Handling Difficult People and Leaving More

Hey, it's friend Mel, and welcome to the Mel Robins podcast. Are you ready for one of the most amazing things you've ever heard Not just today, not just this week, but this month Because I'm going to tell you what happened in our studio today, what you're about to experience is one of the most fascinating things that has ever happened on this podcast I personally am so shocked By this episode, I'm still trying to wrap my head around it and figure out how to explain to you what's about to happen. So here it goes You and I are sitting down with the top mentalist in the world Os Parlman. and now it seems like he can read people's minds, but he's actually an expert in reading people And he's here to help you read body language, talk to anyone, and communicate with confidence Today, he's teaching you the same skills that he's mastered after thirty years as a mentalist How to pay attention to the things ninety nine percent of people miss Because when you learn to do that You become more confident, connected and in control. He will also show you exactly how step by step to become the most interesting person in any room A simple trick to help you never forget someone's name again How to eliminate your fear of rejection once and for all? And why the first ten seconds that you spend with anyone are crucial. And there is so much more that by the time you finish listening, you will never walk into a room, a conversation, or a first impression, the same way again The Mel Robins podcast is proudly sponsored by Aica Insurance, our exclusive insurance partner You know how good it feels when someone makes your life easier? Oh, I just love those kind of people That's why I love Aka. They go the extra mile in the moments you need it most Listening, following up and treating you like a real human being And because they're a mutual insurer The whole model is built around putting customers first. It's refreshing, it's rare, it's covered with empathy, and it's exactly how insurance should feel Aika where your priority number one. Visit amka. com and get a quote today This episode is sponsored by Colgate Total. Look You've heard it a thousand times. You don't wait for a crisis to change your life. You take action now Real power is being proactive, not reactive. That's where Colgate Total actctive prevention toothpaste comes in. It's clinically proven to prevent oral health problems like cavities and gingivitis before they start. so you don't have to worry later. Stop reacting and start preventing Pick up Colgate Total Active prerevention at your local retailer today. Your future self will thank you It's your friend Mel, and welcome to the Mel Robins podcast. I am thrilled that you're here today. I mean, look, it's always an honor to be together and to spend time with you, but this episode, oh boy, did you pick a winner? And if you're a new listener, you're here because someone shared this with you, I just want to take a moment and personally welcome you to the Mel Robins podcast family Today, you and I are talking all about how to read people. to anyone and communicate with confidence with the one and only Os Fermman Now Oz is one of the most extraordinary performers on the planet. He's an Emmy award winning world renowned mentalist with more than thirty years of experience and he's mastered the art of reading people Guiding attention and using a little mystery to make the impossible feel real Oz has performed on some of the biggest stages, amazing everyone from celebrities to CEOs to world leaders. and you're going to hear some of those stories today is Appearances have been viewed over one billion times, and he is the author of the New York Times bestestseller, Read Your Mind And you know what? whenever you watch or listen to O's Everybody always asks the same question Now Do that Please help me welcome The Extraordinary Os Perlman to the Mel Robins podcast. Ohs, Plman. Welcome to the Mell Robins podcast. Thank you for having me on. What an honor. What an honor. The last time I saw you, we were both dressed in black tie on the red carpet at the Golden Globes. And we had just booked you to do this interview. Timing is everything in life. and my ride was serendipitous, we are much more comfortably dressed this time around. And yeah, I'm excited to be here. One of the many reasons why I was so excited to be able to sit down and learn from you today is I believe that you have so many amazing and surprising things to share about success liiving a meaningful life handling difficult situations and creating ortunity and success for yourself. And so I would love to hear you just speak directly to the person who's with us right now, listening or watching and share a little bit about what might change about their life or their mindset or what's possible. If they truly lean in and take to heart everything that you're about to share with us from your remarkable career and life I think All of us are going after the same things, right? happiness, health. liivving a successful and fulfilling life None of that occurs in a vacuum all has to do with your interactions with the people around you, your family your friends, within your work and professional life, your clients, your colleagues I spent thirty years learning the way people think and how to interact with them As an entertainer, my job is to get inside your head and create memorable moments of wow and awe What I want to do is give you that ability in your life How do you become the most memorable person in every room you walk into? How do you gain that confidence Quickly, how do you overcome the fear of rejection that I think holds us back both in our personal and professional lives? I've experienced it. What can you do to fast trrack that And lastly, how do we have more stimulating conversations and connections with the people around us So Oz, how would you even describe what you do A mentalist is a form of a magician. I want to tell you what I'm not. I am not psychic. I do not have supernatural powers. I cannot talk to the dead When people ask me, what is it that you're performing, they are tricks. That is the truth. It appears to be mind reading, but that's the illusion I'm trying to create in my audience. All of it with the goal of creating these memorable moments that you leave amazed and telling everyone else around you what you experienced. I have figured out the way people think I've studied it for decades and I know how to influence them and guide them in certain directions. And I know how to get information from you that you simply don't know how I'm getting. And here's the really important part for you listening to this is that magic is such a focused discipline of look how great I am Shine this spotlight on me. Look at me Somebody told me this once and they said to me Everybody is living a movie and you're the star of your movie Everyone else is supporting characters. someome people are extras The more that you can find a way to make other people you interact with feel like they're also the star of your movie, the more that they will help you in your life. It sounds selfless, but it's a selfish approach that ends up being so selfless. Because when I meet people I want to create a memorable moment for them that they will talk about to others It took me so many years to understand that that's what I do for a living I create memorable moments You know what this reminds me of is it reminds me of this Qote about purpose that has stayed with me forever. And it's this, that purpose is not the thing you do this is the thing that happens in other people when you do the thing that you do. And that's exactly what you're talking about Right? People don't remember what you did. People remember how you made them feel And that's such an important to comprehend and understand the difference between it because so many of us Ab when we leave room, did I say the right thing? Did I embarrass myself? Did I talk too fast? Did I talk too slow? What do they think of me Most of the time People aren't thinkking what they thought of you, it's how they felt around you. That matters. That's that famous Maya Angelo quote. I have a question for you If the person listening or watching has never had the experience of either seeing or being in the presence of a mentalist. Y. Before we go any further, could you just give a simple example Let's say the person who's listening or watching right now is actually in front of you or at one of your shows. Can you just give a simple