Final Thoughts and Closing Remarks

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They're off there saying airplanes UFO Chronicles, a place where people share their experiences of the strange and unexplained If you've had an encounter and would like to be on the show Email me at UFO Chronicles at Gmail. . com He everyone and welcome to the show. How are you all I'm Nick Hunter and this is the UFO Chronicles podcast. Tonight we're in the United Kingdom to speak to Ben, and Ben will be sharing a couple of his UFO sightings. He also had a psychic mum who was a believer, and she met a NASA employee in the nineteen seventies, who said he saw alien artifacts on the moon Ben is up next. But first, if you enjoy the show and you would like to help support the podcast on Patreon, you can do this for as little as one dollar a month. Head on over to wWw dot patreon dot com forward slash UFO Chronicles podcast. You can also find a link in the description of this episode below Any help is very much appreciated. Now on with the show Ben, welcome to the show. Hello, nice to speak to you. Thanks for having me on. You're more than welcome. Thank you for joining us today and you're calling from the UK. Yes, indeed. yeah in Somerset, beautiful part of England not far from Glastonbury, beautiful place. Beautiful, famous for music festivals and ciders Yeah, indeed. and who knows maybe maybe UFOs as well. but yeah, I'm actually to be specific. I'm I'm in a place called Nether Sty, which is famous for the poet Samuel Taylor Coleridge who He's very imaginative, one of the great great artists of our time and thinkers. and I'm also a stone throw away from Inincley Points as well, which is quite interesting as well as a possible UFO hotspot, I guess. But yeah, it's an amazing place Somerset, one of the best places in the country. I agree, lovely. Okay, Ben, you have some experiences to share. Would you like to start the beginning, please, sir Absolutely. Well my approach to the whole subject has quite comees from a myriad of angles really. I as a kid was always very, very interested in Ephology and science fiction to a degree, but I was never like a a mad sort of sci fi geek kind of kid. I came of it very much from a novel angle because my great grandma's unusual character. my grandmother, she was fam my old mum, who sort of brououghtght me up for most of my childhood. And she was psychic and she didn't take money for it, but she was great. She was like a palmmer. She knew dates, names, all sorts, very accurate. And she used to read an Isacasm off a d. She was very much into science fiction But she also had a deep love of actual eology. So there' be Zachariah Stiting or Stitsin or HP Lovecraft But there'd also be, you know, Von Danakkan and people like that morning the magicians, Holy Blood and the Holy Grail, but communion, you know, that were also in the bookshelves that piqued my interest. And so she was more than open to it all being real, not you know, being make believe. So and also when she'd watched things like close encounters, I remember asking, you know, I remember seeing that as a kid, perhaps a bit earlier than most would and She definitely introduced me to a different perspective with it that perhaps most kids, you know, wouldn't have that's perhaps a bit more typical nowadays where you know you're joining the dots between the science fiction and reality and it being a possibility and not just make believe. And really from quite a young age, I believe that there was a possibility. So though on one side I was into things like Lake Seven, Dr. Who, things like that I mean that were fun I also very much was into to an extent, obviously we didn't have the internet then, you know, kind of, as I say, things like Morning the Magicians, the whole area of von Danaken carots of the gods. Now she got her interest, I think from my great grandfather who was a tailor or Mills sorry Mills not a manning. and he was out in Russia during Revolution. He was a sailor. He was a local councllor for a little while in East London and was a popular there as well as a teacher, very wise man and a sailor for a whileild musician and teacher as I say, and he travelled to say in New Orleans during the jazz boom. and he, I think was He filled her with lots of interesting ideas. I don't know if he was a believer in ephology, but he knew HD wells for a while because he was part of the Fabian society, even though he didn't come for money, deeply intellectual and I guess he talked his way and he got to know them all and people like as I say HD Wells and as a result, he was quite a lefty As a result, he u I think again, you know, because warar of the Worlds and everything, it really won the old mum's imagination. And I think living in a household well on the other side of things, the actual mum was quite cynical about it. she was interested, not really a believer. So I saw it from different perspectives, which is after all, what life's like But it was, as I say, just really, really fascinating to me. I remember a show called The Boy from Space, which probably most people have forgotten you might remember It was on many years ago that was very sort of uncanny in the way that it depicted the whole area of aliens visiting Earth And it just all these shows would win my imagination, but I also had a real interest. as I say that I think came from my male mum and the family to an extent. but I did have a few sightings in my childhood particularly in mid teens I had a bit of a nervous breakdown in mid teeenens when me folks moved to Somerset, but I do remember seeing you know, floating orbs or lights that would shoot off. And that really then I knew that hold on, there's more to this than just, you know being interested in watching too many sci fi shows or something, you know, I couldn't have imagined that And I think that was the connection with the same old momum because she was into conspiracies before they became fashionable and then unfashionable and now dangerous. I mean you have to be careful, you tell. But in the old days when it was just a bit of fun, absolutely, you know, and for years and years, I'd follow these stories, obviously with the internet It's opened it up a bit more, but then you don't always know alwaysways who to trust because obviously at the moment with ephology, you've got you know, so much information coming at us all the time, whether it's podcasts with real accounts that are genuine or or perhaps more money making exercises coming out from an entertainment angle. That's where things obviously like coast to coast come in. They're great fun A lot of people on those shows are probably genuine, but also It can be just sort more entertainment, perhaps closer to the sci fi than the reality, so to speak. But yeah, I mean, through my life, I've just always had the interest to say Melmum used to collect newsletters and send off for handouts and things or that you get all about conspiracies. And a lot of it would be aliens stuff And that's how as I say I picked up on a lot lot of it also in the seventies because my great as I say, my great grandfather who knew HD wells as he was in Mills, as I say In the seventies, she she met an employee of NASA actually when she was running a BnB for a short while in London in the seventies. and he and told her that he'd seen I don't it was were photographs or what of alien life or previous visits by humanity to the Mon. I'm not quite sure what it was Which actually reminds one a lot of that old HG Wells First Men on the Moon, one of my favorite films when I was a child finger But she would sort of recount that to me en You know, obviously I mean, this was something my mum who is not really a believer would also tell me about and say, Well yeah, he definitely this definitely happened And so growing up with those influencces, as I say, always sort of piqued my interest, got me really fascinated in the whole subject And I mean, I live in a UFO hotspot now. so So as I said earlier, near a nuclear power station Glastonbury and occasionally, you know you do see sightings that it's possible to see the odd mysterious light The best sighting I've had in recent years was last year, I had two One was in in recent years most notable One was in West Dullage, which was last October, when I think you know to be honest, from listening to a lot of kind of encounter shows and podcasts and things, one can easily but as I was living on my own at that point as well, which I think helps no real influences I think as a result, I was really, really into it. I was also working from home and talking to the od friends and about it, but not ever really talking to anyone that was dead or set against it. So perhaps I was very much normalizing it in my own head. I've often wondered what was it? It almost seems like I made it happen almost, but I didn't