Final Thoughts on Love and Perseverance

Hi everyone and welcome back to the Talk Tracks. Today we have two very special guests, um, Manisha Ladd, who you might remember from season one, uh where you met her son Akeel. And now she has started a center, the Akeel Autism Foundation Sensory Pathway Center. And in her journey, she met Bets y, who has an 11-year-old daughter, Sienna, and is just starting her spelling journey. And in the beginning of the spelling journey, she also discovered that she was tele pathic, kind of confirming some of your prior experien ces. And I think it's gonna be a really beautiful true conversation about fear and perseverance and love beyond anything else. So thank you both for joining us. Hi everyone, I'm Kai Dickens and welcome to the Talk Tracks, brought to you weekly from TTT Media. In this series, we explore the threads that weave together our understanding of reality: science, spirituality, consciousness, and yes, even unexplained phenomena like sciabilities. We examine the mysteries that sit just beyond the edge of what science can currently explain, alongside researchers, thinkers, families, and experiencers. If you haven't yet listened to the telepathy tapes, I encourage you to start there. It lays the foundation for everything that we'll be exploring because every era has ideas once dismissed as impossible until someone was willing to investigate them seriously. And on this show, we do just that. If you want to see our incredible guests in person, we have a video version of this episode on the telepid So why don't we first start by just having you each introduce yourselves and um who your children are sure uh so my name is Manisha Lad and uh our only son Akil Lad is now twenty-five years old and he has transformed me since his diagnosis of autism then, we were not given much of a hope. So till 11 years he was completely non-verbal, non-expressive. He broke his silence through a very controversial method. And during that time, we were introduced about the mind and body disconnect and reflexes. My name is Betsy Flores. I'm from New Jersey also. I have a daughter named Sienna who's eleven years old. We started the spellinging th when she was about uh maybe eight or nine and we're s she's still not open with me. She's for kinda very early on in her journey because uh haven't been able to take her for consistent lessons, but now I'm trying to learn. So hopefully um she'll be open with me soon. And then I want to talk about how you met. But first, you know, for people who might remember you from season one, Manisha was w the first family I met in America that was um both spelling really proficiently, uh Kiel can spell on an iPad, no one needs to touch or hold anything, he can just go. And you opened a center to help other individuals who have non-speaking or praxic children, which I understand is how you met. And at the center you work on like reflexes and the rapid prompting method of spelling to communicate. Yes. And other physical therapies and such. Adaptive fitness. We have a lot of digital uh innovation tools where parents can interact with metronome, where we know how to work on the hemispheres and more on the subconscious mind. And and we also have a small hydroponic unit where the kids learn to do the gardening with the hydroponic. What's the center call? Uh a killer ism foundation, the sensory pathway center. The sensory pathway. Yeah, and our program name is called the Neurosensory Foundation Program. But before starting a center, when Akiro was seven years old, we started a foundation, Akira Autism Foundation, and our whole goal was to help families back in India. So we trained a doctor in India, we raised some funds, we trained a doctor in India, and that's how we got the family started on the first biomedical treatment. And when at the age of uh Levin, when Aquil broke his silence uh through iPad . And uh that time Akil made a very powerful statement by typing that I cannot see my body in my mind . And then we found that Akhil understood everything inside. And he was literally um uh talking from inside to us. He had no idea that he had a body. What he understood that oh have hands and fingers and they move. He had a perception that I see visually, I hear, and I learn. It's in mind. Other person has to also open his mind. That was his operating system . So he one day told me, typed with me and said So he told you he can't help it he has to read minds. Why did he say that? Um because that was his operating system. That was the way he thought. That's because it was happened happening naturally for him. Yeah. It's not a he doesn't have to make an attempt. And that's why he would say that I am very uh fearless of using my resources. What does he mean by his resources? Like being very intuitive. Intuitive? Yes. Intuitive and telepathy. You can see is on the similar similar lines. Yeah. So while he would type with me, before he would uh like I would give him a call, his as if his thoughts were coming into my mind. So his thoughts would enter your mind too. Yes. His thoughts would come into my mind. That was sure. How could you tell they weren't your thoughts? Because he would tell me your answer and my answer is same, but this is my answer. So