example so they can grasp Like what you do? I have one better. That's like explaining a song instead of singing a song. Okay Right? Tens of millions of people can't stop talking about it. Your book is piled up out there I'm going to turn my back You're going to be flipping through this book. You're going to be stopping. booom on one page. And when you go there, this is a conscious choice. There's a reason for this page. And when you go there, I want you to stop on that page, I want you to bring it close to your body and I'm going to turn and make sure there is no way No mirrors I cover my eyes go to that page right now. Okay. The page I'm going to is one where the number of the page Has a meaning to you sort. Something hard, something I couldn't have looked up, something there is just no feasible way, but to you, it has a meaning. To you, you're going there for a reason Okay Now you've got to tell tell this page. your listener, your viewer, they know you, you're their friend Mel You have not told me what age you are going to. There is no conceivable way No I could know what page or what meaning this has or any of it. I want you to take your finger Drag it up and down on the page. You're going past all the words you wrote. And it's as if you stop on one word you're drawing I'm doing It's like magnetized and you circle it with your finger. Y finger starts being swirls around it and you feel compelled And you just keep circling that word and then you stop and you close the book tightly and you put it back down Count in your mind How many letters are in that word, but just to yourself, not out loud. Now, I'm going to tell you right away just by saying K so quickly It was fast. It was an easy word to count. If you had taken longer, if you had struggled, if the word was especially, Oh, I gott to count that word. And then the two L's, double letters always throw people off. you said, okay notot because you were trying to give it away because you We're done counting whichich means to me that the same way I have a five year old who's in first grade in kindergarten, going into first grade, site words You don't count them You just know them The word you picked was either three, four or five letters, four letters. It was four letter word, wasn't it? Yes. It was four letters Think of all the letters Now while the page had a meaning, I'm trying to manage my face. so I'm not showing you any signals Think of all the different letters as they're scrabble tiles, as if we'reing wheel of fortune. Okay And suddenly any one of those four letters may It's interesting to you. You just decide that letter. blinks and lights up and you see one of the letters. Okay. Can you see it right now as if it's in front of you? So I know that we read from left to right. So I know that your brain would have processed looking from left. and going to the right and then you would have stopped and most people go back to the start of the word You didn't, which is interesting. How do you know that? I watched. I just gave that away because I did okay, go ahead. You weren't thinking of the last letter of the word, were you? No, I don't think so, because you jumped back It starts with W You're thinking of the letter W, aren't you? How the hell do you know this? I think I'm done. I just want Everyone that's listening and can't see to know that I've written ad. I've written down one word, I can't change it What was the word out of your entire book, The Let them Theory? Did you go to any page, circle any word? What was that word? Want. Want is what I wrote down That's incredible That's the word. That's the word. That's the word That's what a mentalist does That's what I do Wow, Well I want to know how to do that. So I will tell you the truth is that this will not be useful to you in your life You think it will. thenen why am I listening to this? watching this episode? This trick is a trick. At the end of the day, you guessing a word, you guessing a number You guessing somebody's ATM pin code, unless you have nefarious purposes will be excellent for entertaining. Yeah. But I will tell you the skills that you will want to use, which is how do you walk into a room and immediately command attention How do you walk into that room and become the most memorable person in it so that when you leave Everyone is talking about you. What's at the core is how you make people feel There's other people can do these tricks, I assure you But it's how do people leave my show? How do people leave an interaction with you and feel And think about how many times you've been to a party And you've left and you've said Did you meet that one person? You go, Chris, did you meet them? I love them? Why did you love them Why did you connect with them in such a meaningful way when you maybe met twenty or thirty other people How do you analyze what made them so interest? It's typically because I'm laughing And they're a great storyteller and it's like O we have a lot of connections, or you can go deeper in the conversation because you're talking about something that's a shared interest. Right, they went beyond the surface and they made you feel like you were the most interesting person. Almost every time you realize it, it's not just somebody who's constantly talking about themselves It's them finding a way to bring things out of you that you haven't before So one of the big ones is I mentioned autopilot. I think so many of us when we meet new people We're right away scared. What am I going to ask him? What am I going to talk about and you start second guessing yourself? Y I think the most important thing is the first three questions you want to ask that person Because that's what everyone else asks. What are the first three the dreadful ones, whereere are you from?? you, what do you do for a living? All of the questions they've been asked a thousand times before, their brain goes into autopot. There's a heuristic in their brain that says, I'm going to answer these questions I would do a little more sleuthing below the surface, which is something where you notice something about them. People love a compliment Those glasses are so unique. I'm so curious, where did you get them and what made you get those instead of another one? And so now we get to tell you something about a choice we made that most people haven't thought to ask us. Also you've complimented us, which is a nice feeling right from the jump So it should be genuine, but have a question that branches out and that hopefully somebody else hasn't asked before. Well, you know what I love about that just one teque which I want to make sure as you're listening or watching, you grab it. and you employ it is that you turned a compliment and a question. Y Becauseuse a lot of us are practicing the art of learning how to speak to each other again. So we might be standing in line with somebody and go, Oh, I love those socks But I didn't ask you a question. Right. Those socks are Crazy amazing, what made you want to put those on this morning? That's a great question, right? Because now we branch and I go, you wouldn't believe it. My son got me these last year for Father's D. and now what's happening percolating dopamine. I'm feeling good Wow, what an interesting person. ask me this question. And now where do you go from there? You've opened up new branches of a conversation that instantly would have been shut down otherwise If you have to go to one of those dreadful first three of what does somebody do for a living Put a different spin on it. Again, my tricks have different packaging I could do this trick and I could have just asked you to pick a playing card. You put it back, I find it, eight of diamonds. would have had the same appeal as a word from your book page that has meaning, which I'm going to get to later, it wouldn't because the story differs So for the interaction Wh you're at a networking meeting and you say don't just do the, hey, so what do you do for a living? What is the twist that you recommend that allows you to be more interesting? I think that I would say I would open with how you feel because you'd be shocked at how often other people feel the same way, which is I get so nervous at these. I don't know what to say, but you seem so friendly Can you tell me one funny thing you did at one of these before? Just again, open up a story. neverever ask a yes or no question or a question that ends with a period. because what you're doing then is you're allowing people to close doors. I wanna open a door that leads to room with more doors. We