What Is Making Us Happy

This message comes from XL, providing an online learning environment intended to keep students skills sharp over summer vacation. The platform covers core subjects and adapts to each child's pace. Receive twenty percent off at xl dot com slash npr We've seen plenty of screen takes on Superman, but considerably fewer versions of Supergirl his cousin. Now, she's headlining a new movie, and it turns out she is kind of a dirtbag in the good way. Fearless and grumpy, Super Earl sets out on a quest to support a new pal's revenge journey. make a point that should really be clear by now. neverever mess with a lady's dog I'm Glenn Wellldon and I'm Linda Holmes Joining us today on NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour is Daisy Rosario. She's the senior supervising producer of Audio at Slate, where she works with shows like Death Sex and Money and ICYMI. Hello, Daisy. Hello, Linda. Hello, Glenn. How could to be here? So good to have you. We briefly met this version of Supergirl played by Millie Alcock in twenty twenty five's Superman starring David Cornswet. Her name is Cara, She's Superman's cousin, and she also was born on Krypton When this story begins, she's celebrating her birthday, getting very drunk with the only real friend she has, her dog, Krypto. She soon crosses paths with a young girl named Ruthie who has lost her family to an attack by a brutal villain named Crem They are played by Eve Ridley and Matthias Schoonards. Ruthie wants revenge on Crem and after he tangles with crypto and leaves him injured, Kara needs to find him too. So the unlikely pair begins the hunt Along the way, they meet a wide variety of colorful characters, both human and not, including Lobo, a biker dude and bounty hunter, played by Jason Mamoa The movie is directed by Craig Gillespie, whose varied resume includes I Tana and Lars and The Re girl. Maybe he just likesondes It's in theaters now. I'm going to start with you, Glenn. Obviously, you and I have spent a lot of time talking about Superman and his expanded universe. What did you think about this movie? I mean, I liked it. I think it's a solid addition to the canon. I don't think it's a game changer. I don't think it's setting out to be a game changer. It's setting out to establish that in this relatively new version of the DC Universe we're getting It's not a monolith that has different notes that you can play in different genres. And there's a real I'll be kind here. There's a simplicity to this story that comes straight from the source material, which is a book called Supergirl Woman of Tomorrow Tom King, illustrated by Bill Kiss Everly. It's a Western space and the motivation could not be simpler. You shot Madam Dog. The central dynamic of it is very true grit. and to be fair, a lot of things like it. you know Lonewolf and Cub, Logan There's a lot of stuff that kind of follows this same central dynamic I will say the book is a lot weirder than this movie is. It's got a little bit more grit in the gears than this movie does, and it does feel sometimes like the grit has been used to sand things down and make them a bit more You know, for Quadrant family friendly. and I realize that sounds like a complaint, but this is at the end of the day a superhero movie. so if it misses kids, if it doesn't reach kids, it's not doing pretty essential job of superheroes, but the fact is that with simplicity, with really established conventions of genre Get familiarity. You will know every story beait that hits before it comes. So what matters, you know is going to be the details of the execution. And I think Millie Alcock is great She's giving you layers. The villain Cram you mentioned is a throwway. He's a cartoon. He's trying to give you a lot, but there's not a lot of there there. And we get the introduction of the character of Lobo who you mentioned, a character that I've known. I remember reading about in the eighties and nineties. Boring then, he's boring now I don't think there's just enough there. He's kind of a one trick pony. I liked this, didnn't love it, really wanted to love it, but I liked it. All right, Daisy, how about you? What'd you think? Yeah, this movie just didn't really do it for me. I didn't want to love it. I just wanted to like it and I didn't even really get there. I felt like Millie Alcock was actually kind of miscast. I wish that she kind of was somebody who maybe more naturally had a sense of fun in her, like I think she's compelling in general. But I think the script being what it was, it would have been served better by somebody who's a little bit more comfortable with kind of some of the zaininess that they kind of put around but don't necessarily fully commit to. I was also really distracted throughout the movie by things that were not necessarily references but felt like They were inspiration. And the two main inspirations I felt like I saw early on were Guardians of the Galaxy, which know is a James Gun movie. He didn't direct to this or write this one, but he did write and direct Superman. and he's one of the heads of this new era of DC studios. And also like Mad Max Fury Road. And so there were things that kept reminding me of both of those And those are both really great movies, and this wasn't either of those. And I think if I had just felt that some of those things reminded me of those movies early and then it stopped, it would be one thing, but it was pretty consistent throughout the movie for me. So I just found myself constantly distracted by that. Yeah. That said, I did find myself feeling like You know, if you're not as easily distracted by these things, you might just be having a better time than me in