Reflecting on the UFC event controversy

There's simply no way around the numbers. Donald Trump's approval rating in his second term has completely collapsed But some groups matter more than others, and one group matters a whole lot. That's young men. Take a look at this step In twenty twenty four, men under thirty prefer Donald Trump to Kamala Harris by about one percentage point. But in recent polling this year, men under thirty have widely disapproved of Donald Trump and his approval rating is under water by fifty five points. a stunning decline. Now, I wanted to dig in further with these numbers at an event that was specifically geared to target this group I went to Washington, DC for Donald Trump's UFC event to talk to Young Men about the president. Do we think he's still cool? Have young Men really turned on Donald Trump? Let's diggin. Support for today's show comes from Better Hel. Summer is here, which means travel is picking up, the kids are out of school, and fun is in the air But juggling it can be a lot. 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Go to fetchpet dot com slash save right now for your free quote. That's fetchpet dot com slash save. Why do y'all decide to come out today All proud to be American and we got free tickets. It's' gonna to be a great time. That's about it. One question we have is, would you say you're here for Trump or UFC? UC UFC all the way. UC. UFC has a lot of culture, a lot of different people from a lot of different places and that's what America is to me. You definitely see diversity. You definitely see a lot of different types of people, you see a different type of vibe But one of the things that is really clear is like, you know, Trump used UFC to kind of pitch himself to young men in the campaign trail and things like that. And there seems to be that like younger men really liked him in twenty twenty four is do you'all think that's true? And then like is that still true? just knows how to advertise himself to younger proud. Why do we think Trump and men seem to have a connection. I mean, I guess his views What do it mean Oh That's a good question. Just just like I'm like, whyy do we think this is true, right Yeah, just the way he views everything I guess' similar with how younger people It aligns with masculinity, I feel like, to a certain extent. Like Is it how he talks? Is it a policy? Like what would we say specifically? Wellt first it was what he was promising to America. But what do you mean He was promising lower prices on everything. We didn't know wars were going to start with other countries. It's like the younger generation, they see this stuff, they see everything online and it's like he was promising change. Yeah. That's big change.. Exactly. question I have is, has he lived up to that? No. I wouldn't say so. I was I' wasm disappointed. We're disappointed. I guess what I was gonna to ask about. You mentioned no new wars. You mentioned kind of I mean, Gasp, whatever, whatever you want to mean What do you think has been the disconnect in the second time? middle class, I want things that affect my life. I want to see change in my regular day to day.'s like and I don't see that. You mentioned disappointment, Wh Just because he's not living up to what he said he was gonna do. You know? He said he was anti war. you know, he said he was gonna to lower prices and we're just not like that result is just not happening. You know, we're not seeing it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, do you' all feel the same way? I'm not. Prices are ridiculous Dason Don't even get him start on gas. I don't even want to fill my gas tank no more. Yeah. Crazy, manat. Trp definitely used to seem cool. Like, do we think he's still cool, questuestion Mark? I feel like afterfter, you know, the FS files and everything should have just like blasted out with how he's been acting. I feel like it was a lot more, you know, chill before that. I feel like everything he's doing now is like negate that like what happened with that. Like what we say that the Epstein files you think was the break between like maybe win some of this there was a lot of there. Yeah Yeah I think the wars I think that definitely separated a lot of people, especially young people, you know, because no one likes pedophiles, you know, no one likes to that and the way that it's portrayed, at least it seems like there's trying to be some sort of coverout. Yeah Yeah. Okay, last question will be like The ways that Trump was trying to appeal the young men and pitch himself, like, does that apply to people after him? Like can JD Vance do the same thing? Do you'all like these y Is there another politician? mayaybe even not Republican that you like the way they're acting? Or is this like a specific Trump phenomenon? Thomas Massey. Thomas Masseerestly Anyone else who you see across the landscape and you're like, I like that person. I mean, I don't really keep up with politics honest so I feel like even if someone does do this after Trump, it just won't be at the scale that Trump did it at becausecause he feels unique in some ways in the celebrity or in all of that front.. Okay cool. I will say I really like Mount Damio. You like mayayor of New York? Zong? Yes, sir. I have to disagree with you. You disagreement. should can and disagreree. If there's one issue you would want Trump to focus on if he hasn't What would it be? Foreign aid to Israel. You want to see, I imagine less. A lot less. I feel like you