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To learn more, check out acccenture. com slash Spotify. Coming up on the Zach Low Sh from San Antonio Holy smokes I know it ended up being a tem pointo game It will never reflect how intense the atmosphere for game one was One of the most viscerally, emotionally intense atmospheres I've ever been at helped along by a solid, let's say, six, eight, ten percent contingent of Nicks fans in the building who were Very, very noisy. dueling chance in the concourse, dueling chance. in the arena, twice, the Spurs opened up double digit leads and it looked like they're on the verge of reminding the Kicks, hey, You're coming from the JV conference. This is a whole new, a whole new bottle bottle of wax here in the West and the Nicks walked him down. bothoth times tie game going into the fourth quarter. Nick go up by eight and you think they got control of the game, Spurs come back take a one point lead, just one crazy intense play after another Jail and Brunson late in the game just outstanding Ns get contributions from everybody. they win againgain, Stan Van Gundi is here to breakd down everything that happened in the game and talk about how the Spurs and Dix both might adjust in game two. and then I talk a little bit about at the end just stuff going around in the league. That's all coming up after this on the Zach Lowh show Tw, the Zach Low show from San Antonio. Look who's here. It's Stan Van Gundi and coach, let me tell you That was one of the most intense games I've ever been at in my life. The atmosphere was off the charts I know home fans probably hate the Nick invasion of their arena and it was only like, I'm going to say eight to ten percent Ns fans, maybe that's even a little high But they were loud and I like in the concourse, I was walking to my seat before the game. There were let's go Kick chance that were being answered by Gpurs go chance. I thought that was awesome There were no stoppages in the game until the first time out and it was just this roaring endless intensity The crowd was one of the loudest and just shriekkingest I've heard in that five minutes where there was no stoppages a fan ran onto the floor. and by the way All his friends should shun him forever and shame him. and security was far too polite with him. They should have decked him and laid him out on the court and taken him off And then we had some incredible clutch free throw shooting when Binyama hits two free throws to put the spurs ahead. Bridges hits two massive free throws and just Calm just steps up to put the Nicks up by four. But to me the peak intensity was Nick go up ninety four eighty six with about six minutes left coach And I wrote down in my notes This is now I look, we've seen massive comebacks in six minutes. the Nicks just made one at the beginning of the conference finals I wrote down on my notes this is now a must win for the Kicks. They cannot lose this game. from eight points ahead on the road as slight underdogs in the series would be a catastrophe. And boom, nine run, Surs take the lead And then Brunson with One of the biggest shots of his life on an offensive rebound that he tipped out and it out and got the three in the corner. Yeah I mean, The Kicks end up winning by ten because they're just going to end up winning every close game by double digit points to keep the street going. but In terms of like nerves and intensity and just my intensity watching the game It was one of the most intense games I've ever been at tied after three quarters. Nick walked him down from two big deficits one in the second quarter again in the third quarter And you could just feel the tension in the arena. It was awesome. I don't know if it felt that way watching on TV Well, I mean, I don't think you ever when you're watching on TV, totally feel what's in an arena. but yeah, look. I mean, I think we felt it fromr the time the Ns tied up the Atlanta series and then just started dominating people the fervor of New York fans. They've waited a long time feel like this is their chance. and you're right. they don't have to have a majority of the arena. They're They're the most fervent fans in this year's playoffs and You know, you feel it every time a game goes on. I mean, you live there. I've got You know daughter and her husband live in New York and it's taken over the entire city there. We had we also had a Brunson injury scare two injury scares one in the first half that looked like oh oh, he goes back to the locker room and he comes back and has a fantastic last fourth quarter beginning and end in the middle. the Nick offense dried up a little bit and this when the sws went on that run and then he makes an incredible dagger Over Devin Vasll at the end of the game Yeah, the atmosphere is awesome. The fans are awesome. And New York If they had if they had gotten a split and now they're guaranteed to split. It was a given that MSG was going to just be off the charts in games three and four And now Politics aside, we have this wild card coming for game three. and let me tell you Stan I saw a lot of League opps people Uh, League staffers. Bacing for the president to attend game three at Madison Square Garden, just logistically like how are we going to get everyone in the arena out of the arena? How long is he going to stay? Is he going to get blooed if they show him on the jumpoatron? It's an added layer of craziness. I don't even like that game is going to be Madness. Well we have we have to get there first Um What's your big I mean low scoring game spurs actually their fourth lowest points for possession in any game this season. two of those four are against the Kicks Weembinyama six of twenty one did get thirteen free throws U Josh Hart sensational game. Jose Alvarado's minutes off the bench when Brunson was hurt were like just awesome and delightful and just what every championship team needs a guy stepping in like that when he might not even be in the rotation. But I know we were texting a little bit last night And I know your your focus was on a lot of things, but the cat Weby match upp and sort of pivot point of the series stood out to. Is that where you want to start Yeah, sure. Look, I thought Kat was fabulous on both ends of the floor and I thought that You know, obviously rebounded the ball Drove the ball on Windby. he was aggressive didn't turn the ball over and stayed out of foul trouble. I mean, I think the big thing is is to keeping him out there on the floor and aggressive is huge in this series and I thought it was easily the worst Payoff game when Binyama has played. all year. I thought he was horrible on both ends to be honest. I mean, he just I would say the thing he's got to do 's pretty simple. He wants it so badly, which I admire and he's a young guy with great talent He got to cal down a little bit. I thought he took terrible shots Um, you know, it was just forcing everything. And I thought defensively on cat. I understand Cats passing and he wanted to pressure, but He was never in a balanced stance with any chance to defend. and just letting him go by. He just got a stillill play hard obviously, but he's got to calm down and then He and they have got to get the ball in better spots. closer to the basket. Look, he didn't have an offensive rebound in the first quarters and it's hard to get one when you're spending the entire night standanding behind the three point line And, you know, the three point shot is a nice weapon for him But nine threes too many in that game. He's got to get around the basket, six turnovers in the game to besides six for twenty one shooting. just not good enough and the bottom line is Brunson wasn't good enough either for three quarters But then Brunson had the great fourth quarter and Wimby got better in the fourth until he had the huge turnover And after So we get a Just a stupid val by Derin Fox with one eleven to go to put bridges to the line to make to him Bridges gotught the ball in the middle of the floor. likeike you don't need to fouling