hallucinate it. It was quite extraordinary. I left the house.alked I was just literally walking miles west side of the train station And this sort pretty big black triangle came over and it was making a whirring noise, which makes me wonder if it was the military, but There were people there and they weren't looking up which I couldn't understand. I tried to grab a rather clumsy photo didn't come out very well which is what they all say.. I kind of can understand how that happens now because when you actually see something and you've kind of wanted to see it and it actually happens. You can't believe it's actually happening for a minute And so I can imagine that that's, you know, I know a lot of the civics sail, ye, they're just making it up. but honestly I can see how it happens. You get a sort of freeze, body freeze for a second where you're so excited And so to this day I wish I'd videed it But as I say, it may have been military, but it wasn't extraordinarily, very impressive I'd love to think it was the real thing so to speak. And as I say, it flew over West Stully's train station. I felt like Arthur Dent felt like something it's like his guy to the galaxy. It was a bit surreal to be honest It was an amazing moment. A few years earlier, I also had something I was over flying over The Grand Canyon, completely different part of the world. This is when I was working A I'm a musician and writer and artist I was working a few years on architecture design shows. And're on the way to one of these events and I was flying above the Grand Canyon and there was these blinding lights that was sort of You know, now again, you know there were people on the plane that didn't seem to be looking. It reminded me a lot of a little bit of William Chattenau I own episode where with the alien on the wing, it was very funny. That episode. I used to love watching that for a giggle, but I sort of looking down and there's like loads of theseort very bright lights. I mean very's so bright like when you look son It's not a good idea to keep looking because your eyes will hurt. And there were about four or five of them down there. I mean they were bright. and anyway, I got to the event in Arizona, I think, wasn't it? When I got back, I says You know, I've got to look this out and so I looked it all up And yet, lo and behold, there are very similar pictures online of Grand Canyon UFOs, same with black triangles in the UK. It seems to be quite a lot of siting. So those are two of my sort of biggest sightings. I used to see sort of glowing ons a little bit on the horizon What she offers a say in my teens a little bit. But those have sort of been the main things. in recent times, in terms of, you know, concrete sightings that I've had I've always, as a say had an interest. I mean, when I enjoyed hobby is of writing. and I remember getting a phone call from And a very bizarre conspiracy theorists called Anthony J. Holder who was I don't know if you remember him, but he was like this u very extreme quite ahead of his time, like a an extremer version of David Lke almost, but kind of He would talk a lot about skull and bones and Satanism and secret societies and aliens and things And I knew of him because I'd also written to Richard D. Hall, who in twenty eleven about my book writt, which don't know whether dension or, but it was about it was like a science fiction thing about youFI was just an escapist thing really. It was just a bit of fun. And I put that out there and I think I got this phone call as a result was funny because my particular book was rare because it was the only one that'd been written about Vrill, something VRIL and P source called VIll There's lots of conspiracy theories about. I read about it in morning the magicians Anywayah when I was a kid. Anyway, he called me and he says in very sort of thick I' Carn from Santa Monica, USA. I'm here to tell you this is real This is not, you know, lies is all. And it's sort of very kind of I could barely understand what we wasre saying.ort drawling on It was great fun. I was very excited because I'd seen him I think once on one of these channels because for a while, I don't know how it happened about fifteen years ago on the sky, somehow you got shows by People like Richard D. Hall and even Hilda about all these conspiracies and whatnot. Now all that's being banned now by Sky. You can't get any of that and even on YouTube A lot of it's getting banned Back then somehow it slipped through the net. so I knew about him from that. So yeah, he called me all the way from Santa Marica. in the end, we never met up. It was a shame because he his colleague his's right hand man did call me and it's me at the Georgian pilgrim in Glasssonbury about, but we never did. He dies notot long after. And the sad truth is when I was out there when I saw the UFOs in Grand Canyon, I didn't realize he was still alive then and he didn't actually live that far from where I was living in in Newport Beach. I had no idea. He was in, you know, there's kind of a small world, but sadly I missed the opportunity thereough. But it would have be lovely to have met him again So yeah, I mean through my life, I've had some So many interesting experices that of justect me. excited and interested in it. And I just feel that also because Catalina Island as well, I when I was out in America I was just lived opposite there. and used to see lights occasionally, but nothing that significant. And again, in hindsight, I've heard ally with the TikTok incident that I was also in Quite well a very significant hotspot Funnily enough, around the time of that TikTk incident in twenty eighteen, I was actually living out there then, but had no idea at the time So yeah, I mean, whether it's the HG World's connection or the same old mum sitting you say she' reading I was on a day. she was fascinated th in the reality of it. I think that's the key. And I think was she was open minded on it. I got that influence And so when I've seen UFOs, I think the other thing to remember is I think fear probably puts a lot of UFOs off from appearing to people because I guess sci fi is kind of grainy in us andin it in us to to expect an alien attack or whatnot like W of the Worlds. But I do get the feeling that a lot of them probably are very kind of peaceful and quite the opposite and observing as perhaps not as in a nasty way like HGWs painted, in quite a fearful way and you know, certainly with AI developing as it is at the moment and I had quite an early insight into that for various reasons a couple of years ago. It is quite well it's chilling really, what the possibilities are with that And so I think obviously with discloseure buubly enough at the moment with shows like apon I mean, the thing is I did watch an episode of Weaponized recently and much as I love that show, it was all about music and I'm a musician. so I was like I should be really happy but it It just rang alarm bells for me because it was just a long interview with Wobby Williams, I'm like, what's going on. So sometimes even the shows or even the things you think you can trust, you've got to be a little bit I'm not saying you can't trust that particular show, but It put a few question marks in my mind. So there's so much information out there. It's just cuting it all really and finding out working out what's real or not. But if you've seen something with your own eyes, you know it's real, it just gets frustrating and I think at the moment because you feel that We're on the edge of a real kind of potential breakthrough with UFOs and acceptance of it or alien life, but also there's something holding everything back and it's like it's going aroundound in circles, you know, you're getting actual government , you know, public meetings or whatever about about UFOs for the first time in history, but it's not even on the British news. you know, you think They'd be interested are more interested in gossip. So It's a fascinating time. And as I say right through my life and say books like Holy Bood and Holy Grail, Morning Magicians I was steeped and all that. But as I say, it wasn't As I say solely from the fantasy angle, there was Al an interest, alsoso in music, you know, people like Gary Newan and David Burry and Ultravox would write songs about aliens. And so again, you know, I think perhaps those songs meant more to me because I felt that They wereon't just escape us. I don't know. but certainly, as I say, B not in a household where it was, as I said, believed in on one side, not on the other. I think it gave me quite a useful kind of perspective from different angles moving forward really. But yeah, I mean, it's with the whole area. it's just about, as I say, being open minded and receptive and then I think there's a chance you know, the Per to one, but I think as I say, it's just about belief, but it's always