Recovery and Reconnecting with Family

Hey, you're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind Well, here's a helpful fact you might not know yet. Drivers who switch and save with progressives save over nine hundred dollars on average Pop over to progressive d. com, answer some questions, and you'll get a quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by In fact, ninety nine percent of their auto customers earn at least one discount Visit progressive. com and see if you can enjoy a little cash backack Progressive casualty Inurance Company and Affiliates. National average twelve month savings of nine hundred and forty six dollars by new customers surveyed who saved with Progressive between june twenty twenty four and may twenty twenty five. Potential savings will vary I started Ornaaut in twenty thirteen and we make bike apparel. The best part of Shopify for me is our ability to run the business as essentially non technical people. We're able to admin everything on the backke end, front end, and sell things online easily. If Shopify were a bike accessory, I think it would actually be the bicycle It's the thing that you do the thing on. We run the business on Shopify Start your free trial on shhopify. com Freddy died Obviously, we had no access to the space people So then we became much more survivalistic. We had a special room where we had four years to store food and we had like bunkers and we had Guns We were waiting for the apocalp This is Was I in Ocult. I'm Lizayakuzi. And I'm Tyler Meam. And today is Doomsday guys, it's finally upon us Well, at least it's the end of our time with Hooyt Richard. Which to be honest, for me, it does feel like end times, I am gonna miss Hot and his wonderful storytelling. We have signed up for the cult of Hot, and now we don't wan to leave. But all good things must alas come to an end. Why is that? Why can't it be all bad things must come to an end? Whoever invented life is dumb And I want my money back. Give me my money back. Please. Good luck with that, Liz. Now, if you haven't listened to parts one and two of Hooyt's story, we appreciate your eccentricity. But we highly suggest you do that first Now Before we get into the episode We're gonna let Hoit drop some knowledge on us. Yes, one of the reasons for this bodcast is to explore what constitutes a cult or As Hoyt puts it, a cultic relationship It's really important to think about of the relationships It's a spectrum If I look at one polar side, it would be Jonestown like nine hundred people. being coerced or volunteering to take a suicide coalide And then the other side would be these one on one culture relationships that everybody experiences And that's a clinical term. a culture relationship is really defined as someone who You know, you are seeking the love and approval from. And because of this unconscious think you've created, you've kind of given them sort of an authoritarian position. and they are now using that position to potentially control and even abuse you Unfortunately, that happens to all of us. You know, it can be a parent, it can be a boss, it can be a lover, and a coach And I think it's important to know that It is part of the human experience And the crazy thing is So I think about what I signed up for and what I'm doing now. actually finally doing what I signed up for I would have never imagined it play out the way it's played out. but You know, I actually now feel like I'm having the type of conversations and I'm having the connections to people on a very human visceral life level that I'd always dreamed about And that's incredibly healing for me So to bring us back to where we left off. We learned that Sammy Hagar Van Halen himself was influenced by a cult leader. Fred And we learned that Vanity Fair ran a rather damning article on Freddie, but he wasn't around to read it because he died of AIDS, not a staph infection, just five days before it came out. But someone did read the article. and that was Hoyt's family. They read all about his life as a gem laden member of a very strange UFO cult So Vanity Fair article happens in February of nineteen ninety This part of the story is one of my favorite parts. So my oldest brother, Rory Horry had had his own issues with my family at one point He was at Princeton as well and And he had flunked out a couple times and he was struggling, but he was dealing with some important stuff, you know with this kind of finding himself and eventually came through the other side and So As this whole cult thing starts emerging, my mother's calling it a cult. My brother was Rory was just like, listen, he's just doing the same thing I did where everyone else from I was like, it's a call, it's a call, you know Rory was very kind of supportive with my whole thing. It's like, it's weird. It's definitely weird But when the Vany Fur article came out, he's like Holy shit Could I miss this one I approach my family about trying to do an intervention And my family's going through a really tough financial time and they're like, listen, we haven't seen them. and they were burned out kind of giving up. and P always like, No, I'm going to find a way. And he basically begs Sorrows and steals what he can to get together enough money to do an intervention The best way to do occult intervention is to get the person, in this case, Hot, to a place that reminds them of their life before And they stage an intervention for me up in Port Mon Island And his brother brings a mutual friend from college, along with his cousin and three experts in cult intervention. So then we went up to New England My uncle's He build yachts and was know Olympic sailor, so we go sailing with him. So all of that's kind of tryed to trigger me back into the old life And then the next morning We're at some breakfast pl and then these guys just bump into these other three and they're, o, and we sit down we're talking and everything seems okay. and then They're