A Letter of Love and Admiration

The summer, serve up the cookout classics, craft Mo and dressing, toss green salads with delicious ranch dressing or zesty Italian Serve smooth, craably creamy potato salads with mayo. We all know it's not a cookout without craft. Pandora jewelry brings the sparkle to your summer, now with even better prices. Enjoy up to fifty percent off select styles, from personalized pieces to must have favorites made for the summer. timeless designs that shine with you through every moment, wherever the summer takes you. Shop in store or online, now through july sixth, terms and editions apply Visit Pandora. net for details this super gilt for my old like if I could turn back time T talk about that, we kind of have to go into how it thired. Which is for everybody who hasn't seen what was your firstav? She's in the state of her body. If I wearing a johnny Aola I think the lust for fame comes from not having that attention. As a child, black. I remember my dad was super inubriated, hisis heart stopped and he wasn't breathing. I'm black. attempting to do some formmer CPR,'m obviously I'm twelve. I don't think any of us realize how far it was gonna go that quickly Island records. one hundred fifty per single. I hadn't seen a thousand pound in my life at this point. So then already, what's then the darkest period? Because with light comes shade. In the video shoot, I keep swigging a bottle. You can see it in my eyes as well. I'd be talking some of the walls, you can't walk, you can't talk, your legs go. I've never spoken about any of this before, but me not being drunk From January to No. That's the longest I've been sober since I was twelve years old. Can you trust this? You had so many hits back to back to back. Were you an industry play Hey there, beforefore we begin the episode, I just want to say Thank you for choosing We need to talkal Doing this podcast is one of the greatest joys of my life. And I want to continue to share it with you. So hit follow and the bell icon It takes just a second and it helps us to continue to grow this podcast Yes, We need to talk. Let's have it. All right. So Let's start with how you feel right now Yeah, I am very aware of what youre doing and I'm a big fan of what you do and I've seen it. So I know that these conversations are very open and vulnerable. and I I'm not afraid of those conversations. I mean, we've just met, you know what I'm saying, so there's vulnerability anxiety in thatin. No, I hear you. What I find most interesting is that We have public figures on or at a festival However thousands of people in the audience, right or on TV, millions of people are watching you. But when they come and they sit in this chair There is a bit of nervousness that far more revealing. I've always said, even down to like shows on that I The most nerve wracking shows I do I like forgive me for people who come to them. The weird industry ones where it's like eighty people all sat with like champagne just like watching you perform rather than like Once you get past five thousand, five thousand to ten thousand. there's not much difference because like you're not It's just like a sea of people now.'s bigestowd you've performed in front of us Dum Wembery I'm with capital That was a big one. That was a big moment for me I think I was twenty years old and I had like myesia, I had them chant in RD Um, And Wimby I mean, how people this? eighty five thousand I think eighty five it was full. It was sold out. No, it wasn't just me. I didn't sell it out, but still Yeah, eighty five thousand people chaining your name. Crazy, crazy highire to come down from as well So' let's unpack you U I started with RD We need to talk. Yes. You have a government name. I do. Yeah. All right, tellell me government name and how we get to RD from that Some people find it a cool story. I find it a little bit like not the embarrassing's not the right words. It's not that cool and interesting. so my full name is Riley Davies and I was a big MMM fan growing up was always curious as to how you become E andem because he' Marshall Mathes says M and M So I'm Audi. That's it. Yeah there's not no wild story of like no one gave it to me like so you gave it to yourself, then? Yeah, was in year seven and secondary school. It was not a turmoil of time I was really trying to implement it. you know? Like when you try and give yourself a nickname, it's not that cool because everyone's like calling you that, you what I mean becausecause you're a rapper you're just Riley eleven years old. ' it would kind of be like a little joke in school like what RD ye? And I'd be like, yeah, come on, byy know they're taking li with you that I mean, you know what I mean? So that's why. I didn't realize that. So So it's through Eminem. Yeah, literally you got RD. Yeah. You grew up in Brighton, Brighton, Yeahah do you think has impacted who you've become. Looking back now as an adult, I look back at me as my mentality as a teenager and how proud to just be myself I was and how comfortable I was really in my own skin from such a young age. like I started even making music when I was eleven twelve and I don't think it's young. but even in a sense of like, I was making my own music, I'd bought myself my own USB mic, was uploading it myself onto YouTube. And when people are like, what makes you think you can be a rapper? I'm like, whyy are can't I that? I can do anything. And part of that is installation from my momum's mentality in how I was raised. but I do think Part of it was from Brighton and I think it also is a huge part of me and my career and why people drew to me at a time where like the typical UK rap story is like London or Manchester was is and was coming up, Do you know what I mean? Yeah. But there wasn't necessarily bright and and I was very bright. and obviously Jordan and Ruskitss were from Brighten and they still implemented it, but I was I was screaming it from rooftops. Every video, you could see it was black seaside and I was mentioning it a lot and Yeah, so it plays a massive part and I love it, Do you know what I'm saying? Yes, Yes. Now you just mentioned your mother who from everything I've read about she seems to be The most influential figure. She's the goat, yeah. Yeah in your life So could you talk about early relationship that you had with your mom. and how you believe that it changed in your younger years I was outside a lot as a kid. So my older brother, he' autistic And so he's two years older than me he needed A lot more attention and caring. and obviously my mom And now looking back Na. she obviously had to learn First of all what it is to be autistic and how to navigate that. My brother didn't speak a word of English didn' speak u til he was seven by choice. like he could. he just made dinosaur noises and stuff like that. L we had a good relationship, but I have no animosity to it. It's not like I look back and think, oh my mom cared about my brother more like I love my brother and I love my mom and that's what I don't feel like I needed it necessarily, you know what I mean? But what it did mean is that I'd be playing out with like the older boys. so I'd be like five, six. play it out til late ish for a five or six year old. but It wasn't dangerous because Whver I was, there was a neighbor of some sort that was watching their kid and everybody was all friends, you know what I'm saying? But I remember always being told As a kid, like you think you're way older than you are. Like I've always acted like an adult and I used to always want I chat and blend and be with the adults, even from down like if my mom had all a family over, I would w to stay up later and I would put on like shows and perform. So I used to perform like songs from the musical Oliver Twist. My mom would put me in like a little room. Like a little hat and like, yeah, I'd sing those songs and it would mean while they're all drinking and having fun, I would get to stay up later Right. how much of and this is I haven't heard you talk about in detail, so only as much as you want to But how much of how you are showing up was based on your father beinging present with you. When I was a kids before I'd met him. Again, you don't know any different. So it was like Looking back now, they were definitely time of like the start of like this feeling something's missing like this hole. but I didn't know it was like work its because my old man's not there because he He left when I was two It was so weird to have not M A human and never have any memory or experience of him and then constantly have your entire family L like you're so much like your're dad You're the spit of him, your mannerisms, the way you talk, your personality. and just again, like just goes in one way or the other. What do you think You learned. that age about yourself. Looking back now My mum was definitely still my mum and was like a maternal figure But I'm kind of realizing in this conversation, how we used to navigate things It was It was and has always been a level playing field. It's not been like, this is the rules. You need to do this. Anytime if you did try to do that, they would become rebelled against at the highest level anyway. so I'm realizing and she probably looked at that for right, Well, that's that's not going to work with him. Well my mom's good at that. She didn't like raise me and my brother the same way. So when you think back as to what you needed, you were not receiving as a child, what would that be? attttention I think I don't believe I would have wanted to become famous. where if I didn't have the relationship. dynamic. with my dad dad do. But so how does but help me understand how U leararning more about your father, how does that then push you to then want to become famous or want the public's attention I've wanted to be famous since I was eight years old, like watching Michael Jackson on the TV or like Robbie Williams like this big kind like energy and I've always been around music as well. like my mom has always had music playing in the house. So I think would have I would have always been musical. I've always liked to make my own music, but I think the lust or whatever not last, whatever the word is for fame comes from not having that attention and it's the art call at some point A fire was lit. That was like Even when I was getting the attention, it didn't feel like enough. and so when I'm leaving, there's more and more resentment every time he's in and out and it's like, cool I'm not going to get it from there I get it from everybody else then watch tonight. I mean, then that whole will be filled, obviously, it wasn't I'm saying, but yeah well said as well said. I get it. I definitely get it. So then with your mom, help me understand how that then relationship change because with your mom, I'm just so impressed with her.s incredible. Yeah, ye. So how did The relationship with your mom chang and then tell me about everything like your mom got, like she's got a black belt, Yeah like yeah, tell me about her Um, She's just super gangster in it? What can I say like? I think our relationship We were friends,? me me and my momum were pals, like even for all of primary school, I've never hid anything from my mom, anything I've got up to for better if the words illegal or illegal or nughty or like relationships and my drama and troubles with girls, like Just a super open relationship. and I think that was intentional from her. Let's talk music. Yeah. let's talk music. I am gonna to circle back to your mom though. Yeah. But let's talk music because U This is something that I am I didn't realize until just having this conversation now is how early you knew you wanted to be famous. Yes. because this is also common theme that I've seen among our guests who've all been famous musicians is that early They didn't know exactly what it was, but they knew they wanted to perform. Yeah. And they knew they loved the response that they were getting, the attention, right? So you said it was early super early. Before I knew it was music, I still knew I wanted to be famous. Okay. We used to get pocket money from my momum. I think it was five or a week or something at some stage. My brother used to buy sweets. I used to save the pocket money so I at two weeks and buy albums. So like It was actually early on it was like rock music. I used to love tenacious D. Oacious Yeah. like Jack Black and even like if you look at how kind of my character, if you look at like the humor side of my social media and how I don't take myself too seriously,' a very Jack Black esque.. He was my hero for a long time up Be before it was M and M it was Jack Black Yeah, and then obviously at some point it changed and I fell in love with M and M and rap and hip hop and I used to love his like devel like cleaning out the closet, like he's talking about his mom and that kind of even though he's speakingking about his mom and my friendings with my dad, this Em andem spoke to me on different level. even his like fuck everybody and everything attitudes was something that spoke to me massively as I used to o listen to a lot of M and M and then I remember writing my first or like Not writing, but coming up with my first rap When I was in like the shower, I can't remember what it was, but it used to be in an American accent because these times I've never heard a UK rarapper. This is in like Ye five or year four, like primary school And then I remember the first time I'd heard any UK rap was it was like I can't remember which one was first. It was German Whip with Meridian Dan And that's not me by skepta. and this is all kind of leading into secondary school. You know this is so fascinating to me is that now having talked to so many people who have become famous, right? I see that there's a formula And the formula is exactly what you mentioned Part of it is this belieelf almost to the point where people think It's delusion. I I wouldn't even say it's belief. Like there wasn't dis I didn't I didn't believe it. I knew it. You knew it I knew I couldn't see me doing anything else as an adult. And part of that comes from like just something innate. The other part of it comes from, you've seen it, you see your mother is achieving incredible things, right got that other part So that's one. The other part of