Final Thoughts and Happy Place

Hello and welcome to Happy Place with me, Fern Cotton. This is the show that helps create your personalized mental health toolkit. Today, I'm chatting to Ashley Roberts. I've got a heavy lineage of extreme you know mental illness and people struggling. so it was super important for me also to make sure within myself that I felt like I could have some tools that make me feel stable. I do feel like we have habitual patterns on the way that we think and cycles that we go through within our minds And when I do some of these breathwork practices, I have a way of thinking that is more joyous, more possibility and the more I am in that state, then like my reality is starting to shift. My foundation for stress is becoming stronger. What got two lovely people, How are you? Now I am late the party with a lot of things. sometometimes when something's like very zeitgeisty, I think So it has taken me Mths. to finally get around to watching Whering heights Now this has no connection to this podcast episode whatsoever, but I need to give this airtime becausecause if you haven't seen Muthering Heights Like, I hadn' What are you doing I cannot tell you how much his film impacted me. I loved every millisecond of it First of all, it is just beautiful to watch the costumes, the sets The way that Emerald Fenneel, who directed it has created these beautiful, magical, fantastical scenes with these rooms that are like starlined or the colour palette matches the person's outfit. I just found it aesthetically so beautiful, but Now I must move on to Margot Robby and Jacob Aaudi the most fantastic pairing of all time in a film. First of all, his northern accent is absolutely spot on. If you're Northern listening to this and I'm wrong, you can have a go at me. But I thought it was flawless. And Margot is of course, just exceptional and beautiful and I'm in love with her. but I thought like a few friends had said to me, you're going to love it. It's like all sexy and gorgeous. It was a bit sexy, but more so it was pure romance and love like their love story And I have never cried so much watching a film, Maybe past Lives, that made me cry quite a lot too. But I was crying so hysterically and I think I cried for about ten minutes afterwards, like heaving sobs and it reminded me Every now and again, we just need to have a good cry I love having a good cry either listen to like John Hopkins music for Psychedic therapy. that makes me weep my head off or I need a sad movie. So if you need a good cry Watch Whering Heights or past lives. I haven't got time to tell you the synopsis of that. just go watch it. It's bloody brillant Um anyway, I digress hugeually because I'm not talking about Whering Heights whatsoever We crying, really, but let's talk about Ashley because I just adore this woman. It was so lovely to get proper time to chat to her. We've known each other on off over the years for like quite a long time. Obviously when she was in the pussy cat dolls, we'd crossso for certain work things because I was working in radio and in TV and she would come on the show But now of course, she's a radio presenter on heart and definitely has a much more calm and considered way of life, just about. She wrote a book called Breathwork because the practice has had such a huge impact on her mental health, particularly after the absolute insanity and at times toxicity of being in a girl group in the nauies Now the Pty cat dolls are coming back. They are touring again and I cannot wait to go see them. but This time round, they're in their forties and they have a different approach to the whole thing, which we actually talk about a hell of a lot We talk about feeling comfy in our own skin, which is an absolute treat pressures of feeling that you cannot stop and you can't slow down. We also talk about sleep a lot I'm a shit sleeper Ashley's a shit sleeper. So I think we had like a real meeting of minds during that part of the chat just going, o my god Get it Be there's nothing more fucking annoying than when you tell someone that you're having trouble sleeping, them saying, have you tried lavender spray? I could literally scream when someone says that to me. I've tried everything Cuse tried lave to spray anyway If you ever shit sleeper, you want to be herearing this chat Right, let's do it. This is the show. Aortunateally, I'm so thrilled have you on the podcast. I am so thrilled to be here. I feel like we've been chatting about this. We have. like putting it out in the ethers. We have. I wore my buttercream yellow for your happy place. This outfit is something. I wish I had not worn jeans as a jumper. It's kind of dirty. I'm sweating my to and tits off under here, so don't you worry. We just got a great ree podcast moment of discovering, we are nearly exactly the same age. Yeah, we're in our forty and fabulous era. Virgo sisters. So those sisters? Yeah, September babies. How do you not know that? I am like days older than you. That's so wed. Beyonce is one day younger than me. Okay, I see, I thought she was closer to mine, so I am No. I don't know my facts. Well who else do we have around A girl South Gate same day as me Fabulous. Yeah, we love a Virgo. We love a virgo Because we operate in exactly the same cliche way and I wish it wasn't true. L I've got one of my friends Giles, he's a Virgo. Yeah. We're the same person We want the order O things neat. Over analytical like brain who goes into Langston. Yeah. Soft critical. All's just we're the same. I know. So we get each other. It's Christmas. It was like Christmas time, right? People were just getting it on. And here we are, here we are. Eactly. Parents were having a Christmas fling and then September up pops a baby. Hey! Hello most time. Oh my God, I want to talk about so many things today. First of all, I was texting you during the South African jungle. Get me out ye. Me and my daughter loved watching that together. It was so fun. And I was giving my daughter, who's ten a whole kind of revision on the Pussy Cat dolls and what you were about. and she's now your're like number one fan. I love her. She's ten generation, ten obsessed. obsessed. I mean, the TikTok world actually does know some of our songs. I don't think they know who we are, but they do dance theong around. Yeah cool stillil I'm like, I always popp up on TikTok. Here we go. M still got it ladies, you still got it, all right. The jungle always to me looks like it must be the most amazing experience slash utterly grueling and brutal. It's insanity. I can't even belie. absolute insanity. But you know, that show changed my life. That's the reason I li here. That's the reason I'm adted Brit is because that show Fourteen years ago, I can't believe that it's been fourteen years. Oh. And I went on that show with just no expectation, came out the other side with just a whole new world. and it was so exciting C over to the UK and outside the dolls, Be me and Aa, I'm really proud of that, do you know? We feel like you very much are I feel like I'm yours and I like it means it makes me emotion when I talk about it because you just, I don't know, it's so rare that you're accepted by Another country the way that this has happened. I feel even weird saying now but it's yeah, it's