interesting. Yes, but and some of the thoughts whether he would say like I cannot see my body in my mind, or if I ask him a basic question of if we're l uh studying about living things, what is living thing, what is non-living thing, we teach and you ask questions like why cell is living. And his answer was because the energy in the cell is living, the cell is living. I wouldn't give such answers. So his answers were very, very, very intellect. Very intellectual and very smart and something and you knew it wasn't your yeah. Absolutely. I would never say I cannot see my body in my mind. Why would I win that wake up? Yeah, yeah. So he typed that or you saw those thoughts in your head? How did you No it goes with very flow? Once you give your mind, it's like like a blackboard. I'm going to use your mind and you are your body's going to be your vehicle for me. So you and me are very in tuned. So it it's almost like a keel you said like is it was like a fresh blackboard in your head and he ca he almost like used the interface of your body. Yes. And my mind too. I just want you to share the bus story 'cause I love that story. I I and I don't think put it's definitely not in the film and I'm not even sure if it was in season one, but it impacted me when you first told me the story about how when he was little he would get mad at the bus. And Yes. So t tell that story. So uh he would uh go on the bus and the driver is telling him hi, uh good morning Akil and Akhil not greeting. And he would ask him agail, Akilah, good morning Akil, and he would not answer . Uh so and he would get upset and then he would say, Why I have to s why they keep on asking me the same question when I already said hi. I said, How did you say hi? I I said I answered in my mind. And one day he had a major melddown in the bus and I asked him Akil why what happened? And he said that um teach people how to read my mind. Yeah, because he was talking to the kids too, right? Telling them to keep it down, I remember Yeah, you would say, like he would come and like, Why you're not listening? I said, How did you say? Because I'm telling in my mind and you're not listening from my mind. So he was under that big perception and he would say, My mind is very good. I have to tell my mind what to do . And when he had a meltdown, then he started telling that I should not go into the other mind. Because he says I want to do it, but my other mind is not letting me do. As if there are two minds inside. So interesting. And now he doesn't talk about the mind at all because he has a lot of control over his body. So the more the control came. Yeah. The less he had to rely on. Yes. And that's where the more you work on the children's body, uh, they get the control. And that's exactly all the modalities which we did with Akhil. It's what we do at the center. Great. Okay, so Betsy, you obviously met Manisha through the center, but tell us a little bit about your story. When you decided to bring your daughter to the center and why? So we had been we had been doing RPM well. I mean, she has a great pract uh practitioner, but she's an hour away and she was only available every other uh Sunday. Like so it was twice a month, um, which I felt like we needed more, but there was nothing in my area like in central New Jersey where I could go. Yeah. And so I learned that Manisha was doing uh uh RPM and my daughter she gave me some clues that she could read my mind and but it wasn't always consistent What's an example? When she was a baby and I would do to fix her hair and I would be standing behind her. For some re and then the minute I would put the ponytail thing in my mouth to like she would turn around and tell me to take it out of my mouth. And I'm like, how does she how does she see me? I'm standing behind her. And I would try different ways. I'm like, maybe I'm making a noise. And she would do it every single time. The minute I put it out, she would turn around and tell me to take it out. Another example is I remember waking up one day and just I wanted to make myself eggs, which is rare for me. I don't really cook myself eggs. And my daughter doesn't like eggs. But I come out there and make myself eggs tonight. So I'm thinking all this in my head, and I go downstairs, I take the pan out, and she says, I don't want any eggs. And I'm like, How did you know I was gonna make eggs? It was just things like that. And um, another time she was taking a bath and I was she was playing with this bucket and I I was thinking to myself, I can't believe that's the same bucket that they gave me at the hospital when she was born. Now if you know kids with autism, they you know, at least my daughter's not completely nonverbal. She has a language, but it's mostly all scripts and the same thing, you know, saying the same things over and over again. So s so to her for her to say hospital was unusual and it just was at the exact time that I was thinking it about it in my mind. So she gave me those snippets. And I remember telling somebody, I think she's reading my mind. And then when I took my daughter to Manetia the first time, I wasn't expecting anything. I just wanted the spelling. But Manisha com immediately connected with her. Immediately. And so I I don't know why. One of the