the equation two is need for attention. Yeah. Third Levels of trauma Yeah, that ed all of this. These three things together, I see is now like, you know, so what do you think was the first song that you wrote The first song that I wrote 've spoken earlier, there's a group in Brighton called Audioactive. Jordan's been a massive part of them. and They come round to my School Hove Park and I was made aware of it And I remember coming to the music room after schools at three o'clock. and Hat I will voucherist is a guy from Brighton. he's part of audioactive but also his own musician and he come and I was refusing to leave the classroom. And so I' heard the teacher say like, cool that, these are the kids that want to be a part of it. He's not supposed to be here. He will eventually leave Don't even bother, like it's just not worth the ag kind of thing. like it' basically what obviously That made him instantly gravitate towards me. He's like, What's happening to me? I'm like,'s going on bealf of Mother and I showed him his lyrics? And he was like I can't remember if he cried or not. Obviously it was like like what you're talking about is heavy stuff. I also remember that being the start of like the school getting involved. They didn't What they were were they making fun of? Yeah making fun of of I mean, why were they making fun of you or your music or what was it or both? All of it luck Remember, I'm I was I was small w in schools. I would take I would like not bullied. I was never like no one could have ever bullied me in it. but u My heart was always taken a piss out of anyway, which Obviously eventually gave me, as I'd come later into a teenager small man syndrome and wanting to fight to prove that just because I'm little like. But I remember the first one, I remember really getting taken a piss out. I wasn't this one. No one had heard this one yet they made they'd played it in assembly and I remember feeling so embarrassed and it was something that I'd kept with me for so long, even to this day now memory gets associated. anytime someone plays me like something deep of mind to like I've got like the fire in the brief I' done with Charlie Brus, for example, where I talk about What's happening? What's going with my brother, whatever It you probably couldn't play that around me because it reminds me of like when I made the song, I used music as a vent in. and so I'd made that song and they played it in an assembly for everyone to hear. Even like once I'd blown Some of that the earlier Deper things are done Like there's a black box that's kind of like a little fan favorite. It was done before I was famous. Yeah. twenty nineteen. twenty nineteen Yeah Yeah, got right. Yeah, you got it there. I remember like when people would play it or like I'd hear certain bits of it, it would weird me out because it's like I wouldn't tell you that story I just met you off the road, but I'm putting it online for everyone to hear. So then that's interesting that that's how you started Yeah Sorry, An because because then It seems like you went from that, which is this very vulnerable state of expression. Yeah to them was was was the next I would say It was the breaking moment, Chheky Bars. Chheky Bars was the breaking moment. So I'd left secondary school, went to a college called Northbrook and it was like an arts college I met a guy called Bigs the engineer. shhout out Bigs. He was from Crawley and worked at a studio in somewhere in London and I'm just sitting in on his studio sessions here I'm not making music. so he's recording another artist. that's eer paying him or a lot of the time he didn't get paid. That's another story. But Eventually I saw he moved to a different studio and W it And the guy who owned that studio. eventually became my manager at the time U my first manager He, uh And so I used to go there. and had he had something different about him. Do you know what I mean I could tell he knew the industry a lot better than anybody else I'd met Blown O artists up So he was he' managing Dino at the time. Okay. I used to play my music to him and He would basically be ' shit it' shit And that's it was building up not I wouldn't say it rudely like that. Be like that's not the one. And I love that because everyone else I played my music to they're like, yo, broll like, this sick around. this is sick. I'll shout you and no one shouts you. So this is the first honest industry feedback of've got, but he was still giving it the time And I remember I used to again, sit on bigZ sessions and whatever And he used to tell me I was talented, but he was like, bro, you know what I don't get about you And I was like, what and And he was like I used to come to the studio. there wass like my magnums it might be girls or like just whatever's going on in is like you've got this like mad fun cheeky energy about you. like that's this version of you on the music I'm hearing I don't know him and And he's like, it's amazing that you can do it bit is like you're trying to sell like your vulnerability and your whole story before anybody's listening. so his method was like, whyy don't you just be? You And so broe chey bars. I wrote it in my loft bedroom. I stayed at Worthing at the time The heating didn't work in the yard. so I had bare bubble wrapp You know, like them loft windows have come down. I had bubble wrap around all of them. so they would like the insallation was dogshit. The room hadn't been converted properly. recorded it mix and mastered it myself. Digital Yeah in my bedroom with a I think it' like a two hundred pound mi. How I And how old were you eight You were eighteen. So then you put that out And then What's the reaction Yeah, it was crazy and so fast. Can't remember what it had done. like I don't even think interviews were that mad, but people were talking about it. I had ten thousand followers. I didn't have a TikTok account And Chey Bars was flying mad organically. Fair in mind, this is all in lockdown y. so I'm having all this mad virality, but I haven we haven't left the house in two years. I haven't been outside, you know what I mean? So then Labels are asking, but they'reking to send music they're saying you know, COvid presrictions we' allowed to call on meetings.. Oviously my manager is like, I just sit there send music I'm goinging n. and And he said, do you mean nah? And I'm like any of them that want to hear music have to come and meet me. And it was partly because I knew I didn't quite have the record that I know they're going to want. Do you know what I mean? I hadn't had Oliver Twist yet. And the first people that come The first people at the door in a day. this is in this tiny little container studio. Bear in mind, some of them have been like, okay, well we're not coming then because we're not allowed. I'm like, cool then you're going to be label at Mr Ari. That's fine. No no problem. You're very confident this. But because I'd had this confidence a little bit of like this is my moment and then Siki Bars went In my head now, I'm the Oacle. I can see what's about to happen. And I'm so, so sure of it. So it didn't bother me. Like when I think about it, it was madness. I could have lost out on some big opportunities. It's a good job. It turned out allright. But Yes, so island C. ry, Island record? Island reccords. Yeah Banloy J. And I remember actually This is such a label movie I was very like, cheeky on my social still and my mom, if I used to go stud it, my mom would still make me a pat lunch, isn't it? Because like even though it's mad. Even though I'm eighteen yeah, I'm aike Even though I'm eighteen, mentally I'm still like fifteen sixteen because the world come to h wholeold, even though sixteen still too old to be have pat lunches. I used to love my old pat lunches and even she'd always put knicknacks in them and that's my favorite crisp And I took a photo and I was like, Badest crisp in England, no one can tell me anything different. Get to the studio. these lot have bought like There must have been eight hundred packets of knick knacks spread across this studio lap b up almost like, Yeahah, you know, we can see you like Nick Knacks and that was my first taste of like Forgive my language, I call it label slagness, inn't it? It's like that kind of Yeah, we do really care, do you know what I'm saying? And not that they didn't anywhere but yes,though D Dan Rlex and Sam D'ave comearm and I'm pissing with her I'm jumping around and performing in these ab. I'm doing the bobbish murder. just there's no table. you know what I mean? And that was, I think the first time my Be my manager was willing to like take this some of the way at the time. I don't think he realized I don't think any of us realized the extent of how far it was going to go that quickly. But I think that was one of the first moments Again I could see his approval. And I remember wanting his approval. this was now A new male adult figure in my life. Great point. And like he's he's he's cool. Do you know what I mean? He's got that He's in that life to know what I mean. And also he used to be an artist as well. So like he knows the game. But I remember seeing in his kind of eyes, he didn't expect the meeting to go like that. So obviously, they've left now and we've got a load of different meetings set up And he was like, that was a sick, like basasically I didn't know he was going to do that. And so the what we'd done By the time we had every label near enough knock by the end of it and we'd had this kind of thing. I was even though I was very business minded, we would sit and plan together. what we're going to say to them, what we want, but I would let him do it. So we'd come up with it together And then I would p the character of like just this cheeky young kid who's to the island of Coton and remember. I think an offer at the time, I'll speak about the money. I've never spoke about the money before, but I'll speak about it. I think what we were trying to get was sixty grand for an EP, which is like Six or seven tunes. It has to be twenty five minutes long, whatever. And remember at the time so EMI It was also under universal And a guy the industry of A ar with is, there was a guy that worked there. It might been the president, Archie his name isn't it? I'd been made aware. he was offering bit more than what everybody else. he was the only meeting we took that didn't come in real life done over the phone But I knew I wasn't going to go with him. He was and this is again like a plan. I said to my manager, I was going I'm going to use him Porn And we just threw like a wild figure out there. I think Archie had offered Something like seventy or eighty And We had told Ireland that he had offered a hundred fifty for two singles. So not even a project and obviously hadn't done They were just so mesmerized by like my carts and I played and all these people to come to the meetings were like, well,, we'll match it, we'll match it tonight Iight. And so yeah got that over the line. and it was It was it was one and fifty per single. We got so two songs three hundred grand I'd never I hadn't seen a thousand pounds in my life at this point. You know what I'm saying? So this is Wist to. You'reeen. eighteen mental. It's one of these where you've probably just now seen more money than your mother has made. Yeah. and at the time where I was living, we'd been We had to leave Port Slade, couldn't afford that. Th then we've been kicked out in one of the houses in Werin went to another house in Werin and then just been told that we had to leave that one. Reardless, we were leaving that house. You know what I mean? And within that time frame, I had gotten that money and so it was like, it doesn't matter now, Do you know what I mean? Like I don't know what our plan was going to be. I don't. I have to ask my mom like, what was going happen if If I didn't bl at that point, I probably would have been like scrap some money together and move somewhere else again. know what I mean? So what did you do with the money pissed out the wood I didn't Yeah. with that first three hundred. I didn't save Kenny, even for a tax man, I didn't even know what tax was. at a time. Tell I know, because obviously you get one hundred fifty up frront and then the other one hundred fifty Once everything's done. At the time, I'd made a limited company like a week before company's house, made a revolute or a styling bank or whatever it was and then get a notification while I'm playing Call of Duty with my bedroom and one hundred fifty just landed in my bank. Like. I remember the first first things I went and bought I went to Selfridgge in London and dropped like seven grands on every Stone Island jumper I could find. obsessed with Stone Island. I got every color Ralph Loren Polo. Yeah. E like the orange and blue justust like ones that you like wouldn't even go with nothing, like just mad abstract Ralph Loren pololos. A Gucci man bag A black raaler in track suuit, that was later than the outfit that I wore for for six AM and then The rest of it got put on I was getting like you can get like these apartment hotel things in London.'s like it's not Airbnbs they're like hotels but each one is an apartment. I was just getting them and just It was a waste of money. What I was doing was getting them in London. But because I didn't know any girls in London, I was just bringing the girls up that I knew from Brighton to London to get pissed off I love have a good time and need at like Yeah. Yeah, all went to nothing, basically. Yeah You're eighteen You're eighteen. so then Take me through through the highlights of being on top because it feels like you went from that. which was a monumental moment for you, but then things got just bigger. Yeah, it went mad. like so we' done six AM Um And we actually shot at sixM. And these times all my friend, I'm like, I'm bright and famous now. So now all my friends are getting in the videos and they're around and we're staying at hotels and we had we had birds at the hotels like the night before because now in my head I am acting This like rock star Lvestock T and Waynard followed me from Cheeky Bars DM me After six AM one was just like, Yo bro, you're cold Yeah, it's like it all happened so quickly. So these apartment hotels that I was going to that I was telling you about