The life that I've had here has been so amazing and beautiful and supportive. I've got great friends. I've been able to do so many fun things and I think I needed it. I needed to kind of get out of the bubble I was in over in the States. and so it was a beautiful blessing. Yeah, do you know what? Reading your book Breathwork. I learned so much about you, because I've seen you on and off over the years when you've been on celebrity Jews or we've been at aast together or whatever But I didn't know half of your backstory and some of the stuff that you've been through. and also just the The wildness of your career up until this point, iss crazy what you've been through. Yeah, I mean, I guess in a lot of different ways, right? the human experience can be challenging, but I've also gotten to do a lot of amazing things and wear a lot of different hats. So you know my friend asked me the other day because she was like, if someone was to say, okay, this is the package, right You're going get to do this and this and this, but It comes with this Yes. Would you still say yes And I'm like, yeah, I still say yes. So you know, sometimes the bad comes with the good. And sometimes the bad also s you transform into a person that's been able to use what you've been through to give a positive light or knowledge to. So it's a really good question your friend asks you because I think about that often. You know love I love what I'm doing now. There bits of my career haven't loved. R. But I've learned lots and there's been lots of excitement. But the bad bits are shit and there's no et away from that. It is a harsh industry and you're on the receiving end of outside commentary whether you like it or not, unless you are really thick skinned. It is shit. and I still would do it. othertherwise I wouldn't be doing it now. I would have quit a long time ago. but two things I think can be coexisting Yeah that you love it times it's brutal. Yeah thousandousand percent. Yeah. I mean, your thought can be true. Yeah. I mean you're revisiting a big bit of your career by Go back to the world. I am so here for this I reinvented era. I mean Well, even like you said, like when you sent me a picture of you with the girls and I was like, how do they even know my songs? Because like, you know, you and me we would have been at the same age. the same kind of things. listen the same kind of music. and it's just wild to think we're gonna be able to have that nostalgic moment with everybody, but also reintroduce it to Younger generations are going to love it. We're all going to love it. It's going now gigging, what around U Sorry excing. We are in rehearsals at the moment. OMG, my back, my legs, my thighs, my neck, like everything is just like You know everybody's like, No, you're shape, you got this. I'm like, No, this is a whole other beast. It's like running a marathon in heels. I can't imagine. I watch the videos on Instagram and I'm desperately trying to do the dance routine alongside you like unsuccessfully, but is they are amazingout. amazing choreography. You a lot of like titties in Yeah, yeah, ye out in the world in the lower backs Oo, we feeling it now. But you know what? Also it's I don't know, we're like screw it. L you never know when we're gonna to be able to do this again. So you gotta do it. We gotta just do it. We gota say yes and just go for it. I also love the video of you retrying on some of the outfits from back in the day The hot pants that are like Tiny little knicknacks. The hell did I say yes to that? This not like, you know, you look at like Addison Ray, right? who just rocks it now and she know ' a naughty sort of Fashion is coming back.. My U K is happening. but I didn't even like it back then and I'm like, why did I just say yes to that? I could have just been like put a little extra fabric at the top I'm not wearing that style anymore, that's for sure. I didn't look cute then, I don't look cute now and now. I was like, things were popping out of like all different spaces. I But it was fun to reminisce. My mom was there. She has the box of like, you know she's kept it. She's kept it all. we brought it out. We dusted it off. It' fashion show. You say in this book that you quite literally came out of the womb dancing. Yeah Which is just a beautiful thing to feel you've got that like in your bones. you know, that's just like that natural thing that you do that your body needs to do. It's how you express yourself Yet you say when talking about this in the book Then one day you couldn't dance because dance became wrapped up in toxic experiences and behaviours as well as traumas. Yeah. that must have been Yeah, it was. It was absolutely heartbreaking. I couldn't even actually watch dancing because I would just I would just be bursting into tears. I came out of the womb dancing because my dad also was a drummer percussionist and so I grew around music being played all the time. and it was all of a sudden I started wiggling little putning some dance classes. and I left it like Oh, it was my best friend. It was my meditation, was my escape. It was my expression like you said. and you know for My whole life, all I really wanted to do was get out there and perform And so when it became my job, I was like, well, this is epic. But then it went kind of got wrapped up in this bubble of a major pop group that was, you know global success It sort of yeah, I got a bit like on the other side and I was like, well Who am I actually outside of this? right? I felt just very lost, very disconnected to the one thing that actually made me feel like It was like the essence of life to me. didn I just didn't really recognize myself. and it was a really, really tough time because I always leaned on that just to make me feel better. and it seemed like That wasn't That wasn't present anymore. So I went on a journey I adventure. I guess there's always a moment where if your passion turns into your job, it slightly loses that magic because you don't get to dictate necessarily how and when and for how long you do that thing. It's just like you will do this every day whether you like it or not. you're going to lose that magic, but this seems like more like it was Well also I had, you know, I had trained my whole life so Doing pussy cat doll routines is fun and it is a beautiful form of dance, but all the sort of technical stuff that I'd worked on for so long, it had gone away. And I sort of walked in and I was like, okay, well all I want to do is go in a dance studio I don't know why I feel weird saying this because But like I felt my ego was kicking in and I'd be judged because I'm walking into a dance space with other dancers that might maybe know that I was a part of this group like Oh, she doesn't look good as she used to. You know what I mean? orr something? And it was just, it made me sad. I felt just very Yeah, disconnected to my my my soul really because that's my soul and dance, you know, was just They were intertwined So yeah, it was a tough time but Now I'm able to sort of I can hear my friend Lucas, Lucas McVarlan. He's a choreographer. He's brilliant. He's done loads of films that you would know and choreographed my strictly piece that I dedicated to my dad. And he he's always like, you're so hard