for sale I guess it's been in the family all these years since he passed in nineteen eighty seven. Side notote, Bester's wife Raleigh was an actress who was the first person to portray Lois Lane on the Superman radio show in nineteen forty This looks like a lot of maintenance ouse You know, this is funny because Augustin Burrroughs also put his rural farmhouse on sale this week in Connecticut And so I feel like it's that one is only like one point two million dollars or something. but two o point three five But it's a lot of land. forty two of land. You're paying for the land Be it's only a three bed three bath. Although it says three bed three bath, That house looks like it's got twelve rooms in it. Just from the wind alone. so it's interesting because it's twenty thousand nine hundred square feet, but that's not counting the barn and all the other outhouse like like the other houses. What's the h on the property? The three bed three bed. I that can't be that two story building, but that's not just a barn, is it No, the barn is the red one So how is it three bed three bath I don't know, man Why do I sound insulted by this? I don't really care. I'm just curious. Looks like they're gonna get a good price I'm not gonna to be buying it. Yeah Otsville, Pennsylvania. Look at that Looks like a good spot to go have a commune good like hardtist commune. Let's start a cult Good. finally, Seth Oh, no, sorry, I said finally, but there's one more from Mark. Seth said Romantasy is such a cultural force that Jimmy John's the sandwich chain has created a miniature romantasy audio book to give away as part of a summer promotion. It is read by Walton Goggins. Blade and the Bine, a two part romantasy audiobook read by Goggins, available If you are a Jimmy Johns freaky Fast rewards member who purchased any sandwich or wrap between june twenty third and july sixth as part of the sandwich chains Summer menu of ultimate temptation. or smut campaign. Oh my god We've officially jumped the shark I think this is the sharp junk jump when you're getting those free smells, you get a little something else I'm sorry, did you just say free smell? That's one of Jimmy Johns old slogans, yeah Freeze smell Yeah because of the bread baking U Part one of the Bade in the Brine is about five minutes and forty seconds long. Part two is six and a half minutes. So they is these are basically not even short stories. These are tiny stories Um, I'm uncomfortable the Smut menu I'm My body is confused because of Walt and Gogggins 'cause 'cause the walon Gargonss Would you like toally had Jimmy Joh the plot spoiler alert, it's set in the sandwich kingdom and follows a Jimmy John's delivery girl named Viola who learns she is destined to become Queen Mayo In part two, she must choose between Lord Mayo her protector or Lord Pickle who is dark and mysterious No. Oh no. I bet she chooses pickle I'm a mayo girl myself. Yeah, but yeah, your team Mo. But why not put Porkino lo. Wh Porkino Oh, okay. Well, that's in my brain now. Well we've got a answer for you. Read Marks and that'll take this all over. Mark says The Faith of Beasts, The next book by James S. A. Cy, continuing the Captivees War saga has cover art and a release date of april twenty twenty six. Yeah. Thank you for that totally normal quickburn. I appreciate it. About people we enjoy. J say Cy. Yeah All right, well. I need to shower now to shower my brain Let's jump in into Bury your sword, which is our feedback from the audience Seth says I got nervous when I spotted the title of this episode. I share the last name warar burden with Patrick. Unfortunately, no relation. I'm relieved to know I didn't do something terrible that sparked an episode. I know I don't get a say in this But I fully support company funds being used to watch Murder Bot. I've really liked the six episodes I've seen so far and would welcome Tom and Veronica talking it over A, All right. yeah, you know, I just remembered that today that we had had that conversation and I was like, oh, I did not follow up on that at all Life has been very busy, but I will commit figuring out if I can make that work I had to finish watching. I was watching something. Oh, I was watching Andor season two So I was fully in Andor world sobbing hysterically at the last episode. Oh yeah. then I had to watch Rue one again. Yeah. Yeah, we did the same thing. We went right in from the last episode of Andor into Rogue one to watch them get magically younger It was pretty good was bad. Yeah ye. I think Mon Motha was the hardest one because she looked older to me in Rogue one than she did in the series. But my cognitive dissonance is like really fighting me on that. Yeah like she just like she looks great in the series, but like Yeah, so it yeah was weird, but anyhow, All right Murder pot. I'm on it. I just finished Bedlam Bride So I've got, I think one more book for Dungeon Crawler Carl. I actually put myself on pause with The last book, what is it? The interermminable Infinite Why can' I suddenly remember it? I don't know. I haven't read it yet The inevitable ruin this inevit Inevitableuin. I paused and I'm like blazing through the deevils, partly because I like the deevils. good it's good story, but also part of me is like, need to get through the devils can get back touch of Carl Carl. I also, I finished Bedlam Bride. So are we caught up to each other now? So we both starting I'm part with inevitable inevitable ruin before before we pick the devils I'm a little bit ahead of you, but not too far no Okay. Yeah, I started the deevil's audioobook today and I'm already really enjoying it. It's. I think it's gonna to be a good one. And honestly, it feels like coming home in a lot of ways. feels like like it feels so Abercrombiesque already. Like with the humor. Anyway, we'll get, but I'm like, Oh, this feels like this feels good but I'm waiting for the gross stuff to start happening. whichich I can only assume You won't wait