this movie, but I think it just made it really hard for me to get fully invested. H I get that. I think I come down somewhere in between the two of you, probably a bit closer to to Glenn, I did enjoy it I like her. I did like Millie Alcock. I thought she was good in this. I thought she was fun in this I do like the idea, as we mentioned in the intro of kind of a dirp egg superhero, not that we have not ever seen that. but I did like that idea and I enjoyed her I think my issue was I would have liked to see, I think her in a different story And that's for a couple reasons. One is that you know, Glenn mentioned this kind of very flat villain of Crem Yeah. And you don't really get a lot of a motivation out of him. He's really just kind of a one dimensional monster, but it turns out that the one thing he is doing is essentially trafficking girls And I think there gets to be a point where like When your big source of tension is literally a cage full of screaming girls I think you have to do that off le carefully or it can seem exploitative, and I'm not sure they stayed on the right side of that line The other thing is that in several places You know, we talked about the fact that the story of Ruthie kicks off with her losing her whole family to this violent attack by Krem. I just felt in several different places like it was just too dark for what I want a movie like this to be. And we have been round and round and round about this so many times with superhero movies. How much do you want it to be fun? How much do you want it to be you know, heavy and serious There are certain rules that I have in my head about I don't want you to do X, I don't want you to do Y. We've already talked about the fact that they injure the dog. And that's one, you know rule that you're brushing up against And I felt like I got to the end, you know, there's a lot of trying to kind of triangulate around this question of should you kill people? what does it do to you to kill people? And I'm not sure the movie really earned where it was trying to get to with that question by the end. And that's something I want to talk to Glenn about because Glenn and I have talked about this many times. And I think without giving away plot points, did you find their approach to that question Satisfying? I'll say yes with a butt. because I think one of the challenges of this particular character is that different people over the years have characterized or inv vastly different ways. And they are keying off of this one book by Tom King and Bill Kseverly, which said, okay, here's the thing She's different than Clarark. and here's why. know, we do get a few scenes with David Corn Sweet's Superman And I think those scenes just point up how they really captured lightning in a bottle there, not just with that performance, but with that characterization of Superman as a kind of big, lovable dfus. and it does the thing that putting two very different characters or simimilar characters with different motivations together, you kind of bang them against each other and you start to delineate them. And it's those scenes where you contrast Superman and Supergirl You allow supergirls, it really sets her apart. Clark. has not suffered. He hasn't gone through it. He is coasting on What is essentially a very noble but completely unearned belief in humanity And life hasn't afforded Kara that luxury rivilege is what it is it's a privilege And if Alcock leans too hard into that cynicism. I mean she's writing a line here then Supergirl becomes an off putting jerk They show us how and why The values that she grew up with are not Clark's Midwestern values, this is something that the film, I think handled well. She wants to do good, and she knows that that's not the same thing as being nice because being nice is for show. It's about showing an outward face being concerned with how you' perceivive. and that's something that Clark We see in this room is very concerned about. That's why the suit Being good is about helping others being of use and not being particularly concerned about what others think about it And that's interesting. And I've, you know, long ago I wrote a book about Superman and that is actually a new wrinkle and I think that's the best thing about this movie. I think for me, that part of it though is why I really felt like she wasn't quite up to the material. And again, I mean, I don't think that the script was inherently strong per se. So I mean, I do want to be fair about that. But I found myself even during the movie, right? just trying to do a little fantasy casting. And I couldn't necessarily think of somebody who is really in the spotlight right now who could potentially crush it. But I did find myself thinking like, man, if you had like younger Emma Stone like back in the EZA era. like I would have believed her in this. L she can really do a range and has kind of a natural sense of fun to her that could work because I think that those things are B really hard But I also am somebody who really believes that you can kind of have them both in the same place, but you have to earn them and you have to really lean into them. And to me, it just felt very lukewarm in both directions. Yeah. We've touched on this already, but I think the biggest problem I had with this movie nuts and bolts wise was the villain is no good. It's not the performance I think script wise, this guy just sort of comes you with One tone, one note, exactly the same presentation every time you see him. And when you compare that to somebody like, you know, not only like obviously, yes, Heath Ledger's Joker and people like that, But even the different iterations of Lex Luther that we've seen over