Listener Question on Zone Two Training

They say you can tell a lot about a person by the contents of their freezer So what does the bottle Jaggermmeister say? It says you have standards. You don't cut corners. And you like your Jagermeister shots the way they're meant to be enjoyed. Ice cold. As for the frozen teiquitos and mystery leftovers, wellll keep that between us. Drink it cold or don't drink it at all. Jagereister. Damn, that's cold Drink responsibly. Jaggermeister Leor thirty five percentcohol volume imported by Mass Jagereister, US White Ples, New Yor I'm Manning. I'madisoninner, I'mv Yov.'m Coria Mooore. want to train like a Red Bowl athlete. Tell us your fitness goals this summer to enter the Red Bowull Athlete challenge. You'll get to try each of our workouts for a chance to win an ultimate Red Bull experience. D you have what it takes Today's show is supported by Garmin, and thanks to their tax trainers, I don't even have to leave the house to get a proper ride in Mine is literally set up all year round. There are so many reasons that I jump on it instead of heading outside, like when it's snowy or icy. Or I just want to do some clean intervals. Or I don't have much time. Or I'm dog sitting? Or I want to ride at unsafe times of the day. Indoor training is totally different and a much more pleasant experience now than it was when I started cycling Yeah, stuff like the motion plates are a game changer. You just have way more ability to simulate a real ride. The road feels, steep virtual climbs sprinting. And when you pair taxs with an edge head unit, rally power pedals, your Garmin watch, or a heart rate monitor, you get a full indoor outdoor training system backed up by heaps of data. So big thanks to Garmin supporting the show It's the wor Welcome to the World Oes podcast, the show where we chat about bike stuff. I am here with Jimmy Hello Emily Hello and myself And thank you Igamman for support in the show How are we all? Oh had a weird sleep. because Danny is on night shifts, my wife And my wife. I fell asleep like really early because I did lots of cycling yesterday so I was just, you know, like tired. So I went to Sleep on the sofa nine PM. And then because she's on weird night shifts, she was awake in the middle of the night and then she ordered a pizza woke me up. so I ate pizza. I had it like half asleep, woke up, I was like, o, pizza. ate loads of pizza and then immedately went back to sleep. So weird that my watch didn't even recognize any of it as aleep. Oh, So I don't know if I'm recovered, more recovered like a midnight sn Is it bad for you? Probably I mean you gota eat. M's got to eight. Ask your wife, I don't know if she's a doctor, she knows. Yeah, yeah. She did it, so You can only assume she only does healthy things that doctors would recommend I like how when you were telling that first anecdote as well, Francis, you skimmed over the cycling part of your day so quickly. Is there anything since we're on a cyling podcast, you want to tell us anything about your lovely ride and that you've been doing Oh, can I I No, I have to keep the bike secret I'm testing another bike. Okay, But it's a secret. What ride did you do? was it fun Yes Okay, great. On the subject of cycling, I do have a question for you guys Mm thinking about building a bike Yeah that's a good conversation. is it? It's auding podcast. Yeah. as producer of this show, yes, as your wife Annoying So what I'm thinking is I did it once before and I hated it, but I'm convinced I'm going to like it this time.. I think I want a flat bark street fighter commuter. So one by flat bar steel so you can lock it up get some of those through axles which are like bolt on ones so someone can't steal your wheels if you lock it up outside a shop. What I'm missing is a bike that I can lock up outside a shop or a coffee shop or something like that Where are you gonna to ride it? That isn't hilly. To work Well no, it will be hilly. It's got gears. It's like a street fighter, so it'll be like a one by mullety kind of setup. Okay, right, so fine I thought I was just my head had single speed, which would be Yeah, I would really stupid. Yeah, I know, it'd be lovely though. That's what. if where we lived was flat, I would still have a steel single speed with a basket on the front with super narrow bars, but it doesn't work for where we live. So what I'm thinking is that bike, which that type of bike, which I miss so much, but giveive it Um, a decent range of gearsar so you can spin up anything nice and slow. You can wear normal clothes and not get sweaty because the gear is so easy. a flat bar but not super, super wide What do you think I sounds sick whyy do you need a lot But where are you going at that? you need to lookck up your bike He never goes anywhere. Coffee shop The supermarket? sorry, N me one coffee shop that you frequent where you need to lock up your bike that has bike locks available. You're so friendly with the man who I' sorry, I can't remember his name, but he's a very nice man and he would let you just put your bike wherever. You sit outside with. You only go to one coffee shop. Yeah, you literally sit outside. it's a massive glass window. Yeah, in Durham. But sometimes I want to go to a different coffee shop No, it's Monday's M No, what He' closed on Tuesday Thursday Tuesday. Yeah. Why? I know, I was very upset this morning when I went there. I do it every Tuesday. I sure every Tuesday 'a it's podcast day I'm be like, yeah, I'm gonna get caffeinated. Truth. Every single day. a month with you and we went every single Tuesday. We do it again today. It's dark in there, I made some bike upgrades or adjustments. You know my rim brake bike, which I just defaulted to Ah, you won't fit big tyres in this bike. so I've been running I think a twenty five on the back twenty three on the front. what I found online Turns out you can fit thiries. And it has completely made the bike thousand times better. Yeah. Nice. T what a surprise They look cool as well. They're big fat tores. I squish thirties into my steel moss bike, I think last summer and uh it is very ose but it' road bikees so it's fine. U And yeah, it it's mad how much of a difference it makes. Yeah Have we talked about bikes notoughhing now? Yeah lovely. Thank you for reminding me that we do talk about or we do stuff with bikes a lot of the time. Francis, you came up with a fantastic new phrase this week Have you heard the term lightning in a bottle Yeah, I'm asking the audience. I'm not expecting a reply because that's not how this format works. But lightightenning a bottle It means sort of, I guess to achieve something incredible or special. especially if it's, you know, been like a stroke of luck, we were asked to record a little promo for radio this week so it might go out on but it should go out on UK radio stations. So hello, if you join us from that. We sat down to record this thing And I said, shouldhould we have a little practice run through first? And I said, you know what? Let's actually record it because what happens if the first take? we just absolutely crush it is you know, we might catch lightning in a bottle. I recorded it. We did the take. And what did you call it, Francis? Well, I thought I was saying the same thing as you Or it might be us working out what the best value for money bike upgrades are.ilers It's Tres. I knew you were going to say tyres. He always says tyres. This like. This is liquid in a bottle. liquid in a bottle This I should down wride. This is like liquid in a bottlea. That should be our taglights. liquid in a bottle Unfortunately, I haven't made a song yet called Liquid in a bottle, but coming to a Sotify comoming to a podcast near you some point twenty twenty eight It's a really boring song. Well it kind of to me, it really feels like it's a country song I think it might be the first country