TV Show Recommendations and Closing

John, we were going to record earlier, but you told me you had to go out and buy a bunch of Apple TV four Ks Its the timing seems good There aren't any lines I'll say that You go to the Apple store to buy an app TV borquet, front of line You walk right up Right up to the counter I don't know how many times you've been on the show and we have played the game spend Tim Cook's money So who better to have on the show? undernder the gun while Tim Cook is still on the job. Yeah. while we can speculate on spending Itooks money And we when the news had broke the week before where he said the prices were going to go up, we were recording the rebound. and I thought about making a joke about them increasing prices on the Apple TV just because it seems like it's. It seemed like it would be so ridiculous and then come to see the price increases and it's the one with the largest percentage price increase. It's by far making. Yeah. I yeah I did, I wrote about it because it really it's like we didn't know what to expect. It is. it's like he said Hey, this is bad. We're going to have to increase prices. and then that was a Thursday. And then the Friday came and I thought, who knows that mean tomorrow. They'll give the interview on a Thursday and then the next day. They do it Friday came and went they didn't do it. and then the next week came and they hadn't done it and it's like, I don't know, maybe they're just gonna to wait for new products. I think that was possible that they would do something like that And they kind of did because they did not increase the prices on the iPhone. and that's apparently one of their more popular products. I think here So three big ones maybe the three most popular. I don't even know, but they've got to be close. iPhone clearly most popular. Apple Watch very popular and AirPods, which are obviously to some degree popular. did not get price increases. A another like the Base Mac Mi, the current Base Mac Mini did not get increased, right Well sort of. I mean, it's not really it's it's not the long term Mac base Mac money, but they they had played what was the deal? so they took away the two hundred fifty. They took away. miss that when to go up. I missed that. Yeah They months ago, they took away the two hundred and fifty six gig config. They just took it away and that was the one that started at six hundred bucks So then it started at eight hundred bucks And now it still starts at eight hundred bucks, but it's back to be at two hundred and fifty six gigabytes as storage. Yeah. I thought it was just the higher end one. No, it's for some reason, I don't know why. I guess because they's at some level, they just wanted to increase the base price so that they took it away And we can talk about that in a minute too that it's actually the highest end configs that they're still not selling for certain things. But then on Thursday of this last week as we're recording over the weekend, Thursday is when Apple was, I don't know, we want to call it P day Price day May maybe worksop that M day Margins Day Yeah Celebrating Margins Day. It Celebrating Margins Day. They announced or they didn't announce they they just took the store down for a while. It's lovely that they still have to take the store down to make changes Even if only briefly. I feel like that's a lost tradition. They used to have to take the store down for like three hours back in the day Store comes back up, prices are increased And the poor Apple TV took the brunt of it with fifty four percent increase for the sixty four gig one and a sixty seven percent increase for the one twenty eight config that has Eethernet and the Red networking And when I mentioned it at first, I only mentioned an ethernet and several readers said that the reason they bought it was specifically for the thread stuff because you don't really need storage I don't know. I don't have mine plugged into Eethernet, but thread is something that is unique. And that's ad I It was always weird that thread was only in the high end one But anyway, it's two hundred fifty bucks now up from one hundred and fifty And my speculation is that for this one, because it's widely rumored A, this Current hardware comes from dates are right? twenty two. Yeah, so it's four year old hardware with the A fifteen Bionic chip which is no longer all that bionic. It's about About as bionic as Lee Majors is Lee Majors. That's from the year before with the iPhones thirteen, I think, But you know, fairly old chip not really suited to the current AppleA or Apple intntelligence So they're widely rumored in addition to just the age that new hardware is coming. So my speculation is basically that these prices are for the new hardware And they're putting them in place now with the old hardware so that when they announceced the new hardware, they could have two tiers. These are the prices and they didn't go up. We're keeping the prices the same Right in these troubled times. But I'm just feeling bad for people who are like Yeah, just moving over the summer, you know, like, I'll get pick up a new Alegi over the summer or R. And a lot of these a lot of these products I mean with the HomePod mini as well, like things that we've been waiting for for a while that have been sort of stalled by, you know, enhanced seri delays now to find out that they're going to be significantly more expensive is I mean, there we go We know why It's not Not arbitrary exactly, so It's not great with us So what is the wat? Is it as Bernie Sanders says that Tim Cook is greedy? Well I think Tim Cook's a little greedy, but well, yeah, definitely. But obviously, I mean, they weathered the price increases on SSD's and RAM for a lot longer than most of our competition, but weren't able to do it forever. So at least it's all going for a good cause, which is AI server forms It's like I think it's fine. To be angry that the prices have jumped up like this, right? It is not the natural course of inflation for prices to just jump twenty, twenty five, thirty percent or in the case of Ale TV fifty to sixty seven percent at once, right? That's a sort of out of the ordinary. You know, so it's okay to be angry, right? And I think a rational direction for anger is at the irrational exuberance of the AI data center buildout, which I think It isn't from my perspective about being mad at AI in general, but at what's clearly a bubble to some extent. It's to me, it's only a question of how big is the bubble Clearly, the spending is not commensurate with any kind of actual reasonable projection of revenue that it's going to earn, but the money to buy the data centers and the computers that go in them which are more ram hungry than any other computers anybody's buying for anything else And I guess to some extent needs massive amounts of SSD storage too So if you're angry at the bubble because the bubble has now effects that have trickled all the way down to just buying a new air for your kid who is going off to college and and August or September and you' Unfortunately, didn't buy the MacBook Air yet Or MacBook No, right? which was only from March, right? It's only four months old. What April May or three months old It's three to four months old and they've already had to raise the price and the price it's only a hundred bucks. It's only What is that sixteen to twenty percent? It's in line with the others, but it's no longer So charmingly inexpensive, right? Especially at the education pricing, right? At education pricing, the base model goes from five hundred to six hundred and that's a twenty percent increase. Yeah And there were reports of popularity of the NEO indicating that maybe they weren't going to be able to get all the parts you know because a lot of the chips were binned and stuff like that. weren't necessarily going to be able to keep producing it at the low cost that they had announced it at simply because They were selling too many of them Yeah, I actually think in hindsight, I think that's sort of misplaced, right? Be that speculation was all about the A eighteenhip. Yeah, right? Is it A eighteen or A seventeen. Maybe it's I don't I get them mixed up whichever one they wouldver takeakes from from last year's phone. I think it's the A eighteen chip from last year. And there was speculation that because they were using the bnd ones with only five GPUs for the low end model. And that hey, they saved them all up from a years where the Vihones and this thing was so popular. They were running out of them and they're going to have to like spin up production. on a year old chip and it blah, blah blah, blah. I think if you could get like Tim Cook or turn us over a beer and be like, Hey, what's really going on with the MacBook Neo? They would be like I wish our problem was A eighteen chips Right? That is not the problem. I feel like They could make as many eighteen chips as they want. It's the frigin Ram and the SSDs. Yeah Well, certainly. I think it Yeah. I mean, obviously, this price increase is reflective of that and not the chips sure I don't think the chip thing was ever going to lead to a price increase in the No And I don't think it was going to there was people saying, well, maybe they'll get rid of the low end model and only sell the high end model or something like that I don't think that's the case. I think they would just start putting eighteen chips in software disable one of the GPUs, and that's it And nobody knows, you know Yeah. What would you have done with the Apple TV? I can see the argument, right? I do. I, you know, Wh you could stop selling it. I mean, that's one thing you could do Right, But is that the right move? I don't know. From their perspective, why would you do that? I mean, if you can sell it to people for two hundred and fifty bucks or whatever, then go ahead and take their money. I wouldn't buy it at that price they they've done they've done stuff like that before, you know, they kept so it was at the What was the base, the cheap Apple Watch for a long time. I can't remember it was the three or the five. I think it was Yeah, they that way way past its its expiration date Right should I mean, that they really should not have done, I don't think. In this case,'s the weird thing is like I mean, I do want a new one, of course, but I like for instance, I just got a new TV and I hooked up the old Apple TV to it and I happen to havefortunately I still have three Apple TV in the house and I can it still it still works out. I have one for every room that I need one and need a TV in And that's great, but eventually I'm going to want a new one and I'm gonna buy one even though I'm not going to buy the top end, but even with this price increase It's the kind of television watching experience that I want. I mean, it's my preferred television watching experience. I never hook up my TVs to the internet and I'm not going to be suddenly using the TV's interface to Go to Apple TV plus well not TV plus and whatever it's called now or anything else because I want to go through the Apple TV to do that stuff All right, I guess take a step back and in the game of played Tim Coook's money, there's and wrriting to some daring fireball readers who've emailed me who seem a little angry about Apple raising the prices and this argument that they could have just eaten it that their margins are healthy enough. they could take the hit I think back to and I don't know if this is still true with Webkit, but for years in the early days of Webkit, and it came out publicly somehow. people on I guess because it's open source that it's unlike a lot of Apple projects. they could talk about their engineering practices But it was often