on yourself. I'm like, Yeahah, but you know when you just can hit something a certain way and then all of a sudden it's not there I what you know, being in these rehearsals at the moment is quite nice because even though it's tough We're having to push through it Yeah. And then when you do that, you actually get on the other side of it Oh, that actually feels a bit easier. Oh, my back's limbering up a bit. my thighs, my quads are able to support me when I'm in a squat. Yeah for a few minutes this routine Yeah. I mean, it's the humbling notion of getting older. I mean, we're in our forties, we're in our prime, but like I used to run constantly and love it. Yeah. I cannot run for more than two K now without my knee. It literally feels like it's falling apart. So I don't and it's kind of humbling. Or like I would go out joging and then this twenty year old would sprint past me I' used to be that? That's what I used to be like. It's so frustrating, right? Oh my go. I'm like trying to be okay with it. Yeahah, it frustrates the hell out of you, but I know. Well you're still, I mean, you're looking amazing in these videos. it's insane. But how is it stepping back into that space? If I don't know how you felt know leaving the band initially and having that hiatus, but it sounds like it wasn't all fun in games. And also I know from being in and around the music industry in that era, it was not a nice place to be always, especially for women. I think it was a really brutal industry to be in as a woman in that era, Is Is that your experience? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, the Naughtis were wild, right? Sometimes stuff comes off on my algorithm of people asking women on red carpets. know their weight is, you know, we had paparazzi at that time that used to like throw stuff under our skirts to get shots because the whole Brittany thing had happened and then that was sort of like a trendy thing was to get women. I mean, Perez Hilton used to draw dicks on her face, you know, and like circle where cellulite was and like it was just a wild time. Like you look back and like, how What was that Okay, it wasn't okay. but Yeah, it was definitely becausecause really all you want to do is go out there and just entertain and and do what you love and you know, wear some fun wild outfits and have a good time. But there was a lot of extra stuff coming up. know music industry was well, the industry in general The entertainment industry was I mean, at what point did you think, o God, my dream job is not the dream. I'm not enjoying this. Well, I mean being on stage always outweighed everything for me because It's just like everything just disappeared for for know that hour and a half that we were out there, like you could be going through something at home, you could twisted your ankle. I don't know. And it's like something sort of like it just disappears and you become really present with the audience And so that for me always outweighed it I guess until a point where where it did in a sense. we did get quite burnnt out like You know so many years on the road and at that time We were we were working for a well oiled machine and You know, it wasn't necessarily what our best interests our best interests weren't at the forefront of their minds. it was more like, well then how much money can because it's like yeah, exactly. Oh like they can do two shows a night, they can do another bit of press. You know, if there's more to be had, you'll be put out there. That's how the music industry works and peopleople really understand, you know, I would again, see it from the outside being in a radio studio whatever, how many things bands would do a day? or they'd be in two countries in one dayah we not know where you went. Yeah That was it. We were in three different countries at one day at one point. I remember I actually said in front of an entire Stadium the wrong city and they were like rivals like a booed by like twenty thousand people. And I was like, what's happening Because you just again, like you said, you don't know where you're at Yeah, got to the point where just, you know, our bodody started shutting down. I mean, you were hospitalized for that. It was, Yeahah. They I was I was sick several times actually, but, you know Again, I grew up in a dancing sort of sport like mentality where it was like go, go, go. the show goes on, no matter what. you know I show up, I get the job done. I mean now that I've own up a bit, I'm able to sort of balance that out a bit more and look at that from different perspective. but at the time I was like Oh, I'm just this is, you know, I'm just supposed to do this. like get it done, get it done, no matter what. And then my body just at a point was like, Yeah we were done Fitos. and they thought I was having bra which is just insane. because the symptoms were what for you at the time. Yeah, so I was actually in London and I got I was really sick and I was vomiting and my head was like just ringing with pain and I kept thinking, well, it's going to go away, it's going to go away. and actually team every time I puked actually like my brain was start to calm down a bit. So I kept thinking, I'll be okay, I'll be able to get on the flights because we had to show the next day And I ended up, you know, being taken to the hospital. And I remember them asking me like, okay, well you need to stay here overnight. I was like, well, no, give me whatever you need to give me. I need to get on the plane to go to the show and they're like, you need to just chill out Anyways I went to have a brain scan because I thought maybe I was having a brain aneurysm. And then I got viral arthritis, which didn't even know was a thing on the way walking to get the MRI So I couldn't bend my knee. So I didn't have choice. literally my body was like, your by you screaming? Yeah, like we're done. And that's so interesting you say that because I When I got out of the dolls, I had eczema and shingles and And this acupunctureist was like, if you don't scream, your body will scream for you. it has to find a way to get it out. Yeah, so But I think that's interesting at and reflect on because I think I would have just kept And we would have though. That was thing we all just were like And also there was a slight paranoia. I think for everybody, bands or the position I had where you think, well, if I don't do it,, I'm out. someomeone else will do this job. And it all felt too fragile to say Can I stop for a minute and just like feel well? Because like clearly your body was freaking out at the time, but you still feel like, No, I've got to get on that flight and do that show. Yeah, and there was definitely a feeling of you know you'rereplaceable. So that also like hung over our heads in a sense. so you don't want to lose your job.. also want to do well and show up and be good. So yeah, there was a mixture of things going on. It was an interesting time back then as well.. So how are you for yourself? I'm not talking about the whole band, but how are you gonna do that differently so it works for you this time? Oh gosh, we are, you know, we're grown. like it's so amazing to sit down with these women. And I know them. I've known them for so long, right? But like I'm listening to them and