Closing Thoughts on Creative Flow

Hi everyone, I'm Kai Dickens and welcome back to the Talk Tracks. Today we have an incredible story about a creative download, or some would say big magic. If you haven't listened to season two, episode three about the consciousness of creativity and how ideas choose us, I really encourage you to start there. But today you're going to meet Pilar Flynn, a producer and now a director in the animation space. And hear one of the most remarkable big magic creativity choosing us stories I've heard in a long time. So Pilar, welcome to the Talk Tracks . Hi everyone, I'm Kai Dickens and welcome to the Talk Tracks, brought to you weekly from TTT Media. In this series, we explore the threads that weave together our understanding of reality: science, spirituality, consciousness, and yes, even unexplained phenomena like sciabilities. We examine the mysteries that sit just beyond the edge of what science can currently explain, alongside researchers, thinkers, families, and experiencers. If you haven't yet listened to the telepathy tapes, I encourage you to start there. It lays the foundation for everything that we'll be exploring, because every era has ideas once dismissed as impossible until someone was willing to investigate them seriously. And on this show, we do just that. If you want to see our incredible guests in person, we have a video version of this episode on the telepathy tapes YouTube page. Your home is more than just furniture. It's an extension of who you are. Even small details, like a rug, can completely change how a space feels. And that's why I love ruggable. I recently added one of their Persian rugs in our living room. It's a beautiful kind of worn pastel pink that softens and totally pulls together the space. And there were so many styles to choose from, from Boho and Modern and Vintage. And you can filter by size, by color, by material, by designer. 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And when I say the term big magic, people who listen to season two remember that that was a book written by a very famous prolific American writer, Elizabeth Gilbert, um who wrote Eat Pre Love and she really love her. She's wonderful. Um and you know, this idea that creativity comes to us, chooses with us, engages with us, especially if we're working and ready and a willing recipient. But why don't we start by you just introducing yourself? Who are you? What do you do? Well my name is Pilad Flynn and I've been in the animation industry for over two decades. I'm originally from South America, um, from Chile and Ecuador. So I grew up mostly in countries in South America and and some of Europe . And I guess the reason I'm here in LA to begin with is because at five years old, I went to the theater for the first time to see my first movie and in that moment when I looked around at the audience and saw how connected everyone was, how they were all feeling the same emotions, I knew from that second that what I wanted to do was come to LA and tell stor ies. And from that day I would just tell my family, I'm gonna grow up and move to Hollywood and I'm gonna make movies. And of course, being a little girl that only spoke Spanish, living in Latin America, they were like, okay, Mijita, good luck with that you know great dream but I was so determined there was just something in me that knew you know I just didn't question it and lo and behold everything in my life ended up almost magically lining up so that I ended up coming to the States, going there for college, um, meeting my now husband in college, and I actually landed in animation, which is something I never quite expected because I didn't think animation was the thing you could actually do , but realized that animation was the perfect way for me to tell stories because it had the greatest impact reaching children and making a change and um just to make people feel like they were watching something profound, meaningful and connective . Um was something that yeah, meant so much to me. Love it. So what what have you been up to recently? Like if you were to fast forward to the past few years, where has your career taken you? Yeah. So I've gone all over the map to almost every studio in animation from big studios to small studio, but the most recent was my stint at Disney. I was there for nine years and I worked on two of the shows that meant the most to me , my family, my kids, which were Elena of Avalor, which was uh Disney's first ever Latina princess in a TV series, and um Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur, which uh was of course Marvel's first ever black teen girl superhero and her best friend was a Latina. And so for me to see myself represented on screen like that and for my girls to grow up seeing that it meant everything. It was a true work of heart. Yeah. Beautiful. Okay. So why don't you talk about or introduce us to to Isabel for those people who don't know her and and how she was significant to you growing up, maybe who she is, what she's known for, especially in Latin America. And um yeah, take us on that journey. Yeah, Isabella Yenda is pretty much um literary royalty to the Spanish language world. She is incredible. She's a feminist, a journalist. She has written books that have sold over 80 million copies around the world in over 42 different languages. She was part of , you know, when Chile and Latin America was going through a lot of uh political upheaval in the 70s, she was a beacon of hope for