repeated that in the webkit and Safari team, they had a hard rule No engineer could check in any change team's repository for either Webkit, the engine or Safari overall. if Checking it in made any of the existing tests run slower couldn't check in anything that made Safari or webkits lower And the idea was that it was informed by the past experience that the leaders on the team had at Mozilla and other places where they'd worked on browsers And I think anybody who's worked on software in general Browsers as an engine that things are built on top of, performance is important and was just known that you'd be like Well, let me check this in. I know that this makes something slower We'll fix that later. But let's check this in now because it works completely and we didn't have support for this feature before. and then later on, we'll make it fast sounds good like well, having support for this feature is better than nothing And yes, it sounds reasonable that, yes, if it made something slower, every single page load is ten percent slower. We'll fix that eventually. Well, it ends up eventually sometimes doesn't come for some of those features. And sure Safari had in Webkit put in a policy that you could just you've got to make you've got to make it as fast or faster would be great But you've got to keep all tests running as fast as they did before before you check in a change And Safari's always been a pretty fast browser. I think that's my way of saying, I think Apple and Tim Cook looks at margins the same way And that's who the company is, right? It's not a surprise. That's one of the hallmarks of the way they run their finances. And it's something that gets them investors and It's it's in their DNA I think that what this means for people and it's a pain, but you have to slow down your purchasing. You don't have to go out and buy or you have to like move your purchasing down. I mean, I have a IPhone'm seventeen and I'm probably gonna takeake a look. the E line the next time I go to purchase an iPhone. and if you're running a pro, then maybe think about not buying a pro. It's It is the unfortunate situation that we're in kind of. And yeah You know, they're not just going to lower margins on their own I do not think so. And ye I really do think that the Hey, we never really let margins press with the thought of, oh, we'll get them back later, right? Oh this is a temporary crisis in RAM pricing Let's take the hit on margins for the remainder of the year and come twenty twenty seven and we'll fix them I think That sounds good It's it certainly sounds possible. I think anybody up to Tim Cook would say that is possible But if your rule is we don't do things that take a significant hit on margins, then your margins don't take a significant hit ever, right? If that's your rule for webkit, webkit never gets slower There's always a trade off and the trade offff is, well, then maybe your project that has a rule that you can never check in a new feature or bug fix that makes test slower means that you check in new features at a slower pace than other engines. And if you're just looking at a list of support for features, yours is going to be behind. And maybe that explains partially why Safari often remains behind Chrome in terms of Leading ed support for new web standards? I don't know There's a trade off, you know, it's not free. It's not like, oh, why doesn't everybody do that? It's because obviously it's easier to check in new features if you and allowed to check in new features and optimize them later And it it certainly would go over better with customers to take the hit on margins and eat them and not raise the prices of the consumer products. and figure you'll fix them later But if you raise prices, your margins don't take a hit and what's the trade off? The trade off is Obviously it's going to it has to, I mean, this is again, eCon one hundred one. these higher prices will adversely affect demand for products. I mean, ye They should. I mean I do. I hope they do, because I hope people don't just run out and just buy them blindly anyway But I mean, I will say that We've also had the conversation over the past few years based thanks to Apple Silicon about the price performance ratio that we've been getting over the past Five six years, six years, right? Yeah Yeah twenty twenty end of twenty twenty. So and to a certain degree, we have as Mac, users have really benefited from over those years because I had I had an M one air that was really working fine. I could have kept that machine But last year the M fours came out. and I was like, okay, I've this I've had this machine for five years. Now I think can go I can rationalize going and getting a new one. And I'm glad I did now, obviously, but But that's longer than is usual, I think, to hold onto a machine that really was not experiencing any significant performance issues whatsoever. And I still I still have it and I still run I run the beta on it right now and it's If I had to use that machine right now, other than the smaller hard drive, it would be perfectly fine you're running that's a six year old machine The MacOS twenty seven Golden Gate B beta, you're saying Yeah. It's I wrote about this at least at the bottom of my post, but I did I mean, at a personal level, my main machine is still an M one Max Pro from twenty twenty one. and I bought it is called the M one Max chip bought the maxed out configuration. I don't think I got the biggest SSD because I only got terabyte SSD, but maybe that was the biggest one at the time. I forget. But I definitely maxed out the RAM. I got sixty four gigs of RAM, which is the most RAM a MacBook Pro could get in the M one generation And it was very exp I guess, I think, the most expensive Mac book I've ever bought, maybe the most expensive Mac I ever bought. But and it still is my day to day machine. It is still very fast. It felt very good when I tested The M four MacBook Pro review unit which I guess was over a year ago. And I really liked the nanotexture on on I love nanoexture. I love it on my studio display, which I own and I loved it on the MacBook Pro screen. And I liked the darker aluminum. I liked everything about it, and I thought, o, I'm gonna to bu one of these, aren't I? And then I finished a month of using it as my review unit and went back to my personal M one from twenty twenty one and literally did not feel anything gets slower. And that to me as I've often said as a reviewer, it's when I go back from the I get the new one. I like, oh, this is faster. I think And it's like, oh, it's faster. I think. And then I go back to my old thing and I'm like, oh, that other one is faster. ' this feels slow. R. Oh ye. I went back to my twenty twenty one M one Mac MacBook Pro and nothing felt anything any slower notothing I do with a computer anymore has hit the things that have improved. I mean, maybe a little, I'm sure the chips are, you know, it's going from M one to M four, but I was like, I cannot justify spending seven or eight thousand dollars or whatever, six or seven thousand dollars on a new one. just Berano texture And then I ended up last year When I don't use my MacBook as a MacBook, I use it with the lid closed my desk with the studio display, which is nano texture And then for various personal reasons wound up working outut of my house More days last year. than the last probably ten years combined in very very sunny rooms with glare And every day I was like, Goddamn it. I should have bought that M four with Nanot teexture. God damn it, this was the I should have. I should have, I should have And now anyway, now I'm looking at the prices of most RAM you can put in a MacBook Pro and I am like, oh, I'm really stupid I really I have never screwed up anything in my life like not buying an M four MacBook P a year ago with the Mac RAM because the configuration that I want with The hundred because there's no point to me RAM is the thing that I want because I keep an ungodly number of tabs open at all times. And they consume lots of RAM and I just I I love it. I love just never worrying about it. and I've got I seriously have like nine hundred tabs open in Safari, right? And I don't care. It doesn't matter. But what I want is I want the one hundred and twenty eight gigabytes because I already have sixty four. So I don't want to buy a new machine with only sixty four. And to get it, it would cost like just a hair under ten thousand dollars. And it used to cost seven thousand dollars I remember when I thought seven thousand seemed like an awful lot of money Sure. It is an awful lot of money. And I know I know that we're old John. I know it. but I hear ten thousand and And I don't care what it is. If you tell me it costs ten thousand dollars, I think it better be a car Yeah, and you can't get a car for that. Right, exactly. That's exactly where it shows how old I am because if I bought a car for ten thousand dollars, I'd be lucky if it got all the way Ran. you know Yeah Yeah And I want to, I mean, I want I want to be clear that I'm not I'm not happy about it. and I don't I don't think no one should be thanking Tim Cook or for anything. I just think this is the company that we are working with. and so I mean, I wouldn't be surpris them maintaining margins should not be surprising to anybody in particular. And also I don't I mean, Bernie Sanders comment is like It's just fire branding stuff. And he's stating capitalism is bad. I thinkal capitalism is bad. honestly. I wish he was the pres I I'd much rather have him be the president for sure. There's no question about that. But at the same time, I don't think that that gets anybody anywhere because I would rather have I would rather I would rather talk about their taxes and r rather haveaying their tax McDonald's French fries be president And Well, I love McDonald's French fries, so Everybody would be happier. We would have certainly have better decisions being made But yeah, it's you know, I get why the Fire brand is there, but I had to call it out I do think it's misplaced. I you know, it was Everything's going up. I mean, the poor steam machine, right from Val Yeah really, really innovative, clever and Aorable little PC like Game console. in a little six inch cube somewhere Steve Jobs is smiling adorable cubbe thing costs over a thousand dollars and it doesn't come with a controller. That really That really sounds like something from Apple. It doesn't come with a controller. It's like when you byy a studio display and they're like or the XDR and they're like and the stand is thousand dollars. Yeah, standand is a thousand dollars. Yeah. O the wheels. Th're the wheels. Yeah Well that Iared I compared something to the wheels this week. What was it? Oh, when I said that the configuration that I want for a MacBook Pro went up in price by two thousand eight hundred dollars For that price one used to be able to buy sixteen spare wheels for the Lake Great Mac Pro Those are the days U, those were the days movies used to The only thing to laugh about with the pricing is The wheels for the Mac Pro and the arms for the Pro display XDR. It's almost a shame that they got rid of the Mac Pro because it would have been interesting to see how much that the high of that. what would have gone up But this I mean, it's a weird. I mean, the swing and percentages though does seem Strange. In what way? I mean, like somewhat. Well, I guess the fact so I guess the the SSDs in the Apple TV make up a large portion of the cost of the thing. I mean, is that I think the I think the only I think the only explanation for the Apple TV's is that they priceed them for this fall for new hardware. Yeah. Yeah Yeah that and that