like, u Actually, we need to talk to you about something And I remember my focus just going from like normal things to just tunnel vision. and I was just shrinking back into the corner of the restaurant where I'm just like freaking out. And then they took me to a hotel room and tried to, you know to the intervention and And the problem was They were just trying to academically kind of punch holes in the philosophy. But the truth was my attachment to the group was emotional And so it was just a massive impact. So the next morning I woke up at the crackodawn and we were all staying in some same hotel room and I snuck out and bolted to the airport They came chasing after me. they were still in their pajamas and they catch me at the airport. They were trying their best to do the last violent attempt to get me to come around. They were literally restraining him, physically, holding him down and pleading for him not to go My one friend Nick He said I just started to convulse like a seizure. and He's like at that point, he goes I thought, you know, I thought maybe you werere going break, but then he goes, I thought you might actually pass out. So I backed off and then you came back to yourself and then you bated And I thought I'll never see you again You see, Hoyt had important work to do that his loved ones just didn't quite understand. Remember that according to Freddy, in the year two thousand, the Earth's poles were going to shift on their axis, causing major floods and earthquakes and ninety nine percent of humanity was going to be destroyed. But not Hoitt and the space people. They were going to be taken to the star Arcurus during the mayhem and then brought back down to Earth to repopulate the planet. With a race of super tann, blue eyed, lightithe physiqued, jeorash jean clad preppies. Mly men, of course. Freddie claimed that the flooding would cause the maps to be remade, and the mountains of North Carolina will then be beachfront proroperty. And who doesn't want beachfront property when the world's ending, right Thates sound nice, doesn't it? And the group had spent years saving money and organizing to buy a huge home there. Even though their fearful leader had died, they were still on a mission. We just Powered through to the move to North Carolina. And we started to you know, make our lives down in, uh Lake lore North Carolina onest lake These days, Hoyt has left the hustle and bustle of New York for the calm and quiet of North Carolina Now A lot of people don't realize the beauty that is in this area. And originally I bought land down here. and then I came down and the house became available and it was irresistible. and more or less I just said, this is where I want to live. Yes, beauty, calm and an escape from the impending apocalypse I've always tried to not let modeling control my life worked out that I've convinced some of my colleagues from New York and moved down here with me. We started a whole company, and now I've got a whole life and now it's a dream come true Ah yes, a dream come true. Just some colleagues waiting around for a spaceship to pick them up. You think they made a pit stop before their road trip? out of the galaxy? Like thanks for picking me up guys. Can we do one lastess costcaron? I'd like to get some pringles, some soda, some beef jerky, you know, before I kiss the eararth goodbye. Th then we had we actually had a house, which was an office and that became thing that we would travel to every morning and work at the office all the work's got to be related to Now what we're doing with theternal values. Everyone had quit their day jobs. and they started buying up businesses around the lake. It was like an all male, overly handsome cult version of Ozark. We had the Tourbo business and that expanded into like A whole gaming thing that was on the lakefront. Among several ventures that Hoyt runs from his Hendersonville office is a health and nutrition company. It consults people on diet, fitness, and stress management. And then there was the house buildilding business man of many talents Boy also manages a construction company which builds homes for other nature lovers who might be lured to the deep south. We had several building projects going on all the time This is just a part of one of the spec houses that we have. I'll take you inside to get a little idea of how it's turning out. You guys got to use your imagination here now. I mean it's a little stark right now, but it's going to be pretty amazing. This is all you really need in the house is a fireplace, right? So this is the third deck we have out here. This is the first deck of So we're about what four months away on this thing? About four months. But it wasn't good enough just to build the house. They had to do it perfectly You would sand a wall for fucking hours because you it had to be perfect And we believe that well, they're just going to come in, they're going to feel the spiritual principles that have been used to build a house. They have to be there. And of course, that didn't work. so we were taking a bath. We're having to know sell our houses at great discount and losing money My career was always there to prop it up. And when we said everyone had quit their day jobs, we meant almost everyone. The Vanity Fair article, as horrific as it was Mbe even more famous. So know the fashion business, which loves drama, all of a sudden, I was like, I've been this kind of on time professional Princeton Ivy Lague guy. now it's like, oh my God, Hoyt Richards is in a cult. He's really weird. Maybe he's gonna do something on set that it'd be fun to see Let's welcome So my career actually and it was mostly in Europe started to take off in a whole not realm So that's when I was really working nonstop. No guys, this is not a PSA for why you should join a cult come back like New York for a couple days, and I'd fly out again. and I've got all my old daily planners and it's wild to just see how