are now one of these again, got a few pows with me, a few birds there, whatever And it's a code to get him in past midnight the receptionist obviously goes home. It's a code to get in And some G wagons pulled up, couple blacked up cars Bar man, let these cars are full Most of them have got balleies on in it So I'm like, obviously I've heard like not hrories but this is London, you know, I'm this little eighteen year old boy from Briad. I don't really know what I'm doing. I ain't got no security with me. some I jumped out and I're like, Yo, yo, off the code And I was like again, the best way to navigate the situation is to just put my big smile on Oviously I had my hood up on it, but I've taken my hood down and you know, like S friendly whatever, then like what is that idea here? So I'm like, all my days that I've just been like fine love bumom, bum. And then I'm like, yeah, yeah, who's that taking a b off his te on Way So Haze Bridging was having a birthday Like the floor above us She's like yo, come up, S yo And I was out of my depth, you know, they've got like, model birds in there. I'm there with like, you know like some girls from Brighton and like they're kind of just like friends from school. but we all looking back now I met and looking at even videos of me, I looked very young and like we all felt quite young and obviously he's there like loads of his bs and's Jack everywhere and birds. but he was talking to me about body. like, yah, we're gonna He didn't have the remix yet they'd done the original. I don't know if the original was out or not. I always forget that part but he like, yeah, we're gonna do our remix L like bom my b you on it. And then Sat yeayah cool And I remember at the time, He was advise I'm not going to say the person's name because we get along findine that, but adviseed by someone high up within his labor at the time that he shouldn't get me on it. that basically I didn't deserve the opportunity just yet It was too early. don't really know where my career is going to go or like if it if it's just like a little a blip, which is obviously a lot of the time it is But Tion's always had a mad foresight, I believe, in terms of like spotting people early. and he's like that. And he brings people in as well. What do you think it was about you, the situation that M T on push through the advice not to put you on that song because because clearly that song was that's another massive moment. massive moment. That's like to some people, that's the start. No I mean, unless you are Not I mean, if you're even an average fan, you might know Chiky Bars at six AM, but like in terms of like global and commercial commercial his body is the start of all of that, right? I didn't act like I was hard. I was smiling. It was very like Cheeky Chappy was the only way I put that is me, wasn't inuthentic, you know what I'm saying? I think He bought into that and I don't know saw something. Yeah. so he put you on And you said that a lot of people may think that was the beginning. But why so Be becausecause that song won a mobile award You went on mobile, went number one in England, it went number one in France, it went won number one in Australia, I think. you got like I think it got six or seven number ones. I don't run wild like that. It's incredible. Mental How did that song change Y your careareer It was mad because we knew it was going to happen and it was actually delayed so that wrote I wrote quite a few verses for it And then we ended up going with the one that we believe will go the most viral. We knew this was the moment. It's like we could super flex the pen. and I did a bit But it wasn't like that's not the goal of this right now. The goal of this is to capture everyone. The first line has got to be like, what didn't he just say? whichich is obviously it did happen which is for everybody. Who hasn't seen was your first? It was in the state of our body If I be I wearing a johny, that's the line that went off. And I think Tion and Rus were very intentional of like They covered each area, I isays like Fo fore in America. Bugsy Malone, Manchester, Ari Brighton, obbviously those guys from London like then they had Darker like the female artists like E base that could have been covered was covered It was five days in. it was going it wasn't super viral wasn't and we were like Maybe it's not going to have this mad moment and then literally overnight I said I think it was the sixth day. is it went number one on the second or third week The sixth day America I picked up on it and I was seeing like All like the corny like dances being done to it and like the frat boys doing it. Mia Khalif I' done a TikTok to it. So at this point, I'm losing my mind. and I still don't at this point really understand TikTok. My label had made me make an account And I was telling them like this app's just gonna be some phase. I this. No one to use this. But how does that then change your career Um Well, obviously, it just goes Absolutely bonkers. We had to restructure the whole plan and at the same time of like body being done, we were going in studio And again my manager out of the timewn is very honest. none of the songs were the right ones. So we were I recorded like three or four in this one session with a producer, engineer called Jo Jo And my manager had fell asleep, which is never a good science in a studio essally. And then I'd put the beat on for Oliver Twist. It was just a YouTube beat. And the maddest thing is I wrote Oliver Twist. day You know I told you about that notification one hundred and fifty comment I wrote all over the twist that day And I was on Facetime to my bedrom when the money landed. And I was on FaceTime to him, I was playing call of duty in my room and I was going through YouTube beats. L I weren't like I weren't properly playing it. It's just like, you know, like, you're playing online with your friends. likeike he's in a lobby and I'm quitting and whatever. I was like AFK so I'm scrolling through beats. And so I wrote The hook and the verse or some of the first verse while on FacTime to my mate. So I've got like C call of Juty on, he's there, Money's just landed, beats player. the most ADHD environment ever That is that is. And then Yeah, I then I'd realized this is six. I was like, o I'm going to end it I'm th myself into this so then wrote the rest of that song because e I didn't know how good it was. So I'm recording all these other ones that I believed were better And then I played the beat. I said the first line. I just wanted some more I'll have a twist because before I record, I wrapped the song like I've got a couple powers in the studio and that with me and the engineer obviously. And my manager on my life sat up like the undertaker, like was fast asleep in his chair out And then herby of that line sat up and was like record that That's the one. I have two surprises for you. Okay. If I can.es Ready for this first one? I go yeah. All right I would like for you to read this O there So smileyryy on the front, I can I can make a decent assumption as to who wrote this one You know what's funny is Something was nearly reveal to me within this moment and I thought someone might have approach my mom and my mom is a terrible liar and I was in the car ear the other day. And I was like, have you' ever been asked any questions about this? And she lied so well, I genuinely believed her. She's like, I don't even know what you're talking about. You ask her she. If she had been approached by you guysy or have anybody had asked her? I just had a feeling, you know what I mean Your mom is a legend. An Ivan, she is a legend Dear Riley When I was asked to write this letter, I thought, We talk so much What can I possibly tell him that he doesn't already know? But then I thought, offtten I send you songs that remind me of you or our relationship. and that's other people's words So here in mind From the day that I knew you were coming into this world I loved you. Why I didn't know is what a force you would be to reckon with You defied all stages you were meant to be at walking and talking before I could blink You had this light in you that shone so brightly by little smiley Riley I would always say This boy has been here before. She did used to say that a lot. I used to I used to think fuck does that even mean? but yeah I used to say this boy had been here before Your ability to read emotions in a room and the empathy that you radiated was and still is wondrous But I often wonder at what cost to you I hope you know what a beautiful human you've grown to be When I think back to your teen years I'm so glad that I hung ono those battle robes no matter how hard you tryed to shape them There's nothing a cheese ham Chorizzo and chili mayo soab can't fix. I told you I like my mom's packed lunches and I know. You tell the truth No matter how mad I get slash got at things you did slash do sneaking off to Essex to an Essex studio at fourteen. I could never and still can't stay mad at you You have all this to come and I'm so grateful to be able to be part of this new chapter of life that is unfolding I've never been so proud of watching the man you were during your daughter. daughter's journey into the world The devotion, support and the way you advocated for your love, your baby's mummy was beautiful It gave me a glimpse of the dad that you are going to be I always think it's a funny statement when people say about your music career. You must be so proud of him because you are doing what you always wanted to do from the age of five and your first karaoke machine What fifty cuffs, which is a line from the Oliver twwists the line is what fisty cuffs I used to say because I couldn't quite get my words out what fifty cuffs and that was one of the songs I used to perform. I'd do anything that was that Um What I am proud of is your tenacity, your belief in yourself and your work ethic 's something I know you will pour into your daughter. If I can give you one piece of advice, it's not about parenting hacks or how to raise her, it's simply Listen to the little things Because if you listen to the little things, she'll tell you the big things, even if the big things make you want to explode inside And so thank you for always trusting me with the little things I will love you as long as the stars are above you Please don't ever feel like you're less than perfect even if you do start to dress and dance a bit like your dad. Amazing. is perfect. Absolutely perfect How's it feel like get that from your mom? Yeah, I don't really know what to do with myself now I feel childlike a little bit You know what I mean? Like I've just been snk The first prais is that I got song when I perform for the first time is how I feel reading that letter So that's obviously making me a little bit fishy as well. Yeah. I could see. yourour body language has changed. yeah. while there's this I think some people say it's uneasy to me It is like you've gone back. Yeah that little boy. Yeah. and he's getting that approval. that he always f he needed elsewhere that he always had right there the whole time working on a great initiative with ID Mobile and Mental Health UK. Science tells us that hearing a voice over a call lower our stress Boost our mood and even help us to rebuild connections So they're asking you to ditch the texts and make it a call instead I'm going to admit something to you. I'm ronic texture. I'm the worst person in the world to front this. You're not going to listen to me Why would you? You might listen to someone you know. So I had an idea Flow with me on this For the next few weeks, instead of ads with me in them I'm giving up this seat right here to those people who've been waiting for you to phone them. And for the next few episodes, you'll be hearing from them instead of me So these folks will have just one ask Ditch the text and make it. How to take this? Hey there. I just want to share a content warning This episode includes discussion of addiction. If you or someone you know needs support, we've included resources in the show notes Please take care while watching So Oliver Twist Here's the thing that I'm most interested about that is uh, that you said that when you were a young boy. You would perform Oliver Twist. A didn't it the most full circle moment ever So again at this point, I'm like I am the oracle The world is revolving around me like I what I command. is coming into my life, you know what I'm saying? that's the way I'm feeling at that time.ike it's almost like like a god complex a little bit J Exactly. So this is where I wanted to go because you're still what you're nineteen Yeah, just turned nineteen. Yeah, you just turned nineteen. I'm bearing in mind as well. L what I say to people a lot. And it's something that eventually made me ended up in a dark place at some point and it was hard to navigate because I had turned eighteen in lockdown All this happened. Even Body was like still kind of lockedd down. L the world haven't gone back to normal. byy the time clubs and just public spaces were open again. I never experienced the world in adulthood. As somebody Wh wasn't somebody. You know what I mean? I've never queued up. for a club I've never attended a club as like a I wouldn't say a normal person because obviously I am a normal person, but you know what I mean? It's like it's been bottles and I haven't had the feeling of being turned away or like, do you know what I'm saying? I thinkt get to experienceced none of that It's been VIP. And obviously I'm not getting a little violent up because it was a blessing, Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah. But no, but I think it's all interesting. Yeah And especially too is right around that time, eighteen, nineteen You're trying to figure out your identity. Yeah, whoo are you? But then Y album comes Yes, all right So in the album, Number two in the UK album chart. Yeah Crazy. is man. So stayed in the charts for thirty three weeks as well because a lot of artists will get like a chart position And then it will fly out the next week. It stayed in the charts for thirty three weeks, It's over half a year. wild my horn a little bit. Yeah I mean be proud of that. come on. Yeah. I mean it's just success after success after success. All right. so now What when you