song I ever make Yeah, well country songs often involve liquids and bt L whiskey in the lyrics Yeah, yeah, yeah It like a secret farm where in the back they're actually like brewing moonshine or something. They liquid in a bottle as opposed to lighten in a bott. But noah yeah, this is high up on my list of songs to actually create So into the news. F, cycling Instagram lost its mind after a brown pinarello turned up on the Louis Vuitton Catwalk at Paris Fashion Week. they dressed one of the models in full brown lycra and made him carry a dogam F down the runway I make him ride it It was on sand That's why. Yeah The bike is ridiculous. It's a dark brown frame, dark brown wheels, gold logos, the saddle and bar tape are Light tan leather with a classic Louis Vuitton pattern all over the saddle. The pattern continues down the fork, which is finished in a chrome silver to match the stem And there's a massive aerrow derailleur faring around the cage. You got T Spoke Princeton Carbon Wks wheels with little funny little logos on them. Well it's definitely very Louis Vitton. The brown is obviously because that's a nod to all of the leather stuff that they do. I've never this is I'm not look I'm not the audience. I don't know what Louis Vuitton really is All of those brands, I don't get it. I just see it's just for other people. You know when things are just, you know. So you just don't even doesn't even register in my brain Is it Chanel? Is another one? same thing Chanel is a brand brand. yeah. Francis, you need to have a walk down a seafront in southern Europe and have a look in all of like the hooky designer shops because you'll see loads of it. Like Monaco. No, more like More like Maglf. ye. Oh, okay, right, ye. A. Aacany. The bike lookooks shed, doesn't it I think the reason these awful thing I saw, absolutely awful You know what's funny? I went on the, u I went Louis Vuitton subredreddit just to see what people It was the first thing that came up when I googled this bike earlier. and the people on there are like rothing for it for the b. getting one of it. yeah. yeah. I mean, different strokes for different folks. Pinarellas are very marmide because of their quirky shape. this might be the most marmitey pinarello ever because it is literally the perfect shade of marmite. They grow on you, though, don't they? The normal Pinearellos We me and Jimmy were like for a long time and then they just You see them more It's like when they release a new pair of Oakleys and you're like, U And then six months later, you're like, And then a year later you're wearing them. P me again. It's because Pinell' growing you Every time they release one that's a bit more ridiculous, so the previous generations all of a sudden start to look like. too small. ye the model, I assume his name is probably Hanssel It's so hot right now. Everything about him says surfer. he's got long hair, he's got a baseball cap, he's wearing plimsoles. And also clearly that is a wetsuit that he's wearing because I have zoomed in just to check for scientific reasons there's not a single bit of chamois padding. but I swear. a wet suuit Do you think it's a wet? It's a wet suuit. Not mention the entire short is set on a fake beach. There's literally water and sand everywhere. That's not going to be neoprene surely Well, I don't know, I'm not convinced. I can only assume that he was meant to be carrying a surfboard down the runway and it somehow got like destroyed in a tragic gasoline fight accident minutes before the way he went. So they had to give him a bike to carry instead. Well, I think the reason he's carrying it rather than riding it or pushing it is because they're just exclusively treating it as an accessory It's like the ultimate accessory. What I quite like is that he's nearly doing demonstrating a good cyclocross carry. He is Not quite It's supposed to be under and then grab the handlebar, but it's pretty close So this beach is just a section of a longer circuit what're saying. we actually don't have photos of the other sides where it's like a mad crit coursese. Yeah Oh.'s he's in the lead so much so that he's chill when he's walking this bit. Yeahep. orr he's a triathlete suit 's just he's just signed on and he's going to take his bike to transition. Do doesn't want to risk getting a puncher. He looks like in one of the photos he's about to get mugged byy a hoodie behind him. Oh yeah, she's just popped out to tescort to get herself a couple of bits in goire So wherever. Yeah, odd. I mean, this is it. truly the point of these things is to get attention so well done. Like Der leaked Terileaked. The person in the background of that shot that's on their way to Tesco looks a bit derileaked. Terileaked Okay, well in other news, someone just broke the Tour divide course record I think you're going gonna like this guy found this story, I was like, I need to tell Jimmy and Francis about this. Firstly, what is the Tour divide? It's a self supported ultra distance mountain bike race. It goes from the top of Canada to the US. Mexican border, four thousand four hundred kilometers or two thousand seven hundred miles ish. It follows the Great Divide Mountain bike route which goes through the Rocky mountains. there's Book at tone of elevation. It's just epic Anyway A guy called Victor Busony just won. beat the course record by eleven hours. He finished in eleven days, eight hours, thirty seven minutes And Fort Rad CC Unlike other ultra distant cyclists who might be tempted to plow deep into the night Bunny swore by eight hours of sleep a night and indoors What a legend. My man including rests he average sixteen kilometers per hour, ten miles an hour He's your guy. I had to include this because in recent episodes We have mentioned a couple of times bike packing We include sleeping in hotels, getting a good night's rest It still counts as bike packing. And I think if someone can win, not only win to a divide, but smash the course record eight hours sleep a night Cy in. Ultra races is even more like I filmed transcidental three or four The winners book hotels Against the rules, definitely. they sleep in hotels. Wait no, I won't incriminate them. I don't know if they pre book them, but they may well pre book them, but I do not know for sure. However they definitely exclusively sleep in hotels and just plan their routes really well becausecause it's way better rest Even though they're probably only in there for about four hours at a time it's just fourour hours of sleep three hours fifty min ofleep. U Do you think he woke up had a pizza halfway through his sleooep? Probablybe It would be good for Ultra Imagine how its like a lot of ultra success is just down to how much you can Stomach, isn't it? I think nearly all of it I always remember a really good long distance triathlete that I knew he said to me when I was considering doing a long distance triathon, he was like, Don't worry about it. It's just an eating competition. I was like Do you see this? This is not cycling, but Russ Edgeley Youo you heard of this guy? M S swimmer. Strong manan, I think. He's swam perimeter of Britain. Over the course of one hundred and fifty seven days not setting foot on land once. swam for six hours on, six hours off continuously Where was he sleeping in a boat or something? On a boat So we had a support crew that would just like throw food in Oh, L it like a duck. I don't know what that what does the six hours off look like How much of that is sleep? Ross Edley is a really interesting person. He's done some Bonker stuff one of I think he's done triathlon where he carried a massive tree on his back He's done, I think he's run around the perimeter of the UK. The bit that made that he went mainstream with was he did a cut A weight gain and cut in two days or something rather. Dude' very so jacked what It was first he was one of the really