time, whether you more prefer the Gene Hackman somewhat more ingratiating Lex Luther or the Nicholas Holt brooding and yelling Lex Luther or one of the many others that there have been I think this guy just presents as blank menace. And part of the reason for that is that he does start off by killing Ruthie's family And there's no color that you can add to him when he's introduced in that way. It's not that Lex Lutor doesn't have his own list of dastardly deeds. It's that when you introduce a character who a lot of the audience doesn't know anything about and that's how you meet him, he just becomes kind of undifferentiated evil, especially after he injures a dog. I just felt like that was not a successful characterization. and like I would have bought him as like The second banana. The head henchman The henchman to a real villain. but I felt like I needed a meteor villain And instead of a meteor villain, we got Jason Momoa as Lobo, who's not the villain. He's a kind of a Well, yeah, like we said, Bounty hunter, biker guy. And I think they got so amused by that idea you sort of got that guy instead of a real antagonist. But this is where Daisy's comparison to Fury Road is very useful because immmort and Joe, also a larger than life over the top kind of ridiculous. But also a trafficker, also just as one dimensional, but hell a lot more compelling Is it the performance? Is it the fact that he's behind this weird mask? I don't know, but there's something different there. This guy is definitely giving number one. and it's not what you want from your main villain. No. I don't think so. Well, and I think Jason Mmoa, I mean, to me, like he is just compelling. He's silly. you know, I don't know what he would do with like really, really heavy material, but that is a guy who shows up for work and knows how to be on screen. And I feel like you can feel that energy when he does show up. And so it was almost like a breath of fresh air. It doesn't spoil anything just to say that he's it's not like he's in a ton of the movie. No, you know. You know, I looked at this and I thought, I have no idea whether the reason why they put Lobo in this movie because I believe Lobo is not in the book.. He is an extant character in the universe, but he's not in that particular book. I don't know whether the reason they put him in this movie was to have him played by Jason Momoa, but it felt like maybe that was what happened, in which case you can understand. I agree with Daisy. I think he's very charismatic I think what he does in this film is exactly what they brought him in to do. He does know how to make this very specific type of crack. insults to people and a certain nihilistic attitude while looking like a member of the Kiss Army. Like I think there's a lot to it that is clearly exactly what they wanted from him. I don't know if I think it works terribly well. Yeah. And the other thing is that one of the things that sets the book apart is the art and the colors. Colors of the book are just so vibrant and they really underscore that this is Outer space and there's kind of this seventies side of a van kind of heavy metal vibe and this is another movie that looks like every other superhero movie we've ever gotten, which is the kind of the browns and the raw umbers and the burnt siennas. It's there to do a very intentional thing, which to say, look, the Superman costume is really bold and primary colored, and that's what this universe needs intentional and I get it. And I think it was visually very effective Do I need to sit through another cloudy, murky Brown Yeah universe, I don't know. Muddled. Yeah Mudd. There were these moments in the movie when I would sort of go, oo, like that's interesting, right? Right. For example, there's a conversation between Ruthie and Cara in which Kara eventually says the suit doesn't do anything. And I thought, ooh, that's an interesting thing to push on because Is that true? Is that exactly true? Is it sort of true? Is it technically true? So I wish there' been a little more exploration of that. And I understand, listen, I appreciate the fact that they have tried to stop making all of the superhero movies three hours long. This movie is under two hours, which I my God do appreciate. I think that's the correct length for something like this. but I do think they haven't quite necessarily figured out the balance in terms of what to include. because there are some set pieces I enjoyed here But Also just a lot of like, ultimately, there's only so much that I want to watch a story like this with some of the brutality that this story contains. Yep, And I'm just girding my loins for the discourse because if this movie does not exceed expectations, people are going to be drawing the wrong conclusions about a female led superhero film It could be the story, folks. It could be the story. Well, sure, exactly. And they also have a tendency in some cases to make the movie about the woman not at the peak of the franchises success anyway. So I agree with you, brracing myself for discourse. We're going to try to think about it too much. All right. Well again, Supergirl is in theaters now. You know, I think we all liked at least some things about it, had at least some reservations about it. See what you think. Up next, what is making us happy this week This message comes from Odu, the all in one business management software platform Whether you're a small or large business, Odu gives you one flexible platform built to grow with you try today for free at odoo. com slash NPR podcasts This message comes from NPR sponsor, Raymond James, a financial firm offering wealth management, banking, and capital markets services that