been somethinghing that I've always been interested in, as I say, and I hope You know, I hope that in the next couple of years with the whole AI thing coming up, that if there is some sort of disclosure that's perhaps more mainstream, that it's the real thing, you know, that it is not some sort of faked, you know thing. becausecause obviously people like David Ike You know, whether you believe in him or not, they're getting sort of censored more and more. So it does get more difficult to know who's genuine or not. As I say, shows like you know obviously shows like Doctor Who, Star Trek and HitIk's G, all these shows they prepare people on one side of things, but they also leave people very fearful and unrescepted because they just think it's all fantasy But life can imitate art, art can imitate lifeve you just have to remember that, you know, that often the most amazing things like I mean, as everyone points out, the flip phones that we, you know, in Star Trek in the sixties communication devices, I mean we have them now with mobile phones. It's all come true So definitely, you know, there's no reason not to believe But I think as I say, I would say that My main reason for coming on here is that I would say as someone who passionately believes in it, I just think there needs to be a very measured new approach with it because I just think there's too many UFO, almost too many podcasts, too many things out there where it's getting a bit confused with all the Russell brands in this world coming in who weren't even interested in it a few years ago, three four five years ago. So I just think it needs a clear kind of direction hope fory your show willll be part of that. Hopefully, but yeah, I mean that's the problem with the subject. you know you have got a lot of good information coming out, but unfortunately it's a bit like a polluted river. We've got freshw coming down from the mountains and then you have sewage which is being pumped into it and unfortunately that is the way The subject is there's a lot of good information but a lot of bad information. And regardless of what their agenda is, whether it's just to make money or whatever, I don't know, but there's a lot of rubbish. There certainly is a lot of rubbish out there and there always has been. It's just you have to kind of separate what's real and what's fiction. Yeah, yeah. well, that's where the NASA story was so important when I was a kid because The fact that, you know, Mel M, you know, had said on one side of the coin and she was a believer that I met, you know, a NASA employee believed in it, you know, he'd seen alien proof ofailing life, you know, there's been you know, no was absolutely quiet one hundred percent belief. On the other side the side the cynic was a bit more of a cynic with me mum who was not a believer in it, but even she said, Well, yeah, he definitely said this He did say it, you know, and when you got a cynic saying, Well through British teether. So I had, as I say, a very interesting, well, that must be true, then, example as a young child So perhaps in a way it doesnt say did make them more open to it But I would say that as I say, there's just so much information at the moment, which is one of the things about the internet, you know, in a way, less was more because when I was growing up And as I say, you had books like Communion And you you could go perhaps to meetings of vthologist or you could They're always going to be fakers, but it's so much easier now to fake with technology so much easier to also you know, try to make money from it in some way That's why I didn't really wasn't sure whether to mention, but it was many years ago. and my interest in Vile, as I say, Anthony J. Hilde passionately believed in it as a free energy source in the Tesla mold, you know, and Nazis were obviously trying to harness the power that, you know, people like NASA with Operation Paperclip tried to to tap into. and he, you know, he really I was very passionate Hilda about the subjects and it kind of scared me a bit actually, because I was only just trying to write a pop by a bit of fun, you know what I mean? little was sci fi bit of fun when I was unwell and you know, something to do. And it was just really a case I got really carried away with the concept and new ideas And as having written to Richard D. Hall about it, that was a real eye opener. And so as I say, it was a kind of bit of sweet to know that I was so near, but ye so far from Hild himself when I was out there. But as I say, in childhood again, you know, a lot of heavy metal bands also into UFOs and all this But I suppose you know, when you've got these myriad just like anybody else, you've got a myriad of different directions from it, it's Unfortunately, most people are directed though by the mainstream media or the mainstream entertainment world And so as a result, they tend to sort of get their cynicism or disbelief from that, I guess. And I suppose because attainment has primed everyone up to be scared and as I said earlier with war of the worlds and everything. it's something, unfortunately, it's quite a long tradition of people just assuming they're going to attack us And I think it's that fear, perhaps that reppels them because I say the vast majority of them, I'm sure are peaceful. But as I said, I think the next couple of years I'm quite religious too. I do believe So I think the the next couple of years with AI. it is where it's literally there's a possibility it might attempt to replicate and overtake us. I think then you're getting quite an HG worldlds type war, the worldld scenario or almost a bravely worldld type scenario of how it's all going to unravel in front of our eyes. I think a lot of people are bit in the dark about it follow the mainstream media and the mainstream ors. I don't think they quite realise them and they've been watching a lot of debates and lectures by the creators of AIs, so I suppose I'm a bit more up on it, but it is really quite terrifying. and I'm just curious because I haven't heard a lot of talk on this how the whole alien life, how that will all tie in, whether it will assacerbate or speed it up, whether the AI thing will immediately, you know that will be disclosure or how it will happen. We'll have to wait and see. It is a bit like a real kind of sci fi novel coming alive a little bit. I mean, I think As's a same, I mean, I've got a signed Ray Bradbury and I love I love science fiction. I love Martian Chronicles when I was a boy. I saw that. and That was a work of fiction that I believe I don't want to scare people, that could be very, I think, close to reality from studying this deeply You know, we see not everything David Ike says is necessarily true. but if you believe in the concepts of o how can I put it without sounding like I'm kind of getting a bit too imaginative, but kind of like shapeshifting and everything else, I know from having looked into ethology closely that Certainly there's a belief. that that's possible in reality, not a sci fi. againg, not a sci fi, but there's a possibility of that and that they might even walk amongst us to quote. I mean, it's fascinating. There's lots of ways of looking at it, certainly with again, everything going on with the nuclear situation, artificial intelligence, the war in Russia. It's all a bit dystopian. and I think becausecause so many people are kind of programmed by social media Those are A lot of the active jobs and industries at the moment are all in technology So a whole generation of millennials really have been sucked into thinking it's okay to never leave a machine to always communicate only on a machine too do things really that are quite anti human at one time And I think the whole AI thing is tied into that. It's almost as if we've all been steered. I think perhaps because I'm a little older a perspective of it, but you know, I was I dont I knews I was brought up in a steiner school to an extent. I missed a lot of schooling early in life because of illness And so I think growing up You know, rather than seeing loads of friends I was you know, spending a lot of time with older people and One of them being into ephology. Obviously as a young man, I obviously had a slightly biased view. but you I remember watching films like Post and Candas, but two thousand one as well and reading about, you know, the Dogon tribe in Africa in Mourning and the Magicians clelearly, you know, these things were around long before the internet and I think These were the things that got my imagination fired up really imagination, people might say exactly. and I would countnter well No, I just think it gives you an interest And I think it just it gives you something that you can take with you in life. It doesn't mean you imagine yourFs. it doesn't mean that you're magic I there's so many people around the world who see