early people to demonstrate that actually you can lose loads of body weight really fast, but you'll put it instantly back on again. It was kind of like an exaggeration of This is what happens when you deplete your body mostly of water in a very small space. And he did it at a really like extreme dangerous level, but it was all medically monitored and everything. He's really interesting person. just saw a picture of his hand after he'd been swimming This whole time you have been talking, I have not been able to concentrate because I was thinking about what would being in water for that long d to your fingers. Yeah. Even if I go in the bath, I have to sit in the bath with my hands just out because I can't Oh, you want them in. No''s it's a survival mechanism, isn't it It gives you grip. That's the point. So if you're in water, then your fingers go wrinkly and then you can grip stuff. So if you get stuck in the bath because you've been like this, never get out, that's your fault Okay. It's like Emy's been in the bar for seven hours, where It's like spiders. I've gone down a Ros Ross Edgeley rabbit hole He did A marathison Silverson race circuit where he pulled a four thousandteen hundred kilogram car He's done the world's longest rope climb He's climbed the height of Everest on a rope 's a real ever. That's way better. And yeah, there's absolutely bucket looads of swimming ones as well. That' cool though, isn't it? That's basically being kid to like be a big kid. It's extreme, but it's basically just play, isn't it Is it? No, France that says no At what point do you think it felt like, how long did it feel like play the perarom? What six hour was he on before he was like, all right, actually this really is just swimming around the perarom. Yes, but I would still rather do that than a hundred mile bike ride. Yeah as a lovely nod to last week.. We were still talking about this morning. We went on a run this morning and they're still arguing about that. I explained it in a way and I can't remember it was and you said, Ohh, that was a much better way of explaining. What you said is one hundred miles feels very hard but not far enough to be rewarding. So the effort for reward is low for you. Whereas two hundred kilometers, that extra twenty four miles, really mixing measurements measurements here. Yeah, that extra thing feels, yes, still hard, but way more rewarding as well the effort for reward goes way up for you. Yeah. That's what he said to me. And I still disagree personally, but it made more sense to me. I agree. Easiest one hundred miles I've ever done was when I did five hundred K. first bit was fine first hundred miles easy. And that's what Ross Egey says as well. swimming around Wales He's a piss. round the whole UK hard Whereas if he just done around Wales, he would have said swimming around Wales is really hard See what I'm saying? Yes What would his Cycling challenge be if if he were to do one We has he's an Olympic triathlon with a forty five kilo log. So he has done bike stuff I've got this The foe he does he has a log on his back On the bike On the bike, yeah. Yeahah it is good lad. What would his cycling challenge be? That's the question Francis asked. Probably to cycle to the moon or around the moon or something or rather carrying four hundred worlds on his back Gravity is less there, so, that's fair. That's true. It's got to be pulling a car or something, doesn't it? Yeah. If you rode too fast on the moon you would just Fly off the moon. Just worry Did you see that they're planning to get to Mars by launching from the Mon So currently all of the space race to the moon. Did you tell me that? Yeah. I was like Y. No I think it's just an idea because it would be much easier getting off the moon because there's less gravity. So you build a track, pretty much a straight track, wait for it to align and it doesn't take much energy to like nudge something and it just gets faster than then goes Take your flexibility beyond the mat PayPal Pay nothing at checkout. Then enjoy a flexible monthly payment plan that works for you. withith no sign up or late fees. Find yours then, and an easy way to pay. With PayPal. downownload the PayPal app to get started. Subject to approval. pay mononthly consonsumer loans made by WebBank. Available through PayPaling N ML nine one zero four fivety seven. Learn more at payPal d. com slash pay monthly This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a fifty page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online makes sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check Respononses set upp required compatibility and availability varies eighteen plus So good, so good, so good. New summer arrivals are at Nordstrom Rack stores now. Get ready to save big with up to sixty percent off brands like Rag and Bone, Levi', Adidas, and Free People. Join the Nordy Cub to unlock exclusive discounts, shop new arrivals first, and more. Plus, buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for free Great brands, great prices. That's why you rack want to move us on Franc Next, bike Radar has been kicking off about the price of cycling shoes. Their tech editor thinks we're being fleeced. He used football or soccer as an example French superstar Killian Mbae, one of the best players in the world, is currently playing in the World Cup in a pair of Kkes costing two hundred and seventy five pounds or three hundred and sixty four dollars Is it Nike' or Nkes I think it's Nike. Meanwhile, the DMT shoes Tade Picato will wear at the tour are about sixty percent more expensive. That's another hundred and sixty five pounds or roughly two hundred and twenty dollars Both are top spec performance shoes with features like three D knitted uppers and lightweight lace systems, and it's not just football C comppare cycling with basketball or cricket and you'll see the same thing. Cycling shoes are consistently the more expensive option What's more? Bike radar points to research showing that super stiff top end shoes offer very little real world performance benefit. This was a study by the University of Colorado, and it found that while very soft shoes can waste a bit of power, Most modern cycling shoes are already stiff enough that spending hundreds more on ultra stiff soles adds very little Comfort, fit, and how efficiently you can saain power over time are far more important. So their conclusion was you can probably save yourself some money and go mid range It's good enough Have you guys ever ridden like a plastic sooul shoe? Now you've had a taste of Yes. Did you have a miserable experience like I did? I wouldn't say it's miserable. It's it's more I used to ride in shoes quite a lot Just normal peoplee's shoes it's more you've got a big pedal platform. Yeah. I would you sometimes use them just with SPDs U, you just notice that there's peddle under your foot more Mhm. I use them particularly what noticeable in gravel shoes because The pedal is much smaller I had some flexy soul plastic plastic reinforced plastic shoes, not carbon and I got foot pain. Be the whole sole flexes around where the pedal where the cleat's bolted on I guess it's less of a problem with road shoes because it's Free bolts, bigger platform. So it doesn't flex as much But definitely like mid range I would my recommendation would be like get into the carbon zone price range and then you're fine. It't you don't really need much more than that Yeah, I think it feels like that's what the research is suggesting. Stiff will benefit you ultra stiff will not benefit you that much more And I actually think a lot of people get discomfort from ultra stiff as well Because then all of a sudden you get this really, really, really flat form that you're pushing against, which is then goes, well, then you have to get super expensive insoles to go along with them. Yeah, I guess it's