I'm like, Ohh my God, like Kim's had three kids since we started this. you know, like I've gone through so many different journeys in my life. I've lost a lot of loved ones. I've gone and done, you know different shows or whatever that have helped me grow. And Nick's just been, you know, I think her Broadway show really life shifted her. I mean, doing that relentless schedule and that character. and we've just come together and we're like just I don't know. it just feels different There's more communication It's nice. I mean, we have to give every single lady though that came that's built this legacy because I mean, Robin Anton started Posticat dolls with Christina Applegate in her garage decades ago. And you know, every single woman that's been a part of this has built a legacy. So feel really grateful to be a part of it and really grateful for the opportunity to to get together with these these chicas and I try and really just enjoy it. Yeah is it is like we just we've all sat down and we've hashed out some stuff Rupture and repair is the thing. And we've sat down now and it's been like, shouldhould we just go out there and like Kick some assass, have a good time and just our hair around and hopefully inspire women and all humans out there to just I don't know, just to celebrate a bit more and hopefully bring a bit of joy to this crazy ass world that we'd be living in. I think this is something to do with being in your forties. feelels like There's some lovely alchemy that allows you to do the stuff that you've always loved doing. Yeah. but with just an extra layer of, I mean, maybe it's something to do with self compassion. like we like ourselves more Yeah I think there's less fox given. I will say that in certain ways. I mean, you know, still like have the In sabotur that we got to work on from time to side. gott to hate that guy. little one that comes out with the whip. and I'm like, okay, slow down. Yeah. But yeah, that's it. there's it's like I feel more connected to my body now than I did in my twenties. So to put these outfits on now, I'm like, okay. Yes, let's go. Feeling myself. Yeah. That for me is the best thing about being in your fouries. I mean, I had all sorts of body issues back in the day. so I was disconnected fully from my body, like hated my body Oh my God, I think like many of us did, you know what I mean? And I still could have days of it now. Yeah. But most of the time It over think about it, I just feel so grateful that I'm healthy and that I can move about and do the stuff I want to do. It's like the gratitude overrides all of it. Whereas back in the day, I think Because of stuff like Perez doing, you know, I made a documentary about Perez but Yeah. yeah, because I was sort fascinated in culture of like how is this happening and how How is this okay? And I found it all deeply fascinating, but I think you know, like hate magazine would put circles around us, like the circle of shame or whatever. And I think we all started to believe, and I'm not just talking about people that were with the circle of shame, but the readers going, is there something wrong with me? A I faulty somehow? And psychology around that Yeah grinding us. Yeah. Well, if they're pointing out this and this and this about this person, like should I be pointing that out about me? Yess not setting the best. Not great intentions out there, is it? I'm so glad that you're just all up for going and having a great time. And also for you to reclaim dance because I think like you say in the book that you think this sounds dramatic. I don't think it does at all, but a piece of your soul died totally get that. I mean in my own little way, I loved painting for years and years and I sort of stopped when I had a big period of depression. and I didn't paint I don't think I painted anything for about ten years. And then I got nervous that I couldn't do it. And then I just started two years ago and I am alive when I'm painting. like it makes me feel so sparky and well and like nourished and I think losing a big part of yourself like that, dance art, whatever it is for anyone listening It is a bit of your soul dying. Yeah I love your paintings, Fel. Thank you so. You're so good. Whenever you post something I'm like, I feel very childlike Yeah sort of spitely and there's something And I think dance has that, you know, it's such an important thing if you're a dancer to have that the ability, the execution of the movements to like move freely and feel that euphoria. Yeah, that zone. it's like a sense of of you're so connected to like I don't know, yourself this music, these beats, the energy like and how a sound can hit and how like the way you move your body can tell a story to someone that's listening or watching or however you you know want to to absorb the art form, but like it's just, I think it's magic. It is. Yeah. and it is. Even though you know, the body' a bit sore at the moment, it's nice to be back in the studio and like Kim and I really come from proper like dance backgrounds. and Yes can make be emotional. L being we were dancing the other day, just her and I And I was like, this is insane. Look at us go girl. Look at us go and I've known her for you know twenty something years. and then her kids walk in and they w to see us dancing and I'm like Oh my God, and they're dancing now and you know, I don't have kids myself, but I feel like I really get to see that connection and to have that love through her and her family. It's Beautiful. But look how important dance is you that it makes you Yeah cry. L This shit is important. Yeah. And my dad, you know my dad passed away. my dad loved me dancing and I told the girls, we' been so busy. but we did this private gig recently and I got off stage and I was like My dad my dad would love that. Like my dad would love that we're back together. so I also feel like it's In a sense, I get to honor him a little bit, honor our souls, you know, we get to reignite the the art form that we love so much you get back on stage and connect with the fans. like that's gonna be so cool. L We hope Pride we We're doing West Hollywood Pride is one of our first like live gigs and That's gonna be incredible I mean, when you think back to that period where You're not dancing. I'm imagining you felt pretty low at that point. Could you ever have imagined that you'd be back doing it again You know, people would ask me and they thought I was lying. I was like, I don't know. I don't really know if I see it. I was sort of possibility of it could be cool Um It's sort of like divine timing, I guess, especially when we got together a few years ago But then COVID stepped in and the whole thing went shit so we were like, Okay, maybe that wasn't supposed to happen. You know, then you go on with your lives and you're doing your own thing. and It just kind of it just started happening. We started having a little conversation. I was like, is this real? and And it's nice. it feels healing also within the space the dolls, you know, being able to us we come together and what we're doing at the moment. So yeah, so glad. Is you going come to the show? I'm coming, are you kidding me? Oh too. I'm gonna be My hips are gonna be all over the g. I am gonna be learning those dance