Music Memories and Finding Home

Hello and massive, welcome back to Happy Place with me, Fern Cotton. This is the show that looks back in order to move forward Today, I'm chatting to Allan Cumming. I mean, truly, my dad told me I was worthless and my mum told me I was precious. And of course you wantn' to believe your mum I am a strong person and I functioned very well for someone who has abus of childhood, I think. but it's still with me. Sometimes I can get triggered by certain personalities. I will allow people to be Well abusive. I had those things happen to me that I am acknowledging we're really damaging and could have ended it for me but yeah, I persevered because I believed in myself, I think. You know what? This was one of those chats that me and the Happy Place team were so buzzed about. We're all huge Allan fans. And weirdly, we recorded this one in the evening. We very rarely do that. We're all early birds at Happy Place. We're morning people. so we may bash out three happay placel podcast episodes in a day, but we'll usually start at like nine. This one I think we started recording like six or seven in the evening. reallyally Weird for me, but sort of lovely. It was almost like we were on a night out with Allan coming And it had a different feel to it for me, certainly like we were having like a late night, it wasn't late night, but for me it was cheeky chat And he had he brought such good energy to the studio in a fun like little behind the scenes gossipy way. in again, a really lovely down to earth way. He was just So chilled, so lovely, turned up with one person, so Beautifully normal hung around to have a little chat afterwards. We were gossiping about all sorts of things And then me and the happappy Place team who work on the podcast went out for a little cheeky drink after, because we were in such great spirits. We What was the weird drink that I had meals I had some like weird ead of rhubarb in it or sage or something really off the beaten track. Anyway, I had some super weird cocktail that got me pissed in like one drink. I was like hammered in with one sip of this drink. I blame Alan It's all Allan's fault. Now, this chat with Alan, as I'm sure you can imagine, was a riot. This is a man with a lot of hilarious stories. He hass lived a life But He was also really gracious in sharing the stories that he tells himself about himself. A feeling of worthlessness, which you might be surprised to hear, is something that comes up a lot in his personal life And he also talked about the ways that his new channel four series, Tiiptoe, brought up some bloody raw memories from his own past. It's written by Russell T. Davis, so it's obviously particularly gritty Smer is here, whichich means we all want to look and feel our best. A GLP one may be right for you. Visit orderlymeds dot com to learn more about which GLP one you could be eligible for. Getting started is fast, easy and happens virtually through telemedicine from licensed professionals. Check it out for yourself. Go to orderlymeds dot com slash podcast That's orderlymeds dot com slash podcast Taking care of yourself feels great. CompA medications are not FDA approved eligibility required and determined by a licensed provider and individualults vary your website for details All right, let's do it. Here's the show Alen, you legend coming. how are you?retty good. A littleet a little exhausted, but I'm not I mean, I'm here for you. I know you are very you're a true pro. Yeah, T pro Y I love a chat, but I'm in my general demeanor of life right now, I've had a crazy week You've been in how many continents in the last two days? well, I was in New York last night And the night before that I was in Los Angeles Two days before that I was in New York and two days before that I was in Aberdeen I mean, you're in one of those states where time is meaningless. Like what does it even what is it? I know and it's also like I ten minute nap that was brilliant. Oh, did that work? If I have a nap, I usually feel worse I I can I'm very good at napping And always I'm always good. but I can also just think Okay, I thought I was going to have a nap for half an hour. I've only got ten minutes. I'm going to make it really count. And you can fall asleep that quickly Wow, I'm so jealous. I can sleep. I always sleep on planes. I always sleep in cars I sleep on floors and you know, in dressing rooms and things that I just I just have got u Gsh, you've got written a lot of books. I knew you'd written this one ' I saw you on tey. All those oness over there. I've written all than that evenven. How many of have you written all together? Sixteen, Alen. Shut up I got toa keep busy. I can't sit around. No. likeike you. yes, hello. You can't sit around. I mean, you are always you've just you know, said how much You've been traveveling recently, you are always on the go, whether it's it could be TV, could be TV hosting, it could be film, could be theater, writing. you are prolific in all areas.. Is that pure drive or is there restlessness? U I think I think it's a combination of things. I mean I like being busy. I like I like being eclectic And I like not ever really overly dwelling on one thing So I like the sort of lightness and the nimbleness of it and sort of floating through life. I do The older I get I sort of do think, o, am I You know might really Who am I trying to I don't know mayaybe I'm trying to prove too much or something. I sort of think that of late because you know, it's like forty years since I've been working as a professional actor in person But no, I just actually think I have a lot of, you know, I'm given a lot of opportunities to do things that I really like I may be I'm trying to do a little less than I done or, you know, too much it's too much right now. But I really enjoy it. yeah But's a gift love we could do. Oh my God. absolutely. I really, you know It doesn't feel like Like you forget, I think that most people in the real world do your jobs they don't really like in order to get money to do what they like in their lives. Yeah. And we do we get paid to do the thing we really like. So lucky. I know. I know and it's an incredible thing when you When you