like anything, isn't it? It's diminishing returns. The more you spend, the more you get and there's a point where it clattertles, but the price Uh, can increase Dale exponentially in some cases The comparison with football Is that like comparing apppples toranges? I mean, they I get the point of this is that like they're both specialists, they both you know talk about technologies that increase performance, they obviously function differently B truly and NIC benefits hugely from economies of scale that cycling could never even dream of. I definitely have no interest in supporting the really high cost of cycling shoes, but it does Uh, Cercially makeakes sense why in such a niche they cost significantly more than the equivalent Nike or Nike, whatever you want to call it sh. For me, the biggest issue with the cycling industry is that they keep telling normal people that they should be buying the same stuff as the professionals and actually that isn't correct. I wish the bike industry told people more that actually they just need the right, good, comfortable stuff, and that if you really want to strive for those marginal, marginal, marginal performance gains then you can consider the more premium options. That doesn't mean that you can't buy them if you can afford them, but you definitely don't need them. Nike used to make cycling shoes, didn't they? I've got them. I've got two pairs. Were they a coub like cities or something Well the research suggests that no, they were actually manufacturing them, but they were they are made. The ones I've got are definitely very old. Yeah. they are incredibly comfortable as well. It's a really, really comfortable shoe considering how old it is And they are handmade in Italy I think it was like late nineties, early nineties. I wonder if it spanned over the Lance Armstrong era. in Nike sponsored. But actually cycling Nike still are making cycling shoes, but again, it's the same as Adidas. They're doing like well, no, no, they're doing like it's like a spinning shoe. They did some shoes for Adam Blye He was like a sponsored athlete when he was racing. And they I'm just reading now like They were custom one off cycling prototypes that never made available to the public, but they He posted about he'd be like, my new nkes and they were like with Nike logo on the side Lgit cycling shoes, Cb and sole, everything. Cav as well. Cv used to get them. And I believe they were not They were special edition ones that they were making in Italy with by a reputable Italian brand. but Nike do have a sppinning shoe as well. Interesting Or at least they did, I don't know if's been discontinued I like oh put costs into perspective Bike Fit James tried to launch a shoe brand U Well, no, he thought about launching a shoe. He was getting annoyed about cycling shoes and there not being enough sizes and half sizes and all these things and he was like I just to launch my own They did some research into it Uh and It was over a hundred thousand pounds to just open the lasts for six sizes which as you can imagine, is not enough sizes. notot enough size range or No half sizes and then you're completely like it's just a pointless. It's so expensive So expensive. And that's without all the other hidden costs going to be a million other things to think about launching a product business as you guys know Well, on the subject of cycling shoes, I can give you an update on my Hezo three D printed shoes which I ordered in Oh. This is not sponsored and we still don't know whether you're gonna to get them or not. Well, I think I am. They are currently being printed, but they have been being printed for the last three and a half weeks That's the update. Okay, great, cool. Oh I thought that was b you really built that up Jimmy? Well I'm still really looking forward to them because I've got such weird shaped feet, but is this is like The perhaps antidote to things like Bite fit James' issues is that well, yes, yout you don't need a labgh. M' a custom one. And you don't need looads of stock because actually you can print on demand provided you have enough printers, which is then where the issue comes. Will they' be stiff if they're three D printed? Uh they are stiff They have a yes. Okay Their road ones are even stiffer They will be stiff We'll find out if they show up Moving on, professional rider Paul Sixas is just days away from making his tour de France debut and at just nineteen years old, he'll become the youngest rider to start the tour since nineteen thirty seven not just there to make up the numbers, he's actually De Cathalon's main GC hope And before he's even touched down in Barcelona are ready for this Saturday's opening team time trial stage, rumors are already swirling that he's just been offered the biggest contract in cycling history. So according to journalist Daniel Benson, Pinarello Q thirty six point five are keen to snatch him up once his contract expires next year, and they're considering an annual salary of thirteen million euros. That's roughly two hundred fifty thousand euros a week before bonuses. It's also five million euros more than the basic wage Tade Pagaca reportedly is paid by teeam UAE Emirates The talk is UAE also want to recruit Paul, as does Visma, as does L Trek and net company Inios apparently and obviously De Castlon don't want to let him go either. So a bidding wall. I would love to be his agent right now.. That' so much fun. Right yeah. This is the sort of story you want in the media, right? Now, if you' knew to pro racing, you might be thinking, I've never heard this guy's name before. I've never seen him monog grand to a startline. What is all the fuss about? act you'd be correct, yes, this is his first one. It's his potential that interests teams. Essentially, some people think that he could be Cycling's next big superstar. He's already winning stage races and classics at just nineteen, which is incredibly rare and inevitably comparisons to a young Pagaca have already started. So I would say his stock is soaring right now thanks in a small part to some viral Instagram Songs Paul suuccess You're too good to just be Pacar successor. Do you want to spend your winters riding on to in the desert? Do you wantna rich upmill watch or a statue in my garden? and get you that my sculpt to know if you'd like stainless steel or marble And how lame would it have been if we had Jonas and M Gar on the same team and how cool to be their ass on a a Kathlon bike here the next you know, The chosen one would want someone think of me? Fall success, Please don't sign for U AE. He's got talent. bags are potential, but I think actually it really comes down to whether he can handle grand tours, stay consistent over several seasons, and most importantly cope with the pressure and the expectation because there is a lot of attention and eyes on him right now Sometimes pressure makes diamonds Sometimes it just stuff So it will be interesting to see how he progresses. I hope he does really well. I think it'll be really interesting to see how he performs at this tour. It's a horrible, horrible amount of pressure to put on such a young person, isn't it? Isn't it? Absolutely horrid. Yeah. I just think like, you know Pagaca and Jonas Vingigo were also spotted incredibly early. There would have been internally a lot of talk about wow these guys' numbers are insane, but I don't think that translated to like the virality around Paul's success, like just from the general public seemems, maybe it's just my Instagrama algorithm. It just seems huge. and not creates a different level of expectation, doesn't it? It is kind of an odd time as well, isn't it? is one of the reasons that people are really excited for him because people are bored of seeing Pogata being so dominant. So they're desperate for someone to challenge him. because it's you know, it's clearly documented