reflect back in that period? What was the highest high for you What was the moment that just still it feels surreal? It could be performing at a festival somewhere. It could be meeting someone who you never thought you would meet. But what's the surreal moment? It was all so fast. I don't know if I could pin it to one moment. There's a few So like Byan, Mum My mom wanted my mom had a mini, but it was an old mini. My momum's favorite car dream car has always been a mini And so herer partner, who's now her husband bought her the on she had. I kind of one off him and bought a brand new me. that made her cry That was a surreal moment. So theni, what about What's then darkest period because with with light comes shade. Yeah. Um, I don't necessarily know if I had would have known at a time it was the darkest period, but like with all of this that wasn't the solution There's still something I'm yearning for. I'm still like problematic. I'm still constantly trying to numb myself. You have to remember like I said, you' the first time I've tried any substances of any form was like twelve.y the time I'm fifteen me and my mates again Pasted all the time. And we're all problematic kids, you know what I'm saying? I now know that. It was a confusing time because it didn't make me sad. I wouldn't say that my darkest point was also my highest point But I wouldn't say to you, any of that period was my highest point. I would say I was super, super numb because it was Like I was not happen what I was rapping. We was roock star living. we was doing a lot. like the video shoot. I've never like I never really dove into kind of my habits or like how bad it eventually got I mean, I suppose here's the place to do it. Yeah. I mean, I think I think what's so helpful about this is that lookingooking at the image I wouldn't know that you were entirely numb Noah And I could I could turn it on like that. So Oliver Twist music video We shot in two parts. And so for the first day, We' done like the tattoo shop scene. The scene of me on the I three hundred sixty, the red jacket of my maates and the whole day. We was drinking, I'm doing balloons, I'm doing whatever else in the video shooters and I'm doing this at work, which and it it's normalized. This is my first like proper high production video shoot. again Part of my thing, not even just as a brand, but as like a person, My whole thing was like no one cannot drink me No one can outfy me and again That's what my old man used to say to me like when I was a kid and we used to have a few drinks or we' get up to whatever. he was when you wantan to shot out a title, come for it. So on that shoot though, you're saying that you drink the whole time. The whole time, I'm off like by the end of it, that tattoo scene of me I'm tattooing Adiola This is obviously after the bodyline has gone off, she's in the shock I'm Yeah, I'm pissed out my head, but in that scene when I look back at it like you can see it in my eyes as well. I've done Because in the video shoot, I keep swigging a bottle, which they wanted, but they told me, yo donon't actually sip it I mean, I want like I'd get annoyed at people for saying shit like that to M meill L what? You you think to my fans I'm going to fake the lifestyle that And then the next So we had to do a pickup shoot, half the video was done Second d. Okay. I'd gone out the night before U and was doing, I'll let people draw their conclusions. I'm clubbing at drinking girls' pies u'm I've ended up back at some random Un Unica U I've never spoken about any of this before, but says It feels weird to me to speak about because in that time, this was a big part of my life that we quite intentionally hid like like because the cheeky fun he's the life and a party guy that is less endearing if you were to see the full extent of it and we were aware of that U I'm so gl we kind of hit it. even like slightly from my label. So forgive me if I like stutter a bit because I'm not used to talking about it, you know what I'm saying? And I remember checking a tim And I was ignoring my manager. My plan was to not turn up to this. this is the start of my career. I'm doing this already. And it's like, I look back like, how could you be so almost self destructive and detrimental to something that wanted and's so arful for so long. We've got in the car I'm saying to my manager You can't him to a video showo, I'm not doing it. And he's like, this is your own doing. And they have spent money and this is you are too early. in this sign in and in this relations. And he was one hundred percent right. I don't think he was like force in me or like exploit it. He was saying like this is your own doing and what do you want us to do? Everybody's there. So you're going to have to go down Oh at least I again I'm an adult, you what I'm saying? I'm like a little boy at this point in my tos like n, c't d. So I'm absolutely finished. These I haven't slept for like what wass it? over twenty four hours now So I've gone out at ten o'clock at night. It's now like one o'clock in the afternoon the next day. I'm still going keepeep myself goinging. I'm drinking still. and doing whatever else. But as soon as you' that action The smile was on you pop it eyes wide open. L I don't think you would watch that video and could tell that on one half of the shoot day, I hadn't slept It's sad for me to say, but someome of those moments around I'm supposed to be so, so up I'm notock down I'm not really up Eil that. I'm basically just I'm not always pissed up, but even when I'm not pissed up, I'm in autopilot mode. like I'm very detached because my my whole character or essence that I'm selling, even though it is me It's a role that I'm playing and have developed from I Young wanting something child. And I was constantly like escaping myself person who hadleies feelings and like u dealt with mentalities and problems. Try Vent in to let's say like a pal that you grew up with who is working on site Bick lay and Monday to Friday. and try to like vent your pain to them and see how they react and then see if you'll ever do it again because you don't. you're like, well It's falling on deaf ears. I'm still struggling to make ends meet. and I'd swop v youiew in a heartbeat type shit, you know what I mean? So then you stop doing that like Why would I then be vulnerable C you start to feel guilty? feeling shit still. I was like, why do I still feel shit, do you know what I mean? when you keep that in opposed to inventing it to someone. What does that do to you? Um, I got like I had this weird complex whereas like I said to you earlier like I hate sympathy And then I'm feeling sorry forself. and then I'm angry at myself, I' feeling sorry myself and say But the solution to all of it was always drink drugs and party The celebratory drink of drugs and pie and I feel like shit so I'm gonna go blow off steam drink drugs and party in Yeah, I againain, it just led to more numbing. Do you believe you had an addiction hundred percent hundred percent and I've always been very careful we're wary of speaking on this becausecause I didn't want to be the person that touches in all of this Anden still carries on doing it. So just for like context, me, not being drunk. from and on whatever else from January to what is it now nearly April. Ap That's the longest I've been sober since I was twelve years old L which is a long time. That's profound. Eespecially now having a kid that makes me sad like and I say it that to my momum and there's I'm sure' touch on them. like there are loads of times where My mum was super worried about me because like I said, with all of those highs and everything like you say, like me having that go complex hit after hit after hit and Australia tour Europe tour and all these tours I was doing craziness I was doing, again, like what I thought rock stars did and it was like trashing hotel rooms and having people like stupid amounts of people back for after parties and like again just doing everything I thought I should be doing and then you you have like an industry low where maybe a song doesn't connect it's not hit after hit after hit forever. You have the industry is waves and I'm aware of that now. But when you come into an industry So of clean off the bat like nothing went wrong Even a little moment like I remember a song about mine Hello Mate. This is a summer record we'd done, but it went number thirty in the charts. Amazing. That's a good outcome. wasasn't for Milo abbsolutely like That's not it. I've gone number one, number five, number four, like Flowers was in the chart. So I had Ed Ceran, Adele Alton and John. They would have people always like this surrounded by a good company and it levels, good company. You know that can you address this if you're willing to talk about this is You had so many There were industry plant accusations. Yeah. You know, and I want to so we found so compleplex magazine They were talking about what an industry plan is because people will you know, debate over the definition. So compleomx that an industry plan is an artist whose success comes from their music industry connections rather than their artistic merit or genuine interest from fans So this could include labels using paid social posts and manufacturing viral trends. Yeah Were you an industry plan? Absolutely not It makes me laugh. How could I have been? I'm the white rapper from Brighton. You got that that has to be received well. otherwise it doesn't go. You can pump ten million quid into that from the jump if I'd have been pumped like that from the jump It wouldn't have worked because you have to have that validation, especially I believe anyway, in rap and hip hop like You have to earn your right because it's not a about. L especially I think the term industry plant doesn't exist anymore full stop today. Even for pop acts, if you look at like I call it like the Simon Cow method of like taking different people and planting it like because of social media and because of algorithms and stuff It just doesn't work. L the even how label structures work nowadays, like you get signed and they'll sign you forile whever march and whatever, it's still your job to get their record off the ground. I have to do the TikTok. comments have to engage in it. People, real life human beings have to use the sound. like you can't C inauthentically, do that, I mean? It's one of those where Every, I think notot every, but many of the artists that I've talked to who have had extreme success in a short period of time, people will say industry plant. I remember when I young bllood sitting right here Yeah. and there were accusations industry plant And what he was trying to underscore was how much pre workk Yeah, you just don't see it. Yes. I'm saying. And then also an aspect that we haven't talked about specifically, but you've mentioned a few times, you're like And I'm a white rapper Let's talk about Be a white rapper. Yeah in the industry It was a weird one. I'm also not blind to like I think I've always put it as it's a little bit harder. to get people to be interested at first. as a white wrapper because it's not typically a white space. And then especially I was very aware of the fact that I was alsoso my lyrical content and what I was rapping about Obviously it's like not just white people partie, but it was more typically that world. I'm talking about drugs and parties and turning up and lit and obviously everybody does that, but how I was portraying it fell very White with' no better terms to put it, Do you know what I'm saying? Yes, yes. And so I was aware of that as well. and some people didn't like that and it's completely understandable, Do you know what I mean, especially when and hip hop and the culture itself, the essence is esssentially how it started was a voice. those who wanted their stories to be heard and you go back to like mob deep and all that kind of stuff. That's where I say like the essence of hip hop. And obviously, this is different because we're in UK and it's an offspring of grime that we're doing and it's drilled now and it's obviously all evolved. So Um Yeah, there was a lot of awareness and I'm also aware that Once it went in terms of how these labels view it and I'm not saying this is right by the way, either How they vite as a business is like OK, well he's a UK artist and H's what's cool. And it's made cool by the culture And now this white guy is a face more there are more white people in the UK Then there are any other ethnicity, you know what I'm saying? And so their dollar science in their eyes start going catching because people are drawn to what they can relate to, Janat I'm saying. And so there's definitely unfair benefit in that And so I always tried to like it's a weird complex. I always tried to make sure that people knew I was Aware. So then do you feel like you were used part by the industry because You were white Um in terms of what, like other artists or Yeah so so in terms of Um rap music Right? Because I think this to me, this is such a fascinating topic because What I'm understanding from you is that You came out with these very vulnerable Yeah, very story it was all storytelling And I'm with you. I mean, I'm from New York I'm from the origins of h essence, you know what I'm saying That's the essence. It was it was, as we used to say, I like, it was the CNN of the streets. Yes. It was saying exactly what was happening. What was going on? Yeah. Yeah. And it wasn't it didn't start a party L did it did not like Yeah, that come about I believe more like dip set and like the locks and that that was when rap startred changing a little bit. eror. it definitely changed And I would say even preceding that a little bit, you know, it has started to change Yeah. But it started from, yes, a very This is the struggle. This is our struggle. And this is our struggle as a bllack culture. this is our struggle. Yeah yeah, exactly. And so for you to say that, you know, if the record company saw me And they were like, you know what becausecause I'm white They could use me to reach these fans who were predominantly white And I could speak to it And on top of it, I'm not going to, they don't want you to speak about struggle yourour struggle coming up. They want you to speak about partarty lifestyle, popping' pills, et