questions I have is just like, why doesn't she connect with me that way? Like I I know that she's not reading my mind all the time. And I wonder if it's because she hasn't developed it that much yet or maybe it's because she's turning it off. Um and then but when she connected with Minisha that quickly I said, well then maybe it's We have talked about this so many times in the show that so often I think for children it's easier to connect with a teacher or a coach or a counselor than a parent. And I give this example, you know, which I think is true, right? I think for parents, we have so much emotional stock and pressure that we put on our own kid. Like I'll be watching my six year old in a basketball game. It doesn't bother me if any other kid is running their own way or not running fast enough or not doing this, but the second my son just stops and I'm like, what is he doing? Why is he knowing like this end of the world that he's not doing it. But for every other kid out there, it's like, whatever, that's so cute. And I think we parents do that, right? We put so much on our children. Yeah. But it's not just the spelling, even the telepathy. Like, I've tried to test her since all this happened. I've tried to test her to see if she's reading my mind and she's she's not most of the time. Yeah. I feel like she's not. Oh you know, I I don't know. It just might I just don't think so. So I wonder like what is it about the nation? You tell tell me that what happened when the first time y'all met. So you brought in Siana. Yeah. And to learn to spell or to get minimally verbal. She's not conversational. She has functional language. She can say I need this or I need that. But she's not conversational. It's mostly scripting thing, you know, lines from shows that she repeats over and over again. So for someone like that who's minimally verbal or unreliably verbal, spelling can really help still like spelling to communicate can really complex thoughts at all. Okay. No. Okay. So you were going to help s with spelling, and then tell me what happened next because obviously some sort of telepathy happened. Yeah, see whenever anybody walks into our cent re, it's very pure RPM based. We never say telepathic or anything or anything. We know that if a child is spelling, uh we know when they are reading our mind and when they are not reading our mind. Okay, so if I read something and the answer uh I have in my mind, the child starts answering that. Then we completely know. Or sometimes they give thoughts that I connect from this code to that. Some of the thoughts which they type, which is not in our mind. So it happens very naturally. So like your example of the bike is a perfect example. Which example? Like yours riding the bike and then you hold and then you leave. Yeah. And so they getting the whole control. So it's like it's like you hold the hand and then you start fading your hand and you are just standing in the back, it's like an energy. Everything is energy. So somebody had explained me for Achille's perspective that when Achille walks into an environment outside the house, he tries to matches your energy with the other person's energy. And if that is not matching, he shuts down. So if you are open, he will be open. So with Siena when she came in, I had no intention of doing any telepathy or anything or anything. But I was reading her a story and she was answering. And in the between she was uh talking something, not right now, you know, not right now, okay. I think most of us assume we're hydrated because we're drinking water all day. But water alone doesn't always cut it. Your body needs minerals to actually absorb and use that water. And that's why I've been using RELIT. RELIT is made by Redmond, the salt company behind Redmond Real Salt. 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Go to Quince dot com slash tapes for free shipping on your order and three hundred sixty five day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's QUINCE dot com slash tapes for free shipping and three hundred sixty five day returns. Quince.com slash tapes Okay, I'll explain this a little bit more. So the first time you met Siana, she sits down next to you. Yes. I was reading a story. And you were gonna ask her like yes and no answers. No, basic proper question and answers. Okay. And and then suddenly she makes a statement out of the blue. Aaron Powell She writes to you out of the blue nice mind reading. So okay, so you start working with Sienna. So what happens next? Like did you bring this up to Betsy or did you start test? Yeah, I write her in in in a in a in a session finished, I told Betsy uh she's completely telepathy. Tell me about the test y'all did. So there's a table. There was a table. Sienna's sitting across from me. Uh Manisha was sitting next to her. And Manisha would I would she gave me a book. I would pick oh any word. I tried to pick words that I didn't even know what they meant. And she would look at it, she would go over, hold up the and Sienna would just start typing the word. Yeah just like that. And she just starts typing And we did it. We did it like four times. Four times. And she did it every time. That's and I know if you c keeps on coming to me then I'll try different techniques, I'll