too long, trust me. Oh, okay. Ruth says, gotta say, I'm disappointed with Tom's half hearted rendition of Jisu's all Eyes on me. Come on, Tom, C yourself a K pop fan? I expect a full performance complete with the Korean lyrics and hummed version of the instrumental parts. I too support the use of company funds to watch Murderbot. It's great. Sorry, I kept the same tone from the previous paragraph Ruth because it didn't work with the words. I've been watching with my husband, but we're a bit behind, so I've been sneakily watching ahead without telling him I need to catch up with the new episode that just dropped yesterday. It's a gutter truth that is That is Okay, we haven't really talked about this before. the u It is like Sacrosanct to like W a show. If you're in a relationship You have to stay same point in the show together. unless you agree. Yeah unless you have a talk about it Eileen, I was out of town this weekend with Squid Game dropped and Eileen was like, I I'mone I want I'm gonna to go. I'm going to watch Squid Game. Is that cool? And I was like, yeah, yeah, no that's cool She kind of presumed the sale there and probably because she knew I wouldn't mind. U but but we we talked, we communicated about She didn't just go do it So Ruth, I'm not here, I'm not here to judge. I'm not here to Question I just, you know That's a That's a hard, that's a hard one It's a tuffy Are you prepared to I guess you you just really are is your how's your acting How's your act you feel? Do you feel like you can watch it again? Like can you be like a super surprised Yeah, Yeah. ye Yeah, because that's how you got to do it. That's the it's the only way Yeah. because there's some feel That are communication, come clean Do you think I should do you feel like we got really judgy on? I know. I'm sorry, Ruth. I will make it up for you by singing, makeake me feel alive with me Onandorceuima Chigum Ng, Chip Chunhei, Alu Omnamoru, Aluike As a me. I'm not gonna do the whole thing foreronica. I waseronic dan That was good. Thank you. I was dancing. Yeah. All right. As a reminder, Tom has been taking Korean. like Tom can speak Korean Yes Well, I won't say fully like do you feel comfortable with me saying you can speak Korean? No Do you feel like you need to be fully fluent? I would say Cho Moto, I don't speak it well Yeah, I'm starting to understand. I'm starting I can read all of that. so yeah. Very cool. veryery cool Tazzy Dave says he too supports the use of swordlaser funds to bypass the patriarchy and watch Rber Yeah. I don't remember why that was bypassing the patriarchy. Is that because No is it because of Ryan? Oh yeah Yeah, patriarchy That's the patriarchy. Steve. Isoney, I love you Stephven says my only complaint about Murderbot is the half hour rntime. I am formatted to enjoy an hour of drama shows and a half hour of comedy shows in Murderbot while humorous doesn't quite fit in the comedy section. So when it ends, I'm irritated for another half hour Oh no. It's like a phantom half hour. funny the first two episodes, but I think that's just because I'm I was very attuned to Murderbot's humor Like the vibe Yeah, Yeah and me too. I definitely laugh out loud att least three or four times an episode. It should be once ofertain minutes. There you go John Taloney says I found this quote from Kurt Vonneat relaying something an archaeologist said to him at a camp when he was fifteen. I don't think being good at things is the point of doing them I think you've all got these wonderful experiences with different skills And that all teaches you things and makes you an interesting person, no matter how well you do them. I don't remember what that conversation was about. Well, John Taloney was saying that we gave the full context of this and basically Kurt Vonneat was saying U I'm I do all these things, but I'm not good at any of them. so don't be impressed. And the archeologist was like, I don't think being good at stuff is the point doing Why are we talking about being good at things. That's what I don't remember. I mean, this is a very nice sentiment that I tracked down the Vonnega quote So o, regarding singing. It was regarding singing. I recall heard Vona a bit where he was encouraged at age fifteen to view creative pursuits as paying off. So I hope Veronica will go on singing even if her kids have the questionable taste to tell Mommy she isn't good enough. One day they will treasure those moments. That's so nice. Oh, this makes me feel like I'm gonna cry now. That is nice. No, thank you, John. Yeah a kid. S I'm gonna tell Kurt Vonnegats Kurt Vonnegat's archeologist said counselor archaeologist guy. What camp was he at where there were just archaeologists was hanging fifeen years old at an archaeological dig. Which sounds weird until I tell you when I was fifteen, I went to an archaeological dig during the summer. It was like a summer camp thing in Illinois Mine was only two weeks. his was apparently a month, but yeah, it was a thing we did Oh, I just made out with kids on the tennis court A my summer camps? Well there were kids making out at the archaeology camp too. Probably on tennis courts Proably And then finally today, we wrap things up with a Yonism. For clarification for a past episode, the bonus chapters in the Dungeon Crawler Carl hardcovers are not the same as the extras in the audiob books They are chapters of a standalone multip partart novella set in the dungeon called Backstage at the Pineapple Cabaret. Okay, there you go. Thankk you, Jan for that Oh now I have more things I need to find and consume. I know, right. But you can find The Novella maybe on its own and then you're not left out All right, well, thank you to everybody who submitted both Quick Burns and Barrier Swords this week. If you want to do so, you can post them either on Goodreads or in our disiscord. Al right? Well, we should spend some time kicking off The Devils by Joe Abercrombie. This will be obviously non