now that no one can challenge PG So is that why people are so excited about him Or is it because he's Fren of bit of all just fits the narrative. Yeah, I think it's both of those things probably. I guess if if you aren't aware of why I say French The French veryer, very, very desperate to have France back at the top of Tour de France winers. Yeah. I would say curveball and I did I was reading a commentary on this last week. People are looking Paul's successors away and maybe sleeping a little bit on someone like an Dol Toro is at Dol Toro. He is twenty two also making his tour debut. almost won the o and I would say if he was on any other team the Well, not maybe any other team, but a lot of other teams could be a GC leader. But he's with UAE. so he's there to do one job, support Taddy Pagacha as a domestique I wouldn't be surprised though you know, it's not uncommon that The a really great domestique will also end up in the top ten, top five. I don't know very, very early predictions. What I'm saying is I think actually what Del Toro benefits from is bit of shade. A bit of shade. It's great for Del Toro Do you not think Jonas has massive potential to actually come back and be a competitor because of his horrible crash that he had and now he's starting to recover better from like the injuries that he had when he crashed. Well, ridiculous. Like when me and Danny went through them, she's like, I don't know how the hell he was back on a bike so quick and all this stuff. Recovery takes longer than yeah So surely could he could come back this year and just actually be a competitor. He absolutely could. Yeah, they're saying that this is his Best and cleanest run up to a tour since that crash, which I think was twenty twenty four. It was the itulia Bassque country. he went into a ditch really horrible internal injuries. We talk about Physical recovery as well. I think there was a lot of mental recovery that had to happen there as well. It gets it gets so into your head. I don't know whether you're a professional or not you know, if you are unfortunate enough to to have had a nasty crash on a bike It does, it just gets into your head. Th those split second decisions are slightly slower Should I take that risk? No, I'll go on then. Should I do that one? No, I'll go on then. Whereas if you're at that level, you can't hesitate ever. U I'm I'm looking forward to Yonas. I think he's going to do well. Absolutely. And this is it. None of us have a crystal ball. like we don't know what's going to happen. you know, if you you can make a prediction and if it's right and go, I told you so, but actually none of us We don't know what's going to happen. You cannot count Janna's finger go out and that's not that's not why I I haven't counted about and that's not why I didn't talk about him. I was trying to focus on people who are up and coming, but yes, you're right. it's I am very, very excited for this tour. I think there's It'll be exciting to watch Pog, it'll be exciting to watch Yonas. and I think there's so much exciting young talent coming through. Isn't the course is horrible as well in a good way. Isn't it like massively savage compared in like people are like, what the hell have you done? of course I don't know. I haven't actually looked that much into it. I haven't either actually. I think there's a mountain stage really early on, isn't it? Because they're in Barcelona and I feel like they end up in the Pyrenees quicker and they're doing Is it Al Duez twice? Well we've got one of the hardest routes in modern cycling history It has fifty four fifty four and a half thousand meters of climbing I would imagine they've built a course pul in yellow for at least some of the stages. They're probably hoping that he will get he will he will get and hold yellow for like that first ten to twelve stages, which is typically where the GC boys will go you know, they don't really want yellow until the back end of the race because of all of the additional requirements associated with being in yellow, but they will love him being in it for a period of time. Is he going in your fantasy league, Jimmy? Wh Pull success. I don't know if I want to give that information out yet. Oh, okay. fine. Yes He is. Yeah, of course he is. he's a wild card. He's a GC rider, but He isn't realistically going into that race thinking I'm going to win the tour de France. He's going into it thinking I want to make a name for myself so I get my thirteen million euro contract Yeah. So how does he do that? He makeakes sure he spends some time in the yellow Him coming second is less important than him going, well, I won three stages and I was in yellow for eight stages Mhm gets you a thirteen million euro contract. It' backwards tour where the sprint stages are later, which some people are really upset about I like that. mix it up. The team time trial in the first day is a bit of a deflation. Is that what it is? Yeah, but fine, we'll accept it. I find Team Ch time trials so odd They are odd Be everyone benefits or is disadvantaged by the team's ability to time trial it's just so wious So bringing it back r ono Paul, mayaybe he'll be a future tour de France winner, mayaybe not, We'll have to wait and see, but it did get me thinking how much is winning the tour de France actually worth? The answer is a lot more than just the prize money that you get at the end of the three weeks The real cash comes from the bonuses, the commercial deals, the sponsorships, the merch, the leverage future contract negotiations after you win. So I thought that I'd look into the earnings of the most notable winner from recent years, Mrter Tadee Pagaca and see how it all breaks down So let's start with his UAE team salary Currently, he is the highest paid cyclist in the world with a base salary of around eight million euros a year. Then there's bonuses that he gets from the team for winning races Winning the tour de France itself is believed to net him a one million pound bonus. If you're interested, you would get a bonus of five hundred thousand euros for the Giro and Vela, reportedly, two hundred fifty thousand euros for the worlds. So last year, he did the tour, he did the worldorlds. that alone would have earned him one point two million euros in bonuses. Not bad. I mean it makes sense why he wants to win so much, right Great if you live in Monaca Why is that Francis nice place to live Next, the sponsorships and endorsements When you are a four time tour de France winner Ething you touch turnurns to sold. I nearly did that to gold and then I realized it was a pun that you'd written on purpose. It was a pun. V good Thanks Colnago, for example, have seen huge profit growth and they themselves credit largely to the Pagacha effect It's estimated that he gets around two million euros a year from personal sponsors like Cornago bikes, DMT shoes, met helmets, Continental Tres, the Richard Mill watch. Richard. I find the personal sponsorship thing when they're the same as the team spponsors just quite odd We've seen it in the past with cavs brought b bikes around to different sponsors Sagan did the same. I'm sure there's plenty of other examples. And it just like It feels weird to me. whyy are they not just sponsoring the team and they receives it from the team. Why is there then personal sponsorships as well? Because I guess like in off time he's still posting to millions of people on Instagram. but he would still have to use his team stuff as part of his contract. That's normal. Well, if you're a good Jimmy, you want to be a good agent and say, well, you know, I'm in my work. when I'm in my off time, I'm not wearing my work uniform unless you pay me extra to do it But you'd have to. It'd be in the contract from always being in teeam kit. That's just how it works. Well, maybe when you've had a picacha and you're so big you can negotiate other things