there off guard him. And that was off a double the first real double of the game Blitzed. Yeah, they blitzed Brunson He made a good pass, but just all he had to do was play So to me, Those two plays right there Really bad foul and then Wimbinyama turns it over at the other end Um where ended up being the game Um, So they've got to be better. I think u You know, the Cat thing was incredible and you said it Josh Hart Oh my go That is the most in for the level of play. We're talking huge game That's the most impactful three point game. I think anybody's ever had. and it showed up. L, I take the plus minus on a single game with a grain of salt. on a single game, but it's to me, Last night it stood out. They were plus twenty two with him on the floor. I' be fifteen rebounds, six assists and no turnovers. Four steals and a block He was everywhere And I think He's the guy most responsible for the toughness and resilience this team is shown in this playoff run. So I thought he was Great And let's not forget shamot. I mean, there were some big shots to just sort of keep them afloat Um there for a long time. he sort of disappeared down the stretch But I think look, if I'm San Antonio I'm looking at it and going, okay We were Bad. And we're right there until the end like Let's make some adjustments and I think there's some they can make and Let's just get ready to go out and game two. We're a great team. And if we can win game seven in Oklahoma City, we can certainly win in Madison Square Garden. No question. So Um, You know, I don't think there's any reason for them to panic. neeither team shot the ball very well which I think, you know, not surprising, Zach. You've been in a lot of games like that. I mean, as you said The intensity was so high and everybody was so juiced up that other than Champinne Um Everybody had trouble while and and sham it. everybody had troubble getting the ball to go down from three. So I think it's going to be a great series. I thought last night was fabulous U, and I'm interested to see how they come out in game two. Yeah, eleven of forty three on threes for the sppurs. Although if you look at the tracking data and the wide open shot data, it was pretty even in terms of shot quality spurs actually shot better according to NBA dot com on wide open three. So take that for what it's worth Um I do think so that there' There's all these like mini stretches of games that you forget about and one when they missed a lot of shots in a row They're up sixty three fifty in the second quarter And in like a two minute span When Binyama misses a wide open three. they get an offensive rebound. Castle misses a wide open three. then Dylan Harper misses an open two and Champagne misses a three off a handoff. And those are the stretches like I wrote in my notes, Spurs are missing some good looks here when they could have gone up like sixteen, eighteen, nineteen and really changed the game. I want to start with the Cat Weemby thing because I agree. Well, first of all, Josh Hart The rebounds he assists, all that I thought his defense on Castle late in the game was like unbelievable. He was getting over every screen and even when they chipped him a little bit, he was staying in front of Castle and kind of standing him up in isolation. So I wanted to give him A little love W be Weny only twenty eight percent of his fuld goal attempts came in a restricted area that's extremely low for him. Cat was physical. He was showing his hands as best he could And I was waiting for that first foul and it did not come for a long time And like that is such a critical variable in the series with Mitchell Robins. I thought Mitch Robinson look good. He blew the one putback dunk that made you wonder about Can he grip the ball? I thought I thought he looked all right If they can get forty eight minutes every game out of those two guys and not have to bring in Anadoi at Center or Huckporty or whatever yourre like plan D is. That's huge But you said, get him the ball closer to the rim and adjustments the sppurs can make So how Whenbenam has set a fair number of ball screens a little bit low. I thought he rolled really hard to the basket for the most part and the Nick defense on those plays was like off the charts good. like they were bumping him multiple times, bumping him high, bumping him low and rotating out like on the flight of the ball to shooters. I thought their defense was great So how Give us some concrete coach ways to get Weemby some better touches Well, I think the biggest one and Tim Legler pointed it out on the broadcast in the second half. I think they've had good success when they've gotten him the ball at the elbow. muchuch like the Kicks have had success in this playoff run when they've gotten the ball cap there. from the from the elbow. likeike it's tough to get guys as you know now. It's tough to get guys the ball in the low post. Windby's not the strongest guy in the world, but they've really worked with him on holding his position at the elbow. You know, you you see all these and Zach, you always get to games early when you get there and you watch all these pre game workouts And the thing I've noticed San Antonio during the year. A lot of times just guys getting shots up Wimby works every game before the game on holding position and catching a ball catching the ball in spots and last night They didn't go to that, but one time in the game that I remember from the elbow Weindy can get to the rim obviously in one dribble and he's right there and then I think that's what's going to put the pressure on Kat. If all of his catches are at the three point line, even if he's driving the ball Number one, you've got chance a lot easier chance to get help to him, a lot more time Kat can cushion him. I thought one of the great things Kat did, Kat hasn't always been the most disciplined Defender. I thought one of the best things he did last night is he didn't overreact on Windby's threes. Now granted, he didn't make them Bike He wasn't going for shot fakes and lifting up just guarded the ball and I think that's the way you have to play him. I think If he makes threes, he makes threes. But if you can keep him away from the basket, Like I said, didn't have an offensive rebound in the first three quarters. I thought Mike Brown's decision, you know, so many people were talking about going into the series. Oh they're going to play Wimby. I mean, they're going to play OG on Wimby I didn't think they would And I thought his decision was very good. play big on him. I think when you play small. we saw it last night You know, down the streight and then in the nextick comeback They they put Wimby on heart and Kat just went to work on inside and on the offensive boards. I don't like the cross match. I mean, you can do it at times. I thought that was a mistake by San Antonio. I thought Mike Brown's game plan Um was tremendous, but I think if Windby can get the ball at the elbow. And then they can operate off of that U, I think they've got a chance to to be pretty good. I also think Win be on the roll First of all, he's got a screen better. He's so worried about getting out that he's not sccreening anybody U, He had the one illegal screen, He's got a screen better and then I think they can look for him more on the short roll. Anytime you can get that ball in the free throw line area and be carrying it to the rim, they're going to be in good shape. Yeah, I went back and I watched all his screen and rolls and you're right. He's slipping out early And you just watch the Kick defense because like they're they're getting The sppurs are getting what they should want on that play, which is wheny going hard to the rim against a defense it's slightly in rotation And they got some good threes out of it like Harper had corner three off a Fox kickout and you know, Fox at a corner three off someone else. This big castle got a couple of threes. Champanne was on fire. a lot of that came out of that action, but The Nick defense was just awesome. I mean, they