spoilery. And then we're going to wrap up The Lives of Tao by Wesley Chu with a discussion with Wesley Chu. es a few weeks ago, we did a story about James Cameron picking up an option to work on an adaptation of the deevils Devils just came out in May. So we were like, whoa, James Cameron already jumping on this. And so we decided, okay, since Veronica picked a laser, I'm going to pick a sword and we're doing The Devils by Joe Aber Abercrombie is Ver Joe Aber cy U Tamson Muir says The Devils is an incredibly fun, incredibly action packed, and by the end incredibly affecting book, it slammed the living shit out of me. That's what Tamson Muir wrote Um think If you have never read Joe Abercrombie, you need to know that he is very good at writing detailed fight scenes with blood and gore and There's going to be some poop There's that. O. Yeah It's not all that It's not even mostly that, but that's in there Uhuh He's also really good at writing characters and bands of characters and how they, you know, meet and bond and all of that's in there too. And I think that's the majority of it, But you know,'s there's also some poop Oh geez. This feels like there's, you know okay And Oh no and people are agreeing with you already. Oh no. Yeah But the premise of this book to be non spoilery unless you were like, you told me there was booook. No that's a spoiler. The premise is we're in an alternate Europe in the Middle Ages Uh, and a A werewolf a vampire to a magician sounds like a joke, right? Monk, a werewolf, a vampire and a magician and an elf are all imprisoned by the church and put under a binding by the pope who can do magic. to go and take this princess to Troy as a gambit to try to outmaneuver the Eastern church because there's a fight between the easastern and the Western church. A lot of this is based on actual events. There was a schism between the Eastern and Western churches and there was a rivalry and there were two Roman empires, one in the east, one in the west and all of that. As far as I know, there were no werewolves and ellves involved in the And we got a lady the Pope. Yeah, Lady Pope U Lady Popa and a lady Savior that the church is founded on Lady Jesus I don't know. I'm not there yet. I'd be a spoiler to say what they're called because I don't know. I haven't read that far. Okay, but yeah, I's going to call him Lady Jesus. Yeah, but it's u It's there's a lot of real European history drawn into this and then there are elves and and magicians and stuff. So yeah Oh ye, they Well they do a circle instead of a crucifix. So when instead of sign of the cross, sign of the circle. I get it. Yeah Yeah yeah I wonder Ah, interesteresting curious about the symbolm. And you may say Tom, that sounds like a spoiler. And if you wanted to know zero about the book before going in, then yes, in which case you probably shouldn't have listened to our kickoff But it's not a spoiler. It's like revealed in the first place chapter like this is not this is not the spoiler. This is not the the twist that the book is premised on All right, well, I'm enjoying it so far. so good good tick Tom. I can't believe we haven't. T' always like alsoso there's an alien named Ron Boileroiler That's good Awesome Yeah, I'm excited about it. I'm excited about this one. All right, well, I guess we should pass it off now to our interview with Wesley Chu. Let's give it a listen So let us wrap up the book The Lives of Do by Wesley Chu. And of course, as we mentioned, we got Wesley Chu to come help us wrap up your book. Thank you for doing that. Hey, what's up? Thanks for having me. In flash. So nice to have you on the show. I know it's been ten years since the last time I was on this show Yeah. We've been around for a minute. That's wild has happened. Yeah. And you were not even in California then. I was in Chicago. Yeah. I had no kids. I had a wife. So had no dog. Yeah. You have a dog no? No, she died. Oh, I'm sorry. you got a dog went through a whole lifespan of a dog I, wow. It has been like two lifetime since I saw you guys. That's crazy. And then we were meeting up, I remember in twenty eighteen when I got this house at those writer meetups where a bunch of people were getting together like Mali Ooost drinkling through Yeah. I was doing that with Michael Braff and Brown. That was really cool thing. And then COVID ruined that. And we thought abouting so many things afterfter COVID, we should do it? It's too much effort now I'm just stay in the house No, I think we all were. Well, we got questions for you from the audience and we'll keep an eye on chat and maybe grab some questions from the folks listening live as well. U Veronica, you want to start us off? Yeah, so I've had in the past ten years, I've had two beefs with you that I wanted to cover first before we get started on the Lives of Do. Okay. One was you didn't like Barbie. talk about that I didn't like Barbie Yeah, you said you didn't li with the Barbie movie I'm gonna to need a little bit more context about Barbie. Yeah I wrote this book ten years ago No, it had nothing to do with books. This was She was just mad at something you wrote on Facebook. Ly,arbie. I thought you meant like barbie the context of the book. Okay. No, I'm just mad at you as a person. were we were shifting to talking about lives of now. I had to shift it back. Okay all me to kind of explain myself. I did not enjoy Barbie on the very first viewing. And I think part of it was probably like it got hyped up so much. I came in with a lot of expectations. Yeah, yeah And then after I kind of like, you know, I had my afterfter I brought up my points on social media and got a little slaughtered for it. I did rewatch it again Okay And my grade for it, I think I gave it a C when I first saw it and I gave it a B plus second time. and I appreciated it more once I saw more context of it because the first time I alsoen have been a little high. thought I'm not gonna lie. We are still liive. W