try different boards where I will start fading myself. I'll have different boards where I'll keep the board down and then I am not I have air prompts and I will fade those air prompts. Wherever we feel we there is a need of more prompting, we tell the parents there's a need to work on the body. Yeah. The more you work on the body, then the prompts to fades fade away. Do you think though like for you being because a lot of the coaches and teachers I know who work with so many non-speakers, um not only is it easier to be like a spelling coach and work with a lot of people, but the tel telepathy seems to be easier as well. But do you think that's because your mind gets trained like that? It just knows how to open much quicker? I always say I've been I've always been really bad at like meditation and things like that. And I wonder if that's what it is. Meditation. I w No, you don't think that's it? No. I don't know. I think meditation and because I've gone through the spiritual journey for a kill because I was looking for these answers at the age of ten or eleven when Akhil was typing and Akhil started telling a lot of his inner thoughts. Now what can I do? I had diff he would say there are many different forms of minds and I had no answers So Akiel said you there's many different forms of minds. Yes. And he started interacting, you know, with all the um ancestors and giving messages, you know, so he had a lot of perceptions. But even how many shawks about opening her mind and closing her mind, it's something that I can't grasp. So I that's that's why I feel like I might be blocking her somehow, or she's blocking me. I don't I don't I don't know. What do you think that is? I mean, because it's it's painful for you. I can see that it's or I'm confused by it. To be honest, I mean I I to be honest, I I would I think I would be a little bit relieved that she's not always reading my mind because I'm I'll be honest, it's not always good. You know, like you know, autism can take you to some dark places and I've been really depressed and and if she was reading my mind in those moments, I'd be I'd be devastated because it was it's not good. You know, it's not good things. But it's just I'm just curious more than anything. I don't I don't it's uh I want her to spell with me more than anything. Yeah more even more than the the telepathy. But I'm but it just makes me curious like why is it she has clearly read my mind sometimes, but other times I'm sure she doesn't. Like I have to study with her for school, you know. So there's I'm saying the word and I'm I'm I you know I say a definition she's gotta give me the word and she's the word is in my head ten thousand times and she doesn't say it. So I'm like she's I don't think yeah the the fear Oh maybe but maybe I do have a fear. Maybe it is Let that fear, let that fear go. But the good thing is that it it forces me to clean up my act. Like the minute I start going down a dark place of like depression or whatever it is, I stop myself because I'm like, well, what if she can what if she's reading my mind now? That's it. That's a dark thing. You know, I I don't ever want her to think that she's not enough or that she's making me unhappy in some way. And so I f it forces me to like which is a great thing. So that's she she is changing me for the better, I think in that sense. That's exactly the transformation journey. When your energy changes, when your breathing changes, when you when you are in that with your space of integrity with yourself. Well and also the fear goes away. But the fear goes away. Could it just be different minds too? Like I it might I it might not be anything you're doing. You know what I mean? I don't want you to put that pressure on yourself. It could just be I mean, I don't know how it works. I feel like you are the resident expert in the room, Manisha. But and she is not the only student who has come and told me that. Akira's told it's very easy to read my mind. The other other girl had come in the second session. The first statement she does completely open, you know, very aggressive. 22-year-old. First session I did it with her and I started to have mind-to-mind connection and mom was trying to hold her. I said, No, don't don't touch her, let her give her answers. Let it be wrong. That's fine. And in my mind, I'm telling her, It's okay. That's fine. You know, it's okay, I'm gonna accept this answer. So I'm talking in my mind. It it's somewhere it starts there. And if it is starting there for me, let it start because it's a relationship. And then we start slowly, slowly diving into it. Uh why this. I'll give you another example. One of the students was constantly f uh, you know, throwing things on the floor. You give him something in his hand, throw pencil throw, this throw, throw. So we asked him, Why are you throwing things? And he typed because I want to hear the sound. Since then till now , not even once years through. So once you enter into that mind, once they find the trust that you are okay to give me your mind. I'm I'm okay to tell you. It's like going to a friend, okay, or going for a therapy, and you open up to them and you tell them everything. It's the trust. Why you open up to certain people and how why you don't