were bumping and like they would set those There weren't even staggered screens sometimes. sometometimes it's like the ball handler would have one screener on one side and another on the other side. It's like a choice and whatever he would go the ballhandler would use Wemby's screen and the guy on the other screener would bump Weemby early and then someone would bump him late and they just made it really hard And like I looked up the numbers. This is crazy on Wemby ball screens Zero point five four points per play out directly out of them, which is the fourth lowest number in any spurs game this season. and zero point seven points for possessions also the fourth lowest number and he only took like a couple shots out of the pick and roll. So it wasn't they were not letting him the ball. You mentioned getting him the ball at the elbow They tried like one kind of cross screen for him to get him a post up and and Kat like struuck pushed the catch out far enough that it was a win for the next Um, I wonder if we'll see more of those like pinned down plays in the corner for him. The Nicks defended those pretty well though too Maybe you can give him the ball and pick and roll a little bit and get him driving, but to your earlier point, you know, the help is easier. So It's the N defense was awesome and I want to flip it to the other end You said when being in your view was not good on either end of the floor last night. and no one You almost never hear that about his defense And it was it just like the a little bit too amped up? Like what did what did you notice? Yeah, I want to qualify that. like he still was Vy impactful as a help deffender. and everything else. In fact, one of the things if I were I thought Runson struggled, especially in the first three quarters. when Wimby was on the floor because he couldn't get anything going to the Rim Now Mitchell Robinson did a good job of sealing Windby off on a roll late in the game, Bronson got to the left hand. Brunson got to the rim in that second quarter run When Cornet was in the game and Windby was off the floor. when Wimby's on the floor It's strictly jump shots and he has to deal with the size Oh of the guards of San Antonio. If I were Mitch Johnson, I would think instead of staying with his normal ation where Wimby comes out about five minutes in and then I would try to match Windby's minutes to Brunntson's I think that would really them when Brunson goes off the floor now you can bring Cornet in. I think they can make life tougher there. So Wimby was good in that stuff. I just didn't like the way he guarded Kat. Kat was by him any timee he wanted to be. And I thought he was really oververextended. Yes, you want a ball pressure But with Wimby size, Wimby can cushion him a little, still can test the shot and still You know disrupt passes with his link I just thought he was overzealous. on both ends at a floor last night. And I think he'll be better in game two. The one thing we've learned about him in his playoff run when he hasn't played well He's pretty well always bounced back and played tremendously I think he's a guy with the humility to to look in assesss and everything else Um I think we'll seem better, but yeah, I didn't think he was good on Cat at all Who would you have him guard on defense? because I was I expected him to start the game on heart He spent a good amount of time on heart and slash in his own one man zone on the baseline. But he started the game on Kat and he guarded Kat quite a bit And I thought the Nicks like one of the things I've loved about this Nicks playoff run is They immediately download what you're doing and they're prepared for, you know, they're prepared for every contingency plan right away. likeike if if If Wemby's here, we do this. If Wemby' over here, we do this. and when they saw my cat They're like, all right, like we're gonna we're going to run a lot of pick and pop and pick and roll with cat. and see how he responds to a guy who's shooting forty seven percent on threes in the playoffs, popping open for three, one of the greatest shooting big men of all time And they got like good stuff out of it when the sppurs switched. You mentionedat Kat would drive the guards to the rim and draw fouls and kick it out. Um, and I I was a little surprised he was on cat. um So much, but like what where would you have him? What's your ideal spot? Well I think you've only got really two choices. I mean, he guarded OG a little bit, but he's either going to guard Kat where he's got a guard heart. I like him on cat The San Antonio, I did think early in the game rotated a couple times when Wimby couldn't get back to Cat and I thought they did a good job, which sends Wimby back to the Rim Um, I I didn't have a problem To clarify what you're talking about, because I want to take people inside this I Let's say Brunson, Brunson cat pick and pop with Weemby on cat. Weemby drops back Cat to corral Brunson's drive, Cat pops open Brunon kicks it a cat or Alvarado kicks it a cat. And a third guy rotates up from the sidelines to take Cat, often a small guy, often Fox and then wheny peels down into the paint. Spurs did execute that well. I think that's a super interesting battleground in the series because It left Kat with Fox on him a few times and the Kicks just sort of went on with their offense and I'd like to see them exploit that a little bit more. Well, yeah, you know what? but I do think there's always a fine line between trying to exploit matchups, which you want to do but sort of becoming stagnant offensively because you're just standing around seeking out match ups. I think it's got I think what the Kicks do a pretty good job of is getting to those mismatches organically and just playing them in the flow, which I thought they didid last night I also thought So I would keep cat on. I mean, keep Wimy on cat I would mix in Some blitzes with Brunson think it's got to be all the time. I think Wendby's maybe smart enough to give him the the option to I don't think it changes your backline on defense So just give him the option maybe at times to blitz on his own. throw in a blitz hereere and there. Now again, I like that over not overzealous to where he's fouling, Brunson. I just thought he was so hy last night. He was going to come out and make five threes and you know, turn Cat over and I just thought he was oververzealous. He's got to block that out. I also thought and look I I think a couple of I think the If I'm San Antonio, I thought their schemes were good. I thought I think a couple of things Windby's got a screen in pick and rolls on the offensive end He's got a scream because Like I used to say it all the time coaching. God I think slipping out early on switches or if people are up to the level blitzes certainly, you can get behind the defense, those things or switches you're confusing against drop coverage slliipping out early just makes it easier on the defense Heart can get overpicks they can do all of that. He's got to scream. Okay. I think they've got to get him the ball some at the elbow Um Then, I think the biggest adjustments, I like their defensive game plan. I really did. I think that it's all in rotations. I think more More Harper and less the Aaron Fox I mean, to me Harper was having a great game. He only played three and a half minutes in the fourth quarter. I was very, very surprised by that. He had sixteen point seven rebounds in the first three quarters And He's much better defensively and they're switching and stuff Fxes. so I was surprised by that. And then I think maybe shorten the rotation. U Look, they've done well with the ten man rotation. I'm not sure that they really need to play Harrison Barnes or Carter Bryant. I think Keldin Johnson, Harper and Cornet in his minutes off the bench Um Pling those eight And then the only other thing I think offensively, I thought the Kicks did a fabulous job when they tried to run Champinney up to set the pick They didn't give in and switch Brunson on to those guards Brunson showed, but again