it jet setting around And so it was much harder for me because On one level, I was financing everything still again and there was all these businesses and these things going on But because I was so gone all the time, again, there was a feeling that I wasn't pulling my weight And I felt awful because I was avoiding going there. And I try to explain this to people. they're like, Well, you were gone so much. L, how did they have control over you? And I say, listen, I was my own worst prison guard. Like I knew the rules, I knew I was supposed to do. I knew how I was supposed to behave. And Well also that's a dumb question. Like why do you think Ask Catholicism, why people have so much guilt for X, Y and Z. And they're not in a church every day. Right, exactly. So So it was really this thing of me just trying to battle my own demons and I had still had to call in Every day. North Carolina and talk to them and you Tal to them about What happened that day and did I live out the spiritual principles there would be times where they would be getting into some sort of thing down in North Carolina. where someone would be on the hot seat. And then like a comment come up, when, you know, Hit just like this too. getet that asshole on the phone. And so I get the phone call like like four AM my time or something You know, I've got a job that I got to leave at six. seven in the morning and I get screamed after two, three hours until my alarm goes off and they're like, goo make your fucking money, you piece of shit know Andit I go all freaked out to the set 's, Oh my God, my rich are so amazing. And I'm like, My God, my world is crazy I mean, would know I've got agents who you know I'm having this dream career and I would know meet them for dinner and D wouldceive some comment and give me a compliment and then I'd be like, no, I'm just an asshle. They're like, what are you talking?ike, Where is this coming from? no one could understand. I'm like, No, if you really knew me, No, you don't know. I'm really lower than the scum of the earth And mewh they're like, what You're the highest paid guy in the job you do in the world. Like what are you talking about? No, no, I'm just a piece of shit. Psychological abuse is almost always present in cults. I personally don't know of any cult that hasn't used it It can often be hard to detect, and sadly, it's quite difficult to prove in the legal system But on a mental level, it can be equally as damaging as physical, sexual, and financial abuse. So Hoyt, who was being manipulated and coerced at the time, continued to give money to the group as his way of contributing Big Money You're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind Well here's a helpful fact you might not know yet. Drivers who switch and save with progressives save over nine hundred dollars on average Pop over to progressive. comot answer some questions, and you'll get a quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by In fact, ninety nine percent of their auto customers earn at least one discount Visit progressive. com and see if you can enjoy a little cash backack Progressive casualty Inurance Company and affiliates. National average twelve month savings of nine hundred and forty six dollars by new customers surveyed who saved with prorogressive between june twenty twenty four and may twenty twenty five. Potential savings will vary They can do what's called legal laundering. So you You set up a Cay in account the European countries that I'm working for, those jobs get wired into the account. That account then sends a wire to a Nevada corporation And then the Nevada Corporation makes the loan to etternal values and whatever our corporations were in North Carolina. And then that loan never gets paid back. Okay great. So we're teaching people not only how to be cult leaders.. had legally money, launder money Now how big is big money, Tyler? Like a couple hundred thousand It was upwards about probably over all time. you know, It probably was four and a half five million D you gave him? Yeah, yeah. Oh And a lot of the stuff After Frederick. died was me just maintaining everyone else's like, I'm paying their credit card bills, I'm paying for their their teeth need to be fixed. I'm just kind of keeping the lights on We were also buying some properties. We thought the whole economy were going to collapse and all of that so we wanted gold Now remember Freddy was going to take all of his followers to Arct Turus once the poles shift It was nineteen ninety eight, ninety nine around then. So the Millennium is coming. and this is when the so called pulse shifts you' supposed to be concerned about, right? Y two K was coming, The computers are all gonna crash. This shit's really gonna hit the fan But they'll be sitting comfy in the spaceship to Ac tourists, right Right When Freddy died Obviously, we had no access to the space people, so then we became much more survivalistic We had a special room where we had four years to store food and we had like bunkers and we had guns We were waiting for the apocalpse. The narrative at that time was Fredick took on our karma and because we were such belligerent bad followers. We killed him And now we are no longer able to be taken out. and we're going have to stay here and fight for crumbs with the other people while world goes through hell And that was really where I started to kind of mentally move away from the group. because I'm like, I was never pitched that plan. that's not what I signed up for. I wanted the spac shhips and rejuvenation chamber. I'm, that's good for me. But this fighting for crumbs? No I don't want to be fighting for Krums health fund Truth was I was still traveling quite a lot at that time and I'd be over in London or Paris or Milan or Barcelona or somewhere. wonderful. and I'm looking around and I'm going E economies aren't collapsing, you know, There's not these storms and tidalways and everything know, that's not