open up to certain people? You know, as you're growing up, you have your friend, you have a best friend, and you tell the best friend everything, but you won't not tell that to your mom, or you not tell that to your dad, or you not tell to your brother. You know, it's like that. Well, and I mean, I also think I mean this is like in a way, telepathy might be like a muscle memory for your brain just to let go and get into and I would imagine like people often use the metaphor of like ballroom dancing, right? Like you're really good ballroom dancing partner because you've in terms of typing, even telepathy, because you've done it with so many people. Got it. Done it. Got it. So you know how to get into that ballroom thing. So any child walking in is like, I can ballroom dance with you. Yes. Where it might be harder for a parent or sibling who's like brand new, I would think, to just figure out how to connect in their brains. I I mean So it's I don't keep on doing, keep on doing and you reach that path, but you need to keep on doing. I I I never ever sat with Akhil saying today Akil is going to read my mind. Okay? He would tell me, oh your mind answer in my mind answer is saying but this is my mind answer. I have a question about gatekeeping now and telepathy. Like, is it still pretty pronounced of like do not talk about telepathy within spelling, or do you think it's getting a little better? I think there's like there's like two camps of non-believers. One is relig.ious Because even me, I was raised uh I was raised Catholic and it was like that's like demonic. You know, you just don't and I think telepathy or telepathy. It's just it's like anything like that in the spiritual world , all of that stuff is like of the occult and it's just you just don't go there. And then there's just others that are just they don't believe anything unless it happens to them. There's just that that camp. You know, they just think uh you know they, don't think I had told a friend of mine who I've been trying to get her to take her son, yeah, who has autism, to do spelling. I've been trying to tell her and tell her and I I just can see that he's really smart and he would do so well with spelling. I just have a feeling, you know, and I've been trying to encourage her. I've sent her videos and and she just hasn't done anything. And then finally I I told her what happened with Manisha and then and I even showed her the video of and she's and that's when she introduced it to her husband, which I think was the biggest mistake. Because if if you're being introduced to Steena, the spelling at the s that as of for the first time with tele telepathy, then and if they're completely closed off to telepathy they're gonna be closed off to spelling because they're gonna think it's it's c together. Yes. And uh how does your spouse respond to the telepathy? I he's actually surprisingly open and and and believes it. When I gave him when I would tell him the examples of like things that happened, I mean he was just like, hmm, that is weird. And then I showed him the mini shit thing and he was like, Well, no doubt now. So is because the definition of the telepathy which they see and they've been told. They want to hear from the clinicians. It's very commonly seen mostly, I don't know why it's the it's a dad's thing or what. They want to hear from a profession al rather than from a mom because they think it's like a mom. And that's where I feel you need to redefine the word telepathy. And if you bring the telepathy and neuroscience into picture and how the that's true. Well and a lot of I n I've s noticed now, especially in the scientific community, they'll call it non local consciousness. Yes. Non local communication. Yeah, it's just wording it differently. That's why from the day one I've been telling. I don't like the word telepathy because it looks like telepathy. We define the word telepathy. Yeah. It's not easy, Kai, that I can sit here and I can put a thought in your mind . Okay, and you are going to do that. You're going to say that. It's not it's not that simple. Telepathy happens at that time. It's like you and me have uh learned the script and learn the strategy and learn or you know how I think, you know how I think, you know what's going to be my next move, I know what's going to be my next move. I know with your just bas ic expression, just just you doing this, what this means to me. It's staying with each other for long and having that oneness relationship. How common though, now that you have a center and you're seeing all sorts of parents and kids come in, like uh how many of the individuals that you're working with do you think have this ability around non-local communication or telepathy? Almost everybody. Almost everybody. Wow. So let's say for the majority of the the non speakers that you see there's telepathy . If you bring it up to the parents, are they responsive or do they get upset? Or do you not even bring it up? I don't bring it up till the families are understanding what is this. But now I do tell them very confidently. They always have constant thoughts going on in their mind. They always tell that they know when who's believing me, who's not believing me. They all know. They they understand the world. They understand both the worlds. But it is hard and frustrating for them to . It's not the body is not in their control . 