things and I've seen things that you know there's obviously something to it. We all know that But somehow everything is geared to us not believing that And I' to say I'm not anti religion and I don't believe that You know, believing UFOs means that you are. there are references in the Bible in thehyim, etcetera Obviously with the agenda that the BBC has, whatever that is And with everything, I don't think most people really quite realize where we are with all this. and you have to be careful who you tell, which is why I suppose It's so great to come on a show like this to talk openly about it because you know, I remember thinking as a child, Be I'm a musician and I rememberinking is it amazing that you know, bagpipes developed at the same time in ancient Mesopotamia as they did in in you know, Cornwall or whatever. And it's true, you know, when you look, you know, how did they know they didn't have internet? you know, wasas it some sort of telepathy? They hadn't discovered each other These were completely disparate parts of the planet, they weren't even, you know, they wouldn't have known each other's existence let alone letters or anything like that to say, Hey, this is how you build mean you know, exactly the same sort of instrument, exactly the same point in time. So even things that are practical and scientific that science wouldn't be able to explain like that always piqued my interest. There's more to life, that there's more to human development or intelligence than we think. And it's the same from the perspective of all the alien depictions you see as shown by Devon Danakan. though again, you look him up and You know, just because one individual happened to hit lucky with the subject and do well and that individual might have something dodgy in their past doesn't mean the whole thing is is nonsense And that's the important thing to remember with all this, don't shoot the messenger And also be careful who the messenger is. So it's such a complicated subject. It's a very simple subject actually But in terms of who you believe and the perceptions of it, as I said, five years ago like Russell Bram weren't really talking about it Clearly things are going in the right direction, but whether they're the right people to be talking about it. I suppose is the issue a little bit. but how can we know until there's any genuine you know, genuine disclosures. But I certainly think that you know, looking back through time An another aspect as well just to bring us up to date with a bit of a sci fi connection a little bit because it's like something out of a sci fi I was reading that DNA strings can actually be replicated and emailed and across and information by AI And that again, even though it's not really the alien subject as such Again, it poses the question of if life forms are coming from that angle If in ten years, fifteen years That was to say happen if AI isn't controlled and there's a problem with that at the moment then one can imagine, you know the alens alien life would most definitely want to get involved. It's not a twwilight zone or ET or some sort of fantasy. you know, they would definitely want to to get involved and to either you know, control the situation or save humanity, it could even pose a religious question. So it is very, very interesting time where you honestly feel But everything is coming a little bit to ahead and And that's one of the reasons why I wanted to come on the on the show because Parisees You know, do exist. That's why it's in the dictionary. Guy Fawkes is the most obvious example. And I think that You cingly when I look back through my life Not only is it coming to a headad, I think, generally the whole UFO subject but it is for a lot of people personally as well who've been into it all their lives like myself So yeah, I mean, that's kind of where I'm coming from it really. I mean, I haven't had an abduction experience as far as I know I've never had hypnosis to find out that particular angle of things in terms of actually having haaving met any aliens or anything like that So I can't sort of say that I have unfortunately much as I'd love to say I have But you know, I think the fact that I've seen some very notable sightings obviously in Firstly in well, when I was a child in London, a little bit later as well in Somerset, certain in recent years So the Grand Canyon sighting, which I've got a good photo of, my own personal photos is on my blog actually and also the West Dudage one really really have piqued my interest a lot again along with all the wonderful Ecounter shows, particularly yours I think for that bit more, you know, believable Be I say there's a lot out there that kind of say straddle the two scenes a bit in that terms they bridge the gap between reality, which a lot of people don't want to believe in the truth of UFO's alilen life and science fiction. And with people like two thousand one and close en Counters is a kind of greay area, not quite science fiction, but Almost I don't remember there being at the beginning of post encounters as a little thing saying this is a true story. Maybe there is. I haven't seen it for a few years, but As I say, there's lots of perspectives with the extreme being it's all nonsense, it's all sci fi and as I say lots of grrey areas, not just of sci fi itself, but of the whole conspiracy field and the whole ethology field itself be it the Billy Myers or the Nick Popes or these people or the, you know, the history channels. I tend to sort of go more for trying to find them more versive debates and lectures online and trying and get out there and meet people That's why I was sad not to meet Anthony J Hilder properly. I could have, but by the by. And Richard D. Hall, I'm not so sure about. He's not so much a Uologist these days more an agitator you know, certainly when I look at what's out there I'm not agitatated to journalist kind of enjoyable agitatate. I mean, he was pare demonized by the BBC, but that seemed to be to do with something that wasn't UFO related interest in the paranormal it you'll love the unxnetwork. com AX is your streaming audio and video for everything supernatural, strange, and mysterious, like UFO's, Bigfoot, ghost, and so much more. From hosts like Clyde Lewis, Whitley Streber, Micah Hanks, and Christina Gomez, visit the unXnetwork dot com showpage for a complete list of all the paranormal programs you'll find on the AX Be sure to follow us on Twitter for updates at KUNXDB. Follow our Facebook group on X Network. Find the podcast on Spotify, iHart, Audible, and Apple Podcast.'s time. It too is the YX So it is very complicated picture at the moment and quite also You know, how how will be? disclosure safely happen if it can happen or as I say, it may just unravel naturally in connection with AI. and of course there's a There's also a new conspiracy theory on the block that there'll be a fake alien u thing go on in future. produced by AI So that's going to make things even more complicated. So I mean, it is a fascinating time. And if that happens, then the aliens might say, up, you know, we're the real deal. We've got something to say about this who knows? I mean, all these All of these are they all sound like sci fi plots, which is perhaps why I enjoyed writing when I was younger a bit. But now I mean, this is all you know a hundred percent true stuff and I think that, you know It's fascinating to see how work, you know, play itself out. Noember lyrics When I was a child of a b listening to Down in the park by Gary Newman And licss like my love is a rape machine and talking about clones and strange machines aliens and really when you if you really, you know study what's going on at the moment with AI and everything else and if you're into what we're into, art really was imitating facts, you know, whether it was Hawkwuin reading too much Michael Moorecocker, I think they even got him in the band at one point or Gene Roddenberry actually knowing youphologist athologists in real lifeve whichich he did, you know, we didn't know all that years ago, you know, we just watched Star Trek. We't have a clue, you know. But see, my mum as I say, she gave me that perspective I think because she was so well read, signed R Bradbury, Isaac Asimost every year, but also as I say She' met people in NassA but believed in aliens So As I say, I was coming out from all those perspectives. I do like your term as an off a day. All right, know I've just made that up for myself there. I've just invented a word. there you go. A true original. Maybe it's Colridge infuencing me. I don't know if he believed in UFO's. I'm sure he did, you know. I mean, as I said earlier, with ancient times, the romantic poets, they were open. you look into the poetry they wrote and there's loads of references Be obviously they were bound very much by religion and Christianity, but