are getting so many people writing in asking for specific advice about How do I actually talk to people that I don't know and especially in a professional setting. Right. So is there something you can give as a recommendation to just try and experiment with because I think for a lot of people It doesn't come naturally. Sure. So let's break this down into two channels.w little options. Option one, you can prepare You know someone you might be meeting. You get to do homework. It's not cheating, it's called being prepared If you can do that, and I want to give you an example from my life that was pivotal Y, which is I a few years ago performed a show where the pres President Barack Obama was speaking. Okay, how nervous were you I don't think I was that nervous because I like to convert nervousness into preparation. So in this situation, it's not that I'm flaunting or trying to be showy. I take what you would describe as nerves and say, I'm gonna prepare. Okay. I am nervous if I didn't prepare. And are you going to do a trick on president? I hope so, but I don't know if that's going to happen. So what I'm told is that I'm performing later in the night, he's going to be doing an opening session And so he's going on before me and he's not staying is what I was told. Got it. I never believe that when somebody says. When somebody says it's not happening or a no, I think not yet. So the same way you have let them, I have no not yet. L loveove it. And I have another theory, which I want to tell you, which I call it makeake them This is where instead of let them, I think that make them is what I'm all about. It's what my last twenty years of my life have been because I'm not waiting for gatekeepers to tell me that you're going to be big as a mentalist. This is a category that didn't really exist. And how do you make them remember you? How do you make them talk about you? So with the president I didn't know if I'd have any time with him. So if I am, I want to make it count 'ause it might be a handshake, it might be five seconds, ten seconds, two minutes, who knows, but I've gott to make it count So what can I do in that moment Everyone is going to walk up to him with one version of, It's an honor to meet you, President. Here's a story I have about you. Here's something that you won't remember, but I will I realized to laugh. Yes, But we've all done it too. We see somebody that we admire. We're like, oh my God, I was an idiot. There's nothing wrong with that though. That's what ninety nine percent of people do I want you to be the one percent who doesn't. Okay, Who breaks the mold? What do I do? Here's what I did. I thought about this line for months. So at the moment where there was a meeting and greet. It was impromptu. The president was talking to different people I wish I was taller. I'm five, seven and three quarters. I need that three quarters meel. but all the taller guys are getting looked at. All the women finally he turns to me right when we shake hands. I lock eyes with the president and I say, thank you so much for the gift, sir Right away I see in his eyes. I see in his eyes. You don't have to be a mentalist. confonusion, which is what I wanted to elicit. In that moment, he said the same thing that I believe ninety nine out of a hundred people would say if a stranger walked up to you said, Thank you so much for the gift. Gift. He goes, what gift, which set me up perfectly for me to say I'm going to be performing in fifteen minutes Which means that technically I'm going on after you, so I forever get to tell people that President Barack Obama opened for me Oh my Godd, that's brilliant. So he laughs And now I'm playing chess, not checkers where I want him to say, what are you performing It goes exponentially better, Mel because he goes, Oh, and he looks at me And he goes, I know you. Oh my God, the thing you did with Aaron Rogers was incredible. I'm looking at my wife who's at the show being like, he know who I am, right? He knows who I am. So right at that moment, he's still locked in. And I knew that my moment was fleeting. and I said Are you ready for the most amazing thing you've seen? notot today Not this week, but this month, do you have thirty seconds, sir So right away, notice that I've set up a lottery system of who's going to say no to this, not can I show you a trick? That's not I'm not showing you a trick Can I show you the most amazing thing you've seen? I've set up a tone of how good it's going to be. Do you have thirty seconds? thirty seconds for most people, the minute he said back to me thirty seconds, I've got him So it doesn't matter what we said. He either says no or thirty seconds. Once he said thirty seconds, I'm already ten seconds in and we're going to go much longer than thirty. What I do? I hand him a business card in his hand. I said, think of anyone you're going to talk to in the next week And he goes, I got someone to go change your mind right now. So when you tell this story later You will always say, how could you have known? I changed my mind in the middle. How could you have known? And then he said, I got it And I say turnurn it over and when he turned it over, it says say hello to Marty for me. And he just flipped out. There's you can see the clip.' So that was my moment with him. and that was something that I would say years, I've been thinking, what's my elevator pitch if I had this moment with the president? Think about who you're going to meet. Think about the situation. Think about what you would do with that thirty seconds if you have the chance, which is not guaranteed at all to actually meet this person And so I take it, you had prepared. you knew exactly what you were going to do. and You weren't waiting for the gatekeeper. No. You just did it. There's no agent, there's no manager. There's nobody in life that will ever be as vested in your success as yourself So you don't wait for people to say and invite you, hereere's how you're going to be a star, or here's how you're going be the number one sales personon in your organization or here's you're going gonna be the best mom or the best dad Sorry, that doesn't exist. Everybody's trying to figure out this game of life at the same time I've met people that are literally two of the three wealthiest people in the world, I've met presidents, I've met royalty, and I came to the conclusion at a certain point I had this pedestal. Everyone's figuring it out just like I am And so I'm trying to say to myself When the moment happens and if you can create that moment because so much of what people will say is lucky putting yourself in a situation where luck can happen which is years and years of moving towards that moment. For me to have gotten to that, I could tell you five steps that even got me into the room with the president, that all of which occurred not because somebody opened the door for me, but that I kept putting a toe in and then another toe and then another toe and squeezing it and then opening it up and finding an opportunity. And when that opportunity came exceeding the expectations of the person I was with and having a give and take relationship where I keep giving, giving, giving, giving, so that at the moment, when I want to take, it's not even a take, they want to give back to me And I think that's so important. is that you're constantly doing that with the people around you I love that you're saying this because I always talk about these like at bat moments There are these moments in life that really matter And there's a lot of people and you may be one of them as you're listening and watching that are sitting around hoping to be found. sitting around oping your boss notices you, sitting around or you're working hard with your head down hoping somebody finds your quote discovers you.. And in today's world does that work You have to do what you're talking about, which is to understand that the things that you want are your responsibility. and you got to learn how to ask for what you want. You got to be willing to be seen. And a lot of this comes down to what you're talking about, about seeing the opportunity that you have more ability If you prepare, if you know what you want So if the if it's around understanding first of all There are no gatekeepers except for the way we gatekeep ourselves And you got to prepare The secret that you keep saying is not doing the same old, same old. Right. So that you put the spotlight on someone else What's the next step I implore you to find a way where if you're at the start of