cceter. Yeah. So then being said, do you feel like Literally they used you because you or white I don't know. I don't think I don't think necessarily the label or like the record label industry use me because was that was me. They didn't instruct me. to make that kind of music. That was the music I was making, Do you know what I'm saying? Especially at that time. I hadn't even played any of the labels, any of the deep pain stuff Because even from a management level and just people around me level It was very clear that it didn't quite connect like with who I am as a person, evenven though I have that side to me and I believe that as an artist, as time goes on, you unveil layers of your artistry. and so I have revealed L in later songs, you know what I mean? But It's like you have a main brand It's like McDonald's sells. the big Mac and then they obviously they have other stuff and there's fries and d there has to be There has to be the brand because I am Aardi brand as well as I'm a person. and so there has to be structure to that. I would say that using There might have been like me feeling like being used by Satertain artists or like being put on certain records to sell to a demographic that maybe that artist didnn't initially sell to, Do you know what I mean? that weren't being taken to as much But notah yeah, I don't I don't think so much like industry may I don't know I don't know. Yeah. I feel like it it's a tough it'ss it's a tough topic. And even before you came in here, what I didn't realize was How grounded you were in your Um you know, in your lyricism in your vulnerabilities early on. Yeah. I thought it was party party party. O, old l. but what I see is That's not what it was. Noah, not at all. And I also see that you It was a performative party All of these reasons, your father trying to, you know, trying to U You know, trying to impress others in order to get consence. And I might not imagine like even in rooms or guening that even within Wed like with're in this conversation Like I haven't I'm not sitting there saying consciously or intentionally I've tried to impress you, but I know what you do. I know that you you dive into psychology and you dive into minds. And so within this conversation, I have flexed my capability to be able to dive into my own mind. and I'm still aware of that. then it can If I think about it too much it will snowball because it's like I'm constantly aware but I'm still doing it. is it a choice or Is it? something that's just second nature to me in everything I do, I don't know. I mean so. Yes, yes. So then ultimately, I think what it boils down to is is like if you think about you at your essence, then Who is RD? Well yeah at your core Who are you Hi, I'm Kim and this is for you Jos. My lovely brother. Welcome to I. age after the town You know it was my new's resolution a couple of years ago to text you once a week I think we should level it up now we should take it to the next stage And we should pick up the phone even if it's to commiserate about arsenal I love it when be watching an arrsenal match together because I can see all your like emotions. But even if we're not together, you can always pick up the phone so I can like He, the hot ripp in your voice Mum and mm and treat me like I'm a thirty two year old child and like to know where I am at all times and track me and find my friends. We don't need to go that far with you, but just a little check in once in a while would be lovely. Maybe like on the way to work, on the way home from work, whenever you get like a quiet moment. The Last time we spoke on the phone was for your son's birthday, but I wasn't really chagged to you, I was chagged to him The conversation was probably about Ten minutes and of that I think I spoke to you for about one minute I know having a kid, your life is very busy, but I'm sure we can make time for each other How do you think a call change the relationship with your brother I don't know how different you are from your sibling Ver, very yeah. ye. It's nice to have a different perspective But just be silly with each other over the phone My brother's very like routine then, right? But I'm very like loosey Goosey. I see it, I see it. But like it's nice as well. like he will remind me sometometimes I need to slow down. Yes. And I'll remind him that maybe you can be a bit more spontaneous, right? Yes When you said that, I was thinking to myself Has there been a time where I felt heavy or distraught after talking to my brother never. There go. Yeah, I feel lighter. He's always teaching me about something that I have no idea about that ends up making my life better it's really cool I feel like I should call. I'm inspired We are in partnership with IDMobile and mental health UK We want you to ditch the text Right In my conversation here with Kim, what I've learned is you should just get silly And you could only do that If you make it Everyone knows that unexplainable it factor, that smile that lights up a room, that wow. Well, it doesn't happen by itself. There's chemistry behind the charisma. Colgate Optic White Pro Series tooothpaste removes fifteen years of deep set stains when you brush twice daily for two weeks. How? The clinically proven formula is powered by Colgate's hydrogen peroxide complex. It works at the molecular level to gently dissolve stains deep within the enamel where your brush can't reach. It's proof that daily routine can be remarkable. That's the science of Wow, Colgate Optic White This summer, Prime Vide takes you back before legally blonde, before law school, and into the world of Elle Woods in high school. Set in nineteen ninety five, this Gemini vegetarian knows exactly who she is until her family moves from Belair to Seattle. Packed with iconic fashion, nineties nostalgia, and a throwback soundtrack, Elle proves one thing Law school was hard. High school was harder. From the world of legally blonde, watch L, a new original series only on Prime videoide. Watch now. Yeah and not I mean, I've always wrongfully or rightfully I've always pinned it on my dad with dislike I've always sought after attention, especially like male attention and male older attention and like fill in this hole of like, okay that's that's the male figure we're going to look up to for the next three weeks or this season or whatever it is. It's like the first time I met him was On a holiday in Cyprus when I was late nine or ten can't an age. And were you aware that you were going to meet her? No, I don't even know if my mom knew he was going to be there. He he does He's been a man of many things, but he u t time he was doing something called TimesShare. And I don't know if I don't think we'd plan to go over there to meet him. I think he happened to be in a resort and my n was like should Yeah, yeah. And so. But so there was and then that was never structed. So like the next time I see him was when I was you know whatever But no but I mean, but let's talk about it because because you're notine So you're nine, you're on holiday. Yeah. it's you, your nan, your mom I'd have to Mbe my mom did go over for us to see him. As far as I'm aware It was sheer pot luck He happened to be on the resort, but don't I don't know. All right. you'd have to ask her But from your perspective, your nan was like That's your dad. Yeah. And it was I always remember my nan being a prominent figure and my like that's like, you are so much like your old man. I have a voice in my head. anyytime I say to someone that I was told it' h. It's my nan's voice that I think officer. Okay So you're nine. Your nan tells you, there's your father right there on the resort. So what's going on for you in that moment? And how does that was the first thing that you two say to each other I don't remember the first thing you said to each other. I remember the first thing I' done There was like, I was in the swimming pool and jumped out and gave him a big hug, but also F feeling I thought of even when you' just saying it was being filled with pure fear and I don't know why. There wasn't like a relief of there's my dad. L it was a foreign concept site was I I assume my body went into a bit of like fight or flight mode. you know I mean? And it like first conversation I remember having as he was shy me two but one was called My mom was calledool Christina. I don't know how much you're going want me to talkking about this, but it's cool because I've told him the first conversation you have with him. Yeah, the first one I remember, probably isn't, Jonathan was saying. It was It was made very clear to me that you are not too mention Kat in front of Christina And you are not to mention Christina in front of Kat And a result of that I've got U Assassin's Creed for the DS, which is the game I wanted. It's obviously a fifteen or it might be an eighteen. Assassin's Ced for the DS and guitar hero And my dad chose a guitar hero, I chose Asassin's Creed. So I mean, in essence, he bribed you. Yes, He bribes you with video games. Yeah, I don't think I don't remember it like that. I remember it as like, I wasn't going to do it anyway because my dad told me so This is the first moment for me This guy that I just met this figure, I mean Again, mild man's is a madman, but he has a ge character and presence and even within the country of Cyprus, like they people that are recognizing him and he's the governor inn it?, that's how I fel anyway and that's how I come across. And so this guy was superman now. like I' just almost starstruck by him and that that later developed kind of every time I linked him. but Yeah, I remember going back to my mom and I had these two games and She was kicking off. I remember hearing them might not argue but she's pointing at Assassin's Creed,s obviously the clues is in the name,'s you're assassinating people My myother. She's I different think that's appropriate And you think that obvious hes laughing and he's likeh, And he took the rap. I said, well Which whichich one did he want? And he was like, yeah, he wanted a guitar hero I thought I'd get him that one. and I remember the feeling of like this guy's cool as fuck like Be I wanted that game. and I knew I wasn't allowed that game and I'd said I wasn't allowed that game. And he was like, Yeahah, go and have it last see it. And took a rap for it. Do you know what I'm saying? I see it. I see. So I mean That is, I think, a very interesting interion.ala withith your father. I mean, from the fear to immediately hugg to then spending the night with him and then him basically, you know, presenting all of that. When you When you reflect on that because you've had a lot of years to think about that. Yeah Do you feel like you got? what you needed from him. in that early interaction I don't know because it's always like Well the grass could be greener on other sides or But did you get what you need? You know, because and this is the reason why I push on this is that U already, I mean, we've just met, but already I could tell You're stoic. in that You don't want anyone to feel any bit of shame you. Yeah, I hate it.. I sayay to my mom all the time like, I cannot de very well. with sympathy. like I hate people feeling sorry for it. It's not my thing. Yeah. That's why I'm always like I said you when we first got L like, I'm I'm I've always been super comfortable with these open vulnerable conversations because if I sat here like this and like you're like and how does that feel like I remember I was put through loads of different like therapy. people when like we have somecohehicle cams in the UK where it's like child psychology, like there' people I go to see I hated all of them because they'd speak to you really softly and like And they try and take you down this path. And I used to I mean, I was troubble kiding it, but I used to intentionally. I'd know the path they would trying to take me down and take them down this road and then they'd realize that I was having them on and that would be when I exploded because I can see what you're trying to do and you're pissing off. I don I don't want to be a full stop I've been forced to be here and you don't know me. so Yes, I've never been good at dealing with that. I see it. I can see it.. But I think the challenge in this is that because this is all about you and us being able to Uh step inside of how you were thinking and feeling. Yeah. I'm just wondering If you meet your like I'm trying to put myself in your shoes. If I'm meeting my father for the first time Do I do I think I got what I need what I needed which you need? Probably not defeinitely didn't feel like that that time at the time. rightight. Just that encounter more than what I needed. I didn't know it was what I was missing. It's like The only way I can describe it is like as a child, you have this massive hole. in your kind of heart or heads or like weird distant memory that you don't really know and you have no idea what it is And then is like Riley as a child is a big jigsaw puzzle and there's There's like four jigaw pieces missing. And meeting this man is like Now in hindsight, it's like one jigsaw puzzle mee as a child, I've duplicated, so I've made him all four And It's not been put in But I can see I can see the piece now. Yeah I mean, it's with you L' with you. So then How does the relationship with just your father, how does that then evolve over time. And Yeah, I mean, it was like obviously after that point, I don't really know like the intervals or what the ages were. A lot of it's a blur, but like throughout my childhood I was told more and more kind of the story. My first impression was always like he just up and leftifed. you know what I mean? Like thatad and notough and that that and And he's got How many kids have you got? F So I've got and so like one lives in Brighton other ones. O'es in Cyprus, another They are two li in Branon. They' dotghted about everywhere, but I'm He was How do I put it? He was a bit of a naughty guy Let's say, yeah People can connect those dots,ever if they't want connect those dots I'm not going start inciminating or going into major details of that. but Eesssentially he pads O kind He made a choice. He could have done more of a man and maybe dealt with certain issues or problems that were going on or obtained some kind of money or like I don't