happening. There's no way this is all going down. the way Freddy had talked about it. So naturally, Hoyt would return to North Carolina and share his new observations with fellow members of Eeternal values Boy did I get crushed I was basically, you know, hailed as a blasphemer or a heretic of sorts And so then it's like, oh, you know, we're losing Hawaiiti We got a little quarantine him to help save himself And That's like to save him from himself, we have to Keep him here We have to re indoctrinate him Fucking mother fucker And they shavave my head, so I couldn't model anymore And I had to be I had to stay up in the garage and we kept the dogs up there. so I like to say I was literally and figuratively moved into the dog house And where was he sleeping again Now I was on the floor on a mat. What did your agents think? L you were working like a madman and now you have a bald head and you're not to send the pololaroid with my bald head to say, listen, and the way I spin doctd it, I said, listen, I've become a workaholic. I can't say no to any job. I haven't taken a vacation in fifteen years, which is true And I said, alwaysways find a reason to go and so I said, I've cut all my hair off so I can't do it. forcing me to take a break And they were all like, what they didn't know what was going on, but they were like something's up traraveling privileges had been revoked, and you know I was quarantined to the house. And I had to be the first one up and the last one in to bed, do every type of labor that no one else wanted to do. And I was supposed to handle it with this wonderful, grateful attitude of being able to assist in whatever way I could to the great cause I looked like as a convict, you know, I'm thinking to myself if I had air, I could be in like Rome right now, probably shooting an ad with Cindy Crawford and making twenty five Gs and maybe even kissing her right now. Like I would rather be there than scrubbing the toilet right now. So I guess I'm not really spiritual Wh all the abuse aimed at the only one keeping the group afloat? makes no sense. Well, you're forgetting one key ingredient that was missing Fredd. He knew how to work me very well and keep me in his graces and I kind of liked being the Golden Goose on some level Now the downside of that was as you can imagine, it built up a lot of resentment with the other group members. And by the time Freddy died and the group was left with people, you know, there were a lot of resentment coming my way and I got Bruont of a lot of that It's like the evil stepsisters with Cinderella I would face one of these hot seats every night And they would just attack me for that behavior and saying how I was just being an eomanac. I thought I was better than everyone. and And that would go on anywhere from two hours and sometimes it would be ten or twelve hours. And I would literally just go catatonic And I would beg them to stop and be just tell me what to do. And that happened every night for almost nine weeks Also on several occasions, this guy David Seman used to get right in my face and say You know, I just wish you weren't such a pussy and you had the strength to kill yourself do what's right and take Take us out of having to deal with your awfulness every day If you could just liberate all of us from you That would be a good thing But you're just too much of a pussy, you won't do it. Nice h But the dogma of eterternal values was ingrained so deeply at this point that Hoyt couldn't see what was actually happening to him And it wasn't fromund the mentality of thinking they're being abusive. It was like, no, you know they're the truth seekers. They're actually able to live this life that I'm not clearly able up to the challenge twwisted mentality kept me saying like I just I'm not gonna be that guy. I'm not gonna be the guy that didn't step up It was always me, always me, I was the problem. And I felt like such a failure and I hated them being so angry with me all the time. and I just I don't want to deal with it anymore. I just gott to go. I can't be here So one day, he musters up the courage to sneak out of the dog house. He takes a car, he drives to the airport and he hops on a flight to New York City. He's finally free leaving his more spiritually fit fellows behind Fuckers I escaped. The New York and And then thought, well, they wouldn't think I'm stupid enough to go back to my apartment, but I had nothing. know So I figured I'll just spend a night or two in the apartment and get my stuff together and then I'll head out to California or whatever. But Hoyt was mistaken because three group members had followed him to New York And they defended on me and caught me in the apartment and I was like, mother fucker One of the guys actually slept in the doorway to make sure I couldn't leave the apartment. And I have a fourth floor apartment in New York and I remember looking out the window and looking at the cars below and I go break my legs, but I think I'd live Maybe I should just jump I really thought about it, you know Let chicken down So then I went back to North Carolina and they flew back with me, you know, they took me back It was like a spiritual kidnapping. A term we just coined. thing They simultaneously made me sign a promissory note for two hundred sixty five thousand dollars that if I did leave, it would become doable immediately And sign it, he did. So after striking it big as a model and a businessman, are there any mountains left for Hoitt to conquer There is one more mountain for Ht to conquer, quite literally Coming up. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. You know, on this podcast, we've been known to make joe. According to some people Hor can be healing. It's how we and our guests often deal with trauma. But perhaps an even healthier way to deal with trauma is with an actual licensed therapist. A common refrain we often hear from many of our guests is that they were able to leave their experience behind with the help of therapy. Therapy has helped many guests to take back their power. recognize the patterns they continue to repeat in their lives and find their voice again. But therapy isn't just for those who are in a cult. No, if you need help cultivating good coping skills or learning how to deal with difficult corkers. O podcast hosts Wait, what I love you, Tyler So if you, dear listener, are thinking of starting therapy, it's never been easier than with better help. You simply fill out a brief questionnaire and get matched to a licensed therapist. And it's entirely online. You don't even have to brush your teeth. Convenient, flexible, and suited to your schedule. Look, if it wasn't for therapy, I would have never found out what a covert narcissist is Did you know that narcissists can be covert? Seems like both Liz and I have benefited from seeing therapists and encourage you to try it as well with better help In fact, let's wrap this up. I'm waiting for therapy right now. Discover your potential with BetterHelp. Visit betteretterhelp d. com slash in acult today to get ten percent off of your first month. That's betteretterhelp HLp. com slash in a cult. Hey, you're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind Well, here's a helpful fact you might not know yet. Drivers who switch and save with progressives save over nine hundred dollars on average Pop over to progressive. com, answer some questions, and you'll get a quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by In fact, ninety nine percent of their auto customers earn at least one discount. visit progressive. com and see if you can enjoy a little cash backack Progressive casualty Inurance Company and Affiliates. National average twelve month savings of nine hundred and forty six dollars by new customers surveyed who saved with Progressive between june twenty twenty four and may twenty twenty five. Potential savings will vary So Hoyt had a taste of freedom But it was small. K of like half an appetizer. Like John Dillinger after that first prison break. John Dillinger. born june twenty second, nineteen oh three, he was known as America's most notorious gangster. He was accused of robbing twenty four banks and three police stations. Not right now, not the time. Now, fine I'll read it to myself But like Dillinger, Hoyt had left the compound only to be dragged right back And when he got there, A deal was struck. This guy David had said to me was, listen You don't think the Polshheivtss come in If we get to N Year and nothing happens, we'll pack your bags and you can leave So I'm like, all right, I guess that sounds reasonable. But Cinderella wasn't going to a ball anytime soon. Hoight was still living in the doghouse, scrubbing toilets with a toothbrush and getting burned in the hot seat on the regular. To months into that, I'm like, can't if I can take this. I can't, you know, can't can't, I can't do it. I can't do it. I' not No way you're gonna make it six months. So I started to plan. Similar to John Dillinger, prison wasn't for him. You know, Dillinger once escaped prison by carving a gun out of soap and he painted it with black shoe polish. T w Be yourself ine. Good boy But since Hoy escaped by car the first time The group wised up and had taken away his driving privileges and cut off all communication with the outside world. We had a phone system and An time I'd pick up the phone in the office where I would live The light would go on on every other phone in the house I couldn't call a cab or anything like that. So I figured out the vax machine also had a phone on it, but it didn't light up a system So I'm like aha When I finally planned and just poetically, I did it on july fourth, Independence Day. I like, I am going this time. I am going So at the crackodon, I had called the cab and had it meet me at like four AM and I had the dogs in the doghouse right there. So as I'm escaping, I'm trying to keep the dogs quiet because I don't want them to start barking out. And then the whole driveway was gravel. so it kind of cracks. I'm literally like scavenging it, trying to keep minimum sound And then I u I get to the precipice and I had to go down the mountain. It's about a mile and a half down the road to get to the place where the cab's going to meet me But it's a decent drop and it's dark as hell Th thenen I just started to run. And you know, it wass like when you're running, you think someone's may you start hearing things, you're like, Sone com happen. But I bolted And I got in the cabin and it's like a prison break And then I did not go back to my apartment And I stayed in Howard Johnson for like five days. and then I went to a friend's place in Brooklyn And the guy one of the guys I'd gone to college with who's in the cult knew that I'd probably go there. So he actually comes to that apartment The guy I went to go see was also in the football team was one of the limemen, he's a big dude. He goes down to know see this guy Rick Coley and he's like, Rick, leave Rick's like, I just want toop. He' like, No Rick, Leave He I dont I don't wantan to force you, but he goes, I will. Just leave him alone. He's done. And the moral of that story is Don't judge a fax machine by its color. Did you know that the fax machine was invented At the time, Tyler? I'm just kidding, Liz. I actually have no idea when the fax machine was invented. But I do It was nineteen sixty four, but it was eighteen forty three that Alexander Bane invented the electric printing teelegraph You happy? Happy as a fax machine in nineteen ninety seven, Lz. thank you So Hoint He was finally free from eternal values. It shouldould have been named eternal abuse. So how does one celebrate the leaving of a cult What do you do? Rrip a line off Andy Warhols in Nantucket Shockingly, it's a bit more tame than that less through my mind I've always loved movies and I thought, you know, I could go to the movie theater four of five