your career or if you're at the start, even if you want help in anything Look to see that person who would be a mentor or help and guide you and see, what do they need? inststead of you leading with what can I take from you? It might be information or time, what is it that they want back I'm going to give you just a great example. It is where I've mentored a lot of other people that perform and do what I do And many of them will lead with how did you do this trick? And I'm not going to answer that because it just doesn't show that you put in the work. But I had one young guy who came to me and looked at my website, studied it, and said, I just wanted to let you know that you had typos on this page, this page and this page that you're ress this link was broken, this link was broken and that your Wikipedia had a bunch of errors. If you'd like, I'm happy to compile all this, fix your Wikipedia for you and send an email with every page and where it is to your web designer to help you out. He didn't ask a single thing I go, wow Thank you so much. Yeah, that'd be great. And then after that, found another thing you could do and another thing. And so what happened after about three iterations of this? I said What can I do to help you I wanted to help that person, the same way that sending somebody a thank you card or a gift will almost always elicit, at the very least, a thank you back. And maybe that's not the door opening, but it's a toe in the door I love that I also loved What you said, don't wait for a gatekeeper. Can you unpack that more for the person listening or watching? I think a lot of us have this dream, and I did because I didn't grow up thinking I'd be in showbis. I am first generation immigrant. What did you think you would do So I was on the path of, again, I don't call it first generation where my parents said, you go to school You get a degree, you get good grades, and then you get a job and then you work for someone else. That was the way I was conditioned and brought up. That was what I was defined as success. I started doing magic when I was thirteen years old I won't give you the whole life story when I was fourteen. my folks had gotten divorced We didn't really have a lot of money It was very messy, and I wanted to keep performing and getting new magic tricks and they're very expensive And so for me to do that, I had to start working. My mom's like, I can't, you got to go work. So I walked over to a restaurant, know half a mile from my house, I somehow sweet talked myself into getting a job being a close up strolling magician, printed my own business cards, hand cut them, and started getting gigs doing children's birthday parties and corporate events. And so when you ask me, what did I view? I never viewed it as I could do this full time professionally. I did this in order to get my degree to go work and a corporate job And I worked on Wall Street for a few years and at a certain moment, there were all these light bulb moments as you call them of Wow Could I actually do this for my living? Could I do this? makeake it from like something that's a dream into a reality? And I think so many of us have that of is this what I'm currently doing what I was born to do. Is this what my calling is? And at a certain point, I couldn't keep Going for it, if I was always on the waterall. I had to jump in the pool. I couldn't just dip my toes in the water. So in two thousand five, I quit my job. I went for it full time And it was not something everyone around me thought was a smart fiscal decision It seemed pretty crazy to go from working on Wall Street with a very well paying job to you are suddenly a magician slash mentalist Day one of me doing that, I realized no one is going to call me And like in a nineteen twenties vaudevill and say, I'm going make you a star, kid. That's not going to happen. I had that moment sitting on the couch watching daytime TV and saying I don't have to do anything right now, Mel. I could just eat cereal and sit in my boxers watching TV. And I thought for about five minutes, this is the most glorious morning of my life And then this feeling settled in and I go, oh my God I don't have a boss I could just keep doing this, but no one is going to make this happen if I don't And I turned off the TV and I said I gott to start making moves And there is no playbook for being a movie star or a mentalist or a rock star or so many of these careers. So I think you've got to start defining your goals and what success is in taking small incremental, quantifiable steps towards achieving it. Ohz, let's just take a quick break so that we can hear a word from our sponsors and don't go anywhere Because there is so much more Oz has to teach you, including an incredible trick for remembering people's names. We're just getting started, so stay with me You know those times where your cat or your dog is being all kooky and stubborn? Let them. ' that's when they're at their lovable best. To be their best crazy selves pets need the right nutrition the kind they can get from a canot pet food The people at Acana are as stubborn as the pets they feed. They never compromise. They never take shortcuts, they never accept second best. They insist on high quality meats like pasture raised beef and all sorts of farm fresh fruits and vegetables like butternut squash, whole cranberries, and golden turmeric. 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It has advanced technology to deliver unmatched cooling comfort for hot sleepers get matched to the perfect sleep solution for you. For the great sleep you deserve, visit Mattress Firm and get five hundred dollars off Temper breeze mattresses. They make sleep easy. Restrictions apply, see mattressfirm dot com or store for details Welcome back, It's your friend Mel Robbins. Today, you and I are learning how to read people, talk to anyone, and communicate with confidence with the world's top mentalist Oz Parlman For somebody who is listening or watching because I have a feeling it's going to be one of those episodes that a lot of people send to their adult kids or maybe they send to their spouse, or they send to somebody who is really resistant. putting themselves out there What would you say to somebody who is uncomfortable with even just putting that little toe in the water who sits back and watches everybody else do it. Good What do you want to say to that person? Whenever people see you at a certain level they don't see all the years that came to being here. So they don't see me at fourteen years old walking up to a table being rejected because they didn't want some fourteen year old shrimp coming over all. they had a babysitter and who are you and you start doing cartridge and get out of here kid and they don't care about my feelings. I'm not their kid. that I can't lie to you and say that being rejected in that way doesn't hurt. And if it happens at one table and then another table and then another table crushes you. And so what I learned at that age and I think that it's helped me throughout my whole life, it's a form of resilience I learned how to overcome not just rejection, the pain of rejection. But what happens over time is you have a fear of rejection. I would argue that most of those people that you're mentioning aren't even feeling rejection, they fear the rejection so much that it stops them dead in their tracks before trying. And so here's the cheat code I want to give you how to fast forward cheat so you don't have that fear of rejection. because this is what I knew when I was fourteen years old. And I did it as as a way and it was selfish because I couldn't fail. I couldn't leave that restaurant and just be like, I'm not doing this because I wanted to keep getting magic tricks. I just I'm like, I gotta buy more tricks now. So I can't let these other people be in charge of my future because they're hurting my feelings. So I can't explain to you how I fell upon this, but I realized that I need to separate myself, this part of your psyche that takes the hurt feels it and separate it from this other person. I had this paradigm shift I go, they don't know me. That person does not know me. I'm Oz Pearlman. They don't know me. They know the guy who just came up to them and did tricks. and I called him O' the magician in my mind. I created this split personality where all of the anger, chaos, frustration, hurt got put on this other person, where I could deflect that responsibility, go, they don't know me I'm not hurt when I leave that table. I said, than