have friends and they say things about like, oh well, you know, I'm just doing this I think, o God, I forgot. That that's most people's experience. Yeah, I know we are extremely, extremely lucky. At what point do you think As a youngster, did you have your heart set on, I think I'm going to enjoy that 'cause you don't know. You could watch a film or a TV show or go to a theater show and think, that's probably amazing. Of course there's always going to be shit bits on glamorous bits.. But you had an inkling, that's for me Yeah, I sort I think I sort of thought It wasn't even actually the you know, going to the theater, going to seeing I mean, I think I first liked the feeling of it. more about and I do still feel like that. I feel like It's the feeling I get and I like the sort of process of acting or performing or ating. that I really like And you know, there's been a big upturn for me in the last couple of years in dealing with all the stuff because of the traitors and you know, especially This last week in America been a lot and I have been going to these big things I actually was thinking, gosh, you know, I All that stuff. I sort I said this thing like, you know, I A little piece of you dies, out of your soul dies every time you take a selfie and things like that because I had a t shirt once which was really good said Even though you like getting a photo taken with a celebrity, celebrities don't necessarily like getting a photoaken with you. A bit brutal Sorry, because I feel like all the detritus of it Sometimes especially when you're promoting things as I am right now, that take that that becomes your job And that's not really what I what I wanted to do when I first started out I didn't obviously don't know about you don't know about all that stuff. And that's more to do with fame, right than the job Exactly. Ttally different thing. When people say peopleople say, o, well, that comes with the job Id say, well, no actually. the job is this over here And I didn't you know, it wasn't when I was twenty I wasn't you know, on the red carpet at the T one hundred list. And I think Fay meant something very different back then. Absolutely. When I started in the nineties, it was a very different thing. I don't think I understood what it was going into the industry. I kind of thought, o, you might be known because you're on the TV, but it wasn't a job in itself as it today Yes, it's such a like more Like with the traitors, I yeah, I spend more time promoting the traitors than actually do shooting it. Mat. Yeah U and that's crazy. Yeah. And and also it's just sort of anyway, I love I love my job. I really do And and there's some things I like about the pr. I mean,, you know, honestly, Id really bitching about about I mean, I' ay bit. Like people on planes and things and people went to foot and you think went, you know or you like you werere in the lou or in the l pickking up your dog's poop just like, no, not now or And I've got much better at just saying I don't want to. Yeah, you know, nice to meet you. Yeah that's absolutelyly. Yeahah. And and also the thing what's really good I've learned if you said someone If I take a photo with you, everyone will see and ask my entire evening will be taking photos with everyone in this room and they go tootally get it. Yeah. And I think it's really good to sort of just be honest with people and And I'm always nice and kind and stuff like that, but sometimes you just think I don't want to. No. And I think that's fair enough. you don't have to. It's not, you know, sometimes people are like, o, come on. but I actually I don't know. that part of it is, you know, if it's an event and it's a premiere or something, absolutely that's what you're Yeahah yeah yeah of course. In your life, in your real life. And I suppose that's why You know The older I've got the more I've got I've So I sort of places away from it or Yes, that is so important. It's so. You can love your job, you can do it as much as you want as long as there is. Hasn't even got to be balanceced, I don't think I think balance is usually unrealistic. I've definitely not got any balance in my life. It's sort of most of the time chaotic with working kids and I've chosen that. Yeah. But if you can have tiny moments, for me that is usually solitude love Be on my own.ally What you like Sed Hving just having a bath You know what I mean? S I love having a bar or and I've got this right now. I have a little fant. I mean So I've got this new, well, it's not new, but we've had the renovations done on this house and I've got I feel like, you know, if you're luck enough to be able to have a house that you can make it the way you want to For me, I've realized what that is is sanctuary away from everything And I've got this house in Scotland where It's a little the little pond. I call it a lock. it's not really a lock. It's got an island call it lock. There' a word for mini lock A lockin. A loin. Yeah, a lockin I've got a sauna. I've got put a sauna on the banks of it and a little Jetty thing, so you go in the sun and you jump in. love that. the thing you're like I love that like that doesn't take long, but that to me is like that's my thing. I made it and I thought about it, that's what I wanted to do and I've done it and I love it My new thing s of is my sort of tried wife fantasy that I want to. I've got an agga and I want to make gluten free scones So niche. Yes I really think about these things. Agas are tricky. Are they? Yeah, I had one many, many years ago. I bought a tiny cottage and it happened to have an agga in it I must have been twenty four, I barely cooked. Maybe I was younger than that And it's always at the same temperature. so you have to obviously learn it's a whole new way of cooking. Yeah. And there's maybe it's a three Chambers An oven What's funny is that we before the renovations, there was an oil one and now I've got an elect new an electric one. So basically be ye, it's going to be it's got the things that go up like that. Yeah, ye, yeah, love that. I love that. So I want my sort of childed wife at home, you know. And I like this thing of I' going to be leaning against the little thing where the Tel raels is war