They're bigger than the teams almost. Yeah like the deals they're doing are bigger than the what the teeams are being paid He also signed a slightly controversial deal at the start of the year to be the global ambassador for a cryptocurrency exchange website called Kucoin Some estimates suggest that could have been worth an extra couple of million euros. So if we add that all togetherher, it would be somewhere around the four million euro mark off spponsorships and endorsements Next is the merch. If you pop to Poggy's official website, you'll find t shirts replica jerseys, bibbs, mugs, capps, the works. He also reportedly gets paid royalties for limited edition collabs with portions of proceeds benefit in stuff like the Tade Pagacha Foundation for Cancer Research Several reports estimate merchandise could contribute around another one million euros And finally, the prize money for the race itself, which actually represents the smallest proportion of his earnings. So last year, Tad's win netted Team UAE five hundred thousand euros in prize money. He also scooped forty four thousand euros for four stage wins, twenty five thousand euros for the King of the Mountains jersey, as well as a couple of hundred extra for other minor prizes, altogether around six hundred twenty seven thousand euros Bought cycling is a team sport. So that money typically gets shared around not just amongst the riders, but all of the staff as well. You have to think you know it's not just the DSs in the car, it's the Swannies, it's the Bike mechanics, it's everyone involved in the team. Every team has its own formula for how the money's divided up and the split isn't public Even in a tour where he dominates almost every stage, the prize money is still basically a rounding error at the end when trying to compare his salary and sponsorship income. the total for Tour bonuses, prize money and all of the related stuff that comes off the back of being a tour de France winner. estimated roughly fourteen million euros a year Sounds like a lot of money. It does, yes. I would say when you compare it to other sports, I mean, we were talking about Killian and Bapppe, for example, earlier, I would say they're on a similar level status wise, prestige wise. How so Within their sports, they're known as some of the greatestithin their sports Yeah o, yeah. But in terms of estimated earnings Killian would blow Tade out of the water. But again, going back to the shoes thing, you kind of can't compare because Botball, soccer is the biggest sport in the world and cycling is a niche But still, he's not doing too badly. I'm not getting out the tiny violins just yet. Really the way if you want to make a lot of bank in the cycling game is you have to find a way to break through the mainstream and collect lots of money from personal sponsors. Prime example being Lance Armstrong see was apparently on an estimated thirty million dollars per year in salary and sponsorship deals at the his peak from, you know, brands like Nike, Subaru and that is purely down to the fact that his story, his performance, whatever it was, his Jun sequix through to the mainstream I do think that's quite or at least the bit where you're saying about the personal sponsorship. Yes.. I think it is very typical for prize winnings to not be as high as the personal sponsorships. An anomaly to that is possibly professional boxing. because the actual purse in a boxing fight for the top fighters in the world will be hundreds of millions. their actual earnings for the entry because they'll get a proportion of payer view and things like that whereas in lots of sports such as Christardo and Ronald, he's not a good example because his salary is massive because he's out in Saudi Arabia. but A lot of your top end athletes, their salaries are high, very high, but then their personal stuff is what really, really elevates it huge. And that's what we're seeing with Taday as well. Which makes you think what's if Paul fix us that I said. J say it fast and then Well success. Yeah. if he u does reach the potential of what people are hoping, then he probably is like you say going to hit this level of wealth that we've never seen in the sport. Yeah or he'll be like the man who had the highest VO two Maxs ever recorded. Do you remember this story? He was very young And then all of the expectation just made him implad. And then I think he became like a psychology teacher or something like that. That brings. That' sad, isn't it? Yes so much pressure. people people, you know People arrguably might have better lives if they leave and do something else? Correct. Bike racing's like a pretty tenense lifestyle isn't it? Yes. I mean, I don't know, but yes, I would say from the outside look it looks it looks like an intense lifestyle.. It's a lot of hotels and being away from family and things like that. I think that I don't think there's a sport in the world that isn't like that apart from maybe darts where they actually they get to kind of tart around in pubs and get paid millions and millions. But like, you know, football players are on the road On the road all the time, have to train loads of times a week. probably gets dumbed down a little bit in that they get the summer offarent or it feels like they get the summer off, but actually they'll probably only take about two or three weeks off and they play Playstation all the time. But actually that is legitimately part of recovery. It's the same for cyclists. They'll go out and do a massive ride and they'll spend the rest of the day chilling T trying to do stuff. Yeah, exactly. it's Thankfully, the careas are relatively short and it's like a chapter in someone's life afterwards and they go can do other stuff. What's like Cav who had a relatively long career Isn't he Starting a team Oviously just loves cycling. Yeah, but there's loads of people who've retired and just started a Fm and things it's cool. It's like a different phase of life If there is a sport where the top tier athletes are underpaid, It is rugby Union. I don't know the difference between rugby and rugby union players dem it is rugby. It's just the rugby you will have seen Um The they are the top players are as famous as Tour de France people just in different Faces Faces. It's the viewers that they get is probably higher because It's huge. And yet a top end a top. I think Johnny Wilkinson was the first player to ever make more than a million pounds Because again, people like me who don't know anything about rugby know the name Johny Wilkinson, isn't it? some people break through. So he was rugby's Lance Armstrong. Yeah. Lance Armstrong was making thirty million a year Johny Wilson was making like a million. And can I clarify for the legal department? when you say he was rugby unionss Lance Armstrong, you mean the fame part? The fame exclusively. The dodginess. Okay. Johnny Wilkinson's record is very clean. Okay, cool Rugby union's fifteen players rugby leeague is thirteen. And they can only pass the ball. Oh sorry, six tackles per possession before they have to turn the ball over. So So league is somewhere in between rugby union and American football American football there's a number of tackles before you then hand the ball over Oh, I thought it was the amount of TV adverts has to be four hundred in between each play. Yeah, that as well And now that's come to the World Cup as was it? Yeah. hydration breaks. they have hydration breaks now. And we watch on the BBC with no adverts, so you just have to watch them having a little drink for three minutes. Capitalism. Tea Rg Yeah. Experience a membership that backs what you're building with American Express Business Platinum. Enjoy complimentary access to the American Express Global Lounge Collection and apply to find out your welcome offer, which could be as high as three hundred thousand membership rewards points