know, there's stuff going on over there. It's serious stuff. people are dying and it just shouldn't be happening. Is there any other issue' paying that his taxpayers. Is there any issue you would want him to focus on that he's not focusing on right now? main thing Yeahah, Israel. It just Israel. Yeah. We don't want conflict. Yeah. I feel like a lot of young people are on the same page with that. like it's it's a big thing for the young voters is is it does seem as if like You know, if Epsteem was maybe break one Yeah, then Iran warar and specific relationship to Israel has been a major break in terms of this year. Have you seen people talk about him differently or like feel differently about him since that stuff has popped off? Just keep America first, you know? Like keepe our priorities in America. That's all it is. Care about my family. I care about my country. I want people to be safe and happy where they live Yeah care about my wallet too, man. Yeah. Country familyily wallet in sub order.' sub order in. Doid you call me Edie? Edie Edd Jose. Jose. So would you say you came for Trump or you came for UFC? I came't URF. I know a lot of people are hating about he's doing at the White House and stuff like that B I think it's just a one of a lifetime opportunity to happen. so that's why you came here. Yeah, what about you? I feel like it's an environment. I feel like this is like once an opportunity where we can come and you know come to the historic place and we get to see something that we really like like youF see. Do you like trp? Yeah I be honest for now, but I mean, what about you? I do not, I do not agree with any of the things that he has, you know done or said or what he's, you know, going for, but I think it's pretty cool that he likes the fights, that he likesF you you and all. you like that? Yeah, I think that's, you know, like if anybody that likes youSCF of New York He was at the Brazil game. Yeah, yeah yeah. am was at the World Cup event. You're saying it's kind of like the same Trump coming to this versus him going to the World Cup. I'm assuming that there's people that also go like the New York mayayor, but you know Prettyool that he likes the people game Yeah. 'Cause one thing is like, Democrats don't really do UFC. They don't do anything like that, you know? If Kamala Harris was president, I doubt that there would be a UFC event on the White House, right?ight I'm saying like, do you think that's a missed opportunity for them to speak to people like y'all? Yeah, it might be. Yeah. like that's why I'm saying like Those people like if anything like let's say Kamo doesn't like that, but if she has people aren'ting that lif that, you know, they can always, you know promote that and stuff. Yeah. Okay, last question. If you have one issue you will want politicians to focus on What would it be? Gas prices? Gas prices. Gas prices it's bad. I would say. Yeah I would say gas prices. Who do you blame for that I mean, I just think he's been president in the West. I'm like, I'm like You can't, It is the president, but it's also the things that he's doing with the war and stuff like that. I think you should focus more on the US than the other countries Would you say you're here for Trump or UFC? Oh, I'd say a little bit of vote, you know. Does the political angle did it make you more excited or less excited to come? It'd be even more exciting you. Many people don't like Trump. but that's his birthday. He's a president, scest country on Earth. so we're gonna here to celebrate that and watching Gunmen play it. Did job vote for Trump? I'm eighteen, so I just turned eighteen, so I did not have the pleasure of being able to vote. Okay back in the last election But would you have? I would have to think about that. In my opinion, especially with people my age, I think we all think that the two sides were too extreme. And if someone was in the middle, I definitely would have voted for them. But honestly, I might not have voted.. What do you think? Did you vot? I voted for Kanye. Why is that? same reason. think they're both extreme. They take it to the next level. Do we think Trump is do you like him more or less than this first term? I mean, obviously I like the UFC. so it's like I like that a lot. He's doing that polocal wise. I mean, Id say less. I'd say a little less, but I do like things he's doing like this, obviously. It does change my opinion. It does work to change people's opinions. You're saying this this reached you, but you like him a little less this time than last time I'd say a little bit, yeah. One thing that really came up in the last election was about young men in Trump. Like there was a whole thing about folks like y'all, Y'all's age, like being really interested in Trump. And in some ways it feels as if young men in Trump was a specific relationship in the last eion. I agree that more men think like I guess more masculine they think to vote or Republican than Democrat. Why do we think that is? I feel like more Demrat they view towards the LGBTQ hby. And most like masculine men don't want to be a part of that. they go to the other side. evenven like they don't look at the politics. like politics aside, they don't want to like be associated with gay people. So I feel that could be a reason. whole reason So three big takeaways after talking to young men outside of Donald Trump's UFC event. The first is that a lot of these boys are here for the sport, not necessarily the president. They recognize