Again, I think it's a really interesting discussion that they must have had inside about what to do right now at the end of June. when presumably the Apple TV is the earliest they're coming in September at the at the iPhone event And I think in a lot of I think the year that these actual models came out, they came out in October, right? A lot of times Apple's fallse schedule. They Clearly always have a September event for the phone and the Apple watches And if there are new air pods, they like to put the airPods in that event too Sometimes they put other things in that event. There was I think there was one time at the iPhone event where Oprah was at Apple Park because they were talking about Apple the actual The service Apple TV I think Stevenpielberg was there. I don't know, I didn't see any of them, but They they do other things at that event and maybe they'll move the Apple TV up because they want to get it out now like the less time that they're selling this old four year old hardware at these absurdly higher prices the better I don't But what to do in the meantime? I think that like you said a bit ago that maybe just stop selling them over the summer. But I don't know that's so unlike Apple, right? Right likeike They're not going to make announcement. They're just going to say out of stock or they're going all the configurations will just suddenly have October delivery times. I mean, I guess that's the way they would do it is you would put in an order Now for a sixty four gigabyte. Apple TV and it would say estimated delivery october first or something like that And you're like, what the fuck? And then September rolls around and they announce new stuff and then they fulfill your order with the new generation one I guess I mean, I'm sure they thought of that. then it's like, well, what about How many of them do they sell week in and week out? right? It's it is It's a hard product pinn down, right? It's not like Vision Pro where it's considered like, oh, most people out there don't even know anybody who owns one That's true for Vision Pro If you just went out and did man on the street interviews in a major city and said, do you own a Vision proro Does anybody you know own one? I don't even know what it is. Right? That's the answer. I think with Apple TV, yes, most people don't own one, right? It is not the most popular platform. I forget what the market numbers say, But it's also not obscure It seems like Apple TV is sort of to set top boxes. the Mac was to computing for most of the Max life Right likeike five percent market share, but the five percent isn't just a random five percent. It's the five percent of people who really care And they're they sort of are religious about it and they try to convince their friends and neighbors to buy them too. and And they really can't believe that the whole rest of the world doesn't is using the crap that they use. I mean, and I feel that way. I'm like I don't have to feel this way about the Mac anymore. Most people I know have Macs now. I know that it's not that's there's still majority for Windows, but I don't even know those people. Apple TV though is where I feel like I did back in the day with the Mac But it's like People knew people who own Macs. They're like, Do you own a Mac? And they'd be like, No. But you know my crazy brother in law does and he won't shut up about it. He's got a bumper sticker on his car Who does that Right Mac users, right? Apple T users would do it too. How many of them do they sell? I don't know. and I would feel guilty. I'm not against capitalism. I'm against control capitalism. I don't know what to say over exuberant capitalism. I think every once in a while, every couple of decades The world needs to kind of get together and tap the brakes on capitalism, right? And we're clearly at one of those moments right now And I see it. don' I don't think unfettered capitalism is good for society And this is where I would feel bad Really bad. I would I would just it would bother me. I'd sometimes wake up at three in the morning and think, ah, I feel bad if I were Tim Cook or John Turnis and I thought about every single person purchases an Apple TV right now for two hundred and fifty dollars. A for what they're getting for two hundred and fifty dollars and B that the new one is coming in September or October. I don't know I would lose. I don't think you loses any sleep over it, but yeah. well, that's why I'mbody. I would lose sleep. I am not cut out to No, I am not cut out to sell people two hundred and fifty dollars. four year old devices. I would have felt bad continuing to sell the Trashcan Mac Pro for five thousand dollars eight years after it came out without a spec increase or however many years it was. Yeah. And I get why Apple did it it's just I would think well, especially that last year, when you know you're working on the new one, you know it's coming and it's like somebody comes into the store and buys one and it's like I would feel bad. Again, I think Tim Cooks probably sleeps like a baby I'm sure All right, let me take a break here and thank our first sponsor. Speaking of Apple TV, this is actually somewhat related. 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I remember I've been thinking about the scene for months because it's exactly like these arguments about AI. Yeah just to point chet GPT and tell it to write a screenplay. That's all you need. And it's I could still be watching that movie right now. There's an alternate's talking to me. Yeah. inststead of talking to you. It is so great. Anyway, Cax the app If you use Plex, you're nuts if you don't get this. and this app is so good that it's You should get into Plex just to be able to use this app. That's how good it is The launch price is still only just the app is only a couple months old It's a sixty dollarars one time purchase and that's the launch price. They've been holding out on that price for this sponsorship on this show They're going to raise the price to seventy five bucks soon. I forget when exactly. 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Thank you Speaking of Vision Pro L Por Vision Pro got a six percent price increase. Yeah. Yeah three thousand five hundred dollars starting price originally now thir thousand seven hundred. That's really going to get exales I cannot stop laughing about it. I guess I get it. It's like Well, if they didn't increase the price at all It would only add fuel to the fire that Maybe they're just walking away from the whole platform and they're abandoning it, which is sort of been rumored There were a couple of interviews. Apple didn't do a lot of interviews at WWDC earlier this month, but they did some and there was one where somebody asked somebody I forget who about it and they gave a diplomatic Ale like answer, but more or less shot it down and said no, we don't have anything in the future to announce, of course, but We're all in on this platform and you could see it in all the whatever list of features they added to Vision OS twenty seven. sixix percent increase Yeah, everythingthing else is well, I mean, I guess it gets up to like thirty per thirty percent. So it's between fifteen and thirty three percent, everything else, right? And then The two outliers are the Vision Pro on the low end and the Apple TV on the high end. Right. And I do think, you know, it doesn't make any sense because what did they update the Vision Pro to an M five chip, right? It doesn't make any sense that if all the other M series products, the iPad Pro, all the various MacBooks If they all went up about twenty percent, doesn't really although I guess when they're I don't know, mayaybe it does make sense that the M chip is only or The RAM and everything is that low of a price out of the three thousand five hundred. Maybe it does make sense.. I don't,? It was like Lenses cameras are probably right high I really do think in terms of what percentage of the cost of the device is RAM and storage It was low compared to other products. It's these fancy displays and everything else, the R chip and everything else in Vision Pro and number of units they're selling combined. If there was any product that they really could have just said, ah, we won't touch the price on that one. I think it was Vision Pro and I really they think that they're making too many of them right now? I mean or making any of them at all or just right So Yeah did they need are they buying lots of RAM and SSD to put into them? R L Probably already made enough to keep selling. I would still think so. U I don't know. So I really do think the six percent increase is sort of it's not about the margins and the component prices, but really is sort of a marketing move of saying still liive perception. Yeah Yeah N dead yet, right? was What's the guy in Mononey Python and my weeer Phil Speaking of witch, I should wait for that one to come on That's right. Yeahah, talkalk about one that when it comes on that might be the epitome of a movie that you can jump into Yeah, anywhere, really Yeah, that one, it's a couple of other ones that come to my airplane Right An airave if you could jump into the airplane One minute in, half an hour in An hour in you could jump in five minutes before the end and it doesn't matter. you're just going to keep watching. Mononey Python is sort of like that Although maybe not five minutes before the end. I think that movie kind of ends Yeah It ends pretty poorly. It just ends like so many other skits. Yes. which which I guess is part of the appeal I don't know. Yeah, Right? or part of the brand, but it's like yeah, but it's like Apple and margins. For the first eighty five percent of the movie, you could jump in at any time. I do think that the Vision Pros six percent increase is sort of not dead yet It certainly seems like it Anything else on the pricing Well other than the fact that they also suggested that there could be more price increases Rram Well, and it's odd to get threats from Apple. Yeah, right Right And I understand that they're not trying to be threatening, but It is a little ominous, right? I presume that it means that New iPhones and Apple watches in September will be more expensive than the ones that they replace Yes Yeah, it's the rest of the lineup that's going to get it. R Right. But they and the way that they said it though, they more or less It more or less sounds. And again, maybe they have to. mayaybe they're worried. maybe their pulse on the industry is that Who even knows if these increases are enough? R knows if they have a suspicion How long it's going to go on? I mean, it seems like you get to the point where you know, some of the I don't know, someome of these data centers they're walking away from and are not getting done for various reasons and Maybe the demand doesn't pan out sooner rather than later. but. Chaotic situations Eventually come to an end, but in the meantime often grow more chaotic our house could be on fire and you think, oh my God, this sucks, the kitchen's on fire. And it could get a lot worse, right? It's like you could be like, oh, remember when I was worried because the kitchen was on fire. Well now the whole house burned down, you know You know what I mean? There is a possibility that as much as we're all right now bemoaning the early summer of twenty twenty six as a crisis in RAM and SSD storage. There is a possibility that come Christmas will be like remember the summer Whatever Yeah think Bigs were good. O they were better You know, it is entirely possible that six months from now The situation will be worse. And I feel like that's I don't know. I kind of felt like Appleles's ambiguous statement was covering all