the first time or the second time I think the second time I time like like a serious piece of art the second time because I was like a lot of people gave me a lot of points and gave me a about it. So I'm gonna really like study the movie and I did. But the first time I came in was like lot of expectations and it just didn't quite hit it for me, you know? So there's a lot more context a second time where o, okay, now I see it. now I appreciate it for, you know how it's kind of like, you know portraying how society is and like, you know, really talking about a women's issues that like that guys don't I had to look for those because most time I went over my head.. Be you weren't looking for them. I wasn't looking for them. I was I was just waiting for a super fun, interesting movie. and it was interesting. just I wasn't the right audience for it. So once I s of got the context of the movie, then I really appreciated it a lot more Okay. And then I think that I appreciate that. Thank you. That's good ins. And What was your relationship to the Barbie movie, Veronica that you took personal offense to his opinion being a lady. Yeah Okay. All right, S. Its, you know, just like like in the barbie just a person who lik the barbie movie.. I mean it was not that deep. In my defense, I saw Oppenheimer the exact same day. Oh you did Oppenheimer. Oppenheimer B my mind. Sure. I mean, I love Oppenheimer and I was like and like I think I was just mentally exhausted after Oppenheimer, you know That's a ye that's a thrill notot a thrill ride. What's the word? Merry Go round? I mean, that's a thrill marathon. Yeah. Yeah, ye. ye last movie I'm trying to think of I'm pretty sure the second one was just that you like the Dodgers. Is't that true Is that a thing? Untrue. I actually don't like baseball. I don't like b Oh, maybe it was baseball. Oh yeah, mayaybe that's first of all, I just went to my first baseball game like two weeks ago. It was the Yankees versus the Orioles. It was Earon Judge Knight, so I needed a Bobble headad And And then I was with my girlfriend and she actually explained baseball to me. she's a big baseball fan. And I'm starting like again, it's one of those things where once you understand the nuanance of baseball, then're, okay, that's kind of interesting because you' a lot of stuff going on, a lot of strategy going on. For a long time, I was a Baris fan. I was a football fan, you know, I was a soccer fan, but like baseball just moved at a pace that really wasn't for me So And then also like, let's be honest, I live in Chicago' like cubs and socks and I'm kind of like, a, you know, they both kind of suck.. Like was I was going to ask, how do you go about living in Chicago and not being like immersed in baseball culture. because you got to deal with Cubs fans li I lived in near the north side and you got to deal with Cubs fans all the time. I'm like, you know, I'm sorry, Cubs fans, but you know you're all kind of certain kind of people, you know I mean you're St Liscardino baseball pens in my studios. So I don't feel like you have to say that just because of that. But no, I also I do appreciate baseball a lot more. Yeah So when you went to this Yankees Oris game Who were you rooting for Oh, so I was rooting for the Yankees because H I mean, I don't't I don't have a courseortion in this car. I just kind of like like The Orioles?ike I didn't even know where like I was like, I don't know it's Baltimore, right? Yeah. that's right. Or did they move? No, they're at Baltimore. Oh That's right. Yeah. I didn't even know who the Orioles played for And you know, okay. so here's the thing is I wanted to see an Eron Judge Home runun and I did. And then I realized that Let let them take that back. So usually I'm underdogs fan And what heck compared the lineup between the Oreos and the Yankees, it was like stark. Yeah, you know. So so I got I did get caught up in like the Yankees fans because they're like, you know, there's like Yankee fans are serious fans. Oh intense. Yeah. Yeah, they're intense. So I love I love that wave of like, you know, of like this just this community and everything with us. So that's why I got caught in because If I root for the Oreos and I'm a pretty loud person fan when Iotot for team. You get into it Yeah, I'll get into it, and then I'll get yelled at, you know. And if you're gonna to get yelled at, you want to mean it. Yeah, ye. No I get you. But it was fun. I mean, I enjoyed when everybody had a good time and that's what it comes down to Thank you. Thank you for squashing that beef with me. I feel like you didn't know we even had beef. I didn't know we had do beef It's been stewing for a while. so I feel better now. I feel like I. Yeah When I told her, I reached out to you for the interview, she's like, you know, I have beef with him. And I was like, what? really? And she's like, Yeahah, I'm like, what about? She's like, I don't remember. I was like, I don't think I've remember I first before. You know what? I'm going to go through all your stuff. I'm gonna see what. I'm gonna go I. I love it, I love it. I'm absolutely here for it. Okay, but we'll get to real questions now. The first one comes from Seth He says I'm wondering how Mr. Chu looks back on the lives of Tao since it was his debut. Is it remembered fondly or has he progressed enough as an author that it makes him cringe? Oh that why would that happen? Anyway, sorry, moving on with Seth's question. mean ideas for edits of past books keep popping into your mind or can you set that whole world aside to work on your new stuff I mean that that's a very long question, Seph. But I'm going to try to hit hit a full on. So So I wrote the first draft of The Les of To in two thousand six, I think So almost twenty years ago, I think like I had pagers in that book, you Yeah So period peace now. And like the truth is this is the lies of Tao is the book that put me on the map U And Rowan Tan is actually named after