you very much guys. I'll see if I can come back later. Appreciate you. And I had none of that pain because I separated myself and it's almost like having an agent where your agent gets to have the calls, where they go, I don't want to do this negotiation or I don't want to talk to that person about this thing. You have an agent that handles it. I became my own agent And somehow I created a set in my mind where I said, I no longer feel the pain of you rejecting me because you're not rejecting me. You're rejecting this part of me and you don't know the real me. I realiz that if I give away sixty business cards in a night In the next year, I quantified it, one or two of those people will call me for their kids' birthday party or for some other party. One or two of them will call me. So rather than focus on fifty eight no's, every no gets me closer to a yes I want you to start seeing it that way in your mind. Right now, you're so scared to do it. You're so scared to do something. You're dreading it Five second rule. I remember where I got that one, right? I get out of bed. I want to go for a run at five thirty AM. I'm so groggy. I go Houston. We have liftoff five four, three two, I get up So that works for me, but I'm going to give you a tag to your five second rule. Please, what's my language of dread? confrontation I hate confrontation, Melic. if I have to talk to the guy who did our landscaping and argue about the fact that the trees weren't pruned and I not got to argue about money, I hate that. I will defer it and move it my calendar for three days If I have an argument with my sister, I don't want to talk. I don't want to. So how do I deal with this? Here's what we do. Are you ready? Yes. You've got a phone, I've got a phone Right before you do it, we're about to employ the five second rule In my mind I ask myself how much am I dreading this on a scale of one to ten It's a nine. I don't want to do this at all I put an alarm for twenty four hours from today And I write Dread talking to landscaper as my thing. Tk me three seconds to do that. Right then, five second rule, I make the call. I rip the bandit, I do it. no matter what. I rip the bandit, I do it, I get it over with. Force yourself to do it. Here's what's gonna happen The next day, the alarm is going to go off If you even remember what this was a day later, ask yourself at that moment, What do I register the dread that it was talking the landscaper? It's a two It's a one if I even remember it What happened? Learn from my job. My job is to deceive you in order to entertain you. I have studied the way people think for upwards of twenty nine years. The human mind is wired where Right now, all you did, nothing happened. You feel better. whyy time elapsed? Nothing else Time went by What if you could fast forward those twenty four hours and feel the one or two now? I call it fast forward your feelings. I literally I say to myself, I want to feel the way I do now twenty four hours ago before I do it. And if you do this two or three times, you will realize All it is is perception. All that happened is perception. You are in charge of your mind So right before I make that call, I go, I'm going feel it too now because in a day I'm not even gonna to remember this. So you know what Before I count five, four three I'm going to feel the same way I do in twenty fours now because I so know that that's how it's gonna to be I feel better now, let's make this Kong get over with. I've just my mind and traveled into the future knowing this is how I will feel. I love this and I want to make sure that as you're listening or watching, you actually got the step by step process because I do think it's genius. You have a phone call to make You've paid somebody to do something, they didn't do the job right or family conversation. O family, but even just like the neutral one that you gave of, Oh my God, I paid and it didn't get done right. and I got to call the person and they're going to be a this and of that. And so we've all felt that. And what you're saying is You Set an alarm in your phone It says twenty four hours from now twenty four hours from this moment dred callalling the landscape. Exactly. And then five, four, three, two one, you call the landscaper. Must, you rip the bandid. You do it now. Do it now. You get it over with, it goes howarever goes twentyw four hours later, you've even forgotten about the call and the alarm goes off. And now the fact that you are being reminded that you dreaded this so much and it's already in the past You're now training yourself in that moment to reflect on the fact that it wasn't that bad which your mind is programmed to do. Here's what I think is genius about this and I'm going to try this And the reason why I think this is genius is because For the last sixteen years, I have been counting five four three, two one to get out of bed stillill hate getting out of it. but I think If I were to set the alarm, which I'm going to do tomorrow morning And I then reflect the next morning on the fact that it wasn't so bad, I might actually I trained myself not to feel the dread in the morning versus just having to constantly push myself through it This is fascinating. Dread is associated with starting that the first step is far harder than the tenth. And so you just set things aside, who's guilty of this? I move it to my calendar tomorrow, I move to my calendar the next day. Let's just move it to next week. Let's keep moving things that have no end Telines, right? Creativity requires a deadline certain things that are open ended Never end becausecause I never w to do them. How many of us have those things that we'll do one day Right When's that day going to come And so for me with a lot of these things, unless they're forced upon me, which could be that I've disappoint others eventually and they get mad at me and say, well, when are you gonna to do that thing? The time is now, I will keep pushing the endline and when it takes place. And so I had to do this as a survival mechanism because that dread feels worse than doing the thing. Oz, I wantan to take a quick pause so we can hear a word from our amazing sponsors. and I can tell since you're a mentalist, you knew that was coming before I even said it. Don't go anywhere. We have so much more to dig into when we return, so stay with me You know life can become routine? It's like the same old, same old. 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AC A N A d. com Considering a college degree but haven't started yet Remember this Confidence is the willingness to try And Southern New Hampshire University can help They have over two hundred online programs so you can study where it's convenient And there are no set class times. so you can study when it's convenient too. It's truly a college that lets you balance learning with your busy life Visit snhu. edu slash mail to explore everything Southern New Hampshire University has to offer Welcome back. It's your friend, Mel Robbins, and today you and I get to learn from one of the top mentalists in the world, Oz Perarlman So ohs I wantna go deeper because one of the other things that you say is that the first ten seconds that you spend with someone are critical. What is happening in those first ten seconds? And what should you be taking note of? Can I throw it back to the restaurant days because that changed my life. Truly, when you look at me now, when I approach a table I started noticing patterns and that's what we do throughout life. We notice patterns when we behave with other people, how do we interact? and what do those patterns yield? Right? This does well. let's do it again Yeah I noticed that if I approached people right away, right whence people see you within the first second, there's so many judgments that occur. Now in the situation I had specifically of walking up to you at a table, Right away, they ask themselves all of these questions. Who is this guy? What's he doing here? Does he work here?'