the political aspect, but they're largely here because they're fans of fighting. The second thing though, is that those things are kind of related things as Donald Trump has gone from the fringe to the mainstream. So has UFC itself And a lot of the fans of the sport really appreciate him backing them over a long period of time. But the third thing is the most important, particularly about politics, because I keep hearing from boys that they feel a little differently about Donald Trump in his second term than the first term. They feel like he hasn't necessarily focused on the right priorities, and even the things that made him a model man or had fallen off the second time he's been in office. So I'm going to dig further into that by someone who lives in the al right manosphere. I'm going to talk to Jack Posobic, the far right activist and podcaster who will be at this event and who I talked to a couple years ago. I remember at that time, he told me that the best way to understand Donald Trump is to think about And so what better place to follow up on that conversation? Let's talk to him Support for this show comes from Shopify. Starting a business is the beginning of a whole new chapter in your life, and it's a stressful one. Taking on something that big can cause a lot of doubts. But this new journey doesn't have to be scary, and Shopify wants to help make this experience as exciting and as stress free as possible. 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Ai slash explain Ive always thought the way he looks at these things are, you know, he's got a challenge directly in front of him and he's thinking, how do I take that down? And you look you look at his background with WWF,, There's a lot of that DNA that went into the campaign that went into the admin. And I just I've always thought that that's what President Trump's mentality, Donald Trump demands mentality was. it also seems like an element of showmanship that's built into that WW that Donald Trump understands like look at this goes without saying goes without saying The showmanship, the walkout themes, which obviously he uses at his rallies. Yeah. he won't really behind stage at those rallies, he's directing all that. The other thing I think about is kind of the masculinity projection. like people we're talking to here say that like you know, there's a special relationship between men and Trump that he understands them What do you think that meanans did What is He did stop the only two women who ran for president, you know? I mean I I'm saying that seems built in the cost too. I'm saying like, what is it about Donald Trump as a guy? look That guy' like. Lookook at his background, right He's always been around with boxing, Don King, Iron Mike Tyson back his day, Vanderhole, even his hip hop stuff. Even the hip hop stuff, he's always been sort of attracted to that masculine figure, physicality, always been around with sports. like sports are just back in such a big way right now. and Trump was always a big part of that, including, by the way getting UFC off the ground. and Dana White tells the story all the time. noobbody would give them assurance until Trump came along and said, you know what? Let's give it a shot, right? They started as non mainstream non establishment You know, outside of the Overton window of discussion, but they connected with the people in a way that WWF connects to the people. You go and look at the places that pro wrestling goes and holds their events. N just their raws and the WrestleManias, but the house shows, the shows that don't even make it on TV. And then you go cross section that, cross reference that Magar. it's one of same group of people, the same sort of culture that ras you each other. You may not You know, you may not have a pro sports team in your town, but you know what? When WWF comes to town, you can see full Cogan body slam with giants. You might be able to go see Donald Trump. I come in and he's going to come as the New York City fififth Avenue billionaire. He's going to come and see you and show that you matter. I mean, yeah, you're right, There was a lot of outcry about, you know, UFC on the lawn, but I hear what you're saying that it's about bringing a culture Mostly lives in communities that necessarily don't have big sporting event, major sports st and bringing that to the White House. you're saying that's what Donald Trump has is serve those communities. He's always had that sort of authenticity that connects directly. So it doesn't surprise me at all that he would say, you know what? I'm here. I'm in the big place right now. I want to bring all my friends in together and do this. I want to though ask about what's changed, maybe from first term Trump to second term Trump. becausecause one of the things we heard even to talking to some of the young men here was that they feel like Trump's a little less cool now than they may have liked him four years ago. Like what do you think is any difference between Trump's connection with those people now? that maybe those young men who supported him in twenty twenty four, but they' a little softer now, because we talk to some of them here. hear that A lot of people saying, especially young men saying, lookook, you know, we want more focus on domestic than genereralm. heard that to that I'm sure you do. I'm sure do. I hear the exact same thing And I communicate that to the White House whenever I talk to, whoever I talk to in there, you know, whoever's listening