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With hundreds of ready-to-use templates, Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store that matches your brand style. Best yet, Shopify is your commerce expert with world-class expertise in everything from managing inventory to international shipping to processing returns and beyond. See less carts go abandon and more sales With Shopify and their Shop Pay button. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at Shopify.com/slash tapes. Go to Shopify.com slash tapes. That's Shopify Mm. It's not in control. Also it would be very easy for somebody now just hold the letterboard and now fade fade it and let the put the ch let the letterboard be on the le on your left hand and let the child spell and now start fading yourself. Fading those prompts, fading those techniques, fading that is also a skill. It just feels like it takes practice. I mean that's what it sounds like. Yes. Yes. Yeah. Patience. I think it's important thing too. I mean for parents or teachers or coaches, like how how can you assure that if you're wanting to teach uh an individual um who's typing to communicate that their thoughts are their own, that their answers are their own? Like we see the difference. What's advice you'd give? We see the difference in the answers. So you can tell when it's your Absolutely, no doubt about it. So what are some I mean, talking about Sienna now, like let's dive into that a little bit. So you've been working with Sienna, Bessie's daughter for help. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it hasn't been that many. Yeah . And how is that going for you? Do you feel hopeful that she's gonna become open? And what are your Yeah, I feel better. I'm more hopeful now. I've been practicing with her more at home. I took I'm taking a spell ers course, not the the Spellers Parent course. Um and it's been helpful. It's it's because you you kind of want I think a big mistake that parents made and I think I made it I you see them open with someone else and you just want to ask them open on the questions right away. And it just doesn't work that way. You have to kind of start at the bottom. It takes time and go up. And so she's doing better now. Now she's before, because I'm her mother and I know her little loops, she's like, she would have the impulse to do the loops with me. Like, you know, say this and I say this, say this and I say this, and we can get caught in this saying these loops all day. Um, but she's kind of slowed down with that now. She's answering the questions. And there's simple questions at this point. It's just spell this word. It's simple. But um but there's progress. So I'm hopeful. I just have to be more consistent in practicing. That's exactly it is you keep on doing, keep on doing, keep and then have a courage to go into that space of asking open-ended questions. Why? And let it flow. Yeah. I have no expectation. Because I think in the beginning I would have the expectation. She wouldn't answer. I would get frustrated and it would be done. And it was and it was my fault because I would want it so bad that I would become frustrated and I know she's feeding on my energy and she would shut down or you know refuse to to continue. So I'm getting better just not even expecting that at this point. It will it will happen. Don't don't give up time. Don't be so hard on yourself. Well it will. And the thing is, I think about some of the non speakers we featured on this show who got open at twenty. Yeah. At twenty six. I know. Eighteen. Like you were starting so young. And what's really kind of exciting to think about is what I've heard from those older parents is, oh my goodness, had I only started when they were nine or ten, what would their life look like now? You know what I mean? So you're always doing I'm already thinking about that with high school. I want to put her in a high school where there's spelling. Yeah. I don't want her to be in regular high school buttons in your position learning um that you know, learning the flow with your daughter, your child and starting the process. Manisha, how how many minutes a day do you think someone should practice with their child? Yeah, depends what at least fifteen minutes to start with every day but then go up to an hour and then what the individual wants to do. If the individual is a is a child who wants to learn a lot of new things and is thriving, yeah. Then you can move for hours and hours. You know, one thing that I feel like has come up a lot and it might be good for both of you to talk about, I think because you're in different perspectives of it, is so many parents are given very little hope and therefore do not presume competence, especially because there's such a behaviorist bent to our society, right? You watch behavior. But from the non speakers that I've interfaced with like talk to, so often what they'll say is like the baseline for communication is being presumed that you're competent, right? It's everything. I know you're smart. I know you're in there. I know you can do this. I have no doubt. Right. And I think for even parents, you