my nephew, my oldest nephew. Really. And Cameron Tan, who later one of the main characters in the later books, is my second nephew And so And A lot of times when you're a beginning author, know you kind of write what you know in many ways, and I absolutely did this. I put myself in the book. When my dad read an old one of the first copies of the Les of Tao. He was like son I read your book. You know, it's good There's a problem with it. Your main character. He's kind of likekable, but she's not very likable Well he modeled after you. Oh wow. he was right. I guess I was winy dude back then. So so yes, in many ways, it's I don't think I can realize a Tao again. was like to believe that I'm a much better writer than I was twenty years ago. So there' a lot there's a lot of aspects about it that I would not have I wouldn't be doing now if I was rewriting that book So yeah, parts of its crringe, but also I love Liza To. It was like the one book that in many ways is the most organically me, you know that I could write. and, you know, I tell a lot of people that The art of prophecy, the Wd saga is a spiritual successor to Tao when it comes to like the tone, the humor, you know, the relationships. But like Les of To was me back in the twenties. so ye. I have a comparison where Um I You know, I compare Rowan Tan's journey from who he was as a kind of out of shape IT loser to this like this just no bad ass secret agent Yeah. I compared his journey to mine as a writer. Because back then, you know, I worked I too worked I worked an IT job that I hated, you know? and like Rowan's boss and the books were like a combination of three bosses that I didn't like. So so there was that journey of like finding my true self And that's kind of who, um, I took that journey with Roman and by the time he became was I bec I became a writer. Well and you did a lot of interesting things along the way, possibly not, you know as crazy as some of the things that Ronan does. but you're not just a writer after you stopp being the IT, right? Right. I mean, I mean I used to be a member of SAG, I did a lot of stunt work And And like a lot of that was in the book. It's like you know, when it comes to snunt workk, you know, I was very proud of the fact in the early draft that like, you know, I can do every single action scene in this book And in in a scene where he gets u where the he gets u someone' trying to rob him And he he had the wine bottles in the alley. Yeah, yeah. that actually happened to me. No kidding. I was in bartending. I was in bartending class in the South loop in the early two thousands. it was like ten thirty at night. And the exact same thing happened. like walking home, making the wrong turn in the alley 'cause I was an idiot being and like and there's the thing about it is I trained Chinese straight swword and and like weaponry for many, many years And the moment I was like, dunk D don't bottle. like That never occurred because training and fighting are different things. R. And All that training went out the window where I literally when I was like, you know tryrying to fight the guy. I did the Lisa Simpson thing where I was like, I'm gonna wayake the windmill and charging. And that's That goes to show, you know, you really need to you need you need just a bullets once in a while if you actually get that training in that makes sense that that was based on a real experience because I have walked the South loop at that timepe of night. I haven't had that experience, but I could feel it. I'm like, oh yeah, no, I could absolutely see that happen. That conversation felt like a real conversation. So I'm in danger danger. I am rough withgan sometimes. That's absolutely true Tryke wanted to know if you ever played the MMO City of Heroes. D. Be he says the prorophus and Genjix remind him of the alien Kelddians who merge with humans, with one faction working to better humanity opposed by the Warshades who use human as pawns. They aren't exactly the same since City of Heroes uses the melding of the two in the context of superheroes and supervillans, But I could see if the book were inspired by the aspect of the game., I mean I played city of H heroes for like fif only like The first month or two that it came out, you know it was cool. I've had a lot of MMO's, but the things I bounced off a lot of MMO's. but so City at Hoes, I didn't get to that part of the story. Oh okay. So So it's just pure coincidence. I had a dude who I was trying to make him like a crowd control guy and after like two months of being ineffective. I was like, this sucks. I mean,ss another there's another book I I came out of the seventies where I get comped that book the Needer the Need or something like that. and also Chuck At least I didn't see Chuck either So that you know, that's interesting. I've kind of forgot about Chuck Yeah, I guess but there's there's an overlap with the secret agent side the secret agent I never saw Chuck until after people told me about it and I'm like, and then I saw like a few episodes. I'm okay. That's kind of cool. I could kind of see that comparison, but you know I mean But I think in a way that's like that's kind of like a dream, I think of humanity to just be able to learn something without having to Well Roan has to put the effort into it because he has to train, he has to physically get fit, he has to learn the moves. but to have the knowledge like immediately implanted in your mind. like in some ways, like that's that's kind of something I think a lot of people want in in a lot of instances. hello chat GBT, I guess R? No, but but I mean that's I mean, that thing it's It's all about the work, you know. And like right now, you know, it's like and that was a very important rule in the Tao universe was like Rowan had to put in the work, you know, regardless of the knowledge that you know that Tao was giving him, you know, you have muscle memory, learning how to fight, learning how to do the