you know they were obsessed with nature and spirituality and the universe and our role in it. And so absolutely, I'm sure that Cge so he didn' write poem on UFOs. I'm sure he would have believed in it If I don't remember right, Aznov wrote a book and it was about finding God. So you had human beings that left the earth in search of God. and you also had some aliens that left their planet in turn to search for God and the two men, it escapes me to the name of the book now. But yeah, that was an interesting one. And you're absolutely right when it comes to AI. I think when you have people that grew up preate internet certainly have a different opinion when it comes to AI compared to The youngsters now that are post internet. Not all. I mean, sometimes it's a bit like I remember meeting a kid out in America who who was about seventeen and he said to me,, I says, what music you into mate? you know music things, I love anything pre nineteen ninety. I said, what Yeah pre nineteen ninety. I I don't listen to anything after then, everything's yeah, probably even earlier than that. And it sort of reeled off all these names of stuff from years ago Not that he is correct. I mean that there is good music around now and you just have to search for it. It' doesn't get as successful as it used to or should do because of the corrupt industry. but that's another conversation. But what that shows is that youngsters can Think differently, think outside the box. I mean, you and me aren't that old anyway. we're quite young, but the point is, you know they can and hopefully will be a bit more different in future. It's very difficult because It all and it's not just as for young people, the same for older people But if all your heroes, be they sporting, musical, film stars, whatever, they're all saying what everyone in the media is saying, which could be anything, you know, whether it's to do with COVID, the war, AI, aliens, any of it, you know They're impressionable and we're all impressionable even as we get old if someone's a favorite film starbars, we can' believe what they say. And that's the only thing, you know, sometimes people think for themselves, but there's so many more external, you know, as say the narcissistic nature Instagram, Facebook, it's all sort of pulling people in certain directions often. to our try st clear a little bit of social media It's as I say, it's just too much information coming up people. So it's a bit confusing, but there are a few kids that think outside the box And I think as I said earlier, it's the same issue with too much information on ephology, it's very easy for a naysayer to come up. for example, I'll give you an example. I mean there's probably videos already out there. In fact, I saw one the other day. Well, I thought this guy's different. I'll give him a try and I listened and I realized he was, you know, I think he was pretty much a cynic built such a powerful argument. All these people that I'd heard in Yod you podcast with the Yod UFO show that I L or would recommend that have infiltrated the stuff that perhaps is genuine and that person hass just come along and pick cherry picked all the Un genenuine stuff you know, that the untrue stuff and they sort of lumped it all together and made it all like a pile of nonsense And so that's what I'm saying. it's so easy to kind of for the whole subject to get, you know, discredited, which is obviously ridiculous. I mean, how can you think we're alone in the universe? This is why I say to anybody, Do you seriously think? I mean And people that do believe we're alone in the universe or believe things as they are, i. e. that you know, nothing has being any different to everything the government tells us and everything I mean, there are people like that, even intelligent professors do all over the place because we've seen that the last couple of years. People will swallow anything if it's presented well enough So yeah, I mean, it's a tough one, but I think that's very interesting with I think Asimor you said about that that plot line because again, that may be are imitating live accidentally on purpose because yeah, I do think that I mean, I've often one might even wonder, well, how does one know if gry aliens are even aliens or not? I mean, they don't seem very organic. They seem very they seem to communicate from what I hear by telepathy. but they could just as easily be AI robots. I mean, we don't know. I mean, the AI robots being created look so realistic And as I say, there's reason to believe that that they unfortunately it does sound like like a sci fi, but they could actually potentially I saw this in a I think a statement on having you wanting to pause for six months, the whole day. I think there was a statement that came out and I'm sure in there it' said about it's possible for them to actually be physical outside of the robot realm where they could actually as organisms, DNA create themselves in laboratories. I mean, it's extraordinary. It's like something soil and green, but you million times magnified and will actually come alive. I mean it actually reminds you a little bit of an old out of limits episode about one whereher the creature comes alive I think it's the first one of the first episodes of that. It's a briiant episode actually But again, you know this isn't sci fi this is reality, quite extraordinary. And in this old outer limits, this creature goes crazy that he communicates with. Now, I mean, whether whether that sort of thing is going to happen and that's what I'm saying. They' your example there of of a plotline where humans left Eth to find God and aliens came here to find God or whatever I mean, that's where AI is taking us away ultimately from God, even though many say, well, it's nothing more godlike than intelligence. Obviously, if it's artificial been sort of taken away, taken away from it Even if as Elon Musk has tryed to say I think one of the videos was a deep fate you know, you can live forever with like something out of reminds me of Colden Lazareth the old Dennis Potter plotline where Where is if you a head in a fridge and it can live forever through AI. I mean, these are the sorts of things that are genuinely being, you know discussed. So clearly everything is going to come to a head, I think. and the religious questions and fundamals my fundamentals All that and whether, you know, whether it's a A second coming over Jesus we recognize or something more unusual We'll just have to wait and see. I mean, whether it might all fizzle out and that actually, you know, all the nayers will just get deleted from society will' just all flip into the background and and we'll just everything will turn into sort AI mechanized world. peopleeople will just have implants that make them You know, they're already doing it with with Elon Musk and the whole neuralink. thing it could be that you know people will all be updated a bit like Microsoft Windows back in the day and no one will question everything and everyone will be perfectly happy by twenty thir. We'll have to wait and see, but it is an interesting time. It certainly is. you know you know when it comes to AI, you know you have all the deep fakes now. there's videos, you know you can see of apparently people and they're not people. it's all you know, it's all digital and stuff. So even now you don't even really know what you're seeing on TV is real anymore. especially, you know, if you grew up with films like He said two thousand one with how And the Terminator movies with Skynets, we all know what happened there. It all turned very sour very quickly Yeah, there's also a lot of people to say like the millennials because I've worked in sales a lot in the past. And I mean, you know, I mean with a good salesman, you know, they'll sell anything, you know, and they'll make anything sound good. I mean Adolf Hitler could have probably hired a team and they would have, you know, this lot would have made it sound convincing. you know, they don't seem to question anything is what I'm saying and it is funny. It always not funny. It's kind of kind of strange. I saw a funny article actually in a subversive newspaper called The Light recently, which is a sort Somerset publications but it was going on about How he was a neighbor he's a neighbor of Dave I think Iost probably shouldn't mention it. a neighbor of a member of Pink Floyd, one of and probably the one that's left And he was sort of explaining in this article that musicians just don't, you know, I mean from talking to him clearly from a few moments, you know, believes everything that Everybody you know in the media believes whether it's about the war or COVID or anything. I don't know quite how we got on such contentious subject so quickly, but He clearly has talked to a few times and this article was like, you know, musicians pop cult rocker