American Express Business Platinum. There's nothing like it. Terms apply. Welcome offers vary and you may not be eligible for an offer. Learn more at Americanexpress d. com slash businessash pllatinum. Our roll battery is the same It's like asking full socer players are the same Take Messi, the most decorated player ever. Is there any other player who has achieved that? No, just him. Now take Duracl. Is there any other battery with power boost ingredients inside? No, just Duracl. Remember, goats only trust goats because they're built different, and Messi only trusts Dacl Flies crashing the cook out Take back your space with STEM's portable flying insect fan trap. Set it down wherever flying insects show up and let it get to work. Using UV light in a fan, it attracts and traps bugs twenty for seven, like house flies, fruit flies, gnats, and mosquitoes. It's easy, bestest free, and people and pet friendly when use as directed. Live life never buug with STEM Visit stTEMorbugs. com to learn more. Right, we were talking we talk a lot about the tour this time. We have and I'm going to give you some tour de France information. So this year we are not going to be doing the Wild Oes Pro show. So if you followed along over the last couple of years, we did daily tour de France content or we did daily tour de France videos to recap what happened in the stage and yeah, like I said, we're not doing it this year was too destructive and we haven't worked out a way of being able to do it and it being pleasant. We will be doing our usual weekly show, which'll definitely have some Tour de France updates in, and we're going to be doing some Tour de France themed videos throughout the month as well. Lastly, we are going to be doing the Cade Fantasy League again on Valo Games and I'm also gonna to set up a Patreon chat for it. So again free if you join our Patreon. there'll be a chat room specifically set up for us to talk about Tour de France stuff as well. Oh, that'll be fun. So join the fantasy League, get onto our patreon and let's j Do some tour de France stuff. Well, thank you for that information, Jimmy. The Vo Games is also free. No prizes, no sponsors Eternal Glory until next year, that's what you win Wellow, do you though, because can you remember who won it last year Yes, it was I think it was a woman called Kat because she was mad that I said, Ohh, some guys won and I didn't know what his name was, and it was a lady Derek, actually. And Bob just confirming the ground is now good to you've been joined by a beautiful lady It's a man actually, Derek. Oh, also, on the subject of Patreon I did last week we were talking about warranties because of e bike conversion kits. So I actually put a poll out on our Patreon and I got loads of responses. So if you were one of those responders, thank you very much. The general consensus is that sixty five percent of people I think that a warranty is important thirty five percent, no. As expected, most people haven't had to use their warranty though. And just a couple of comments on the feedback is someone was talking about happens if the company goes bankrupt? Obviously the warranty is it no longer has validity. If you're buying a second hand bike, you potentially don't get your warranty covered and in some cases, the brand just won't honor the warranty. So actually having a warranty, there are some downsides too anyway Do you think this is this I've definitely had situations in the past which are not warranty related. There's just been an issue with a bike and because I've bought it from a brand, they've fixed it. Are you counting that as warranty. Would that be warranty in your mind. Technically, yes. someome of that is yes. in that some brands will do something about it because it is something they are obligated to do I feel like lots will, more will than won't Some of it is just customer service That's what that's what I mean. Yeah But I think warranty is more of a legal obligation of a product in a sense of This product has failed, therefore you should do something about it. But I have to fix it. think I think you're probably fair in that in a lot of cases Brands don't want to upset their customers and therefore, if you've had a legitimate problem with a product and you go back to them and say, this is an issue, can you help me out rounds I mean, it's why I'm not too fussed about. I can't remember what I said last week about waranty. I don't think Did didid I say I don't care about it or did I say I haven't even considered it like I've had issues with a bike. sometometimes I've broken something I might I' just assumed that a warranty wouldn't be A upheld. Yes, because it's user error in your case. except overt stuff On the hole If it's a reputable brand, I feel as if even if something's out of warranty, they probably will do something to help you out I think said it's like did discount on a new one and things like that I think the second hand bike replacement idea is an interesting one because obviously lots of people buy bikes second hand and therefore would you even have a warranty anyway? So I would imagine there's lots of people which aren't really thinking about warranties Um I just thought it would be a really good place for me to put out a poll our audience and just get some feedback because I always work on the basis of warranties are really important actuallyually surprised that so many people also think so, but then Fortunately, most people don't ever have to actually use it. Yeah, whichich makes me think is it important or not? It kind of comes down to the value of goods, doesn't it? Like if you've got a thirty thousand pound car yourour warranty has a lot more value than if you have a five hundred pound bike. And often it's a thing on a bike which brerakes and can be replaced. And wouldn't be covered by warranty anyway B not Okay, I'm going to finish off with A listen' takeakeover question. This one is from Dave in Dubai. He sent us a lovely message and a video, which I am going to summarize. He's fifty five, He was diagnosed with type two diabetes last year and he says that his blood sugar levels were bad. Since then, he's lost twenty five kilos, which is fifty five pounds and got his blood sugar levels down to pre diabetic levels using diet and exercise, which is awesome He wants to lose six kils more to get down to one hundred kils or two hundred and twenty pounds. His focus has been Zone two training, but he has hit a problem Power meter and heart rate monitor zones are wildly different, so he doesn't know which to follow when he does a zone two ride. He says if he's in a zone two heart rate, his power is typically zone three or four. lower heart rate for high effort. He also says the temperatures in Dubai have increased. I'm finding it increasingly difficult to get my heart rate into what Garmin identifies as zone two. Despite riding in what feels like a steady endurance effort, my heart rate often remains below my zone two range His heart rate is staying low despite it being hot and his power metet are telling him he's putting a lot of effort in we want to know if it's best to follow heart rate zones or power sessions for weight loss First up. a little bit of Mr. Demotivator. Congratulations on the amazing work that you've put in thus far to get yourself a lot healthier than you were previously. Good work The question is is the hundred kilos that you want to be under Is it arbitrary or is it does it have actual medical reasons for it? Because thoseose little bits just trying to get over the line end up becoming really, really hard barriers to get to. And actually if you've got yourself to a point now where you're nearly there, you're nearly a hundred kilos and you're significantly healthier be content with that, be happy with that. And if a bit more drops off, amazing. If it doesn't, you are significantly