? o Oh my God.?'s got a deck card? Is he a magician? Is he any good? Is he going to leave? A to embarrass me? That was is Is he going to embarrass me? Does he need money? Oh my God, do I have money? All of those questions occurred in a split second My job wasn't just to entertain you. My job was to diffuse tension and to answer every one of those questions, put a check mark next to them as quickly as possible in as few words and actions as possible and then the power dynamic. You now want me to not leave Now I'm in charge of your attention. I'm holding in the palm of my hand. way So right away, I noticed a few patterns. When you approach somebody head on, this is so silly and you want know about body language reading, try this today. five minutes after. If you approach someone head on We are hardwired to feel danger when someone comes directly at you. I would approach tables at an angle So when I walk up to you, notice I walk up and approach at an angle with one eye showing not two. It feels from a like just from a Pavlovian response of fight or flight. it is? you feel less danger I immediately put a time constraint in place because the lingering person who walks up to you, you don't know when they're going to go. They're close talking. Oh my God, how long is the conversation going to be? If I walk up to you and say I only have thirty seconds. Right away, I've taken away so many of the parts of tension that you had. Who is this? Are they going to stay? What are they doing? Is this going to be long And then right away, I know that you don't know if I work there. You don't know who I am. Am I asking you for money? Right away, I knew that money and getting a tip makes you awkward. I see people searching, honey do, Ioney do. So I would say to you Have you heard what's going on tonight This is your lucky Kight. So right away, I've asked a question that has no yes or no because no one says no, I don't like lucky knights. I go, The owner has me here as a special treat For all of you And I'm gonna to show you the most amazing thing you've seen this week. So I haven't ever given you a question you can say no to because when I used to walk up to you the dears, who wants see a trick? No, thanks, kid. I've allowed you to stop me. So I kept cutting down the amount of words, same way a great comedian makes the premise short and the punchline fast to check every box so that by the time I walk it up to you, you're intrigued. You're interested. you know I work there. You know the owner social currency has blessed you with being here. I'm here as a treat from the owner. I'm not asking you for money. I don't want money. And so now you're loose, you're relaxed. and now keep in mind I've opened the door, but you better deliver So what I've done is I've taken away all the tension, but I better have a great trick as an opener. Y All I've done is just start it. I'm not giving you the secret to how you're going to be a success at what you do. That's on you. But I've given you the way to open the door so that the person is now interested and they've bought in and now you get your shot at bat How do we apply All the knowledge that you have to those ten seconds of first interacting with somebody So this is going to be situation specific, right? In your personal life, let's say you're meeting somebody that you're interested in. That's going to differ very greatly than if you are a pharmaceutical rep and you're meeting a new doctor or a new administrative assistant who's going to open the door to that doctor. Every one of these situations is different. But in every situation, the common denominator is You need to start thinking person in front of you, because most of us when we walk up are thinking about ourselves And what are we going to say about us and what's going to matter about me? And I want you to take and stop that. That's where I said, makeake them care about you, make them talk about you, make them remember you. and you do that by making it makeake it about them. When you walk up to that person Try to be aware of what makes them tick. When you are at like I had a Delta flight recently cancel, shhout out, I love Delta. I fly them all time, but I had another one. And then another one. and I'm stuck at the airport, and I'm walking up to the airport attendant and everyone else is being rude to this person. Yeah. And that agent, do you think that's going to help when you are the tenth person to come up and be rude and flex your status and all that? And by the way Do they have any contontrol over the weather or the equipment or the timing out. did they cancel it on purpose to screw you No. But you're mad. and I think that if you walk up to that persones and you just say What a rough day, huh? All these people coming up to you. I know this isn't your fault I know you wish things were going smooth If you could help me out, is there any chance that there's another flight you could get me on before this. right? Just right there the way you've empathized, lead with empathy. So if you want to walk up to somebody right away, leadading with empathy and having an awareness of who they are, what makes them tick, and putting in one statement where you You're not a mentalist, but use my playbook. Get inside their head. Think what's it like for them If you're that pharmaceutical rep and you go in there, you said, I bet you've had so many people pitch you today, all different products. I want this to be the best one you've had all day even thirty seconds. I've got to tell you something exciting. right? something where you just J allude to what their day is and what they're going through and what's happening with them I think that goes such a long way. If you're meeting somebody and you like flirting. I'm not telling you what your pickup line is, but I can tell you that right away leaving with either a compliment a smile, a time constraint, or just saying something very friendly that you see through their eyes the world is going to make such a bigger impact than immediately saying something about you. I love that. And it immediately gave me an example in a work setting because I think a lot of time it's easy to be tentative about approaching somebody. When's a good time? When's this? When's that. And months can go by. before you get time on someone's calendar. And if you take what you're teaching us, which is stop thinking about yourself, I need time with this person. Why is this I'm not getting the time, I bl And you think about the person you're trying to reach, J they have a lot going on Holy accow there's a lot coming at them. Why is a really busy person? So if I step in their shoes And I see them going down a hallway You don't walk up and say, hey, I need time with you. You start walking with them. you say, hey, I know you're really busy. Right. Can I I'm going walk with you for the next thirty seconds because there's something really important that I need to share with you. I want to make sure it's on your radar. Yep, boom Now of a sudden you've got my interest. And you're walking with me and I'm going to give you more than thirty seconds. Absolutely. can if you can put any type of benefits oriented language where it's not even I have something important to share with you. It's I want to make your life easier and I have an excellent way so that you're making more money, having more time yourself. Again, ye invert. the value proposition so that when you're approaching somebody, you're always saying the thing that you're doing to make their life better easier anything. You could literally say, I want to save you a gigantic headache because I see an issue brewing and I want to bring it to your chititionent. Now I'm stopp Now I'm not even walking I think a lot of people make the mistake of thinking, you got to have a thirty minute Zoom call scheduled at some point to be able to lay out what this is. and there's a way to use these strategies to think about the other person. it so it's not about you frrame it in a way that it would be interesting to them, diffuse any of the objections, and now you're in. and it takes just a few seconds 's's it's changing your mindset in a way. You know, one of the things O's that you're exceptional at is remembering people's names. And I would love to have you speak a little bit about why is this an important skill to develop in yourself and what happens in the other person's brain when they hear their name Our name from the time we're young is something special to us, right? And if somebody forgets your name, make no mistake about it, it hurts a little bit. There's a sting. to the fact that you weren't as important. Now mayaybe your memory was faulty, maybe it was all if you forget someone's name, no matter what you think, it's not a good thing And we've all felt it. We've all done it. We've been on the receiving side and the giving side Most of us make a huge mistake in thinking they'll say to me, I'm so bad at remembering names. Oh, how can you show me you're so good at it? I'm going to tell you that the main culprit in forgetting people's names has nothing