routines. honey. Honey's coming. Honey' love her. She's gonna be cringing her head off watching me dance You you getting ready? I'm excited for her to it Part of your journey and big reason why you wrote this book is because during this period of feeling really shit, you saw an advertisement for a retreat that has kind of led you to everything since with the breathwork that has become a real foundation for your happiness, your mental health Yeah must have been a very fateful turning point going on that retreat. I had no idea what was What was ahead? I mean, I was feeling lost. I was living in Notting Hill and I was like I don't know what's around the corner. There wasn't a lot of work going on at the moment. and I was like I feel like I need to just go on a wild adventure. And feel like it's maybe I read I think I read like E P Love or something. I was like I G going to Bali. Yes. Okay it works for I'm going to Bali. So I'm gonna meet the medicine man. Yeah. And I just booked, I went on my own And there was a group of people, no cell phone, no technology, you know really delicious organic food. And guy that was speaking and these teachings and tools of life I don't remember what he said. I just remember going to these breathwork Kundalini classes Andaza what is this? 'causeuse I was like, inststantly, you were like, this is greatace. Yeah. I just first of all, I just was like Oh my God, like Just for a little bit, my mind was quiet or at least just calm or in like and I was like, oh, there I am Lock, I forgot that I could feel like this and that I can exist in this space I forgot And I was just like I want more of that. So I went seeking it out wherever I could. and kind of doing it just sporadically and taking different classes And then I went actually to a doctor I did some blood work because there's a There's a lot of mental illness in my family. and I was just wanted to check to see where I was at and maybe considering possibly the idea of having a family, but I was like, I just want to make sure what's going on here is okay, I don't want to pass anything down from what I've seen growing up, know it wass really tumultuous. It was really, really tough to deal with. And I I was nervous. And she told me, she was like actually Let's put that aside And let's talk about the way your system operates. And she's like, you get really stressed out very easily when you're asked to perform. And I was like She' like, wow, this is my whole life, What do you mean? And she's like, I recommend Breathwork or Kundalini, if you' heard of it. And I was like, oh my Godd, yeah, I love it. I've been doing it like spadically. This is amazing. She's like, it's almost like a prescription And I was like Okay, so I seeked out this teacher. And you're a Viro so you're like I like the prescription. I love the prescription. G me like, yeah, some structure a list, I'm ready And I found this amazing teacher and I was just like, I was I mean, I've been off in different parts of the world doing it for hours at a time during the day. I've done a two hundred hour course rows up at four o'clock in the morning, do an hour and a half before I go to work, do breakfast radio. Just because I was like the way I feel after I do these practices and these techniques, is a sense of peace, a sense of Joy you know, I do feel like we have habitual patterns on the way that we think and cycles that we go through within our minds And When I do these practices, I have a way of thinking that is more joyous, more possibility, more joy. and the more I am in that state then like My reality is starting to shift. My foundation for stress is becoming stronger. and my friends around me were starting to reflect back to me like, we see a shama That's so great. U Yeah, littleittle did I know would lead me to being able to write this book, but I'm just so passionate about it. Well when you know it works And I think when you know that you've got more autonomy and power over how you feel, how you deal with stress. I think most people listening to this, myself included don't like feeling stressed, but feel it all the time. feel powerless. So I think if you can introduce something where you're like, this is going to reduce it, this is going to enable me to get through this and cope. Yeah. why wouldn't you do it? And I mean I got you know, I've written a book about this. I talk about it all the time. I'm doing events now and stuff, but I need this stuff. like I have to do this and I don't have to. I also want to. I enjoy it. But you know, sometimes we're resistant towards the things that will make us feel better. I am all the time. It I'm like You are literally preaching to people to do this. I'm like, sit down and do it for five minutes. And then the second I start, I'm like Oh my go, I love it. Why do we do that toso? Why are we it all the time. It' like, No, I'd rather just be stressed and not take five minutes. Yeah Now I'm gonna to do like eight more jobs, even though I'm exhausted because that's what I do. I know I complain moan to everybody. Oh that's very much my cycle without a doubt. But I think it is I think to find the things that make you feel well Yeah are so important. And like you say in the book and you've just touched on, you know that you've got the poor mental health in your family and your lineage and there's so much research suggesting that we can pass that on whether it's because you're seeing it, you're around it as a kid or if it's neurologically or you know, biologically It's really rough to grow up in that environment. And you know, you saw your dads struggle when you were a child and he ended up taking his life actually around this time that you hadd been on this retreat. Yes So you had so much to deal with post pussy cat dolls, you're not dancing and then out of the blue, you lose your dad. I mean, that must have been just the most overwhelming time It was yeah, I mean, it's You can't put it into words really right? It's It was awful. You know, my dad dealt like you said with a lot. so I anticipated that something like this could have happened at some point throughout my life But you're never really prepared for it. And when it does happen, it's It's awful. And I think also, you know, not just my dad, I have I have it it's I've got a heavy lineage of extreme you know mental illness and people struggling. So It's u It was super important for me also to make sure within myself that I felt. like I could have some tools that make me feel stable because for a while there for a second, you start second guessing yourself like, okay, well, wait is, you know, am I Okay, and I've had sleep issues my whole life and I feel like when I did some EMDR, which by the way, you gave me that, do you remember that? Fern, you gave me that recommendation. What the fuck? Yes. So this was years ago. I don't know if you remember this, but I reached out to you because I had seen some stuff online at EMDR and you had been speaking about it. I don't know that that's led you to do it. Yeahon. Yeah. And you gave me someone in America that yeah, and I worked with her. And through her, I found out that the sleep deprivation stuff was because I was concerned that I would go insane if I wasn't getting enough sleep and by doing all of this. Oh