Global Implications and Western Reactions

This is the Guardian If you're looking for something predictable and low friction over the long term, public markets may be a suitable option The moment you want different investment characteristics, it may be time to consider the private markets. See how your wealth can work smarter at creativeplanning d. com slash access It's almost trying to show he can meet the world's top leaders whenever he likes. everyveryone sort of wants a piece of him. There's no doubt that Beijing is really reveling in this now that China is having this moment on the sort of diplomatic stage. China definitely has the upper hand this occasion, And I think both parties know that. She knows that. Putin knows that. Xi Jinping has welcomed Vladimir Putin to Beijing just days after hosting Donald Trump. but with an increasing power imbalance between the pair as the relationship between Russia and China changed From the Guardians T todayay in Focus, this is the latest with me Lucy Hong Well I' joined Deka Vatt the Guardians Dputy head of International News. Thanks for joining us Deviga. So this morning we've been seeing all these scenes of pomp and pageantry in Beijing as Vladimir Putin, the Russian president has travelled to China for I think the twenty fifth time, and he and Xi Jinping have had more than forty meetings in the past talk about the optics of this meeting because it's in the exact same location that Donald Trump was in just a few days ago. Yeah, thanks for having me, Lucy. Yeah. So as you say, Trump was there just last week And this visit has come hot off the heels of that, probablyably much to Trump's Chagrin, I'd suspect. And yes, the optics and the theater of it feels very, very similar. So you there's been the honor guuard and a gun salute, which Trump got to cheering children, waving in this case, Russian and Chinese flags a marching band And alongside the kind of formal talks and the sort of handshakes, there's going to be background discussions behind the scenes, which again, we sort of saw with the Trump visit know, and the optics will be watched, especially closely for this sort of compare and contrast opportunity it gives us But the relationships are very different. So let's talk about that because I mean these are two strong men who've been seen as being very much allies on the global stage. I think Xi Jinping has described Putin as his best and most intimate friend, slightly disquietingly Has that shifted in recent years, do you think? and perhaps this year given how much turmil we're seeing and in light of course, of Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Yes, I think so. so yeah, it's absolutely the case that unlike And she this is a kind of really historic relationship that goes back. years and years and they share a lot in common. They're both sort of autocratic strong men who've managed to maintain power for years and years. Again, you know one suspects Trump might look on on that quite jealously. And so there's a pree existing relationship here. and this trip feels a lot more about from the Chinese point of view anyway, working out how to sort of leverage that relationship in a kind of useful way now that China is having this moment on the diplomatic stage that it's long kind of sought, It's long wanted to be seen as the sort of seat, the center of power of global diplomacy in a way it's not really had the opportunity to before. And I think there's a big sense now that although there is this relationship with Russia China will want to really think about how it uses that to its advantage the fact that the two visits come so closely together It's almost she trying to show he can meet the world's top leaders whenever he likes. Everyone sort of wants a piece of him. Yeah, and striking to see the obptics of all this pomp and pageantry and this display of military and economic heft from China Also striking that Xi Jinping has said this quote that the world risks regressing into the law of the jungle. I mean striking that China would be advocating the rules based international order and kind of seeming a bit like the adult in the room. Yes, And I think there's no doubt that Beijing is really reveling in this moment. It sort of gets to say that because of the war in Iran and because of the war in Ukraine. It gets to sort of relish this role that it can kind of seek to play as a sort of global player in diplomacy. There's been no sort of direct mention of the US. She has sort of warned of unilateral and hegemonic counter cururrence running rampant in the international system And he also sort of said, as you say, the world faces the danger of reverting to the Lw of the jungle. And Putin interestingly, has kind of made a big thing of Russian and Chinese cooperation on the world stage. And so that that's one of the key stabilizing factors in the world, which again, feels ironic Given the word Ukraine But you know, some might say that we're in a position where the US's actions have sort of enabled both of them to say this, not with a straight face because it still seems ridiculous when the US is also now a volatile player, it has sort of enabled to position himself in this kind of way. Yeah, and perhaps as the sort of leading strong man superpower of this strange new world that we're living in. But in terms of the dynamic between these two men, Putin and she meeting today, there's a sense that they've previously met us But on this occasion things are very much working in China's favour. They're signing a number of deals on tech and trade, particularly this gas pipeline right. But there's suggestions that these are deals that are very much being signed on Chinese terms. Is that fair to say? Yes, very much so. So China definitely has the upper hand on this occasion in a way it may not have done in