Champ Pinney's got to set that screen and give Castle Fx whoever it is, a chance to come off and attack Brunntson. I don't think he did a good job. I think if San Antonio goes back One of the things they're going to see on their pick and roll game is The most fundamental thing, they certainly they just didn't scream well enough. They've got to do a better job that end, but I think Harper causes a lot of problems for everybody But in this series he's got to get more. I mean to have Fox at thirty eight minutes in a game. he didn't play well. Now I know he had the best plus minus of anybody other than Keldin Johnson. He was dead even. He didn't play well And Harper did and he only plays twenty seven minutes. I think that's got to That's got to turn around Um in this series And then I think the Kicks They took care of the ball. They did everything right shootings is obviously big. The only thing they've got to do is I think they got to do a better job, especially on the perimeter guys of keeping them off the boards U Yeahamp Champeny is a Champanney is a dangerous little offensive rebounder from the corners. Yes, Champenney had three Castle had three, the cell had four Um You know I think you know, but it was interesting becausecause San Antonio had fourteen offits of rebounds, but they didn't convert On fourteen second chance points and the Nick said twenty three second chance points. the biggest one being the three you talked about Brunson late in the game the fact that he was able to tip the ball out and get that three. so You know, a lot of it comes down to basic things. takeake care of the ball, rebound the ball Dt don't have bad fouls and you know, things like that, But but I do think the whole I think San Antonio, I think Mitch Johnson's going to have to look at his rotation a little bit going into game to what works Um, And what and what doesn't couple of things, eight turnovers for the Nicks and I mentioned before the series. I think the Spurs were twenty eighth in defensive turnover eight and the Nicks had to win the turnover game to win the series. They checked box Um The Fx thing is a big, big looming issue for San Antonio with his extension set to kick in next season. It's not even kicked in yet. He quieted the noise with a with a pretty good game seven against Oklahoma City. Obviously the biggest game that he's ever played in the NBA and the biggest game of the season to date for the sppurs Three of thirteen last night for the playoffs, sixteen a game on forty two percent shooting. He's obviously you know, we don't know the state of his high ankle sprain. He's probably not one hundred percent, but defensively he's never been Great. And Harper was just flat out better than him last night. And I was also surprised by the minutes. I remember before the Oklahoma City series, you know I wrote in my notes about that series So very h. The Thunder was is a very good offensive team. The Nixser an even better offensive team in the Thunder. And I remember thinking If Fox is at all limited or if they're really going at him, Are we going to see more of just Harper, Castle, No Fox and Wembinyama? And like the numbers for that kind of lineup are off the charts and I was surprised we didn't see more. And the other thing they actually played the three point guards together for I think four minutes last night. They don't do that very often And you mentioned Keldin Johnson like he hasn't had a great playoffs eightight minutes really surprised me. I thought he would play I thought they kind of forgot about him and the rotation in the second half is like plug him in and see if he can get you a big three or he defended Kat some and Weemby could roam around Um I thought that was weird too, but the Fx thing is like, he's just got a He's just got to play better for them to win this series. I want to go back to Weenby Well, let me say the other thing on Fx though. And I'm a Darren Fox fan. so This isn't a negative. I he hasn't played as well They certainly need him. I'm not arguing chang in the starting line up But To me, it's pretty simple. It's not a one game thing. anythingy can happen in one game. certain guys can be better and you certainly adjust as coaches Dylan Harper's a better player than Daron Fox in my mind, period. I mean, he's just a better player at least and he creates more problems Bet on the defensive end. he's bigger, he's stronger He can get in the pain. He creates match up problems Um I just think he's got to play more. I would think when they sit back and evaluate the game They're going to look at that and see it I think Mitch has been great all year and particularly in the playoffs of adjusting game to game And and I think that's one of the things we'll see. Fox definitely has to be better, but so does Vell Castle W Minyama. I mean, like I said, if I'm San Antonio, I'm saying Look, we were in this game. We were down to when Fox fouled with a minute and eleven to go. We were down two points. And then we had two bad plays in a row. Dumb foul, windy turnover and We got a lot of guys who are capable of playing better All I'd feel okay going into game too pllus, you gott to think they'll comeal down and settle in a little bit Um, So I'd feel good Yeah, I don't think anyone has any reason to feel I picked Nixon seven. That was my pick I don't think anyone should feel I mean, obviously the Nick should feel thrilled that they already got a road win in the series. That's huge Asolutely Nothing. I thought it was going to be a long series. I think it's going to be a very long series. I do I do think It's funny, like, I do think the Nicks had to get a split to win the series in the first two games, which sounds a little stupid because even if they go down two , they then have three of the next five at home and like they haven't lost a home game yet and all that. The idea of beating Wy four times in five games just seems so daunting for me that I thought the Nicks had to get a split I don't know if I would characterize even like game two as a must win for the Spurs. I mean, you'd never want to fall down Ozer two in any circumstance, particularly at home. I mean, I just think these two teams are going to play a bunch of close games. Oviously the Spurs would prefer to be one one and not o two U Let's take a quick break because I want to dig into Wenby's defense just a little bit more The Zach Lo showow was brought to you by Fanel. It all comes down to this. Who do you think will bearing the ring at the end of the NBA fininals? Make your call with Fandel right now, new customers can hit the court with three hundred and fifty dollars in bonus bets guaranteed after betting five dollars for seven straight days. Fandel is the best place to bet all your favorite players during the NBA finals. B on their baskets and boards or build to same game parlay for a chance at a bigger payout justust as at fanual d. com slash low to get started twenty went over in select states, eighteen over in DC, Kentucky, Wyoming first online real money wager only. mininimum five dollar wager required for seven consecutive days, bonus issued is non withdrawable bonus bets, which expiire seven days after aceipt. Gambling problem, callall one eight hundred gambler. Call one eight, seven eight nine, seven seven, seven seven or visit ccpg dot org slash chat in Cnecticut This episode is brought to you by State Farm The best passers see every angle of the floor to make the perfect assist and State Farm is no different. They know the game inside and out and look at every angle to help set you up with a plan that fits your life and budget. Get the coverage that's right for you. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Coverage options are selected by the customer, availability and eligibility vary by state I just think watching The Spurs do with Weemby on defense is just the most fun subplot of any Spurs matchup partarticularly this one when Mitchell Robinson is not in the game And they have three basic choices, We beyond cat and figure out how to deal with cat's pic and pop shooting. Um When beyond heart. and see how the Kicks adapt to that and put wings on Kat and their wings since they made this Harrison Barnes for Champanney starting lineup switch unlocked their season, huge adjustment by Mitch Johnson But they're small. and Kat can eat on the offensive glasses we saw last night. He can post up. I think they can feed him in the posts a little bit more Or third option is Weby just sort of hangs around the baseline playing a zone defense and nominally guarding who's ever in the corner and then you figure it out from there. I thought the Kicks were ready for all of it Um I don't know which those three looked best to you. but what do you think of that sort of how the Kicks handled like the one man Wy baseline zone Well, I look, I thought they did a decent job and I didn't think they Nicks were great offensively like They weren't. I thought what they did great offensively already hit on. they only had eight turnovers. They didn't beat themselves. I thought San Antonio's defense was fine. I think their problem was at the offensive in and then I think in the fourth quarter, Brunson as he always does you know, got going. I the There's so many good things about Brunson. Um, but the thing that always amazes M is He can be having a bad game and he doesn't let it affect him downown the stretch You know, he's not one of those guys who gets down loses confidence. I think he almost gets when he's having a bad game more motivated to finish strong. He was my vote for clutch player of the year again. I just think He has so many of those impactful fourth quarters But other than that, I thought San Antonio's defense was good. Like I said, I'd adjust some things offensively and I would adjust my rotation a little bit, but And defensively I'd have Wimben Yama play cat a little bit smarter, but I thought they did exactly what you said as the game went on He would start, no matter who he started on, he would just always end up on the baseline. trrade guys off to where he was there and you can see the impact I mean, very seldom does anybody go in there and try to shoot the ball I mean, the one that Bridges, I think, tried to shoot over him. And, you know, I mean, it's just it's crazy. You just can't take your normal shot.'s the most impactful defensive player I've ever seen in the NBA. I mean, people talk about Gubert and Mark Eaton back in the day, but they couldn't go out on the floor I mean, and you know, and cover you know, the way he does. I mean, a guy blocks threes and things. I mean, it it's It's incredible. I don't like playing small on cat. I think he just I think you know, you forget what a great rebounder he is and he had two key offensive rebound put backacks when they played small on him. I don't like it. I keep wimy on him as much as I could. The other thing when Windby's on him Cat tends to stand at the three point line. And That's good makes it better for the Nick I mean, for San Antonio on the glass. So Well, well And you never can stick with one thing all or the whole series. You know that. I mean because people get ono it And when he is on cat, man to man and they do just pull Cat away from the basket, the Nicks went right into their sort of flex screening off ball offense hunting mismatches, see if they can get switches or cuts And a guy whose name we haven't mentioned at all yet and we're derelected doing so is OGN and Oi seventeen points, a huge fourth quarter and one of his fourth quarter threes was they took a page out of Oklahoma City's book when the sppurs were in that one man zone And when when Weemby kind of got attached to a shooter in the corner or was like nominally guarding that player A couple of times the Nicks just cleared out everyone else to the other side of the floor and brought that player up to screen for the ball handler and kind of made Weemby suddenly Um defend two on two in a pick and roll And one of them I think was Bride and shhamot in the fourth quarter that Wendby was on shamot and shamit like fake roll to the basket and then Moon walked back to the three point Ac and Wendby got a little confused and Duce turn the corner and hit An and Oi for a three. I thought that was a smart little counter, but I like the way the sppurs defense looked. with when be kind of playing his zone and that that four minute stretch where it went from ninety four, eighty six Nicks to ninety five, ninety four urs There were just a bunch of possessions where the Kicks were just kind of running in circles like nobody wanted to shoot and then someone would be like, I guess I got to take a mid range jumper Yeah with with one on the shotline. me if you're San Antonio. I don't want I want to play almost no Brunson minutes with Windby on the bench I thought he just You and I were teexed during a game. I thought he just that Second quarter, Brunson got going a little bit And it was with Cornett in the game. Play Cornet when Brunson's out of the game. you can defend the rest of those guys Um without him and match Windby's minutes to to Brunsons would probably be my bigiggest adjustment. Coaching wise if I were if I were San Antonio. All in all, just a massively enjoyable game to be at other than the stupid fan who ran on the floor. And again, I hope all his friends and family shun him for months on end and publicly shame him for being an idiot and The shirts were awesome. Apologies to Bill Simmons. I love the Fiesta shirts Atmosphere was great Nick's fans hung around after the game were going crazy. And by the way, there was a I'm not going it's not it wasn't a lot But we were sitting on press row, Ian Begley was to my right and Chris Mannox was to my left, right under where Barcley was And when the Kicks were up by six with whatever, thirty seconds left and then they had to foul in and Oi People were walking for the exits, just some, not a decent amount. And I'm like, of all fanbes the Ray Allen shot was against you. never and we all laughed That was a closer game. It's the finals. anythingy can happen. You can't leave until the game' over I mean, the Ray Allen game should have cuts t sppurs fans at I'm saying backack in the day. I'll tell you one other thing and this is very rare. in fact, God, I don't know if I've ever done this in an analysis of a game But it really stood out to me. That was the best officiated playoff game of the year. E agree Everyone agrees on this. Why did you like it's hard for me when I'm at the game to notice all the intricacies Yeah, you know what stood out to me is the fact that I wasn't ever focus calls ever at any point in a game where I was like Oh my go, that's a foul. Oh my Godd, they're letting them I just You know, they say, I mean, the cliche is if you don't notice something They're doing a great job and that's pretty much how it was. I thought You know, they didn't overreact to things Um, You know, I just thought Scott Foster, James Capperers, Seun right Um I've had issues with officiating our times in the playoffs this year, but I thought they did a u fabulous job last night. I don't think either team can have have any gribes, Brunson, of course, the one where Cornett stepped on his foot, thought he got fouled You watch the replay three times, Carly not a foul Um, you know, they did a they did a good job on it. Um, I just I thought they handled things very, very well and it made the game enjoyable to watch. I thought they had a good balance They let guys play, but not ridiculously. I didn't see a lot of L. Ridiculous contact where I thought people got away with stuff. Yeah, they did a super job. I didn't think like I'm watching like a haawk every time cats involved in any action whether it's getting getting around a screen, defending Wby one on one. likeike I didn't think they let him off the hook on any sort of fls that should have been called. I think he defended honestly with showed his hands was physical and avoided thousand e like Yeah the third foul to me was a bad one Wim be in the lane. That's the only time he