it's gonna be brilliant. It like I can't it's wild. recommend it enough. and it's obviously not always easily accessible because it's not necessarily something you can get for free And that's a big issue but I think if you can get it, especially if like PTSD or when you do feel like for me, I had you know several things and some of them I haven't tackled yet, but one of them was I could not drive on the motorway. And I thought this is actually becoming debilitating because I can't go and see my parents easily because there's no train route to the house and if I want to take my kids somewhere and it's far away, I felt really stuck And angry at myself. I couldn't do it And also live TV in terms of presenting, I still haven't done. and I don't have any desireative at this point. I think when I You know, my life is less hectic, I think, Oh maybe I would want to work on that but the moment, not a priority. But driving was a big one. And I did this I did about six months with this practitioner. been tipped off about And At first I was like, is this I felt kind of re traumatized at times and I really didn't want to go back to certain things that I'd experienced And then something clicked. And I had this one session where I sort of started laughing and I was like What's this about Eama stored in the body. It's in the fling body. It's in your bones. Fascia is. Stored in there. Yes. And that's what's wild When it starts happening, you cry, you laugh, you like it's just a release. Yeah. And when I do some of these breathwork exercises, you know, like I feel like that I get this sensation. I know when it's happening now and I get quite almost excited because I feel like my body's releasing and letting go And now I actually look forward to that because I feel like then there's going to be a nice shift of of letting go of stuff that we're holding on to on an unconscious level, right? Oh my Godd, I don't think we're conscious of like half of it. Yeah probably ninety percent of it. We're just so used to, I feel like this. I react in this way. I panic in these situations and we kind of see it set in stone. So I think if you can experience a shift like that and you know that you can move through it is fucking amazing, right king amazing. I'm so glad that that I had such an impact on you. Oh my God, tremendously and it then, you know, led me to I mean, I've always sort of been hopeful and inquisitive about tools and stuff that we can learn along the way to help, right? Beuse I'm like There's got to be other ways besides, you know, just going out and getting what shit faced and actually feel worse. And all of these sort of led me down this path and then Yeah, I mean breathwork has been such an amazing, beautiful thing that I've really connected with, probably the most outside of dancing. that gives me that feeling. Yeah. And now because I do a lot of movement when I do my breathwork as well and I put on some nice little playlists. so like I feel like you're kind of like dancing a movement at the same time using your breath Balance there. And how has it happen with your sleep? Be I'm a shit sleeper And I've gotten a bit better, but then I'm going through a bad patch right at the moment And actually last night was the first night in ages that I didn't take melatonin or I have anti anxiety medication if I need it. And I was like, I need to prove to myself I can do one night where I don't have anything. And I was laying there getting impatient, like, o my God, is this is not good. what if I'm awake tillil like one or two and I've got a really busy day tomorrow. And then thank God, I fell asleep by like half ten. It was fine. Yeah. And I slept on off till half five. I was like, actuallyually, that's pretty good night. I can cope with that But not being able to sleep is horrific. It makes you feel like dog shit. Sometimes it makes you feel like you cannot cope with like the smallest things in the day. There'll be a ton of people listening to this who willll be going through it Right now. Yeah. What has helped you in terms of sleep? honestly, I've had sleep issues since I was fourteen. I had a really, really bad episode when I was in high school, I didn't sleep for four nights and I thought I was going insane And from that moment, my brain just sort of on this belief system I struggled so much because we were, you know, and then I got in the dolls and we were traveling and mooving around different places, hotel rooms, different time zones. I got to go, you know, I' got to get up and make sure I perform well and I do well. I'm not going have enough sleep. the stress, the cortisol levels are just, you know, everything is out of whack. Um, For me, I don't know if you have a routine. before you go to bed. I mean, it varies. It shows you like Beg my children to go to sleep and then I read until I get sleepy, like that's my routine. Yeah. I mean, but that has made It calms me, the reader. Yeah, that's samee And I'm not big I wasn't a big reader really like growing up and stuff. but first of all, again, using breathwork to be able to regulate the nervous system is one. I love. I just thought this stuff was really boring. and I'm like, oh, I don't want again resistant towards it. I don't wan to do it. Like I just w to go to bed and go to sleep. like whyy not? I just lay there' stress. and I'm like, o Oh my God quarter those levels are rising, you know ruminating. I mean, I do think some stuff is hormonal at times. but my relationship to it first of all, is better than it's ever been since I was fourteen. I'm forty four years old. And I'm telling you the last few years this has just happened lastast few years since I was fourteen to just be forty four and now feel like I'm able to like Okay, I it's routine, it's ritual for me. And understanding that, okay tonight, if I wake up in the middle of the night and I'm fully anxious and I'm having the heartbeat and I'm like going over and over on the cycle in the head, I'm like, I just try and talk to myself. I'm like, okay, tomorrow might be a little tough because you might be tired. but it's okay, it's just going to be one night and you're able to get through this Back in the day I thought it would last for who knows how long and then I would feel like I was going to be sent after somewhere. Yeah. that would be the panic is you're never going to sleep again and therefore your life is ruined. Yeah. And actually I'm sort of I'm trying to talk to myself like I manage perfectly well with my ten year old who lately has sort of like been a bit finding going to sleep tricky Yeah And I go in to her bedroom ever before bed and I'm like, you know what? If you were to lie there all night just resting, it's okay. Yeah. And I say to her because she's only ten and I probably shouldn't say this, but I'm going to admit this. I go to her, just say in your head And she loves that I'm swearing because she finds it really funny. So she's like going go and say the thing and I go fuck. And then she's giggly and then she's in a good mood. she goes to bed kind of laughing. And then I can see her kind of like chuckling as she's lying there. And then when I get into bed, I'm like, noope, now say it to yourself. Yeah. Like forget. It's gonna to be okay. It's not the end of the