possibilities in that regard Presumably though, hopefully that this is really only a reference to the iPhone and Apple Watch, which did not get price increases and I guess they're just waiting for the new products to do it But then I guess it's curious why didn't they do that if that's my theory of what they did with Apple TV inccrease now. Why didn't they do it with Apple our iPhone and Apple Watch Yeah. I don't know. Maybe because they sell so many ungodly more of iPhones and Apple Watch that they're like Let's let people who are worried about prices buy these old ones now, right You know, that they them buy them now if they're worried about it and give them as much warning as possible. will take the And I think maybe in that case it's also an instance of where they for the for like the pros, right, they probably have things locked in at the very least Wouldn't you think that they had the prices for those contracts locked in through that cycle Gess, you know? and then Yeah. I mean, and you don't have to like with the Vision Pro, you don't have to I mean, unlike with the Vision Pro, I mean, like you don't have to worry about the perception that you're getting rid of the iPhone obviously. And so you don't have that concern. And so just keep selling them at the prices that without basically without marking it up even further and taking the profit you just keep selling it at those prices. And then the rest of the lineup though, like the baseball, the seventeen is further out. It's not coming to the you know, the eighteeen is not coming to the spring, right That's supposedly right. You know, and the Rumor mill is very consistent on that regard. I haven't seen anybody say otherwise.. what we're expecting is a new release strategy where The only new iPhones coming in September are the eighteen Pro and the folding. quote unquote, ultra and the regular no adjective iPhone eighteen will move and the iPhone air second generation which still weird that it didn't get a number is moving to the spring schedule when they've been releasing these e phones, so they'll have I guess some kind of every five or six month release where Tw high end premier ones come out in September and then the rest of them come out in in the brain it. The question is will they increaseed the prices of the seventeen and seventeen E and the iPhone Air in September even though they're year old products or keep selling them until spring at the existing prices. That doesn't seem sustainable. Maybe I don't know I don't know. I feel like well when the prices of the pros go up might behoove them to raise the prices of the seventeen s simply because it makes the seventeen s look much more attractive Yeah, in personarison Right. And and I always fill out the chart with the pricing. and I think it's always it's unsurprising to me because I do it every year But it's like, oh, every hundred dollars, there's a new iPhone. What's the seventeen E start at? I forget, six hundred dollars There's a six hundred dollarars iPhone, a seven hundred dollarars iPhone, an eight hundred dollars iPhone and if they only increase the prices of the eighteen Pro and the folding one, which everybody is thinking is going to be two thousand or higher. Maybe now people are thinking twenty thousand five hundred dollars That would create this gap between if they don't raise the prices of the iPhone seventeen, that there'd be this gap between the seventeen and the eighteen pro Yeah that I mean, there could be, you know, all sorts of products are sold with a gap between the mid tier and high tier, but That hasn't been Apple's strategy. I don't know I mean, and you look at the iPad lineup, they raised everything. Yeah in pretty relatively similar to proportions This is another example of Apple doing something that I don't like, but is probably good business is moving. Like I said, I have the seventeen, I tend to by at that level and now I'm going to have to wait six months longer in order to for the privilege. I do I don't love that. I mean,t I would rather be able to get a new phone when the people buying pros get new phones. B I feel like it maybe it does'. I mean, I think it probably makes sense for them. They get that lead time. anybody who' on the fence is going to have to think twice about it because they're going to have to wait longer to get a cheaper phone And that's probably good business, but I don't have to like it. I think that the mentality that you are describing for yourself is exactly why they're doing it Yeah because there's an awful lot of people who are like, I could buy a pro, but I think they the non pro is a better value for me and I kind of like it. and I like, you know, mean camera smaller. Maybe they should have been doing that all along, honestly. Right. And then they could it did, right? becausecause the SEs and the Es all came out though. I mean, so they were doing it with that very bottom of the lineup, but they weren't doing it a step up. and so they're Fixing that mistake now, I guess. And so these come out and then you're like, ah, and then there's like this dopamine craving part of your brain that is like right. Hey, hey, September isn't this I in the prices that they're gonna be at there, it's not gonna to be a question for me. I'm just gonna be like, no, I don't need that I don't know, but it's obviously and It's just obviously going to be a a major part of what people are talking about when they come out, right? And And it would have been anyway, even without the the RAM and SSD crisis and this this unprecedented industry situation It would have been anyway with the folding phone costing two thousand dollars or more with all of the other folding phones cost But Apple would be the first ones to say we're not like these other companies. So It is commensurate with what all the other folding screens cost. and presumably Apple's is the nicest folding screen It's like even so even if this wasn't happening, whatever the starting price of the folding iPhone was going to be is what people would be talking about, right? And some percentage of the day one Mainstream news headlines are going to be Apple announced new iPhones and one of them cost two thousand dollars, right We can we can laugh, we can roll our eyes, but that is what people care about, right? And it is eye catching. and now that whatever that number is, it's going to be twenty to twenty five percent higher prob And with the you know, it's like, well, but they also announced iPhone eighteen pros and they don't fold therere the normal shape and the price didn't go up at all That would have been a better story. then And their prices went up a lot too I don't know what they can do about it though. And I don't think they're happy. Ben Thompson has emphasized this and done the math on it that If you hold for inflation, They've actually lowered the price of top tier iPhones over in recent years. It's actually in terms of if you inflation adjust the dollars. iPhones, including iPhone pros have come down in price over the years. E though famously inflation has been a global phenomenon for the last five years That's true and that has been great, but that's the sort of thing human psychology doesn't notice, right? That price that you're used to has stayed the same and inflation adjusted, it's actually a better value. It's like cognitively, even if you understand that sentence, you can say, oh, that is interesting and I'm kind of happy about that. It doesn't really hit you emotionally But when you When your new iPhone costs twenty five percent more than the last one you paid for two years ago That hits you in an emotional way. and the fact that you've saved some money on inflation adjusted dollars to five years before doesn't really assuage the burn, right? It's not that much of a save I could just see Tim saying to turnist Good luck. It does make for an interesting first keynote, right? Yeah You also I mean, you also wrote recently about It not seeming like Tim is really going to be putting his feet up after this. No, I don't think so after ye. I don't think that that's a reason for the transition. I don't think that the escalating number of global government diplomatic. tasks that Apple's CEO has or somebody at Apples has to take care of I do think it's higher than it ever was. I don't think it's going down anytime soon. I don't think that Tim Cook was like I have so much to do globally that I kind of need to step aside as CEO and become executive chairman and take care of this. But I do think it contributed to the timing. I might as well do it now because my plate's still going to be full Har, let me take a break and we can continue on that because I thought that was an interesting Side note. 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Go to evenrealities. com and remember that promo code, talk show. to save ten percent off the R one ring or the even clip when you add them to your order Thanks to Even Realities for sponsoring the show One of the other little things, the thing that prompted your comment before the sponsor break there about Tim Cook and his global responsibilities or whatever they however Apple phrased it What was the the word u I forgget dealing with the dictators around the world. Was that what Apple said No, I don't think that was the way they put it. I think that maybe they should have assist with certain aspects of the company, including engaging with policymakers around the world around the world. pololicymakers around the world. Yeah. The idea here is that There are two Chinese companies and I have to admit, I have never heard of either of them before Why am TC And XMTP? I think it' the CXMT. CXMT. I don't know. Both of them CXMT or YMTCO. They both seem like a really shitty draw in scrabble. is I'm going I'm going to go with the X, I think. I think the X is Yeah, X more point. Yeah. I think the X is more points than the y Yeah, at least some points, but both of them pretty light on the vowels. But the gist of it is I'd never heard of them before just as I understand it, this seems kind of complex, but these are two companies, they're Chinese companies both apparently affiliated with the government in China and the military and the government is subsidizing them and they both make rams. And the government is subsidizing them to a significant degree to make them competitive on a global stage And governments outside China around the world have sort of cast a stink eye on buying RAM components from them because it would disadvantage the non subsidized actually trying to run a business where the revenue cost of goods revenue minus cost of goods equals profit runs the business And that if China if two Chinese state run companies grew to a dominant position in the RAM market worldwide, then China would have control over the RAM market and Geopolitically, this is a bad idea for China to have control over an important market, which we've seen with things like the rare earth minerals of that China has and I Geographic good fortune and government control has led them to a dominant position in these rare earth materials there increasing importance to various devices being made around the world And apparently, I didn't remember this controversy or didn't even notice it in twenty twenty two, but Apple had apparently floated buying RAM from one of these companies in twenty twenty two. onlyn for use in phones for the Chinese market that they would continue that phones for the rest of the world would continue sourcing from the regular non Chinese RM manufacturers. that Apple previously bought from. And then for the phones in China, some or all of them would use RAM from these Chinese companies And It