know how I would have fixed it. to be honest, M might giveing his jews and that the best solution in terms of the safety for like My mum and me and my brother, he had to leave the country. so he didn't just leave and walk out my mom and stayed in England. he'd fled. onlynly up until really recently he doesn't come Brighton a lot because said there's a lot of history for him here. but when we did see him and he would take us to like the park or whatever, this would be like there'll be years in between. It wasn't like, okay now that you've met her dad, I always have a conversation with my mum about this recently like. It wasn't now that you've met your dad You're going to see him every other week. He's going to come I way say to my mom probablyro would have helped a little bit with the feeling of like this constant yeararning for attention. because if anything, I always say meeting him and then disappear in fver long until you decide it's fine you come back What's not What can I what can I do then? how can I get this attention from this guy? Because also when I'm with him, I'm so idolizing him. is youu for it, man. And I feel I believe all like majority of young men probably look at their dads that way no matter what it is your dad does, but especially when you're rolling around brighting with him and There are certain characters that seem a bit, you know, and they're like he what you what I'm saying and things that I remember we walked past one chip shop one time and there was a guy Huge guy having a mad rle. with someone, I think that person had owed this huge guy of money And he' picked him up and put him through you like when you like like a burger shop they have like the window, He throwned him through the window. so my dad had like stopped and like moved back and he'd put this wind glass everywhere. I'm super shit of myself. I've never done anything like this. And then the guy who'd done it, my dad one was up , what are you saying?? He's like, Yeah how are you being? These are my boys. And I'm like being introduced to this guy that's just put ger windows And you're looking like, wow, my dad. This is just mad callool to me. like none obviously looking back like not loads of it is great, but also I'm not like resentful like that was wrong. He shouldn't do this. I don't have that viewpoint. Maybe I would I don't know. Yeahah I just I'm a big believer in everything happens for a reason and this is my story. I'm not a big believer in like resenting made you into who you are, do not I But I get it that I mean you' You viewed your dad as your superhero. Yeah, yeah, yeah. wanted to. And I think most boys do anyway, but this added mystery of like, well, what is it that he does? and my mam allowed all that? L she was never Your dad's a bad person. she never slated him off. The stories that I eventually got told over time. were via him that were been verified by her. but she never My momum's a great person. I think she allowed for us to meet in for he was. and so I didn't have any like is literally zero conception of him Yes at all. Yeah. I mean, Yes before that point. Yes. you know, I'm willing to bet that but you'll have to' have to ask your mom She intentionally brought you . Yeah I don't know. I feel like maybe she knew he was in Cyprus. I don't know if he was meant to be there that day, but I'd have to ask her I' I'm pretty sure We didn't know he was going to be there. as far as I'm aware. because also my mom at this point when she when I'm nine and ten, she's with H feella U notot at the time they're together now Um So I don't know how that dynam would have worked her if they' have planned to do that knowing that he was there and stuff. He was like My mom had a boyfriend from I don't know when they started seeing each other. I remember meeting for the first time around this time. Like, that's my first kind of early memory of him, but he's in the army. so he was around like Sometimes he'd gone for Mumps at time. if he was there, he was only there for a weekend and then he had to go back to base. and that was their relationship for like, Only recently since he's been Dcharged which is like fourteen years whatever it is. That's incredible. Yeahah, That's incredible. So So then the relationship with your father It sounds like was Then just like that, it was like he would pop in Be in your life a little bit, pop out and you would wonder Where is he Yeah, I'm just like it was this atttention. I yearn for so much. And then especially because when he was here, This isn't any disrespect on knocking to my brother, but like me and my dad get along very well. and it probably stems from because I was always told You're so much like him. I played into that. and then because of the K of giza he is, he's like Iroud, Yeah like that's my boy. like blah blah blah blah blah and I would imitate him And I would see that he liked that, Do you know what I mean? That made him proud. I was like his little prodigy. down to everything in primary school now I've got three birds on the go tonight I was say I'm telling my dad's laughing like obviously he's still kind of saying, you shouldn't do that. but I can see he doesn't mean it because he's smiling like a chesthured cat while he's saying that I shouldn't do that. Do you know what I mean? Yes. Do you think your father then ended up having biggest influence on your life as a as a young boy. One million percent. even til now, I remember one of the times he calmed down He is fond of alcohol. and other things. And so being around that like when me and my brother are going to stay in a hotel with him one time I was How what was that? I think I think I was in primary school I'd year se and my brother was two years older. U What year is that? Yeah eight And Looking back now, I didn't quite know what the other substances were I can see what it was on now. Do you know what I'm saying but he'd had a few and then done that. And we were in this hotel in Brighton Station, the IBIS Hotel and he was back and forth and at the bar and we were staying in the hotel room while he was down there drinking, which is obviously unfortunate because we don't get to spend loads of time with him Do you know what I'm saying like then he's come back up and where he's drunk and he's got a lot of health problems due to lifestyle choices and stuff. and so he was in a a real bad way. and Allegedly at the time that's funny as well because sometimes he exaggerates or again, he does things put on a show and like wear it as a kid, but he had come in and was all over the place and even fell to the floor And then as far as me and my brother were aware, whether he was faking it or not, I don't know, but his heart had stopped and he wasn't breathing.. And so My brother, I remember my brother sobbing his eyes out. I remember being super frozen crying, not even really like sad And I remember like obbviously I'm twelve, so I'm lack attempting to do some formmer CPR and like get him up and like slaap in his face and like shaking him And then he like sat up and like took a breath and was like, o what happened And he was like, I you know when someone's drunk and they're like, they're talking about things that like they've obviously had a conversation in their head. like it's not really making sense to me what he's saying. so that's scary as well because you just like even know if you're talking to me or like again now I just know he was super inebriated, you know what I mean? And then like I remember trying to like roll him over or whatever. And then I remember the next day he was fine and that was kind of the start of like I didn't not you might not you would say to my brother in front of me like You might not S me for a bit like because Riley's going to obbviously experiainced her mom, what happened And then I' be like,, no, no, I'm not. And he's like No, you are, and it's fine. and then my brother would be like, No, don't like ' everyone not gonna see d there was another time. So then in that moment, then you had to decide if you're gonna to keep that. Yeah, I didn't tell my mom that, I think I only told my mom that like a few years ago. Wow, so you held that to protect your father. Yeah, yeah. And it seems like that was the relationship You protected him. Yeah. And my mama said that to me all the time. I remember L's a lot of times when I was a teenager where she used to be like, you know, he's your dad and not the other way around, yeah And I'd get annoyed because also my whole thing is like I had such a strong relationship with my mom. When I come into like late primary school and a teenager, It becomes very common for someone who to you know like your m, and none of that ever offended me Anybody spoke about my old man on any level, especially now like now that I'm a teenager I f in fourteen Any of my uncles do it anyone around me within close family, even people that know him, like No no one can't cut off Superman me, like, especially because now in my head I'm his little minini Me. Ton know what I mean So we are we are one And our relationship likeack is funny coming away from like a little bit like I say it all in hindsight now As if I' I don't still do it, but Ioubt I catch myself doing it all the time. It's so second nature, J what? I mean Y. You know, even beyond you being his mini me, it seems like you saw yourself through him. Yeah, like it was Weird it was like. I don't know how to explain it of like When everybody has said to me all these characteristics that I do have that I genuinely did have before I met him. It was weird to meet a guy that I agreed. I was so much like. And so I think there was fifty percent like This guy is exactly like me, and then the other fifty percent is like I probably wasn't exactly like him, but I filled in the gaps of the bits that I wasn't like. I made myself like him. Do know what I mean? And And then I mean, already now, I mean, you know what a father's love is now For sure. Yeah when you look back at the behavior at least that your father exhibited in that early times, Do you feel like He showed you love. Yeah. Yeah, I do. I think this is where I' not like we'll disagree because I'm sure you don't necessarily have an opinion on it. but I think love comes in all different shapes and sizes and formats. And one thing I will always say about my old man Not just me and my brother, all of his kids, even the ones that maybe he hasn't been allowed to see or like has less of a relationship with because they are not on it or whatever. He fucking loves his kids And he is problematic person with his own shit going on I don't belie it like The same way I have been problematic and hurt people or whatever That doesn't mean that I didn't love person or you know what I'm saying? It's like, I just Because of whatever I had going on, I had pretty shitty ways of showing it sometimes. orr I wasn't showing it sometimes, but it didn't mean that I didn't hold that in my heart. And this is why I don't hold anything in bad regard for better or worse. it's like version of myself that I developed is Audi like that Hey d see the state of loud in front of a bunch of characters that I've never met and owning the room and walking into places and like I own the place and like Yes I always had it in me And I believe like like I was told, you know, you're so much like the Dad and B, from that character before I met him. And so I had it in me before I'd met him, but I still believe it comes from him. And then the extra bits, die but added on top by trying to emulate him, you know what I mean? That's insightful, man. And now, you know what's interesting is is I see that becausecause it's interesting. I think I've watched now every video that you've put out you know, I've washed everything and to me The person that I've seen in those videos is exactly who you just described It's that's probably your dad. Yeah, it's a show. like and don't get it's not a million miles away from me. Right Like R. It's still it's like it's like just it's almost can I say exaggerated? exaggerated. Yeahah, one hundred percent, that's like the version of show business I always remember growing up was like you put on A show You know what I mean? Like same like I'll use Robby Williams as an example, like amazing performer. like he doesn't walk around in his day to day life. like I am Robbert Williams. This is my ar. That would be super strange, Do know what I'm saying? Right, right. That wouldd be crazy. Yeah, that would be wild. So obviously it's It's an exaggerated art form. that I And eventually for better or for worse, I started buying into buying what I was selling at some point. and I don't want him to be hurt by this because he knows I love him dearly and our relationship is now changing where playing field. there was a couple moments when the playing field became level and one of the times was like U A father's day Hey. were supposed to have come down and I'm with my partner and her sisters and her dads come And there's been three times that he was meant to come and meet my partner's dad. and for whatever reasons he's got himself into a pickle and not come And this had happened again this time of Father's Day. Father's D is a tough day for him because he lost his dad when he was and then was homeless after that And so I'm aware of that. And we now have a rule where it's like, let's just leave Father'say. because it's as I said ar before f for a little bit. but That was one of the first times Pper I'd had to go in I know that you just I know that you're a fucking liar li. just Own it. to say you went up and got pissed or like don't. like on't try bullhit a bullshit. I was like, Unfortunately for you, I am so like you. I know every single trick up your sleeve. I know all the language. I know the bravado, I know the man behind the mask because I am that same man behind that mask kind of thing And it was good for our relationship. like he's never had anybody in his life. I don't believe speak to him And it was Like it was aggressive from my front and he He's a guy that probably doesn't take Bad off blad act not. I mean. So but but but but you you were able to stand up to him. Yeah. and it it it was anger it was anger for My brother and him being confused and and where is he and like, It's just it just filled me with raraid. And so that