reached down You know, and That's a hard thing. You know, Bob Mcadoo, when I worked with him in Miami It's something that I have carried with me throughout my entire coaching career And Bob Mcinoo said big guys should never get a foul below their shoulders And I really, really like that. Like if you're going to get a fl as a big guy, it's contesting a shot up at the rim And you know, you get a foul, maybe an over the back going for the rebound thingsings like that, but you're not going to play at a guards level and get a foul. I thought did a great job of that last night other than the one play Um quarter I think. he got his third foul. he reached down on him, but you know, over the course of the game. if he stays that disciplined. now the key will be If Wimby goes on a run and the balls going in the basket You know, it's pretty easy to stay disciplined when a guy is shooting six for twenty one because of you're not getting scored on. But if Rimby makes for in a row. which certainly he's going to do at some point in this series Now do you panic and foul. I think that's going to be the challenge for Kat is to stay disciplined and just realize guys are going to make some shots. donon't lose your discipline. That's going to be his challenge and the big challenge with the Kicks Coaches go through it all the time. The Kicks have been great with it in the playoffs so far You know, there's that tendency when you get game one on the road So like, okay, we did our job We took back home court and you're just not as ready to go in game two. That's going to be the challenge on Friday night I don't exxpect any letdown from them. Now history says the spurs win game to homeome favorites that lose game one tend to win game to often by a lot I think the Nicks will play well and hungry in game two. I was telling people before the game, I have receipts in my text messages and people can, you know who I talk to. I didn't I was't worried about the rust factor in game one for them either. I thought they would come out and play a good game and they played well enough to win Look, I mean, it sounds corny. I said it when I picked the Nicks to win the series and I don't know if they're going to win. It's going be a long series. the S spurs have the best player et cetera I think they've found some sports magic in the last month. Like there's a real like magical alchemy going on and it has sustained All the little trends, all the little adjustments, all the little sacrifices that You just know it when you see it and they add up to something have sustained game to game. They've sustained long layoffs I think I just don't, if I were the sppurs If I were a Spurs fan, I would just not bank on the Kicks playing a let down game or a bad game in game two. I think they've won twelve games in a row. I think a little bit of sports magic is happening right now and I can't really explain it completely, but the Kicks are just on another level. I expect this to be a super long suuper competitive series. The last thing I want to do with you before you go in your perspective is uniquely valuable Rick Adelman passed away this week and I've always thought, you know, we all loved those Kingss teams that he coached and The corner offense in Minnesota and everywhere else in Portland and everywhere else he was that he was like wildly underrated. I remember the first time I met David Addelman for a coffee way back years and years ago. We talked about his dad and how I thought I think there should be a little bit more Hall of Fame momentum for him. He's got a ton of wins. He's an offensive innovator and then you get into the Hall of Fame. I just want to give you the floor as a coach. L I know you didn't know Rick well, but I just thought he was chronically because he didn't win a title as a head coach one of the most underrated coaches in basketball history, and I'm glad he got his due and I just condolences to the Aaman family. Absolutely condolences to the family and Um I agree with you. I think even being in the Hall of Fame, he was underrated U, But I think especially as an innovator, I think when you look at the modern game Probably the coach that gets the most credit Yeah bringing or starting at least the revolution. to the modern game is Mike Dantoni and he deserves that. I mean pace of the game and the three point shot and all that. So taking nothing away from Mike But I don't think Rick Addelman has gotten the credit he deserves as an innovator. You know, even though the corner offense is a little bit different than the five out that everybody's running He was a guy who started pulling his bigigs away from the basket. Chris Weber, Vladi Divoach, Brad Miller You know, he would always find those guys play through them the elbow, you can see elements of that and the principles, virtually everybody in the NBA is using some version of the principles that Rick Adelan started or at least started to use more extensively in his time in the league and I don't think he's gotten credit for that that he deserves. You know, and I think look, it was born out of What all great coaches do, you take a look at your personnel And you say, okay, who do I have? Now let's build something around it? And he had two of the great passing bigigs with Flotty and Chris Weber. and said, okay, this is what we're going to do. They were near impossible to defend those kings teams. I mean, near impossible to guard Um, and and we're better defensibly when they got really good, then people gave them credit for rep. Absolutely was a hell of a coach. He was not He was one hundred and eighty degrees from a self promoter. And You know, he was never a guy who talked about Well, we execute, you know, there's the coach c thought we executed our system really well. you know, that was not Rick. He would just talk about his players and get from game to game. Yeahah, he was tremendous. He's a guy that I have A lot of respect for. I've told David Adelan that several times and Yeah, my thoughts are with the Adelman family, but Rick Adelman did a lot for this leak It's hard to believe that we're almost a quarter century now removed from the heyday of those Kings teams whichich means there is a whole generation of basketball fans who only know vaguely what we're talking about through highlights Those teams just as much as the seven seconds or less teams. We're like just slapped you in the face with their freshness and their style of play and how loic stood out Um, Well, and if you take the game today take Dantoni's sons and Rick Adelman's teams, whether it was Sacramento mainly, I think we think of, but Minnesota, Houston, you know, like Those two guys, the Almost everything you see You'll go back and be able to see in one or both of those systems and those guys deserve Tremendous credit for what the what the game has become Well, I know another coach I think it was Orlando Rnd White Howard picking rollles was shooting all around him Richard Lewis power for. That team did pretty well. I don't know whatever happened to that coach. but but I don't think we and I say this, I'm not trying to be modest. I don't think I mean, we we got to four out and got more shooting on the floor, but Concept wise, it's always been a pick and roll league and we were a kick and roll team. So I don't really think we did anything differently other than space the floor you know, so I don't think we had nearly the Um on the game that Um these guys have had. now. I do think There are some players and one of the players I don't think gets enough credit and interesting he played for Rick Aelan played for San Antonio and then I had in Orlando. You know Guy like Hito Turkulu who was never an all star. I knew you werere going bring up Hito. I knew But he's he's the modern prototype You know, I think what went through the league, right? My brother and I were talking the other day. if you think about the league We went from conventional bigigs Right And then we got to more of a four out And then people went Sa That was a thing for a while. We're