a lot of people and especially women. And her books have always been about strong, powerful women and people and the supernatural and magical realism. She's actually one of the um creators of magical realism. And throughout her life, she's told stories about herself personally, but also about people, you know, either in Latin America or different countries. And she even won the presidential medal of honor that uh Barack Obama gave her. So yeah, she is literally yeah, the queen. And growing up in Latin America, as most kids will tell you, she was taught in schools and House of the Spirits is one of the most famous of her works. Uh but she's got so many novels. And to this day, she's just turned um, I think eighty-one, eighty-two, and she just put out two more books, you know, in the in these last kind of in this last year and a half. So she's incredibly prolific and has not slowed down despite her age, which is such an inspiration. Magical realism. That's what you said she's known for, correct? So can you talk about that? I mean, she's one of the most prolific writers in the world. She's beloved. Um what is magical realism and how do you understand that Isabel um engages with the world? Like what is her philosophy? Just to let everybody know that Riel Garcia Marquez was also the founder of magical realism, and so um they both kind of were were the the founders of this um beautiful literary term, which basically means that their stories and their characters live in a very grounded world with very grounded um uh chapters and stories, but the supernatural and magic just happens all around them naturally. So nobody questions it. It it's just there. So say we're sitting here and a ghost might join us and sit next to me and I might just nod to them and keep going. Or um, you know, some of the characters have magical powers that just are. And so I find that so beautiful because honestly I think that does exist and to them they just bring something that people question to the forefront and um especially in Latin American culture, I think a lot more than culture here. We just accept the supernatural as part of everyday life. I remember growing up, my um nana used to call her my nanny. Uh she'd be tucking me into bed, and whenever she'd hear a an owl hoot, she'd go,es Oh, well, that means someone's dying tonight. Well, good night, Mihita, you know, and it was just like uh, you know, just something you just kind of said and and just was and you lived with. So um, yeah, a lot of her novels feature that and like I say, House of the Spirits is the most famous um that was known for that, that included ghosts and magical powers and um premonitions. And uh I've always found that so fascinating and beautiful because yeah, I believe in all those things. Yeah. I love that. What a different perspective. And liberating as well. And it seems and tell me if I'm wrong, but I think the way that Liz Gilbert plays with creativity and sees the world as this non-physical thing engaging with us, making its own the creativity, making its own will manifest through us seems almost like almost identical to how Isabel goes through the world. Would you agree with that? Yes, I think so because I know she said she sits down and the story comes to her and she feels like a vessel for the story. So a story that's kind of waiting in line or ready to be told. She's kind of there, ready with her pen and paper, and here it comes. And she allows it to just roll through her, you know, as it wishes to kind of live. Yes. And now your li it's just so amazing. Your life has now intersected with her in a amazing way around an amazing short story. Which is so crazy and I to this day I have to pinch myself I can't even believe because growing up and seeing her such a uh an inspiration and light for me to be crossing over in any way with her, especially in this way, has been such an honor. I can't even begin to tell So what happened? Because I just think the story is so beautiful. And just shows that anything can happen. Yes. And kind of like you say, definitely was not expected, never thought I'd be sitting here, you know, talking about this or this having come to me So the way it started was I had just finished Elena Vavalor and Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur at Disney. And like I was saying to you, those two shows meant so much to me. And even though the stories we were telling, the characters were something that I truly held close to my heart. They weren't stories that I had created. And when they were over, I just had the sense of well, now what? And like I I've put those helped put those out into the wor ld. And now there's something still left in me that that I just felt like was dying to come out and I didn't know what. So I had finished the shows and the longer I thought about it, the more I started getting this feeling inside me that felt like I was vibrating on a cellular level and I couldn't shake it. It was almost like something was shaking me from the inside out, telling me to pay attention. And I was like, what? What is it? Like what what is this thing? And it was so funny because it was almost like this weird internal itch, you know, even though, you know, it didn't hurt in any way. It was just kind of like just really like sitting with me. And I finally decided to just put it out in the world because I was like, what is this feeling? Why can't I shake it what am I supposed to be paying attention to but I also put it out to my