movies right now. You can stop me wa, I don't have to answer anybody if I do I can do something just stupid like that and No one's gonna know and no one has I don't have to talk. I was like, oh boy, this sounds like a whole new chapter for me Aside from the failed intervention, it had been over ten years since Hoyt had spoken to his family in any meaningful way But where else was he going to go at this point So I went up and spent like ten days with my parents And Nntucket I was going places where I thought People would not ask me too many questions because I knew my parents would be too terrified too And they've got notes they'd written, you know, we think he's out. you know, we're not sure we're not gonna to ask him, but we think he's out. But it wasn't until almost twowo years later where I finally had a conversation with them I was terrified. I was embarrassed, I was shameful. Even though he was in the safety of his family's home, he still feared the group members finding him. so he tried to put as much land between me and them. And then he thought of someone And you're not going to believe who Fabio He hadd always had this open door policy. He said like, anytim you want to come you stay with me, you know. So I lived with Fabo for a year and he was amazing because you know there were very few places I could go where I thought someone would just be okay with me being there and not ask too many questions. You know, I love Fabio. he' he's just as solid as they come. He's incredibly loyal, very generous, just super kind natured guy. It's really interesting when you hear Fabio's take on it because he goes Hoit showed up my door and because I knew immediately something terrible. that He was like a shadow of the guy I knew When he shot up, I can tell there was something major wrong with him. Pople slally down, depressed. it was a mess. I mean you can tell he was like a beat up dog. I knew one day. That will come. I knew soon or later, you know, they're going to take him to the cleaner Yep, that is the voice of the real Fabio. We wanted this episode to be fabulous, not fabioless K You know, he told me, so if I, you know, I really need to talk to you and, you know, I'm like Tically not my bank account, I have no money, I have no place to go I was like, Hi, you're one of my best friend. Of course you can stay here You can stay here as long as you want. you know, It's like I' going to help you, you know, to get back on your feet Very successful, I'm working all the time, making tons of money. I got full time a skieper. so you know, it's like if you need your laundry, if you need, you know, I even pay his phone bills. I mean, everything You know, make sure there's always food in the house All women over fifty five are drooling right now. We are hoping this episode draws in an entirely new demographic. Hey, twenty and thirty somethings, send this episode to your mom and then let us know you did. Don't worry listeners, there is much more Fabio at the end of the episode. because I've learned in life that When someone's gone through something bad, it's best to leave them be and give them a safe space And when they're ready, they'll come and talk to you. Yeah, because you know, sometime when you go through trauma, it's better the person to open up and tell you about it. It's not your business trying to go and be curious So I was always, Hey, we're just going go out there and have some fun like the old days. Nothing's changed. If you want to talk, we talk. If you don't want to talk about it, I don't care And he gave me a safe space for almost a year. Never. tried to dig that stuff up because I wasn't ready to process. I was going through PTSD. I was not ready to talk and didn't even know what I'd been in id didn't know what I hadd gone through And I was so convinced it was just my fault I tell people all the time, if As shitty as cult life was The aftermath was so much harder trying to make sense of it tryrying to come to grips with it, come to terms with it I mean, I remember having some trepidation because I hadn't figured out it was a cult yet at that point, my belief was waning dramatically. but I still didn't know. Yeah, I still didn't know. And all it could have taken was like a couple big hurricanes or you know massive earthquakes that might bring me right back and like, Oh my god, maybe I was wrong So if he was going to find out if this group was all bullshit or not, he would go back to the place where it all began. to Stio fifty four party on New Year's Eve and when it went from ninety nine to two thousand. So I was back in studio fifty four and I'm like if something happens, I might as well be there. Em andem was there that night. The world's gonna end. I w to be where Em and M is too. And as the clock turned, midnight. There was no bang. There was no end. He was still standing there with the disco lights and body sweet Yeah, I just remember being uneasy but also relieved when nothing happened So, all that prep for a world that didn't end And now what do you do when everything you've been told is a big fucking lie? For Hoyt, he reconnected with a friend who had also left the group, and they started deconstructing the events that had occurred within ernal values. And he had heard people refer to the group as a cult, but not convinced, he thought perhaps that he should investigate this concept Yeah I hadd ordered this book called Combating Cold Mind Control. It's a story about Steve Hassin, you know, who wrote it had been in the moonies, how he'd been indoctrinated My approach for even looking at the cult material was like Listen, I know I was not a cult. L someone like me does not join a cult like that. I would never join a cult. Like That's how clos minded I was. But then after six months, I'm like, well, let me at least look into what cults are because clearly people think that and maybe it'll lead me to what it actually was At least I can cross the cult box and say