don't presume competence for a very long time. Absolutely not. Even when you think you are. Even when you think you are, you think I'm presuming confidence, but then you start to have these little doubts and you can't. You just can't. Well a lot of parents who've even come and hear a talk will say, I'll see other kids learn to spell and learn to communicate and get open and think, Oh, well that's that kid, my kid. Yes, yeah. And that and I loved the spellers movie. It's wonderful. But I the only thing I wish they would have said more was about because they showed how hard it is. The process. Because they showed a lot of kids spelling after like being open after like the second session and that just doesn't that's just not the norm. So I wish they would have kind of talked a little bit about the process more that it's not you just can't stick a keyboard in front of a kid and he's gonna start spelling. No. And I think we but we want it so bad that you really just have to be patient and you just have to be patient and just and go through the process and you will get the reward. But it's just being patient. And it can take months or years. It could take months or years. But you know why? Because I think this is what confuses people, especially people who are spelling skeptics, will say, Well, why can you put a board in front of someone and they can spell with Manisha really well, but not someone at school or not with a parent or a sibling. How do you explain that? I mean, I I want to hear it from that's neuroscience. Autism is very, very new. Okay. Our brain is so hardwired for everybody. I go to a doctor and if I'm not feeling well, first doctor tells me, Don't worry, take this medicine, you'll be it'll be all good. And you just know I take a medicine. Unfortunately for autism, there is no such guarantee. There is no such hope. The box is empty. When a parent like me sees the box is empty, I my perspective was, oh, the box is empty means I can put so many things into that box now. What do you do when you have empty box? If you see a box empty, you're going to put a lot of things. Meaning you're trying different methodologies, treatments. Yes, but that was my perspective. So what you're saying is because there is no across the board treatment for autism or aporexia or the ability to speak could look like an empty box. There's no treatment, sorry. And some parents will just take that as as a death sentence in a way. Like it's the end. There's nothing more we can do. Yeah. Just accept that um our child might be suffering or might not be able to communicate or might have these, you know, um dangerous behaviors that are hurting self self inflicting harm or whatever. But you're saying the another way to look at it is like, oh, there's I'll try everyt Yes. And I'll just start filling the box. Yes. And what's I think the most frustrating thing I would imagine as a parent with a child with autism is that it's different for everyone. It is different for everybody. It's like there's like a million you have a huge thing of keys, ring of keys. And one of them can unlock your child. And you just have to i if some people are lucky and the first key they try it it works. And for other people there's lots of keys and you have to go through a lot of them before you find the one that works. Um on the way here, I was reading um Edu and Autism. Yeah, what a what a great book. I mean and one of the things that he talks about about why he would not spell with some people was because of he would see colors. He would see their aura. And if they were a certain color, he knew that those people are not, or he could just feel whether or not if there was any doubt they wouldn't they wouldn't he couldn't spell either. Exactly. So it was like th they there's a lot that goes into it, I think. I think they see people's uh auras, they s feel energies, doubts, fears, and they just refuse if they some people I I think say they can't or they don't want to. Yeah. Is Sienna open with you yet? I yeah. Yeah, right away. And has g given any information that has been really helpful to you around maybe what she likes or doesn't like I need to I need to see her more because now I know which techniques to use with her. When Siena was first diagnosed at like two years old, we did a lot of biomed stuff. Like first we tried the diet, I did the gluten free, casein free, soy free for like four years. We did so many supplements. I I mean I did cranosaclotherapy. We did a little bit of M NRI reflex integration a little bit. Um but that that requires a you have to be doing with them every single day. I did we did it. Yeah. Which is hard to work. Yeah. I mean there's so I we've tr we tried a lot and we with we spent thousands of dollars and with very little progress. But you know, something like spelling, if I can get her to be open with me, she can tell me what makes her feel good. What what's what what what's helping? What does she feel better if I give her this? If I don't do this, because guessing is hard. It's hard to see, you know, when especially when you're not seeing that much progress. I think it's w definitely worth trying. And I think it's I've seen how it's helped a lot of kids. Kids of my my um of my friends or whatever, but in