did not go over well. And Apple was just like, never mind, forget it. Bipartisan, right? And it is very rare these days for anything to be b partartisan. I mean, really But Marco Rubio and Mark Warner, who Rubio, of course, was then a Republican senator from Florida. Now he's the seecretary of state And it more, right? he's also, I forget what else he is. What else is he? Oh yeah, I forget what else he is I mean, it's hard to keep track. Some kind of national security director or something or no that was well else' something else he's not qualified to do.. Yes, but more than one other thing he's not qualified to do Something else that he's not qualified to do, but also more qualified than anybody else in the Trump administration. Right true, right? It's the truth of it. Yeah. It is both things can be true that he's absolutely unqualified for any of his current jobs. Yeah. and's also better him than somebody than the next guy Right the most qualified, most informed, most honest person in the Trump administration Both things can be true But he's in a more influential position now than he was in twenty twenty two as a senator from Florida, but also Senator Mark Warner, a Democrat from Virginia wrote a letter just to say this would be a bad idea Their letter, I guess use more words than that, but more or less is a bad idea Is the idea that it's a bad idea simply because we don't want China to control the market O is it or is there some sort of implication that there is going to be spyware and RAM they didn't say I don't that's a great question, John. because I thought that too and I'm glad you brought it up. And I don't know. And I kind of Googled and I didn't I didn't see anybody speculating about that And I don't it seems harder. I mean, bring up the big hack, right? I I think the idea behind that wasn't there like an extra piece of equipment in those wasn't supppposedly there was an extra piece of equipment that was doing some sort of spyware? But it was on was whole The idea of the big hack was that it was a whole on a whole motherboard, there was a secret chip Yeah phone home and I don't really it seemsart. I mean, I first I don't I'm not nearly technical enough to make this assessment, but it seems hard with RAM do something. I don't I don't know. I don't think it's possible. And I'm going from and this is the thing where I do feel old two system of architecture courses I took getting my computer science degree in the mid nineteen nineties two more than me s But RM really is just memory. It really is just ast As fast as possible access to It seems like at the very least you'd have to have something else controlling the registers or something. mean Yeah, I don't because the software that you're running is There's just no place, right? Like if there was something funny in the RAM, it would have no way of communicating out, right? It' really I don't I actually don't think it's possible I think it's really just about not giving them any kind of position because their thumbs on this scale, because the government wants them to have a prominent position in the RAM market. You know, you could see it now, right? The previous foray of Apple like, Hey, how about we buy Chinese RAM for Chinese iPhones was four years ago And Here we are four years later and China thinking, hey, RAM is going to is already important and is always going to be important and maybe will become more important was correct Right RAM is one of those things. there are certain businesses that are just like, o, that's a good business to be in because nobody's ever gonna get tired of that, right? Like Maybe you'll gain competitors and you'll have to compete but, you know, if you run a restaurant, people are always gonna need to eat, right? Ram There's no it's never gonna to f Itounds like people are eating more, right with ra R. Right. Exactly. It's like everybody is It's like the opposite of the GLP one drugs. Everybody is taking drugs to get fat. I don't know. Everybody's, you know, put on more muscle. Let's say let's say it goes right to muscle about that. Exactly. Everybody's trying to build protein. Yeah I don't think it's a security thing. And if it were I feel like there'd be more of a political debate over the fact that so many devices are made in China Right, Right?ike I would think so too, right? I mean, it seems like if the if the government could exert that kind of control and do that they would be doing it already regardless of whether or not they are financially invested in the company Although I do think in hindsight, like if somebody could have foreseen like the whole plot of the Apple in China book by what's his name McGe? If somebody could have seen what Apple's partnership with Foxcon and hey, how about we start building these devices in China and seen how it would go And the gist of Apple in China is that as much as Making these iPhones and everything else in China allowed Apple to grow to the enormous size that it has and produce iPhones the nearly unfathomable scale that they do. Like it really is just unbelievable that they make however many iPhones they sell a year, it's just this unfathomable number, right? Remember when The tariffs came in a year ago and I Napkin math on Well, they're sending six seven hundred and forty seven s full of iPhones out of India ahead of the terriffist How many iPhones is that And it's like this fun job interview question. Oh, how many iPhones fit in a freight seven hundred forty seven And it's this ungodly number of iPhones. And then you're like, oh my God, that's amazing. How many six airplanes full iPhones. my Godd. And then you're like Well, if they're shipping them all to the US, how many weeks of stock is that? And it was like two weeks Yeah And it's like, oh, Itill a lot. Yeah, I mean, it's Yeah. It's so they'd be shipping most of those iPhones over here anyway. They just kind of needed to get a couple extra planes in the air before midnight to beat a tariff. It's just unbelievable. How if it weren't for China, I think that's one of the themes of the book. They wouldn't be able to sell as many iPhones as they do because they literally would not have been able to make as many as they do And therefore the price of iPhones would be higher because the supply would be lower, but demand globally would be the same possible that Apple would be just as profitable, probablyroably not But it might be close, but it would be by buying more expensive fewer people buying more expensive iPhones around the world which might be exactly where we're back to with the price increases. But then I think if you could play that future out, I think national security hawks in the Senate and and just national security apparatus would say, this is a bad idea and geopolitically because it's going to embolden China. And that's sort of the main theme of the book, Apple and China was that however much it benefited Apple, the partnership with Apple benefited China as a whole more than Apple. So I think That lesson has been learned and The idea that China is going to expand into RAM is something that they're trying to keep from happening in the first place And same thing with AI, right? that they're the same reason dating back to the Biden administration that they've been trying to limit the, you know, the sales of high end NVidA hardware to China them try to keep them behind in AI. And they obviously can't keep the hardware out of their hands, but make it black market only M And by making it black market only, it's more expensive and it's they can't get as much of it as they could otherwise, like any black market could And I think that's how they're looking at the RM market But it is interesting to Yeah, it's it' be interesting to see if Tim Cook has greased the wheels. I mean, enough to get a different answer this time Right because you know, even though he's only going to grease one wheel, right Exactly, right. And it's however much Marco Rubio still may feel the same way he did in twenty twenty two and may be in a bigger position of influence. if Trump tells him to wear shoes that don't fit, guess what he wears? I mean, that's true. I you know I'm not making that up Yeah. No, I know. know Trump got ono a thing where he was bought four shimes or something. There's a certain kind of shoe and a couple months ago, he started buying them and he's like, I full cabinets wearing shoes that don't fit. Because not only does he think every man in the cabinet should be wearing the same pair of black shiny patent leather shoes He also thinks honest to God, if you're out there listening, Trump thinks that he has a gift like a carnival barker like guess Like you go up and it's like, guess your age guess your age within two years or you win a prize. He thinks he can guess your shoe size Right. And so he's like, you don't have the shoes. You look like a size twelve and Marco Ruby is like a size seven. I mean, there's pictures of them. Yeah. he looks like a little kid wearing his dad's shoes. But he he warore them to work So you know, again, Trump says, hey, Apple can buy RAM from North Korea. Rubio is gonna to be like Sure thing, boss, right? He might say Privately. Are you sure? Maybe they's a bad idea? And Trump says, shut up, Low Marco. and then yeah Next thing you know, Apple' buying North Korean Ram You don't hear that much about North Korea You know what That's certainly not North Korean RAM, that's for sure. I think there's a problem I think that's I think it's probably frustrating to Kim Jong Because when like Joe Biden was president or like when Barack Obama was president Or like when George W. Bush was president. It's not really a partisan thing It's like a sane or insane thing When a sane man was president of the United States, then Kim Jong un had the role of the mad manan crazy madman who's in charge of the most worrisome military When that title goes to somebody else, nobody pays attention Didn't they have like a back and forth during this first administration though Oh, yeah, yeah. He went over and visited him and walked over and shook his hand and and he's telling people he sent him Trump has a framed letter from him that he says he really, you know, was the whole thing He's very impressed by how much Kim Jong un likes him I mean sometimes it impresses him I sometimes I wonder John if I died and it's just having a fever dream It's lashin eight years you'd really be waking up. Yeah. I don't know Mhm Yeah, I don't know. I guess that it does raise the question of why aren't there more companies that make RAM And it seems like the answer is This is one of those things where it's you got to be really it's, you know, the only rM worth buying is sort of cutting edge RAM and it's really hard and the margins are often very narrow and it's a market that goes up and down Well the thing with the Micron CEO who was throwing some shade at Tim Cook It was just three years ago, they had negative they were losing money. They were negative margins and Now Micron, the company that The American company that sells most of the I guess they're the biggest American rAM. manufacturer The last quarter, they had eighty percent profit margins and now he's he's riding high on the hog and throwing some shade at apple for not throwing a bone to them when times were tough three years ago. But I guess it's super capital expensive to these factories. You know, it's like, why is TSMC the only company in the world that can make the leading edge CPU manufacturing processes, right. There's one where it's all the way down to one company. And the one company is in a geopolitical, not great Part of the world, Taiwan. I guess RAM is just similar. I don't know. it's just