family my friends I told my husband I told all my girlfriends you know who I have a group of amazing girlfriends that are so supportive and and that I tell everything to. And I just said, there's something in me and I don't know what it is, and I feel like I need to be centered to figure it out. Help me. Like, what am I supposed to do? And after I put that call out, one magical girlfriend, my friend Amanda , really heard me. And she called one day and she said, I've been thinking about what you said and I think I have a solution. And I was like, What? What is it? And she she lives in Northern California, near the Redwoods, and she said, Why don't you and some of our friends come up, stay with me. I know this awesome little area that has cabins in the middle of the Redwoods. Why don't we just have a weekend? You know, get away from the kids, jobs, the city, and just sit and be together in nature. And when she said that to me, just something in me lit up and I was like, yes, yeah, that's that's exactly what I need. So even though it was this crazy time of year, dropped everything, went up there, and it was five of us. And the second I got there , I just started feeling centered. It was almost like all of my cells and whatever was shaking and signing started aligning. And we got to the cabin area, and Amanda let us in, and it was so beautiful. It was just these little rustic cabins in the middle of the woods, like nothing around. And we settled in, and I'm looking at these giant, beautiful ancient trees, and so of course we started unpacking everything. And then Amanda comes over to us and she's like, Uh Pilar, I have another surprise for you. She said, I've set up the front porch so that we can have a really deep meditation and so we can just take the afternoon to meditate and be together and commune with the energy of the trees. And I was like, who is this friend? This friend is amazing. She is amazing. And and of course, my first thought was like, okay, this sounds kind of woo . Like, what are you talking about? What do you mean we're gonna sit and meditate and commune with a tree? But then another part of me, not my brain, my my spirit, my heart, was like, yes, that's that sounds amazing. Let's do that. So okay, so this isn't something you normally do with her as they go into the trees and meditate. Never. These are all people that are kind of in animation. We're professionals. Um, you know, we we we love spiritual stuff and talking about it, but never something this intentional. And I guess that's that what was the difference. Is she was like, I heard you, I'm gonna help you, I'm going to set something up intentional for you to talk within yourself. So it wasn't like it was anything this vague or magical, and that's what was so beautiful about it, was so normal in a way. But her speaking those words and saying, We're intentionally going to sit, you're surrounded by people you love, you're away from all the noise, you were communing with these trees in nature. By her intentionally saying that to me, it kind of just realigned me from the inside out. It was it was incredible. So cool. So we all sat there and we just, you know, sat together and at first we started talking, and you know, we drank our tea and we had crystals and you know, sage and everything. And then we just kind of had a moment of silent meditation. And it was so silent and beautiful, and all of a sudden, as I was sitting there and for a lot of uh a lot of my girlfriends things were coming up you know especially because we felt safe you know and vulnerable and in the silence and in closing my eyes I suddenly started hearing this inner voice. And it was kind of an outer voice, but by inner and outer it was kind of one and the same. And it was almost like the trees were starting to speak to me telepathically. And maybe they were always there trying to talk, but I was finally intentionally listening. And so as I sat there, I started getting some downloads, and it was mostly about my family or why why I was there or the stresses of work. And so I'm listening and I'm going deeper and deeper . And then I decided to just go in as intuitively as possible and just open my mind's eye. And I thought, okay, I'm gonna surrender. I'm ready. Okay, what is it? 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She goes, I was just in the backyard, and I think the trees back there have a message for you . And the craziest thing was normally, you know, my mind, again, my mind was like, What is she talking about ? But somehow I heard myself say to her, I know . And she just kind of nodded. And I got up and I walked past and I went to the backyard and I see this beautiful , you know, I say beautiful, but it was actually just this like plastic lawn chair, but in the moment, you know, everything looks so beautiful. So this plastic lawn chair that you recline on was just sitting in the middle of these trees. So I go and I lay down on them and I look up and I suddenly realize that right above me is this circle of giant ancient redwoods just looking down on me and it almost look like ancient ancestral kind of you know grandparents. I want to say abuelos, you know, looking down and right in the center above them was this beautiful kind of space where you could see the stars. The stars were starting to come out. So I was laying there looking at them and I was just marveling at the beauty. So I took it in for a while. And then finally, I again I kind of surrendered and I