it wasn't that if I do some research. And of course I just start my research and immediately figure out I fit in the cult And it was also demoralizing that know I so convinced myself that I was in this special situation that no one would ever understand And then I'm reading the book, I'm like, no, actually, that's bullshit. You've been in a cult, notot even a very particularly strange cult, pretty standard cult. And you're just standard cult member who's now dealing with the fact that that's the truth And then I spent a few months just calling the guys in North Carolina and ripping them like, You're on a fucking call. you're all brainwashed. You'rebody' just living in a house I paid for it. You got a business that I paid for I'm coming down. I'm going burn it all the ground. Just litenting all this pent up anger it had for decades, and I knew I was in some way behaving like the group said, you would behave if you leave. So I was now someone that's possessed by the dark forces and I'm screaming at them. And so it's falling on deaf ears, but it was incredibly liberating and healing for me to toe off and just tell them all to fuck off But eventually you know, I had no money My modeling career had basically dried up overnight because moving to LA. is like moving to Fiji. and I just know I couldn't move back to New York. It was too triggering. you know, I had so many bad experiences there. and then I thought about going to Europe. but All of it was going to cost money that I didn't really feel secure yet, you that I would be able to pull off. And so I thought about, know, well, maybe I'll just sue these guys and then I like, No, that's gonna cost money. But he discovered that the group was running low on money. 'Cacause once I stopped making the money, they had no way to pay bills and things started to stack up for them, you know And so they started having some hardships and then they decided they were going to sell the lakehouse. and I was like, those motherfuckers are not selling it without, you know that money should be come to me. And because I thought they're just going hidail it out of town. so Once I knew it was on the market, that's when I got this great L Jim Boen came in I brought a Ro case against them racketeering And it was so obvious they had like thirty six corporations that kept shuffling all sorts of shell games going on. they were just doing all sorts of mischief and I knew where a lot of the bodies were, not all of them, but I knew a lot I knew none of them had paid taxes for the last fifteen years and so I was going for blood And then the laword is like, listen, I really recommend unless you want this to be your life for the next three years Let's try to mediate. So I was kind of was like, I guess I guess that's what we have to do. And then I watched them mall. Under oath? whyy and lie And that was an interesting experience because I remember thinking Three years ago, that would be me. But I was just so grateful to be on my side of the table and not there. I'm like, Jesus, it was a great kind of reference point that seeen how far I'd come just in the three years And after weeks of mediation, Hot won and was awarded a sizable settlement, which essentially shut down the group Time for Cinderella to go to the fucking ball or at least be able to afford the dress I couldn't take all their businesses and stuff, but any of their resources and then you know all their businesses blew up, they all moved out of the area. There's no one even lives there anymore. And that's when I was at least able to kind of start my life with a new perspective, just knowing that if nothing else, those guys weren't going to be out there doing the stuff they were doing Insurance isn't one size fits all. And that's why drivers have enjoyed progressives name your price tool for years now. With the name Y your prrice tool, you can tell them what you want to pay and they'll show you the options that fit within your budget. 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A So after twenty years of being in Eeternal values, from age sixteen, to thirty six and giving the millions of dollars along the way was finally free physically and mentally and he had just recovered a large sum of money in the lawsuit But you don't have to be a cult leader to be a con artist. lost the money that I made in the suit because I didn't know anything about investing or anything, you know, I gave it to some real estate person who said, Ohh I can double your money in six months and it was all a scam and You know, I just had no discretion, nothing, no real street smarts That's when it started, the recovery and that's ultimately led me back to my family You know, I had that first year and a half where I wasn't spending too much time with the family. But then after I figured it out, I started to reconnect with them. And then the way it played out was u My mother was dying of cancer So She kind of needed like a full time nurse All my siblings all had families and dealing with all the chaos that comes along with the family. And so I said Let me do this So I was her primary caretaker for you know the last six nine months of her life, whatever it was being in the position of the caretaker and in essence parenting my parent It was very healing. that was kind of an important step for me to say Yes, I'm doing it for my mother, of course, but I'm most doing it for me because that's the kind of person I want to be That person's not an asshole H my moments ster Yeahah. Today, Hoyd is able to freely talk about his life in the cult and in the healing, has found silver linings Being in the business I'd been in for fifteen years traveling around the world, being around where people abuse drugs and all sorts of things I'd kept pretty clean because I was involved with this group, like You know if I was at some place like, oh, we're going to Mconal's for the weekend down and, you know a be s she's got someplace. I just