me your bum. Womm me your bum after a big walk or after afterumped in the locken In lock Lala. Oh so I do so I really I I absolutely my life is completely the same in terms of it's not balance, but I do have like little things that I feel at least if I can do that. Yes, you know. Be when I heard you on Lulu's podcast or maybe a few years ago now And she asked you if you were a workaholic And it's a really interesting question because You know, perhaps I could say that I am, you could say that you are, but actually I think when I look at how prolific you've been, how diverse your career is, it seems more so that you just need to create. It's something a desire within you that it's not like I just must fill my diary. It's like you've got to be creating that's part of who you are. Yeah, I think it's true. and I always think if you're An addict, it means that you wake up in the morning and you have to do that thing. or you can't do without the thing I can do it, I can do without I love Like the year with COVID. It was my favorite year of my life. working. Yeah. and I just loved it. Do you know I loved. What? Not getting invited anywhere. Yeah. I loved it. I remember think an ex that I went to ye Yeah, it was so good. I was like, Ohh my go, I forgot how much I don't like these things Yeah awful. But just yeah, like not mean that so it's not that I I didn't miss any of that that year. but I do feel it is about being creative like why I laugh when you said about being creative is that t my theatre that I runan near at Loxfy Festival Theatre, I'm an artist director that one of the our finance guy Dougggie said to me, Alan, you have too many ideas. And I was like sorry. And I thought, wait why am I saying sorry? But I do, I sort of feel sometimes I feel like I wish I didn't have so many ideas because I'm also quite strong willed and I'm good at manifesting things. And so sometimes and so the other day, so this is so weird. yesterday, was it yesterday the day before I met Dakota Fining at this thing in LelA. and I was talking to her about Budapest and I said, Ohh, I love Budapest. I made a film there years ago and she she's making a film there And I I remember thinking, o I'll manifest I want to do another film in Budabest so I can go there. And I thought, Oh no, don't stop it right now because that will happen And you want to be making sces. Why do you think you're particularly good at it? Because I think over the years, I've been pretty good at that. I'm just manifest random kid from the suburbs and then I ended up doing this extraordinary job because I was so dead set on that idea, there was no other option. I'm not quite sure what the other bits of the alchemy are that are necessarily needed. I think you know the whole manifesting thing can be talked about in a way that feels like, oh, I'm failing manifesting, I'm failing at life. I is. I think If you all Stong it might be as simple as if you are that strong willed And your vision is that clear and you're determined to put the work in, which is the other bit that R Often missing from the combo. And it's also not crazy things you're you know, about manifesting I want to go to Budapest. That's not No, you're not saying I want to become a preremier F footballer. Right. Yeah. But I've done things might be good to football. I've just assumed that not. Like I was just thinking a few years ago, I did a thing that said, I really want to do Oh I remember when the last time I did coabber I you know, I've done that musical cabt a few times. And I did it on Broadway I was fifty and I finished. and I remember thinking Whoa, This is I'll never be asked to dance like this. I'll never This is the end of something. I' never be I'll never use my body like this for my work Again and I thought, I I'm still good one more in mirr. and I thought I'll do something, I'll do a show that's sort of I'll dance in a musical or something or you, blah bl, blah What happened was and I sort of was thinking, what can I do? I end up doing a one man d's theatater piece about Roberturns that nearly killed me And so that's the dangers of manifestation. Yeah, yeah. You have the idea and also you put it into action as quickly as possible. I think if you have the idea and you sort of dilly dally too much, that's where it floats off. You've got to kind of get into it straight away. But seemingly there's something within your personality, your your makeup, whatever you've inherited from your ancestors, that has enabled you to think big Dream big. and have the discipline to do it because I'veard when you, for instance, did your speech when you Walker Fame star in Hollywood was placed down You mentioned a teacher who had said some pretty shitty things about you, like you wouldn't amount to anything. you wouldn't work in the ar. a professional actor, yeah. And that drove you further. I think for some people, that would stop you in your tracks like, o Godd, yeah, I am. what am I thinking? I'm you know, But your mindset is often to go, well, I'm gonna to prove you wrong. Yes But I still feel that he I still feel I want to speak out and say how wrong that is because I by whatever God or yet or act of will. didnn't, you know, I'm a successful actad I also feel there would be a lot of other people would who would be ushed by that and Yeahah be damedood. And I was damaged by that, very much so for quite a few years and then but you know I also realize that it's also connected to my father that I F feel that I had a In the same way that he told me I was not able to do something. I was not I was sort of worthless in this area this teacher. My father told me that as well. And so I feel like from a very early age I had make up my own mind about things because I could see that things weren't Or there was one parent telling you you were terrible and nothing telling you you were great. So you you know, they can't be both right. So I feel in my life I've got Two things. One, I'm suspicious of people who are extreme and they're putting me down and two I let them do it for quite a while longer than I should before I get my shirit together. That's the sort of legacy of it. I do feel it's when that's why I spoke. I've always