they just don't They're not subversive anymore. They don't want to change the world anymore. It's what their job used to be, know, whether it was the pistols or the sixties or the hippie Dream or whatever So yeah, I mean, it is more difficult now, but then, you know, they've been so stered and controlled since the last twenty five years with social media that is bound to go this way because they think they're free because everything tells them they're free because we're connected and we' have such connectivity that It seems that way. It's very easy to believe that. I mean, but you're right. I mean, even what you were saying, well the connections like with how in two thousand one It's a warning, you know, and things can be real that they really can. I mean, when I was messing about, as I say, writing about Vlle. U you know, as a Tesla type free energy source that Nazis believed in and all this thing you know, part of me thought well, maybe it's true Part of me thought also, you know, you shouldn't really write about dangerous things, but thennis we used to I dont want to attract any energies. But then part of me thinks, you know, now that you know, people are really talking about things like this, but you know, I'm in for we know realri real. from talking to Anntony J Holda is real, something like that. you know, I think it probably is And that's why people like Tesla got bumped off, I expect, you know So it's so many It's a very complicated time with you all And I just think it' it could be that as a say, and most bizarre situation plan out in the next few years where you know, is it a real aided invasion or a fake one? We don't know Phaps there won't be any aided invasions. I doubt. I it's more likely that the AI is going to be a problem and It'll be more a case as I said earlier, Ainian intelligence coming in somehow sort of either get us back to what we're supposed to be or Oh, you know learn from us and it could be quite a strange situation. hopefully we'll live to see it, but it's It is It is quiet Well it's frightening, but it's also exciting. I mean, the thing is If you're in a situation where, you know, there's a huge know pandemic fake or real or there's a huge war that's going to happen you know that people care about, don't give a damn about, depending on the media and the propaganda, Whatever situation or danger that's looming, they're all a lot more tangible than this situation with AI have yet There doesn't seem to be a lot of sort of massive panic about it, just a lot of to But as I say, I've heard some only really I've not really heard any direct kind of relating the two really, artificial intelligence and extraterrestrial intelligence. And obviously, you know I've always held the belief that it's highly likely to wear extrestals ourselves because we We go against everything all the nature on the planet, We' always going against it, whether it's to trash hedgerows and always seem to be I mean, when the Adam and Eve us, or the part of us that's always been, I suppose, demonized to a point by Christianity, unfortunary paganism, but which is unfortunate. But certainly because it's not Satadism, obviously, but obviously that part of us, the nature in us, that Colle was loved, et cetera. he was religious you know, is something that we need to reconnect with badly. And it may be that alien life, you know, once we've gone completely away from it because we're literally like something out of the way it's going Blade Runner or Tron or when of these sci fiers come real, then it may be a case that you know, if we really have the cut machine in future that the aliens try to get us back to what we once were. if if There and are some overassarched by AI. I mean, if AI can literally recode itself a million times more intelligent than what it is, then Really. I mean, it would be a sort of new god, wouldn't it? sort of strange new techno god. I mean it is These sorts of fundamental questions O sorts of questions that are being asked onlyly a year ago, you'd had thought this thing to me is either, you know completely bonkers or his too much part or whatever. But the reality is, you know, this is truth, you know, this is the way things are going. It's still there's still so many that don't want to believe, partly because we all want to believe what we believe in. You know, it's bit like religion, isn't it? or anything, you know, it's a bit like if James Randel, whatever his name was came on here and says, Oh, we all want to believe in UFO's you silly man You know at the end of the day, whatever it is You know, we all want to believe in certain things, but we've all got a right to believe what we believe in. there might be a grain of truth. and in fact, whatever it is might be perfectly pertinent, but then it might be, you know, it's all open to interpretation And I just think that But as you say, I think with with everything as it is, I mean, I watched quite a bit of George Galloway. I quite like him because he's very opinionated and he it says things very much how they are. And even he at one point mentioned aliens actually, though he's finally waking up to AI it's dangers, which is quite comical Yeah No, I mean, I've experienced it. I've messed around with Chat EPT a few times already. I'm a writer and it's only natural that I sort of curious and it's frightening, you know because it literally talks to you. I mean, it's you know, I had a conversation with it in a sense where, you know, I was trying to write a poem but I wanted it finished in a particular way and I wanted it done in this style And it did it and it was awful. So I said, no, I want it done in this style with this And I suddenly realizeed, you know that in a way I dont can be an enemy, it can be obviously in a big way, but the way it will lull us in is a bit like with social media, web dating, all these things sort of normalis things. We people thought we were dead weird, muchuch easier to get down your pub and pull than online people would have said years ago, but everyone's got used to it now everyone does web dating In the same way. I think people just get used to a concept. It doesn't matter how uncomfortable If it's seen as progress, they'll accept it. And I think also that's another danger where we're going where AI, I think might to literally save us, that might be in a position, not to much save us, but it might seem to save us because all people will say, oh look, it's cured all these diseases. It's helped us trace alien life. It's done all these things that might seem good at first. But the reality will kick in that You know, there's no point in really, you know, now we'll disease free it. It's a bit like the Morlocks and the The Halloween is it in in more of the worldlds, you know see my great grandfather met the writer which is amazing to think. But you know, he, I think had it completely right. I think, you know, in that the Morlocks I mean, they're the people that be unfortunates. I mean society record child poverty, noobbody talks about it. Prime Minister been invoted in on TMS, you know,, you know, people tend to put their head in the sound a bit. and I certainly think S meanvententionally political, but I certainly think that just the way the way things are heading it's exciting But it's kind of frustrating too, because you feel that the AI will suck people in particularly younger people into thinking it's going to solve all these things. like everyone as I say socially uses it for dating because it's so much quicker and all this, but not necessarily But I think when it actually turns around and bites us by collectively deleting this as a species or coming to a point where those with money are literally like robo cops, they're half technology and all the people with no money or organic normal people, but they can't get jobs. they can't get anywhere because they can't do anything because they're not one billion times more advanced like the rich people are because they've all had AI upgrades. Whether we're going to have some sort of crazy world like that? I think If things go that nasty on the planet, you know, we're halfway there anyway I definitely think, you know, either God, Jesus, aliens, I think from all perspective, maybe they're the same thing You know, as von Danaken once said, God dves of flies also, but Whichever way you're coming at it with. you do feel you know, theoretically, we're all coming to sort a crisis, whether you call it end times, whether it will happen in the next two months, two years, you know, two decades. That's another thing. you know, it's very difficult to know how and when be it the AI you know, apocalypse, if that's what it is or revolution and the disclosure or they're kind of concurrent of alien life. You've kind of got the two things at the same time. It's almost like a race Maybe that's why there's so many wacky