for some kids, I do think some of them are non responders. And I think my daughter was one of them. She just didn't respond or she responded very negativ ely to we did we tried to do uh chelation. I mean uh and she had a horrible regression with that. I mean, so it's it there's just so much and you and you just have like the all these keys and you have to try them. And I think it's worth trying, but I I reached the point that I said I don't want to do anymore. Yeah, and I've heard this from so many parents. You try everything. And sometimes it doesn't work or it's a net negative. Yeah. And then you're done. It's exhausting. You just give up. Kind of. Yeah. And I and I I I mean my daughter is, you know, she she has some language. I f you know, she's I'm not completely close to trying things, but I've tried so many. And when I tell you so many that I just I I don't know. I just feel like I need for her to spell because I think that's where independence will come or you know, as much as more autonomy. Um and then she can tell me what she wants, what's what's what she needs. And I think and Manisha, this is where you could probably weigh in on this too. You probably meet so many parents through your center who are at the end of the rope, who've tried everything, who have very little hope left. I've heard from a lot of parents who were at that space that the only thing that ended up working and changed in their lives was spelling. Because negative behaviors switched. They were able to figure out what their kid needed or didn't need, even just simple things like meeting parents who said they thought their child loved a cartoon on loop. So they do that. And then when their child starts spelling, they're like, I hate that. It's so frustrating and so annoying. Yeah. And never play that for me again. You know, which you don't know. You think you're doing the right thing. So I mean do you think of of if of all the things parents could try, if you could suggest one one thing, what would it be? It is so hard because every child is different. But you mentioned the word use the word aut autonomy. Autonomy . Brain development. What's that? Brain development. Brain development. Our kids' brain is not maturing. Our kids' reflexes are not integrated. They have a lot of inflammation in the body. Something that has helped though, uh at around eleven, around ten years old, she started to show signs of um puberty. Um and then her behaviors got really bad. And I was at my wits' end and I didn't know what to do. So I I what I did what I never thought I would do and I I went to a psychiatrist and she's on so loft, and it's been wonderful. Really? And I never thought in a million years I would try, but she needed it. It it's just it just calmed her down. It's the anxiety is so much better Wow, that's fascinating. How have you reconciled now the telepathy with the very um almost like fearful religious point of view of this is dark or is this something dangerous? I think anyone should read the Book of Heaven because when I heard about Katie and Houston and how how he was very spiritual and and I read the book and it just completely changed the mind. Just I I just there there's no way you can read that book and r read Eusta in's thoughts and think there's anything demonic about it. In those dark moments with with autism, you're you're seeing kids suffer and you're suffering and you're like where's God in this? And then to learn about he's been with them this whole time. Yes. He's been there. He's been there. He found a way to reach them when we couldn't, you know, it's just to me, it was so comforting. It's like a comforting, like he's been there the whole time. He's found a way to bring peace to our kids when they didn't have peace in this world. I mean, to me, it was it i was the complete opposite of demonic. It was beautiful. And I think just to add to that, which is so I think important, right, is that you know, there's people in our film, Hindu, um, Orthodox, Jewish, Christian, Muslim , I mean, or that like in the telephone Davis universe that we've talked to, or agnostic. And the wonderful, most amazing thing is once the children start spelling openly, even if the parents weren't deeply devoutly religious in whatever in whatever um denomination they come from, the kids seem to have this profound deep connection with God. Absolutely. And also quite often we'll talk about spending time somewhere else with with God or with uh you know, I don't even know what. Um, but it's really beautiful. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. And I don't know how you can hear that and s and hear those words and hear it from these non-speakers and think that there's anything negative about it. Like how can you believe that? It's almost God's way of keeping them connected because they know that kids need connection and we all need connection and that's and they didn't have the ability to connect in this physical world. So he did in the spiritual world. To me, it was so comforting that all those times that I was like, where are you, God? He was there. He was there all along with our with our babies. And it's it's bearing beautiful things. Love. It's love. So how can you see anything see it as anything other than than