said, okay, I'm here. I'm intentionally here. What is it I'm supposed to know? What is it I'm supposed to be doing? Because I knew it was something that I was meant to do. And all of a sudden I heard back . You know what you're supposed to be doing. And I was like, whoa, what? I was like, what was that? And it was crystal clear. And I heard it in my mind almost telepathically, but it wasn't like a thought. It was a voice. And the best way to describe the voice was it was almost a mixture of what felt like ancestors and guides and the trees. It was all like one and the same. But it was crystal clear. And I said, Well, what? What do you mean? And they said , think about it. And I thought, okay, I'm like, what are they trying to say? And I said, okay, I know the feeling of what I'm supposed to be doing. I I I definitely know I'm supposed to be doing something. And they said, No, you know . And so I just took a step back, I guess, you know, laying there, and all of a sudden, it was almost like a beautiful mind moment where all these weird puzzle pieces started coming together. And what I heard was, you know, you're supposed to take all the knowledge that you've spent all this time acquiring, all the people that you've connected with, you're meant to uh put together an animated short film with a story by Isabela Yende and you're meant to put together a team of incredible Latino creators and you're meant to, by the way, put an Oscar campaign together and create an incredible film. And I was like, what? And it was just like such a clear, oddly speci fic download that I was kind of in shock. But at the same time, it made perfect sense , which was equally shocking. And then I heard myself saying, I know , but I'm so scared . And then they said to me, okay , you have fears, what are they? And so all of a sudden I started launching in on, I'm afraid of people laughing at me for wanting to be a director. I'm afraid of what if it's not good? What if Isabel doesn't give me the rights to one of her stories? What if I can't get funding? What if it sucks? What if, you know, and I'm just like, what if, what if, what if my family is mad at me for doing this? And I just started kind of vomiting up all these fears. And then when they were all out of me, I looked back up at them and I could just feel them look at looking down at me with amusement almost. And they were like, okay, those are your fears. So what? And in that moment, it was almost hysterical because in the next millisecond I got this incredible download realiz ing how much my ancestors had gone through, how much my family had gone through, how much I had gone through in this life to go through all these obstacles, all these challenges, for me to be sitting in this lawn chair talking about this film I wanted to make and realizing that it was achievable , that I could do it. And the only thing that was stopping me was all these ridiculous fears, because now they seem so small compared to what all these incredible ancestors have gone through. And I suddenly realized, oh my God, you're right. So what ? And in that moment, actually I realized I had tears running down my cheeks because it was such a beautiful, like aha moment. And you know, I lay there for a little longer, kind of communing, you know, with them and and speaking to them because it it was just such an incredible connection. No, we'd gone through this kind of just deep meditation and tea and it was more I just felt so connected to myself, to nature, to my girlfriends. That was a really important part of it, I realized it was almost like a little coven we'd created right there of of um safety and vulnerability . Um so yeah, it was just so wildly incredible and shocking that this had just happened that I that I almost couldn't believe it. And and honestly to this day, I don't know if I would believe it if it wasn't for my four girlfriends being there and hearing all this the second after it happened and now them seeing how everything has come together after that. So after I had gotten up, you know, wiped my tears, went back down, the first thing I did was I went to my bedroom, I grabbed my phone and uh because what had happened was in the vision and in the puzzle pieces that had come, I had literally seen everybody that was meant to be a part of this. And so the first thing I did was I reached out to the first person I saw in my vision, which was a writing partner that I had had, Rafael Agustin. We had worked on one thing together, but he was extremely busy. We'd never like really professionally collaborated, other than this one small thing we'd done. And I texted him and I said, Rafa, I'm in the Redwoods. I just communed with I think our ancestors. He's from Ecuador . And I got this vision that we're meant to do this Isabella yen, they animated short film together and we're supposed to create an Oscar campaign and I'm supposed to do this with you. And I hit send. And I waited a few minutes thinking, what the hell am I doing? And I saw the three little dots come up and I was like, okay, he's either gonna block me forever or like I don't know what . And I suddenly get his message back and he writes, Oh my God, this is the craziest thing I've ever read. I don't know what you're talking about or what you're on, but I love every word of it. I am so in. And from that moment on, I was off to the races. And every single person in my vision that I've come to or gone to and asked to be a part of it from then on, including Isabel