bananas. It just it's Yeah I don't know I'm just used to an entire lifetime of thinking, boy RAM is expensive. And all of a sudden it's like I look back at the forty years in my life and I think, ah, RAM used to be cheap. Yeah, I mean, people have been joking about bringing back RamDoubler. And disk doubler two with the SS Yeah, sure. why not? you, why not both A Do you ever have ever run those things back in the day I I don't think I I definitely ran RamDouller for sure. I don't think I ever ran disk doubler though Well, I ran this douler. That was Oh, that was Th those were the days. They were system extensions. I guess I'll put them in the show notes And they I guess they used L Gzip style compression instead of compressing files on disk, they RAM doubler would compress your RAM. And so it's and again, you could write back in the day, a system extension on Classic MacOS could pretty much do anything, right? It could just patch anything And they patched all calls to the memory manager so that they went through the extension first and they compressed Everything in RAM. and decompressed it when you called it and it worked. I remember Reading about it and thinking this is a bad idea and then I got my pirated copies of it and installed it And Son of a bitch it worked, right? And it was like, I guess it's a little slower, but it was nowhere near as much slower as I expected it to be. because what I remembered at the time is that when you'd click on a stuff it archive, what was the other one called? Compact Pro. Oh man, remember that? We had That one I don't even remember now CPT was the extension compact Pro. I mean, that was a stub I was stuff it Yeah. No stuff it to the core. There was a there was a there was a rivalry, compompact Pro versus Stuff it. But when you double click when compompact proro wasn't wasn't really stpping up in that rivalry R right, we didn't use Zip on the Mac because Zip didn't take care of the resource forks or the Mac metadata. So we had our own everything, we had our own floppy formats, we had our own compression. But you would double click a stuff at archive and it would take a while to decompress, right? youd just sit there and watch. And I thought, well, is every single call to RAM gonna be like this Ay Every single thing I do is going to I'm going to have to wait a couple of minutes here It wasn't like that. And then disk doubler was the insane one. Disk doubler, I believe because it was like withith a Ram doubler If you didn't like it, you could just restart, take the extension out and now you' don't have Ram doules This dbbler actually reladed the entire Yeah that's I think And I think that's why I didn't use it I did because I was an idiot compleomplete idiot with a forty megabyte I almost said gigabyte, forty megabyte hard disk. Oh was constantly thirty nine points eight Mgabytes consumed and And I had no way to back it up completely because if I had had A second forty megabyte disk, I would have instantly filled it up with new stuff, not used it to back up the original So I in college just through caution to the wind. installed this doubler and it worked. It gave me It didn't give me eighty. It gave me like, I don't know, seventy five megabytes effectively. Yeah. but close enough that I didn't feel like I didn't feel like I got ripped off by pirating the software than by I was went into trouble to firate the software I did not feel ripped off by the effort I put into. not paying for the commercial utility disk doubler But it worked. and I don't remember ever regretting it. Yeah. And I looking at at the like I was trying to remember what the years were that these So version one of RAam Doubler came out in January of nineteen ninety four That sounds about right day They went through. Yeah. I mean, it obviously only worked 'ate Classic Mac OS, so. Yeah. Oh yeah. That was I use those things Well bring them back I don't think you I don't think you'd do it anymore. No, I hope not. You can do it with Chinese Ram, which you can't do with any other way. Yeah. Exactly. Or maybe North Korean The North Korean one would be great because then you did all the RAM and then it would it would pop up like a your RAM needs a Wi Fi connection Please he's kind Oh, that's unusual. My RAM needs a Wiifi connection That's where you have to start wondering. Maybe there's something whyy does your TV need one honestly? Right Exactly. I mean, I know why. I know why it wants one, but why does it need one All right, let me take one last break here and thank our good friends at Squarespace Oh man, Squarespace. they keep sponsoring the show mayaybe you think Why does Squarespace sponsor either every or seemingly every episode of the talk show? 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The only difference is that you, the logged in admin have the ability to move stuff and change stuff and the visitors just see it as a non editable website, but it's all Whizzywig. what you see is exactly what your visitors get They've got all sorts of other built in stuff, everything you can imagine. They take payments with all the payment stuff that you want, Apple pay pay and installment features from various services credit cards. if you sell time or resources, if you are like a consultant or a trainer or something like that. You can do all of that through your Squarespace website, send invoices to your clients and have your clients pay the invoices on your website through Squarespace payment stuff None of that stuff has to come from a third party. It's all built into the platform. If you sell stuff like t shirts or stickers or anything like that and you just sell little things. you could do all of that through Squarespace. you could just build an entire store All of it right there built into the same platform Think about it. if you have any kind of idea for a website, this is where you should go to build it. It is the easiest way to do it They've got great analytics, great CMS for creating updates to your website. Go to squarespace d. com slash talk show Squarespace com slash talk show. to find out more And when you use that code talk show, you get ten percent off your first purchase, which can be for an entire year at once, pay for an entire year all up front at squarespace d. com slash Talk show What else has been going on lately, John? What else do we have to talk about How about your reactions to Golden Gate running on your spare Mac I like it better than Tahoe. How about that That's a low bar. right. I know. I'm still running, you know, like sort of implied I'm still running Squoia on this macook gira that I'm using right now, which is little the device that I use most of the time And we'll probably skip Tahoe completely to go to Golden Gate simply because I think it's easier on the eyes. It's still not Perfect, at least I mean, it's still I mean, obviously it's still data, but there's still things that it does that I don't visually that I don't love I don't understand why the scroll bars are so much darker and there's still instances where they touch the edge of the window that drive me crazy. I'm not going to put it on my main Mac that's out of beta. I mean, I've got it on my phone. I've got IOS twenty seven on my main phone th already though. It is a little buggy, but not in any ways that have really made me regret it at all I do think battery life is a little worse, but I think battery life has been so good with an iPhone seventeen Pro that I don't care. But on the Mac, it's Visually so much better. It just it's like, o, I could live with this. I don't love all the changes I do Overall still like the way MacOS eight or fifteen seequoia looks overall The way that Golden Gate looks already, if they don't tweak anything further, it's like, oh, I could live with this at least. The thing with To, I literally just I would have been miserable every day. I'm never deffinitely I'm just skipping the whole year. I love it. And do you attribute that to simply just being an old? No I person No, I don't. I really don't. Because there've been so many other changes over the years where that instinct kicks in every couple years, it's, I don't like that Come on ye. the I think it was two full years of MacOS where Helvetica was the system font It was like IOa seven came out on the iPhone and only the iPhone. And then the next year it came out for the iPad. And I think two years later, they did like a Iowa seven style refresh for the Mac. Maybe it was one year after Iowa seven. I forget if it was one or two But like at least a year or two later, they did a refresh of the MacOS interface that was clearly aligned with IOS seven visually and changed the system font to Helvetica. because San Francisco wasn't ready yet. I mean, and in hindsight, I know I actually know for a fact that they San Francisco was in development at Apple. The first platform where it debuted was Apple Watch I don't I just when and I like Halvetica as a font. I just don't like it as the system font. I don't like it in I didn't like it in the menu bar. you know, I didn't I didn't like it, but it didn't keep me from using it. It was just like, o, I don't like that. but I'm a big boy. And even if it feels like overall, it's not two steps forward, one step back. if it feels like two steps forward and two steps back, it's like I can live with that, right? because it's at least even It's with Tahoe. it's no steps forward and seventeen steps back. Every single thing about Tahoe that's different visually from Sequoia, I think is worse. Everything. There's not one single visual aspect of MacOS Tahoe's user interface that I think, oh, well, there's that one thing that's actually kind of nice. I kind of miss it. not one thing. Everything is worse. Yeah. The only reasons that I have considered upgrading are simply for software compliance reasons, but I hope managed to dodge those to date. I know that the new version, I think it's still in beta of transmit from panic is Tahoe only Net newewswire was Tah the Net Newswire seven was Tahoe only My friend friend Lex Friedman released this app Gnome, which is a great little utility for finding managing your gifts. He originally just released it for for Taho and and managed to talk him into getting us a bespoke. I mean, I think it I think the whole thing works on Sequoia now, but that was a that was based on I think based on my request And what what's his fellow's name Lx Friedman Lx free Yeah He sounds like an interesting guy. There was a guy He is an interesting guy, notot the other one. not the not not the Lex. Oh, no, not that one. No, no. not that guy. No. It's you know what? this is actually two for two. Snell brought him up last episode talking about when Lex was at Mac World Back of the day, that The voicemails he used to leave. for Apple PR And they would answer his calls and even leave like these five minute voicemail messages, which really did not make them want to answer his phone calls And then Snell brought it up, told the story and it was very funny. And then I got a text message from Trudy Miller at Apple PR after she listened to the episode and said Lex is she said, I liked Lex. But his voicemails were very long And I wrote back to it said, you know, if you still have them, they would make for a good podcast They would Yeah fifteen year old voicemails to Apple PR from Lex Friedman No, I shouldn't even joke. I' actually I know that it runs on Sequia is his GIF app gnome. because I've been running him ragged Literally with feature requests. Yeah. he's mentioned that Yeah, Ive I've because I'm enamored with the ab But I had a whole bunch of requests and It funny mean, we were just talking about it, we were talking about it