are inspired by people. Before Raymond James financial advisors build plans, they build relationships so they can craft individual strategies designed to achieve priorities and pursue what's possible That's the power of personal disisclosures at Raymondjames. com Raymond James and Associates Inc, member NYSE SIPic This message comes from XL, providing an online learning environment intended to keep students skills sharp over summer vacation. The platform covers core subjects and adapts to each child's pace. Receive twenty percent off at xl dot com slash npr Support for this inPR podcast and the following message come from Carvana. Selling your car, Carvana has offers so good, they're almost inexplicable. Sell your car one hundred percent online in minutes. Visit cararvana. com today. Now it is time for our favorite segment of this week and every week, what's making us happy this week, Daisy Rsario, I'm gonna to start with you. What is making you happy this week? So what is making me happy is an iconic piece of pop culture, but it is certainly not something new. I've been dealing with some health issues, which has me home a lot more. And when I'm home on like a beautiful day and I can't go outside, I find myself drawn to kind of like longer movies, epics, things like that. It makes me feel like I still did something for the day. So I don't know if you guys have heard of a little movie called The Godfather, but it heard of it But man, talk about a movie. that has never failed to live up to the hype for me. I don't watch it often, but it just lives up to it. I mean, the way that it is structured, the arc of the characters, the quality of the storytelling, it just is beautiful. And so yeah, in a time where there's just so much that does feel cheap, it is really lovely to kind of revisit some of these classics in this way. and that is the one that I did and it brought me a lot of joy. So I just felt like I should shhout out the Godfather, not that it needs any help, but just more to remind other people that you know, a three hour movie When it's earned, as in that case, it can be just such a wonderful way to spend an afternoon. There is never a wrong time to shout out a great repertory movie, like a great movie from from the catalog, great catalog movie, I'll say. Yeah waitning for your hot take on Godfather three. Yeah. Well, Daisy Rosario recommends a little movie What is it call the Godfather Godfather Godfather, right. all right. Thank you very much, Daisy, Glenn Weldon. what is making you happy this week? Well, as Daisy well knows, after eighteen years, the sllate Culture GabFest podcast is coming to an end. That's not making me happy. I've been a listener from the jump and you know, they have been the first to say that they did not invent the round table discussion format, but the fact remains that gathering around the table to discuss pop culture and talking about, you know very un sererious things in a serious way and vice versa, you know, serious things in an unserious way. They blazed a trail, and that shows like ours certainly have followed. I do feel like I have come to know the hosts of that show in that kind of unidirectional parasocial way I've certainly become huge fans of their writing, which I will continue to follow after the podcast ends. But you know, the fact is that Wednesday mornings are not going to be the same, and I'm grateful for the years they gave us But I have a very selfish recommendation from their archives It's not the episode that I was on, although I was on the episode, but an episode where they talked about something I love that also ties into this episode of this show, which is superhero movies, where they showed themselves to be Two or three of them show themselves be the kind of critics who change their minds about something. In June of twenty seventeen on episode four hundred fifty five They reviewed Patty Jenkins' first Wonder Woman movie. And it's remarkable to listen to because both Dana and Julia, two of the hosts, talked about suddenly getting it, seeing The simple wish fulfillment fantasy formula of superheroes working on them because That scene in Wonder Woman where she steps over the trenches and she's a woman in a silly costume kick and button taking names, and it was just as inspiring and joyous for them as Ive and it has been for me over the years. and something I've known these characters have the potential to be. The other host, Stepven Mattcaaff did not get it. He fell asleep during the movie because of course he did. and I would want nothing else. I would want nothing less or else for him I'm going to miss the Slate Culture Gabfest like an ach and I just want to thank them for being a part of my life for nearly two decades of it So that's what's making me wistful C' sayy. I'm so glad that you mentioned that. We definitely wish them well, appreciate everything they did and for sure, acknowledge the influence that they've had. podcasting world. So best wishes to all of those folks, both hosts and obviously production and everybody who has worked on that show. It's a hard goodbye. So thank you both for mentioning it.. Of course. I'm sure, Daisy. Well, we appreciate it What is making me happy this week I read a lot of domestic thrillers. I love a domestic thriller. Sometimes I like one that is more like literary, right or at least gets treated as more literary. And sometimes I just like ones that are really good at being domestic thrillers And I have been recently tearing through the work of a writer named Sherry La Pena and she writes books with titles like Getting awayay with murder. She didn't see it coming. What have you done? Not a happy family. Someone we know