that it's, hey, they want more focus on domestic Whereas they see the fore and stuff They say know, whether I'm foring against it, I just want to see stuff that affects me directly. And that's right hear over over and over again. It's that Epstein and you know, just a a gaspraise whatever it is. And And so I think that an event like today is going be something hopefully kind of maybe restart that connection. Yeah so you're it seems to be acknowledging that there is a little bit of a break in that connection, or at least some of the young men who was such strength for Donald Trump in twenty twenty four, it seemed like you're acknowledging they might be a little. I hear it all the time. I hear it all the time Imy, isn't there kind of a fair argument that Donald Trump came in on prices, came into lower prices and they're not lower. Inflation just hit a record high since those kind of buy in years? Like what's happened there Well, I think that what the president would say is is That's the price of getting Iran off the table as an international cr. So you ack acknowledge it, I acknowledge it of course. gas prices are up. They are coming down But that is the price for this. Now, will that be in time for the midterms to have that, you know, have that softening effect? We'll see. Yeah. But I think at the end of the day, the president's looking at when he leaves office at the end of twenty eight, letg, you know, or I guess you know, january twenty ninth, that you know, that he'll be able to say, hey, I took the Ran off the world stage as this international threat. You know, I'm a trust the process on that. I certainly acknowledge, there's friction,'s pain points absolutely. Well the second thing that I want to bring up is Epstein because that came up with some of the young men here. like has it been surprising that Donald Trump has not seemed to follow through on the scope of transparency that he's promised Look I to see I want to see everything that's come out. I mean, everybody knows my background with this and I was gonna say like as the pizza gay guy like than that. But I mean, like the whole thing with the Han Bondi gave us the binders and said, oh, this is gonna be the big thing. And here they come and said, okay, but you always said that was part one That would want to think there's going to be part two, park three, park, et cetera. You know, however many is until we get all the way out. I think that if the administration had just said, you know what Just ripp the bandet off. Just ripped it Bring itrow it It's gonna happen eventually. Why not be the ones to come out and say, look, we want to have all of this out. There's so much of an appetite for it. And I'll tell you why because the crimes that have been alleged and sububstantiated even to this point are so horrendous, so heinous that it's just become this I guess avatar, I guess, of the elites versus the J kind of thing that we're talking about that if you don't release it, it becomes es he' on the side of the elite. It becomes what I was going say it becomes a block between that relationship that I was just talking about that he's always traditionally had with the average people of America to say, hey, wait a minute, we thought you were on our side, release everything. We want it out there. hear you I just want to follow up because what we were hearing from some of the boys here was The inability for him to be transparent on this front has already blocked the relationship that they felt like they had with him when he was coming into office. Why is his lack of transparency to this point not been enough for you to already say they've crossed that threshold cause it's a relationship problem, right? It's like It's like with my wife and we have a we have an issue and I said, well we solve that iss. She said, Yeahah, is she happy about it? Right? So you know, you know what I'm saying You know what I'm saying're saying still's there's still like some lingering. So that's why I'm hoping and I'm certain and by the way, I'm very pleased to see that you see the turnout today. There's a lot of people who said that like, oh, he's totally lost his connection with You know, the average person out there. I would say that I think today is an example of him saying, you know what? Hey, I'm on your side. We're going to do this thing. I'm opening up the White House to as many literally as many people as we can. We should see this as a part of the repair of that relationship. Is that where you' say? Reconnect. Reconnect. Reconnectconnect.. It's like it's like, you know, sometimes we get a little busy Girl needs date night. I take herl I say, you know it' sweetart I'm putting the phone down, I'm putting Twitter down, I'm putting all of it down. It's nice to meeting you. It seems a little different. like even from the times that we've talked, like, I remember three, four years ago, we would be at scenes like this and be hearing things about Democrats and pedophilals and Democrats have like up And now iss is kind of and now we see the kind of reversal of those things. I'm saying asone who, I think help popularize. Is that fair to say some of those initial claims about Democrats? How is it is my kind of my question now that that focus is now on Donald Trump. I think the focus now is more elite generan. Okay. I would say Not D or R, but elite class. like that. And by the way, I saw that back at the time too. That it's always been that and back then it was the president. So I watch