Allende, has said yes. And so I wanna talk about some of the pragmatic fears you had. Because obviously nothing has stood in the way of this project wanting to get into the world. Yes. Um first one, have you ever directed anything? Never. Other than in college. Yeah. And so I just want the audience to know, like, it is hard f to get people to fund anything as a first time director. Especially high level. Yes. And then Isabella Yende . I mean, it must be so expensive to option her book. She's one of the most famous writers in the world. So talk to me about how on earth you went about this and what happened. Yes. Well, what happened was and actually before that let me just insert um the fear part and the Oscar part because because I don't want to forget to to tell you this part. So what's amazing is the last little button of and by the way you',re gonna be uh putting together an Oscar campaign for this because of what you said, because of never having directed, it just sounded so audacious, so wildly, like egotistically crazy to be like, I'm gonna put together an And as I've gone through this journey, I've realized that that last little bit was not about winning an Oscar, winning a statue, it was about telling myself because I am worthy of it. And those words were almost like the the present day this world password to say I'm worthy of this, I'm worthy of the best. And everybody I've brought onto the project telling them that, and by the way, we're going after an Oscar campaign, has been a way to tell them because I think you're worth it. And one thing that I've really realized is as Latinos and especially in this industry, the only thing that holds us back, not talent, not knowledge, not storytelling, not having each other, it's that fear that we're not worthy and that other people will not find as worthy. So those few words was just the I found the the very quick and easy way to tell people when I was pitching this, yeah, I'm standing here and I I believe in myself. I'm worthy. You should believe in myself too. Which is crazy because I would never, I'm such a humble person that to have those words come out of my mouth was almost the first challenge that they gave me. Um , but that has kind of made me feel like, yeah, you know I can do this and and you can all do this with me. So anyway, back to your your question. Yeah, because I think like one getting the rights or you know to tell a story to to a book from one of the most famous , prolific, you know, best selling authors in the world is no easy feat. And then fundraising is no easy feat. And I would imagine one of the most difficult things to fundraise for outside of documentaries is uh short animated films. Animation is so crazy expensive. Not to mention nowadays animation is i in a total slump. It's so hard to get anything made. Even the big studios can barely find money to get anything done . So when I first went about this, to be crazy enough to want to bring this into the world and an Isabel and this story into the world, not even something that's for kids, and to get it funded and to make it 15 minutes long, it's like most people would have thought, including myself, by the way, before this vision came to me, that I was crazy. But what's funny is I didn't even know what story w the vision was about. I had no idea. I didn't even know she had written short stories. I'd never read any of them. I'd only read her novels. So the first thing I did after Rafa said, I'm in, I got home. I was dying to get back home. I I get in and I immediately start Googling, has Isabella Yen there written any short stories? And it turns out she's only written one book of compilations of short stories, and it was based on her novel um Eva Luna, and the short uh story compilation is called Cuentos de Eva Luna, basically stories of Eva Luna. And so the second I saw that, I bought the digital copy because I could not wait for the hardcover to come. Bought the digital copy, started reading it right then and there, and the very first story I read was called Los Palabras , two words. And I read the story, and as soon as I finished reading it, and it's just the short little story, I knew with every cell of my being, oh my God, that that is the story I meant to tell. And I knew so profoundly that I started reading the other stories. And it was weird. It was almost like my body was rejecting them because I didn't want to waste time. I was like, why am I wasting time? I know this is a story. I I just trust the intuition . And so I email immediately emailed Rafa. I took screen caps of it, set sent them to him. I was like, this is it. This is the story we're meant to do. And he was just on board. You know, he was like, okay, that's the story we're meant to do. Now what? And I was like, okay, now I guess we figure out who has the rights. So we write her a letter, and actually Rafa wrote her the letter about me, which was so beautiful and humbling because he put all his favors that he could possibly muster into this letter to her about me wanting to do the story and the why. He writes her this letter and then we wait and about two weeks later we hear back from the agents and they kind of said, Oh my God, yeah, those paladas , yeah, that that happens to be her most beloved short story she's ever written. She wrote it in nineteen eighty nine. She's been asked for the rights by multiple people, and she has said no to every single one of them. They're like, so good luck. And we were like, uh okay. And