wanted to talk about that actually about the teacher And I didn't say who they were or anything. That's not what interests me, but it's about the fact that I I had those things happen to me that I am acknowledging we're really damaging and could have endnded it for me But I yeah, I persevered because I believed in myself, I think. Yeah, well, because when we're young, our brains are still developing. So of course, you're so sponge like taking on every bit of criticism and then forming an opinion of you are as a person, which I think we probably keep on figuring out until the day we die.. But when you're young, you know, you're so susceptible to that kind of critique. and I think you've obviously talked a lot about your dad growing up. And when you're a tiny kid, especially sort of zero to seven where that imprint on a young kid can be lifelong. It is remarkable that you've managed to override that. because I think again manyany people, and I've sat here and interviewed lots of people or even I could look at my own life or people that I've interviewed in other areas, are completely screwed from you know, the moment they go out into the big wide world to find out how they fit into it They're blocked because they've been told You're a piece of shit. you're worthless. you won't out to anything. I think it takes Again, like a whole recipe of strength and courage, resilience and determination to override I I think it does. but also I think it is very for me, it was I realize now my mom being this polar opposite telling me the polar opposite I mean truly, my dad told me I was worthless And my mom told me I was precious. And of course, you want to believe your momum. I am a strong person and I have overcome I function very well for someone who has had an abusive Childhood, I think It's still with me It's still that's what I wrote a book, you know about it. then I wrote another book kindind of about the fact I was well, it was another book, but also about the fact that I didn't want people to think that because I had suddenly revealed all this stuff about myself that it was all kind of tied up It's very American. It done. Oh, yeah, fine. Oh, you came it. Yeah. It's not I have I I It's with me all the time and I As I say, let I allow that kind of behavior. I realize even to this day I allow people to behave towards me, c a certain type of man Yeah, probably. who is sort of telling me that is kind of maybe slightly you know, gaslating me or something demaining me. It doesn't happen that often, but when it does, I really I see this is a new thing I've realized. I let it go on too long because I'm sort of thinking, o they must be right. I can't they can't You know give them familiar. I think a lot of that abbsolutely We're like, oh, I know this. I know how I know this st Yeah, I'm used to this. Yeah. So So I but also just even things like Yeah, there's well there's just a lot of, you know, there's many things about anngered and Violence I got this new Rusll T. Davis show Yeah that I've done. It was very difficult because It's it's about the way that violence and hatred is normalized And it was so it was very triggering God, I bet it was. in many ways. But it was also why I wanted to do it Summer is here, which means we all want to look and feel our best. A GLP one may be right for you. Visit orderlymeds d. com to learn more about which GLP one you could be eligible for. Getting started is fast, easy, and happens virtually through telemedicine from licensed professionals. Check it out for yourself. Go to orderlymeds. com slash podcast Oderly Meds. com slash podcast. Taking care of yourself feels great. CompAa medications are not FDA approved eligibility required and determined by licensed provider. individual results may vary your whatbsite details I mean, I watched the first two episodes and it is o it like many of his shows raw and gritty and You've got so many different emotions wrapped up into the story, love and sorrow, and you've got you're living next door to David Morrisy, who plays I guess like the other end of the spectrum in terms of worldviews, values politics. trying to work out how to live alongside each other. I mean, is the opening scene of episode one I was like, o my God Shocking, shocking. I can't imagine how triggering mostost of it was But there are some beautiful storylines in there. Like I just watched episode two today and I don't want to give too much away for people that haven't seen it. I G good old hearty cry at the lovely text exchange that you were having with the young neighbour It was so beautiful. Yeah I know I can qu it. I think about that. I saw it you know, u ple mons ago and in it, you know, I I it's been quite familiar to me for the last couple of years But even I was I was so I was on the edge of my seats, but also I was incredibly moved by those things, which is great because You know, I was moved by them when Russell told me about the story and then when the scripts came in, I So the fact that I moved when the finished product is so great because often you aren't you know often doesn't quite land in the same way, but no, that's really beautiful. And also I think it's so moving his past relationship with his His e. Yeah. It's really lovely Charlie Cnd do plays my ex in it and It's it's yeah, it was it was a lot, but a lot of died stuff came up during that time and I didn a monastic existence doing it. Yeah. a lot, I mean,'m I've been in therapy for thirty years. mean that. Sty years. I best. All for it. I mean, it's so incredibly helpful to me And just as just, you know, as a as a checking in thing, not sometimes there's obviously things that, oh, want to talk about there. or other times it's just, you know, I always say it's like going to the the gym for your mind And I love it. I got to keep going. tootally And to be reminded of certain, you know, my therapist would to say, Oh well, you're probably feeling that because of And you go, oh yeah, yeah. Yeah we can't see it because we're in it. Y. You just need someone to I have that literally every week, like, oh my God, how could I that's so obvious, that's right there. But we're living it. So when you're shooting something like