ever seened it in the White House many, many, many times. And they were the ones who were perceived as the ones blocking the information or trying to hold it up. They both testified now whatever, right? We'll see if they actually tell the truth But you do see it as being something where again, I think the some of the initial stonewall or the Hming and hauling out of Anan Bonnie's office, which no longer holds is responsible for that. I really do. He' saying that has a direct effect to the kind of scenes we even see now where like people are using those kind of insults focused on Trump and Republicans in the way that they weren't doing New years ago. Yeah, they were they are, but I do think it's a little bit it's a little bit cynical, right? Be it's like Democrats were in the White House for years. They had the whole government, they didn't anything about it that. You know, okay, if you had Feny viles, give us the ESen viles. Why didn't you? But, you mentioned of the centrality of Iran war, which seems like a big reason for some of this shift. like one hundred percent. I guess to me, know, I heard Trump meet the press a couple weeks ago say that he did not break a promise by the actions versus the rhetoric of no more new wars I was at so many of those Trump rallies. I heard him make the argument for no new wars How is this not a break of that promise Well, the way I've said it is is that This is not an Iraq style. It's not an Afghanistan style war where you've got, you know Thousands of troops that are storming the beaches. That is a war areas. It's a war. It's a war, but it's not a forever Is it an operation? Sure. But it's different from the idea of a full on full scale ro deployment to a Middle Etern country. How many people believe you on that front though? Be I mean even I imagine that hard cell. canan you at least say like, is that cell getting harder to make with even Trump's own fans? F left No, I don't think so because because we do see that He hasn't put troops on the ground. I want to look ahead now, like, you know, there does seem to be a unique relationship that Donald Trump has with young men, or he was able to really execute that in twenty twenty four. Yeah a guy who's turning eighty today. For a guy whos turneding eighty. So I'm saying is that the same for JD Vance? that's the same for Mar Is that' the same for the people coming after Trump? You know what? there is something real special that I see whenever JD goes and he's with the military where it's like he comes out there and he has this camaraderie with them that as a veteran myself, I think is unmatched. When we take him to campus events, it's the same deal. It's they really look look up to him and they seemless one of theirs. He's huge J culture. in a way, different way than Trump has been. He understands the memes, he bads the memes, he portrays himself as the memes. he leans all the way in. Whereas, you know, President Trump did post his Ffe meme in twenty fifteen. He's more of a scroller. more of aweet.ull retweet, whereereas JD, I think has totally immersed himself in that meme culture and in that internet culture where you know, people have criticized him for it. Is that something you think Democrats can like? The question is which Democrat? And I just I don't see a Democrat that has that right now. I really don't I mean, James Talo like You're real, you know? and Gavin Newsom, he just comes across as slimy and then Kamala Harris is trying to run again. I'm not saying it's not possible, but I just don't see it would be. Yeah, you're like Of those options, you're taking JD Vance, particular to that relationship. Yeah I take deocr. All, I'll give you one, though, I'll give you one You can see the Democrats trying out this, you know, hey, let' take let's take a white male veteran who's also a Democrat and put them in and just get them to talk about economic. Democrat. So Grand Platner is kind of like the next iteration of that strategy. Will it stick? Will it not? We'll see. But I can I think I'm starting to see the beginnings of a new strategy there to bring back the blue Dg Democrat, but in a more like Bernie Sanders populous but but more I guess just manly? Is that really? Okay. R. And your So that version maybe taking now with Graham they may have gone a little bit too a little bit too far, but you can see them trying to do it and I predict they'll continue to do so. Last question, like, is there any fear you have that the combo of Epstein, Aran has put him on a worse footing with that same group of young men who he was succeeding with just two years ago the numbers are softer today, there's no question about that, but that's what this is all about. That's what having the UFC here is about. I think And there may be that acknowledgement that's coming off to say, hey, we need to reconnect. Let's reconnect. Let's do it on your terms. Let's bring everyone in. let's have that basash with, by the way, winding down Iran, which of course is going to have that effect on gas prices that we always. That has to come alongside it. It's got to come. It's gott to come. There's no question. You cannot disassociate Woraron with the gas prices and the economic pain people are feeling. And if you do that politically, if you try to say, well, you know, it's so important that we do this and don't worry about it, mean, you're done. You're done if you say don't worry about it and don't worry about the gas prices. What helps He's victory. You have victory.