the funny thing is most people would have been deterred by that and thought, oh my God, she doesn't give the rights to anyone. But all I could think was, no one has the rights. That means it's possible. And then a couple weeks later, we get a call back from the agents and they're like, oh my God, this this is crazy. We don't even know what's happening. This is so weird and rare. She read the letter and she said yes. She said, yes, you can have the rights. And then we said, um, okay, so we'll need the shopping rights, you know, for year because we're gonna have to gather the funds first. And um and they said , well, how much how much do you want to give for the shopping rights? And of course we have no money. We're both out of work at the time. So we were totally ballsy and we were like, for free. And they were like, you guys are crazy . Hey everyone. 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So elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com slash tapes for free shipping on your order and three hundred sixty five day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q Uin C E dot com slash tapes for free shipping and three hundred sixty five day returns. Quince dot com slash tapes. They're like, all right, we'll go back. And we thought, well, what do we have to lose? You know, maybe they'll we'll come back with something. They call us back and they're like, this is crazy. This is so rare. We don't even know what's happening. Who are you? Like, you're nobody. We've never heard of you. She said, Yeah, she'll give you the shopping rights for a year for free. And we were like, wow . And I tell you, Kai , the moment the contract came in and her signature was on the contract next to my signature, I showed the first person I showed was my mom . She burst into tears and she said, Oh my God, your abuelitos would have been so proud to see this. And all I could think was, yeah, they see this, they help make this happen. And it was just so profoundly beautiful, you know? Because they would have known her too. I mean, growing up, right? Oh my gosh. Everybody. Ask anybody in Latin America. Um , yes, they know her. She's as famous as Stephen King. It's like Stephen King giving the rights to his most beloved short story to someone he's never met for nothing. Like when does that ever happen? Never. But when that happened to me, I thought, okay, I have been given this precious gift, this beautiful baby that wants to be brought to life. And somehow it's found found its way to me. And I'm gonna do everything in my power to um yeah, to bring it up and bring it out into the world. And so then the next challenge. You have you need to find money. So then have the shopping rights. Now we need to have money. Don't have much time. So I started again, I first started reaching out to friends of mine that were artists that I admire hugely, mostly Latinos, some not. All of them immediately, resoundingly, said yes. But the biggest part of the puzzle I had to put together was who the production company was going to be and/or how I was going to get the money to hire a production company. And there's um a yearly festival that's the biggest film festival for the animation industry in France called the Anasi Film Festival. And one morning I just woke up and I thought I have to go there. I meant to go to France and find what I'm looking for there, which sounds absolutely crazy. I was out of work, so was my husband at the time. And so to spend money, to drop everything, leave our kids behind, and go all the way to France just sounded insane. But I just knew I had to do it. And um, so I booked it. We fly out there, and one of the companies I met with was Icon Creative Studio. I pitched them the story, and the most amazing thing happened. They said to me, Pilar, we can make this happen, and of course we want to do this with you. And I was like, wait, what? Whoa? I I I mean, usually to do a short, I mean it can sometimes cost millions, you know, to make something, especially the quality I was going for. And here they were going, Yeah, we can do this for you. And they reminded me that when they first got their start in the industry, I was one of the biggest advocates of theirs and I helped them get their first job at Disney. And they said, Don't you remember you were our biggest supporter when we first started? Now we want to do this. for you It's cool. And but I somehow knew I had to fly all the way to France, sit with them, look them in the eye, have this physical energy exchange for us to be on that same wavelength to then move forward with this giant gamble on both of our parts, mostly theirs, honestly. Yeah. I mean it's pretty wild to go all the way to France. And that's like a big bold swing when you are out of work. Out of work. I mean it's a huge swing when you're out of work. That would terrify me. So where are things at now? Is it out of production? Are you doing an Oscar campaign? What's the status? Yeah. So now we go into production next month. We already have the animatic uh pretty much locked and done. We've done our cast auditions, but it has just been in such beautiful flow, it has all just come together. And I have to say in directing this project, I've never felt more in flow centered, feeling like it was something I was meant to be doing, like everything has just felt so right all along the way. Even the words I use when I'm launching my artists or talking to them. And it's funny because, you know, this is a story