on the rebound and he And he'll say he'll, you know talk about his AI uses. but we were talking about it rebound in the morning and in the late afternoon he had a version out for Danyamy It really is very interesting existence proof of the utility of AI coding. Same thing with the whole episode I did with Adam Lissigore talking about his MacA hovercraft and Adam was super smart, clever guy but not a developer at all, let alone a Mac developer. and he made a Mac app that is really, really interesting and does to me, something that seems very complex acting as a virtual camera. And that's Adam a very smart guy. And then Lex, you know, who's not a very smart guy he will able to make I'm amazed I like I am amazed by him. I mean like he is a Renaissance man. He does He does everything It's me shame I do nothing. No, but at one point I just felt like, hey, this might be exciting to Lex that. I'm obviously using Gnome and I'm full I've got a bunch of ideas and I'm sending them to him and mayaybe he would like the idea that I'm using the app and have ideas. and he seem to agree that these are good ideas But then the amazing part is he wasn't saying like, okay, I'll, you know, I'll look into that or I'll think about that. It was like two hours later, he's like, there's a beta that does it. Yeah, you know Yeah And I have to admit in all and it is, it is one of my favorite parts of where I am career wise and the life I've been able to make for myself is that when I was young, I thought, wouldn't it be great to know the developers of all of most of at least most of my favorite apps. and if I knew them then I could Convince them. And wouldn't it be great if I had an influential website where maybe maybe my requests would carry an unfair amount of weight And I could convince the people who make the apps that I use and love. implement features that come to my mind And I thought that would be great. Well, that is sort of how I live my life, you know, and it's I don't want to brag, but I think I have a good hit ratio of feature requests and feature requests getting implemented You werere talking abouteiling RMoubler I can remember I know I'm sure I have the floppy back here, but like the first time I got Photoshop, I just walked into the computer lab at school with a floppy disk, stuck it in the thing and dragged Photoshop onto the disk because you could do that back then. and walked off with it. And now we know several people who are or have been working on the phhotoshop. Photoshop. Right I know people who work on Photoshop or have worked on Photoshop It is very odd. Right. And the they're like, that's what you used to do this pirate software and it's a yes. and the that was that easy. copy protection such that it was was that when you registered the copy, if you bought legit bought the fresh copy and then you launched it, it would ask for a serial number and and a name And I guess And again, anything went back in those days the app would write that information into its own resource fork somewhere Yeah. So that when you'd copy like a Drexel University licensed copy of Photoshop And then you'd launch it at home if you went to about Photoshop It would say licensed to Drexle University, whatever lab Well, yeah Did I care? I don't care. sa Fred Flintstone in there. You got it off the computer. it was fine. You couldn't install it from the floppies, but you could take it away from the computer But I Honestly, it is there is a weird. So it's not just that people like Lex and Adam are making really clever cool apps and they are people who prereviously did not make clever cool apps But they're making cool apps and they're making adding new features at to me at a crazy pace. like all these years literally at this point, it seems crazy to say, but decades that I've known very talented developers who make softwareies I've never. I mean, when I worked at Barebone software, I was in the office with Rich Siegel I didn't get changes made as quickly as I do now. It just by sending them to Lex on iMessage and then all of a sudden later in the same day, he's got a build that does it. It's like ye Crazy, but it's a very cool app gnome You know what, my least favorite change is from Tahoe and it is either exactly the same or almost exactly the same in Golden Gate. and I'm very sad that they didn't fix it is I hate the way highlighted menus look File Eedit view Like when you click the file menu highlight over the word file, not the menu that drops down, but the highlight on the menu. I hate now that it's not like a rectangle with round corners, it's like a pill And it is it's just sort of a light shade I think that the menu should look like a tab Right? It should be and it should be connected to the menu underneath. It's sort of a classic look to the menu and that you could draw and if you drew like a SF symbol of a menu from the menu bar dropping down you would have a very strongly highlighted menu title. And then it as a tab at the upper left corner And then the rectangular menu underneath The Tahoe look for this. It' just every single time I click a menu in Tahoe or now Wen Gate. I agree. Every time it breaks my heart because it just it just should look cool. It doesn't look cool at all. It looks like they're embarrassed, right? And I've always you laugh, but I honestly think that that was sort of part of the wrong direction that Mac UI has gone for ten years at Apple has been there's a contingent of designers or interface thinkers within Apple So didn't like the menu bar, right? They're like, oh, we should make it hide automatically or we should make it smaller. We should make it clear. We should de emphasize it more put do everything every nobody goes in a menu bar anyway and it's like, well, nobody goes in a menu bar if you make it look visually less prominent, right? below these many years later it is one of the it it is an idea that is literally the con basic concept is unchanged from nineteen eighty four, like the original Mac But it is a great way to organize a complete hierarchy of everything the app does By having a reasonably limited number of menus that can fit in a menu bar And you have to give them a title. It forces the developer to sort of organize them into I don't know. what's the most menus an app can have reasonably mayaybe nine or ten, but for the most most apps have five, six, seven menus Some of them are standard and everybody knows what to expect in the file and edit and probably a view menus The window menu is pretty standard across all apps. You kind of know which stuff goes there And so you end up with this consistency across all Mac apps for so many things. like how do you print? Oh, you go up to file print, right? You know where it is. How do you change the toolbar, right? You go to view customize toolbar and then can customize the toolbar in your Mac app It's such a great organizing feature and it seemed like Apple was de emphasizing it. And I kind of get it for some users that a certain level of basic functionality should be in the main menu They lost the balance of Hey, everything could be a control in the in the windows and you don't need to worry about the menus. And it's like, no, the menus where an app can be rich and full and have a bunch of features that are more esoteric but important to some number of people And I also think it should look cool. I don't know, and I don't think it looks cool any. I think that's sad. It just see, I mean, it's part of the whole they seem to be like trying to make any number of interface elements. Hidden And it's not like we really need to screen real estate anymore. It just seems like it's in order to make it more like the phone. Yeah. And I don't think that's a That worthy as worthy of goal as they seem to think it is. I'll say that Have you been using IOS twenty seven at all? just a little bit. I have it on my thirteen mini. How's it run? notot that much But have I have played around with a little bit I mean it doesn't seem it seems obviously much less different than Taho does. I don't even know. Does it get Apple intntelligence? Seri AI U It does well the thirteen mini, it certainly doesn't get the enhanced stuff like the voices, right? And I'm still wa the last time I looked I was still waitlisted. so Oh, really. I will say that I know that and I don't I still don't think Apple's documented it anywhere, but I did it since the last episode of this show. Last time I talked to Jason. rununning IOS twenty seven on a spare phone, but my main iPhone was still on iPhone or IOS twenty six But I upgraded both the other one, the main one to twenty seven because it'spple the Siri AI is so good, so useful. I don't care what other bugs there are. I'll use it all summer at this point. So starting with beta two I'm running it, but I had done the thing where I upgraded it to the developer beta of IOS twenty six point six Because they said that if you do that, it'll it'll do the indexing the pre indexing. Yeah, right? Yeah And it totally true. So when I I had upgraded to twenty six point six like WDC or before WWDC? I don't know. It hadd been on twenty six point six for a while. When I upgraded My spare phone to Iowa is twenty seven It took a full week, I think from Monday, literally till Sunday for the indexing to finish. It took six or seven days. With the my main phone, which if anything, had more has more stuff stored on it, it was instant. As soon as I as soon as it finished installing IOS twenty seven, SiriAI was ready to go fully indexed. That's cool. So and you don't even have to do a beta. if you're waiting like a sane person for the real version of ViOS twenty seven in September twenty six point six will surely be out any day now, right? probablyrobably I don't know, either by the end of this month or early in July. And you could just never, never put a beta on your phone And by the time IOS twenty seven rolls out, you'll never the indexing thing will be a problem that only those of us who installed developer betas in June ever had to worry about. suuper, super cool. And I just continued to be amazed at the little things that SiriAI can pick up Just you know, and again, it's like, oh, of course, an AI can do that. but it's like that's a cool thing. Do you remember there was a kickstarter project last year for a book called Go compomputer Now, I think is the name of the book But a guy named Ben Zotto wrote it and it was about a computer company I'd never heard of before, the Shere computer compomany from like the early days of the PC industry, like nineteen eighty And I linked to hisstarter.ember now that you said, Yeahah, okay. Yeah So I'll put it in show notes. But you can go to if you're just listening, go compputer now d. com is the name of his website And I linked to his kickstarter and I bought the book and it's delightful and it's everything you'd want. For all I know Glen Fleisman helped him. I bet he did en. Glen helps anybody making a book and anybody doing a kickstarter But anyway, this guy who wrote the book, Ben Zotto, he had emailed me over the years. He had like an iPhone app years ago. I think he sponsored an episode of the show in twenty thirteen or something. But he there was another tier of the Kickstarter where you got like coffee mugs. and I guess he had extras. I didn't spring for that one, but he sent me a coffee mug And a very nice little paper letter on paper, thanking me for having linked to his kickstarter and that when I linked to it, it goosed the sales significantly. And he sent me a nice little mug and it was a delightful little gift to get in the mail. I was very pleased this punch. But you know, I wanted to write back to him, but I had it was a paper