world. L Yeah. Tomorrow,' be a bit sleepier. It's okay. you're gonna cope, but it's the panic before of this is it. Everything's going to be awful. Yeah. Ive had so many nights like that where I literally haven't slept before I used to get then OCD would click in and I'd have to go to the low. I would go to the Lou and I'm not even exaggerating. One night, I went out to a party and I got in way later than I wanted to like one two in the morning. and from two till eight AM I went to the Loo all night constantly, like barely anything coming out obviously. I'd get in bed, five minutes later, go for a week, get in bed, five minutes later, go for a week all night. And I couldn't not do it It was the worst. I can resonate with her It's the world. I know And you like No, I'm okay actually. I can just go to sleep. There's nothing me There's nothing to release. my have like over Yeah U like sort of a weird over awareness or like heightened awareness of my bladder Yeah Like it was full but there was nothing in it. Yeah. Oh my Godd, it' the worst. I know worst the worst. I mean, I will say like If I'm standing here being forty four years old and able to get some night's rest off just some natural supplements and some breathw routine, like it is possible. It's possible because I have taken everything under the sun for many decades of my life to just try and get maybe couple two hours, four hours of sleep just to be able to function the next day, but actually feel worse because of what you've taken. And if I can do it, I feel like it is possible. But again, as you know again, they'll be a night where you don't, like it's a bit shitty or you're going over something in your head But I also really try to just sit with myself like, okay, this is not going to be that serious tomorrow. like let it go And I even did I tried something trial and erroring a few things lately. Okay because I'm really getting into this neuroplasticity thing. trying to like understand it because I feel like we are our habitual thoughts, right? Even sometimes when I don't feel it, I'm trying to repeat things over and over again when certain things come up or like routine in the morning, when my feet hit the ground. evenven if I'm like, oh Godd, it's rain, it's gray. I' got to get up at five, I got to go to work. I'm like, todayoday is going to be a good day. So many amazing things are happening for you. You have so much to be grateful for. You're healthy. You have a beautiful family, you have beautiful friends. And I tell myself this every single morning And I've done it now for the last few months and I'm starting to feel shifts and changes and things So and again, I'm just trying to trial and error stuff on myself when I read or I, you know, see something online. I'm like, okay, let me give this a go. Yeah and see see what happens. T right. And I do yeah, you know, is there' stuff in this and So I think sometimes good a good thing is when things are feeling like they're out of control, like sit down, take a moment, take you some deep breaths and just say, okay, it's all right and repeat things that you're grateful for, repeat things that like They make you feel good Yeah. You You chey, but it's no it's so It simple stuff six stuff. I think also with sleep A lot of the time when we talk about sleep Yeah, it's all about what you do just before bed, but actually it's the whole day before that usually informs then how you sleep. And I have to remind myself of this because when I overload my diary because I'm like, No, I could fit one more thing in there or I should be working harder. or why is this not going as well as it should? And then I'm pushing myself and pushing myself, off course I'm not going to sleep. I go to bed with a full head actually, I learned something the other day, mean in not particularly comprehensive manner, but I heard this theory and I think it's like an old school psychological theory where It's about the vertical and the horizontal. So the vertical is like when we're walking about, we're moving about in our day and we're talking to other humans or we're even looking in the mirror, everything is very cerebral and it's like, I'm talking to you and we've like compartmentalized everything. we're just and we're looking at things in our eyeline. And then as soon as we lie down in the horizontal That's when we're like Hm Here's my inner world and this is my body and this is how I'm actually feeling. and it's one of the first moments for most people when we're like on the rush where we go actually do I feel all right? Like you know, and that's the moment where we have to process the whole day or our whole lives Wow, that'sit. I need to do more of that in the day rather than wait until my head hits the pillow Tw five minutes of even like, you know what I mean?. But like, yeah, you're right. And it's and especially the world we live in, there's so much stimuli, there's so much information, there's so many messages, emails, you know, we have to be on on on all the time and it's wild to think that then like all of a sudden yeah, okay, now go switch G. Some people can't do that. I'm like that is a superpower. I'm so jealous. Amanda Holden is like that. I work with You know, we all know ourselves. I love Amanda. Oh I amm so jealous. She how She's just one of those kind of people, you know, that can just their head hits the pillow and they're out and I'm like, Do you ever like write things down before bed? I sometimes think I need to get into the habit of that like get not only a practical list of you need to do this tomorrow, but also like, I'm fucked off about this. or like this is making me sad or like whatever it might be. I have in the past. I don't do that as much anymore. That's not necessarily a part of my routine, but I know that that works for many people to just get it out, get out of your head It makes sense. For me when I do my routine, I actually it's wild because I've started to, I think train my body in a sense to understand. like And then these supplements, I do also stand by as well. Oh yeah, like magnesium. So it's a magnesium three and eight. Lthenine apogenin. I've not heard of that one. Okay. The three of them combine Hubberman, I've learned it off of him neuroscientists. and Again I've trialed and error so many different things we need to. But doing yeah, I take those about thirty minutes before I go to bed. I turn my phone off. Yes. I do. I turn it off. I know it's such a big deal. I take those supplements, I have a bath. This is also, I mean, again, I don't have kids. so this is but I do this all in about fifteen ish minutes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. you know. It is doable U I do some breath work I do like box breath or four hundred seven eight or alternate nostril breathing or, you know, just anything that I know will get me into parasympathetic state And then I read and it's like I start to feel like, okay and I'm I built up trust within myself because before I dec get nervous. Oh you think you're sleeping? I guess noope, noope, you're not It pulled me back out. I know that feeling. And I've gotten to a place where I'm like, oh no, it's okay Not only is your book full of Aecdotes and helpful stories. You know, this stuff for me is helpful. I