reflexes failing, you know, it's like like in the course of the lives of Tu, it took Ro like like a couple of years to get competent, you know. It's not like the movie wanted where The dude was like curving bullets in like three weeks. Yeah, right. Angelina Jolie movie. Yeah. that's my big thing with cheating montagers is like they get good really fast and then and then suddenly they're like they're like experts No,'s one of the things I found compelling is that he his training is earned, it feels more believable because he's not it's not a linear progression. It's not overnight or anything like that. You see. You see him fail and you see it that's important to me. Yeah I fail a lot, you know, But like like I did I did a a podcast with Ban and Sanders I did a panel with Bandon Sanderson once and I was like, you know, I got to beef to pick with with Robert about, you know, how like Randald Tor became like a Hren Mark master in like three months. you know, Yeah, yeah. Yeah yeah yeah. because that's very common in a lot of romanticy as well That happens a lot in the I've gotten really into the romanticy world and I have a separate like book club also about that. And so I've been picking up a lot that there's The training thing It's a very shortened timeline in a lot of these stories. and I think it's much more realistic when it does take a long time and there is a lot of failure I mean, it takes a whole book. I mean, my original draft for the Les of Tal, I think I had them like I think it spaned four years, you know And that just me being like, you know, being silly, but like, you know, obviously at the end of the day, you need to know, whatever happens needs to serve the story and when you have too much of a timeine know, timeline going on, then it becomes problematic and it kind of hurts the story. Yeah. And then Mark noted that you wrote tyyphoon in The Walking Dead Universe back in twenty nineteen. Are there other science fiction fantasy and or horror franchises that you'd like to visit or chronicle there's some really, really want to do a John Wick book. Yeah.ike I mean, I'm known for my action sequences Um I love that universe. I love how cool it is. I love how much how it could make so much sense. It makes so much sense. you know Yeah. So I would love to write a John Wick book I On the fence about Star Wars Yeah. I mean I wasn't aoot I wasn't a Star Wars a super fan. So and then and things is like might be good That might be good actually That's an interesting perspective. So the Star Wars people ask me at one point like, well, what would you like to work on if you did a Star Wars book? And I was s kind of like Max Ribbo Max Ribo was the Blue elephant. Oh. Right, right. the one sitting at the bar. Right Yeah because like the Holy trilogy, like the Ho T triinogity has been done know, a thousand times. Sure. We've had a million Luke Han and Leabu stories. So I wanted to some're so good Or like like I wanted to do one that was like when young Han was at the academy and he like breaks out Cewy from like, you know, from the, you know pron or whatever. L something kind of like like a little bit more off to the side, notot about the main plot line butook. there's something really cool about, you know Yeah, just so I would love to do something like that. Yeah, yeah. Um There's a lot of Scotch in liives of To whichich I don't mind as a Scottch drinker, but I was curious if that if that's another example of you putting yourself in the book or not. I dr a lot of Scotch dr. Okay. I'm California sober now, but I go. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, but back in the day, you know, was it was like I bought I bought into the writer drink writer's drink when they write. And I mean, I was working like sixteen, eighteen hour days at the time, just kind of writing and day job and writing And like the thing about You wantan to write drunk and edit soilber, you know? Oh yeah. becausecause I remember I was having a great time. I was having a blast writing like that. and then every day I'm like, what am I writing? I have no idea. This is uncoherent, you know So how to eventually stop that? Also,s a lot of calories Yeah it's surprising how much is just an alcohol. It suugar. Yeah. ye, it's just another form, right. Yeah Um Do you still drink Scotch at all or I love Scotch. Yeah, okay. you know, I don't drink that much.'s When you when you're like fifty Okay. When you're like fifty and you have listen well, Veronica. two or three drinks, you know, my recovery time is like three days. No kidding, man. Yeahah. It's the same for me. So like I'll have a beer You know, I have a scotch and I actually drink the cider a lot more now, but but it's rarely my first choice. What's your favorite scotch though when you have a go to Ard beg Oh yeah. Arbeg Ugadel, which is kind of like I like really peety scotches, but like bold bold flavors I don't like peete for Pete's sake. And a lot of scotches kind of got that way, you know, like how smokey can we get? You' right. Yeah Was that you or me Somebody's Gemini just wanted us to repeat something. That's funny. I think it's your watch. I think I see it. They're always listening.ways listening. Well, we shouldn't turn this into the Scotch situation. Do you recall how you decided which historical events to reference in liivves of Do? Like how you went around about that So the lives of Tao originally in its like oldest form had two shparate storylines It had their Ronan storyline, and then it had Tao storyline.. So Tao Storyline was actually it was chronicled over like thousands of years and And what happened was theed my publisher at the time, Angry Robot, they were like, well, you know, we love the stories here. but Having the two story lines kind of slows it down a little bit too much We want you to kind of like figure out how to integrate Tu storyline without actually writing everything out. and that's kind of how I ended up writing those