the past. And I think both parties know that. She knows that. Putin knows that. And you can sort of see it on how the trip has played out. So even in the language, there are kind of subtle differences in what they've sort of said. So Putin has said that ties were at an unprecedentedly high level, which is something he said before. And it's this really unequivocal love for China in that sort of statement Whereas she has described relations in a much more mutual way as unyielding. So there's an acknowledgement there that this is a very close relationship. As we've sort of discussed before, they have considered each other and have said openly that they are friends before. And there's certainly a kind of warmth there that you don't necessarily see in other relations that both of those countries have with other countries But nonetheless, the relationship has shifted and it does feel like China is trying to play a game where it is positioning itself Depending on what could be for its advantage at this moment, rather than tying its mask to Russia and saying that that is a relationship it wants to pursue at cost to all others. because that's definitely not the case anymore. And of course, Russia's economy has been absolutely battered by international sanctions, but also the sort of war of attrition that's grand on. Absolutely. Yeah. So the war in Ukraine has put Russia in this position notot least because of the sanctions, which me that on the battlefield things are not going as well as it would have hoped And that's just how this massive impact on the economy, the trade relationship, the economic relationship is not It's very uneven. and so Russia really needs China. And there's an opportunity here with the war in Iran, China has faced big problems in terms of energy supplies because of the sort of hold upps in the strait of Hormuz. And so there's an opportunity here for Russia which feels like Putin would really want to seek to increase that relationship on the energy front with China, get China more reliant on Russian energy supplies. And that could be a boon for its economy at a time it really needs it. Yeah, it certainly does. But is there any sign of what X is likely to be saying to Putin behind closed doors about ending the war in Ukraine? Do do we know what sort of messaging he has towards Russia on there Well, this comes back to your point earlier about the sort of hypocrisy of both countries talking about kind of wanting stability in the world Oder. China's position on the war has always in terms of its public stance, has been very much it is a neutral player. and it's released these really kind of carefully caveated statements about wanting peace and the world order to be maintained But behind the scenes, we know that it has supported Russia in many ways diplomatically, you know through state visits such as this one and also economically with all these deals that are going on, the countries have had joint military exercises together. There have been reports this week not fully stood up yet that China might have even had a role in sort of helping with training of troops. So even though it says it does not support Russia in this war, it is certainly making moves behind the scenes to help the Russian war effort. And so it's possible Those conversations will have been had behind the scenes One would have thought Putin will be kind of quizzing she on how the Trump visit went because obviously the Trump Putin relationship is also important for both parties. Yeah. So how do you think this meeting will be looked on by the by Europe and by the wider West because I they've met several times before, dozens of times before, but this meeting under particular scrutiny and has particular consequences for the rest of the world. Yeah, I think that's right. I think the world is in a really kind of perilous state at the moment theseese wars we are seeing with the way the U.S has become such a volatile player and has proven time and time again it really cannot be relied upon in a way Europe might have once hoped And so pursuing the relationship with China, Europe has made clear, is very important because it needs to be friends with other big bullies in the playground. if you like And I think this visit highlights that there are all sorts of problems in being friends with China you know, as we've talked about, we know that there's been this tacit support behind the scenes from which of course, Europe willll be deeply uneasy about given the war in Ukraine happening on Europe's very doorstep. and Ukraine itself is probably looking at this very closely too a fascinating. Thank you so much for your time. Not at all. thanks for having me That's it for today. My huge thanks again to Devor Kabat, the Guardian's deputy head of Innational News. You can keep up with all our coverage of Putin's visit to Beijing over at theguardian d. comot And if you're an arrsenal fan or not, head over to our sister podcast foootball Weekly, where they'll be discussing the Gona's first Premier League title win in twenty two years Watch it on YouTube or listen wherever you get your Thanks for listening to this episode of the latest. Today in fooccus will be back in your feeds as usual tomorr morning the latest we' be tomorrowning This episode was presented by me, Lucy Hoff. It was produced by Brianie Moore. The senior producer was Ryan Ram Gobin, the lead producer was Zoe Hitch. H Kiright. I'm Karr Sherman. and we are here to tell you about our new show, which is rooted in this feeling that at least I have, I know you have where you know, it's kind of like when you wake up in the morning Pick up your phone And you're just hit in the face with a fire hose of news, right? Like There's war, there's authoritarianism, ourur planet is burning. 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