tipoe. And you are confronted in a scene, or there's something that's come up, could be a feeling that you weren't expecting because of the nature of what you're discussing in the scene. There's some big, heavy political subjects in there. and how the two characters are kind of so opposing in so many ways. What do you do to make sure then that you're alright rather than just sort of if you can't obviously leave certain and just integrate back into the world with all those feelings? I mean, on this because it we shot in Manchester And in a funny way, I remember thinking, o, I'm good to mag this. And like I runan a bar in the story on Canal Street, you know and And I've never really spent very much time in Manchester, only just little fleeting visits. And I remember thinking for o I have a great time I I'll be out in Canal street, I'll go to all that while It'll be really fun, I'll let go because I'll go dancing all the time but nothing. I was like a monk I you know, I went out to feed a couple of times at weekends, but no I had I I I went I would go home and be quiet. I know so not like me actually I That was the way I dealt with it. And I had my dog with me and I think that was really important. Yeah. For a lot of the time La was with me, but and you know, just having to go out with heard and having to get up earlier Just, you know, and even just the gym, I've become one of those people that sort of wax is lyrical about the gym Recently I find myself saying, I really what's your favorite non alcoholic beer? And I thought, what have they done to Alice? And'm not I'm drinking again. but just I just really was I let it, you know, in a funny sort of way having access to Your emotions and being someone that is, you know, very conscious of A lot of the things that I have to do are trigging or challenging to you know, some of the things that I find really difficult in my life. And not I go through life. I'm a happy person and I'm but I'm also prepared be vulnerable. and I think that's what you have to do to be an actor, to be a good actor. You have to be prepared to be vulnerable. So if you And of course, it's not you can't just switch it off but the fact that I use the fact that I am like that in life, I feel like I feel like I'm like that and Like I'm constantly Joy is here, but also despairs may be there too. And I'm not despairing a lot of the time, back I feel things and So I use that in my work But also I Usually I would to sort of get out of it, I would go out in have fun and d With in this one, it was Also I didn't know so many people in Manchester and so going out in public when you don't know so many people You have to go out in a psse to keep, you know Yeah. So that was one of the things as well and I I yeah. so I was a little bit of a monk Do you think it's always helpful to sort of have that access or level of exposure to stuff from the past because you know, obviously there is exposure therapy. I've done it in certain ways with MDR and I movement therapy, which I found really helpful But I think when you're doing it on the job, you know, you're working, you're confronted with issues that you know might make you feel a certain way or a memory might flash up. Do you think it is always helpful? or you know, because I'm always I'm always considering how much should we leave things in the past and go, I've dealt with that, it's done versus I need to have an awareness that it's there so that I don't get caught out or I don't get I think I think it's not like when I'm doing a scene, it's not I'm not thinking, oh This is like the past or this is like an instant in my life. I suppose that's what method acting is and I don't really adhere to that I'm being you know, I'm just pretending to be someone else and meaning it. But sometimes when the situations you're pretending are Silar to things, very similar to things you have great experience of thenen it s of helps. But I think in general, just being someone who is willing to show your vulnerability. in your life on your face and you know is helpful to being a good artist and especially a film on film because, you know, you're You know, that's why it's so crazy that I'm doing the traitors because I have the worst poker face in ever. In real life, I'm like So does Alan Carr and any Bonny one that' why across the area Yes, I know it's so funny. I saw Maura. do you know Maura? Yeah, yeahish She was at the time thing last night. She was interviewing me. She goes, Why did not make me a traitor? And I was like, Well, if we had, you wouldn't have had that great moment on TV. But I don't have good booker face. In real life and I don't know that's I don't know that's. I couldn't go on it Gn't you? can't lie. But then you would maybe like if you I mean, I think the thing is When you have to lie I mean, that's kind of like acting. when you have to lie. But even like, you know I don't know whether I'm getting sloppy, but like I have a thing in my ear all the time when I'm doing it. and What do you call this again? Yeah p silk yeer you ch led? I like this. So I' P and There's great guy called Sam, who's the producer who is always talking to me. and sometimes I actuallyct I feel I'm just like Reading? Cars, you know blah, blah And he and they've said, o, what I've actually been doing is this thing. Like roll in my eyes's like when they've made really stupid decisions. And so you have yeah, is have like I've just sort of lapsse from character, really No, I'm like that. can't I sort of can't not say the thing, like say the truth. I would rather always just well like I'm not very good if I've got not somebody else's secret, but a secret about me. I can't not Say it Yes. Have to just say that I't likecre. I don't like surprises and secrets. I hate surprises. Yeah Yeahah, me too. I'm not good with them. I'll always find out that it's gonna to happen I've got a spidey scense and I'll work it out. Yeah ye, I don't like surprises. I often quite often they do things You know, when you're doing press stuff they're, Oh, you've gota surprise' my heart Yeah. And here's your primary school teacher. No No, you don't want that. No. So say when you're it could be anything. Theatater, and you've got