snippets. Okay at the very beginning of this chapter Did you pull from like things you were interested in, things you had learned about, or did you go do original research? or There was a lot of original research. because when you're playing with history ye It all has to kind of fit. you know, the timelines have to fit, you know and so it was a puzzle. It was very much like figuring out like you know, what characters he could possess how would even get there Yeah and what, you know, historical significant you know, time would actually work and what would it mean for him? And how what does it mean for the for the war in general? And then like because it's it was a lot of fun. It's just retoning also like this this historical event happened Wh Yeah. Now this might be why it happened, but let me give you a cooler reason why it could happen You know And as long as it made sense and then as long as the reader bought into it,, it was it was a really fun like experiment to work with. I hadn't thought about that. Like you could go and like show off your historical prowess and the reader would be like, I'm not familiar with anything things. that's not hidden. So you got to pick stuff that's interesting and that they're familiar with. And then you got to make it cool. and then you got to make it work with the story. and then you gota have to make whatever happened impacted story. Otherwise, you know, it's's Victor Hugo going on a hundred page tangent on the side of about the war that nobody cares about. Yeah Victor Hugo could get away with that, but yeah. That kind of leads into my own question, which was are there any lies of Tao that you didn't get to include in the story that maybe you had in the back of your mind that were like, oh yeah. Ta is definitely this person, but it doesn't make sense in the current telling that I'm doing No. Oh ye that' so it's's so I I dredged history just to kind of like because I not only had Tao's character, then I, you know, then I mean, I had IO's character and then I also had several other characters throughout this. I mean, the Tau books were Tive has essentially been six books So I had I spent a lot of time just like finding c bits of history and just kind of using it. and how how can I use this in a way that kind of like you know tells a really cool narrative. It's c Um Psession story was really interesting to me too because you would think, oh, the alien takes over. and a lot of the other ones we talked about earlier, the alien takes over and the alien takes over. The alien can't control the hosts How did if you remember, how did how did you hit on that dynamic? That is like one of the that's a F first important rule of writing this book is I did not want you know, it had to be a symbiotic relationship. It had to be. I mean, when people ask me, I caught like like a buddy like a romance, a buddy thriller. you know, because once someone can take over someone, then it then that changed the power dynamic You know, then he's just then he he's just a puppet a puppet. Yeah Yeah. yeah. And that's and that's so many possession stories. R. And so the thing that was really important to me was They have to work with each other, they have to be friends. in the sequel series, the Rise of Ile, I kind of flip the narrative around where there's an Indian girl named Ella Patel, She's a straight rat. She's sixteen. She's really, really svy inc comppetent. And then there is Ile, the the profist who At one point back in the, you know, the the The Quasing universe was a really high ranking asing, but now it's completely incompetent. So I kind of flip that narrative around and had a lot of fun doing that too. but But it' definitely one of those things where they have to kind of like figure each other out and learn to work together. Yeah, yeah, because I guess the human could exist by ignoring Genjix, but not the other way. I mean, the Genjix is just kind of a prisoner in there, right? Yeah I mean it's hard to ignore somebody in your head. Yeah, you know And and I think I think I made a touched up upondant in a few books where like, you know, you eventually go crazy. It's a voice in your head. Yeah Okay. All right last question for me. How did you come up with those names? Genjix and Profus? So u A lot of writers then enormous amounts of time, like finding that perfect name and perfect word for like other characters or theyll have they'll have written out songs and poems by the time they kind of like figure stuff out I am not one of those guys.. I'll be like Hey, he sounds like a gym and then I' need be Jyim. And I'll come back to I'll come back to it later and then Id never come back to it. And now he's Jyimm. Yeah and it has like like Because there are like The word saaga, for example, is a sprawling universe. I have a lot of characters in there. And I'd be like, this person sounds like a L like a kasami. and then and then now now it's set you know, So I don't I don't spend I don't because for me, the name the name is just an identifier for the person is right. And it's really the work on how you build a character that's actually important. Now, should I spend more time on it? probablyrobably, but I could spend I could waste so many weeks just figuring out perfect names and, you know, the name of this river and I just don't So you just came up with those in the moment. Literally within like ten seconds of the rumber M. I guess it's that, you know That's amazing Well if you say, you know, if you think about it, I mean, none of us got to decide our names and it didn't necessarily define are ide you decide? Oh well, that's cool. Oh yeah. I was b No. I was I was born Zu Hong. And then I came and immigrated to Nbraska when I was five And no one could pronounce my name. And there was a dash in my first name. Which by the way, if anybody went to grade school in the eighties, we had those scantrons, There's no dashes in sccantron though So it just made my life really