to do with your memory. It's that you never even knew the name to begin with So most people, when they think they've forgotten a name They never imprinted it on their mind. And the reason is The person told you their name. You didn't listen. That's literally it's the simplest step. It's so silly, you're not gonna to believe me. I have a set of three directions that I have stolen from shampoo bottles. but I call it the lather, rinse repeat of shampoo bottles, which what do you do with shampoo? Everybody knows. putut it in, lather. smmells good. Rse Clean hair, repeat, we got to sell more product I repurposed it. I call it listen, repeat, reply. Okay. Please say it again. listen, repeat, reply. Listen, repeat, reply. I want this to be something that ten minutes after this episode, you will start using and ten years from now, you will still be doing on a daily basis. Listen, repeat, reply. You will not forget a name again if you follow these directions. I don't care what your memory iss like But listen is the simplest by far But for a lot of us, it's the hardest When you meet someone Listen to their name. I know it sounds so simple, but what does that mean? It means quiet your mind At that moment most of us are thinking a bunch of things. The big ones are, do I know this person already? What am I going to say next? Oh my God, did I feed my dog this morning? Did I X,YZ? a million thoughts are going through your head and our brains are not good at reading and writing at the same time? They do one of them really well at best So right when I meet someone I Clear my mind And I say, what's your name? Tracy. And I immediately repeat. listen, repeat. I'm going to repeat their name a minimum of twice, immediately after hearing it Like I met the person doing sound downstairs. There was no name tag. I go, Caroline. And I go, is that did I say it right? Is it Caroline? So right away, I'm going to repeat the name twwice You right then have about a ninety percent less chance of forgetting that name in the next fifteen seconds. We're going to go beyond the fifteen, but in those fifteen seconds, it will not go away. Listen, repeat The last one, really ensures that it is solidified in your mind. reply. Say something back that hooks it in your memory. Here are the three that I like to use First compomiment A compliment right away, I go, Mel, I love your glasses, Mel. Where did you get those? So it does two things. One, people like to hear compliments T, it's a visual. So now you're meel with the glasses in my mind. rightight? I've connected to something visual that I see, I've said your name more than once Next one, how do you spell the name Now for a lot of names you'd be shocked. If it's Jhn I go, Are you Joh with an H or are you're John with no H? And I go, John with the H, That's the right way to spell it. I've now said the name four times Right? You're going to remember, John with the H You can do that with Tracey. you can do that with Michelle. onene L or two els. I go Michelle with two elves. I know so many of you, The Michelle with onene L you make a joke You make something third, if you can connect it to somebody you already know. So if I meet somebody and the guy's name is Evan, I go, it's so funny Evan. I go, we've got a great music teacher named Evan. He's a great guy. So anything you can do to connect it with an existing memory, now that's Evan and you see it next to this other person, Evan. This is not a memory palace, this is not a mnemonic I'm not going I'm telling you ten minutes from you hearing these words Try this. tryry it three times a today and you will be doing this for the rest of your life. Listen, repeat, reply. Why is it so important to develop this as a skill? I haveve noticed time and again that people who are genuine, people that are authentic, people that look you in the eyes care about you in that ment. makeake you feel seen Heard and understood They are going to go so much further in life than everyone else that are going to say, please that are going to say thank you that are going to do these things You know, I don't think the nice guy ends last. I think that those little wins accumulate over time And you ask me, how did you achieve success? By doing these things day in, day out, small little bits, those people will become your champions. Those people who you thought nothing of, and you knew their name and you took the time to write down notes afterwards about their children or what was important to them. And you know that information a month or a year or a decade later, they remember you, they talk about you memorable moments and they will champion you and elevate you in your happiness and your success in your life You just mentioned taking notes and you and I share something in common, which is this habit of keeping notes once you meet someone. So right. shhare a little bit about this habit. So I find that taking notes, I did it as a matter of necessity because I have a lot of clients that book me for events and they'll book me again and again And so what happens is it's very awkward for me because we have an asymmetrical interaction, which means that sometimes I do things that people will remember and talk about for the rest of their life. I'm not trying to brag, but that's my job. That's what I try to do, create those moments. and that for lack of a better term, I will have done that to several thousand other people in between the time we last met. So it's not that they don't mean a lot to me, it's that that will blend in with other ones. because Contrary to popular opinion, I am not a memory expert I use my memory effectively in certain ways. And the beautiful part is I can cheat when it comes to my memory can write notes down. So what I realized is I didn't want to do a show again, see someone there and have forgotten this amazing experience I gave them. Yes. becausecause to them, I look in their eyes and I see that they're disappointed And so I did this, it was born of necessity, started taking notes over a decade ago on what was happening. And then I took more notes and more notes. and I do this It's a great way to train your memory because as soon as my show ends or as soon as the dinner party ends or as soon as anything, Some people think, I don't know why that it's like a weird sociopathic teensency that you're cheating. I disagree vehemently. I think that you're being given information. Why would you let it flow through your fingers like sand. it becomes more valuable the longer you hold on to it. It shows that you care It doesn't mean that you didn't remember. if I look at those notes before I go to a show, that shows I carered and people will give me credit for knowing something or remembering something that I truly didn't remember, but I took the time to review it. So I tell you, find an easy way. Maybe it's notes. I will write notes down in my calendar and in an app after every event, after meeting people. And you don't even have to introduce it as a for me, I'm not doing it as a trick. I'm not pretending I didn't know this information about you. I've shared this before on a podcast and also, you know in speeches. You can use this same strategy at your favorite restaurant. Yep You can use it at your local coffee shop And if you find you're the kind of person that goes in and you can't remember the barista's name or you can't remember, you know the woman that is working on Tuesday nights at the restaurant, just make a contact file for the restaurant and in the notes app, just describe people and constantly be adding to it. like it's an incredible thing to do. Incredible. Incredible. Be when you call people by their name, particularly in these more casual relationships People are Lord You also say that every one of us has a built in BS detector? Y. How can you use it to tell when somebody's lying to you? I have seen so many instances where my first instinct was correct. Now not every time ennough statistically that it's a statistical advantage. I would tell most people that if you can really be honest with yourself with what you believed at the first moment, kids are lying to me right now. Well, maybe this no, I bet you they were lying. I bet you, more often than not, they were. That person you went on a first date with If somethingomet doesn't feel right, it's probably not going to be right four or five or six dates from now There's so much in your instincts that you will talk yourself out of I've learned to have that voice that says not to, I don't listen to it Well, you know, it's