healthier, well done Hm that is that's very fair. You're right in terms of like this might not be the case in Dave's case. we don't know, but arbitrary numbers the one hundred miles, the one hundred kilometers, It's just like nice round numbers, sometimes fit in nice boxes, but actually bodies don't necessarily work with that. And also like Wait measuring your weight is such BS because it toally depends on and How dehydrated you are. Have you had a poop this morning? Have you had, you know, how much food have you had? Like you can't you can't be really you're never going to hit a hundred kilos and stay at one hundred kilos forever. So My weight fluctuates so much it is insane. That's because I use your smart scales when I was staying in your house. I was standing on never like pushing down like that I guess hundred and fifty l It would do nothing 'causeuse it knows me it know you for your toes Yeah I guess I guess so I don't know. Yeah I don't know. Askpint Do you have toeeprints the same as fingerprints? You do believe. Back to the topic. He needs to retest his zones There shouldn't be this massive, massive discrepancy. Of course, there's things that do things the heat does, but it would be The other way r Yeah, make your heart rate go higher. It might yeah, definitely. Yeah, retest the zones. Ra really heart rates's more than, like How was nice? If you were to if you're doing lots of zone two riding When I did mine, even though I had a power meter, I would have a heart rate cat. to stop me from doing too much because obviously cycling the opposite of running where You're at risk of overtrading on a bike because you can just sit there and keep going and do loads and loads of volume and not get injured U the heart rate cap is important just to make sure you're not doing too much and then you can still do your fast hard sessions if that's what you want to do I would stick to heart rate For Zone two The beauty of heart rate is it factors in Fatigue you how hydrated you are that day how you know, it factors in the state of your body in that moment. which is white. Francis's u how we're being Nice is a really, really good way of looking at it. Heart rate is the one. Yeah, you're right that it does it seems odd that the power number would be three or four, which is like a hard effort, but the heart rate would be low. it might be worth checking the accuracy of all of that equipment. Realibrating and stuff like that Calibrating. I would also say mayaybe if if it's heart related, check with your doctor as well because it does seem L L, you know what I mean? it's just it might be worth checking out. There's things that catch you out like Jimmy's Jimmy changed his crank length and thought he was really powerful and it was his crank length. Exactly that. Weird chain rings, things like loads of stuff, loads of stuff. Yeah. if you take all of the meeasuring equipment out of it Can Ask yourself how did the ride feel? and really a zone two effort should be like a steady but working pace. you should probably be like breathing deep but still able to have a conversation. And I noticed actually in the video he sent us, he was having a conversation with us. so that would indicate it was probably a zone to type effort So if his Power is reading So in full then Again, maybe there's calibration issues or retesting issues, perhaps Yeah, the only caveat I want to give is we are not medical professionals.. And if you are in doubt or unsure or think it could be something medical, get it checked because changing your zones will not help you Yeah. canan I make one more point as well on the ic of what is the best exercise for weight loss because that is what he said. And my opinion as you know I mean,' I'm not a any kind of professional at all But who but who is? No, I'm not a professional. The best session, I would say is the ones that you can realistically maintain and commit to regularly, consistently, long term. I wouldn't overthink it too much. I'm a big believer that bodies have like a weight that they like to be at. Yeah. And if he's finding that he's now struggling to get that last couple of kilos off L like I'm saying, if it's just an arbitrary figure, don't put the pressure on yourself. Just enjoy what you've achieved and enjoy riding bikes and prioritize the enjoyment of riding bikes so you stick with it rather than trying to force things in which make it unpleasant, boring a chore. Francis likes use the word chore when it comes to riding bikes, especially when it's long because that is ultimately it. It's like, well why Joy riding bikes, that is the number one goal, especially if it means that you are healthy. Long term health benefits are always going to come from lifestyle changes that feel sustainable. Do wantanna know what I think is the best exercise for weight loss. Go on if we can go that vague walking Walking. Yeah. you do like hour and a half walk throughout the day Little breaks, little walks The calories add up so quick I just think like If we're really going to dig down into a weight loss, ultimately, it comes down to kind of, very simplistically energy in versus energy out Correct. I don't want to get bogged down in it, but ultimately that I don't think there's any such thing as best exercise for weight loss You burn calories, you eat calories. Don't overthink it, let it be sustainable, let it be healthy do not over analyze numbers to the point where it becomes destructive Yes, I think that exercise for weight loss is an oxymoron Beuse it makes you wake up in the middle of theight and eat pizza. Yes This is like metabolic benefits and stuff like that. That's why like for type two diabetes, they will recommend it because it has like metabolic benefits and way more of their benefits way beyond weight loss. Everyone should exercise, but That doesn't mean we should all be doing one hundred milers every week. Yeah. We should be mobile and active and walking and moving and using our bodies and stretching and elevating our heart so that it has conditioning, doing becoming a runner and running hundred miles a week becoming a cyclist and riding a bike fifteen hours a week doesn't make you healthier can But it doesn't Lifestyle changes that are sustainable being active are The most important things And not chasing arbitrary numbers. Yeah, but I would say honestly, Daveid, it sounds like you're absolutely smashing it. You've already smashed it. You're doing amazing. Ke aty it. Keep riding So I think we'll wp it up there. If you have a question, a problem, an unpopular opinion, anything else you want to share with us, remember, you can send it to Wild Ones podcast cade media. co UK or whatsApp us on plus four four seven eight sixzer eight six zero two one three. And lastly, I also wanted to thank everyone for the postcards There are a lot. It has become quite overwhelming. but I have sat down and read them all. They're all lovely. Thank you very much. I got sent a sticker as well, which I've put my laptop. Thank you very much for all of them. Yeah. I think that's that's all for this week then, isn't it? Yes we could. Thanks for tuning in. and if you like what we do, please subscribe and like and tell everyone to watch our stuff and listen to it because that would be great. Thank you very much. On all devices On all devices all the time In your house all the time on repeat. Thank you, goodbye. And come chat with us on Patreon as well. Yeah, and remember, if you want to sign up for the Fantasy League, you have to do it before the tour starts on Saturday If you if you late then the doors are closed you are't coming in, sorry. That's not our rules, that's fellow Games res. Yeah And happy tour de France Yay is Louis Vitton If you'd like to support our work, check out the Mud store below this video or at we are thewild ones. com We got mugs, we got hats, we got shirts We got backward hats