was one of the like the first times that that feel were kind of important in that It started to unwrap. and I still idolize him. it's still something that sometimes I find myself doing by accident, sometometimes I do on purpose because he has so many great qualities and I know So some people might watch this and have an opinion of his character and I don't want it to seem him like he is just as ful bad person because he's not, he loves his kids and he's done so much for me and he's always supported my career, even in tunes where I'm slaggering him off. He's the first person to share it on Facebook and he knows it's my story to tell like he's not likeike, when you can't say this or like you' not, you know what I'm saying? so I just want to put that out there. Okay, it's f. Bottom Yeah it started to unveil this kind of pedestal and revealed more to me about myself than him if anything. And and you made this realization win. I think it slowly happened over time. so we have that moment That wasn't the start but that's a key moment I remember. time standing up against him. I remember my m momum being proud of me as well and texting me saying. But is this job done? Just within the last what? two years? Two years. Yeah. This is very recent. So so you know what so interesting so I always looking at identity is the story that we tell about ourselves And normally when I say, who are you What I'm looking for people to say is tell me story that you tell about yourself. Yeah. And it feels like you you begin to truly know your identity Yeah about two years ago. Literally it's wild J like and I'd felt a change. in how I would be absorbed by those stories before. he's the coolest thing since last bread. and obviously still he's still a cool guy, I still love him. But from being with My partner and having this new perspective is like Almost H sympathy for him for the first time. which is something that I've always hated feed in. for people and for myself and What I saw was someone who had basically done the same thing as I had. but throughatever he has dealt with, him losing his dad when he was young and being kicked out by his mom. and having her growr up and become an adult. like so many obviously in a very different world because it's music and fame and whatever. but It's like humanized them even more, but now on a sympathy level and it was the first time in my life and it was qu I remember I was actually quite ot upset by it. It was a weird feeling of like almost guilt because that tape had'd been tooken off to what I'm saying. you like that the mask had been the curtain had been pulled a little bit and I know that he could feel it as well. He could see Oh I could see in his eyes he could see in me this story. I can't it was just it was just a not like a regular Bullshit funny mad thing that happened when it it's always about girls and someone being cheated on and someone being hurt and a load of drugs being taken and like some some mad story that has some Snatch guy Richie thememed ending Jhnsing. Right. U and That was a super surreal moment for me because it had happened without me realizing. And so when I' then went back to my partner, Oh and kind of explain this feeling So yeah, it was just quite a profound moments. For me. That's a life changable. Yeah, like my whole life had just been turned on its head We have conversations just like this one every week. So if you haven't already, hit subscribe and I'll see you for the next one The one area that I know that we haven't talked about is that you are now independent. You're an independent artist. Yes. And it seems like you've consciously made this decision to be an independent artist Yeah. what's the reason for that And I knew that love not the love because I don't want to slate the label that I was with because they're all amazing people and obviously they've all got their j jobs to look after. But just tide change in the industry. everyverybody has to move their time. ANRs have got to maintain their jobs. It's a really tough industry where like, If you are not meeting a certain quota of delivering a certain amount of records and a couple of my records haven't connected, they they can't just they can't I have to die on this hill because Im do. But everybody and their mom in the building doesn't have to die on the hill with me because they've got a famies to. And I know that now, even though I was Ill probably you'd asked me at the time, I probably would have slagged them all off I'm And so All of that combined with like, again, all of this stuff that I hadn't really dealt with I'm going three days on the trot and my mum's having to film the states I'm in And to showline I'm likeate I'm in we got like a bar, had a bar in the house that we're no longer at But like I'd be talking to myself or talking to the walls or I'm on all sorts of drugs now on and especially when I found and dove into ketamine. That was the numbing agent. And so my thinging with that was never like I would do a little bit because some people do it together they call it wonky or like There a bit mine was it was go go all the way. It was spines. seeven grams at a time And then it started like cls me doing it while I'm out, which is a terrible look because You can see far easier when someone's on something like that rather than the other because you can't walk, you can't talk, your legs go then there are videos like that coming out of me and then that gets worse and then what it stops being is like I'm going out for a little bit And kind of front in there is like Yeah, I want to go out and get lit, but I'm only out for a few hours now and going straight back home and carrying on For days at home. Yeah, yeah at home on my own in my days. For days. Yeah, yeah. in my bedroom at home, like I'd have two bottles of rum byy my bedside table at night. This in my darkest moments, two bottles was a rum three free five of of packet. and at least seven grams of kedamine and just on my own and You know, I mean I'm surprised you didn'tie. It's wild Fom that yet And there's just so many times where my mom's like Im in the room or come into wherever I'm at terrified or just super worried about me. The combination of all of that happening I'm a My older brother going into psychosis. That was The strawer broke the donkey's back How does that change you then I'm filled with this super guilt because not only Have I been distant from him because we're on different paths on life But I've also had fors rubber that. We only know I could try and make a relationship bond a bit better. I could see him more. I could bring him to shows. I could bring him to studio. I bring my mates to studio. like I love my brother. we get along, and say, why don't I? And then obviously due to the path he had taken and whatever had gone on with him That's happened rightight underneath my nose. We live in the same house together how How have I missed this? How's it got to that point where he's taken whatever he's ten and obviously' put him into a drug ind dou psychosis and like Imo he'd My mom had said it to me and He had come home I don't know if you've ever seen someone when they're like that, but like I have it it's terrifying like didn't look like him. his eyes one day wasn't making sense. was Jiron, he's never really been the same since and he still has It's complicated like he has sometometimes he's good and even when he's good, he's still not the same as what it used to be And when he's having an episode or whatever It' tough And it's like I would I now Dal the fact that I will My brother probably won't be the same againgain I don't know what the source or The reason was as to why he felt he had to take or do whatever it was he was doing and taken led to him being like that or getting into that state. and and if I could turn back time And not have fame and music but have My brother Be normal or not normal that sounds like a bad way to put it, but like just have that relationship that I had once with my brother I would not' say I believe you would Yeah I didn't realize that. they gave me chills with you talking about that you have Yeah. And it was something I had even before The psychosis is something that I battle with all the time. Yeah, yeah, it's tough is that's a lot of weight to carry Um, and what I also reflect on is how you described your brother as is looking up to you. He's your older brother But you were the big brother, in essence How is your mother managing her tube bo becausecause her two boys are still with her. You know, they're showing up differently. Yeah now But how does How does she today Um diffifficult, like so with Me and my brother have both had a very different few of my momum And me and my brother have fallen out over it. quite a few times throughout our lives. Again, this makes me sad to say, their relationship is difficult now, just looking from the outside in because he's againgain a little bit before and since a scenario and since a psychosis not scenario, but He's very secluded. doesn't really want to talk a lot Um and he has his feelings about My mum are like how things were done And so she obviously still checks on him I would deffinitely go far enough to say it's probably quite a one sided relationship My momum sigh. You know? And that doesn't mean I know he loves her. Do you know what I mean? Yes. B I think there's just There's some resentment held from him and I think some of it is due to like his brain has obviously very recently been reired due to whatever substances and it's too difficult to try and not only communicate with him Just on a day to day level, how are you, you know, what have you eaten today today then? try and dive in So all that, like there's a time and placeace for it. and at this moment in our lives it's not now So, but I'll tell you what I mean, that is a difficult situation. Yeah. and and that's a lot All of you be going through in this very moment Yeah. And one is, I mean, I definitely appreciate the transparency. I think it gives us a view as to what you were dealing with what you are managing, you know, what's top of mind for you Um, and and and my wish is that you know, your brother is able to move to a place where you both can feel The love. that I know that you have for each other. And he and your mother are able to move to a place where they can feel the love that I know that they have for each other because It's been the three of you since the beginning F day dot So then how do you I mean, now I have a totally I have a totally new perspective on you But now As you've moved into fatherhood, I can see now how this completely reshapes how you show up. you know, not only as a father, but Buty as a man in society, one hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah I mean Can we talk about fatherhood Yeah, I think before We talk about that, we kind of have to go into mee and my partner think we have to do me and my partner first. Okay. you notan Yeah, me and I was. Okaykay. because likeike you say, like this reshaping my walk, how I am and How I view the world It starts with her and I mean, I'm sure you saw or maybe you didn't bother my post but like my whole life. evenven though I've glamorized and idoliz my dad There's always been a part of me that's very aware that is not How are you father? parent someone. Yes. And so. On that, is this where you wrote for a long time Michael Hast And my trauma was my identity? Yes Can I read this? Yes. This is profound. So you wrote this on IG For a long time, my past and my trauma was my identity I held onto it as tight as I could, fighting anyone and anything that tried to change me hurting people in the process. And this is two year ad. You wrote, I promise you will never know the feeling of wondering who your dad is. where he is or if he loves you enough I'll show you every single day one hundred percent I believe that. I mean it my whole heart. Yeahah. Yeah. I believe it So It's ocean Yeah, who put you on this this this this path? Yeah, because like I was saying like I was always I've always been like, I'm never having kids. I don't want to be a dad. I've always been, I've like b in the fact that I am this bad person And is it that you also so you didn't want to be a dead? Did you also not want a committed relationship It doesn't that I didn't want it. I didn't really think I was capable, like I've never been able to hold down Westterward. What's Monogamous. Oh yeah. that's the singular one, right? Exactly. Mogamy. Monogamous relationship relations. And even like I can for someone, but it was always like once you were out of sight You are out of mind I of I've hurt people, you know what I'm saying? I'm very aware of that And Sounds horrible. For a long time, I was also proud of that That's who My dad was, he was The top Nar assisting and that was super cool, Do you know what I mean Um Like Just like even for a reference He H nickname for me. is Asmodeith Asmodeus is the sun of the devil somewhere in some kind of mythology And that's like it's that's our band and that's our relationship, but that's Thus. That's been his nickname for me out all my teenagers as well. and I love that. That was again, it's like yeah, like we're bad. you know what I was saying? like it was cool to not give a shit about no one or anything. And it's look And it's kind of strange because my mom is so the opposite. She is like the most loving open person. All my mom was like the mom to all my friends. right Growing up. So ye, so Ocean, she was aware of all this. Yeah, so she she was she's been a friend for a long time. and u kind of saw all the different states that I've been in throughout majority of my career the more I got to know her as a friend and then as our relationship developed She Bfu so much and wore it veryery, very differently to how I wore it and her outlook on why she should wear it differently I had this new faround perspective of like just through falling in love with her and not just falling in love with her but falling in love with her. outlook on life It was probably one of the only ways I could have possibly have been changed because she didn't try and stool it into me in any way. It was just the same way like we talked about my mom's mentality and how Wing her do whatever she wanted to do made me believe I could do whatever