a big load of theatater shows coming up, Traitors, which is so gargantuan in the states. It is a massive show, like it is here, but on a ginanormous scale. or you're in a film, whatever What is the The feeling of that unworthiness or the past from your upbringing. Does it creep into those big moments is it a dialogue? Is it an in narration of I shouldn't be I shouldn't be here.ere Where does it crop up? What is it? It's not I feel very Now anyway I feel very I'm good enough. I understand my power. Yeah I do and I feel I am what I know what I have to offer. And like you know, it's great actually doing things like I mean, I think when I'm acting, I feel like I'm a good actor and I feel I, you know, I do tell the story and I can be Wrenching I can be funny I don't have a problem with that. I don' I'm not insecure about Yeah And in the thing like like, you know, like at Pit luxury, I am really aware. I understand what I bring. like what it means what I can provide to the theater and to the because of me being famous out and coming, coming and then me attracting people to come and what all that means. I absolutely get all that. I don't have a problem with all that No, it's not really like that What it's just that sometimes I I can get triggered by certain personalities. I will allow them I will allow people to be Well, ab beesf, I suppose. Af and they, you know, it could be sort of And it doesn't happen very often, but when it does, I will I think, o, I should have stopped that sooner. I should have seen that coming That's that's that's my expxort, so we call it Blindpot Blind spot. Yeah Yeah. That's what it is. And it's also like one of these things because I am so confident and I understand some I am very self aware, I think Ecept and then when something like that does happen and it did happen actually, you know, relatively recently And I'm mad at myself for having allowed it to happen and not having seen it. But that's the whole point. That's what you that's the whole point is that you It's so ingrained. for all for all my formative years That was my familiar. was someone undermining me and telling me I was And also the thing of getting pleasure out of hurting you something that's so difficult to like that I I You know, you know, that thing that people actually you can see they're enjoying this power that they have over you. And also it's think about when you are famous and blah blah, blah And I bet you know this too that people kind of want to bring you down sometimes. And it's just really like, why? why do you I'm not doing this to you. What is it about it's all about them, of course, their feelings of insecurity So that's the thing's hard, I think. It's just this You walk into a room and there's a People know a lot of stuff about you have loads of opinions about you You don't know them or have any opinions about them. And you go in open like this. And even when you are open like this, it can be interpreted in a different way because of all the I guess they've got about you. That is exhausting. Yeah And especially when you go into situations where you're having to genuinely interact and connect with people, you just realize how much of a sort of how much work how would you got to scrape through it or to get to them, you know? Yeah. and you've also got to It's such a strange thing. you've got to go I'm a human. I'm a nice person. Yeah I'm just regular guy, you know, it that is exhausting and bonkers. It was funny when I started the job at Pit Locky. I sort of said that I felt they wanted to do these, you know, I' doing that for Fading San. Yeahes it was a TV show. film. They want to a documentary film about me doing it and about me starting this job and I thought, I don't want to go into this arena, a new arena for me, you know, running a theater and then and I'm like, o, you know, famous person comes to run the theater and with a film crew, like the first time I'm meeting all these people with a film. So I said no. I didn't want to do it because and I said this thing I felt like I thought people thought I was going be like Godzilla, stomping suuper luckery, you know, kind of And and And I was right to think that, I think that because people did have U, you know, there is a scenario there that people believe in. Yeah. And and so you have to a lot of the time starting in that job was about trying to sort of push that aside. and I genally feel I'm actually really quite good at that. When I'm in a room with people And they see me And you know what the you know I think did it when I felt like I've got them and this is they understand me was when I DJed a big party and we danced our tits off. Yeah. And I invited all the town to come My little flyer of media. Oh, I play all sorts of I'm like into puppy disco funny, you know. Oh I like that. I love all just and I dance myself. Yeah. Like now I think since I'd be when Id you know, I've done a few I've done it I like teaching. But I think when I go to a club and I think or at a party, I think, why is the DJ not dancing? Why the fuck should I dance? So the DigJ is not dancing in arosse manner. Yeah, I don't like that. So I dance too and get everyone dancing And it's just such fun. and they had they had flyers for it in the chip shop. and the c up And other people from the town came and I feel it was a really So good levela Absolutely Absolutely. And I feel if you can't dance and let go And also I feel like I'm good at losing my inhibitions And I think I'm good at encouraging people to lose in the business because I'm basically saying, I'm not going to judge you. And that's what it is. you create a because I'm like bonkers and dancing away, so why can't you? And It is such a thing that's hard for some people to do, but I love it when it happens. Yeah the best And it is ultimately so bonding because I think then you go into work the next day. and we've all had a lovely dance the night beforeolly It's a sigh. it's a sigh of relief. Smmer is here, which means we all want to look and feel our best. A GLP one may be right for you. Visit orderlymeds d. com to learn more about which GLP one you could be eligible for. Getting started is fast, easy and happens virtually through