going to go small ball to get more skill on the floor Then as players developed and a lot of them coming from Europe you realize like We don't need to be small to have skill on the floor. So now Small guards are getting harder and harder and harder to play with. now it's Big skilled ball And I think guys like Novitsky, but even more Hito Turkalu who could Put it on the floor, make passes, shoot the ball, play anywhere on the floor That's today's game. I mean, it it's it's fascinating to sort of watch John Hollinger had a good thing in the athletic the other day about Bigman position has changed. I mean, it's night and day. I mean, Victor Wimbinyama like is Well As that evolution was happening and a lot of it traced like the rise of the wararriors and the decline of the post up and all that is Um Is that was happening? I would always say skilled size is the endgame of all this and absutely. And that has happened. But I will say onic and fitting that you're bringing this up about small guards. when a six foot whatever small guard is up is the best player on a team that's up one zero in the finals. And obviously Becky Hammon is taking a lot of crap two or three years ago and she said, he's not a dude, he's not a one A. And I went back to watch the clip stand And little did I even remember The next day she's on NBA today and they they ask her about this and she doubles down on it. Who's on NBA today with her? M. I'm on the set. I'm like, oh my God, I was there for this and they go to me and I give this spiel about how look, I don't think any of these rules about this guy can't be a one A or you can't win with this guy are absolute. I said, I think Chris Paul probablyably could have won the title as the best player on a team and Isaiah Thomas did. I talked about how you got to surround him with the right people. Is there like a one another one A or another player like if your if your best player is the thirteenth best player in the league and Bronson' better than that now. Do you also have the fourteenth best player in the league and that's now the cat kind of became that guy You got to surround him with size on the wing. They've done that And there I just completely forgot that I was part of this discussion, but I think we're learning Look, whether they win the title or not They're facing a great team. their underdogs are up oneo. They're three wins away from the title I think we can just I think they're close enough. you can put to bed like clearly you can win a title when Jen Brunson is your best player because I think that absolutely Absolutely, but look, I think thing you have to be careful of if you're someone else building a team. Y. We all know the line and I think it holds true in a lot of cases The exception proves the rule. Sure. Absolutely You know, like Jayen Brunson's a unicorn in his own way in terms of his mental toughness, what he does at the end of games It's not the way I think Becky Hammon was on to something. It's not the way to build a championship team, but it doesn't mean it can't be done with the right God Now Can you do it with a lot of small guards? No. you can't, I don't think You know Are you going to be able to do it with Trey Young, who's a remarkable player I think it's unique I think it does bring up one thing of The one thing I haven't heard enough of throughout the playoffs, mayaybe I've just missed it frront offices deserve Unbelievable credit. I mean Leon Rose, he has five starters. None of those guys did he inherit. none of them. He put the whole thing together, the Brunson free agent signing and trades for his other four starters You know, tremendous. And then Everybody looks at San Antonio. Well, they got wimby. Yes they did. But in building the team Castle was the number four pick. The guys ahead of him were Rissa Se, Alex Sarr and Reed Shepard. So like You know, like that's that's a great Harper was not a And the other guys are good too, but Harper wasn't a given at number two with DJ Edgecom. C Kannippple guys who are good players. Champiny they picked up on wavers, but he fits there te I think they've really understood fit. I think Cornet was an underrated free agent signing Devin Vll was the number eleven pick Ryan Wright's first draft, I believe C You know, like And the guys ahead of him were Patrick Williams James Wiseman, Isaac O Coro Killian Hazes Oby Topppin, Jalen Smith. These weren't like given picks. Yes, Wimby fell in their lap But you've got to build a team around your star And they've done an unbelievable job of that. Both these front offices, obviously Oklahoma City Boston, probably the four best in the league in terms of how they built their rosters right now, but these guys, Brian W and his staff and Leon Rose and his staff. They deserve phenomenal credit and obviously both coaches have been great. I love how San Antonio' just leaned into their youth you know, that the move to put Harrison Barnes on the bench not a not an easy move for a first year coach. to take a veteran guy and say, hey, we're going to give you a much decreased Rll they Chris Paul started eighty two games for him last year They let him walk. They created opportunity for these other guys like they leaned into it Front offices, coaches are both done They've both done a great job and then When you have put those two together and then the referees do a great job It's going to be a fun series to watch. Amen. We have between three and six more games inclusive left of this thing. I hope it's six. I hope it's an epic one. No one is watching more carefully than Stan Van Gundi. Thank you for your time coach. I'll talk to you soon Thanks, Zach. Have a good one. This episode is brought to you by Nas Energy Introducing new NS Eergy Grand Prix Guava For those that want to be fueled up and fired up with one hundred bound hour tropical tasting power Iignnite your taste, start your engine Shift your flavor to high gear with new Nas Eergy Grand Prix Guava Hit the street, grab a can and get after it This episode is brought to by Netflix. The T mobile home runun Derbies right around the corner might be one of the best showcases of pure power and off sports baseballs Biggest sluggers. along with some legendary Announcers, Puhos, Rizzo, Bonds, Sabbathia Al Duncin. Yeah Hunter Pence, Matt Fast Kirzian, a whole bunch of people. And it's the one night where you don't swing to make contact You swing to make history. I'm interested is who what Bond says about this actually. Anyway, it is all live from Citizens Bank Park In Philly, watch the T moobile Home rununs Der live on Netflix Monday, july thirteenth at eight PM Eastern five PM Pacific All right, I just want to tack on a couple of things that are not about the finals that are going in going on around the league. Number one, Orlando Magic hired Sean Sweeney, currently coaching for the Surs in the NBA fininals. I haven't really addressed that. I think Sweeney is a very good coach who's going to do a great job in Orlando He gets pitgeonholed a lot of times as a defense guy and he has often been a defenseive coordinator. Trust me. He can be an offense guy too and has been sort of covertly an offensive coordinator a couple of times here and there. in his career. Obviously a lot has been made of his connection to Jana Setenta Glumpo from his time with Milwaukee, Sean's time with Milwaukee. I think that is worth noting. I mean, one of the things that Coach Sweeney has accomplished in his career has managed to do is Thread the needle between being but not thread the needle, but it's rare that a guy can be brutally honest with superstar players. and not annoy the players. In fact, the superstar players tend to really really like him after spending time with him. I think that's really hard to do. And I think it comes down to they respected. he's not scared of them, to scared to tell them the truth, scared to what the tell them what the film shows he's right because he grinds and he's done his homework and they appreciate that he's right and that someone is telling them