views at the moment, there's a possibility of a kind of staged alien thing, which I suppose could happen if if certain species want to make themselves available to humanity on a peaceful mission in a peaceful way and obviously the powers at BL like, we don't want that happening because you know, that might bring global peace. So we better stage a fake alidian invasion. I mean, that' that could be that sort of scenario again Anyone listening to this is going to think I'm barking, but that's fine, you know. I'm a writer, you know, I've got artistic license but you know It might sound like a flight of fantasy, but You know, these These fanty can become fact and I genuinely believe some of these scenarios could play out. It could be most extraordinary period in in human history because we've never created anything on purpose. I mean, it's so stupid to it's more intelligent than us So For that self defeating act to happen I mean, I hope there's a few aliens with a sense of humor out there. I mean, it really is the geek has inherited the earth. I mean, if you're old enough to remember you know, how golf music, how we used to sort of laugh at the geeks on on the computers, you know It's that lot that have took over, you know, it's like so but yeah, it's you got to laugh or you go crazy really, but it's a fascinating period in history. that will also say Certainly, I think I first heard it from it was Werner von Braunn from NASA. I think he had mentioned about a fake alien invasion. It was a student of here as he told And then she I think she came out in one of the press conferences. several years ago saying, you know, this is what von Braun had said. And he said the, you know, you always need fear And there's all these things which will happen based around fear. you know, we've seen it decades now. There's always something to fear. And he did say that I can't remember if an asteroid would be first or the fake aid invasion would be before it, but he did outline that backack in the seventies. he had mentioned mentioned stuff like that. But that's again, that's been something which has been around for a while. Wow, That's interesting. I didn't know that actually. I had no idea that that u be plac that's interesting. If you have a look on the Steephen Greer press conference from two thousand one, now there was a NASA employee that worked with him. I can't remember a name I should do because I'm actually friends are on Facebook. And she came out and said, you know this is what you know he had told me. It was all to do when NASA was airbrushing out objects, you know in pictures and then then releasing them to the public. But yeah, no, she had mentioned that. That was a two thousand one press conference with Stephen Greer the very first one you did Yeah. isn't he a chap? Yeah, because I think I've still' seen some of that footage. I think he's the chap that says you can manifest a UFO or something if you like it's like praying really. He has a belief that telepathically. And I kind of believe in that only because like when I have my viewing in West Dullwich I'd been listening to so many I won't explain what my lifeifesty was like at the time, but I was living qu working from home. so I was kind of for a couple of months, very much maybe in a bit of a world of my own. but it was as a result, I very much normalized the subject So it was almost as normal as me to listen to a UFO podcast of the morning. I'd stick it on to to the news. I got very kind of obsessed with it for that little period. that I will say. and it's almost made me wonder if you can because I'm sure it's him that said or maybe it's someone similar name that you can sort of wish for it all out what happened when it happened in West Stalge maybe, but But yeah, I've seen some footage and ye, I mean, it's a bit confusing, isn't it? Be people will have to struggle enough with the concept of there being aliens and that it's not a sci fi and that it's not fantasy and And obviously now with everything, you know, with certain things the last couple of years where there's been a media story, so to speak, everyone's believed about something on a massive level where all our lives were massively disrupted. and people sort of went along with it, then It's plausible on one side to imagine people complying with draconian laws, staying indoors, et ceta for some sort of alien invasion. But on the other side, with all the questioning that's a little bit more prevalent now, even amongst the most people that believe everything the news says with a lot of the stuff that's come out recently you know, obviously people are also a bit more questioning. so to see how it plays out. I mean, people might question a fake invasion that might help people communicate better and with real alien life in terms of, you know, I mean, these are almost all light sci fi plots because really rather than a reality, but We know there's more than a fifty percent chance that these could all be realities But what I was going to say is that you could imagine that it could be a situation where as I say, ET alien might decide to help us to not fight the AI, but somehow with it repease it if AI was to decide in future like a teacher in the wall pink fl, you know, nasty sort of authoritarian figure shake its finger and delete us forever, but like the space bypass in Hitchik is going to the galaxy at theginning with the Vogon captain, you know. Hopefully that's not what the aliens are going to be like to us, but I think it's more likely to be the AI will do something like that. But yeah, it's as I say it's mind blowing, really, fascinating, but mind blowing. Yeah, you should always definitely question When someone is telling you something, one hundred percent, on a side note, you know if any sporting celebrities or music celebrities trying to give you any healalth advice, I look at it as if say, if I want to get healalth advice by someone that chases a ball, I will ask my dog. Yeah. Well, you probably can trust your dog a lot more than people for sure. Yeah. The Animal Kingdom Dogs are wonderful, you know, you know I read somewhere. I don't know where it was. It was on of one of the I think it's coast to coast U I would remind my dogs a bit dolphins and that's a bizarre theory that dolphins might be connected somehow with aliens or aliens and owls as well. Its like quite extraordinary things, owls and dolphins, I don't know. about the connections there, but be fascinating to know. But yeah, I just think like we were saying earlier with it's just started all my life as a child. The whole area of like when I remember seeing the film First Men on the Moon when I was a child, which is like a proto Steampunk kind of film really madea years ago. It was a wonderful film But a lot of the woming old mum told me about you know, meeting someone who genuinely believed in aliens on the moon That was it, you know, I was always my mind was I was always, as I say, sucked in And as say you know, my meagre attempts at wr right, you know, I say doing Steam punk myself or trying to attempt to do it But when I actually got sucked into the real when you get sucked into the real thing, there's a real feeling and you want to get out there and I've very nearly gone to a few UFO conferences, I'd love to. and that there There's a few. I know that there's one in Glastonbury Occasionally and not that far from me. but so I would love to go I've never actually got to a UFO conference, which is a major, this is my nearest to it. The South of England definitely need more UFO conferences. Yeah. I was in talk with someone a while ago about maybe bring in these was to do with a film festival in Gloucestershire and I said to him, you know what this place really needs is you know like a conference, like a UFO and a paranormal conference Exactly. You know, something like that. Now I know you didn't come on to promote your book, but do you want to tell us about your book? Well, I'm going to say I used to go to the Siritualist Association a little bit years ago they used to be in Berkeley Square in London and they were I only mentioned that as it reminds me of a little bit of the communal feel of going to see to a UFO event must be similar where you're meeting people all into things that were unusual. But yeah, nouul I wrote a few of them. It's nice of you to mention it. as I say, you can cut out any mention if you want. but as you've asked me about it, it's nice. Yeah, the rule books, I might go back to doing a third. I've done a few excerpts on YouTube actually me reading reading episodes because as a I'm a musician but I love writing and attast about ten years ago I wrote and there' never been any books written since Victorian times. when Ball W Litton, Edward Baller Litton wrote his poem about Ville coming the coming race that's actually, I think either Hitler and his