telemedicine from licensed professionals. Check it out for yourself. G to orderlymeds d. com slash podcast Oderly Meds. com slash podcast. Taking care of yourself feels great. CompAa medications are not FDA approved eligibility required and determined by licensed provider. individual results may vary your whatbsite details When you were talking a moment ago about Certain people that can trigger that feeling in you, I totally know what you're saying because I have it with it's quite niche. People that I know have gone to like a fancy uni Here all men who are journalists. It is that combination. Right Yeah. So when I sense that that's who I'm being interviewed by, they went to Oxbridge and my instant thing, I'm making it allop in my head because this might not be the case, but they're going stupid, uneducated, like they're just judging me from the get go. Some have been vile. That's probably because some I've had a couple been. So you're vile mom I am. And what happens to me in that moment is I become Probably thirteen. L in my Like in my body, I can feel like, oh my God, I'm like this I've sort of fold in on myself. I feel like a silly teenager because you do sort of regress back to you whatever that. may have been back then. Yeah. Do you have that sense like you become, is it childlike in that moment Ugh I think maybe I I'm just don't think about this recent thing, what I how I Now in a funny sort of way, Well, I tried it was two phases. So the first bit, and I suppose was is the bit you're talking about the triggering Try super hard I tries to, I think what is wrong? What have I done wrong? that's I think Miakkuba Miiakubo, what have I done wrong? What is this how can I I'm not doing this right? I should have, you know, and which is You know, I'm worthess. I'm terrible. And it's not I don't go to that in general in my life. when when I'm challenged in that way and I feel like I'm not I'm doing something well or I'm letting someone down go o, it's me I've got to work, I' got to do. And then there comes a point when I'm like Oh would know. How dare you I, you know, and I have Look, what's lookook at the situation here and I completely turn. So just I wish that would The first bit would be less Yeah because that's and because then I'm like Oh this is what we're going to do here This is what we're going to do and we're going to be fair and we're not going to, you know We're not doing this. No no, no,. And that part I just and also because I was also I also do What did you think you were doing? Why are you trying to undermine me? Why would you do that? you know, that when when When that happens, I actually conf I'm very good that's the thing. I'm very good at confrontation. Oh are you? Yeah I'm working on that one. I've got I don't know why got so much better at it. And I think the thing is sometimes when you say that, people think that means you're good at shouting. and confrontation That confrontation is just going, I want to talk about this I'm not going to do that. whichich is so healthy. People want that. We want to know where we stand with people what the boundaries are. Yeah. It's like even saying I don't want to take a selfie Yeah, you know, that's actually a conf confortter and when I'm I've just got really good at it over the years and I'll just say to people, you know I I don't want I need to talk to about this or bl bl. that rather than getting angry about it or storing it up, which is probably what I used to do. Same when I was younger It's actually been really interesting that I'm right now I'm in the middle of the High L musical in Scotland with forbs and might you know who we wrote the S thir. Iool you brought it back for this. right. So nice. I love it. Oh it is. so born cur. And Shon Redmond and Patrick Richart, the original two actors in it We're all in it and you know, we're all a thousand years old and it's worth like these bunch of amazing young actors who weren't born when the series first went. It's so nuts But it's been interesting going back to Wking with Forbes or even working with Savon and Patrick it' thirty years later. and just and I think I I am I I think I deal I deal with things in a different way, you know, I know I don't Like Forbes and I, I think I say to him I don't think we should do this or we should, you know, rather than Perhaps in the past, I think I would have stored it all up. sort of hoped I was sending the signals to him that I wanted when when I might not have been. Yeah. And now I'm really clear about it. I just and it seems like you're being doo d but actually you're just being cleared. Oh it's so much better than building out better resentment and then pissed off or being passive aggressive or no one wants that. No. I think it's a great life skill having It really is I'm not quite sure how it happened, but it has happened. It's so funny. o I remember like recently a couple of years ago I was my house in New York was been renovated and the builders said, Oh, yes, you can move in on this certain date. So sell your old apartment. It's ready? Yeah, we're ready to go. And then we sold the apartment really fast and they said, Ohh, there's a three month delay. And I was furious. furious And I remember I said to them the head of the building, I said, If this was a restaurant, you'd give me a free meal. What are you going to give me And I did this whole thing and he sort of and I got fle some free, I got another year of warranty and I didn't have to pay the thing after a certain date. And it was like fair you know, ye and everything and I told my business manager about this And and he said Gosh, you're really good at confrontation. I wish I was that good at confrontation. I was like, I don't want to hear that from you, my business manager. But what was hilarious was that When it was all finished And you know, like when you have finished like here it's called snagging. Right Yeahah. So we're having that in our place up in Sotland right now, snagging snagging Yeah.id they call it something else America can't remember I was coming out of the house one day and the man I'd time with And he was scared of me after that He was coming up the steps and he saw me and he kind of