couldn't do that. I had to run that by the group. and I know they'd be like, What the fuck you doing going in there? That's like satanic. So it kept me out of trouble You know, there's all sorts of things, you know I can look back and I go, manan, I would' have been phograph. So I don't know That of crazy There's still time hoit, stranger things have happened. I tripped at a party and fell into Ariana Grande's lap, so you never know Today, Hoyt enjoys living a modest life I don't need the big car in the big house. I like listen, for me it's It's making impact on people and feeling loved and being a be in relations where I can show my love to those people One of the things people ask after big life events happen is why Why did I get fired? Why did my aunt pass away? Why did I end up in a cult I feel like the one prayer that I kept asking for was you know as God, just please make this make sense for me some wayay And I feel like I have that now. And so Now I just tried to with that point of view likeike Shakespeare says, be true to thyself This quotation comes from Act three scene three of Hamlet, in which a man named Paolonius reprimands his son Laertes for being at home instead of on booard a ship that is set to carry him to France. You know I can't stop him guys. Polonus says, This, above all, to thine own self be true And it must follow as the night, the day, Thou canst not then be false to any man Farewell Blessing season this in Thee to which Lertes replies Most humbly Do I take my leave My Lord And Lord H Do take your leave For you are doing Thank you, White for telling your story with such grace, poise, and openness. It's not easy to share in this way, and we are humbled by your bravery currently lives in Los Angeles, but sorry ladies He's taken. He's still occasionally models, and not long after the cult, he found a new creative outlet as well I started to reinvent myself as an actor and that was incredibly healing. know, I'd go to I'd be an acting class and do some really kind of dark people like, Dude, where the fuck did that come from? And I'm like It's a long story Three episodes long, in fact, and we love you for it, Hoyt. Today, Hoyt mostly writes and produces films. And he's currently involved in a very cool project that we can't really talk about, but when it comes out, you will know. He also has a podcast in which he interviews people who were in cults called What the Flock. It's one word guys What the fuck Check it out to hear more of his tantalizing voice. We also have provided a link in the show notes. And today, well, Hoyt's been able to leave his cult life behind. Well, for the most part I've got a king size bed And I basically sleep like I'm in a cough and I barely use the bed When you're sleeping on the floor with very little cushion Any turn on your hips, it's quite it's not a very comfortable thing. so I literally sleep on my back with my hands at my chest. Like a corpse. Yeah, like a corpse. A very good looking corpse, that is Okay that's our show. Wait wait, wait wa We forgot something One final, very important question Okay Did you ever have sex with Cindy Crockper? In my mind so many times? Yeah, I do have a few regrets in my life. Cindy and I were actually you know, friends and I'd still consider her as friends. I haven't seen her in a long time, but I would be lying if I didn't say I had a crush on her. You're amazing, thank you It was fun. It's good to see you. Here's to moving forward. Here's to moving forward. One step after another. Correct I guess you're not gonna ask me if I ever had sex with Cindy Crawford, are you, Liz? I was gonna ask you if you ever had sex with Hite. In my mind, so many times. All right, that's it. See you guys. see you guys. Hear you guys next week. Where we have another great episode, a poetic Story of a woman in an extxtreme religious cult Yeah, the worshhiping would good very People would fall out in the spirit onto the floor And if you were a woman and you fell out and the spirit ne of the sisters on the church would come with what we called a lapkin Okay, folks, as promised, here's a little bit more of our fabulous Fabio interview. It's fabulous. No, it's with Fabulo, so it's not fabiulous. It's fab Fabulous You had left the Catholic church at this point? Oh yeah. I mean I was like I was you know, of course, you know, it's like when you grew up in Italy, you know Catholic church, you know, everywhere Catholry school and priests and so on. but I never got along. I always saw from the beginning There was a lot of hypocrisy and I saw things and I go like, you know, these people they are a bunch of hypocrites. I mean, don't get me wrong. There are some good priests. But at the highest level of the clergy, they' all they are connected to the mafia, they are You know, I saw so many things that when I was a kid. So already eighty nine years old, I'm telling the priest, you're an hypocrite. you know, God didn't choose you, you choose you know, you choose, you know to represent God, but you know, you don't live it. you know, and I'm supposed to respect you because you wear that custom. The custom doesn't make the monk They used tell all the kids I was the son of a devil, I was the anntichrist, because you know it's like I was like point the figure out at them and tell they were aypocrites All the p I remember when the parents used to come and talk to the priest, they would look at me like, you know I was like, Oh my guys, that's the Antichrist. you know And I was like, fuck you guys. You know, it was like, I didn't give it shit. You know, it was from one ear out of the other You know, I couldn't care less He did talk about his childhood, but he also discussed the height of his modeling career which is C Bonkers Yeah, like people you know, they want to act and they want to model and they love. I was the type of person Just give me the money. like you know, you know, I was honest, Just give me the money and that's it