need to hear other people sleep badly. so I'm not like a freak at night going, It's only you in the whole world that's awake right now But you've also got really practical tips if you want to try box breath for your first time. And why? And looking at the parasympathetic nervous system giving us the information that we need to go, oh, I see why this works. because also what, you know, when I was reading it, I was really consciously going Yeah, know that's it. I breathing? Be I know that I hold my breath when I'm stressed and I' even do it if'm I'm really conffidently doing these podcasts. I love doing these podcasts and I've been doing them a long time. But if there's a bit of a chat where I feel nervous or a bit edgy, I know I'm holding my breath and I'm like, fuck I've not even breathed in for like thirty seconds That's not good., And every breath we take sends a signal to our brain and our body. And most of us are in fight or flight all the time Be're shallow breathing.ike you said, we're holding our breath. We're like we're not, you know breathing deeply. So byy even just the power of being conscious of our breath and extending that exhale and breathing through the nose as well. We activate the parasympathetic, which says, we're safe, we can relax, it's okay. And again, repetition, the more you do it, the more the your foundation for stress because you know, we're not going to exist in a world where we don't get triggered and stuffs not happening. It's not going exist. But at least like I call it my bounce back. My bounce back is so much quicker these days. whereere some things I would have paralyzed with anxiety, which you wouldn't my boyfriend's like, people have no idea because Just internally what's going on. because from the outside of say. thing I have the say same, I've done like live TV shows and I've been a panic attack the whole way through and everyone's like, I couldn't tell. Yeah. You're joking? I felt like I was leaving my body floating off to another stratosphere. Right? It's wild. So my bounce back to feeling like likeike not beating myself quite as much less whippy, whippy. and tal being able to talk myself and bring myself back to a more we call in like Kundalin and breath neutral state is quicker. than it's ever been my whole life and I really I really believe it's because I'm I'm showing up and doing these practices and these stuff that help my nervous system it's like, okay, it's all right, we can handle this. Yeah. I'm doing that regularly. Yeah the discipline, which is boring. No one wants to hear it. No one wants to shit is boring. Yeah it takes you got to do it every day, but you do. Yeah. You've got to do it. all the fucking time. Yeah. and I mean, even if even if you don't do it all the time, which I do suggest having like a daily routine. but even if you can sit down for like thirty minutes a week Once a week I mean, I'd love for you to do more of that because that just seems like nothing. Nowadays when I do like these lovely beautiful hours of this stuff. But even just that where you can feel that shift and state, its it's the shift When you start to be like, o, okay I feel a little lighter, I feel a little bit more peaceful, a little more joyful. I feel like I can think more in a state of like, oh, this could be possible. What if that works out? Actually there's There's a solution to that Um and that's that shift that happens. And I feel like, you know, sometimes a shift In your state' a mini miracle. Oh my God it is. I know and just to like let your shoulders drop like. A' just like. I kept doing it in the book. I was like, Okay, that's interestress I' write a note about that, Oh, not breathe again. Yeah,. I was like really focused on it when I wasming the book It's actually comicical. Oh you be h for of it. Yeah Its so funny. It's a bloody, briiant book, and and it's so helpful on a practical level, but also I think for you to so generously and courageously share bits of your story that I know we're not comfortable to talk about about or enjoyable to look back on. you know, it's a lot for you to go into your family lineage, but also all the stuff you've been through in your career. So I think it's a very, very helpful thing to share. So thank you. Well, thank you. I appreciate that. I mean, I think you know I wanted to in a sense also to show that like I'm doing these practices because of what I've been through. and I know that what I've been through is just really a human story at the end of the day because nobody gets out unscathed, you know? And so I hope it just inspires, you know, obviously, I'm passionate about breath workork, but like whatever makes you feel better. Exactly. Do doing more of that. Whver makes you feel well is wellness. Absolutely. Simple Yeah First of all, in this little end segment, I want to ask you We are creating a playlist of songs that make you feel Really great. Okay, can put Percy catiles in there if you want, but what are you putting on our happappy Pl playlist? Oh my gosh, this is such a pressure because It is my brains going in your brain different. My brain goes, I can't think of one song. The world Not one. I mean, there's like Oh my go, there's so many good ones I feel like that's like just typical. and I'm like I love Destiny's childild. So like Destiny's Child sururvivor is always a one I used to use that when I'd go in my cryo chambers and I' like I can get through this' horrible. So cold. C could you leave it? Yeah, they're chilly. Oh my God. Okay, I'll go with Desin' childild. Can' we don't you wish your girlriend a spot like me in there? Becauseuse I will now. Of course we can put in there too. It was cringy. Not at all. It's one of the greatest songs of all time Oh know what I'm excited for is we're getting to perform Clubsong, which is our latest single for the first time coming up. I'm excited about that. so far I mean yeah It's gonna be exciting. We're doing the American Music Aards and Buster Rhimes is coming out. How amazing. I'm so excited for this whole new era. It's so great Lastly, Ashley,, where is your happy place? me with my mom lovely mom. You know, I think that's I've been so lucky being here in the UK because I've got a really beautiful chosen family. but my mom is just I just love her to pieces and I miss her and I wish Phoenix was a bit closer. But yeah. That or beach, I'm good. Yeah, or beach with you mom. Perfect. I love. Yeah, absolutely. Well Ashley, I've loved every minute of talking to you and this could quite literally go on for weeks if we allowed it to. But thank you for being on Happy Place and good luck with everything that's to come. Thanks for having me Oh, thank you, Ashley That was So wonderful and I think For most people ike I don't think although Ashley's written a lot know about a lot of this stuff in her book, many people won't know a lot of Ashley's backstory, what she's been through and how she's dealt with it. So I'm so grateful that Ashley felt like it was a safe place where she could talk about all of this stuff and also more importantly, talk about some of the solutions that she's found. That feels very, very helpful The Pussy Cat Dolls tour kicks off in Europe later this summer. A massive thanks again to Ashley and to you, I love your loads