and that he will also praise them when they do awesome stuff, which they didn't generally do. So I do think it's worth noting, does it make Orlando a sneaky suitor in the honest Derby, you know, that would be an interesting move for them. I at the beginning of last season, I pitched Palo for Janis as onene of the more interesting potential fake trades and then I remembered my cap rules and that Palo was almost poison pilled impossible to trade because of his extension kicking in. Well, that's not the case anymore. D didnn't have a great season, but I think there's still A lot of shine on Palo as a young player number one option type, whether he can be the number one option on a great greatade team is TBD Um, obbviously Orlando disappointed this year. It would be a Out of character, sort of young for aging. aging's probably a little strong. Honest is only thirty one for this front office, but you know, once you throw four first round picks to Desmond Bean And you see that the Franz palo thing remains sort of in terms of a fit. Sometimes it's great. Otentimes it's clunky U, I think it's something that you could probably at least discuss internally, those four picks that they traded for Banain make it a little hard for them to fluff up the offer with stuff On top of Pllo Who knows? I mean, I don't know what's going to happen with the honest, but we have reached a point where I would be pretty shocked if he doesn't get traded. I have said several times in the last month that if I had if you put Gun tohead metaphorical gun to headad. If I had to pick a team, I would pick Miami despite the lack of a blue blue chip asset or young player or pick or whatever, but because obviously Jonis is going to be able to put his thumb on the scale a little bit. But I think lots of different scenarios are in play Despite what Bill has said about Bill Simmons has said about the Celtics not wanting Yonis, and I said I also don't sense a great urgency for them to get Yonis a lot of people are sort of eyeing them as a wild card in the offseason in general. So we'll see. A couple other things. Oklahoma City, Andrew Schlelectton and I did a sort of download of their loss to the Spurs and what comes next for them and all the second apron issues and what their most likely path is. And we both kind of agreed that I got to tell you, no one around the league sees them as a honest team. Everybody every GM, every scout I've talked to would be pretty surprised if they veered in that direction. And that's why we sort of agreed on a You know trim the payroll a little bit one way or another and Most of the courps together, including Hartenstein, either opting him in or a new deal for a little bit less money. Dort is sort of TBD U try to move up in the draft, et cetera. I'm I'm five days, two days later, three days later, whatever it is. I'm more convinced than ever that that's probably the case. I will say there's also a roadmap that a couple people have alert not reminded me of where they could just opt in Hartenstein and opt in Dart and cut payroll elsewhere maybe eat the second apron penalties for a year because It's not like they're in desperate need of making a trade. If their draft pick ends up getting frozen seven years down the line No team has ever been more well positioned to weather a drag pick being frozen because they have so many picks still coming to them from Denver, from the cllippers, etcetera. Um, and then, you know, next year, if you opt those guys in, Then you can really reset financially when Shay's new big deal kicks in twenty twenty seven, twenty eight, I think is new his massive Supermax kicks in So that's another another thing they can do. And I will continue to say I know JWub and Chet are not thirty percent maxes or super maxes. JWub didn't meet the criteria for it this year and Chet didn't negotiate into his contract I still will forever beat the drum And they're like the homegrown max guys. Shay's not a homegrown player, although they got him when he was very early in his career Um And Kaseason Wallace is not going to a max player, etcetera. But I still think you should get some sort of tax slash apron relief for guys you drafted making the max somehow so that it's not just this prohibitive You can't even keep the team together. You have to look at all these painful moves when you've built the team pretty organically. I will pitch that forever U And obviously a lot has been made about Oklahoma City potentially, um trying to trade up in the draft. I would bet that's true Um, I sniffed around a little bit I would be shocked if they were able to trade up into the top four I think it would take so much that it would be prohibitive almost for Oklahoma City. and I don't even know I don't even know what offer they could make that any of those four teams would be intrigued by. Those four prospects at the top of the draft are so outrageously good and so interesting in different ways that I would be really surprised if Oklahoma City could get into the top four Um There is still a lot of intrigue though at the top of the draft. I don't think anyone knows who Washington is going to take for sure. De Bancea is obviously a the quote unquote, safest pick Tons of Darren Peterson intrigue still obviously around the league. Nobody really is sure like what does Utah actually want at two? Are they going to be happy with whichever of those two is there? Are they going to do they kind of secretly want Darren Peterson because he feelills more of a natural sort of void for them at Gard There's just a ton of intrigue. you know, Memphis and Chicago are probably sitting there like, hey, whatever, whoever falls us We'll take one of them. Chicago will take the last of them, Caleb Wilson, Camboo or whatever. We're going to be we're going to be psyched to do that. I think it's going to be super interesting to see how the Intel kind of floats out. Who works out? for which of those four guys works out for anybody but Washington who obviously is in the catbird seat with the number one pick Um I don't even know if those teams will trade up or down with each other. I get the sense now that they're probably all in stand pat mode and just see who's available to them I think it's the top four and the order they fall in is going to be outrageously exciting U And we will see on draft day, which is only nineteen days away And bad news for me the NBA moved the draft to june twenty third. You know what's happening on june twenty third? Croatia is playing in the World Cup in Toronto and we bought tickets for the game a long time ago. So I've got to figure out How to balance all that which is going to be delight becausecause I'll tell you this, the NBA draft comes around every year, the World Cup does not. so figure that one out, but I hope you enjoyed today's episode. Thank you to as always Jonathan, Michael, and Billy on production. thanks to Stan Van Gundy. The great Stan Van Gundy. thanks to you all for listening to and are watching the Zachlow S showow. Get ready for game two. I can't wait. I wish it started right now. And we will see you after game too. I'll put up another episode. Talking about that game. Thankks everybody. See you next time. twenty one and over in President select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or eighteen and over in P presresident in DC, Kentucky, O Wyoming, gambling problem. Call one eight hundred gambler or one eight hundred My reset. Call one eight eight eight seven eighty nine seven seven seven seven or visit ccpG dot org slash chat in Connecticut or isisit MD gamblinghelp dot orga in Maryland. Hope is here Visit gamblinghelpline mA dot orga or call eight hundred three two seven five zero fivezero for twenty four seven support in Massachusetts or call one eight seven seven eight Hope NY or text hope NY in New York for Louisiana, call one eight seven seven, seven seven zero seven eight six seven Uncovered windows can make your home feel up to twenty degrees hotter. 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