letter. So I scanned it, put it in Apple Notes as a scan And then asked a question It was like he said why the mug was green. And I was like, hey, Siri, why was the Go compputer now mug Green. And it's it like bl, bloo, bloop, bloop,oo, bloop. And then it said it was to match the PCB board color of the sphere computer which was from the letter It was in the printed letter he sent me. It answered the question from something I had scanned and put into Apple Notes. It wasasn't even in text and you know then sent Ben a lovely That's pretty cool.. I said love I don't know. His letter to me was lovely. I sent him like two Thank you. Coffee. and I got a picture of me drinking coffee out of the mug, It was coffee good. I don't know It was a very nice thing. But you can ask you if you have like scans of things in your Apple notes, you can ask questions about what's in the scans and it freaking knows. It's amazing. It's absolutely incredible I just continue to be impressed by it. I more like this from Ms. That's probably am I like I keep a note. I have a note that's called Where the fuck is it Yeah, ye. And so I just put in like things that I'm putting away and think I'll want this six months from now and I will not have any idea where I put it. So I jot it down in an Apple Note and that's probably perfect for like I could just say, hey, where is where is this thing I swear to God. it's going to work. It is it is The most game changing thing that's happening to these computers I can remember. and it's and I cannot I can already see it. Here it is. It's not even the end of June yet and I'm already taking it for granted The only thing Yeah this is the problem with installing a beta on a device that you're not using on a regular basis. R It's like, well, that' thatad. Immediacy And Ive promised I don't know. I wouldn't be surprised if I do get stupid and just install the beta of Golden Gate on my main M one Mac MacBook proro I talked about earlier on the show. By the end of summer because I'm already running into situations where I want to ask questions of the new Siri AI but I'm working. I'm on that computer and that's still running sequoia. And so I'm like literally using pulling my iPhone out of my pocket to do things and I'm like, o, I can't wait u til I have this on my Mac And then that that young that part of my brain that installed disc doubler without any backup There you go. Be that guy that rewrote in a in a nonreversible way, the entire format of My hard drive with no backg Yeah. Yeah. That part of my b can't be that bad canan't be that bad. That's But that's what the part of the braid was like It was like, hey, you did that back in the nineties Right Why don't you install Golden Gate now thenen you could ask S AI on every computer I wasn't even backing things up back then either too. It's like you could't It was too f. There was no way to do it. Yeah. Right It's like you dragging some important files onto a zip disk, but that was about it Yeah, I remember when I first was able to because Adam Engst was always at tidbits was always sort of the eat your veggies, take your vitamin sort of writer in the Mac world who talking about backups And it used to be, I forget the companies, but there was a software and then you could buy these tapes. Remember you'd buy like little Oh yeah because disks there weret the idea of backing up to diss, it wasn't just discks were too insanely expensive. We had those at work. I never I never had a tape system at home I I wound up buying one and it was such a pain in the ass that I never used the goddamn thing Yeah. I was like I just it was just money pissed away down the drain because I was like, I'm not doing this. This is this is too big of a pain in the ass No, I didn't back up. It gave us as irresponsible as it is today to back up. It wasn't so irresponsible then because There was it just was impossible financially. And like I said, if even if I could have afforded another forty megabyte hard disk. I would have filled it up with new stuff. The idea of buying spending what would have been the unfathomable expense of a spare forty megabytte hard drive And then using it just to duplicate the one in my computer I mean, Id see the senseive. I mean, we may be getting to the point where it's going to become too expensive again. Right. And meanwhile I mean, I was like a MC nerd and then for a couple of years fresh out of college, I was doing like I was like working for a service here in Philadelphia where I forget it was a MAC specialists, MAac something like that. but it was like you could it was like a temp type job where, you know, but I could it was like twenty five bucks an hour or something where you could like someomebody some design firm has a Mac that won't boot And they don't have anybody who knows how to fix it called Max specialists and they had nerds like me that they'd called say, can you go there tomorrow morning and fix their computer And I would go and fix their computer. I knew I I knew all the things, all the keyboard shortcuts I knew I'd bring a spare disk with utilities on it that could fix stuff I had so many friends all over the nineties and they'd be like, oh, my Mac won't boot. And then it was like, oh, your hard disk is corrupt You've lost everything Yeah it just that happen that would just happen all the time Yeah. And in the meantime I had no backups and I was like, well, it won't happen to me And it didn't happen to me. So you know, what lesson did I learn? None, of course, but I forget what those damn tapes were called. They were such a pain in the ass. It was impossible. I mean, ye, its just It just was that, right? Oere that? Yeah. something like that And I retrospect is just the music software. Remember now. Yeah. Retrospect was the software Yeah Yeah. yeep Terrible. It was horrible I mean, it served a good purpose and I'm sure people who actually did use it and then did have a corrupt hard drive were happy that they did it. I was like, I just can't be bothered. I don't know It's just it's It's a long time ago, but Anyway, I guess that's a show. Good talking show. Yeah. good talk. Anything you Hey, how about this? anything you're watching on TV you'd to recommend Oh, Boy Do you like scary shows Sort of. There's this show called From, which I had never heard of until a month or two ago And I'm only three episodes in because I don't really like scary stuff, but I like the show. I think it's really well made. I mean, you know, the first three episodes are really well made and I've heard good things about it. and but it was just weird to me, but like, here's the show that's just finishing its fourth season I think and it's I mean, the reason it's on MGM. so that's the reason why no one's ever heard of it. It's It's a spooky show. It's definite scary, but I think it's pretty it's pretty good. It's a little bit like lost in a way Yeah. ye. I bet hope bad for you. I watched that show. did you I enjoyed the entirety of season one as much as it seems like you are And then came season two No Okay. Well and we'll see if I make it anyway, but I do think My wife and I think Amy and I watched season two to its end, but I've Let's just say that I did not realize there was a season three or four Yeah. there's and I think it's been renewed for a final season five. But I did enjoy season one. Yeah. o. Okay. I thought you were going to suggest a show that we started watching last night Widows Bay Widows Bay is terrific on Al. Widows Bay is a little scary but I it's not scary it's not scary, like from, I don't think And it's also just hilarious That's what I heard is that it is kind of spooky and kind of funny and kind of Pulls both off. And yeah. Two episodes in All three of us, me, Amy and Jonas agreed that it was excellent and we really liked it and can't wait to watch more. And does the cool thing that I think a lot of Apple TV shows do which is episodes are like often thirty five, thirty six minutes, which is like Hey, that's it's actually it doesn't make any sense in the old days of terrestrial TV where the show had to be right half an hour with commercials or an hour with commercials It's like this no man's land, but it's actually a really good episode leng Yeah, it's just enough, right? Yeah Yeah. Yeah, really be without being too like. there's no filler. it's all new Two episodes in, I thought it was pretty scary, very funny, and I love the way it looks. It has like a a sort of film look to it But without looking gimmicky like it's trying to look like it's twenty or thirty years old, but it does it just sort of doesn't look digitally shot or Christine. It's like, I don't know, noise in the rarain or back. And they make it seem old by a simple explanation that there's no cellular service on Yeah on the island. Yes. right It's as easy as it's as easy as that. There's just like there's no cell service on it so nobody carries a cell phone It works. I don't know. I really like it. And I can see why people have raved about it on Apple TV and it's it's just, I don't know and already two episodes, just two episodes in. And I can tell that there's going to be more new cast members to come because it's like a whole genre? It probably, I don't know, going back to at least two What was the great David Lynch show, C can't believe I'm forgetting the name. Twin Paks. rightight. Yeah. It's sort of a twin Peaksy sort of Yeah. Oh, it's town full of everybody's crazy in this town. Weirdos. Yeah, they're all delightful weirdos. Yeah. Right. Everybody is a delightful weirdo And oh, they're going k just we're just going to meet new weirdos every episode. And I really I really appreciate that genre. And I do think ers love getting roles like that. I just feel like and again, we're all only two episodes in. I have no idea what happens to her But there's like this terrible terrible waitress named Kathy And I just think, oh my God I love her But I think, oh my God, I would just I would be so mad if I just know how every single customer in this restaurant feels when you realize Kathy is your waitress. And I just couldn't help but think when the episode ended, I was like Oh, that actress just had when she got that role, had the luckiest day of her entire life. Because it is she is so chewing up scenes. It's just unbelievable She might only have four lines in a script, but it's like, oh, those are like four really good lines and I love the show So Kudos to Apple TV. Yeahes. defeinitely definitely seconded. That's a good one. Yeah that is I mean one more we watched Legends on Netflix, which was a British show that was on OS, I think for a while and now's now made its way to it's one season and it's based on a true story. and it's by the same made by the same people who made the gold if you ever watched that. Nope didn't. Al Also a very good show about a Gold Heist in Britain in the early eighties. Oh no, I did watch that. Was that a real? wasas that a documentary? But it's not documentary, but it's a true. It' based on true stories. No, yeah. I did watch that. Yeah ye, That's right. based on a true story. Yeah. Yeah. so Legends is similarly done. you know, and I think the gold was really good. so Its good. It's a good show. Okay. I should thank our sponsors, I guess, right? probably if I could I always try to do it for memory. We had coax, right? Coax app dot com which is a super delightful Very fun front end app for your Plex server, which I can't stop raving about Even realities where you can get smart glasses and a smart ring that goes with the glasses at even realalities d. com promo code and squarespace at squarespace. com slash talkal showhow Apparently they make websites or help you make websites now.