cohorts read that and were influenced by it because of the connections with Eesoteric and the whole that part of the world basically Germanic, the whole the whole kind of tribal of Norse legend and everything. I think the whole Norse connection, Nordic Norseing is what sucked them in on a racial level, perhaps. I don't know. This idea was, I think based in a real you know, fable a real kind of a real concept going back many thousands of years and anyway, he kind of mythologized it in his book. and I'd heard about this and I realized it's not really been a sort of a sci fi kind of done in the sort of Da Vinci code way about about some the whole connection between Nazis and UFOs even though you obviously got Indiana Jones and all that, which went frivous and fun, there hadn't been a sort of more serious where it's sort of more of a kind of as the say, sort of thrill So that's kind of where I came at it with the angle I came at it with. and it was very much as I say, a kind of Da Vinci co kind of popboiler kind of thing where I wasm just writing it for fun really. I put it out there and I got it on an indie have this it for a while called Double Dragon and it was fun it sold a few copies, but At the end of the day, I main need did it for fun really because the subject gripped me and I was ill at the time and it was a good way of getting out, getting me out something artistic out there But I did I think the best thing about it was was you know, some pretty good reviews, but I think the best thing about it was getting the phone call from And Jay Huler. I don't know how he got a hold of a copy, but he called me out of the blue. and was that was amazing really talking to him and that was kind of best thing. I might go I might go back to it in future and write write a bit more about it and expand the concept. But yeah, it's fun because there hadn't really there's a few books have come up since mine actually But mine was the first to actually lookooked at those specific concepts of as I say the whole kind of Nazi connection with aliens and real and this power source and the supernatural. and it was fun to write as a result. The whole connection with occultism and the Nazs is, you know, it was very deeprued. it was the real society, wasn't it That's right, The real society There's always been this very deep root connection with that and especially UFOs. Interesting. what I'll do is I'll put the link below in the description. so if people want to headad iss the Vil Codex, is that right? Yeah, there's the Amazon shop for it. I don't really I haven't really not It's not that I've retired as an author. I still write poetry songs I'm writing a comedy book at the minute, but And I might return to Rll, but I kind of neglected it.'ve neglected it a bit. It's quite a bit. There's actually a YouTube introduction to it, might be the a good thing to include. It'd be great for me to reconnect with the subject to and get strongly involved with it if I can in the next year because I do think that It's so important to say this period we're all of us really. and we'll see how things play out in the wider society. It's very, very interesting. I think the key is Really the whole disclosure movement is how it's going to And I think we're all curious simply because there's so many ways it could happen, whether it's a fake thing or you know, whether it will come through the Conventional media because there was a silly weather balloon stuff with the Chinese weather balloon recently and everything Obviously that got on the BBC and they made a joke out of it, Oh it's not alienss exclamation Mark. So we're still bizarrely in that sort of, isn't it funny territory, even in twenty twenty three, which when you think All the things we've been talking about, it seems quite bizarre, but that's the conventional media for you. They're very clever patronizing and fooling, you know, the most intelligent people out there, like you were saying earlier Professors politics. Yeah, I won't say politicians ever avoiding doing anything any good and getting paid for it. Brillant. I mean, wow, goodness me. I mean, with everything one wonders how it's all going to put itself out because everything is so intricate with all the systems and the intelligent design, I suppose that we called whether you call it mother Nature or God's design. it's It's so intricate and clever. You look at bees and the wonderful work they do and how you know, their work, how everything they do helps us, our health, honey, how what a wonderful healing substance that is and Royal Jelly, of course soough of course Roll Dah had fun with that one with that wonderful story years ago and tell the unexpected. But it's certainly, you know, even with something like that, just simple such as the times we're in, one wonders how insect life, everything will be affected. It's like the butterfly effect with time travel. If for the, you know, if truly, things are going to start changing in the next couple of years, not just in the workforce But across you know, the whole strata of humanity because of AI It's kind of one wonders how it willll affect the animal kingdom, everything, but I guess we'll just have to wait and see again. Now That's one thing that is quite extraordinary. showhows like The Invaders or the prisoner Patrick McGan, they seem to tap into those are two particular shows. and say the other one' utopia from about ten years ago, which got banned, which is an extraordinary show where there's sections where they talk about vaccines which are quite bizarre, which very much fit recent events. and I suppose out of limits, Twilight Zone, but there's a few shows that evoke What we're going through. but I am not a number. I am a free man Oh yeah, because with well when with the survivors, they're all the monongsters of course. They've just got a strange little finger And people might laugh. but with a lot of these ideas, which as I say, sounded so wacky to me ten years ago, as I say when I spoke to Hilda. Those were the sorts of things he was on about. And to be honest, there's a lot.' even I'm sure there was some sort of government, someone in government in U.S. government. In the last couple of years, it wasn't even on the news, said that there was possibly, you know alien life and all this. And so it's really fascinating to think. , you know, there's so many, so many angles to it, you know, really is. And I think think as I say, at least just having an open mind. and not laughing and saying, Oh, you know, you've been watching too much, maybe you need to put your box set of the invaders away. You know, the day these things are real, you know Um and th As I say, life arts, people can say, well, you know, they say At can imit take life and genuinely a lot of You followed us I've listened to a lot of debates recently and there is quite a belief among some that there know they do walk amongst us. As I said earlier, there's even possibility if it's not, you know, relig just religiously profanity to say that we ourselves are alien liive to begin with, at least. So there's lots of ways of looking at it. but as I said so much today, we've had such a fascinating chat and I hope I haven't sir Lit you with too much verbal diarrhea bit, but it really has been interesting, Jane. It's been wonderful talking to you Ben. Just wonderful to been on and you know I really appreciate you giving me the time. And as I said, I've talked quite a lot. I've probably repeated myself a few times. Hopefully it'll be fun for to some of the listeners, but no thanks ever so much for having me on the show really. I just really enjoyed it It's a wonderful thing that you're getting so many of these calls in. and what it makes me think is that people really You know, it could be the mixture of two things, isn't it? I mean, people say on one side of the coin there's well then there's more the aliens definitely arged you're totally right, things are reaching ahead. thingsings are coming over ahead, they're either coming, or's going to be disclosure. On the other side, it's because people are because of all the problems in the world because of You know, everything was the last couple of years economically and racial tensions since COVID All the things have happened, peopleople are lonely and they're looking without the religion pererhaps not doing the job it did' in app pars. Pople are looking for something to believe in So I suppose from youve got that and you've got that, you've got the two different perspectives. I wouldn't say they rational and're really rational because those of us who believe know that UFO's aliens, it's perfectly rational and real, you know? As you can probably tell that I've been looking forward to chatting about it for a while because I don't really have any outlets for this march amongst those. I know I write about it a lot of my