interesting, I love this because I feel the same about myself that Intuition, another way to think about it is pattern recognition That's all it is. It's iterated and pattern recogned. Yes. And if you this intuition or this sixth sense, it means Your mind body and spirit is recognizing a pattern And To me, even if you catch it wrong and You make a decision and you realize that pattern recognition was wrong. making the decision and then gathering the data adjust the patterns that you spot, right And so to me There is no other way than to act on your intuition and the pattern recognition and the sixth sense that you have because that's the only thing that hones it because you need both the right calls and the wrong calls to adjust the settings to recognize the right patterns. Like I totally agree with you. Some of the sixth sense is stuff that's subconscious that you don't realize. Yes. So I can give you great examples of BS detection with people you know, which is when they vary from their benchmarks. So again, this isn't a foolproof, and it's not infallible. so I don't w want to tell people something that you're going to then say, oh, did work But it works more often than it doesn't, which again, is my barometer for success in many ways. I have no way to tell you, one hundred percent, here's where someone's eyes look if they're lying. If there's different things that very help people behave, but here's the key People will change the amount of details. speed with which they speak, the cadence with which they speak when they lie. You can normally detect when people that you know are lying because they change from what they normally do. So let me explain you, I can't tell you one or the other. Most of us will add unnecessary details when we lie add more details that we don't need to embellish. You know the person who calls in and goes, I got a fever of one hundred four and oh my God and this and you didn't need all that. If you were really sick, do you know what you would have said? You said, I'm really not feeling well, I can't make it today All of the embellishment is almost always a lie unless you're a person who embellishes all the time. And now if you just say to me, I'm not feeling well, I know you're lying. So what I would describe is Notice people's patterns when they tell the truth. If you know them well You've literally taken in thousands and thousands of data points of them doing this. You just haven't consciously studied what they do I do And then see what it feels like when you're not sure if they're lying and you'll be able to tell almost always, it's different I would love to switch gears and talk about difficult people So let's say that the person who is listening or watching right now is dealing with somebody who is really challenging, whether it's a difficult coworker or maybe it is a rude customer, or somebody that is like defensive, maybe it's even your partner. What do you do in those moments? where Things get tense or there's a lot of friction, what's the best way to handle these situations? So for me in my professional environment, hecklers are an issue, right? Somebody who wants to figure you out And this can go down a few different paths or channels. One is Analyzing what is at the core The motivation for doing this So for a lot of people, the motivation is attention. They want attention You have it And there is an insecurity playing out where they feel lesser than. Also, I have a profession that relies on deception at its core. At the end of it, I don't tell you how I did it. So it can be presented as an intellectual challenge for some people where they say, you know something, I don't, therefore I feel insecure. I feel threatened by you. So I want to figure out how you did it. So in that moment, if I know what they want is attention I want to give them that attention And if that means that I can give them a peek behind the curtain, for some people, they want to feel intelligent. They want to feel they've caught me So what can I do Why don't I let them feel like they caught me? But I'll let them feel like they caught me on something simple. I'll look them behind the curtain and I'll go o, you know how this works? Let me show you something. And I bring them in and I include them and they feel like, wow I've now gotten what I wanted, that spotlight, that shine. He is noticing me. But now we've already built that rapport So again, this is how I do it in my life, but who are the hecklers in your life? Who are the people believe in you that are talking down to you, that are telling you, hey, stay in your lane, you know, don't bite off more than you can chew. Certain people that are bringing you down with their energy. rightight? Yeah. I think that in many instances, you have to look at what's motivating them. And I think so much of the time It's a mirror for their insecurities. It's the compare and desare mentality which is what they're saying to you is what they actually feel about themselves And so know that where they're coming from is from a position of they're insecure about that. Now, you're not going to change who people are, let them, obviously. So if somebody is bringing you down, I think that me knowing where their motivation is coming from and knowing that they don't really want to bring me down, they feel down. That's where it's coming from If I'm defusing a heckler whose energy is going above mine, never try to overcome them Anger is not going to best in that situation. You're in a fight with with like a family member and you're getting elevated and you're about to say something you can't take back Pause Breathe Write it an email, draft it, and don't send it Put an alarm forty eight hours, if you still feel that strongly, and if you want to send it again, I've deleted pretty much every one of those emails I've ever drafted because some things you can't take back. I really loved what you said about how This kind of flipping it around to understand that somebody's not trying to bring you down they feel down and that they're projecting at you the things that they feel they're lacking in themselves. Almost always. Almost always. You know, how do you know when it's time to stop trying to win someone over and simply just walk away I think that I get to pick my audience. That's a beautiful part about me. I get to pick the people in my show who I'm using minus sometimes on TV. You have to decide what is right for you and decide if At the end of the day is this person helping to uplift me or bring me down and I think that's something you have to trust yourself on. And even if their example is one where is frustrating or scorn or negativity You can't control how they behave. All I can control is my reaction to that. And trying to understand and assess where are they really coming from and what's the root cause of it? Be in so many instances the root cause is not actually that they want to bring you down or make you feel bad. It's that they feel bad inside and they don't know how to deal with that. Oh, as you talk about the power of leaving people wanting more How can the person listening or watching use that right now in their everyday life, whether it's in a meeting or it's on a date or it is in even your friendships That's the number one rule of showis is leave people wanting more is where is that curve where you get right to the top before it starts to go down That's something you learn over time and that's built on confidence is leaving people wanting more in a meeting, Answer the questions and then move along. So many of us will keep talking when we've had our fil, we've said everything we wanted. and then right then, we know I gota fill more dead space Silence is sometimes golden in negotiations and in life me a decade to learn that when I'm done performing an effect and I do something amazing I let them react I used to try to fill the time, fill the space, start talking over people. Kind of like with a comedian call stepping on laughs if people are still laughing start your next joke all the laughs finish before you move on Otherwise, you're eating your own dessert. When it comes to dating, I think be just out of grasp be just out of grasp I'm not saying to play games, but You don't want to overshare. You don't want to give too much too early. So many people have that pattern. and I think it's the same in business is you overwhelm somebody earlier Try to match someone's energy I would do job interviews So many people would either go in too much too little If you walk in and you're too down