blanched And And he said went, Ohh, well, so Alan You know, you're here in the house now and it's so beautiful and it must be it's worth all the trouble, isn't it And and I said and I just think This is like I I'm so glad I have the skill that I actually can say these lines. thinkink of these lines at times. I said, My rage for you is diminishing, yes It So theatrical. Is its so Betty Davis M for you A s a rational comment, yes I love that. I'm I need to use that in the future. I'm on a very good path towards that. I used to be so bad at confrontation I've just done a book tour and me and my friend Paora, who were chatting about this very subject of people pleasing and not wanting to rock the boat. Yeah. sort of thought of like the worst one that we've both done, which is when you're in a massage and someone is really going to town and they go, is the pressure r? You're literally crying. And you sees a pressure r and you go, It's great Why are you not saying it? This is stop. It hurts. Yeah It's mad. Anyway, I'm not there anymore. I'm not where I'm in the middle getting that. is That's such a good example. This is so ridiculous. Before we wrap up, we've already touched on music and your love of DJing and playing great tunes. We are making a happay Pl playlist where we're going to put all of our guests have put brilliantly happy songs on that or songs that make them feel buoyant and Jubil and want to dance around. What would you put on our playlist Am Iow there's a there's a mash up by David G How do you say again Geta? G, Geta, geta of Clim Mars Is this one you couldn't play on desesert Island? Yes And and so because I don't know why I couldn't play it because it's a BBC Yes, PBC. So It's the Plyimers five hundred miles. Sa titanium ones midnight oil I always get which one's the band and which one's the song Time has come. Oh yeah. too say fair's fair That way What a mash up Honestly, geni We're putting that on there. No one else just unsurprisingly has put that on there. It's amazing. becausecause also It starts with the midnight oil thing and then everyone's, o, and then it goes, d d d d, d d, d d d d d and And it's, oh, it's seeia. Th then its then you hear. When I wake up. I was like, what? it's the Pclimers. And then you know, it keeps coming in at different times and its o it's so good. Des Island Dcks made you just play the proclaimers, didn't they? Yes. It was just straight up. No. it was great, but it wasn't Yeah It wasn't what I wanted to do. Yeah, because it was a mash up. it's on Sound Cloud and things like that and not actually It's not commercially available. That's what it is. We'll find it. We'll get it somewhere that's going on there. Have you done Do on disks? No, I'm not there yet. Vonde, please pick me. I'm really intrigued but when people cry because everyone cries. Yeah. And Yeah, well music evokes Yeah. E also when you're in it when you're doing it It starts And you hear the steam tune. Yeah and it's actually because you've got headphones much better you hear little seagulls and everything And you're like, Oh my Godd I'm actually on on ites And I've listened to it forever.ess. I love it. And I love when it's like some random scientist lady. Oh me I've never heard of. and I think, well, you're amazing. yeah. I love it. I love it. Storytelling it's so good Yeah, it's just' such a brilliant And so many people have tried to do versions of it over the years in different ways actually the old fashionedness of it and the thing they think You know, what can you actually what you have to think of what you would actually take for an island if you were going on an island yourself Marijuana seeds Why not? If you're gonna be, they might have a good time.ight and be chilled out. Yeah, you know. One of my favorites is Princess Margaret. Have you listened to that one? No. Oh my God, it's from obviously a million years ago. It is genius. Do you know, I'm obsessed with Princess Margaret. Me too. Be I love this I once insulted Princess Margaret. No you did not Forbes tonight it's so funny because recently've someone sent us this a picture of us and I you know those things that And it looks like Princess Margaret is curtsying to Forbes. I think she was just smallter than him, or maybe I don't know. It was a it was this is probably in the nineteen eighty seven or eight or something very long time ago. And it was a gala for Scottish ballet And she was the patron of Scottiesburg. Right. And it was at the time when You know, it was like when Andrew and Fergy were all bus And we were Victor and Barry, these characters and we were sort of huge in Scotland at the time. And we came on but it was a It was a frosty crowd. And we said this guag, we said I was like, Wh which one's Fergy like that? And Pin you know, Margaret's up in the thing. And he went, No, it's not it's Margt. I was, which one is she like this? And and Fz went that's up there. munching the chocolate liqueurs. That's what we said, Kind of funny. That's great. And the whole place is what Oh look that and only with it o And my friend who was sitting near her after I thought it'll be fine. it was it's little for everyone, but you know, everyone's nice when you saw him afterwards, you said, Oh, Alen. And I went, Oh I said, was it really bad? Did she really look like she was offended? And she went She visibly stiffened. Oh I love visibly stiffened And so then we met her. She was nice when we met her. One final quick question, Where Alan Cing is your happy place? And my happy place is att home. at home, I think probably It's either it's either it's maybe in Lock Lada It's like that it's leaning against Magga O it's in I have a place in the Catskills of mountains. It's northern New York. so w city. And I have a place there that my brother said is like I've bought my childhood and I feel that It's I'm complete I made it. You know what I mean? I made it was I built the cabins and stuff like that and I feel that's I feel that's a really great achievement as well. I have a sense of achievement and it's just a sanctuary and it reminds me of Scotland. And yet it's my it's like my it is it's like my childhood that I've The things I loved about my childhoodbringing