I wanted to do. It was like watching my partner and how she carries and out of all that and how she treats people, the kind of person she is. I had said in that post she has A very special kind of light I like about her like her energy and u So yeah, when we've started speaking and like all we first like dated or like gave it a go in that realm rather than just being friends. I was like, trust me, you don't want to get rarapped to that. I just try and do like the whole swagger L like I'm so messed up. Like it actually kind of cringes me out when I'm saying out loud now And she was very like, yeah, cool like, you know, actually when now we speak about it, she's like, I knew You were just, you'd had such a warmed perception of yourself And then slowly over time And it didn't happen overnight and we've had our ups and downs because it's complicated, as I'm sure you know of is like I I found myself Halen in H. which might sound a little bit codependent because it's not necessarily her job, you know what I'm saying? But it was like this new l Is that did that also impact your perception of fatherhood? Yeah for so long Even while we were in a relationship, it sound like I've made clear to her, obviously I'm at the age where that's the things you discuss quite early in relationship and I had said, I don't want kids Be her one asked why I was like, becausecauseuse I'll be a shit dad. I don't know how to be a good dad I was aware that this father some relationship wasn't normal And I was like, well, that's all I know but I also don't want to pass that on down. And H her answer was always like That's why you're going to be the best at. and then We had a A moment changed all of that for me. We had anatopic pregnancy before this pregnancy Um, She was excited. And so if I'm honest, at a time, didn't think I wanted it, but I was up for it because She was off for it. Let me just for anyone who doesn't know, because because I was not familiar with an ectopic pregnancy So this occurs when a fertilized egg imp plants and grows outside the main cavity of the uterus. It's most commonly and this is about about ninety seven percent of cases in the fallopian tube. Yeah. So known as a tule pregnancy is unfortunately a non viable pregnancy cannot proceed normally and poses a life threatening risk to the parent.es, if not treated. Yes. that she kept saying like I know something's wrong, like I'm in a lot of pain. this is now eight weeks in And So yeah, weve got we've done a few private scans and basically they can't find it. So they're like, well the It must be a topic because we can't see the little Egg or whver and obviously she was distraught because not only did she really want this baby, But she was also kind of aware that I wasn't quite Ready? What? it done for me that I hadn't let her know at the time was revealed to me that I was Ready because even though I had all those worri. the second I found out it wasn't happening. My heart was broken as well. and I've said this is actually a conversation I'd having with my dad because I'd spoke to him I said, you know, A ready for all this. I'm not ready to hang the gloves up yet. like the lifestyle and all this kind of stuff and d d da. And then I've said like Yeah, Phil I feel like shit and was that there actually was a part of me that was more excited than I thought. I was just so used to pretending I don't want to evolve in life and I want to be disverged on myself that I told myself No, I don't I don't want kids and I'm this version them and then Like obviously something like that will strip any kind of defence mechanism or mask especially seeing my partner' upset and so Yeah, that has. revealed that to me and I said that to her. And just like that, you're dad No Well, now I am. I mean, but now I mean ye, yeah, obviously it was a process Again, I didn't I've said to you that I stopped I haven't drunk or I haven't been drunk. I had a beer the other day for the first time I' watching a football and just had one which is A moment for me, you know what I mean U, but I haven't been drunk since January. Obviously she was she's been pregnant since. August. so There was ' still ups and down and still a process for me to go through, but I was able to Aain make be aware of myself and heal a little bit. And like I said, this is all very like raw. It's all so recent. so I'm not sitting here pretending like no noeed. I am this complete man and No no, I can see it. you're still You're still in the battle. Yeah, one hundred percent. Yeah, you're still in the battle, which which which I applaud you. for coming on Talk. being in the battle. I think we have so many guests that come on and reflect This happened to me ten years ago. This happened to me five years ago You're saying this is happening now now. Yeah ye ye. I have a letter here I'd like to read it to you. Okay. if I could And then I'm going to give it to you afterfterwards Ready? Yeah to my RyI Watching you become a father has been one of the most beautiful things I've ever had the privilege of experiencing For someone who once thought they never wanted children You've stepped into the role in a way that feels completely natural likeike you were always meant for it Our baby girl is so lucky to have you as her role model You are more talented and capable than you give yourself credit for And somehow you continue to amaze me. more every single day I see how much you carry on your shoulders pressure you face and yet you still show up for us without hesitation I truly don't know what we would do without you I don't think you fully realize the impact that you've had on my life The way you've brought light into it, what I needed it most For that, I will always be grateful You always remind me how strong I am and how well I carry my trauma. We've said this, but you forget to remind yourself of the same You've carried your own through so much in ways most people wouldn't be able to There have been times when others would have given up after being knocked down again and again ' been hard to watch, but push through it every single time and you come out the other side with strength and positivity. I don't think it's ever been easy for you That one hits hard Yeah. I don't think it's ever been easy for you handling success and strong opinions from such a young age Al dealing with your own personal battles behind closed doors all while providing for and caring for your family When I look at where you are now and the person you've become, It's truly something that I admire And I'm so proud of you I'm so excited to do parenthood with you, to build a life full of memories as a family. and I feel incredibly lucky to have chosen such an amazing father For my children Children We've been through so much and we've faced everything as a team and we've come out even stronger Our little family is everything. because of you We love you so much, always Your girls You know who wrote that? I do know you wre now. You tried to get me. I nearly went just then. No, I tell you, I think letters are some of the most incredible instruments that we have And I'm going to give this one to you. Thank you. I'm curious. What did you think of that letter It's I mean it's always nice to hear and Again, she always gives me like a new perspective because I do always tell I tell her constantly, I especially remind her when she needs to be reminded of how strong she is and I always I always kind of give her the kudos of like I am Bet. because of how you wear your trauma now and it's not something that I ever think about that like intern of that I'm also We in mind bar and ye, I'm a little bit lost for words That's amazing to hear. No, I love it. I love it. So then on that note I' got the final question for you. Everyone gets it. Yes. If you reflect back on all of the conversations you've had throughout your life. Which one stands out as the most memorable Who was it with? And what did you learn That's a difficult question. onene that comes to mind is a conversation I had with my momum when I said even as and like I think about now it makes me laugh because it was quite a strong conversation to have with a a child who just could have been saying something on a whim whereas I want to be so I want to be rapper I want to be a musician and A lot of parents would say Oh that's amazing. I'm so happy you have that goal But you need to have a backup plan You know, that's a really hard thing to achieve and I'm so happy you've got that aspiration. But and it'll be a but and the conversation with My mom was And this exact phrase was they would and you better fuckking give it your ru and We had we went further into that conversation Again, I'm like I come up like pretty young. I think either late primary school or early secondary school. and That was like a realization moment for me O one of the first times of my mom's mentality and how she tackles and views the world and I felt like it gave me a bit of power because I'd realized it it was like My mum had passed down this Power ono me and that I knew I was fucking I was capable of it, Janight I saying. Yeah. You know beforefore you came in I knew you as the rapper, the white rapper from Bright. You know what I mean? How do you feel as well? Did you? I mean, I'm sure it's not what you expected? No, no Not at all, not at all Um And I'm definitely walking away Highly impressed. with your maturity highly impressed with your ability to reflect and pull lessons very excited about your journey as a father you seem to be fully equipped to knock this out the partark. I hope so. Yeah. I mean, you definitely do. But most importantly is I love that You have gone on a journey to figure out your identity And you know precisely who you are right now. And I think you like you are becoming. That's a great way to put it L. It's the first time in my life where I would introduce myself to someone and I was proud of who I thought I was proud of who I was when I was bad, but it wasn't really pride. It was all just a fun. and really I just didn't love myself. And it's the first time I love myself in a different way. And'm if I was to introduce myself to someone and say like, I' proud of the man I am. whereereas before it was like It was pretend pride really. It was just all kind of ego and I wasn't I knew that I wasn't. behaving in the way that I knew I could. so Yeah, yeah, no, it's good. It's good. And I was going to say, you know, u I see Now it's really cool because I met RD obviously. You know, I know Smiley Riley You see the smile when I was reading the letter L like a Chestter cat. I can't wipe it off. I know Smiley Riley. this is cool. Yeah, you do. But yeah, this honestly, this has been an honor. I think likewise I feel the same s. Yeah, yeah. it's It is going to change, I think, a lot of perspectives and enlighten Many, many people for sure Thank you. Thankk you for having me. Yeah Riley Davies, RD, having him sit here today. I see how layered he is and how much He's had to manage But more importantly, how much weight he still carries with him. Near death experience addiction the fractured relationship with his father is challenges with a music industry I mean There's so much to his story. It's hard to believe that he's only twenty three. the advice that his mother gave is something that I think is really good advice. So that was at the early age. She said, lookook, if that's what you want to do, then you better get to work. don't mess around. And it's interesting for me because it's the same conversation I'm having with my U with my oldest son right now. where he's giving me different ideas of what he wants to do Part of me is saying, o, well Watch out for this or watch out. But the other part is what she says We'll just get to work Uh I think a lot of people are going to be sururprised quite possibly shocked. at what Ri had to say When you listen to his entire journey It's very understandable why he has landed at the place he's in today. Absolutely adorefulore playay. I think it can brillant I feel sad people who don't. But then that became a thing. you know, they're like I was somebody who went down on girls. So you became almost shamed for going down. Yeah At seventeen, you do Coke for the first time. You are removing pain you didn't realize you had. And my last memory was I was trying to escape something. What were you trying to escape? My therapist is be buzzing and you' asking me these questions. If there's any question That feels off. You just say, Paul, doesnn't I go there? I'd be impressed if you found somewhere. Wow Okay There was also a point where I was very close to a suicide. My mom wrg me and I was like, sometometimes I feel like I just open don'or to be it. Knowing that like I'd put my momum in a position where she could think about losing her son while she was alive. My dream throughout my whole life was for my mom to be happy. Let's get to then Jade. Jade tells me she loves me all the time and I Love it. I never knew I could feel like this. Dud's my superstar. And I'm hest slepistuff. Do you believe that you will marry Jade We need to talk. Yeah, yeah, we do InZock Dock, we know being a healthy adult is like living in a video game Every day has side quests, taxes, laundry, birthdays, and just when you're leveling up, you have to book a doctor. The insurance portal crashes, they put you on hold, yourour doctor doesn't take your plan, game over. We see you, so we made booking a doctor easy Download SoockDark, search by specialty, insurance and availability. Look instantly, no cheat codes required Find a doctor you love with sockock. Starting a business can seem like a daunting task, unless you have a partner like Shopify They have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website to marketing, to selling and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need There's a reason millions of companies like Mattel, Heinz, and All Birds continue to trust and use them With Shopify on your side, turn your big business idea into Sign up for your one dollar per month trial at shhopify. com slash special offer The girl is shot The chairs are held together by optimism. And what happened to the rug S sounds like your outdoor setup is not ready for patio season Fix it all with Wayfare, shop Wfare for grills, rugs, furniture, and more