difficult. So I think I thinkking seventh grade, my dad was like, you need to pick American name. Yeah. And I picked Alex From like family ties. Again, I didn't think I didn't think too hard names, you know even then. I idea that you didn't even think too hard on Alex, I'll be an Alex. And then then by Alex by like my freshman, Alex Keatan, right? yeah. By my freshman year, I was like, I don't like that name. You know? So and then I'm like, Prinince's br You know I I like st I like star trek.. So yeah, but so even though in Princess Bright, it's Westley. And that's too hard for my parents to say. You know, my parents are from the old countries, can't they can't say multi syllabable like that. So yeah, I became Westley. Oh yeah. Andice. Was that something that had just been an informal name Yeah it was easy to change, right? I am still legally me. And I actually very recently looked up like, how do you legally change your name? And unless you're getting married It is not easy. I got like put an ad in a newspaper, you know it You have to put an ad in the newspaper. Yeah. Wow. I mean I mean I heard about that like a long time ago. Yeah it's still a thing. Like they never changed that rule that law or something. someomebody from the eighteen hundreds were like, you to put your name in a newspaper for four days or something like that. Oh wow. So ye I do just that that's letting the community know. Yeah, right? I'm not even sure what How to do that? Yeah. That wouldd be the hardest part of the whole process. You can't is it online newspaper account? No, I don't know.. I I sound like you know the it's so weird Kanoga Gazette or something. You don't put my name there U Well, let's see. Veronica, do you have any more questions that you want to we really enjoyed the book. It was a lot of fun for us to read. So thank you so much for coming on the show giving us of some of the background to things that we never even considered And just hearing some of your personal takes on how this thing came to be. it was a joy to read. Awesome. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. It was That book is very near and dear to my heart And it's not often that I pick a sci fi book also. That's right. This was a reverse situation. Yeahverse. This was Veronica's pick and she pick she picked laser, which Mbe have has never happened before his Iice may had Yeah. Handful of time. Yeah. Do you tell that to Sanderson the next time you talk say I'm gonna see him tomorrow. perfect. He's gonna be like you. P a message. You you want to hear a fun fact? Yeah, sure. Yes. Brandon Sanderson and I went to junior high together. In Lincoln, Nebraska for one semester Did you know that? That seventh grade. Wow. Was that something you had to rediscover later or did you like remember each other? So I actually never met him Gee, that was cool. No, no,. but no, but I was I was doing the writing excuses podcast and then know wed record like, you know episodes. Yeah ye. and we were just getting food one day. We're getting Thai food and He was like, I'm from Nebraska.' like I' from Nebraska. I'm fromincoln. I' from Lincoln. before we knew it, we were we like we triangulated like same high school junior high. And like, yeah, like teachers and overlaps and all that. That's wild Uh, chat room wants to know, didnid't they do the bllue elephant the Pirate series? I don't know if Wesley will know the answer to that, but No Yeah.. Also they're debating the pronunciation of Tau. I go by tow And with the tea. Yeah. And they're like Tom was saying Tao and now he's going to change it because Wes said Tao. Yeah you know what? I'm easy that way. it's all good. Then they thought we'd have a beef about it for. I mean, I like having beefs. I feel like you have a beef have more to talk about. know whoever wins the beef kind of like Yeah. I'm a beef holder. That sounds weird That's not that's not there's no one. Well, we've got that on tpe. Shut up. Shut up, chat. No, but it was this was fun. I mean this was great oppun, come on Thank you for talking about a twenty year old book with us. know Thank you for choosing the twenty year old book. If you want to let folks know what you're up to lately these days, you know, let them know. What's going on? Yeah what are you working on? So I just finished the third book in the War Art saga and the book the series starts with the At of prorophecy, to the Art of Destiny to arrt of Legend h the word saaga is kind of like my love letter to kungfu movies Oh cool. And like I said, it is a spiritual successor to town in terms of like You know, the humor, the relationships I flip a lot of things on its trope like the chosen One trope, like the master trope, you know, So it's a lot of fun. It's kind of like the one series I wanted to write when I was a kid Now when I was a kid, I was you know in Nebraska, And I There were there weren't that many, like, you know I learned English by watching like by watching like, you know Cil movies And the like the dubs. Yeah, the Yeah. Oh wow. So I had really bad grammar for a very long time. So it's that era of com from movies Yeah V very specifically. Yeah ye. not the CGI stuff, but the real like Dunken Master Dunken Master too Fks Fist of Legend, you know, onnce uppon a time So like back when it was like a real skill. Yeah yeah Oh, that's cool. I love that. actually I actually watch a lot of the Wusha stuff now. My wife and I like watching it. It It's a very different R sensibility than that, but it's still fun. I mean, it depends. Are you watching the like post two thousand two or is it all CGI now? Oh yeah No we're talking like current like Oh yeah twenty twenty stuff. Yeah. Well make a list. Okay, yeah Awesome. Most of my kung fu knowledge comes from Bu Tang clan that's legit too. Is it? Yeah. All right. body Literally take that to nextself. Yeah. You're dating yourself. Wesley, thanks, man. This was really good fun. Thanks for having me guys I appreciate it.